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View Full Version : Ho 229...that's nice, but what about the Arado 234??



Baltar
02-25-2004, 08:59 PM
Some strange choices for the expansion. What about the Arado 234 (both B and C versions) for a jet bomber? This one actually saw use fer cryin' out loud! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Baltar
02-25-2004, 08:59 PM
Some strange choices for the expansion. What about the Arado 234 (both B and C versions) for a jet bomber? This one actually saw use fer cryin' out loud! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

LEXX_Luthor
02-25-2004, 09:12 PM
Cos it looks more like a Cylon Raider, so you should Be Happy Baltar.


Richard Hatch homepage ---> http://www.richardhatch.com/

__________________
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:
you will still have FB , you will lose nothing ~WUAF_Badsight
I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait... ~Bearcat99
Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age ~ElAurens

WUAF_Badsight
02-25-2004, 09:26 PM
someone bothered to make the Horten bomber which 1C:Maddox Games accepted as being high enough quality so they did the work to add the model into FB



no-one bothered to make the Arado AR-234 tho . . .

prehaps you might like to try

i also would like to see it fly in FB

necrobaron
02-25-2004, 09:30 PM
Me too. It'd be nice to have the world's first jet bomber.

"Not all who wander are lost."

Thrawn888
02-25-2004, 10:16 PM
iv been a major supporter of the ar-234 especially the C since i believe it went faster or carried heavier bombload.

there WAS an ar-234 being modelled back in october i think but the project went dead, sadly no-one has picked up this very useful aircraft.

an while id like it i cannot model at all iv tried its way harder than it looks so i give credit to those modelers that bust there hump to do it

ASH at S-MART
02-25-2004, 10:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Baltar:
Some strange choices for the expansion. What about the Arado 234 (both B and C versions) for a jet bomber? This one actually saw use fer cryin' out loud! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Here is Baltar at home

http://www.aims.ca/Publications/gift/Pics/horse.gif

The name of his horse is GIFT

ASH at S-MART
http://www.thecobrasnose.com/images4/brucecampbellSMart.jpg

Oso2323
02-26-2004, 12:13 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Here is Baltar at home
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hmmmm. That would make more sense if they were giving the expansion-pack away. And from my understanding, much of the direction came from Oleg, not from 3rd party modellers.

I can understand Baltar's frustration - it kind of makes sense to include major aircraft & variants that actually flew in WWII before adding on the '46 stuff. I mean, it's interesting, I grant you. But it's the icing on the cake, not the cake itself.

For what it's worth I've only flown the 262 a handful of times.

ASH at S-MART
02-26-2004, 08:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Oso2323:
And from my understanding, much of the direction came from Oleg, not from 3rd party modellers.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Than you miss understood.

ASH at S-MART
http://www.thecobrasnose.com/images4/brucecampbellSMart.jpg

J30Vader
02-26-2004, 10:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Oso2323:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Here is Baltar at home
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I can understand Baltar's frustration - it kind of makes sense to include major aircraft & variants that actually flew in WWII before adding on the '46 stuff.
.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Before someone comes in and tears you a new one in all caps, the 229 did fly. However, it never saw combat.

I think you mean " variants that actually *saw combat* in WW2 before adding the 1946 stuff. "

And it is only a gift if someone gives it to you.

BaneTheEvilOne
02-26-2004, 10:24 AM
And it is only a gift if someone gives it to you.[/QUOTE]

We are paying for it, but i would pay more to get Arado, Grief, do335, Hs129

ASH at S-MART
02-26-2004, 11:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by J30Vader:
And it is only a gift if someone gives it to you.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>If you buy a dosen eggs and the box holds 13 eggs.. that is a gift... Now you can beyach about how much heavier that box of a dosen is due to the extra egg in it.. But it would just make you look foolish.

ASH at S-MART
http://www.thecobrasnose.com/images4/brucecampbellSMart.jpg

Oso2323
02-26-2004, 11:18 AM
And if you wanted brown bread but they only sold white? :-)

Nice egg metaphor, btw.

Magister__Ludi
02-26-2004, 11:49 AM
Stop it ASH, the original poster is right, there is a priority order for the planes, even though modellers are free to choose the aircraft they want to model. There is no doubt that Ar-234 would have been a much more interesting addition to the game. First of all it was used during the war, it was a much more capable bomber (it had many different bomb delivery methods) and it was slow enough to be intercepted by fastest fighters (interesting situations could develop from here http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif). You will see none of this with Go-229, so what's the use?

BaldieJr
02-26-2004, 12:21 PM
Be a man and prove your point: model it yourself!

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
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+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
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Gibbage1
02-26-2004, 12:27 PM
The Ar-234 was "resurved" when I was looking for a new aircraft to model. The guy who resurved it never finished it. Thats why.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Baltar:
Some strange choices for the expansion. What about the Arado 234 (both B and C versions) for a jet bomber? This one actually saw use fer cryin' out loud! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

ASH at S-MART
02-26-2004, 04:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
Stop it ASH,<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No.. Oh, by the way, WTF are you talking about?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
the original poster is right, there is a priority order for the planes, even though modellers are free to choose the aircraft they want to model.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I never said there was or was not.. I simply pointed out that we were going to get an ADDON one way or another.. And we were going to pay for it.. But due to the initiative and selfless act of people like Gibbage we are going to get more aircraft for the same amount of money.. ie an 13th egg in a 12 pack.. So dont look a gift horse in the mouth!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
There is no doubt that Ar-234 would have been a much more interesting addition to the game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>That is your opinion.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
First of all it was used during the war,<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>True Dat.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
it was a much more capable bomber (it had many different bomb delivery methods) and it was slow enough to be intercepted by fastest fighters (interesting situations could develop from here http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Maybe.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
You will see none of this with Go-229,<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>IYO

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
so what's the use?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Just because YOU can not figure out a use for it does not mean other wont be able to.. I personally would like to have seen other aircraft modled first.. But, when you consder alot of what was done was done for *free* and the fun and love of just doing it.. I sure as H am not going to whine about getting an extra aircraft that I wouldnt have had.

ASH at S-MART
http://www.thecobrasnose.com/images4/brucecampbellSMart.jpg

diomedes33
02-26-2004, 04:38 PM
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but I'm on of the few if not only one looking forward to the go229. It flew during WWII and proved that it was a valid design. The plant was bombed before it became fully operational.

This plane will not be the uber-noob plane everybody thinks it will be. The B-2's FCS does thousands of corrections a second to make sure that plane flys straight. The go 229 has standard wires and brute force to keep it in control.

IMHO, because I haven't flown it yet, should take great skill to fly.

Comparing an ar 234 with a go229 is like comparing a p47 to a b25. They do not perform the same roles.

go229 is a fighter/interceptor
ar234 is a bomber

i want the 234 to be in the il2 also, but like gibbage said it was reserved.

http://www.public.asu.edu/~guthriec/ubi_sig.jpg

Magister__Ludi
02-26-2004, 05:26 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by diomedes33:
I'm probably going to regret posting this, but I'm on of the few if not only one looking forward to the go229. It flew during WWII and proved that it was a valid design. The plant was bombed before it became fully operational.

Comparing an ar 234 with a go229 is like comparing a p47 to a b25. They do not perform the same roles.

go229 is a fighter/interceptor
ar234 is a bomber

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Go-229 will be interesting to fly once, but a Go-229 campaign cannot have the depth of a Ar-234 campaign. Go-229 could not be used as a fighter, not only that it could barely roll, but also it had poor yaw stability (think the way you fly a fighter without rudder in FB, not a pleasant experience -- it wasn't that bad but it can give you an idea) so no fast yoke puling in this plane. It could hardly be an successful interceptor/bomber killer, it reveals a huge profile compared to Me-262, and it had engines inside fuselage next to enormous fuel tanks - not a great idea if you want to attack bombers with those easily flamable early jets. Range was somewhat better than of Me-262 on paper, but it was never tested in practice. In this early form it did not have any of the sophisticated systems fitted on Ar-234 nor its excellent view. Not much of an addition to the current fleet of jets. If I would pick a plane for RLM I would choose Ar-234C, it fixed the speed problem, making it impossible to intercept even with external loads.

[This message was edited by Magister__Ludi on Thu February 26 2004 at 04:58 PM.]

ASH at S-MART
02-26-2004, 05:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
If I would pick a plane for RLM I would choose Ar-234C<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Nobody is stopping your from picking it.. If you hurry and finish the 3DMax model of it and it's cockpit.. and it meets Oleg's standard they might get it in the addon.. You know kind of like Gibbage did the P80. But you better hurry! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

ASH at S-MART
http://www.thecobrasnose.com/images4/brucecampbellSMart.jpg

diomedes33
02-26-2004, 05:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:
Go-229 will be interesting to fly once, but a Go-229 campaign cannot have the depth of a Ar-234 campaign.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well ya got me there, ar234 has more history to develop a campaign.

with out enough information about the go229 I really can't debate. What little information (http://members.cox.net/rebid/Farnborough_05.html) I was able to find said that the stability was as good as any other aircraft. But that's on the internet so who nows how accurate it is.

The plane facinates me, because if it was light years ahead of its time. If there's a way to fight another plane with it I'll find it.

However if it turns out that the go229 has no personality and flys just like a 262 with a slower roll rate, I'll loose interest and go back to my dora and g6/as.

http://www.public.asu.edu/~guthriec/ubi_sig.jpg

MandMs
02-26-2004, 06:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Magister__Ludi:

Go-229 will be interesting to fly once, but a Go-229 campaign cannot have the depth of a Ar-234 campaign. Go-229 could not be used as a fighter, not only that it could barely roll, but also it had poor yaw stability (think the way you fly a fighter without tail in FB, not a pleasant experience -- it wasn't that bad but it can give you an idea) so no fast yoke puling in this plane. It could hardly be an successful interceptor/bomber killer, it reveals a huge profile compared to Me-262, and it had engines inside fuselage next to enormous fuel tanks - not a great idea if you want to attack bombers with those easily flamable early jets. Range was somewhat better than of Me-262 on paper, but it was never tested in practice. In this early form it did not have any of the sophisticated systems fitted on Ar-234 nor its excellent view. Not much of an addition to the current fleet of jets. If I would pick a plane for RLM I would choose Ar-234C, it fixed the speed problem, making it impossible to intercept even with external loads.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah, the loaded speed of the C was still in the catchable range of Allied a/c. You say you would prefer an a/c in the plane set that was only a prototype(234C). http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/crazy.gif Yet the Horton was only a Prototype.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif The Ar234B would be the logical a/c to add.

Strange comment of fuel tanks. The 234's fuselage was two huge fuel tanks.

Better visibility for the pilot? The Horten had 360* vision(above the horizontal) with respectable vision forward. The 234 only had good vision forward(from 10 to 2 o'clock) and upwards forward.



I eat the red ones last.

p1ngu666
02-26-2004, 06:06 PM
it should be interesting to fly
hats off to gib, he got the modeled finished, hope he can cope with the flames http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
im lookin forward to it too

http://www.pingu666.modded.me.uk/mysig3.jpg

necrobaron
02-26-2004, 06:16 PM
I'm looking forward to the 229,P-80,He-162,and Me-163. Not all of us here are whining about getting them.

"Not all who wander are lost."

jensenpark
02-26-2004, 06:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
Cos it looks more like a Cylon Raider, so you should Be Happy Baltar.


Richard Hatch homepage ---&gt; http://www.richardhatch.com/

__________________
_RUSSIAN_ lexx website http://www.lexx.ufo.ru/members.shtml
_Stanly is a _moron_, kai is a walking dead beet, Xev just want sex._
:
_you will still have FB , you will lose _nothing__ ~WUAF_Badsight
_I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait..._ ~Bearcat99
_Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age_ ~ElAurens<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL! Sorry Lexx...I don't think anyone got it but me. Good one anyways!

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LEXX_Luthor
02-26-2004, 06:29 PM
necrobaron:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I'm looking forward to the 229, P-80, He-162, and Me-163. Not all of us here are whining about getting them.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Me too http://d21c.com/walpurgis9/dogs/part4/0070.gif The Rocket Servers will be kinda cool.

I don't know why Baltar is Whining about it.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif ---&gt; http://www.cloudster.com/Sets&Vehicles/Cylon/Cylon.htm



__________________
RUSSIAN lexx website http://www.lexx.ufo.ru/members.shtml
Stanly is a moron, kai is a walking dead beet, Xev just want sex.
:
you will still have FB , you will lose nothing ~WUAF_Badsight
I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait... ~Bearcat99
Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age ~ElAurens

Ob.Emann
02-26-2004, 06:34 PM
Ah, finally, some people who are actually LOOKING FORWARD to the jets. I myself am extremely interested in the Go-229, I have read both of David Myhra's books on its development and have done lots of research and I'm anxious to see how its flight characteristics are modelled.

Aside from the information that Diomedes33 posted on its stability, I also read that the Hortens had equipped flettner tabs to further stabilize the V2 prototype, and apparently, Reimar Horten wanted to test the Ho-IX with a rudder attached, but Erwin Ziller's crash killed off that plan.

Der Oberst von schlechten Piloten