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View Full Version : OT; Has any UKers seen the movie "Hooligans"?



Pirschjaeger
11-14-2005, 10:47 PM
I just watched the movie lastnight. I enjoyed it and thought it was quite interesting.

I am curious though and want to ask the British members who have seen it what they think of the movie.

Fritz

Tooz_69GIAP
11-15-2005, 12:11 AM
This film is called Green Street in the UK, not Hooligans.

I saw it a few weeks ago, and it wasn't a bad movie. It dealt with the problems of football hooliganism in an interesting way.

But hooliganism, as far as I am aware, hasn't been on that kind of level for over a decade. It does flare up now and then, compared to the eighties and early nineties, I don't think it's quite so prevalent in the UK now.

Although, I don't live in London, so I don't know for sure if it's still around. Although, international football has it's problems as England fans tend to cause quite a bit of trouble when they go abroad.

Plus, generally, if it starts getting bad again, it's in all the papers.

CaptAce
11-15-2005, 12:23 AM
I saw the movie and I was confused by it. I don't see anyone could get so worked up about a game. I've been a fan of the same teams my whole life, but I don't ever imagine myself forming a group and having gang wars with other fans over any sport.

I think the idea behind the movie spoiled it for me. Everything just seemed over-dramitic and silly.

Pirschjaeger
11-15-2005, 12:31 AM
Like I said, I enjoyed the movie, but I figured it had been overdone and over dramatisized.

I bought the movie in China and they typically change the movie titles, so I don't know if "Hooligans" would be correct in N.A. either.

The guy that played the American is a Brit isn't he?

Cool movie and thought provoking.

Fritz

dazza9806482
11-15-2005, 05:11 AM
I.D. is a far better film Fritz as is SCUM.

Check them out, actually SCUM is slightly off on a tangent...

speaking of tangents (kind of), anyone seen Romper Stomper?

excellent

XyZspineZyX
11-15-2005, 06:02 AM
When I first saw RomperStomper I walked out of the cinema half way through the film & told the ticket lady it was a load of racsist cr@p. Since then I have watched it a few more times & realised it has a deeper meaning. Quite an interesting & violent film with the old saying of what goes around comes around ringing loudly
There was another one done on footy hooligans called ID. Very good film.
Scum is an absolute shocker, oh to be a 10 year old in Borstal, NOT

dazza9806482
11-15-2005, 06:09 AM
Yeah Romper Stomper is very abrasive, but its becomes clearer later on that the culture represented doesnt come out in the best light

Pirschjaeger
11-15-2005, 06:21 AM
If Scum and ID are anything similar to Trainspotting, forget it. I dispise these types of movies.

Recently I started watching a French movie. Sorry, I forget the name right now, but within a few minutes I had had enough and snapped the dvd in half. Some of these movie makers are sick minded. There's no need to show a person crushing another person's skull while repeatedly smashing them with a fire extinguisher.

They can still portay the most violent acts without graphically showing them. IMHO, the producers that use such graphic tactics are displaying their lack of talent.

Fritz

ploughman
11-15-2005, 06:42 AM
I have not seen it but I thought Elijah Wood was a yank. Football hooliganism is an interesting phenomena and probably a localised manifestation of some universal aspects of maleness. 'Firms' fullfill some mens need to congregate, bond, and beat the cr*p out of each other a la' 'Fight Club.' There is also the corporate entity that is the gang/crowd that has a mind and logic all of its own, it is more than the sum of its individual members and has its own rationale. Some thinkers are of the opinion that British, and more specifically the English, are only one spilt cup of tea away from having 'the red mist descend' all of the time and that there is a disturbingly large ammount of mayhem laying only just beneath the surface of the average Englishman, and that most of the 'reserve' we all hear so much about is there to make sure it stays there. Heny Kissinger thought the British the only nation who seemed to enjoy a good war anymore. Danes and Swedes enjoy motorbikes and mayhem, Englishmen enjoy football and mayhem. It doesn't travel well, unfortunately.

I also hearby claim the title of 'longest run on sentance in this thread.'

Pirschjaeger
11-15-2005, 07:33 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

dazza9806482
11-15-2005, 07:42 AM
Interesting Fritz, Trainspotting is one of my favourite films, why do you not like it?

I can see your point about violence, but on the other hand if something really needs to be shown to convey impact then there are limits on how much a director can 'imply' said acts.

to me, a film which attempts to sanitise violence or other types of graphic action, loses a lot in terms of its feeling of realisim.

unless, as you suggest, it can be done subtley and cleverly.

maybe its just western film culture, but society has been moving to the more visceral side for a while....

SCUM and I.D. are both excellent, brutal and moving films imho

NorrisMcWhirter
11-15-2005, 10:46 AM
I saw the movie and I was confused by it. I don't see anyone could get so worked up about a game.

That's the point - they don't get worked up about a 'game.'

As Ploughman rightly points out, football hooliganism is actually a well organised "pastime" and isn't just reserved for 'nutters', 'chavs' or 'skinheads' - there will often be small, 'cells' of hooligans who have a well defined structure and who will organise trouble with the people they are going to fight through mobile phones or the internet. They can just as easily be City types (MDs, bankers etc) as they can be plasterers.

It's also not confined to England - I think I've said this before but it wasn't so long ago that the Turks were smuggling (IIRC) hooligans from Liverpool into their country to stage trouble (the British police go to great lengths to prevent them moving around by removing their passports when there are 'away' games) between themselves.

There have also been riots in the US following football games (Denver?) but I imagine that wasn't organised in such a manner.

I've not seen the movie as the subject matter doesn't really interest me probably because I think hooliganism is unacceptable. I'm certainly not adverse to violence, however, as rate Scum very highly.

I would also suggest that it's flawed to suggest that just because a director wants to show violence then they don't have enough talent. Peckinpah was certainly violent for this time with The Wild Bunch and he was highly respected as is Takashi Miike, who stunned even me with the last half hour of 'Audition'. Forget Fatal Attraction and bunny boilers - that's child's play (no, not the film http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif) compared to the latter.

Ta,
Norris

BaldieJr
11-15-2005, 10:57 AM
on-screen violence is for the poeple who dont comprehend the depth of words like "kill", "hurt", "rape".

its how a guy takes a great story and ruins it for cash: by making it accessible to even the stupidest.

Tooz_69GIAP
11-15-2005, 11:00 AM
I just have to say, although in some respects I agree that unwarranted violence can at times be unnecessary in a movie, in Trainspotting, and others like it such as ID, La Heine, and others, the violence is there because that is what is there in reality.

Coming from Scotland, and being very aware of violence in the cities, and the culture, etc (worked as a doorman all over Scotland for about 5 years) that there are people who will stick a pint glass into your neck if you look at them wrong, and there are people who will walk the streets looking for someone wearing the wrong coloours, etc.

It happens every day, and it is very visible, especially in some areas in Glasgow, or London - take yer pick.

Perhaps showing the extent of this violence in a mainstream movie will help to highlight the problems (art imitating life, etc), or maybe not. But I think to dismiss certain forms of media as crass, or unprofessional, or whatever because you see a skull caved in; well, I think that is a mistake, but the beauty of the movie industry is you get to pick and choose what you see!

Dunkelgrun
11-15-2005, 11:26 AM
I haven't seen it but must admit to being puzzled as to why 'Green Street/Hooligans' has been made now. As Tooz said, violence on this level has been almost eradicated from British football grounds, yet the world still thinks that it happens every weekend.

The main culprits these days are Enland 'fans' travelling to away games; some English people (not all of them violent) are very xenophobic.

I don't know how the German and Dutch authorities have progressed in tackling football hooliganism but there used to be some hardcore troublemakers there too. Italy has also had problems in the past, while some Spanish and Turkish supporters are beginning to exhibit disturbing signs of racism.

Having been tear-gassed in Turin in 1980 (England fans started the trouble), for doing nothing more than being there, I will certainly be giving the World Cup in Germany next year a very wide berth.

Cheers!

XyZspineZyX
11-15-2005, 05:58 PM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
If Scum and ID are anything similar to Trainspotting, forget it. I dispise these types of movies.

Recently I started watching a French movie. Sorry, I forget the name right now, but within a few minutes I had had enough and snapped the dvd in half. Some of these movie makers are sick minded. There's no need to show a person crushing another person's skull while repeatedly smashing them with a fire extinguisher.

They can still portay the most violent acts without graphically showing them. IMHO, the producers that use such graphic tactics are displaying their lack of talent.

Scum & ID are nothing like trainspotting. Depending on what you want to see both are worth a look (my opinion)

Fritz

Xiolablu3
11-15-2005, 07:00 PM
Trainspotting is a GREAT movie, I love that film.

The violence is there to show what the alternative is for Renton and his mates if they didnt do heroin, and why they have rebelled from the 'norm' ie. go out, get pissed and fight, thats what the 'locals' do. Thats the
role models they have.

I guess if you arent from a bad area of a city in England/Scotland you might not understand, but the violence is certainly needed to show the 'lager lout, pub culture' which is often found in the UK.

There is a big message behind trainspotting about legal/illegal drugs and which are really worse.



Havent seen 'hooligans' but I know that these type of people (football hooligans) DO exist. Amazing and far out it may seem , but trust me , there is a lot of trouble with these people in the UK. I think its more about the fighting than the actual game, they actually enjoy the scrap.

danjama
11-15-2005, 07:04 PM
UP THE GUNNERS! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Xiolablu3
11-15-2005, 07:11 PM
Reeet, ya goooin down ya deeerty cockney luvver. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Pirschjaeger
11-16-2005, 05:16 AM
The poop in my Cornflakes, regarding "Trainspotting" was the image of the dead bloated baby. I didn't think that scene was necessary. I got a soft spot for babies.

I'm also very much against drugs. So basically, the scenes and the behaviors of the characters were quite discusting to me.

There's always the double edged sword when it comes to extreme violence in movies. One side will say that people need to see it to wake up and see reality. The other side says showing the violence just makes it more acceptable. Both sides have valid arguments.

Noticed I pointed out that I enjoyed "Hooligans". This movie has a lot of violence but not so many graphic details. Near the end of the movie one character sits on and punches another character in the face until he is pulled off. The second character is dead.

When I remember the movie I can visualize the act in great detail but the detail wasn't in the movie. That tells me that the movie maker was talented.

In the French movie, a character is out cold on the floor. The other character continuously beats his face with a fire extinguisher. The camera or the view doesn't change during the 20 or so hits. Sorry, I still can't remember the name of the movie.

I've seen more discusting things than these in reality but that is reality and not anyone's choice. **** happens. Someone mentioned that we have the choice of what we want to see in a movie but this is incorrect. You only really know what's to be seen after you've watched it.

Everyone's got their own opinions and that's the way it should be. That's what makes life interesting.

More shocking than anything I've seen in movies is the fact that Baldie and I are on the same side. This tells me I must rethink what I wrote. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Hi Baldie http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Fritz http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif