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View Full Version : What happened to the CW-21B Interseptor?



DIRTY-MAC
03-26-2006, 02:47 PM
I have seen all this info around regarding the upcoming patches, but there is no mention of the CW-21B anyware?

http://www.internetmodeler.com/1998/october/aviation/sierra_cw-21b-rightside2-400.jpg

http://www.pacific-fighters.com/ss/CW-21_041.jpg

http://www.pacific-fighters.com/ss/CW-21_Cockpit_011.jpg

Tooz_69GIAP
03-26-2006, 04:49 PM
As far as I am aware, it was finished, submitted, and the model was inserted into the engine, or was about to be, some time last summer, or so. It did appear in that long list of "possible" flyable and AI aircraft to be included that Oleg released at some point maybe a year or so ago. It was listed as flyable.

Last thing I remember was that is was supposedly going to be "in the next patch" which at the time was, I think, going be 4.02m. But since then we have found out that the guy who implements the aircraft into the game only does those aircraft he likes first, and then he goes onto the others. I.E. probably the reason why the Fokker D.XXI isn't in yet, along with a few others as well.

That's what I remember from postings here at least.

pdog1
03-27-2006, 01:05 AM
Originally posted by Tooz_69GIAP:
Last thing I remember was that is was supposedly going to be "in the next patch" which at the time was, I think, going be 4.02m. But since then we have found out that the guy who implements the aircraft into the game only does those aircraft he likes first, and then he goes onto the others. I.E. probably the reason why the Fokker D.XXI isn't in yet, along with a few others as well.

That's what I remember from postings here at least.

You cannot be serious? Who is this twit? Surely Oleg wouldn't allow this?!

JG52Uther
03-27-2006, 01:17 AM
the guy who implements the aircraft into the game only does those aircraft he likes first
I believe Oleg said something to that effect.

F19_Orheim
03-27-2006, 01:29 AM
makes sense in a way doesn't it , I would do the same if I was that guy... but I would have implemented the Fokker firsthttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

pdog1
03-27-2006, 01:59 AM
Originally posted by F19_Orheim:
makes sense in a way doesn't it , I would do the same if I was that guy... but I would have implemented the Fokker firsthttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I guess this guy is a real Mother Fokker....

Gibbage1
03-27-2006, 02:37 AM
Well all I know for sure is that it was accepted and put into the game engine.

This is not official since none of this came from standard channels, but I heard rumblings of a Pacific orentated add-on and the Cw-21b would be featured in it along with some early Japanese birds that we also have seen.

SaQsoN I think is the one putting aircraft into the game. I know Oleg himself said everyone but 1 man has moved to BoB, so this WILL make things slow. I hope they do use it. It was my finest work, and my last. I would hate the last thing I contributed to ILe to be the Ki-43. definitly not my best work.

Time will tell.

DIRTY-MAC
03-27-2006, 03:24 AM
yeah its a lovely model you have done Gibbage http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Maybe SaQsoN could answer this?

by the way is it possible to se some more pics of your model Gibbage?

russ.nl
03-27-2006, 02:19 PM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
Well all I know for sure is that it was accepted and put into the game engine.

This is not official since none of this came from standard channels, but I heard rumblings of a Pacific orentated add-on and the Cw-21b would be featured in it along with some early Japanese birds that we also have seen.

SaQsoN I think is the one putting aircraft into the game. I know Oleg himself said everyone but 1 man has moved to BoB, so this WILL make things slow. I hope they do use it. It was my finest work, and my last. I would hate the last thing I contributed to ILe to be the Ki-43. definitly not my best work.

Time will tell.

Thanks for the info Gibbage and it really is a great model http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif]

I hope there will be a pacific add-onn or patch. It would be a shame to let that plane and others just rot away on some HD.

Sturm_Williger
03-27-2006, 02:45 PM
Originally posted by Tooz_69GIAP:
...the guy who implements the aircraft into the game only does those aircraft he likes first, and then he goes onto the others.

Dang ! Just our luck he's not into Cr@pplanes ! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

GerritJ9
03-27-2006, 03:05 PM
My guess is that it will be part of the Manchuria addon, together with the Ki.27 and Ki.21 and possibly a few other early Pacific War aircraft. Makes sense since the Chinese were supposed to receive this aircraft- but the ML-KNIL was the only air force to use the CW-21B in combat; certainly the biggest user!
One remark is that it is strange the CW-21B is modelled with a ring and bead sight; according to historian P.C. Boer all Brewsters plus the Hawk 75s and Interceptors had been fitted with reflector gunsights just before the Japanese landings at Balikpapan on Jan. 23rd 1942, which was about two weeks before the ML's Interceptors saw combat for the first time over Soerabaja.

PBNA-Boosher
03-27-2006, 05:21 PM
I want my American Ki-43!

Tooz_69GIAP
03-27-2006, 07:33 PM
Originally posted by GerritJ9:

One remark is that it is strange the CW-21B is modelled with a ring and bead sight; according to historian P.C. Boer all Brewsters plus the Hawk 75s and Interceptors had been fitted with reflector gunsights just before the Japanese landings at Balikpapan on Jan. 23rd 1942, which was about two weeks before the ML's Interceptors saw combat for the first time over Soerabaja.

It could be that there was little data on this modification in the way of photos, so Gib did the ring and bead site. Either way, I've been wanting to fly this thing for ages!! I hope it appears.

Gibbage1
03-28-2006, 01:16 AM
I did not model the cockpit. I also never had any referances of the reflecter gunsight at all. I never once saw anything about a reflector during my research. If I had known the rings were replaced, I would of told Jeronimo.

DIRTY-MAC
03-28-2006, 01:44 AM
Originally posted by GerritJ9:
My guess is that it will be part of the Manchuria addon, together with the Ki.27 and Ki.21 and possibly a few other early Pacific War aircraft. Makes sense since the Chinese were supposed to receive this aircraft- but the ML-KNIL was the only air force to use the CW-21B in combat; certainly the biggest user!
One remark is that it is strange the CW-21B is modelled with a ring and bead sight; according to historian P.C. Boer all Brewsters plus the Hawk 75s and Interceptors had been fitted with reflector gunsights just before the Japanese landings at Balikpapan on Jan. 23rd 1942, which was about two weeks before the ML's Interceptors saw combat for the first time over Soerabaja.

what is the source (historian P.C. Boer?) you got the info about CW-21B with reflector sights?

A little pic
http://www.aviationart.nl/Curtiss-wright_CW-21B.jpg

GerritJ9
03-28-2006, 02:52 AM
P.C. Boer wrote two books about the ML-KNIL's early Pacific War: "De Luchtstrijd rond Borneo" and "De Luchtstrijd om IndiŽ". Both were published in the late 1980s (1987 and 1989) and unfortunately have never been translated from Dutch into English. They are, of course, out of print though occasionally a second-hand copy turns up.
The reflector sight fitted was most probably a U.S.-made sight.

HotelBushranger
03-28-2006, 04:01 AM
Ugly bloody thing http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

russ.nl
03-28-2006, 06:54 AM
Originally posted by HotelBushranger:
Ugly bloody thing http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/crackwhip.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Watch it now... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

DIRTY-MAC
03-28-2006, 08:37 AM
Originally posted by HotelBushranger:
Ugly bloody thing http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

I think the CW-21B is among WWII most beautyful fighters

GerritJ9
03-28-2006, 03:06 PM
Ugly, maybe......... but it had a phenomenal climb rate, left an A6M2 for dead. As Capt. R.A.D. Anemaet of 2-Vl.G-IV, who flew first the CW-21B and later the Hurricane IIB, said, "...the CW-21B could outclimb but not outturn the Navy-0. The Hurricane could do neither."

DIRTY-MAC
03-28-2006, 04:04 PM
Erik Shilling of the Flying Tigers said it could probably outclimb a Zero even if flown upside down,I was one of the nicest planes he ever flew,

should turn a bit better than a Hawk75 and the Buffalo, and dive and roll pretty good to,
(it had metal control surfaces) at least the ailerons

russ.nl
03-28-2006, 11:45 PM
Originally posted by DIRTY-MAC:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HotelBushranger:
Ugly bloody thing http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

I think the CW-21B is among WWII most beautyful fighters </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif those lines and curves its like an angle. (or demon http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif)

Aero_Shodanjo
03-29-2006, 05:37 AM
It's so ugly, it's beautiful http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

If in game the CW-21 will be able to outclimb the Zero, well, it sounds like a plane for me. hehe...

Too bad the ML-KNIL only had a squadron of them in the defense of NEI. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

DIRTY-MAC
03-29-2006, 06:44 AM
climb rate will be around 4500-4800 feet per minute at about 45 degrees of angle! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

Gibbage1
03-29-2006, 05:20 PM
I fell in love with the Cw-21b when modeling it. Outstanding curvs and shapes and a simple delight to work with. Im looking forward to flying her. It will be very competitive vs the Zero and Ki-43. It has 100HP more and about the same weight. Im not sure what the wing loading was, but its aerodynamics was better.

Foxtrot-Hotel
03-29-2006, 06:10 PM
I fell in love with it, when I first saw it, and I think you have done a great job there Gibbage, let's hope we don't have to wait too long for it...I'm a Huge fan of the Vrap planes, can't get enough of it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

DIRTY-MAC
03-30-2006, 06:41 PM
Gibbage no chance of some pics?

Gibbage1
03-30-2006, 07:49 PM
Originally posted by DIRTY-MAC:
Gibbage no chance of some pics?

I could. The problem is I am VERY busy working on my P-38 for FS2004. I will try next week. Maybe do a desktop wallpaper? I also did the Ki-43 so I can do a sceen with those two fighting.

GerritJ9
03-31-2006, 12:27 AM
Great idea about the wallpaper, Gibbage....... but make sure it's the Ki.43 that's going down in flames, please! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Gibbage1
03-31-2006, 03:12 AM
Originally posted by GerritJ9:
Great idea about the wallpaper, Gibbage....... but make sure it's the Ki.43 that's going down in flames, please! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Be sure!

DIRTY-MAC
03-31-2006, 06:17 AM
great! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/metal.gif

Bremspropeller
03-31-2006, 08:18 AM
The guy who desinged that cool pit deserves a big thump up - the guy who modelled it also...

Aero_Shodanjo
03-31-2006, 08:52 AM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DIRTY-MAC:
Gibbage no chance of some pics?

I could. The problem is I am VERY busy working on my P-38 for FS2004. I will try next week. Maybe do a desktop wallpaper? I also did the Ki-43 so I can do a sceen with those two fighting. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh yeah! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Thanks in advance http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

And thanks very much for all the planes you've made m8 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

DIRTY-MAC
04-04-2006, 05:41 AM
bump

DIRTY-MAC
04-08-2006, 06:58 PM
hoping for a wall paper...

Gibbage1
04-09-2006, 07:28 PM
Sorry. I keep getting distracted. The P-38 I was doing for FS2004 is finally done. Maybe I can get to that wallpaper soon!

What res you run your desktop at?

DIRTY-MAC
04-10-2006, 06:38 AM
great!
1024x768

HotelBushranger
04-10-2006, 07:23 AM
I'ma hankerin, for some spankerin!

That is, if theres no pics posted http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Copperhead310th
04-10-2006, 09:46 PM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
Well all I know for sure is that it was accepted and put into the game engine.

This is not official since none of this came from standard channels, but I heard rumblings of a Pacific orentated add-on and the Cw-21b would be featured in it along with some early Japanese birds that we also have seen.

SaQsoN I think is the one putting aircraft into the game. I know Oleg himself said everyone but 1 man has moved to BoB, so this WILL make things slow. I hope they do use it. It was my finest work, and my last. I would hate the last thing I contributed to ILe to be the Ki-43. definitly not my best work.

Time will tell.

mmmmmmmmm i dunno Kevin i was always kinda fond of your P-38L. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif
Ascteically speaking of course.

DIRTY-MAC
04-13-2006, 12:11 PM
bump http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Gibbage1
04-13-2006, 01:18 PM
I was working on it last night. So far so good! I need to fix a small problem with the motion blur on the prop. Should be done tonight.

I still have not heard any word on the Cw-21b at all. Sort of makes me worried.

russ.nl
04-13-2006, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
I was working on it last night. So far so good! I need to fix a small problem with the motion blur on the prop. Should be done tonight.

I still have not heard any word on the Cw-21b at all. Sort of makes me worried.

When I read your first sentence I thought: "Yes, he's working on it. Oleg must have asked him to alter it."
But then I read the second........ http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif

Have you found the time yet to post a couple of nice shots for us plz http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Gibbage1
04-14-2006, 01:44 AM
Sorry about the delay. I also wish I could bring news about what has happened to it. The Cw-21B is in Oleg's hands.

http://www.gibbageart.com/files/cw21b1024.jpg

Feathered_IV
04-14-2006, 05:02 AM
Fingers crossed. I really hope we see that beauty one day soon.

DIRTY-MAC
04-14-2006, 08:40 AM
looking good Gibbage http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

were did you get the information on the Dutch CW-21B paintchemes, they hade some pretty unusual ones didnt they?

GerritJ9
04-15-2006, 03:07 AM
The Dutch CW-21Bs had basically the same camouflage pattern as the B-339s, i.e. two shades of green known as "oudblad" or "old leaf" and "jongblad" or "young leaf". They corresponded to U.S. Olive Drab 41 and Dark Green 30. Lower surfaces were most probably aluminium dope. National markings were initially orange triangles on fuselage sides and lower wing surfaces only, serial numbers were in white with the prefix "CW". Those that were still in service after Feb. 23rd 1942 would have received the national flag marking to replace the orange triangle, in the same locations.

DIRTY-MAC
04-15-2006, 07:36 AM
I know that, but there were some very weird paintchemes that Gibbage did, one with a blue camo thing, maybe you can post a pic of it Gibbage?

GerritJ9
04-15-2006, 08:53 AM
I don't think there is any historical basis to those skins. If there is, I have never seen any evidence that confirms that the KNIL CW-21Bs actually flew in those schemes. To be fair, much material was lost after Java fell in March 1942 (for instance, no photos of Dutch Hurricanes are known to have survived, nor of CW-21Bs with the flag marking) so Gibbage may have used an obscure source for those skins, or perhaps they are just artistic licence. But every single photo I have seen of Dutch CW-21Bs shows them in the two-tone camo pattern with orange triangles- not even one in bare metal, unlike the Hawk 75A-7s which can be seen in bare metal finish in several pics. Come to think of it, I can't even recall seeing a photo of one in Chinese markings.

DIRTY-MAC
04-15-2006, 08:29 PM
I hear you. I have never seen a CW-21B in any other paint cheme than the ones you describe, but Gibbage says he have some wvidence of other paint chemes,and there are several pictures
of CW-21s in Chinese markings
but its probably the same aircraft, the first that‚¬īshot down a bomber in 1939 if I remember correctly, and it was a italian Br-20"! used by the Japanese.

I will soon post some intresting history and info about the CW-21 and CW-21B

Gibbage1
04-15-2006, 09:08 PM
I did not do the skins myself. LeadSpitter did them, and Jeronimo did the research and the cockpit. In reality, it was his project. He was doing the cockpit and asked me if I could do the external for him. I agreed and he provided all the referances. He is also Dutch and did a LOT of research on the bird. He is also the one who came up with the wacky cammo jobs. I sent him a lot of screenshots asking to verify the colors, and he said it was good! I dont know his sources at all.

DIRTY-MAC
04-16-2006, 06:30 AM
cool didnt know Leadspitter was involed in it too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif, I know Jeronimo did because I had some contact with him and sent him some stuff on the CW-21B, anyway you guys have done a great job with this beautyful fighter, thank you very much http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

This is my favourite WWII fighter,
going to post some stuff on it soon

DuxCorvan
04-16-2006, 08:26 AM
Gib, I really hope your Demon makes it, since it was your last hope after your PBY lost its chances...

God knows the many hours you have invested in your babies. It would be a pity not one of your Post-PF work would be in.

Besides, this is really an only-chance item. What other sim -past-present or future- would feature a CW-21?

GerritJ9
04-16-2006, 08:39 AM
Considering some of the really obscure aeroplanes in this sim alone (BI-1 and I-185 for starters) I don't see why it won't make it. My guess is that it will be included in the Manchuria add-on so not long to wait.

DIRTY-MAC
04-17-2006, 10:50 AM
found a clip with CW-21Bs flying in formation!
the clip just after the Martin bombers, they are the only clip I have seen of the CW-21B, didnt think there existed one,
can you see them among the Hawk75s?

http://www.awm.gov.au/alliesinadversity/mov/f01884-4.mov

ElAurens
04-17-2006, 10:56 AM
Interesting clip, be sure.

Thanks!

Gibbage1
04-17-2006, 05:30 PM
Originally posted by DuxCorvan:
Gib, I really hope your Demon makes it, since it was your last hope after your PBY lost its chances...

God knows the many hours you have invested in your babies. It would be a pity not one of your Post-PF work would be in.

Besides, this is really an only-chance item. What other sim -past-present or future- would feature a CW-21?

I was paid for it. Oleg would be waisting that money if he never used it.

EJGrOst_Caspar
04-18-2006, 08:09 AM
Maybe he did... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

Feathered_IV
04-18-2006, 08:26 AM
Heh. I wonder if Oleg has a computer in his basement with a private "Il-2 Series, Special Edition" installed. All those extra unreleased and forbidden aircraft on it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

EJGrOst_Caspar
04-19-2006, 03:22 AM
I doubt that. I bet at home he is playing IL-2 1.0. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

Ruy Horta
04-19-2006, 04:32 AM
According to Camouflage & Kentekens the CW-21Bs were delivered in US equivalents of Jongbland (Dark Green No. 30 / Medium Green No. 42) and Oudblad (Dark Olive Drab No.31 / Dark Olive Drab No. 41), the undersurface was supposed to remain unpainted bare metal.

Dark Green No. 30 and Medium Green No. 42 are pretty different, the ODs are almost the same, the general effect is however clear.

At least this benchmark work does not give any evidence for funky paint jobs, but seeing is believing

Platypus_1.JaVA
04-22-2006, 06:17 AM
How beautifull the aircraft is, don't forget it was the amrican incarnation of the A6M zero design philosphy. This means that it had little or no armor protection and was destroyed easily. Especially with the Zero's 20mm cannons. There where also structural problems regarding the tail section. Structual problems aren't modelled in the game (thankfully) but it wasn't a super fighter that some people seem to imagine.

Tooz_69GIAP
04-22-2006, 09:39 AM
We don't think it's a super fighter, we think it's going to be a fun fighter, that will climb rather nicely, and give exciting competition to contemporary opposition!

DIRTY-MAC
04-23-2006, 07:13 AM
Originally posted by Tooz_69GIAP:
We don't think it's a super fighter, we think it's going to be a fun fighter, that will climb rather nicely, and give exciting competition to contemporary opposition!

BULLS EYE!

leitmotiv
04-23-2006, 08:09 AM
I think your Ki-43-I is great, Gibbage1!

Gibbage1
04-24-2006, 02:13 PM
Originally posted by leitmotiv:
I think your Ki-43-I is great, Gibbage1!

Thanks. I hope one day the two will share the same virtual skies. They would get along great togeather!

DIRTY-MAC
04-25-2006, 01:00 PM
Ok here comes some reading that I promised
enjoy:
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g2/DIRTY-MAC/cw-21b1.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g2/DIRTY-MAC/cw-21b2.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g2/DIRTY-MAC/cw-21b3.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g2/DIRTY-MAC/cw-21b4.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g2/DIRTY-MAC/cw-21b5.jpg

pretty hopeles situation....
anyway hope you liked it

next week im gonna post some more about a pilots experience flying the CW-21 Demon

russ.nl
04-25-2006, 02:35 PM
Thx Dirty-Mac, these were on the forum a while back but nice to see again.
Do you by any chans have blueprints of the CW21B?

DIRTY-MAC
04-26-2006, 01:34 PM
Yeah I have whined about it before,
I have some blueprints and seethrough prins somewere I will see if I can find them

PBNA-Boosher
04-27-2006, 06:34 AM
I like the CW-21b, it's a funny little bugger.

Heliopause
04-27-2006, 10:16 AM
P.C. Boer wrote his books in Dutch but "Luchtstrijd Borneo" has a English summary.
I read it last year from the library.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b334/PauseHelio/Borneo4-5.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b334/PauseHelio/Borneo6.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b334/PauseHelio/Borneo7.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b334/PauseHelio/Borneo8.jpg

DIRTY-MAC
04-27-2006, 11:11 AM
Its a pretty hopeless situation for the Dutch,
I have some other combats reports regarding Hawks 75s and they were also in the same hpoeless situation as the CW-21Bs and Brewsters

Platypus_1.JaVA
04-28-2006, 05:56 PM
And after the Japanese had gone, they found Indonesia taken over by freedom fighters. After a series of violent 'police actions' the republic of Indonesia was founded. It meant that alot of good people died for a lost cause. A lot of people who had lived there all their lives where no longer able to return to their homes.

Still, colonialism sucks. No country should try to be the boss of another country.

Gibbage1
04-28-2006, 09:00 PM
Still, colonialism sucks. No country should try to be the boss of another country.

Lets not turn a thread about an aircraft into a political debate.

DIRTY-MAC
06-26-2006, 02:06 PM
Enjoy http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif:

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-211.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-212.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-213.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-214.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-215.jpg

DIRTY-MAC
06-26-2006, 02:08 PM
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-216.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-217.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-218.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-219.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-2110.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-2111.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-2112.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/cw-2113.jpg

DIRTY-MAC
06-26-2006, 02:14 PM
hope you emjoyed it?
I will post some more CW-21 stuff later

Gibbage1
06-26-2006, 03:20 PM
I have asked many times and have gotten no reply about when the Cw-21b will be put in. Looking at the facts, I dont think it will ever see the light of day in IL2. Why do I say that? There are only 2 "add-on's" left before Oleg focuses on BoB, and they dont list the Cw-21b. Plus my questions have gone largly un-answered.

Sorry.

russ.nl
06-26-2006, 04:27 PM
Thanks Dirty-mac, injoyed it very much. And thank you for updating this thread again.

Gibbage he of little faith http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I heard that there may come a free add-on/patch just for this kind of stuff, after all three pay add-ons.
Lets hope so, I do.

vocatx
06-26-2006, 04:43 PM
That would be a shame, Gibbage. I was very much looking forward to trying this beauty out.

Siwarrior
06-27-2006, 02:05 AM
Originally posted by HotelBushranger:
Ugly bloody thing http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

ROFLMAO

Wheres my CAC boomerang eh EH!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

GerritJ9
06-27-2006, 03:30 AM
I am now reading Peter Boer's latest book "Het verlies van Java" and while it does not contain specific data or any test results performed by the KNIL, it does, rather surprisingly, state that both the CW-21B and Brewster as flown by the KNIL were, according to KNIL veterans, very manoeuverable fighters- they were even a match for the Ki.43 when dogfighting!!!! Whereas the RAF Hurricanes would, when possible, dive on their opponents from greater height and then use their excess speed to climb again to above the Ki.43s, thus avoiding dogfighting, the KNIL pilots would, after the initial diving attack, have no hesitation in in dogfighting. The Brewsters were, by the second half of February, all equipped with U.S. reflector gunsights and had sheets of natural rubber applied to the petrol tanks, making them self-sealing. This latter modification was, however, not possible with the CW-21B as the fuel tanks were integral with the wing structure although they did have reflector gunsights by then.
Initially the CW-21Bs were to avoid combat with enemy fighters after the experience over East Java in early February, when the A6M2s chopped them to pieces over Soerabaja- the light construction of the CW was very vulnerable to the Zero's 20mm shells. It was not until a wreck of a shot down Ki.43 was examined that it was realized that there were actually TWO enemy fighter types; the Zero was hardly used over West Java and as the wreck proved that the Ki.43 had a much lighter armament than the A6M2, the restriction was lifted.
The book clearly indicates what disadvantages the Allied fighters had over Java- no early warning system (radar stations were under construction but the first were not operational until Feb. 26th) which made it impossible to identify the Japanese targets in time or guide Allied fighters to the enemy formations; too few fighters available which were always outnumbered when they met Japanese fighters; lack of sufficient AA guns to protect aerodromes. The lack of radar was, I think, the greatest handicap. The Battle of Britain clearly shows how vital this was when facing an enemy who could choose his target and thus concentrate his forces, which the Allies could not. The experience over Java shows what would probably have happened to the RAF in 1940 had radar NOT been available in Britain.

DIRTY-MAC
06-27-2006, 05:11 AM
Just out of curiosity,
the CW-21B had a climbrate of 4500 ft/min
(1372m/sec) at ca a 45 degree angle
what other later fightertypes has around the same climbrate, anyone?

ElAurens
06-27-2006, 05:36 AM
The 109 K4 comes to mind.

Remember that this figure for the CW 21 was initial rate of climb and was not sustainable at higher altitudes.

HellToupee
06-27-2006, 01:52 PM
spit mk 9 was like 4700ft per min, at 25lbs it was over 5500ft permin.

DIRTY-MAC
06-27-2006, 05:03 PM
thats cool, but in the early days nothing was close to the CW-21B in climb. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif
and the CW-21 was even better in climb http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

DIRTY-MAC
08-24-2006, 03:19 PM
bump!
Is Jeronimo around here anywere,
would be interesting to know if he has anything interesting to contribute regarding the CW-21B?
maybe something on the blueish paintcheme?

DIRTY-MAC
11-01-2006, 03:48 PM
bump<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

Otto may have been a weirdo, but he was a dam good fighterpilot.
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/ohhbabyfinal.jpg
aka HOOTCHIE MAMA online

GerritJ9
11-04-2006, 05:24 AM
Patience, patience.... if all goes according to plan the Interceptor will be available with 4.08. But unfortunately there are no maps of areas where it saw combat (East and West Java), nor are they likely to be made before the FP/PF sim is retired.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

The KNIL is dead. Long live the KNIL!

Tater-SW-
11-04-2006, 07:16 AM
Did they actually get in combat more than a couple times? In "Bloody Shambles" I think I have seen them mentioned as in the air twice, and once was a strafing mission, the other time it just said they were flown off to avoid getting bombed.

tater

GerritJ9
11-04-2006, 10:08 AM
The CW-21B saw air-to-air combat over East Java (Soerabaja) on at least two occasions in early February 1942 but suffered badly against the A6M2- they were outnumbered and often caught at a disadvantage- lower altitude, or taking off/landing, destroyed on the ground etc. The survivors were withdrawn to West Java and saw action there until a few days before Java's surrender. Bear in mind that there were not many to begin with- 24 were ordered and delivered pre-war so there wouldn't be as much published about their operations as about the B-339C and D.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

The KNIL is dead. Long live the KNIL!

BigC208
11-04-2006, 03:12 PM
Gerrit,4.08? Is that a sure thing? What about the DXXI? Really curious now, thought 4.07 was going to be the last update and then the whole crew was going to work on BoB.

Nimits
11-04-2006, 05:17 PM
4.06/4.07 are the paid add-ons; after them, it has been widely understood that there would be one final patch to clean up any small new issues, but mostly to add in any final maps or planes that did not fit under the two paid add-ons.

GerritJ9
11-05-2006, 03:25 AM
The D.XXI will probably be in the final roundup patch (4.08?) together with the CW-21B, Avia B-534 and the F2A-3. I would have preferred the B-339C or D to the F2A-3 since historically the F2A-3 wasn't as important as the B-339C/D: the F2A-3 saw combat on only two occasions (Battle of Midway and the interception of two H8K flying boats in March 1942 off Midway) whereas the B-339C/D was in action over Singapore, Sumatra, Borneo, Ambon and Java for three months. The B-534 will be an interesting match against the I-153 although I don't know whether they actually met in combat.
The maps not released in 4.06 and 4.07 will probably be in the final patch as well- Norway and possibly Slovakia/Italy/Bessarabia.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

The KNIL is dead. Long live the KNIL!

Antoninus
11-05-2006, 04:24 AM
Originally posted by GerritJ9:
The maps not released in 4.06 and 4.07 will probably be in the final patch as well- Norway and possibly Slovakia/Italy/Bessarabia.

plus Ian Boys new africa map.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

_____________________________________
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/3734/il2sig26hf.jpg

Actually everybody talks about aerial combat. I maintain that hitting ground targets, and especially ships is more dangerous than aerial combat. - Joe Foss

TROOPER117
11-05-2006, 06:02 AM
Thats great news about the CW-21.. I've become pretty interested in this little fighter, and its use, although relatively limited in the far east, is non the less needed for historical accuracy.
Lets hope some sort of rendition of the Dutch East Indies comes along at some stage.. (fingers crossed eh).

Regards.. Dave S.

DIRTY-MAC
11-05-2006, 10:49 AM
If some of you missed it, I have posted some history on the CW-21/B, and some combat reports on the Dutch CW-21Bs on page 4 in this thread,
Check it out
wery interesting read<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

Otto may have been a weirdo, but he was a dam good fighterpilot.
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c15/HOOTCHIE-MAMA/ohhbabyfinal.jpg
aka HOOTCHIE MAMA online

russ.nl
12-28-2006, 10:14 AM
Bump, don't forget this little pease of art in 4.08!!<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

PH-Valken@HP
http://xs411.xs.to/xs411/07010/banneruss2.png (http://xs.to)

Feathered_IV
12-28-2006, 04:50 PM
+1<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

***********************************************

http://server2.uploadit.org/files/Feathered-sigpic.jpg

"Intelligent, normally observant and answered all questions freely. He was arrogant and proud to be a pilot. Fellow prisoners in hospital consider him mentally unstable."

Treetop64
12-28-2006, 07:18 PM
Bump for a worthwhile thread.

Also, just thinking that the Dutch had a few squads of CW-21s stationed at Indonesia, before the Japanese fighters came in and ripped them to shreds...<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

------------------------------
"It breaks my heart, but I am almost certain that raaaid will get the Nobel Prize in physics before we get the Avenger in PF."
-- Zeus-cat
------------------------------

Feathered_IV
12-29-2006, 05:14 AM
Olegs around at the moment (please notice this thread!) http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/halo.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

***********************************************

http://server2.uploadit.org/files/Feathered-sigpic.jpg

"Intelligent, normally observant and answered all questions freely. He was arrogant and proud to be a pilot. Fellow prisoners in hospital consider him mentally unstable."

Goose.au
12-31-2006, 09:22 PM
Hey all, Long Long time lurker, first post.

I've been waiting for the Avia B-534, Hawk-75, D.XXI and the CW-21 sinec i first saw completed models of these aircraft.

Have been so disappointed so far that these excellent models have not been placed into the game.

Fictional jets are all fun, but in my mind it doesn't get better than early war fighters.

I really do hope that ALL the above aircraft do get placed into the game, especially the Avia and Hawk.

jjtasker
01-01-2007, 01:59 PM
Would be nice if after Oleg officially stops supporting IL2 the SDK tools were released and it would allow the includion of a lot of the stuff that is "done" but not in for various reasons.. like those aircraft caught up in the lawsuit..

VMF-214_HaVoK
01-01-2007, 02:09 PM
What happened to the Curtis P-36 Hawk? (flyable)<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/vmfhavok/theBlackSheep.jpg

VMF-214 The Original Black Sheep Squadron of the IL-2 series are currently recruiting dedicated and mature pilots. Visit us at http://vmf214blacksheep.com/

Goose.au
01-01-2007, 06:39 PM
VMF-214_HaVoK that is what I ment by the Hawk-75, that and the P-36 are essentially the same plane.

Now I'm sure I saw completed cockpits for the planes WAAAAY back just after the AEP was released, and then again before PF was.

But still no P-36/Hawk-75, I'll be incredibly disappointed if they are never made flyable.

Those and the Avia B-534, such a good looking aircraft.

MM-Zorin
01-01-2007, 07:13 PM
And please don't forget the Ju88 variants!

I know, they are no fancy fighters, but still essential additions.

VMF-214_HaVoK
01-01-2007, 07:50 PM
Would be nice to have more variants of the B-25 as well. The one with the Howitzer comes to mind. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

This is are last chance for new planes. Hopefully some of these wishes will come true in 4.08. If not then we will have to wait years for the SoW series to evolve.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/vmfhavok/theBlackSheep.jpg

VMF-214 The Original Black Sheep Squadron of the IL-2 series are currently recruiting dedicated and mature pilots. Visit us at http://vmf214blacksheep.com/

Goose.au
01-01-2007, 08:37 PM
The JU-88 maybe, but I can't see any more B25's.
The team might just not have the time, we shouldn't be expecting much more than what is already completed/very very near completion.