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View Full Version : the manoeverability of the p 51 in the il2 game



eli201
07-11-2005, 10:29 AM
as far as i know the p 51 was one of the best airplanein the ww2, but in the game of the il2 i notice that this airplae have one of the poorest manoeverability.
i dont know if it is because it is not an american game, or because that was in the reality?

bazzaah2
07-11-2005, 10:34 AM
is this a fishing trip?

FritzGryphon
07-11-2005, 10:37 AM
Reality. High weight combined with relatively small, laminar flow wings results in rather poor sustained turn, and sudden stalling characteristics.

I'd suggest you read up on the performance figures in detail before posing such questions claims, and leave out the naked racism.

You are right about one thing, though. Many previous American made quasi-sims have severely overmodeled the capabilities of such aircraft like the P-51 and P-47. This has led many game players to have unrealistic expectations of PF.

Grue_
07-11-2005, 11:46 AM
Welcome to the sim http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Manoeuvrability does not necessarily produce a great fighter. The P-51's strength is it's speed.

If you like yanking planes round in dogfights try some of the early war fighters as these were much lighter and more manoeuvrable aircraft.

SeaFireLIV
07-11-2005, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by eli201:
as far as i know the p 51 was one of the best airplanein the ww2, but in the game of the il2 i notice that this airplae have one of the poorest manoeverability.
i dont know if it is because it is not an american game, or because that was in the reality?

Either this is a troll fishing attempt or he wasn`t happen with the detailed responses he received on SimHQ. He posted the exact same question there. The guys there are right, eli201. Live with it and learn to fly the P51.

SeaFireLIV
07-11-2005, 12:10 PM
Happen=happy.

Why don`t the **** forum allow me to make edit corrections sometimes?

Chuck_Older
07-11-2005, 12:13 PM
I'm gonna go against the grain here.

"Maneuverability" is not the simple act of making a tight turn.

The "P-51" (there are several variants, each with it's own characteristics which may affect flight performance) is a manueverable aircraft- but not the most manueverable one, by far. Stop thinking of maneuverability as meaning "the aircraft which turns the best", eli201.

At certain speeds, the P-51 will make quite good use of it's manueverability.

geetarman
07-11-2005, 12:20 PM
It's ok - really! Push aside what think the plane should do, and learn what it can do. In 4.01, it has become a harder to plane to enter combat with. It needs constant trimming to fly straight and on course. Any change in pitch, power or speed is going to result in a correction with the cotrols of some sort. It no longer "rides on rails."

Unlike what you might believe, the Mustang was not a great low-alt, turn and burner. I read a great account one time of a pilot in the 8th AF in England who was used to acclimate the green USAAC pilots coming into the ETO. The grrenhorns believed that the war was over because of what the 51 could do. This particular pilot would take up a weary old P-40 stored at the base and mock dogfight the new guys in their Mustangs. The fights would occur at low alt. The old 40 would clean their clocks at that alt!

Now, what can the Mustang do? Well, fly it at higher alts and fast and you'll see. It handles verrrry well at high speeds, better than almost anything. At higher alts, it is pretty easy to get a guy off your six by utilizing it's high dive and level speed, coupled with it's superb high speed agility. Spit's, P-47's, Lightnings, German planes, whatever. Provided that you have miles of open air below you, you can wring that thing out and most planes can't follow you.

To fly the Mustang well, expand your concept of the "battlefield." Don't look at your fighting area as being a small box to work in, like you would in a Zero, Hurricane or even a 109 or Spitfire. Use the sky and stay fast.

The D20 version also has a gyro gunsight which assures hits if you use it correctly. You won't miss, provided you know how to operate it!

In sum, the P-51 earned it's rep as being a great fighter plane. Read the accounts of the aces. None of them really thought it was the best at everything. Most were very honest. It flew best while high and fast. Up there, the aces felt they had a plane as good or a bit better than anything the Germans and Japanese threw at them. Down low, or in a close-in turn fight, was a different story, and they knew it.

Good luck and stay with it.

horseback
07-11-2005, 12:26 PM
I'd suggest you read up on the performance figures in detail before posing such questions claims, and leave out the naked racism.
The word is "nationalism," my friend. There is no distinct US race, although we have produced a variety of distinctive blends. My own childrens' ancestors have arrived here via means as varied as the 'Asian land-bridge', the Mayflower, a German tramp steamer, Ellis Island, and Northwest Orient Airlines.

Maneuverability, as Chuck has already pointed out, is not merely the ability to turn a tight circle at 120mph indicated. The Mustang was very maneuverable at high altitude and high speeds. eli201 has probably not heard the whole story in context.

cheers

horseback