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3.JG51_BigBear
01-30-2005, 09:53 PM
The Zero has long been one of my favorite airplanes. My Grandfather developed a fascination with Japanese aircraft as a pilot in the air force during world war two and after the war built literaly hunderds of models of zekes, franks, oscars, nicks, etc. I remember walking into his den, which was basically one large display case, and being fascinated by the little green planes with the big red meatballs.

I've gotten tired of flying the FW190 and am finding the P-51 far less exciting that I thought I would so for the last week or so I've tried flying the Zeke and I can't for the life of me figure the frigin thing out. Short of pulling the stick into my chest and spining in a circle I can't come up with a decent tactic to save my life. The early versions roll okay but later models don't roll well at all so reversals are next to impossible. The armament also leaves something to be desired so you need to be at point blanck range to score kills but without the horsepower to move that little thing along or the ability to dive its next to impossible to get into range of a well flown navy plane.

I know plenty of ways to defeat them but does anybody have any proven tactics for winning with these things. Thanks.

3.JG51_BigBear
01-30-2005, 09:53 PM
The Zero has long been one of my favorite airplanes. My Grandfather developed a fascination with Japanese aircraft as a pilot in the air force during world war two and after the war built literaly hunderds of models of zekes, franks, oscars, nicks, etc. I remember walking into his den, which was basically one large display case, and being fascinated by the little green planes with the big red meatballs.

I've gotten tired of flying the FW190 and am finding the P-51 far less exciting that I thought I would so for the last week or so I've tried flying the Zeke and I can't for the life of me figure the frigin thing out. Short of pulling the stick into my chest and spining in a circle I can't come up with a decent tactic to save my life. The early versions roll okay but later models don't roll well at all so reversals are next to impossible. The armament also leaves something to be desired so you need to be at point blanck range to score kills but without the horsepower to move that little thing along or the ability to dive its next to impossible to get into range of a well flown navy plane.

I know plenty of ways to defeat them but does anybody have any proven tactics for winning with these things. Thanks.

WTE_Dukayn
01-30-2005, 09:58 PM
I try to keep it low and slow. You can pretty much turn inside anything else in the air. It's true that above about 350 Km/h the controls start to die on you, which just means you have to bleed that speed off. I've actually seen a full loop used to quite good advantage in a Zero to get onto another plane's tail...dunno if I'd recommend it though.

3.JG51_BigBear
01-30-2005, 10:18 PM
I have used the loop with limited success. I've found that if I use up my energy quickly in the climb and use full flaps at the apex of the loop I can flip over really quick turning the loop into a kind of oval. If I can pull the down leg tight enough there is the possiblity of the briefest of shots at the enemies nose. I find that most often the opponenet is gone before I do all this ****.

Low and slow makes me nervous. I used to look for the planes going low and slow, they make the best targets for boom and zoomers. In early war scenarios I don't mind it that much because except for sustained high speed dives, the Zero can keep up with just about anything. The problem with being low and slow against later Allied planes is there total speed advantage that'll destroy you if just putt along right above the waves.

This plane is really a lot harder to fly than I thought it would be. After the A6M3, which is an exceptional aircraft, the whole family seems to fall apart. I've read all the stories of the quick decline of the Zeros towards the end of the war but someone must have devised some tactics for them at least in late 43 early 44.

WTE_Dukayn
01-30-2005, 10:26 PM
with regards to low and slow, you're talking the fight itself, not your cruising speed or whatever. Almost all planes will try and get altitude to gain speed when engaging, so by all means climb as well, but you don't want to go hell to leather into a diving attack. The Zero is a dogfighter: agile and light. It's controls work best below 350 km/h. It is a nervous life being a Zero pilot regardless, the things can flame up so easily. The fact that you can't really run from anything pretty much means if you can't turn the fight to your advantage you are gonna be dead meat sooner or later

Jieitai_Tsunami
01-30-2005, 11:44 PM
I like the zero because you can do almost anything in her. I'm happy alot of people don't know about the zero because they only expect a turning fight.

The zero should be able to climb higher and faster than most other aircraft except the P38 because of it being light. You should keep height and dive on your opponent when he is not expecting it.
In this game this does cause some damage but only when you dive from a large distance and too steeply.

You can then b.n.z in the zero but try to take him out in one pass and stay above him.

The zero can't dive with an opponent well though. It does seaze up and does not roll well.

Maneuvering for me is only when low and slow. In a large dogfight you can sneak away by maneuvering too.

Remember keep the zero fast and use the energy you have because the zero does not make energy by its self well http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

LEXX_Luthor
01-31-2005, 01:15 AM
BB:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I've read all the stories of the quick decline of the Zeros towards the end of the war but someone must have devised some tactics for them at least in late 43 early 44 <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Through PF you can see and feel what all the stories tell of the quick decline of the Zero. There were no winning tactics available for the Zero late in the WAR. The Zero should have been fully replaced with new planes, instead of "upgraded."

Feathered_IV
01-31-2005, 04:36 AM
Going up against Wildcats online I found it useful to initiate a head-on pass. Most opponents will gladly take the opportunity to go head to head with the A6M due to its famous lack of protection. Just before entering gun range I nose down enough to throw off their aim and hold this angle as we pass each other. Often you can see their fire passing just behind you. As soon as they pass by, pull up and over into a tight Immelman. With luck they will think you are still going downhill and indulge themselves with a turn to port or starboard and start down also, bleeding energy as they go. This leaves you above them and with all the advantages.


http://anime-templates.com/images2/Roruni%20Kenshin%20gifs/upload_236829.gif

3.JG51_BigBear
01-31-2005, 06:27 AM
Tsunami-Alright I think this could work with the later models. They have a thicker wing and heavier weapons so they should be able to act as second rate energy fighters.

Feathered- That's a really good idea. I used to do the same thing when I flew the 109.

I guess my next question is what are the terminal dive speeds on the later model zeros and how do I read the speedometer in these things. After three years flying German planes I'm having some trouble adapting to the Japanese gauges. I figured out the fuel gauge system the hard way (kind of a count down system) and I figured out the engine instruments pretty quick but the seepdometer still escapes me.

And Luther, I totally agree with you but I'm determined to figure something out http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.

VF-29_Sandman
01-31-2005, 07:06 AM
remembering how ojisan_rock flew the m2 in cfs2, u couldnt touch him in the head on, and he'd be on ur 6 in a heartbeat if u even thought about turning too soon. he would not fly the zero over 120-125 mph. at this speed, he could flip a dime on u and plug a few shells in...enough to make it hard to control the bird. he also had enough energy for a climb that would throw off a b/z'er with relitive ease. it's all in the timing. and i've never run into a zero pilot quite like him.

the zero shouldnt be flown over 10'000 feet. at or above this height, the performance of the m2 diminishes. where speed='s life in the heavy corsair, hell/wildcat, slow speed is the order for the zeke. the faster u push this kite, the longer its going to take to come around. 300 mph isnt where u want to be in a a6m2 zero.

p1ngu666
01-31-2005, 08:42 AM
use the superb climb.

just run the engine flat out, wid rad open, and the zero is resonable at mid alt. also u dont HAVE to kill your oppent, damage them and force them down, work in pairs too, and climb at every opportunity, i think 230kph is best.

u will probably need to put on some flap in turns http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

the 5b and 5a are the best zero's imo, alot like the 3 tho http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

u dont haveto fly it as a tnb fighter, but it is a useful ability http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Blackdog5555
01-31-2005, 09:47 AM
I've read several Real life encounters with/ about the zero. according to Thatch, poor gunnery and poor tactics was the primary demise of the Zero. After all of the experienced pilots were killed, it wasn't the bad plane but the bad pilots that caused the high loses. Chennault stated that if had the Oscar/Zero instead of the P-40 thats his AVG would have been just as successful. Real life Zero pilots, when they were smart would circle high above the enemy in groups. Wait for the enemy to climb which mean that they slowed down. Then when the enemy was going in a slow climb, split S and attack. Never dive after a fast moving energy fighter. Dont ever stay low or you are dead meat. Stay at about 225-250mph. Drag and bag works well. What I do is to get altitude and wait for an enemy to chase a plane up in a zoom climb, sneak in behind, wait for the plane to slow, get within 100 meters and fire. There are some great stories of Japanese Aces on the web that are fun to read. The 20s are not accurate and have Slow rate of fire so you must get in close. I love the Zero in this game. Not my favorite but fun to fly. A hard plane to master is the Oscar, that telescopic sight is worthless. Impossible to do deflection shooting. and talk about poor armament. 2 light machine guns! Ok for WWI.. but jeesh.

Osirisx9
01-31-2005, 11:01 AM
If you want to learn how to fly that Zeke online, join the Zeke vs Wildcat server in HL. The guys there really know how to handle the wildcat and it can hold its own against the Zeke. However there are some real crafty Zeke specialist on that server who know how to exploit the Zekes talents. Most of the time when I get killed by the Zeke is when he has altitude and gets on my six with a considerable energy advantage especially when I'm chasing another Zeke. The Wildcat can outrun the Zeke but the Zeke can out accelerate the Wildcat thats why it is not wise for the Wildcat to be caught low and slow. I find that allot of Zeke drivers on the "Zeke vs Wilcat" server take advantage of Wildcats slow acceleration poorer rate of climb. Most of all practice , pratice and practice. Dont be fooled by the Wildcat especially when you get a guy who knows not to get low and slow and gey sucked into a turnfight. Visit the "Zeke vs Wildcat" server on HL if you have the merged version of the game and mix it up. If you dont have the merged version , you can always join the Stand-alone server. The Ip for that server is 69.9.37.146:21006

RAF238thOsiris
www.warbirdsofprey.org (http://www.warbirdsofprey.org)

3.JG51_BigBear
01-31-2005, 08:26 PM
Great tips everybody, thanks. I was still hoping someone could explain the speedometer to me.

VF-29_Sandman
02-01-2005, 06:10 AM
map a key to 'toggle speedbar'. then it goes from kmh to kias to mph. u will turn tighter and quicker below 250 mph in a zero. and u'll survive more if u stay under 10k feet; the zeke's just didnt like it upstairs.

3.JG51_BigBear
02-01-2005, 03:40 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VF-29_Sandman:
map a key to 'toggle speedbar'. then it goes from kmh to kias to mph. u will turn tighter and quicker below 250 mph in a zero. and u'll survive more if u stay under 10k feet; the zeke's just didnt like it upstairs. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah I could do that but on a lot of the full real servers there are no speed bars and I'd really like to figure out how to use the cockpit instruments if possible.

NorrisMcWhirter
02-01-2005, 03:56 PM
Hi,

It climbs like a sherpa on speed so use this before initiating attacks/for defence.

Played an odd co-op the other day, Midway 1943, with 44/45 Corsairs/Hellcats vs 1941 A6Ms(!) I shot down two Hellcats using climb to get me out of trouble and got home alright.

Cheers,
Norris

nakamura_kenji
02-02-2005, 04:35 AM
blackdog find that ki-43 is very good plane because of telescope sight make it easier to get very acurate hit from range further than most fighter ^_^. But yes i would like ki-43ll with reflector sight and improved engine.

I hope i get play soon on zero v wildcat server ^_^

midgie
02-02-2005, 08:29 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 3.JG51_BigBear:

I guess my next question is what are the terminal dive speeds on the later model zeros and how do I read the speedometer in these things. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The airspeed indicator (left of compass) goes through two revolutions clockwise reading the markings on the outside ring first (up to 160) then the inside ring. Speed is indicated in knots, IJN use Knots IJA kph IIRC.

For a cockpit reference see http://www.310thvfs.com/AC_Panels.php

As far as tactics the best advice I've been given for the zero was 'don't let them shoot you'.

Ijnpilot
02-02-2005, 09:25 AM
I think the best advice on here so far is don't let them shoot you. Of course there are tactics to take advantage of a planes qualities, but most of it depends on your skill, the other pilot's skill, and a little luck.

In a head on attack I normally nose up and do a tight immelman. Early war American fighters can't react to this effectively, and it leaves you slow (which is good) and at a higher altitude.

When they're on your six, you can do the aforementioned stick into your chest, lower combat flaps and whip around the turn. Wildcats, P-40's, and the other early war planes can't beat the Zero in this. Or you can give it full throttle nose up and hang on your prop until the bigger, heavier fighters are running out of steam.

We all know the American fighters can outdive anything, so if you encounter a pilot who thinks he's slick and goes into a dive just forget about him. If you follow him you won't be able to catch up and you'll lose precious altitude. Eventually he'll have to climb up, and you'll have the Zero's superior manuverablility and acceleration waiting for them.

The visibility in the U.S. fighters is also poor. If you happen upon the luck of an approach that goes unnoticed, you can approach from six o'clock low and if you're accurate with your fire the other pilot may hear a few pinging noises before that lumbering beast is scrap. The visibility in the Zero is fantastic and a wary pilot can see everybody approaching...most of the time.

The armor in the American fighters is nice, but round after round can down even the heaviest of fighters. Make sure your convergance is tight on both the guns and cannon. The trajectory of the cannon is pretty droopy so probably 150m and less of convergance. If you end up real close the cannon and machine guns together can rip apart a Wildcat.

Against aircraft with rear gunners, do what you would against a bomber and do slashing attacks against vulnerable areas which would be the sides and the 8 and 4 o'clock positions.

If in the unfortunate situation you have to engage a bomber and it's armor and armament, go for the engines. They're big and can't take too much punishment. Remember not to get hit.

I hope this compresses most the tactics into one post.

3.JG51_BigBear
02-02-2005, 02:13 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by midgie:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 3.JG51_BigBear:

I guess my next question is what are the terminal dive speeds on the later model zeros and how do I read the speedometer in these things. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The airspeed indicator (left of compass) goes through two revolutions clockwise reading the markings on the outside ring first (up to 160) then the inside ring. Speed is indicated in knots, IJN use Knots IJA kph IIRC.

For a cockpit reference see http://www.310thvfs.com/AC_Panels.php

As far as tactics the best advice I've been given for the zero was 'don't let them shoot you'. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks, I think the knots/kph thing was throwing me off.

Feathered_IV
02-02-2005, 05:34 PM
If you are low and slow contest or outnumbered. Fight with your canopy in the open position. The added visibility is a big help and the reduction in speed is unimportant in that kind of contest. If you are flying at around the 230kph mark you've probable got enough throttle to spare to make up the difference anyway.

georgeo76
02-02-2005, 06:32 PM
My Thoughts (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=26310365&m=5851018142)

3.JG51_BigBear
02-02-2005, 06:40 PM
Great advice, thanks.

EnGaurde
02-02-2005, 09:24 PM
indeed, i think the purest combat ive found has been that zero V wildcat server.

close is a gem.... reallllll close.

ive disassembled an SBD and a wildcat in quick succession flying so close that their wingtips spanned nicely the outside of the canopy frames, you can track their feeble attempts to escape easily with the view pulled right back.

At that range you dont need a gunsight other than as a guide.

i also fly with the canopy open, no bars to obscure the view.

the wildcat may be a hammer in comparison, but the zero is a scalpel and needs to be deftly maneouvered to get to killing range. But, once they're under your knife, the keenness of the blade will result in the surgery being a complete success...

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif