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EoT.Patton
11-18-2010, 12:13 AM
This is for those who have beaten the game.

<span class="ev_code_RED">*SPOILER*</span> !!!!!!!!!

May I say .. WTF!? Can anyone explain the ending to me? I was trying to listen to what the Goddess was saying while I was hopping around on "Tron-Like" platforms, but I didn't catch much, however, it seemed like she had an angry tone. Saying stuff like "You have 5 senses, we have 6. We kept one from you; Knowledge" .. or whatever.

Then, forcing Desmond to kill Lucy, and the Goddess says "It's done. She is lost" or whatever.

I am so confused! After spending literally like 15 hours today playing this game, the ending has disappointed me and left me wanting answers.

I don't see how another Assassin's Creed could come out, because, it seems it's all over. I know they will be releasing DLC, but, while I haven't searched, have they said for any DLC to add-on to the ending? Now that Desmond has the Apple, I don't understand what that means for mankind. O_o

On another note, while Desmond and Lucy were getting into the old underground area with the statues of Altair and the others, Desmond said "Ezio came back when he was much older. Why did he come back?"

Well? Why did he come back?! I was expecting all of this to be answered at the end. Yeah, he left the 1419, 1420, 1421 with the image but, why was he in the statue area?

And one more thing. While you're jumping around, pulling levers in that church, and even when you get in and see the Apple, Desmond see's Ezio doing so. However, when you were Ezio, you went to, I believe the place in AC2, and put the Apple back and locked it away. SOOOO, Why would Ezio go and take the Apple back?.. Then, how did it return back there again?

Sheesh!

Anyone else have anywhere near as many of these thoughts going through their head as I do? I suspect if you play an hour a day for a few weeks or whatever to beat the game, you may miss some of this, but when your entire day is just Assassin's Creed .. it's the only thing on your mind. ROFLMAO

Shiboleth17
11-18-2010, 06:08 AM
Yeah, I feel like the ending gave more questions than answers. Have you seen the truth yet? 16 mentions something about Lucy being untrustworthy, so that is probably why she needs to die.

They can (and hopefully will) release another AC, because there is still the whole problem with the world needing saved from some cataclysm that could wipe out all life on earth. So in AC3 (possibly) Desmond will likely use the The Apple to determine where the locations of the temples are and activate them to save earth. Also, they could always release new games about other assassins unrelated to Desmond... This way, they could create any world they want. I feel like they might go this route when they finish Desmond's story.

No idea why Ezio would come back to Monteriggioni except to leave some hints about where he hid the Apple.

I don't think Ezio originally placed the Apple back into the spot from AC2, since it later shows Ezio leaving the Colosseum in Rome. That was the first and only place Ezio hid the Apple.

One thing I found interesting about the end was the line that was spoken after a few seconds into the credits. I believe it said something like "****, he's gone into shock. Put him back in the machine. It's the only way to fix this." Then another character says something like "but the animus did this to him." "Am I the expert or not, Do it!" "No."

This gives me a few ideas. I believe this dialogue could be one of several things. First, it could simply be Shaun and Rebecca (or more than likely other assassins, since the voices are male and not British) trying to get Desmond back into the animus, which is why you end up back in Rome as Ezio when the credits end.
Second, it might be a flashback of a memory. Which means it could be Desmond's personal memory, or the memory of an ancestor. The only memory I could think of that might make sene is that the dialogue could be the moment when Vidic pushed subject 16 too far with the animus and drove hime insane. Then abstergo created a clone of 16 in order to get the info they want, hence, subject 17 (better known as Desmond).
Another possibly I have though of, is that this dialogue is going on in the real, real world. what I mean by that, is that all of the time that Desmond thought he was escaping, and going to Monteriggioni etc. was actually spent in an animus (so Ezio's was actually a memory within a memory). Then, you hear that dialogue because Desmond (or some descendent of Desmond) is going into shock from too much exposure to the animus, and comes out of it for a second after he sees the memory of Desmond killing Lucy.

The stuff that bothers me most about the ending is what 16 says in the Truth. Some of the craziness that comes out of his mouth leads me to believe one or another of my above theories...

Anyway, let me know what you think of that.

EoT.Patton
11-18-2010, 08:57 AM
You bring up some good points. First off, I did not watch The Truth in Brotherhood, so I bet that probably answered some questions. I wonder why Lucy couldn't be trusted.

The end when it was rolling through the credits did make me wonder, because as you said, it was just male voices, so I figured it had nothing to do with Desmond. Ending up back as Ezio in the end, I believe, had nothing to do with the voice even, but just so you can continue playing. (Who knows!? .. maybe the voices did go with this story somehow, someway.)

I guess I'll have to see The Truth, but, I suspect it'll probably just cause more questions then answers.

And yes, I do hope for another Assassin's Creed, though, I don't know how they could top this one and make it better.

Caesar010
11-18-2010, 03:59 PM
I tend to agree with Shiboleth17's hypothesis of a memory within a memory. That having been said, I was watching the truth video and then went back and watched the one from AC2 where Minerva can be seen holding an apple and controlling the humans.

Do you think it's possible that Subject 16, when referring to the woman who could not be trusted, actually meant Minerva? (Would he refer to her as a woman, a god, either, or both?) Thus, Lucy's death could be foreseen as an act to prove this point.

Just some food for thought as I continue to think about the drastic turn at the end.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/disagree.gif

Piflik
11-18-2010, 04:14 PM
Another possibly I have though of, is that this dialogue is going on in the real, real world. what I mean by that, is that all of the time that Desmond thought he was escaping, and going to Monteriggioni etc. was actually spent in an animus (so Ezio's was actually a memory within a memory). Then, you hear that dialogue because Desmond (or some descendent of Desmond) is going into shock from too much exposure to the animus, and comes out of it for a second after he sees the memory of Desmond killing Lucy.


I thought so, too, after hearing Subject 16's message in the Truth Sequence. I guess the 'real' protagonist of the AC series is Desmond's son...

EoT.Patton
11-18-2010, 06:15 PM
Definitely an interesting thought process. Looks like I need to see The Truth to figure out what's going on here.

MrT858
11-18-2010, 10:03 PM
Seeing as there seems to be alot of theories being thrown around ill try mine. First being that Lucy is/was probably a templar. At the very end the apple talks about the cross darkening the horizon which im assuming to be the templar symbol; from that i gather that someone in the room at that point in time is a templar aka Lucy. Also more clues pointing to this are the red footseps going back and forward outside the villa; (when u play as desmond and go outside for the ten mins in eagle vision). Now based on the emails i read on the computer everyone has a surveillance duty to do including Lucy. They are also red meaning at least as far as it goes in the animus; enemy. Lucy also had access to absturgo still as she accesses their mainframe at least once that i can think of and tells you that they are training templars. My last bit on the whole Lucy thing and its been a couple of years so i may be wrong but wasnt she missing a finger in the first game when she reveals she is an assassin; but as we know from AC2 Leonardo invents a way to use the blade without the loss of the finger and any modern assassin would know that, but it is possible that she only thought a finger had to be removed because she had only seen it in the animus and was not a real assassin. My second theory is that possibly you never escaped absturgo and you are still in the original animus being fed some sort of memory that will lead them too the apple; but im probably wrong on that one. Last thing I want to point out is that it is very possible you are desmonds son or something due to the fact that if you look and listen closely while your collecting pieces of the truth; you hear a sonogram and what could possibly be a fetus. So who know i guess we will find out eventually.

Vaddix
11-18-2010, 11:06 PM
Why has nobody mentioned EVE. Like really thats one of the most exciting part of the game. I dont get how people dont understand the ending. It was a cliffhanger, not suppose to understand it.

Lucy was killed because she was a threat the Desmond and Eve's reunion, be it Desmond's feelings for her or her Templar ties.

Vaddix
11-18-2010, 11:34 PM
Another explanation. We all know its the SUN that brings about the end of the world.
WHAT IF..... Its Desmond's son? Someone mentioned they heard a heartbeat like in the womb in the truth sections.

WHAT if they made him kill Lucy, because she will become pregnant with his son?

sassiecas
11-19-2010, 01:24 AM
Lol.. sooo I bet the people at Ubisoft are all sitting back watching people speculate with smirks on their faces! All of you make valid points and I can't decide which theory I like better. You know what would be really funny? If they released another game that gave no answers and even more questions.. or better yet no game at all LOL.... I'm not sure about the next game or not but I honestly think they'll have to bring it into a more modern time period soon to save the world from the sun in 2012... I'm getting really tired of the 2012 thing... kind of annoyed that they had to drag this into the game. I was also wondering about the red trails you see in Eagle vision out side modern day Monterriggioni

jcquik
11-19-2010, 01:43 AM
This ending kicked my as....lol. I was shocked desmond killed Lucy.....Like you all Im pretty confused on what happened.....here's my take on everything.

Firts off I think Lucy is/was still a templar. Since the second game Ive been expecting somebody to betray desmnd. I actually thought it would be Shaun at first. There are a couple of clues as to why I believe this. The first being the amout of access she still has with Abstergo, during sequence 5 & 6 she totally disappears, and you see the red trail leading back and fourth from the fountain to mario's study. Red could either mean blood or Templar. Personally i believe its more likely to mean Templar. Then if you solve the puzzle's subject 16's video says she can't be trusted. not she as in lucy neccesarily but a "she" in general. Then at the end Juno talks about balancing the cross and reuniting with "eve". Really anything is possible but keep in mind that desmond really has no way of knowing for sure that anyone is telling him the truth. If you think about it though it was kind of forshadowed with the whole machivelli storyline. remember nothing is true. everything is permitted.

jcquik
11-19-2010, 02:03 AM
another interesting thing is the memory within a memory theory.....when they first arrive at monterregoni they are discussing the possibility.....I kind of ignored the conversation when it happened but then during the credits you hear the two voices. First of it obvious it was used to be able to get the player back in the game. Ive read a couple of interesting theories and it could really be anything. I dont think its one of desmond decendants because of the whole sun thing in 2012 and satellite launch being 72 days away. I still think thats a big part of the game. (of course if Lucy is a templar then she could have made those things up just to get the piece of eden and Juno). Personally I believe its desmond himself which is why he went into shock according to the voice during the credits. I think he might back at abstergo and they captured him again and would make him go through that memory in order to find out what happened to lucy and the PoE. Remember if you read the emails lucy kept writing to someone who said they would look into desmond's bleeding effect and they were supposed to meet at assasins headquarter's or he could be back at assasin's headquarter's and they had him go through the memory to find out what happened to lucy because desmond repressed the memory and shaun and rebecca were frozen so they wouldn't remember. I'm kinda leaning toward the latter because it seems more plausible and whether Lucy was a templar or not the assasin's order would want to know what happened. Just some thoughts of mine. let me know what you think and also if you guys have any theories........no matter what I can't wait untill Assassin's creed 3!

sassiecas
11-19-2010, 02:06 AM
Yeah I've been mind f*cked for the last couple of hours since beating the game.... love it and hate it all at the same time... who else feels this way???????? I keep reading some official articles and most critics agree that this game is just going to be a stepping stone setting Ubisoft up for something really big later on hopefully in the next game. Also I think they wanted to have it out with Call of Duty and get a non-frustrating new unique multiplayer game out there.

sassiecas
11-19-2010, 02:14 AM
Oh SNAP Don't forget the apple can show the future too! Ezio used to to find out where Caesar or whatever his name was going to be at! So maybe that whole ending scene hasn't happened yet and it was a future image... but idk... just another theory!

JarheadButtle
11-19-2010, 08:56 AM
Another theory just to throw in there as i was scrolling through all these different theories....


16 mentioned Desmond's son....


What if this whole game is just going to be a mind f*** and we find out Desmond's son is the one reliving these memories. They mentioned a memory within a memory, so it's possible.

I think that would be an interesting route.

Piflik
11-19-2010, 09:11 AM
You mean like I said in my first post in this threat? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

One more thing...if you talk to Lucy and the others while not in the Animus, Desmond asks some questions about how they knew how to build an Animus or how Lucy knows all that stuff about Abstergo...the answers are all quite nondescript...

When I first played AC2, I thought the complete team is an Abstergo setup to make Desmond continue using the Animus, but now I think Lucy is a Templar-double-agent, planted into the Assassin-cell long time ago...and I mean really long, since she and Rebecca have already become friends before Lucy started to 'infiltrate' Abstergo 7 years prior to Desmond being abducted...

Caesar010
11-19-2010, 09:45 AM
Regarding the Red Footprints, I'll admit I never actually got a look at them. I went out once into the village and collected the artifacts then rarely ever saw an opportunity to go out again so unfortunately I don't know exactly when they appear. However, I do remember reading an e-mail where Rebecca says she will be going out to get groceries and asks if anyone wants anything. Does anyone know when the footprints appear in relation to e-mails being sent out?

Speaking of e-mail, Juno57 (Lucy's e-mail). Temple of Juno that the apple is located on top of and 57 (Wild guess) Oct 4, 1957 the year Sputnik was launched or Nov 3, 1957 Sputnik 2 was launched. Rebecca's email, GuyFawkes Guy Fawkes day is Nov 5.

Also, I've seen a lot of talk of the shroud being used to heal, in another post. Probably something from AC2 that I'm forgetting but also worth mention here.

(Interesting tidbit, beat the game at 6:30am on Nov 18, my time. That's 6, 30. Which, when multipled by 2 and added together... 6x(2)+30x(2)=72. And, 18th when mupltiplied by 4 equals, you guessed it 72! Take that Ubisoft I can make random sequences of numbers mean things too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/inlove.gif )

Piflik
11-19-2010, 10:09 AM
The 'law of small numbers' in perfection http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Vaddix
11-19-2010, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by JarheadButtle:
Another theory just to throw in there as i was scrolling through all these different theories....


16 mentioned Desmond's son....


What if this whole game is just going to be a mind f*** and we find out Desmond's son is the one reliving these memories. They mentioned a memory within a memory, so it's possible.

I think that would be an interesting route.
He also mentioned that he is too late and everything he holds dear is gone.
I like it. It is a total mind ****.

tjmd018
11-19-2010, 11:40 PM
Just finished ACB for the 2nd time. Still the ending is messed up, but Juno says before Desmond stabs Lucy she says, "The path must be opened." Then if listen to 16 in the truth he says, "Her DNA is the key." referring to Eve's. I know this is just a guess, but The Truth video from AC2 you hear both Adam and Eve speak to me their voices sound very much like Desmond's and Lucy's. That being said, I believe Desmond is the modern day reincarnation of Adam and Lucy is Eve. And for the path to be open the DNA of Eve{Lucy} is the key to opening the path through blood. I'm not saying Lucy died, because we've seen Ezio get stabbed twice{with the DLC} in AC2 and survives. Lucy could possile be in a comatose state till Desmond finds the temples. As for the voices during the credits we hear desmond going in to shock. I believe the Apple drain some of his life away as it did when Ezio used it in the game. I think one of the voices other than Desmond is the William for the e-mails. So what do the rest think?

MasterSamson88
11-20-2010, 12:00 AM
I feel you might be right, there's no way to know for sure of course, but with that being said there's no definitive proof that Lucy is dead either.

I do have this aching suspicion that she'll be alive somehow in AC3

SWJS
11-20-2010, 03:07 AM
Just finished ACB for the 2nd time. Still the ending is messed up, but Juno says before Desmond stabs Lucy she says, "The path must be opened." Then if listen to 16 in the truth he says, "Her DNA is the key." referring to Eve's. I know this is just a guess, but The Truth video from AC2 you hear both Adam and Eve speak to me their voices sound very much like Desmond's and Lucy's. That being said, I believe Desmond is the modern day reincarnation of Adam and Lucy is Eve. And for the path to be open the DNA of Eve{Lucy} is the key to opening the path through blood. I'm not saying Lucy died, because we've seen Ezio get stabbed twice{with the DLC} in AC2 and survives. Lucy could possile be in a comatose state till Desmond finds the temples. As for the voices during the credits we hear desmond going in to shock. I believe the Apple drain some of his life away as it did when Ezio used it in the game. I think one of the voices other than Desmond is the William for the e-mails. So what do the rest think?
I feel like this is the most plausible and most acceptable theory. It certainly relieves some of the "HOLY CRAP I JUST FRIKKIN KILLED LUCY" vibe. Also, Desmond being the one in shock makes the most sense, because if you remember, as Lucy fell to the floor, so did Desmond.


I feel you might be right, there's no way to know for sure of course, but with that being said there's no definitive proof that Lucy is dead either.

I do have this aching suspicion that she'll be alive somehow in AC3 This is true. 16's puzzles from AC2 imply that the Shroud was capable of healing and resurrection. If Lt merely injured, they could probably just patch her up with futuristic medicine. If she's dead, Desmond will probably become obsessed with finding a way to bring her back, so if he learned anything from 16's puzzles, he'll probably go after the shroud when he regains consciousness.

Sniper4488
11-20-2010, 05:00 AM
The ending is just Like O_O wtf and who knows whats gunna be in the next game.... cant wait(thats if they make another one)but idk all of this stuff is just like so confusing

sassiecas
11-20-2010, 03:17 PM
Originally posted by EzioTheAssassin:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Just finished ACB for the 2nd time. Still the ending is messed up, but Juno says before Desmond stabs Lucy she says, "The path must be opened." Then if listen to 16 in the truth he says, "Her DNA is the key." referring to Eve's. I know this is just a guess, but The Truth video from AC2 you hear both Adam and Eve speak to me their voices sound very much like Desmond's and Lucy's. That being said, I believe Desmond is the modern day reincarnation of Adam and Lucy is Eve. And for the path to be open the DNA of Eve{Lucy} is the key to opening the path through blood. I'm not saying Lucy died, because we've seen Ezio get stabbed twice{with the DLC} in AC2 and survives. Lucy could possile be in a comatose state till Desmond finds the temples. As for the voices during the credits we hear desmond going in to shock. I believe the Apple drain some of his life away as it did when Ezio used it in the game. I think one of the voices other than Desmond is the William for the e-mails. So what do the rest think?
I feel like this is the most plausible and most acceptable theory. It certainly relieves some of the "HOLY CRAP I JUST FRIKKIN KILLED LUCY" vibe. Also, Desmond being the one in shock makes the most sense, because if you remember, as Lucy fell to the floor, so did Desmond.


I feel you might be right, there's no way to know for sure of course, but with that being said there's no definitive proof that Lucy is dead either.

I do have this aching suspicion that she'll be alive somehow in AC3 This is true. 16's puzzles from AC2 imply that the Shroud was capable of healing and resurrection. If Lt merely injured, they could probably just patch her up with futuristic medicine. If she's dead, Desmond will probably become obsessed with finding a way to bring her back, so if he learned anything from 16's puzzles, he'll probably go after the shroud when he regains consciousness. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I was watchign the credits and I thought that one of the voices sounded similar to a less hysterical less distorted version of Subject 16... I'm not honestly sure he's really dead either lol...

meceron
11-20-2010, 03:37 PM
Ok so I have read all of the theories and now i got my own. One in AC2 when the god talks to Ezio she refers to Desmond which in that case if you where in a memory of a memory and Desmonds son she would be talking to Desmonds son not Desmond (unless Desmond is also the sons name lol mind F***) anyway to back up that theory even more it says theres 72 days left until the satilite launch which they give a date and the year Desmond is in 2012 meaning he would have to have a son already. This also may bring up that yes subject 16 was pregnant that could be desmonds son blah blah blah but that just leads to a crap ton of more questions so lets leave it as simple as it gets lol. Anyway next if Desmond really is the only peron and its not his son that means the voices at the end are of two people refering to Desmond he did go into shock after the god kills Lucy so either its William and somone else or he got captured. Lastly I like Lucy way to much to think about her being a Templar so im going to say shes not and the reason to kill her or stab her is to put the course of fate in the right path slowing the team down balancing the templars and assassins. This meaning if she dies then Desmond will search for a way to bring her back posponing his objective or if she is stab slowing the objective still but seriously I dont think shes dead and to bring up one more fact Lucy iis to intune with the objective of the apple meaning she wouldnt have had sex with Desmond theres no way to many complications. Ill be adding more to my theory in an hour or so just gota put some more speculations in a compacted story. There will be another game.

harryslik
11-20-2010, 05:38 PM
So whenever somebody touches the apple at first they see the future. Other than Mario, but i think its because he was not meant to. So I believe we were seeing the future when Desmond goes to hide the apple again with the group, and then they make him stab Lucy. So in the next game you have to stop yourself from killing Lucy, and stop the Templars. That seams relatively possible to me.

RiTCHi3x
11-20-2010, 05:50 PM
Well I am intrigued by the whole 2012 part of the story and how it fits in with the historic part. So what I think could be something the bit about Adam and Eve , well I think that Desmond could possibly be a decendent to Adam and to save the human race 2012 etc he needs to find Eve. It is possible that you need to kill Lucy to mabye stop Desmonds temptations/distractions so that he can fufill what is needed in him.

LT21Titans27
11-20-2010, 06:26 PM
IF you listen to the voices, 3 of them, the first two are unkown, , one could possibly be 16, biut idk about that, the last one, the one that says "no!" is Desmond, no doubt about it

tjmd018
11-20-2010, 07:59 PM
I just remebered something that Minerva said in AC2. She named 3 "gods" herself, Juno,and Jupiter. She also stated that Juno was before her, and Jupiter was before Juno. At the ending of ACB Juno states that the one Desmond seeks is out of her sight. Could she be meaning Jupiter is the one we seek?

Piflik
11-20-2010, 08:12 PM
Yes. I think Jupiter is still alive and in fact is what people today call God (with a capital G)...and that he is the leader of the Templars.

Vaddix
11-21-2010, 12:04 AM
Originally posted by tjmd018:
I just remebered something that Minerva said in AC2. She named 3 "gods" herself, Juno,and Jupiter. She also stated that Juno was before her, and Jupiter was before Juno. At the ending of ACB Juno states that the one Desmond seeks is out of her sight. Could she be meaning Jupiter is the one we seek?
Jupiter is male. Each god states they are no longer living. The Capitoline Triads. Each is a preconceived recording. Like they know what exactly is going to happen in the future and have set events into motion that cannot be changed.

Vaddix
11-21-2010, 12:07 AM
Originally posted by Piflik:
Yes. I think Jupiter is still alive and in fact is what people today call God (with a capital G)...and that he is the leader of the Templars.
The gods are clearly not on the Templar's side. They each say guard against the cross. When they say cross they are referring to the Templar's. The Templar's main Symbol is the pagan cross.

Bugattiboy91
11-21-2010, 12:40 AM
Yes, I would agree that this game leaves more questions than answers, but maybe it so that they can make an all-answering series concluding game that could may or may not take place in 18th Century France (because of the revelation Shaun had). If you bought the guide it reveals that the`answer Shaun came up was the 2 symbols appear in the Declaration of the Rights of Man and the Citizen which was a radical of the French Revolution.

On another note, why did Lucy have to die? And I have seen some people question whether is Lucy is actually dead. I guess we will just have to wait and if Ubisoft tells us or not.

Again, like people have said earlier Minerva mentioned 3 "gods" specifically. We have seen Minerva and Juno, but we have yet to see Jupiter. That gives me some what of an assurance of a another game in which something happens with Jupiter's temple as the re-occurring theme is to do one temple a game.

In terms of people saying what happened with the voices in the credits. The Complete Official Guide reads:

...Desmond is vaguely aware of being manhandled into the back of a van. Voices argue over returning him to the Animus, and he barely able to protest before the darkness descends again.
You could argue that means it IS Desmond who goes into shock. And it says "...barely able to protest..." which would probably account for the weak "No." and the end of dialogue between the voices. As for who the voices belong to I have no idea and do not wish to make wild accusations like other people.

Lastly, Just a tid bid of information the title for the solving all of 16's puzzles trophy is Morse code and translates to "I AM ALIVE."

I done for now.

P.S. Where the hell did 72 come from? I thought 42 was key to the universe and all that weird a-ss sh1t.

Agentbarto
11-21-2010, 05:08 AM
Hi everyone here are just some hypotheses I've come up with after finishing this game.

Towards the end when Desmond is freerunning through the Apple's resting place, I noticed Minerva was telling the story of man and how he came to be. She seems to have some animosity towards humans because of their uprising. She says something to the effect that we were never mean to be intelligent; apparently it was an unintended accident... we were meant to be slaves to them, the overlords. After viewing 16's cryptic warning this leads me to believe that it's quite possible that he was referring to Minerva, at least as likely as Lucy.

I am somewhat scared about Lucy's character I actually liked her so I'd hate for her to be a traitor. Here are some things I found odd. During a few conversations in the Sanctuary, Desmond seems to be suspicious of her ability to get information in and out of Abstergo after they fled. She simply replies that some old passwords work. and Desmond and Rebecca seem to buy it. I dunno a little shady considering she disappears from the Sanctuary near the end for the span of a couple of Memory Sequences. However it's possible that she went into town to get some eats and we missed this. I'm inclined to question this however, since we never saw either Rebecca or Shaun missing when they went; but again, we may have missed this. Rebecca and Shaun seem unphased by this (and they are pretty perceptive I believe, especially Shaun) so it's possible that she is an Assassin.

In accusing Lucy, some have been quick to point out that there were red footprints leading from the Sanctuary to the bottom of the steps outside the Villa. I believe these belong to the traitorous Thief that committed suicide after being discovered. In the beginning he was seen leaving the Sanctuary so it may have been him. Also after completing the first memory sequence and leaving the Animus the footprints are already there and this was before any known trip to town to get something and no one was missing. Plus since artifacts can be found via Eagle Vision it's possible that those footsteps may have survived the test of time for those perceptive enough to notice them.

A simple explanation: 16 was somewhat bitter because of how Lucy treated him, maybe he felt used and wanted to warn Desmond about Lucy, after all this was encrypted before he died. (wasn't it? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif ) Lucy to my recollection didn't talk throughout the Truth this time so maybe she felt guilty again.

A quick thing about Desmond's son is that the son is supposed to be a fullblood alien because it is suggested by Minvera/Juno and 16 that Eve and Desmond are halfblood and that their progeny would be a restoration of the ancient race.

A small little theory linked to the above one; Lucy may be turned into a genetic Eve. We know according to Minerva's story inside the church, her race was very close to creating a technology to restore or prolong life, but it was never completed because of the uprising. Since Desmond activated the Apple by touch (most likely a genetically linked activation) it's possible that if Lucy is in fact dead and not just injured, Desmond might be able to bring her back using what Minerva and her race left behind. Of course this might result in a manipulation of her genes, leaving Lucy as the new Eve (named so either because she is genetically similar to Eve or because is becomes the mother of the new race just as Eve was mother to us hybrids.)

Also in reference to the voices at the end I'm probably wrong but maybe it's 16. There are allegations that he is alive and seems unlikely for anyone to mistake what Desmond did at the end as a result of the Animus. Maybe that's just observer bias on my part though.

Also I got really giddy when I found out that Ezio had been so close to the Apple's final resting place without even knowing it so early in the story line. (the catacombs were part of a Romulus labyrinth and I didn't find this out until my second go at the story, hence my excitement.)

Quick bone to pick in ACII we were told we'd get to go to Rome, only to find out it was a one-off. ACB; we were told Spain. Again a one-off. Anyone else somewhat annoyed and left wanting more?

PS: I really dug the music inside the Apple's storage facility at the end.

Sniper4488
11-21-2010, 06:10 AM
okay i think i found something out....well before desmond touches the apple shaun (how ever u spell it) he was saying something about the 2 symbles..and he said they can only come together in one place and then they frezze....and then when the godess lady says "there is one who would accompany you through the gate. She lies not withing our sight the cross darkens the horizen" and then she says "the Path must be opened" then she says "you cannot escape your part in this the scales shall be balanced"and then for the last one when you stab lucy she says "it is done the way lies all before you only she remains to be found awaken the sixth go ALONE!"

so this is what i think so if you guys think this is reasonably then yay and if not then idk lol haha and the ending i believe the one that says No is desmond..or idk and one more thing to add to this...if the desmond we play as is he son....what if subject 16 is his father? who knows...

iNvid22
11-21-2010, 10:47 AM
Subject 16 cryptically tells Desmond that he must find Eve in Eden, as her DNA is the key that complements Desmond's own DNA. And the fruit of their union will be a son - a saviour reviving the gene stock that has long remained dormant in Desmond's hybrid lineage.

The First Civilization is held to be an advanced race that came to inhabit the Earth before mankind. Having remoulded a previous indigenous species into their slaves and workers who would be later known as humans. The FC created some of the pieces of Eden to control their workforce. Most humans, but not all are believed to retain the dormant but still receptive neural configuration that rendered their ancestors vulnerable to enslavement by the technology.

A war eventually broke out between the FC and humans eager to win their freedom from eternal servitude. In their weakened state the FC were unable to anticipate the Great Catastrophe that would deny them existence. To erase them from history altogether? This would take human fallibility. Instead of recording their nature and achievements, mankind defied them and made them supernatural. Instead of factual accounts, we passed down fairy tales and embellished their myths. The only evidence of the FC now rests in the Temples, Vaults and artefacts so highly prized by those who have grasped the truth.

The Assassins may be all that is left of the FC - genetically speaking. If the hybrids are the last chance of preserving the gene stock - perhaps even reviving it - this could explain why Desmond Miles is even more important than Abstergo or the Assassins ever realized.

If the Templar satellite succeeds its influence will immediately turn to the annihilation of the Assassins - and thus the extinction of the DNA stock they carry unbeknownst to themselves. The FC would certainly oppose this to protect their plan. But why should Desmond accept any of his imposed fates, saving the planet from Templars only to return it to the entities who once enslaved us all? Until we know more of his current captors, and the power that the Apple still wields over him, the questions remain.

Sixth Sense and Eagle Vision
Only the FC possessed this, it relates to Eagle Vision. Possibly some sort of superior apparatus for perceiving reality and true knowledge. Juno tells Desmond that Eagle Vision is related to the Sixth Sense.

"After, the world became undone, we tried to pass it through the blood. Tried to join you to us. You see the blue shimmer. You hear the words. But you do not know"

Juno exhorts Desmond to awaken the sixth sense, she anticipates the rebirth of her race's innate powers and suggests that it will play a role in connecting his future to her past.


The Prophecy

The prophecy tells of a prophet who will use 2 pieces of eden to open a vault. rearranging the codex pieces shows location of vault.

Prophet (Ezio) must deliver message from the gods. Ezio captures a speech from Minerva and passes it onto Desmond via genetic memory. Ezio not understand it is not important, it is meant for Desmond.

While Ezio's role as the prophet was to deliver geographical and historical information that would activate dormant technologies, Desmond's role is to deliver his hybrid DNA to Eden so that the FC may return from the past, to be reborn in the future.



The Catastrophe affected the FC in such a way the survivors knew they were doomed to extinction. Running out of time to research and counter its effects they tried more desperate ways to perpetuate their race - such as inbreeding with mankind.

The Apple Desmond looks for and eventually finds is a tool that the FC are using to achieve their grand plan - rebirth.

The timing is important. With 72 days to the launch of Eye-Abstergo, the prescient FC has chosen now as the time for Desmond to open the path to their Awakening - alone. Only "she" remains to be found, and Lucy is not the one. Where is Eden, and is "she" Eve or an descendent of Eve?


Capitoline Triad

The CT consisted of Jupiter, Juno and Minvera and was a select sub-pantheon of supreme deities worshipped in Rome long before the Holy Roman Empire prior even to the Republic. Ezio's encounter with Minerva confirmed they were members of the FC, their elevated staus and reverence potentially corresponding to some hierarchy of leadership among "Those who came before"

Only member of the CT not encountered yet is Jupiter - the king of gods. The prospect of Jupiter manking an appearance in a future AC is all the more ominous when we consider that he is also the god of sky and thunder. The catastrophe approaches.


The Catastrophe

Solar flare or coronal mass ejection that scorched Earth with life threatening radiation.


WE'RE ALL GOING TO FRANCE?

Apple projects the Masonic Eye - a historically recurring signifier of the all-seeing eye of god.
The Phyrigian cap also called Liberty cap is known to symbolize freedom and pursuit of liberty.

Shaun would know that the two come together in the Declaration of the rights of man and the citizen - a defining radical document of the French Revolution. Is the Apple pointing the way to 18th Century France?

Radman500
11-21-2010, 02:19 PM
ed they were members of the FC, their elevated staus and reverence potentially corresponding to some hierarchy of leadership among "Those who came before"


so basically desmond's son.. will be the first of the rebirth of the FC????? he will have the sixth sense etc.

DeSabellis
11-21-2010, 02:50 PM
I finished the game. While mystery and suspense are nice things to accomplish in a story, I'm not sure if this is a good cliffhanger. A good cliffhanger would give a bit more information and closure, but not too much. It's basically, at least in my opinion, a very harsh attempt at being suspenseful.

Now then. A few things. I don't believe that anyone is reliving Desmond's life. It wouldn't make any sense to relieve parts of Desmond's life that involving him reliving another person's life. They could directly skip to Ezio's life or to portions of Desmond's life. After all, there is nothing to learn from Ezio that cannot be learned from Desmond, since Desmond acquires the piece of eden.

After the credits, Desmond says 'NO' in response to being put into the Animus. Since Rebecca is not talking about being the expert, since she created the Animus 2.0, I would summarize that Desmond is captive again, possibly at one of the other Abstergo facilities. This is furthered by the fact that Vidic is not talking. Or he is somewhere else, perhaps under the control of William H. Either way, I would gravitate closer to the fact that he does not want to go back into the Animus, and as such is being held against his will.

As far as what Shaun said, France is looking like a good possibility. Pachter said one time on Gametrailers that AC2 was going to be set during the French Revolution, and that he got this information from a source. He later said he was wrong in a way. Maybe it was a bit of a miscommunication. After all, William H. is in Europe somewhere.

I think there are a few safe bets- I think it is impossible and impractical to be reliving Desmond's life. Lucy died for a reason. Shaun deliberately mentioned those two symbols. Someone aside from Rebecca is placing Desmond into the animus.

Where do we go from here.... Anything about Eve and France? Will the past and present go together again (Ezio and Desmond both in Italy)?

Agentbarto
11-21-2010, 03:30 PM
The Final Voices

Maybe the voices at the end are Assassins (not Abstergo or other templars) and Desmond. Maybe the explanation for Desmond's refusal is that whoever is trying to put him in the animus is incorrect about going back in or maybe Desmond is just worried about what he just did to Lucy and wants to remain conscious.

William H.

I get the feeling he's the head Assassin in modern times what make you guys think he's a Templar? or controlling Vidic?

The Ancient Aliens

iNvidious01's explanation of the aliens is compelling and it leads me to believe that maybe these aliens are attempting resurrection for a more insidious purpose. Why else go through the trouble of resurrection if Desmond can control or activate Ancient technology; ie. The Apple. If they were just trying to save us they could simply rely on Desmond to find the temples and activate them since he is capable. All of this seems to indicate an underlying plot to resurrect and re-enslave.
Also if the humans are descendants of Adam and Eve, then doesn't that make the Templars descendants as well? So maybe the aliens have interests that are similar to the templars? Maybe thats where the templars learned their views of humanity and the world. The whole "we control you to keep you safe" autocratic philosophy seems to be part of the Templar and Alien belief.

Brian_B33
11-21-2010, 04:11 PM
Even though the ending left you with a lot of questions, from what I understand there will be another game. Assassin's Creed is supposed to be a three part game, then they decided to come out with brotherhood.

notafanboy
11-21-2010, 04:45 PM
when i saw the ending i was like "OMGWTFBBQ"

Ajnowotny
11-21-2010, 05:37 PM
I don't remember who said it but I like the idea of the the first civilization people trying to get reborn. That would mean that subject 16 was referring to Minerva and all them when he said, "She cannot be trusted." That would mean that Lucy's death was not required, only forced by Juno because they feared she would get in the way.

If that theory is true than I think what's really going on is that the people of the first civilization and humanity are still fighting. That the future that subject 16 mentioned was the outcome of the FC people winning. So subject 16 is trying to warn Desmond and tell him what to do to fix it so that humanity wins.

As far as the voices during the credits go, I think it is just a typical story cliffhanger that we shouldn't over think. It is just supposed to bridge the gap between the ending of ACB and the beginning of the next assassins creed game.

Theassassin4756
11-21-2010, 06:07 PM
What if this was a massive VR training program.

Highly non-probable but hey people are clinging on to a son that was mentioned for a sec so anything is possible.

I still don't think that Lucy is dead.. he hit her in the side... plus its modern times.. pop some Advil and your good to go lol.

We have all been seeing this from Desmond's POV while in a Animus at A-HQ hence the voices at the end.

sgtJARHEADxX
11-21-2010, 06:20 PM
I don't believe in the "Desmond's son" theory. 16 says "The sun...your son." Well "the sun" is what causes the cataclysm. And memory within a memory wouldn't be much of a plot twist anymore.
The voices in the credits I think are either guards or assassins (most likely guards) that found Desmond a while later and put him back in an Animus. While Desmond is waking up he says "No."
The ending was okay, still not as awesome as AC2 (haven't played AC1).

esilva1229
11-21-2010, 06:41 PM
There is no way he was recaptured by templars because he was placed back into the animus 2.0. if the templars captured him he'd be in the animus 1.28(or watever version they had)

Theassassin4756
11-21-2010, 07:22 PM
THIS^

Piflik
11-21-2010, 07:48 PM
Originally posted by Vaddix:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Piflik:
Yes. I think Jupiter is still alive and in fact is what people today call God (with a capital G)...and that he is the leader of the Templars.
The gods are clearly not on the Templar's side. They each say guard against the cross. When they say cross they are referring to the Templar's. The Templar's main Symbol is the pagan cross. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Juno talks about 'him' in her speech at the end of the game...I only speculated that 'he' is one of Those Who Came Before...probably Jupiter...and it is quite unlikely that there was never any conflict between the TWCBs...after all they created us in their image...so Jupiter could have separated from the others, called himself God and created a Religion with him as the central figure of power...the Templars are his executive http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Hdmetz
11-21-2010, 08:06 PM
I think that evryone raises good points, I think a lot of these theories could be correct, but we won't know until the next game. I read caesar010's theory about not being able to trust Minerva/The Ones Who Came Before and i thought of something. What if the apple made Desmond stab Lucy, because she really is the descendant of Eve, but the Ones Who Came Before donM't want you to save the world. After all humans were their downfall. What if this is their sick twisted way of getting payback. Because if Eve is dead you can't activate the apples. Or if you believe that Desmond's son will save the world, if Eve is dead he won't have her DNA. So maybe this really all the Ones' Who Came Before plot to end the world, not save it. Maybe the next game will focus on saving Lucy and the world.

I'm also interested in the theory that Lucy is a Templar double agent. When in eagle vision outside the villa you see a red footstep trail. Generally that means enemy. This could be Lucy whenshe's on watch, but why doesn't her trail turn red any other time? It is interesting but I don't think it hokds water. The red trail could just be from the bleeding effect from when the villa was raided.

And maybe the apple really did just have you kill her to keep you from being held back in finding Eve and saving the world. But I think it would just be ***holish to kill off a main
character like that who had a major role in the previous games just like that.

The voices in the credits do intrigue me. I don't know whether it really has something to do withe the ending or if it's just so you can keep playing as Ezio. Maybe after the ending and credits it transfers you to memories of subject 16? Him and Desmond are both related to Ezio. Maybe your 16 back at Abstergo before 16 "died". This is just me spitballing though.

Then there is the theory that the apple is just showing you a hallucination and that the ending hasn't really happened yet is entirely plausible. But, and the same goes for all of the theories out there, we won't know until the next, and possibly last game.

Agentbarto
11-21-2010, 08:54 PM
Originally posted by MrT858:
Seeing as there seems to be alot of theories being thrown around ill try mine. First being that Lucy is/was probably a templar. At the very end the apple talks about the cross darkening the horizon which im assuming to be the templar symbol; from that i gather that someone in the room at that point in time is a templar aka Lucy. Also more clues pointing to this are the red footseps going back and forward outside the villa; (when u play as desmond and go outside for the ten mins in eagle vision). Now based on the emails i read on the computer everyone has a surveillance duty to do including Lucy. They are also red meaning at least as far as it goes in the animus; enemy. Lucy also had access to absturgo still as she accesses their mainframe at least once that i can think of and tells you that they are training templars. My last bit on the whole Lucy thing and its been a couple of years so i may be wrong but wasnt she missing a finger in the first game when she reveals she is an assassin; but as we know from AC2 Leonardo invents a way to use the blade without the loss of the finger and any modern assassin would know that, but it is possible that she only thought a finger had to be removed because she had only seen it in the animus and was not a real assassin. My second theory is that possibly you never escaped absturgo and you are still in the original animus being fed some sort of memory that will lead them too the apple; but im probably wrong on that one. Last thing I want to point out is that it is very possible you are desmonds son or something due to the fact that if you look and listen closely while your collecting pieces of the truth; you hear a sonogram and what could possibly be a fetus. So who know i guess we will find out eventually.

I don't believe Lucy is a Templar. The biggest reason is because of eagle vision. What we know for sure about it is that it tells the truth no matter what we expect right? So that eliminates Lucy because in the first game we find out she's an unexpected ally. So to go back on that and say that eagle vision is like an enhanced subconscious that tells you what you believe to be true deep inside would take away from the credibility of that ability.

Agentbarto
11-21-2010, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by Hdmetz:

The voices in the credits do intrigue me. I don't know whether it really has something to do withe the ending or if it's just so you can keep playing as Ezio. Maybe after the ending and credits it transfers you to memories of subject 16? Him and Desmond are both related to Ezio. Maybe your 16 back at Abstergo before 16 "died". This is just me spitballing though.


That's what I thought too given the rumor of 16's continued existence. I thought maybe this ending was a "meanwhile" or flashback scenario because it didn't make sense for anyone who was at the church (one of the voices is thought to be Shaun) to believe that the animus was responsible for Desmond's actions. Of course the guidebook says it was Desmond... But desmond could be a clone of 16 so who knows.

Vaddix
11-21-2010, 09:36 PM
Originally posted by iNvidious01:
Subject 16 cryptically tells Desmond that he must find Eve in Eden, as her DNA is the key that complements Desmond's own DNA. And the fruit of their union will be a son - a saviour reviving the gene stock that has long remained dormant in Desmond's hybrid lineage.

The First Civilization is held to be an advanced race that came to inhabit the Earth before mankind. Having remoulded a previous indigenous species into their slaves and workers who would be later known as humans. The FC created some of the pieces of Eden to control their workforce. Most humans, but not all are believed to retain the dormant but still receptive neural configuration that rendered their ancestors vulnerable to enslavement by the technology.

A war eventually broke out between the FC and humans eager to win their freedom from eternal servitude. In their weakened state the FC were unable to anticipate the Great Catastrophe that would deny them existence. To erase them from history altogether? This would take human fallibility. Instead of recording their nature and achievements, mankind defied them and made them supernatural. Instead of factual accounts, we passed down fairy tales and embellished their myths. The only evidence of the FC now rests in the Temples, Vaults and artefacts so highly prized by those who have grasped the truth.

The Assassins may be all that is left of the FC - genetically speaking. If the hybrids are the last chance of preserving the gene stock - perhaps even reviving it - this could explain why Desmond Miles is even more important than Abstergo or the Assassins ever realized.

If the Templar satellite succeeds its influence will immediately turn to the annihilation of the Assassins - and thus the extinction of the DNA stock they carry unbeknownst to themselves. The FC would certainly oppose this to protect their plan. But why should Desmond accept any of his imposed fates, saving the planet from Templars only to return it to the entities who once enslaved us all? Until we know more of his current captors, and the power that the Apple still wields over him, the questions remain.

Sixth Sense and Eagle Vision
Only the FC possessed this, it relates to Eagle Vision. Possibly some sort of superior apparatus for perceiving reality and true knowledge. Juno tells Desmond that Eagle Vision is related to the Sixth Sense.

"After, the world became undone, we tried to pass it through the blood. Tried to join you to us. You see the blue shimmer. You hear the words. But you do not know"

Juno exhorts Desmond to awaken the sixth sense, she anticipates the rebirth of her race's innate powers and suggests that it will play a role in connecting his future to her past.


The Prophecy

The prophecy tells of a prophet who will use 2 pieces of eden to open a vault. rearranging the codex pieces shows location of vault.

Prophet (Ezio) must deliver message from the gods. Ezio captures a speech from Minerva and passes it onto Desmond via genetic memory. Ezio not understand it is not important, it is meant for Desmond.

While Ezio's role as the prophet was to deliver geographical and historical information that would activate dormant technologies, Desmond's role is to deliver his hybrid DNA to Eden so that the FC may return from the past, to be reborn in the future.



The Catastrophe affected the FC in such a way the survivors knew they were doomed to extinction. Running out of time to research and counter its effects they tried more desperate ways to perpetuate their race - such as inbreeding with mankind.

The Apple Desmond looks for and eventually finds is a tool that the FC are using to achieve their grand plan - rebirth.

The timing is important. With 72 days to the launch of Eye-Abstergo, the prescient FC has chosen now as the time for Desmond to open the path to their Awakening - alone. Only "she" remains to be found, and Lucy is not the one. Where is Eden, and is "she" Eve or an descendent of Eve?


Capitoline Triad

The CT consisted of Jupiter, Juno and Minvera and was a select sub-pantheon of supreme deities worshipped in Rome long before the Holy Roman Empire prior even to the Republic. Ezio's encounter with Minerva confirmed they were members of the FC, their elevated staus and reverence potentially corresponding to some hierarchy of leadership among "Those who came before"

Only member of the CT not encountered yet is Jupiter - the king of gods. The prospect of Jupiter manking an appearance in a future AC is all the more ominous when we consider that he is also the god of sky and thunder. The catastrophe approaches.


The Catastrophe

Solar flare or coronal mass ejection that scorched Earth with life threatening radiation.


WE'RE ALL GOING TO FRANCE?

Apple projects the Masonic Eye - a historically recurring signifier of the all-seeing eye of god.
The Phyrigian cap also called Liberty cap is known to symbolize freedom and pursuit of liberty.

Shaun would know that the two come together in the Declaration of the rights of man and the citizen - a defining radical document of the French Revolution. Is the Apple pointing the way to 18th Century France?
Its interesting how all of this excluding the fictional characters are actually part of the Sumerian tablets
If anyone has read about the Annunaki, Then this is their story. These games are the story of the Annunaki. They have the 12 bases helix of dna, we have the double helix. The hybrid race was called Nephilum and they appear in the book of Enoch and the holy bible.

Interestingly enough, this games plot isn't too far from our own history, and highly plausible.

Agentbarto
11-22-2010, 01:24 AM
Haha dude you read my mind! Book of Enoch was featured in Banned from the Bible on History Channel and it sent shivers down my spine when i ieced it together with the Sumerian stuff and Annunaki legends.

Glad to see the Ancient Astronaut theory getting some recognition.

Also isn't it "interesting" how there's the whole avian theme present considering the Annunaki stuff. All of this may seem far fetched but it helps to draw connections to understand AC better.

lolig01
11-22-2010, 10:14 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MrT858:
Also more clues pointing to this are the red footseps going back and forward outside the villa; (when u play as desmond and go outside for the ten mins in eagle vision[/QOUTE]

But in the tunnel leading to where the apple is you have to press some buttons. What colour is the assassins sign above thos buttons. Red. So it doesn't have to mean that those footsteps are from an templar, maybe their just from one of the assassins.

macquick
11-22-2010, 01:13 PM
Btw, ppl:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...n4LU&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFshNuMn4LU&feature=related)

At 0:26... heck, is this a cross?

SargeChris13
11-22-2010, 02:15 PM
My theory is coincided with others. Lucy jokingly asked desmond if he was focused on the right thing.Maybe he was focusing on seeing the future, which leads him to freeze, and kill lucy. In the next game, he will prevent lucys death, and then find out that he had a son somewhere.They find his son, find the temples, kill vidic, and end the end of the world.

SargeChris13
11-22-2010, 02:23 PM
I also think that the 2 people talking in the credits are vidic, and some other guy

bsmith239
11-22-2010, 03:17 PM
My theory:

Basically, Desmond is reliving his own memories sometime in the future at the behest of some 3rd party (assassins but probably templar). What their motives would be is anyone's guess but it probably has to do with eden more than the pieces of eden.

Subject 16 said that what Desmond thinks is happening in the present is actually in the past. They (the assassin's) have already lost and now all that can be done to save man is finding this decedent of eve.

My best guess is that in the real world timeline Lucy did not die. She is a Templar who has feelings for an Assassin and is quit possibly the DoE he needs to find.

Juno had Desmond kill off Lucy in the memory sequence because it is not what really happened and thus it caused Desmond to desynchronize from the animus he has been in the entire time. Evidence for this can be found in the quick conversation during the credits.

The reason why the animus doesn't jump around in his memories is because they are literally his memories. There is no memory loss since they have not been passed down. In fact he is able to live them literally from start to finish with the only time he reaches desynch being when Juno forces him to go against his own memories.

I suspect that in AC3 Desmond will wake up in a facility, believing he killed Lucy, but in time he will come to realize he is actually going to have to find eden to save her.

edit: I also believe Subject 16 is Desmond's subconscious.

Theassassin4756
11-22-2010, 08:05 PM
^ good theory about 16.. but i belive he is just an ai construct that is in the animus memory core that Lucy stole.

I Also think that Desmond will wake up in the Assassins HQ because they are gonna want to know what the heck happened .

I glad people are starting to see past the whole son thing... granted people are entitled to an opinion but come on.. it was mentioned for like a sec.

Also WE DON"T KNOW IF LUCY IS DEAD OR ALIVE!!!
sorry but we shouldn't jump straight to person got stabbed they die.

EoT.Patton
11-22-2010, 08:53 PM
A little "real world fact" which kinda has nothing to do with this but I know a few people mentioned the number 72...

Pope Alexander VI (Rodrigo Borgia) died at the age of 72

Carry on. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

AlteredIdol
11-23-2010, 10:50 AM
Enjoyed the game immensely, absolutely despised the ending. It felt so artificial, that they had given us a cliffhanger ending for the sake of it being a cliffhanger.

I do like cliffhangers, its gives us something to debate and discuss. But I also like it to be coherent, what it seems to be is a jumbled mess with very few answers given and too many questions that need answering.

Subject 16's messages are so cryptic its hard to fathom just what path this game will take. He says that Desmond's present is the past and that its too late to save them. If that's the case them whats the point of Desmond continuing. But then he says find Eve in Eden. Does that mean there's a chance to reverse whats happened or what??

Then there's the voices at the end. If Desmond has been in an Animus all along, then what good are 16's messages as he has no ability to free himself and all he can do is relive past events. And if he has been in the animus all along, why has 16 not left some clues in Desmond's present too??

Is Lucy dead or alive after being stabbed. According to 16, it doesnt matter anyway as it has already happened. Was she a templar spy, was it an illusion created by Juno to focus Desmond's mind or to confuse him further.

I hope to god its not set in the distant future or with Desmond's son. That would be major cop-out on the scale of Star Wars ending with Luke Skywalker's descedant waking up and going "ooo, bad dream". But if the events have happened already and the world has ended, how can it be set in the future?

There are too many vague and unanswerable questions at this time. Loved to game, but the ending feels a bit like a screw job. We still don't have a clue whats going on.

Kingdom320
11-23-2010, 11:49 AM
Yeah...I'd like to say..that Lucy wasn't actually a Templar, It's not been proven...However, When Subject 16 mentions "Beware of the Cross" it could refer to the fact the Desmond is Forbidden to "Cross-Breed?"

Rocanatic
11-23-2010, 05:50 PM
I have read all of the theories and I think they're all good but I don't think it would be desmonds son because that would mean that the 2012 thing had already happened and I don't see what use they could have with desmonds son but you never know. Also I dont think Lucy is a Templar because she seemed good but she could be. I think that Lucy might be a descendant of eve and she's not dead but also the goddess at the end tells him to go by himself to look for the sixth. The voices at then were weird but there's no way to tell it's subject sixteen or Desmond. I think there's going to another one because if not then ubisoft is just screwing themsleves over leaving ppl hanging like that

eth1232
11-23-2010, 08:44 PM
Okay eveybody, listen to this, the acheivement after finsihing the crypts is called I Am Alive. I think that Subject 16 is alive and well. Also why does everybody think that Lucy is Eve? There 3 billion women in the world. I could be some random person, rebecca or has anyone thought this, subject 16 is a female? Also i am guessing that ac3 is gonna be one last fight with the templars, and the FC will destroy themselves. Does anyone remember that garden behind Maysaf. That hangs in my mind, i think that that is actually eden, pretty stupid i know. Also the voices in the end. It does not sound like anyone we know, but i do like the theory that desmond is being held somewhere and only left the animus when juno made him. i have great expectations for jupiter. he is the guy who zaps people with thunderbolts, i am guessing he has the final pice of eden you have to take and unite all of them to kill of the FC and with that power destroy the pieces themselves.

eth1232
11-23-2010, 09:06 PM
O my god i just remembered something. In one of those holy texts there was a woman before eve who married adam. but adam wanted complete control over her (as men did to women) and she wanted to be equals. so God banished her and she was angry. she became and everlasting spirit that killed peoples babies in the womb and as they were born, to get revenge on eve, who took her place. one of the things 16 said was not to trust her. she could be another addition to the roster of FCs. or something else competely. and since she was still alive in the stories, why cant Adam and Eve be?
Also will someone please post the new subject sixteen puzles i suck at them lol

DisablinSpider
11-24-2010, 09:39 AM
Originally posted by eth1232:
or has anyone thought this, subject 16 is a female?

isn't subject 16 the male voice talking to you during the 'truth' sequence in AC2? also for 16 to be able to show the memories of Adam/Eve escaping Eden with the apple, wouldn't he have to be related to either Adam or Eve? and since Desmond is related to 16 wouldn't that mean Desmond is also related to either Adam or Eve? well either that or the FC had a video recording of it that 16 got from Abstergo?

Kingdom320
11-24-2010, 10:12 AM
4 every one who are still confused..Desmond is a part of "Adam" and he must find his "Eve"..Lucy WAS not a traitor! because it hasn't been proven..However she was a distraction,..What goes on from here is up to Ubisoft...but that ties the end of Ezio.....Ohh and Subject 16 is NOT a female..4 that i am sure

gsm0081
11-24-2010, 10:38 AM
Originally posted by eth1232:
O my god i just remembered something. In one of those holy texts there was a woman before eve who married adam. but adam wanted complete control over her (as men did to women) and she wanted to be equals. so God banished her and she was angry. she became and everlasting spirit that killed peoples babies in the womb and as they were born, to get revenge on eve, who took her place. one of the things 16 said was not to trust her. she could be another addition to the roster of FCs. or something else competely. and since she was still alive in the stories, why cant Adam and Eve be?
Also will someone please post the new subject sixteen puzles i suck at them lol


Lilith is the woman that was married to Adam before Eve.

joon023
11-24-2010, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by MrT858:
Seeing as there seems to be alot of theories being thrown around ill try mine. First being that Lucy is/was probably a templar. At the very end the apple talks about the cross darkening the horizon which im assuming to be the templar symbol; from that i gather that someone in the room at that point in time is a templar aka Lucy. Also more clues pointing to this are the red footseps going back and forward outside the villa; (when u play as desmond and go outside for the ten mins in eagle vision). Now based on the emails i read on the computer everyone has a surveillance duty to do including Lucy. They are also red meaning at least as far as it goes in the animus; enemy. Lucy also had access to absturgo still as she accesses their mainframe at least once that i can think of and tells you that they are training templars. My last bit on the whole Lucy thing and its been a couple of years so i may be wrong but wasnt she missing a finger in the first game when she reveals she is an assassin; but as we know from AC2 Leonardo invents a way to use the blade without the loss of the finger and any modern assassin would know that, but it is possible that she only thought a finger had to be removed because she had only seen it in the animus and was not a real assassin. My second theory is that possibly you never escaped absturgo and you are still in the original animus being fed some sort of memory that will lead them too the apple; but im probably wrong on that one. Last thing I want to point out is that it is very possible you are desmonds son or something due to the fact that if you look and listen closely while your collecting pieces of the truth; you hear a sonogram and what could possibly be a fetus. So who know i guess we will find out eventually.

I agree that Lucy is a templar, but what is a interesting thing, if the footsteps outside monterrigioni are templar footsteps, why aren't they inside the villa? So they aren't Lucy's. Then you could think, they are from another templar who talked to lucy outside the town, but if thats true, and Lucy is a templar, why doesn't she have these footsteps? The other possibility is that it is blood, and that is, i think, a better option, because never in a ac-game you could have seen templar footsteps. and they have the same color as the blood in ac1 and as the truth figures on special buildings.

Could you guys do something for me? becouse my xbox doesn't read the discs any more so microsoft will repair it, and from today on it is two or three weeks before i get it back, and i havent finished the game and also havent been outside the animus (except in the very beginning of the game when you have to get some power from out of the village, but then i didn't used the eagle vision). well, could you look for me if there is a kind of figure in these footsteps? like a cross, or the symbol of assassins?

Then I have something to say about the memory in memory theory. I agree with this. and i figured something out. could you remember in the very beginning of ac1, whem the "animus-women" explained that the animus gave you an extra aid(sorry i'm dutch and i could find a better word than aid in the dictionary), "the eagle vision"? well why could use desmond this "aid" if he isn't even in the animus? yeah the bleeding effect, but thats only ezio's skills and not these thechnological things of the animus. so i think also that it is an memory in memory thing. or, and thats also an possibillity, do altaÔr and ezio really have the abillity to look who is a templar and who isn't? could be and thats why i'm asking you guys http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

joon023
11-24-2010, 12:49 PM
and something else, the theory about desmonds son, how could he get a son who can get into the animus, in 72 days? maybe it is in 2030 or somthing, but why, when the war supposed to be over after 2012, do they use the animus that much that someone gets in trouble by it, while it isn't even neccesary anymore to look in the future that much, and with so much haste that he gets in trouble by it. so IF the desmonds son thing is true, that means, after my conclusion, the war will be go on for a while. so actually i dont believe in the desmonds son thing. i think it is another assassin, or it is desmond...

xcamthemandudex
11-24-2010, 03:18 PM
Originally posted by EoT.Patton:

And one more thing. While you're jumping around, pulling levers in that church, and even when you get in and see the Apple, Desmond see's Ezio doing so. However, when you were Ezio, you went to, I believe the place in AC2, and put the Apple back and locked it away. SOOOO, Why would Ezio go and take the Apple back?.. Then, how did it return back there again?

This one I'm sure I know. He wasn't locking it away in the Vatican, he had to present it to Minerva to get her to talk to him.

*Edit* I am sure tat at the end of it (when you were Desmond) and you saw him, he was putting it away because his deeds were finally done. He must have wanted it to be safe in a place where no one (Templar decedents) could get it.

Wind91
11-24-2010, 06:00 PM
I think the problem we are facing now is that we are over interpreting words and phrases instead of taking them at face value. This is obviously the sign of a good writer however, as the audience you have to be careful not to get into the false info.

My theory (based on what ive read)
-THe ending first - Desmond was probably found by the Assassin's; William H and someone else the emails make WIll seem quite knowledgable. Considering they didnt know what happened in the chamber they could just be assuming Desmond is suffering due to the Animus.

The Ancient Civilization are not evil or have some scheme - based on AC2 i found is pretty obvious that they, grudgingly, accepted their fate and decided to give mankind hope. Desmond is meant to save humanity and the world. At the end of Brotherhood it seemed obvious that once the ancients realized it was KO for them, in order to save their existence, knowledge, legacy, help humanity, etc - they tried to combine themselves into human DNA. Obviously there's the multiple theories on this (desmond will marry his "eve" and they will bring about a rebirth of the race which will then again filter back into humanity). I think the Ancients just did something Machiavelli has been doing- the ends justify the means.

Lucy's death - im still not sure but ive been very suspicious of her for a while now. SOmething just didnt add up. Of course even if she was good - she could be simply a threat in Desmond uniting with the girl he needs to find. Sacrifices have to be made, the world is at stake as well as humanites future the Ancients cant afford there to be any mistakes in Desmond's destiny now. Desmond will be bitter but he'll move on, unless they want to follow the typical "ancient people baaad" ****.

Subject 16 - idk i think he's dead and should stay dead, because if he survived that brings up A LOT of questions - mainly how the hell?

All in all, i dont see why we need another Animus adventure it's time Desmond took center stage. Theres 72 days left...yeah sure the french revolution could be a possibility but again - false info/frivolous. At that moment i thought of shaun as just uselessly babbling with desmond shutting him up by picking up the apple.

Final point - the ancients foresaw all these events and set them in motion, the templar are about enslaving humanity, assassins about freedom. DOes it make sense for the ancients to have placed their commitment in a FAMILY (not person) of Assassin's? Yeah they enslaved humanity, but i firmly believe they know that what they wanted was wrong. Every game shows how enslaving people is wrong, bad, it backfires. It already backfired for them and now they wont let it happen again.

But yeah AC3 - desmond, you can continue on with AC4,5,6, etc. because the war between assassins and templar wont end. Desmond's son can also take over the franchise at some point in time. I think at that point would be a good moment to bring up the possibility of an evil race to counter the ancients, assuming desmond's son is a "pure" ancient/altair lineage - his enemy being a race that is the nemesis to his own would be cool.

misc points - the 6th sense; probably eagle vision this is...well the most obvious sixth sense but she says it's incomplete and it makes sense. in EV mode you only see blackness, allies, target, enemies. It feels incomplete/hindered this could also be how the ancients foresaw the future which is why they kept it away from mankind.

Conclusion!!! Ancient race isn't bad, this entire time they've been guiding/preparing Desmond to save the world and humanity. They accepted they are done, it's over for them, good bye - but they cant let the world burn again and humanity must remain free now - represented in the assassin's and desmond's family. Lucy is questionable, either way her fate is either saving desmond or a necessity for desmond. Subject 16 - well i dont care he'd be cool to be alive but then again keeping him dead would be fine.

RomanDozer
11-24-2010, 09:06 PM
Lucy was a double agent, that's why she went missing for so long from SEQ 6 to 8. Yeah, gone, without a trace. There is another topic people are posting under too, which I did also, but wanted to say, I bet when she is missing for those, she got picked up by Templars and replaced. Or hell, maybe she was working with them all along? Who knows but I bet the DLC will clue us in more on some issues. (Here's hoping anyway) But I think Lucy had to die because of what she was, which may just boil down to someone with bad intentions. Look how possessed she was to get the thing...always barking up our rear due to the time restraint on the Templars launching their satellite. She was a double. The power of the apple saw it. She was just...a bad apple :P

Kerid
11-25-2010, 12:47 PM
I think no one mentioned this but I think it's worth it, in the last glyphs, 9th or 10th, the computer voice seems kind of desperate, it says something like "Shut it down, shut it down, KILL ME!" or something like that, can't remember exactly. And in the Truth sequence, it actually builds subject 16's body in the animus. What I think this is, is an AI... in a world where a machine like the Animus is possible I think an AI is possible, even more seeing how Subject 16 seemed pretty good with computers, having hacked into Abstergo's top secrets and all.

Desmond seemed to actually speak with subject 16 while it was clear that he's dead... so I think subject 16 is actually a human turned AI (like in Halo Reach with Dr Halsey being Cortana I guess) or he's not dead and the Truth sequence was in fact just some way to speak to Subject 16 wherever he was, instead of a recording.

Subject 16 also said something about having to replenish energy? What is that all about? A human would just say he's tired... and he was also talking like he's from the future, saying all is gone, and it is too late, so that makes me think the whole part with Desmond running around is actually another animus memory without Desmond knowing? I just mind****ed myself :P

I had the subtitles on and Subject 16 said "The sun... your son" I guess he talks about the sun because of the coming cataclysm, but why talk about his son? Maybe that like other people said his son is the real main character, and he's the one in another Animus seeing Desmond's life... maybe the cataclysm already happened and he's one of the survivors? Minerva already said there were a few survivors to the last cataclysm so I guess it's possible, even more so with Desmond's son being one of their descendants, and he might be looking for something else, maybe a way to travel back in time? In AC1 near the end you could read an e-mail about Abstergo's report on Pieces of Eden and there was one talking about time travel... I'm not sure if they would go that way but that's just me saying random stuff.

RequiemDogma
11-25-2010, 05:18 PM
I think Wind is correct. A lot of things are being taken at total face value in a game that makes clear "Nothing is true, everything is permitted."

16 clearly has a larger part to play than was originally suggested, but taking the achievement name "I am Alive" to mean he's in a computer somewhere, is a bit of a stretch in my opinion.
Here are some idea's I have concerning 16.

Desmond Miles suffers from multiple personality disorder, and subject 16 was his original, dominant personality. This would explain why 16 is so livid in a memory construct inside the animus. A sever physical trauma, like say, 'nearly' bleeding to death could 'kill' a personality.

I wouldn't say it was a stretch, considering Desmond being a hybrid, that he may be immortal, but without the complete sixth sense, is unable to, naturally, remember each past life.

Another is that 16, utilizing memories and skills from the bleeding effect, essentially ascended his physical form, implanting himself into the animus. That is why the construct freaks out and talks like someone lost and trapped at the start of each cluster. The clusters are portions of 16's existance. His heartbeat for example, is the one heard, and he's afraid he may not be recompiled.

Another bit of a stretch is that Adam bled through into 16's consciousness, and they are more or less, one.
Either way, 16 is dead in body, and is capable of compiling, at will, memories that he can use to communicate with Desmond.



Desmond: Subject 16?
Subject 16: Yes, yes, Subject 17.
Desmond: Youíre dead. I saw your blood.
Subject 16: No time. It is far later than you know. Too late to save them.

16 has clearly got a secret about what actually happened to him, he is also, probably refering to the assassin's that Desmond is with.


Desmond: Who?
Subject 16: She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become, everything you hold dear, itís already gone.

He could be talking about Lucy, suggesting that it's too late now for anything to work out because of the short amount of time left before the day of awakening.
He could also be talking about Minerva and Desmond's hope to save the world from the coming apocalypse.


Desmond: Explain. Please.
Subject 16: Eden. She... in Eden. Find Eve. The Key. Her DNA.

Desmond needs to find Eden, and Eve within it. What follows suggests that there is either a key for Eden that Desmond also needs to find, or that Eve's DNA is the key. This could mean that only a hybrid of a lesser dilluted generation could activate the temple failsafes, or that a child of Desmond and Eve would be able to survive.


Desmond: Tell me!
Subject 16: I cannot... The sun... Your son... Too weak... Must replenish energy...
Desmond: Donít go.
Subject 16: I am with you 'til the end. Find me in the darkness.

16 may only know the basics, or what steps to take to further the truth, but not know it himself, or he may simply mean he doesn't have enough time.
Reference to the sun suggests a support for the solar flare idea.
Saying "your son" seems a pretty straight forward way of suggesting that Desmond's child will have a key role, but 16 delves into crypticism from time to time and may be speaking of something Desmond does or creates as clearly, two months is not enough time for any relationship, unless he was in one pre-AC.
He may also be refering to either sun/son, or both in saying "too weak...", or he's simply being over-verbose in explaining that he needs to recharge.

Lucy isn't likely dead. The achievement is called "A knife in the heart" but he clearly stabbed her in the lower abdomen, in the presence of those who would care for her. This doesn't make a whole lot of sense, considering what Juno meant to do, especially since Desmond and Lucy never 'got together'. Juno said something along the lines of 'the cross' darkening the path, likely meaning the templars. This doesn't necessarily mean that Lucy was a templar however as Juno was also, apparently, attempting to remove the chance of relationship between Desmond and Lucy (Betrayal is often refered to as a knife in the heart, and Juno said Desmond needed to be guided.)

The next game will probably take place in revolutionary France. Shaun mentions the masonic eye and the cap. The cap originated in France and the Masons are a subsect of Templars.

As for the time-travel idea, an Abstergo email in the first game said that all artifacts able to alter the flow of time needed to be quarantined and never used.

Wind91
11-26-2010, 01:51 PM
im skeptical on going into the animus again at all in this point. This story/arc of AC is meant to be a trilogy, i find no valid reason to go to french revolution just to see the 2 symbols together. We already know the symbols are originating from the ancients - but it's not relevant. The animus wont help Desmond find eve or eden - the apple very well might though. I mean AC eventually has to take place solely in the present/future otherwise the series will die. After this story you need to create a new threat/challenge for Desmond against the Templars or just jump to desmond's son.

RequiemDogma
11-26-2010, 04:49 PM
Not sure I'd totally agree. The "Day of Awakening" is only 72 days away for them, and unless Desmond has a son he doesn't know about, he's not going to be a character, if in fact "son" is in reference to offspring.
I wouldn't go so far as to suggest that the symbols are irrelevant either. Many symbols appeared, cycling in the air in front of the group, only 2 were picked out to remain static. If the game doesn't take place during the french revolution, then something that occured during the french revolution will be important to the story.
As for the Templars, they are more obstacle now than antagonist. Desmond hasn't been actively fighting their present day machinations in the way that the Assassins have. (though, if he was recovered by HQ, and the voices in the credits are indeed William and someone else, this could change.) But the game has not taken us in a direction fit for an era where firearms are the main battle weapon. Ezio was good, but he wouldn't be prepared for an armored hummer with a roof mounted .30 cal general electric mini-gun (a private military favorite), and neither would Desmond whos only skills come from the bleeding effect.

Also, the Animus is the only means they have for communicating with 16, who's become a more important figure now than he was suspected of being in AC1.

Aromaci
11-26-2010, 05:01 PM
WOW all the possibilities. Tell the truth I can't believe all the theories people have come up with. A lot of them also seem logical.

The whole memory within a memory confused me when they explained it in the game so I kinda forgot about it. But I guess if it was Desmond's son reliving Desmond's life, I agree, why the need to go into Ezio's life. But 16 does mention a 'son' as well as a 'sun'

The 'she can't be trusted' might well be Minerva. She was quite angry during her monologues.

The Lucy not dead cause Des faked it like in ACI is also an intriguing idea, but it seemed as though Des didn't really have control of his faculties. (Though the press button thing is suspicious).

Was weird how Lucy disappeared for a time (I thought it might have been a glitch. :P)

French Revolution seems like a logical place given the symbols (Ever since before 2 I'd thought about how it could go there next)

Guess we'll find out next year. Ubisoft seems to have confirmed a new game, Q4 2011.

Wind91
11-26-2010, 06:36 PM
i dont think there was every any indication that abstergo uses private military though. and even if they did that means the assassins do too considering they can still fight them. besides what skill does desmond need to fire a gun? Ezio had one on the blade and a xbow and throwing knives if you can throw knives like a ninja and get instant kills you can use a gun.

RequiemDogma
11-26-2010, 09:34 PM
Originally posted by Wind91:
i dont think there was every any indication that abstergo uses private military though. and even if they did that means the assassins do too considering they can still fight them. besides what skill does desmond need to fire a gun? Ezio had one on the blade and a xbow and throwing knives if you can throw knives like a ninja and get instant kills you can use a gun.
Abstergo definitely has at least one PMC under their umbrella, or a very well armed security force (AC1, when the assassins attack to rescue desmond, they're terminated swiftly to the sound of automatic gunfire).

Sure, Desmond could shoot back, but I doubt he could dodge bullets.

Rivath
11-26-2010, 10:44 PM
Ok, after thinking and reading about this WAY too much I caved and bought the ACB guidebook. At the back they explain *cough* what happened. As some of you might know, Altiar, Ezio, and Desmond are all descendants of Adam (The Truth). Now the gods (for some strange reason) want to reunite the DNA of Adam and Eve to stop the world from ending. So Desmond needs too find the one who carries the genes of Eve. Basically the main reason why the goddess (Juno btw) killed Lucy was because she was seen as a "distraction" and would lead him away from Eve. Yeah that's right, the gods are toying with Desmond's sex life.

Now for some minor things, the godess talked about the whole 6th sense thing I believe some of her exact works were "you see the outlines but do not comprehend what it means" (don't yell at me if I'm wrong)..... HELLO!!!! EAGLE VISION! Or can everyone turn on and off their inner senses like a light-switch in the future?
(I highly doubt it)

Lastly the men in the van..... I have a theory. In the achievements for the ACB "the Truth" the achievements title is in sign-language and spells out "IamAlive". The expert who forces Desmond into the anaimus is 16 you know, "Im the expert here!" that guy. Now for the other one. If anyone went ahead and read all the emails in the base you would learn the name of the modern day assassin's leader-type-person. Say hello to William (kinda a boring name compared to Desmond, and Altiar huh?). After all, if you're about to traverse on a dangerous mission to find the key to saving all of humanity you probably gave your boss a heads up on where you are. SOOOOO!!!! In conclusion the gods want desmond to do the nasty-in-the-pasty (or future, this all makes my head hurt...) with the descendant of Eve. The 6th sense is Eagle Vision. And the men who are currently looking after our boy Desmond is his boss hes never met, and his relative (subject 16) which we dont know if hes met yet...

Thats all, im done.....

amovieby
11-27-2010, 12:27 AM
Just throwing this out there from some of the posts I've read about the First Civilization and Templars having similar goals...
What if Vidic is Jupiter?

nellyhoose
11-27-2010, 02:13 AM
I agree that the ending was just creating more questions. But one thing that I did notice between sequence 6 and 8 was when I left the animus and was search around Montegroni that you could only see in eagle vision was a weird red trail (that looked like tire marks) from out of the tunnel all the way down the stairs near the fountain.

The other odd thing was that Lucy was no where to be seen, it was just Shawn and Rebecca. They weren't willing to talk. Then in the emails somebody named William S. was having a communication with Lucy. The way it seemed she was up to something, and the fact that she wasn't there was just weird.

I have a feeling that she was working for Abstergo all along, not the assassins. If she was in assassin maybe she was just a spy setting the whole thing up.

nellyhoose
11-27-2010, 02:16 AM
Originally posted by Rivath:
Ok, after thinking and reading about this WAY too much I caved and bought the ACB guidebook. At the back they explain *cough* what happened. As some of you might know, Altiar, Ezio, and Desmond are all descendants of Adam (The Truth). Now the gods (for some strange reason) want to reunite the DNA of Adam and Eve to stop the world from ending. So Desmond needs too find the one who carries the genes of Eve. Basically the main reason why the goddess (Juno btw) killed Lucy was because she was seen as a "distraction" and would lead him away from Eve. Yeah that's right, the gods are toying with Desmond's sex life.

Now for some minor things, the godess talked about the whole 6th sense thing I believe some of her exact works were "you see the outlines but do not comprehend what it means" (don't yell at me if I'm wrong)..... HELLO!!!! EAGLE VISION! Or can everyone turn on and off their inner senses like a light-switch in the future?
(I highly doubt it)

Lastly the men in the van..... I have a theory. In the achievements for the ACB "the Truth" the achievements title is in sign-language and spells out "IamAlive". The expert who forces Desmond into the anaimus is 16 you know, "Im the expert here!" that guy. Now for the other one. If anyone went ahead and read all the emails in the base you would learn the name of the modern day assassin's leader-type-person. Say hello to William (kinda a boring name compared to Desmond, and Altiar huh?). After all, if you're about to traverse on a dangerous mission to find the key to saving all of humanity you probably gave your boss a heads up on where you are. SOOOOO!!!! In conclusion the gods want desmond to do the nasty-in-the-pasty (or future, this all makes my head hurt...) with the descendant of Eve. The 6th sense is Eagle Vision. And the men who are currently looking after our boy Desmond is his boss hes never met, and his relative (subject 16) which we dont know if hes met yet...

Thats all, im done.....

All I can say to that is WOW. That is a lot of information. The crazy thing is it all makes sense. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Wind91
11-27-2010, 12:55 PM
william also talked to Shaun, he is one of the Assassins elders.

And yeah either Lucy is a triple agent, or she basically had to die because she would ruin desmond's destiny.

thecapeo
11-27-2010, 01:14 PM
I'm starting to get the feeling that maybe the FC are not really on our side. That maybe they want to be reborn to restore their power. Their original ideas and the ideas of the Templar mesh well. The last Truth Cluster recording has a Templar explaining to his protege how there will be no worry, no democracy, no etc. It sounds an awful lot like what human existence would have been like prior to Adam and Eve escaping with the Apple.

Subject 16 seems to be the only one who truly knows what's going on (of course he is ridiculously cryptic).

Wind91
11-27-2010, 03:25 PM
we discussed why the ancients are not evil in other threads but a quick rundown would be

a) they would help the templars not the assassins
b) they already said that they accepted their end and decided to help humanity as much as they could before they died - Desmond is the culmination of this.
c) they are not being reborn, Humans are already made in their image - we are derived from them. Desmond's DNA is a hybrid of human and ancient the main point of which is to pass and give humanity the 6th sense, knowledge -aka eagle vission complete.

Aromaci
11-27-2010, 03:57 PM
I thought I'd put down the things I'm putting my money on.

<UL TYPE=SQUARE>
<LI>I think that we'll find that Desmond and Lucy are connected (fate) and they might be modern day versions of Adam and Eve. But on that note, the idea that Lucy had to die so that Desmond would move on to find his Eve (ie someone not Lucy)sounds plausible. AC3 might be Des going to France to find clues as to Eve's whereabouts.
<LI>"She isn't who she seems to be" is referring to Minerva or Juno
<LI>We'll be seeing Subject 16 in the flesh.
<LI>Memory within a Memory could be important.
<LI>The voices at the end is just a plot mechanism to get you back into the Animus to keep playing. The Official Guide says "...Desmond is vaguely aware of being manhandled into the back of a van. Voices argue over returning him to the Animus, and he barely able to protest before the darkness descends again." The idea that it's Desmond's son or 16 is very integrating but given what we know, it's very hard to argue. Occam's razor people. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif If it was true it would bring up all kinds of logical problems with the story. Like, why wouldn't future Des just jump straight back to Ezio if he really wanted to see what happened? Or if he didn't just stick with Des's memories outside of the Animus?

[/list]



Originally posted by JulienGS.
I had the subtitles on and Subject 16 said "The sun... your son" I guess he talks about the sun because of the coming cataclysm, but why talk about his son? Maybe that like other people said his son is the real main character, and he's the one in another Animus seeing Desmond's life... maybe the cataclysm already happened and he's one of the survivors? Minerva already said there were a few survivors to the last cataclysm so I guess it's possible, even more so with Desmond's son being one of their descendants, and he might be looking for something else, maybe a way to travel back in time? In AC1 near the end you could read an e-mail about Abstergo's report on Pieces of Eden and there was one talking about time travel... I'm not sure if they would go that way but that's just me saying random stuff.
This interests me. Seems possible but again if the end was a hint to memory in memory, it creates problems with the plot.

thecapeo
11-27-2010, 05:06 PM
Originally posted by Wind91:
we discussed why the ancients are not evil in other threads but a quick rundown would be

a) they would help the templars not the assassins
b) they already said that they accepted their end and decided to help humanity as much as they could before they died - Desmond is the culmination of this.
c) they are not being reborn, Humans are already made in their image - we are derived from them. Desmond's DNA is a hybrid of human and ancient the main point of which is to pass and give humanity the 6th sense, knowledge -aka eagle vission complete.

Just for the sake of furthering the conjecture:

a) They don't have the same motives nor aims as the Templar. They'd have no stake in helping the Templar as their goal is to join the Adam and Eve DNA lineage. The Templar would never do that. The Templar are trying to wipe that lineage out so there aren't any humans who can resist the PoEs powers.
b) Minerva said that, Juno didn't. Juno seemed ****ed about how everything went down with the humans and Subject 16 is warning against trusting a "her".
c)Juno called that a massive mistake. That humans should never have been given such knowledge. She calls the hybrids their biggest mistakes and their enemies: "You, birthed from our loins and the loins of our enemies. The end and the beginning, who we abhor and honor." She is also speaks in regards to her race as still having some stake in things: "We did not build them to be wise. And now they are our final, faulted hope." Bolding mine. That's "our", as in their hope not humanities. Honestly, why would these "extinct" beings be trying to save humans anyway? Her final words before Desmond picks up the Apple, "We wait for you, Desmond. You will come here. You will activate it. You will know only when it is too late," don't sound very rosy either. She then proceeds to force Desmond to apparently kill an Assassin (Lucy doesn't show up red in EV).

Really, this is all for the sake of argument, but I certainly can't believe you could say with surety that Minerva, Juno and Jupiter have humanity's best interest in mind based on the extremely small and contradictory information game makers have so far provided. In fact, I'm willing to bet the writers aren't even sure where they are going to go with the AC3 yet.

Steelbadger
11-27-2010, 05:38 PM
Originally posted by capeo:
c)Juno called that a massive mistake. That humans should never have been given such knowledge. She calls the hybrids their biggest mistakes and their enemies: "You, birthed from our loins and the loins of our enemies. The end and the beginning, who we abhor and honor." She is also speaks in regards to her race as still having some stake in things: "We did not build them to be wise. And now they are our final, faulted hope." Bolding mine. That's "our", as in their hope not humanities. Honestly, why would these "extinct" beings be trying to save humans anyway? Her final words before Desmond picks up the Apple, "We wait for you, Desmond. You will come here. You will activate it. You will know only when it is too late," don't sound very rosy either. She then proceeds to force Desmond to apparently kill an Assassin (Lucy doesn't show up red in EV).


Add to that when she (Juno) says:

"Here is a safe place. Eternal. To store objects. Words. Wisdom. But not life. Almost did we have the means. But time... time erodes us. We can distract him. We can see past him. Feint left when he strikes right. But his reach is so very long. His stamina unending. We cannot evade his grasp. Not forever."

and

"It is hard to stay contained. Knowing as we do. We wait for you, Desmond."

The use of tense throughout her monologue gives them impression of a consciousness rooted, at least partially, in Desmond's present time. "We Wait"? If these were really recordings made using time-travel (or viewing) technology, which is what I origionally assumed, then why are they waiting?

I origionally thought that the vaults were like advanced messages recorded a long time in the past, with apparent foresight from the recordings as a result of having seen future events and how people would act (allowing them to turn their head in the right direction, address the correct names and react to stimuli). But now it almost sounds more like an infomorph being (One who's consciousness has been moved from a body to an artificial computer). Possibly one waiting to be reunited with a body.

They can stall time, which is what they have been doing, but until now have been unable to keep life safe from it's advances.

Maybe they need the next solar flare to be able to overcome the technological barrier of giving themselves eternal life and they've been buying time up till now. Juno certainly seems very impatient; more impatient than I'd be if I was recording it as a message thousands of years ago.

thecapeo
11-27-2010, 06:07 PM
Originally posted by Steelbadger:
Add to that when she (Juno) says:

"Here is a safe place. Eternal. To store objects. Words. Wisdom. But not life. Almost did we have the means. But time... time erodes us. We can distract him. We can see past him. Feint left when he strikes right. But his reach is so very long. His stamina unending. We cannot evade his grasp. Not forever."

and

"It is hard to stay contained. Knowing as we do. We wait for you, Desmond."

The use of tense throughout her monologue gives them impression of a consciousness rooted, at least partially, in Desmond's present time. "We Wait"? If these were really recordings made using time-travel (or viewing) technology, which is what I origionally assumed, then why are they waiting?

I origionally thought that the vaults were like advanced messages recorded a long time in the past, with apparent foresight from the recordings as a result of having seen future events and how people would act (allowing them to turn their head in the right direction, address the correct names and react to stimuli). But now it almost sounds more like an infomorph being (One who's consciousness has been moved from a body to an artificial computer). Possibly one waiting to be reunited with a body.

They can stall time, which is what they have been doing, but until now have been unable to keep life safe from it's advances.

Maybe they need the next solar flare to be able to overcome the technological barrier of giving themselves eternal life and they've been buying time up till now. Juno certainly seems very impatient; more impatient than I'd be if I was recording it as a message thousands of years ago.

Exactly. Juno's words stand in contrast to the impression left at the end of AC2 that these are just recorded messages left by these beings. Juno implies that though they are beholden to time they are still actively fighting it. In other words they are waiting for something and they still exist in some appreciable, if currently metaphysical, way.

RomanDozer
11-28-2010, 02:41 AM
Desmond: Who?
Subject 16: She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become, everything you hold dear, itís already gone.


Lucy is not who you think she is. A Templar agent. I just have a feeling it was all set up from the begining. For some reason, Lucy and Desmond were "allowed" to get away and Lucy has been a mole inside the Assassin's Guild all along. When Des stabs her, it's as if the voice talking to him is trying to tell him, this has to be done to save what is left. Why else would the PoE have used Desmond to off her? What threat was she? She's a fake...I just feel it. There was something not right about that girl from the start. Maybe she developed genuine feelings for Desmond, maybe it was a show. Either way, she had to go down apparently and it wasn't just so Desmond could prove he had it in him to kill.

I think the reason the voice talking to Desmond grew aggitated at times (while you are getting the Apple) was because it has seen what mankind has done with the technology, used it, killed each other, etc. for all the wrong reasons. Perhaps it was just letting it's feelings get the better of it, her, whatever it really is. I think it's as if this other "race" doesn't want either side to have it, but knows it's better to go with the lesser evil, if in fact they do view humanity as evil.

Yet how was it able to fortell the coming of Desmond? I can honestly say, ACB has put me more in the dark than the AC or AC2 did. I am so lost in the sauce now

xXxDAL978xXx
11-28-2010, 03:05 AM
Originally posted by DespondentSoul:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Desmond: Who?
Subject 16: She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become, everything you hold dear, itís already gone.


Lucy is not who you think she is. A Templar agent. I just have a feeling it was all set up from the begining. For some reason, Lucy and Desmond were "allowed" to get away and Lucy has been a mole inside the Assassin's Guild all along. When Des stabs her, it's as if the voice talking to him is trying to tell him, this has to be done to save what is left. Why else would the PoE have used Desmond to off her? What threat was she? She's a fake...I just feel it. There was something not right about that girl from the start. Maybe she developed genuine feelings for Desmond, maybe it was a show. Either way, she had to go down apparently and it wasn't just so Desmond could prove he had it in him to kill.

I think the reason the voice talking to Desmond grew aggitated at times (while you are getting the Apple) was because it has seen what mankind has done with the technology, used it, killed each other, etc. for all the wrong reasons. Perhaps it was just letting it's feelings get the better of it, her, whatever it really is. I think it's as if this other "race" doesn't want either side to have it, but knows it's better to go with the lesser evil, if in fact they do view humanity as evil.

Yet how was it able to fortell the coming of Desmond? I can honestly say, ACB has put me more in the dark than the AC or AC2 did. I am so lost in the sauce now </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Same. After AC2, it was starting to make sense, i was getting everything but now after finishing ACB, i'm left with so many questions. I don't know what to think about Lucy, she must have been a Templar and was just pretending to like Desmond and be an Assassin to find the Apple. During the game, she kept dissapearing, leading me to believe that she was a templar. I also think we are playing as Desmond's son and he is reliving memories of his dad and when he saw Desmond stabd Lucy (His mother) he went into shock cause he couldn't take it. When the credits role, the 2 voices are new, i've never heard them before. Also, with the truth thing, Subject 16 says "The sun.... you son", leading me to believe that the Sun isn't going to destory the world, the son is (Desmond's son, who i think is the son of Lucy and Desmond). Who knows, so many questions, but it looks like we only have to wait 12 months until another AC game comes out, can't wait.

spookier
11-28-2010, 04:56 AM
While it is possible that Lucy is a Templar agent, I think it's much more likely that Juno/ the others of the FC saw her as a threat to Desmond reuniting his DNA with Eve's. There are quite a few explicit clues that point to this, and TOWCB, as we know, can see into the future.

Also, I acknowledge that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I can't help but think there is NO way Desmond's son could possibly be the protagonist. It is now 72 days till the big disaster, and if Desmond even had a son, he would have mentioned it by now. I just can't see it happening. I have no doubt that he will figure in to AC3 somehow, just not as the protagonist.

thecapeo
11-28-2010, 07:07 AM
I agree with both posters above on the point that after AC2 I, as well, thought I had a fair grasp of where the game was headed. Now? Not so much.

I don't think Lucy was a Templar though. She would be red in Eagle Vision. Although maybe the Templars are using a PoE to force her to be a double agent against her will? or without her knowing? Then maybe her allegiance would still not show red?

Who knows? Obviously Desmond's son factors into this somehow but unless they get into some crazy time paradox stuff (which I sincerely hope they don't) I can't see him reliving Desmond's memories.

Wind91
11-28-2010, 07:12 AM
I think Desmond's son is gunna be more of a thing they will lead into AC IV with. Because his son will be a human with full fledged Ancient DNA - which is what the ancients wanted, give humanity the 6th sense - Knowledge. The responsibility for Desmond Jr. is a little different too not only does he represent Altair's line, he also has to live up the Ancients last acts of saving humanity.

Danny_Boy1113
11-28-2010, 11:46 AM
Well, Juno (the goddess from ACB) said that someone, a woman exactly, had to accompany Desmond through the gates... She also said she's in Eden, where Adam and Eve come from. One of the things that caught my attention was when she said "awaken the sixth"...

Eden was apparently located in Mesopotamia, right now called Iraq. Desmond is Adam's descendant and he has to find Eve's descendant in Eden. And for what she about "Awaken the Sixth":
1. Adam
2. AltaÔr
3. Ezio
4. Subject 16
5. Desmond (Subject 17)
6. The Next Assassin

Danny_Boy1113
11-28-2010, 11:49 AM
I forgot 1 thing...
I think Desmond was forced to kill Lucy because she was a love interest to him and he has to fall in love with Eve's descendant, and Lucy was in the way.

Kerid
11-28-2010, 01:02 PM
I think she was talking about awakening his sixth sense, not a sixth person

Lazaran
11-28-2010, 01:09 PM
People are getting Minerva mixed up with Juno. It was not Minerva in the end, it was Juno who forced you to kill Lucy.

I'm wondering if maybe Minerva is a "good" god, and Juno is her "bad" sister. She seemed like a ***** to me. Or maybe she was just doing what needed to be done.

Maybe if the Assassins were descended from Minerva, the Templars could have come from Juno? That could be why Cesare was still saying even as he was about to die that no man could kill him. He might have had god blood in him from Juno, and truly believed he was a god.

thecapeo
11-29-2010, 01:38 PM
Originally posted by Lazaran:
People are getting Minerva mixed up with Juno. It was not Minerva in the end, it was Juno who forced you to kill Lucy.

I'm wondering if maybe Minerva is a "good" god, and Juno is her "bad" sister. She seemed like a ***** to me. Or maybe she was just doing what needed to be done.

Maybe if the Assassins were descended from Minerva, the Templars could have come from Juno? That could be why Cesare was still saying even as he was about to die that no man could kill him. He might have had god blood in him from Juno, and truly believed he was a god.

Yeah, we haven't even touched on Cesare and his claims in this thread, nor how open ended his "death" was.

DDarkLaw
11-29-2010, 01:46 PM
Originally posted by xXxDAL978xXx:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DespondentSoul:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Desmond: Who?
Subject 16: She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become, everything you hold dear, itís already gone.


Lucy is not who you think she is. A Templar agent. I just have a feeling it was all set up from the begining. For some reason, Lucy and Desmond were "allowed" to get away and Lucy has been a mole inside the Assassin's Guild all along. When Des stabs her, it's as if the voice talking to him is trying to tell him, this has to be done to save what is left. Why else would the PoE have used Desmond to off her? What threat was she? She's a fake...I just feel it. There was something not right about that girl from the start. Maybe she developed genuine feelings for Desmond, maybe it was a show. Either way, she had to go down apparently and it wasn't just so Desmond could prove he had it in him to kill.

I think the reason the voice talking to Desmond grew aggitated at times (while you are getting the Apple) was because it has seen what mankind has done with the technology, used it, killed each other, etc. for all the wrong reasons. Perhaps it was just letting it's feelings get the better of it, her, whatever it really is. I think it's as if this other "race" doesn't want either side to have it, but knows it's better to go with the lesser evil, if in fact they do view humanity as evil.

Yet how was it able to fortell the coming of Desmond? I can honestly say, ACB has put me more in the dark than the AC or AC2 did. I am so lost in the sauce now </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



If it was all set up from beginning why did Lucy trained Desmond to become an assassin wouldn't it be much easier if they would just stay in abstergo get the AOE and kill Desmond?why did Lucy killed the guards in AC2?Why did Lucy gave Desmond kill the abstergo agents when they got to the hideout? Lucy helped Desmond sniff around abstergo,and didn't gave the "guys" from AC1 kill Desmond Why did she protect him?The last Thing They got the AOE in ACB in the ending why didn't lucy just killed desmond from behind or something? But something can be true The voices ..I dunno but if lucy is a real traitor maybe she called Abstergo Agents to kill Desmond ..but that's just stupid . Lucy in not a traitor She is an assassin http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif



Same. After AC2, it was starting to make sense, i was getting everything but now after finishing ACB, i'm left with so many questions. I don't know what to think about Lucy, she must have been a Templar and was just pretending to like Desmond and be an Assassin to find the Apple. During the game, she kept dissapearing, leading me to believe that she was a templar. I also think we are playing as Desmond's son and he is reliving memories of his dad and when he saw Desmond stabd Lucy (His mother) he went into shock cause he couldn't take it. When the credits role, the 2 voices are new, i've never heard them before. Also, with the truth thing, Subject 16 says "The sun.... you son", leading me to believe that the Sun isn't going to destory the world, the son is (Desmond's son, who i think is the son of Lucy and Desmond). Who knows, so many questions, but it looks like we only have to wait 12 months until another AC game comes out, can't wait. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Dude how can Lucy and Desmond have a son IF LUCY IS DEAD?!
when did Lucy disappeared?


I have one word to say about the ending of ACB "Nothing is True Everything is permitted"

oneill95
11-29-2010, 03:09 PM
guys, this is what i think. In the truth it says that 'she cannot be trusted' or something. I believe that LUCY IS STILL PART OF ABSTERGO and kept them in the know of what the assassin's are doing and thats why subject 16 warned you and the 'ones who came before' killed her. Also i think that the two men are from abstergo because about a minute after lucy dies they come, And rebecca's animus is the only one that the assassin's have because she made it so i dont thinkthe men were assassins, meanwhile abstergo has hundreds. Anyone have anything to add http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

oneill95
11-29-2010, 03:27 PM
there is 0% chance of lucy being desmonds sons mother and desmonds son reliving desmonds memory at the same time (if u didnt understand that then this next bit cud be difficult http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif). this is becaue if u remember in ac2 desmond relived (outside the animus)altair with the fake templar leader from ac1, anyway wen altiar left you stay with the woman (dont want to get too graphic but...) altiar's sperm (ezio and desmonds not very important decendant) was in the woman.

If lucy was the mother of desmonds son and we just didnt see any hint of that then desmonds son (as sperm) would stay with lucy.

WOW that was tricky http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

TatsumaruIshida
11-29-2010, 04:41 PM
"awaken the sixth"...

Eden was apparently located in Mesopotamia, right now called Iraq. Desmond is Adam's descendant and he has to find Eve's descendant in Eden. And for what she about "Awaken the Sixth":
1. Adam
2. AltaÔr
3. Ezio
4. Subject 16
5. Desmond (Subject 17)
6. The Next Assassin

Okies i just had post something about this cos to me it seemed so obivious that made me think how someone could IMO get so far off the track.

So in that temple and all the time we are jumping Juno is talking bout the Sixth Sense that the FCs have but we dont that we can only touch, feel, smell, hear, taste.. that the sixth only the FCs have.. and that to late they tried to give it to us.. that we or some only percieve a blue shimmering etc.. aka eagle vision.... so taking what she said in this speech previously.. the words "Awaken the sixth" cannot be refering to anything else but the sixth sense.. that sense which would make man like the FC not a sixth assassin especially when we may have only seen/heard or played the memories of 5 assassins there has obiviously been more through out history.

(edited for typos)

Solidrave
11-30-2010, 09:57 AM
Well personally mid game I got the feeling that something wasn't right with Lucy. So it would kinda make sense if she really was a double agent for Abstergo because:

1) If Abstergo can see anything above ground due to cell towers how come they were safe in AC2

2) If Abstergo really wanted to get Desmond back why didn't they bring guns. I mean they have the money for it, and the power to cover any trouble if something went wrong. It might have just been to portray Lucy in a good light though.

3) When you get out of the Animus and talk to her Lucy says that some of the passwords still worked even though she could not get very far. Would a company that just suffered espionage say "Oh well, s**t happens, lets just change some of the passwords and leave others so that we may get spied on again."


And as a side not for any future releases.
In AC2 before fleeing Abstergo Lucy made Desmond relive as Ezio just as he was born. If that is because the Assassin's Animus misses some key component then we probably will still be playing as Ezio in the next AC installment.

DDarkLaw
11-30-2010, 01:55 PM
Originally posted by Solidrave:
Well personally mid game I got the feeling that something wasn't right with Lucy. So it would kinda make sense if she really was a double agent for Abstergo because:

1) If Abstergo can see anything above ground due to cell towers how come they were safe in AC2

2) If Abstergo really wanted to get Desmond back why didn't they bring guns. I mean they have the money for it, and the power to cover any trouble if something went wrong. It might have just been to portray Lucy in a good light though.

3) When you get out of the Animus and talk to her Lucy says that some of the passwords still worked even though she could not get very far. Would a company that just suffered espionage say "Oh well, s**t happens, lets just change some of the passwords and leave others so that we may get spied on again."


And as a side not for any future releases.
In AC2 before fleeing Abstergo Lucy made Desmond relive as Ezio just as he was born. If that is because the Assassin's Animus misses some key component then we probably will still be playing as Ezio in the next AC installment.
They Didn't bring guns cuz They didn't want to kill Desmond!!!
They weren't safe in AC2 Lucy kept warning him That abstergo agents can come every second.

Lucy is not an abstergo agent it just doesn't make sense!
if She was she wouldn't run away with desmond she would stay in abstergo and keep him there with Warren.

ninjadox101
11-30-2010, 07:15 PM
So the ending implies that Desmond was still in an animus during the sequence where he is forced to kill Lucy.

Has anyone considered that this never actually happened, but that Juno forced Desmond to stab Lucy in order to desynchronize him, and bring him out of the animus?

RequiemDogma
11-30-2010, 08:52 PM
1) If Abstergo can see anything above ground due to cell towers how come they were safe in AC2
They weren't. Abstergo found them.



2) If Abstergo really wanted to get Desmond back why didn't they bring guns. I mean they have the money for it, and the power to cover any trouble if something went wrong. It might have just been to portray Lucy in a good light though. Stray fire in a warehouse where desmond will be participating in the resistance? Yeah, too high a risk.



3) When you get out of the Animus and talk to her Lucy says that some of the passwords still worked even though she could not get very far. Would a company that just suffered espionage say "Oh well, s**t happens, lets just change some of the passwords and leave others so that we may get spied on again."
Vidic was TERRIBLE with passwords, and security. Abstergo could also be leaving false openings to track access and locations from which said access was made.


And as a side not for any future releases.
In AC2 before fleeing Abstergo Lucy made Desmond relive as Ezio just as he was born. If that is because the Assassin's Animus misses some key component then we probably will still be playing as Ezio in the next AC installment.[/QUOTE]



So the ending implies that Desmond was still in an animus during the sequence where he is forced to kill Lucy.
Didn't really imply that at all.


Has anyone considered that this never actually happened, but that Juno forced Desmond to stab Lucy in order to desynchronize him, and bring him out of the animus?
Theory seems to rely heavily on, well, theory.

ninjadox101
11-30-2010, 11:52 PM
You have watched the ending right?

Obviously everything is speculation, however here is my reasoning:

Whenever you do something drastically different from the way that Ezio experienced things, you desynchronize in the game. Whether it be that you get caught sneaking around when you weren't supposed to, or you murder a bunch of innocents, it kicks you out of the memory and forces you to do it again.

Immediately after Desmond is forced to stab Lucy, they both collapse. Then during the credits the voices say that he's in shock, and that the animus is responsible. If Desmond (or even a descendant) really has been in an animus all this time, then it's not too far fetched to believe that maybe Lucy isn't dead, and that Juno somehow forced Desmond to do something that didn't happen in order to kick him out of the animus.

spookier
12-01-2010, 12:37 AM
Can people please get the whole "Desmond's son for AC3!" out of their system. I'll wait, and I appreciate that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I'm amazed at how many people have latched on to this idea.

Yes, we all know that we were 'put back in the animus' during the credits, but there is NO REASON why this can't be Desmond himself after being discovered.
We know that Desmond falling down could possibly be due to de-synchronization. Honestly though, its much more likely that he simply fainted from shock and the effect of the Apple. And Lucy was stabbed. No need for anything too overcomplicated.
And yes, Sixteen DID say things that lent themselves to a "future" storyline... but Ubisoft have explicitly stated that Desmond is the protagonist of the trilogy, commented on his search for the temples being the crux of AC3, and I highly doubt they would invest so much time and effort into developing a character and a plot set-up for him simply to suddenly strip it away and bypass the great looming catastrophe.

ninjadox101
12-01-2010, 03:29 PM
People are going to wonder, that's just how it is.

I agree that it's possible that Desmond may have actually stabbed Lucy and then collapsed, however i don't think it's a very sensible ending for a character that's been there since day one. It just makes more sense to me that this particular event happened while in the animus, especially after hearing what the voices have to say during the credits.

As for the idea being overcomplicated, i have to disagree. A dream within a dream isn't exactly a new concept, nor is it impossible to understand. It's just an idea that makes you think a little more about the details.

Regardless, we won't know for sure what's going on or why until the developers reveal it to us.

spookier
12-01-2010, 07:27 PM
I wasn't implying people shouldn't theorize, hell, I love to guess where story's like this will go... I just personally find the idea of such a jump for AC3 a bit too out of synch http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif with the more deliberate set up.
I do agree, however, that these hints do have a meaning, and I have my own views on their purpose. I just don't think they will all necessarily pay off in the next game.

EDIT: I believe Lucy was stabbed. Weather she is dead or not is an entirely different matter.

kartoonist435
12-02-2010, 06:59 PM
I see what everyone is talking about but I think the more logical answer is a combination of all of them. Lucy is eve's decendent that's why 16 says her blood is the key and in the end Desmond is laying next to her and the apple and her blood spills onto the apple. Desmond wouldn't kill her on his own Minerva had to force him to. Secondly Minerva said something about cleansing by fire and floods. I think as December 2012 approaches he and Lucy will need to make there way to safety aka eden which they will find using the apple. Ow onto the part where 16 says it's later than you know and that its already too late. I think that in "reality" you are desmonds son and the Templars are trying to find the location of Eden all of what happened in the end was too much for him to handle and that's why he starts going into shock.

kartoonist435
12-02-2010, 07:08 PM
Why would Desmond be in an animus reliving his own memories maybe there is no son but Lucy still pretty much has to be eve if the ending was reality then that should open up the next game to finding Eden before it's too late. I think it was just too coincidental that the apple laying there gets lucy's blood on it and the whole 16 the DNA is the key stuff

Kaipur
12-03-2010, 08:35 PM
Ok I'm going to put my two cents forward. First off, I love the Assassin's Creed series and this game is just as awesome as the others (minus the glitch issues of course). That having been said, I was thinking that either Lucy or Shaun was a templar, HOWEVER, given what I found at the end I'm thinking that what's going on is that these people are being used by the ancient race, or gods, or whatever they call themselves. Subject 16 never NEVER said Lucy was the untrustworthy one only that "SHE is not what she seems." That could be anyone and could in fact imply Juno. It is a possibility now to me that perhaps Juno is so upset with humanity, given her rather hateful tone, that she wants to see it annihilated. So it is possible she is using Desmond to open up the temples to bring about the catclysm of humanity. The fact that the "cross is darkening" the horizon merely references how sporadic the Templar actions have been at this point and are making it difficult to predict the final outcomes of what is to happen next. The Sixth sense being referenced is the ability to foresee future events and therefore become part of the timeline itself. So it seems to me.

Second, I think there may be something to Lucy being descended of Eve and that maybe 16 was subtly helping Desmond when Juno tried to make him kill Lucy (so that she would no longer be an unknown factor to Juno--and make controlling Desmond easier.) I think that by missing vital organs, Desmond got some blood (DNA) on his blade so when he is put back in the Animus by the two men (who I took to be Shaun, he sounded like Shaun to me, and William M.) the DNA would lock into the system allowing Desmond to track down Eve and discover why the apple was taken in the first place.

Third, this is Desmond's story, not his son's. I'm not sure what the cryptic message by 16 meant but I do not believe it was in relation to Desmond per se. I think we will see Desmond become the premier assassin in the third game and likely join the ranks of the master assassin's. The Templar seem to me to be the secondary enemies while the main enemies may be the 'gods' themselves.

However it plays out, i'm in for the ride. I just hope the next game isn't so damn glitchy. This one is just really ridiculous with that. But anyhow these are just my theories on it. We'll see the first quarter of the next game take place in another ancestor's time period, but then without a doubt Desmond will take over to complete the saga. There may be something that happens to Desmond's son as a result of the coming events maybe but I don't think we're playing the game as his son as that would just be too confusing for the general audience and I don't think Ubisoft wants that kind of problem to deal with.

~Kaipur

etnitz
12-04-2010, 12:08 AM
just remember the assassin's creed: nothing is true, everything is permitted.

tortle
12-04-2010, 01:09 AM
Well I figured that I'm just as lost as the next person so I'll throw my thoughts in too. I personally think that first off subject 16 and what he says is the most important piece to figuring this mess out thats why its called "the truth" lucy seems to be eve and her dna is needed to awaken the sixth sense hence the the apple and her dna mix either that or their son will have the full powers of the sixth sense regardless desmond will be the next hero. I also think that the templars are run by jupiter since they are christian and the gods are trying to destroy the hybrids adam and eve so that they can control the population again so when 16 says she cannot be trusted its juno not lucy its weird that lucy disappears for awhile but its too simple to say shes a trator remember nothing is true everything is permitted who knows lucy might still have connections with the templars or she might have taken a visit to hq who knows. I think 16 is alive might be desmonds dad clone or brother idk lucy did say she didnt know if his parents made it 16 might also be an ai but still 16 knows the truth even if hes crazy. the voices at the end were there mostly to get you back in the game and i think its a group of assassins. still though it seems as if no matter what the humans are screwed and only desmond and eve will be able to servive since they are the hybrids and will find eden

Sponge-worthy
12-04-2010, 01:32 AM
I'm also leaning toward the Lucy as a double agent thing. Just the vibe from her in this game. For example, in her email about what is happening to Desmond is unfortunate, but is necessary to 'achieve our goals.'

Not to mention that her long disappearance from Monteriggioni is never explained. Of course, it could all be misdirects, but if not for Lucy, then Abstergo has very little to no presence in either AC:II or AC:B at all.

mx.brmn
12-05-2010, 12:10 AM
My theory is this. Desmond is one of Adam's descendants. (That's pretty obvious.) He needs to find Eve and they need to combine DNA to make a baby with "The Sixth", the power of knowledge or whatever.
And as for what happened to him, his body is so used to the animus that with all the time out of it now, and stabbing one of his friends, the stress and shock has essentially sent his body into withdrawal, as people do with drug. He passes out from the withdrawal, and somebody with an animus (I'm hoping for Assassins) finds him and rescues him.

As for Lucy, hopefully whoever found Desmond also can get Lucy medical attention before she dies.

So best case scenario, in AC3 Desmond is woken from the animus and finds himself in the Assassins HQ with Lucy alive and in as best condition as possible after being stabbed. Then Desmond will find Eve's descendant and do what needs to happen to destroy the Templars and save the world.

This is all speculation, and not even necessarily possible if I'm forgetting some important detail. Tell me any input so I can make this idea work better.

Thanks. I freaking love this series.

tortle
12-05-2010, 01:13 AM
whahaha I think I have found out what happened to sixteen. ok so sixteens blood was all over the animus room in ac1 so hed have to be dead or dieing when they found him. so using the fact that he had to "replenish his energy" he has to be an AI now and he put himself or maybe lucy put him in the templars animus's core which is why lucy had to take it with them when they fled abstergo he also said he will be there when desmond needs him and this explans why 16 is in the animus and how he is still alive. this also helps prove lucy is not a trator still we dont know who 16 is but i think this is what he is.

robertolu
12-05-2010, 07:02 AM
IF you remember in the email for those who got out of the Animus
1)William sent her email stating she should not get to attached of have any feeling to Desmond
2)Subject 16 told Desmond not to get trust her which is Minerva obviously

jiggawade
12-06-2010, 01:09 PM
just beat the game for the first time and at first i thought after desmond killed lucy she was a direct descedent(spell check) to eve and they would go into some supernatural after death jesus training for 3 nights buuuut i checked the previous truth and eve has black hair...so my guess is that lucy isn't eve and there was a defect with their company not sure of her being evil or not...her death i believe will cause desmond to gain his "sixth sense"(knowledge(check minerva's bull**** speech))(not like the movie) and in that know what the defect was....i think subject 16 and desmond are blood relatives and if not psychologically(spell check) related because in the truth 17 sais desmond can look for him in the darkness....darkness from a dead person only spawns in the brain and thats why at the end the guys are talking about shock and stuff because hes having a memory about 16...o so back to eve uh i also checked the truth and adam has a beard just like ezio(scarless) but similar...

Before minerva/desmond stabs lucy shaun(spell check) talks about the phyrigian cap(spell check) and the masoninc eye(dolla dolla bill yall) anyway they only come together around the time of the french revolution on the declaration of rights and man and some other blah blah blah about citizenship and illegals...so french ancestor next? dunno...

um 16 sais son because for desmond has to make an offspring for the next doomsday that one should be obvious...

i think that each ancestor has a whats the word i guess villian works and surplus mission they have to accomplish and then have offspring...and then every millenia a new earthly threat is at hand and the ancestors mission usually revolves around that...the gods means were their knowledge and supernatural powers and humans have anumi(spell check plural)

o and the borgia guy? i think that he can't be killed by man because he is a descendant...

jiggawade
12-06-2010, 01:10 PM
beat the game for the first time and at first i thought after desmond killed lucy she was a direct descedent(spell check) to eve and they would go into some supernatural after death jesus training for 3 nights buuuut i checked the previous truth and eve has black hair...so my guess is that lucy isn't eve and there was a defect with their company not sure of her being evil or not...her death i believe will cause desmond to gain his "sixth sense"(knowledge(check minerva's bull**** speech))(not like the movie) and in that know what the defect was....i think subject 16 and desmond are blood relatives and if not psychologically(spell check) related because in the truth 17 sais desmond can look for him in the darkness....darkness from a dead person only spawns in the brain and thats why at the end the guys are talking about shock and stuff because hes having a memory about 16...o so back to eve uh i also checked the truth and adam has a beard just like ezio(scarless) but similar...

Before minerva/desmond stabs lucy shaun(spell check) talks about the phyrigian cap(spell check) and the masoninc eye(dolla dolla bill yall) anyway they only come together around the time of the french revolution on the declaration of rights and man and some other blah blah blah about citizenship and illegals...so french ancestor next? dunno...

um 16 sais son because for desmond has to make an offspring for the next doomsday that one should be obvious...

i think that each ancestor has a whats the word i guess villian works and surplus mission they have to accomplish and then have offspring...and then every millenia a new earthly threat is at hand and the ancestors mission usually revolves around that...the gods means were their knowledge and supernatural powers and humans have anumi(spell check plural)

o and the borgia guy? i think that he can't be killed by man because he is a descendant...

CyanideCN
12-07-2010, 10:28 AM
I have this theory. The assassins main motto is "Nothing is true, everything is permitted.", so what if Lucy's death was just an illusion, from what I know the apple has the power to make illusions, multiply yourself or something and control minds. All of them were caught in the illusion, but Shaun, Rebecca and Lucy were just standing there (exception though Lucy got stabbed) but it looked like Desmond was the only one that was conscious at the time. Then after the illusion he got traumatized by his doing, but leaves our main characters unscratched. Leaving it to the credits to point out that he went into a state of shock, but there was no reaction towards the other assassins (Lucy, Shaun, etc.) Especially to Lucy since she's dead (as seen in the game). Probably I'm wrong but hey who knows, only the developers know about it.

d-ShLuM
12-07-2010, 09:04 PM
Originally posted by CyanideCN:
I have this theory. The assassins main motto is "Nothing is true, everything is permitted.", so what if Lucy's death was just an illusion, from what I know the apple has the power to make illusions, multiply yourself or something and control minds. All of them were caught in the illusion, but Shaun, Rebecca and Lucy were just standing there (exception though Lucy got stabbed) but it looked like Desmond was the only one that was conscious at the time. Then after the illusion he got traumatized by his doing, but leaves our main characters unscratched. Leaving it to the credits to point out that he went into a state of shock, but there was no reaction towards the other assassins (Lucy, Shaun, etc.) Especially to Lucy since she's dead (as seen in the game). Probably I'm wrong but hey who knows, only the developers know about it.

That's a good theory and it is possible. As we all know, Altair led to believe he was actually stabbed by Al Mualim, when really it was just the illusion of the Apple. This could be the same case here, just simply switch out Juno for Al Mualim, and Desmond for Altair (luckily Desmond is not the victim of the stabbing, rather it is Lucy http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif).

RKO289
12-08-2010, 08:53 AM
While we're throwing round ideas, here's mine. Desmond is a descendant of Adam and Lucy that of Eve. Juno states "the path must be open" and from Subject 16 we're told "her DNA is the key". Make sense to me that Lucy's blood is the key. There's also no reason to believe she's dead, stranger things have happened and in the Subject 16 video from AC2 he says that the 'shroud' has the ability to heal and resurrect. Desmond faints due to using the apple and being drained by it as Ezio is when he uses it.

For the voices at the end I believe them to be of either William or Subject 16, or both, or are they the same person? William asks about Desmond's condition in his emails and the trophy for 16's puzzle is morse code for "I AM ALIVE".

They also talk about 3 gods throughout the game, we hear from Juno and Minerva but Jupiter is missing. Juno also says that the one Desmond seeks is "out of sight". Jupiter? Minerva talks about men being made in their image as slaves, I believe man got intelligent and the war broke out.

Finally, I think eagle vision is the "sixth sense", they mention hearing and seeing things, I forgot the quote. We all know eagle vision can be used to see enemies etc. and Altair can listen in from distance in AC1. As for the footsteps at the beginning, at the moment, I belive them to be of the theif we see fleeing at the beginning as they are there when we start the game. However, what gives me doubt is, why? The thief isn't that important. Very last thing, I don't at all believe about playing as Desmond's son, at the end of AC2 Minerva is talking through Ezio to Desmond not his son, unless Desmond is Desmond's sons name which would be sneaky.

Thanks for reading my essay! Maybe Ubisoft don't know yet, they're just reading all these ideas and will use their favourite, haha!

PranoidAndroid
12-08-2010, 04:45 PM
I like the idea of subject 16 being one of Desmond's different identities that he's not aware of. And the possibility of the scene where Desmond stabs Lucy being an illusion seems totally plausible. That would also back up the theory that William H. or another Assassin believed that Desmond was experiencing severe side effects to the Animus. Desmond may think that he killed Lucy and be in shock as a result and the two men with Desmond at the end may take that as an Animus induced effect.
Another thing: Earlier in this thread, people were mentioning that Lucy disappeared for a while, but if you were to look outside the Sanctuary, she is standing right there, waiting for you to trigger a conversation with her.
Also, I have kind of a wild theory: What if the "catastrophe" is really the launch of EyeAbstergo? The launch of that satellite would greatly increase the Templars' power and maybe even bring about the entire destruction of the Brotherhood. This in turn would ruin any chance at the First Civilization being reborn through Desmond and "eve". So maybe the Ones Who Came Before are really only looking to bring about the second coming of their race. I do know that this catastrophe has supposedly happened before, so I may be totally wrong, but it's just a thought.

PranoidAndroid
12-08-2010, 04:48 PM
Also, Juno mentioned that Eagle Vision is essentially a watered-down version of the sixth sense. She said that they tried to pass it down to humans, but that all Desmond sees is the "blue shimmer".

rmmustang20
12-08-2010, 05:18 PM
this has a decent explnation skip to the credits b/c it shows the whole last mission

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnM6OY3xIGg

Oil.Change11
12-14-2010, 06:54 AM
I think that Juno and Minerva are not on the same page as each other. Maybe Juno is one of the original ancients that kept us enslaved. 16 might be talking about her as of who not to trust. Desmond and company think she is there to help them but she might have a different agenda. I don't think the others even saw or heard Juno. If they did Lucy probably would have second guess going there. To me this was not the place Minerva wanted Desmond to find. The ones who turned from war is probably the ancients that decided to study the sun or whatever and could care less about who should rule and started focusing on preserving life. Maybe there was a seperation of thoughts between the ancients of what they should do about humans during the war. To sum it up, I think Juno is trying to get back into power, while Minerva is trying to lead Desmond to help against the catastrophe and she may be the only ancient that thinks like this. IMPORTANT: the ones who turned from war may not even be the ancient aliens race but the first free humans or a coalition of both races.

Oil.Change11
12-14-2010, 07:15 AM
Sorry for the double post but I'm a noob. But the temples could be our ancient structures such as the aztec pyramids or something. Minerva did not say look for recordings so it might not have to be high tech. Just clues on the walls or something. Who's to say we didn't steal thier machines to leave messages though, right? I just had to say this because it seems as though alot of people overlook the fact that Juno and Minerva may not have the same goals. Minerva only mentions Juno as the same race as her, she did not say seek Juno out. She probably didn't know Ezio was going to leave the apple in Juno's temple. P.S. Did anyone else notice the red lines on the floor under the first gold switch in the final room. The switch right in front of the Stairs to the apple. Did someone bleed there or is it a more sinister meaning to that sign on the floor. IT CHANGES COMPLETELY.

mental-ity_2.
12-14-2010, 03:44 PM
i beleive that desmond does have a son but not at the moment i think that subject 16 is either desmonds brother or possibly a son that desmond was not aware of. the ending is a shocker and of all theses possibilities id have to say that the memory within a memory idea is the most logical direction for ubisoft to take because it opens up another story for them to follow up on. who knows maybe the next assasins creed will be a prequel where you play as subject 16...i think that would be cool.

Nutella0Mutt
12-14-2010, 05:48 PM
In terms of "awakening the Sixth", does anyone else think that maybe Subject 16 has found a way to awaken his 6th sense? He was found a way to predict, manipulate time, and become a part of the timeline like the Ones that Came Before.

And I feel that we can't trust anyone but Subject 16. After all he said he would stick around with Desmond forever.

"Subject 16: I am with you 'til the end. Find me in the darkness."

No one else has promised to be by Desmond's side. I wonder if the TWCB (those who came before) are aware of Subject 16's um... existence? Maybe he's purposefully hiding himself away from both the Templars and TWCB. Why else would he go to all the trouble of leaving hints for Desmond? I'm sure there is a big connection between the 2. Hell, maybe 16 is a long lost brother lol. I hope AC3 gives us answers!!

tkdavis87
12-15-2010, 04:22 PM
http://assassinscreed.wikia.co...irmed_Pieces_of_Eden (http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Piece_of_Eden#Confirmed_Pieces_of_Eden)


Where it talked about the DIA incident and someone sending an email to Vidic, I remember that since the assassins are descendents of adam and eve, and they are immune to the effects of the apple, that the person that sent the email to vidic could be eve...maybe...

Nutella0Mutt
12-15-2010, 10:54 PM
Originally posted by tkdavis87:
http://assassinscreed.wikia.co...irmed_Pieces_of_Eden (http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Piece_of_Eden#Confirmed_Pieces_of_Eden)


Where it talked about the DIA incident and someone sending an email to Vidic, I remember that since the assassins are descendents of adam and eve, and they are immune to the effects of the apple, that the person that sent the email to vidic could be eve...maybe...

Yes yes thanks for the link. : ) We'll uncover answers at some point.. We'll figger it out one day! So many loose ends and questions! They got us good this such a complex story!!

Nutella0Mutt
12-15-2010, 10:56 PM
Originally posted by Nutella0Mutt:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tkdavis87:
http://assassinscreed.wikia.co...irmed_Pieces_of_Eden (http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Piece_of_Eden#Confirmed_Pieces_of_Eden)


Where it talked about the DIA incident and someone sending an email to Vidic, I remember that since the assassins are descendents of adam and eve, and they are immune to the effects of the apple, that the person that sent the email to vidic could be eve...maybe...

Yes yes thanks for the link. : ) We'll uncover answers at some point.. We'll figger it out one day! So many loose ends and questions! They got us good with such a complex story!! Very impressive. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kricketman
12-16-2010, 03:52 PM
In the Truth, when subject 16 was saying "She's not who you think she is.", I don't think she was talking about Lucy. She has been with you too long and she has been too helpful to be a traitor.
I think that I understand why subject 16's video segments are called the truth.
They tell the truth about "The Ones Who Came Before." I believe that subject 16 was trying to warn Desmond that they weren't who they thought they were.
Think about it. In the truth of assassin's creed 2, Adam and Eve stole the apple from the ones who came before. I believe that Adam and Eve stole it for a reason. Because the ones who came before were abusing it's power. There is even a scene during the truth where it shows someone using an apple to force people to create something with metal. It is unknown what they are making, but it is unimportant.
The Ones Who Came Before are not who we think they are.

AcrobatEx
12-16-2010, 05:06 PM
Originally posted by EoT.Patton:
This is for those who have beaten the game.

<span class="ev_code_RED">*SPOILER*</span> !!!!!!!!!

May I say .. WTF!? Can anyone explain the ending to me? I was trying to listen to what the Goddess was saying while I was hopping around on "Tron-Like" platforms, but I didn't catch much, however, it seemed like she had an angry tone. Saying stuff like "You have 5 senses, we have 6. We kept one from you; Knowledge" .. or whatever.

Then, forcing Desmond to kill Lucy, and the Goddess says "It's done. She is lost" or whatever.

I am so confused! After spending literally like 15 hours today playing this game, the ending has disappointed me and left me wanting answers.

I don't see how another Assassin's Creed could come out, because, it seems it's all over. I know they will be releasing DLC, but, while I haven't searched, have they said for any DLC to add-on to the ending? Now that Desmond has the Apple, I don't understand what that means for mankind. O_o

Relax. I believe Desmond is getting put back into an Animus by more Assassin's. Not templars, like a lot of people are saying. It was the other Assassin's Lucy had been telling via Email about Desmond's side-effects, hence the "... but that's what's started all this..." quote during the credits.


On another note, while Desmond and Lucy were getting into the old underground area with the statues of Altair and the others, Desmond said "Ezio came back when he was much older. Why did he come back?"

Well? Why did he come back?! I was expecting all of this to be answered at the end. Yeah, he left the 1419, 1420, 1421 with the image but, why was he in the statue area?

You answered your own question. He came back to leave the numbers for the password to the temple under the Colosseum. The fact that he went to look at the statues in the sanctuary is irrelevant.

Now, you may wonder why he left them there in Monteriggioni. Monteriggioni houses the Sanctuary, which is sort of an Assassin landmark. Ezio wouldn't want the Apple in the hands of anyone but an Assassin, so he decided to leave directions to it's location should later Assassin's, for whatever reason, need to find the Apple. So what better place to leave the key to it's location in than a hidden Assassin shrine? And also what better way to write that key than in blood or some organic paint so that the reader would need to have Eagle Vision?


And one more thing. While you're jumping around, pulling levers in that church, and even when you get in and see the Apple, Desmond see's Ezio doing so. However, when you were Ezio, you went to, I believe the place in AC2, and put the Apple back and locked it away. SOOOO, Why would Ezio go and take the Apple back?.. Then, how did it return back there again?

What are you talking about? In AC2, Ezio has the apple from the moment he gets in Venice until The Spaniard takes it from him in the Vatican. Then they fight outside the vault, and by combining the Apple and the Staff, Ezio gains access to the vault. After Ezio exits the vault, the Staff gets pulled into the earth, and Ezio takes the Apple. Then the whole game called AC: Brotherhood happens, at the end of which, Ezio uses the Apple to find and kill Cesare Borgia. Following that, as we find out in the final memory of sequence 9, he stored it in the Colosseum. BUT, we don't see the whole memory, you just see Ezio place the apple there, then you see him outside the Colosseum, walking away. Those 'ghosts' of Ezio are bits of the part you didn't see, the process by which Ezio got inside the temple under the Colosseum. He didin't "come back" and get just for kicks and then have it magically appear back under the Colosseum for Desmond to find.



Sheesh!

Anyone else have anywhere near as many of these thoughts going through their head as I do? I suspect if you play an hour a day for a few weeks or whatever to beat the game, you may miss some of this, but when your entire day is just Assassin's Creed .. it's the only thing on your mind. ROFLMAO

I know what you mean. These games are awesome! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

The only question I have is this:
In AC1, I believe Desmond and Lucy are talking about the Apple. Lucy mentions Vidic and his associates' interest in the Apple, and Desmond states that it looks like the Apple is at Masyaf.

Following that, if I am not mistaken, Lucy tells Desmond that the Apple was destroyed. She says something about an accident at the Denver Airport.

Also, if you manage to steal Vidic's Access key, you would see that one of his Emails referring to a ball 'breaking open' and people 'going crazy.' I thought that meant that the apple went hay-wire and broke.

But apparently it was under the Colosseum the whole time.
Just sayin. :/

Nutella0Mutt
12-16-2010, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by AcrobatEx:

The only question I have is this:
In AC1, I believe Desmond and Lucy are talking about the Apple. Lucy mentions Vidic and his associates' interest in the Apple, and Desmond states that it looks like the Apple is at Masyaf.

Following that, if I am not mistaken, Lucy tells Desmond that the Apple was destroyed. She says something about an accident at the Denver Airport.

Also, if you manage to steal Vidic's Access key, you would see that one of his Emails referring to a ball 'breaking open' and people 'going crazy.' I thought that meant that the apple went hay-wire and broke.

But apparently it was under the Colosseum the whole time.
Just sayin. :/

There is apparently more than one apple. There were 50 Pieces of Eden, and 5 Apples. I dunno why. Here's the info.

"Besides the Apples of Eden, the First Civilization created many more Pieces of Eden. Some of these affected humanity in similar ways, whilst others affected nature and even time itself. The first, second, third, fourth and fifth Apples' were all capable of controlling the minds of men, creating illusions and, to a degree, permited physical control over said minds[3]; the Apples could all be used in conjunction with the Staff of Eden, which increased the abilities of both Pieces[2]. "

From: http://assassinscreed.wikia.co...irmed_Pieces_of_Eden (http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Piece_of_Eden#Confirmed_Pieces_of_Eden)

So there are 50 pieces, where 2 have been destroyed:

"The other two that made up the last of the 50 pieces, one of the Apples and the Staff, were destroyed in the DIA Satellite Incident and the Tunguska blast respectively[3]."

So there is the Denver International Airport incident.

AcrobatEx
12-16-2010, 07:58 PM
SAWEET. Thanks Nutella0Mutt. It's awesome to see other people who are willing to go the extra mile to be a nerd! Haha keep gaming!

Nutella0Mutt
12-16-2010, 08:12 PM
Originally posted by AcrobatEx:
SAWEET. Thanks Nutella0Mutt. It's awesome to see other people who are willing to go the extra mile to be a nerd! Haha keep gaming!

: ) You're welcome. We all need to work together to solve these strange questions. Thanks for your analysis. Maybe we'll randomly meet in Brotherhood lol. Game on.

hero-toxiko
12-17-2010, 06:18 AM
Originally posted by EoT.Patton:
This is for those who have beaten the game.

<span class="ev_code_RED">*SPOILER*</span> !!!!!!!!!

May I say .. WTF!? Can anyone explain the ending to me? I was trying to listen to what the Goddess was saying while I was hopping around on "Tron-Like" platforms, but I didn't catch much, however, it seemed like she had an angry tone. Saying stuff like "You have 5 senses, we have 6. We kept one from you; Knowledge" .. or whatever.

Then, forcing Desmond to kill Lucy, and the Goddess says "It's done. She is lost" or whatever.

I am so confused! After spending literally like 15 hours today playing this game, the ending has disappointed me and left me wanting answers.

I don't see how another Assassin's Creed could come out, because, it seems it's all over. I know they will be releasing DLC, but, while I haven't searched, have they said for any DLC to add-on to the ending? Now that Desmond has the Apple, I don't understand what that means for mankind. O_o

On another note, while Desmond and Lucy were getting into the old underground area with the statues of Altair and the others, Desmond said "Ezio came back when he was much older. Why did he come back?"

Well? Why did he come back?! I was expecting all of this to be answered at the end. Yeah, he left the 1419, 1420, 1421 with the image but, why was he in the statue area?

And one more thing. While you're jumping around, pulling levers in that church, and even when you get in and see the Apple, Desmond see's Ezio doing so. However, when you were Ezio, you went to, I believe the place in AC2, and put the Apple back and locked it away. SOOOO, Why would Ezio go and take the Apple back?.. Then, how did it return back there again?

Sheesh!

Anyone else have anywhere near as many of these thoughts going through their head as I do? I suspect if you play an hour a day for a few weeks or whatever to beat the game, you may miss some of this, but when your entire day is just Assassin's Creed .. it's the only thing on your mind. ROFLMAO
ok heres the cut and dry.
number 16 is still alive but far too insane to help.
desmond is not a clone his tattoos prove otherwise.
the person speaking to Desmond just sounded like an older Desmond and he called himself
subject 17 as if he thought Desmond knew already,
just like minerva's warning desmond through ezio somehow desmond was able to go back and warn himself.
minerva is gone so ts not her issue.
the truth was referring to how juno might have actually been lucy the entire time as her email name was juno.
like the other game there might be dlc but a long way down the line for now enjoy the epic multilayer.

hero-toxiko
12-17-2010, 06:23 AM
Originally posted by hero-toxiko:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by EoT.Patton:
This is for those who have beaten the game.

<span class="ev_code_RED">*SPOILER*</span> !!!!!!!!!

May I say .. WTF!? Can anyone explain the ending to me? I was trying to listen to what the Goddess was saying while I was hopping around on "Tron-Like" platforms, but I didn't catch much, however, it seemed like she had an angry tone. Saying stuff like "You have 5 senses, we have 6. We kept one from you; Knowledge" .. or whatever.

Then, forcing Desmond to kill Lucy, and the Goddess says "It's done. She is lost" or whatever.

I am so confused! After spending literally like 15 hours today playing this game, the ending has disappointed me and left me wanting answers.

I don't see how another Assassin's Creed could come out, because, it seems it's all over. I know they will be releasing DLC, but, while I haven't searched, have they said for any DLC to add-on to the ending? Now that Desmond has the Apple, I don't understand what that means for mankind. O_o

On another note, while Desmond and Lucy were getting into the old underground area with the statues of Altair and the others, Desmond said "Ezio came back when he was much older. Why did he come back?"

Well? Why did he come back?! I was expecting all of this to be answered at the end. Yeah, he left the 1419, 1420, 1421 with the image but, why was he in the statue area?

And one more thing. While you're jumping around, pulling levers in that church, and even when you get in and see the Apple, Desmond see's Ezio doing so. However, when you were Ezio, you went to, I believe the place in AC2, and put the Apple back and locked it away. SOOOO, Why would Ezio go and take the Apple back?.. Then, how did it return back there again?

Sheesh!

Anyone else have anywhere near as many of these thoughts going through their head as I do? I suspect if you play an hour a day for a few weeks or whatever to beat the game, you may miss some of this, but when your entire day is just Assassin's Creed .. it's the only thing on your mind. ROFLMAO
ok heres the cut and dry.
in ac2 ezio didn't leave the apple in the tomb minervas energy thing powered it up and it was given back to him.
he then escaped and lost the papal staff to the traps in the vault.

De4th18
12-19-2010, 04:35 PM
Does anyone think that when subject 16 refers to the sun/son, that it could be saying that YOUR SON will be the end to mankind? And that the goddess was trying to prevent that by killing off Lucy? I'm not quite sure how they would work that... But it seems a possibility.

De4th18
12-19-2010, 04:38 PM
Or hell, maybe subject 16 is Desmond's son? Would explain how they can share the same memory. Or subject 16 is his father. Seems more likely that it would be his father over his son, due to the fact that 16 comes before 17. lol

De4th18
12-19-2010, 04:40 PM
Just tossing around thoughts here.

Maybe Desmond is reliving his father's memories?

Nutella0Mutt
12-19-2010, 07:13 PM
Originally posted by De4th18:
Just tossing around thoughts here.

Maybe Desmond is reliving his father's memories?

bleh! No triple posting, jut edit your message.

I hope we don't get any Inceptions-style memories. Memory within a memory... endless...

Agentbarto
12-19-2010, 10:17 PM
Okay so I'm waaaay too lazy to read through the footsteps theories (in case this is a repost of some sort) but I think I have a very simple explanation that takes the blame off Lucy (Thank god)

The Footsteps

Right so I was playing through the game for a third time and I noticed that during the Villa attack after you are wounded and Mario's been killed you have to escape and rescue Claudia from the soldier. How did these soldiers get up there? Well you can actually see them storming up the very same path the footsteps are found to lead in the present (2012). This is the easiest explanation for the footprints. Again the reason they can be found in the present may be because they help to foreshadow the discovery of the traitorous thief since he did get into Mario's study and most likely took the same path back out given that the other corridors and the main hall may have been damaged by that point, thus making the quickest route impassable and prompting the thief to take a detour. Also given that he was a traitor he probably rallied the soldiers just outside Mario's study down to the cave entrance rediscovered by Desmond years later.

At the very least the footsteps help to indicate that the bleeding effect is causing greater synchronization and soon Desmond may be able to have an ability similar to clairvoyance which would allow him to know exactly where to go, what to do, and what happened. He'll be like a tracker hunting game except he'd be trying to piece the clues together to understand what happened. Shaun's historical analysis may take a backseat when researching events connected to Desmond's ancestral lineage.

De4th18
12-20-2010, 09:52 AM
Originally posted by Nutella0Mutt:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by De4th18:
Just tossing around thoughts here.

Maybe Desmond is reliving his father's memories?

bleh! No triple posting, jut edit your message.

I hope we don't get any Inceptions-style memories. Memory within a memory... endless... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry.. Didn't think to edit my message.

De4th18
12-20-2010, 09:55 AM
Originally posted by Agentbarto:
Okay so I'm waaaay too lazy to read through the footsteps theories (in case this is a repost of some sort) but I think I have a very simple explanation that takes the blame off Lucy (Thank god)

The Footsteps

Right so I was playing through the game for a third time and I noticed that during the Villa attack after you are wounded and Mario's been killed you have to escape and rescue Claudia from the soldier. How did these soldiers get up there? Well you can actually see them storming up the very same path the footsteps are found to lead in the present (2012). This is the easiest explanation for the footprints. Again the reason they can be found in the present may be because they help to foreshadow the discovery of the traitorous thief since he did get into Mario's study and most likely took the same path back out given that the other corridors and the main hall may have been damaged by that point, thus making the quickest route impassable and prompting the thief to take a detour. Also given that he was a traitor he probably rallied the soldiers just outside Mario's study down to the cave entrance rediscovered by Desmond years later.

At the very least the footsteps help to indicate that the bleeding effect is causing greater synchronization and soon Desmond may be able to have an ability similar to clairvoyance which would allow him to know exactly where to go, what to do, and what happened. He'll be like a tracker hunting game except he'd be trying to piece the clues together to understand what happened. Shaun's historical analysis may take a backseat when researching events connected to Desmond's ancestral lineage.

I think we all may be looking too deep into the footsteps.I think it may just be showing you where to go to get back to the hide-out. Or it could be deeper. But some people believe it is blood, and I have to say I disagree. I've never seen blood light up red in the game before, when in eagle vision.

Nutella0Mutt
12-20-2010, 12:04 PM
Originally posted by De4th18:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Agentbarto:
Okay so I'm waaaay too lazy to read through the footsteps theories (in case this is a repost of some sort) but I think I have a very simple explanation that takes the blame off Lucy (Thank god)

The Footsteps

Right so I was playing through the game for a third time and I noticed that during the Villa attack after you are wounded and Mario's been killed you have to escape and rescue Claudia from the soldier. How did these soldiers get up there? Well you can actually see them storming up the very same path the footsteps are found to lead in the present (2012). This is the easiest explanation for the footprints. Again the reason they can be found in the present may be because they help to foreshadow the discovery of the traitorous thief since he did get into Mario's study and most likely took the same path back out given that the other corridors and the main hall may have been damaged by that point, thus making the quickest route impassable and prompting the thief to take a detour. Also given that he was a traitor he probably rallied the soldiers just outside Mario's study down to the cave entrance rediscovered by Desmond years later.

At the very least the footsteps help to indicate that the bleeding effect is causing greater synchronization and soon Desmond may be able to have an ability similar to clairvoyance which would allow him to know exactly where to go, what to do, and what happened. He'll be like a tracker hunting game except he'd be trying to piece the clues together to understand what happened. Shaun's historical analysis may take a backseat when researching events connected to Desmond's ancestral lineage.

I think we all may be looking too deep into the footsteps.I think it may just be showing you where to go to get back to the hide-out. Or it could be deeper. But some people believe it is blood, and I have to say I disagree. I've never seen blood light up red in the game before, when in eagle vision. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes you have. We all have. Subject 16's symbols were made in blood, and Abstergo washed them off before putting Subject 17 in. But Eagle Vision allows Desmond to see them as if they were fresh.

Thats why we think they may be more significant than just normal footprints.

De4th18
12-20-2010, 01:20 PM
Originally posted by Nutella0Mutt:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by De4th18:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Agentbarto:
Okay so I'm waaaay too lazy to read through the footsteps theories (in case this is a repost of some sort) but I think I have a very simple explanation that takes the blame off Lucy (Thank god)

The Footsteps

Right so I was playing through the game for a third time and I noticed that during the Villa attack after you are wounded and Mario's been killed you have to escape and rescue Claudia from the soldier. How did these soldiers get up there? Well you can actually see them storming up the very same path the footsteps are found to lead in the present (2012). This is the easiest explanation for the footprints. Again the reason they can be found in the present may be because they help to foreshadow the discovery of the traitorous thief since he did get into Mario's study and most likely took the same path back out given that the other corridors and the main hall may have been damaged by that point, thus making the quickest route impassable and prompting the thief to take a detour. Also given that he was a traitor he probably rallied the soldiers just outside Mario's study down to the cave entrance rediscovered by Desmond years later.

At the very least the footsteps help to indicate that the bleeding effect is causing greater synchronization and soon Desmond may be able to have an ability similar to clairvoyance which would allow him to know exactly where to go, what to do, and what happened. He'll be like a tracker hunting game except he'd be trying to piece the clues together to understand what happened. Shaun's historical analysis may take a backseat when researching events connected to Desmond's ancestral lineage.

I think we all may be looking too deep into the footsteps.I think it may just be showing you where to go to get back to the hide-out. Or it could be deeper. But some people believe it is blood, and I have to say I disagree. I've never seen blood light up red in the game before, when in eagle vision. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes you have. We all have. Subject 16's symbols were made in blood, and Abstergo washed them off before putting Subject 17 in. But Eagle Vision allows Desmond to see them as if they were fresh.

Thats why we think they may be more significant than just normal footprints. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh, forgot about the glyphs that Subject 16 put all over the place in blood. I've been trying to figure out what exactly the footsteps are there for, but haven't been able to yet. But, I do think, at the very least, it was put in to guide the player back to the hide-out for if they lost their way around. Since there is no map when you play as Desmond.

Janoian
12-20-2010, 04:02 PM
**SPOILERS** Well.. kinda.. it's the first Sequence but a spoiler is a spoiler I guess.

About the 'footsteps' in ACB, in the first sequence when you get back to the Villa, your city gets attacked and you have to stall time to get all the citizens out through the secret entrance (Behind Altair's statue). When MARIO gets shot by Cesare, EZIO gets shot as well, you get found by a few mercenaries and they drag you to the Assassin logo statue. You fight some baddies yadda yadda yadda THEN you walk up the stairs to save Claudia and to escape the attack. Could it be Ezio's blood loss from the shot wound? You have to follow Claudia to the backside of the villa, she walks the right side and not left..

superbalex
12-20-2010, 04:53 PM
Originally posted by Janoian:
**SPOILERS** Well.. kinda.. it's the first Sequence but a spoiler is a spoiler I guess.

About the 'footsteps' in ACB, in the first sequence when you get back to the Villa, your city gets attacked and you have to stall time to get all the citizens out through the secret entrance (Behind Altair's statue). When MARIO gets shot by Cesare, EZIO gets shot as well, you get found by a few mercenaries and they drag you to the Assassin logo statue. You fight some baddies yadda yadda yadda THEN you walk up the stairs to save Claudia and to escape the attack. Could it be Ezio's blood loss from the shot wound? You have to follow Claudia to the backside of the villa, she walks the right side and not left..

i think your on to something if you look at what Nutella0Mutt said about the blood being washed off, but clearly visible in the future by using eagle vision.. it could all hang together.

De4th18
12-20-2010, 09:58 PM
Originally posted by Janoian:
**SPOILERS** Well.. kinda.. it's the first Sequence but a spoiler is a spoiler I guess.

About the 'footsteps' in ACB, in the first sequence when you get back to the Villa, your city gets attacked and you have to stall time to get all the citizens out through the secret entrance (Behind Altair's statue). When MARIO gets shot by Cesare, EZIO gets shot as well, you get found by a few mercenaries and they drag you to the Assassin logo statue. You fight some baddies yadda yadda yadda THEN you walk up the stairs to save Claudia and to escape the attack. Could it be Ezio's blood loss from the shot wound? You have to follow Claudia to the backside of the villa, she walks the right side and not left..

This could be the reasoning for the footsteps to be there. The devs like to put a reason behind everything, even a trail showing you where to go when you need to get back to the hide-out.

cozza248
12-21-2010, 03:35 AM
Subject 16 sayd "you can find me in the shadows" that means he probebly put himself into the animus as a file or something!?!?!?!?!? but maybe lucy was killed so that Desmond and Eve could reunite and have a baby "the sun" that would end the world

Janoian
12-21-2010, 07:46 AM
Originally posted by De4th18:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Janoian:
**SPOILERS** Well.. kinda.. it's the first Sequence but a spoiler is a spoiler I guess.

About the 'footsteps' in ACB, in the first sequence when you get back to the Villa, your city gets attacked and you have to stall time to get all the citizens out through the secret entrance (Behind Altair's statue). When MARIO gets shot by Cesare, EZIO gets shot as well, you get found by a few mercenaries and they drag you to the Assassin logo statue. You fight some baddies yadda yadda yadda THEN you walk up the stairs to save Claudia and to escape the attack. Could it be Ezio's blood loss from the shot wound? You have to follow Claudia to the backside of the villa, she walks the right side and not left..

This could be the reasoning for the footsteps to be there. The devs like to put a reason behind everything, even a trail showing you where to go when you need to get back to the hide-out. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The 'showing you where to go' theory just seems silly, I mean the devs know that we will question EVERYTHING in this game I don't think they would make bloody footsteps just so newbies know the way back to the Villa.. they should have made the footsteps all around the town if they wanted to show newbies the way back. Even if you go past the 10 minute mark, you automatically move back to the hide-out.

Think about it, if newbies couldn't even find the way back to the villa, what makes you think they can use eagle vision?

De4th18
12-21-2010, 09:13 AM
Originally posted by Janoian:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by De4th18:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Janoian:
**SPOILERS** Well.. kinda.. it's the first Sequence but a spoiler is a spoiler I guess.

About the 'footsteps' in ACB, in the first sequence when you get back to the Villa, your city gets attacked and you have to stall time to get all the citizens out through the secret entrance (Behind Altair's statue). When MARIO gets shot by Cesare, EZIO gets shot as well, you get found by a few mercenaries and they drag you to the Assassin logo statue. You fight some baddies yadda yadda yadda THEN you walk up the stairs to save Claudia and to escape the attack. Could it be Ezio's blood loss from the shot wound? You have to follow Claudia to the backside of the villa, she walks the right side and not left..

This could be the reasoning for the footsteps to be there. The devs like to put a reason behind everything, even a trail showing you where to go when you need to get back to the hide-out. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The 'showing you where to go' theory just seems silly, I mean the devs know that we will question EVERYTHING in this game I don't think they would make bloody footsteps just so newbies know the way back to the Villa.. they should have made the footsteps all around the town if they wanted to show newbies the way back. Even if you go past the 10 minute mark, you automatically move back to the hide-out.

Think about it, if newbies couldn't even find the way back to the villa, what makes you think they can use eagle vision? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, the footsteps don't appear to lead anywhere. I was thinking that it would just be for newbies to find their way back.

But, like I said. They /appear/ to lead nowhere. Or, if you look closely, they could be going into the drain under the assassin's symbol. But the kidnapping theory seems a little off. Most vans I know couldn't go up the stairs fast enough at either angle to kidnap someone without them being able to run, and there's also too many footprints to say that.

Like people have said, it could just be washed up blood. But, you wouldn't think Ezio bled that much to get back to the sanctuary in order to escape the villa attack. He would have died if he lost that much blood.

It's something having to do with the Templars probably. (If not the bloodloss due to the wounds.)

Janoian
12-21-2010, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by De4th18:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Janoian:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by De4th18:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Janoian:
**SPOILERS** Well.. kinda.. it's the first Sequence but a spoiler is a spoiler I guess.

About the 'footsteps' in ACB, in the first sequence when you get back to the Villa, your city gets attacked and you have to stall time to get all the citizens out through the secret entrance (Behind Altair's statue). When MARIO gets shot by Cesare, EZIO gets shot as well, you get found by a few mercenaries and they drag you to the Assassin logo statue. You fight some baddies yadda yadda yadda THEN you walk up the stairs to save Claudia and to escape the attack. Could it be Ezio's blood loss from the shot wound? You have to follow Claudia to the backside of the villa, she walks the right side and not left..

This could be the reasoning for the footsteps to be there. The devs like to put a reason behind everything, even a trail showing you where to go when you need to get back to the hide-out. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The 'showing you where to go' theory just seems silly, I mean the devs know that we will question EVERYTHING in this game I don't think they would make bloody footsteps just so newbies know the way back to the Villa.. they should have made the footsteps all around the town if they wanted to show newbies the way back. Even if you go past the 10 minute mark, you automatically move back to the hide-out.

Think about it, if newbies couldn't even find the way back to the villa, what makes you think they can use eagle vision? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, the footsteps don't appear to lead anywhere. I was thinking that it would just be for newbies to find their way back.

But, like I said. They /appear/ to lead nowhere. Or, if you look closely, they could be going into the drain under the assassin's symbol. But the kidnapping theory seems a little off. Most vans I know couldn't go up the stairs fast enough at either angle to kidnap someone without them being able to run, and there's also too many footprints to say that.

Like people have said, it could just be washed up blood. But, you wouldn't think Ezio bled that much to get back to the sanctuary in order to escape the villa attack. He would have died if he lost that much blood.

It's something having to do with the Templars probably. (If not the bloodloss due to the wounds.) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hmm what also could be possible is that it's not bloody footsteps at all, just footsteps

Yeah i know this goes against my theory but this is assassins creed! nothing is true (everything is permitted)

De4th18
12-21-2010, 10:04 AM
Indeed.

Nutella0Mutt
12-21-2010, 12:36 PM
Originally posted by Janoian:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by De4th18:

Well, the footsteps don't appear to lead anywhere. I was thinking that it would just be for newbies to find their way back.

But, like I said. They /appear/ to lead nowhere. Or, if you look closely, they could be going into the drain under the assassin's symbol. But the kidnapping theory seems a little off. Most vans I know couldn't go up the stairs fast enough at either angle to kidnap someone without them being able to run, and there's also too many footprints to say that.

Like people have said, it could just be washed up blood. But, you wouldn't think Ezio bled that much to get back to the sanctuary in order to escape the villa attack. He would have died if he lost that much blood.

It's something having to do with the Templars probably. (If not the bloodloss due to the wounds.)

Hmm what also could be possible is that it's not bloody footsteps at all, just footsteps

Yeah i know this goes against my theory but this is assassins creed! nothing is true (everything is permitted) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The theory about Ezio's blood loss does seem plausible, but remember that he was on top of the roof, then fell, then was dragged to the fountain. He would probably lose the most blood falling off the roof. That was a hard fall.

I also remember Ubisoft sending out a survey asking people what additions they would want to the game, and one option was an advanced Eagle Vision. One that could PREDICT future events, like the paths guards would take on patrol, the path the target would take, etc.

So maybe for some weird reason we are seeing a future path someone will take?

It's possible.

I still think it's related to Subject 16.
Maybe he managed to escape Abstergo either physically of digitally via anibus, and got to the villa. He might be bloody because he has a hard time keeping his form together, like in the cluster sequence. It might be "digital" information (16's version of blood) that's trailing. And he would follow the team into the sanctuary and implant itself inside Rebecca's anibus.

NO IDEA but it's fun to guess. Nothing better to do on a rainy day. : )

Janoian
12-21-2010, 01:44 PM
I just thought of this, it could be EZIO! When Desmond sees his come back to the villa in Sequence 1!

Desmond: ''(Ghost) Ezio came back to the Villa .. but why?''

De4th18
12-21-2010, 02:33 PM
Originally posted by Janoian:
I just thought of this, it could be EZIO! When he came back to the villa in Sequence 1!

Desmond: ''Ezio came back to the Villa .. but why?''

You sir, are a genius! But, he's not a templar... Why would it show up red? I think they may change him to a templar in the long run or something, if it is indeed his footsteps.

Janoian
12-21-2010, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by De4th18:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Janoian:
I just thought of this, it could be EZIO! When he came back to the villa in Sequence 1!

Desmond: ''Ezio came back to the Villa .. but why?''

You sir, are a genius! But, he's not a templar... Why would it show up red? I think they may change him to a templar in the long run or something, if it is indeed his footsteps. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well.. damn! In that case we can guess all we want but i don't think there are any hints in the game linking to someone xD

De4th18
12-21-2010, 02:54 PM
Originally posted by Janoian:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by De4th18:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Janoian:
I just thought of this, it could be EZIO! When he came back to the villa in Sequence 1!

Desmond: ''Ezio came back to the Villa .. but why?''

You sir, are a genius! But, he's not a templar... Why would it show up red? I think they may change him to a templar in the long run or something, if it is indeed his footsteps. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well.. damn! In that case we can guess all we want but i don't think there are any hints in the game linking to someone xD </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah, I think we are screwed until the next game comes out, as far as the footstep theorizing goes.

Choco-breeder
12-22-2010, 11:29 PM
In regards to the footsteps,

*SPOILER*

In the first sequence, there was a bald guy with an eye patch that followed Ezio and he was amazed he was alive. He said something along the lines of going back to help the others. Towards the end of the game when you save Pietro, you see the same guy and find out he was the traitor. The footsteps could've been his as he went outside the villa in that direction and possibly into the drain.

That's what I think anyway.

cosminbaila
12-23-2010, 05:01 AM
There a lot of theories i like here but none of them are relating to the first game.Did anyone solved the puzzle at the end of the first AC.Also this game follows only a descendacy theory.Vidic is a descendent of Al Mualin the leader of assassins in AC1.Also i backup the theory of desmond beeing a descendent of Adam and Lucy a descendant of Eve.The theory of desmonds son does not have any reference and is not related to the other games.Remember that at somepoint Altair made love with Maria which was a templar.The halucination that desmond has it when he gets stuc with Maria in the tower.And from what i recall in all assassins creed games the main hero gets stab.I think that stabbing him is a ritual o pass o some sort or a ritual of beggining.Lucy is clearly not dead but only stabed maybe will get more answers in future games.

umairnadeem
12-23-2010, 01:26 PM
stabbing

to everyone asking to what juno's words meant, here are my cents on it. when juno says the cross darkens the horizon she says this exactly: There is one who would accompany you through the gate. She lies not within our sight. The cross darkens the horizon.

she is saying that there is one girl who will accompany you through the gate, and Juno and the other gods don't know where she is, because the templars are hiding it from them.

she really doesnt mention lucy being a templar... im sure that lucy isn't 'hiding' the girl from desmond by any way .. it doesnt make sense.

umairnadeem
12-23-2010, 05:58 PM
btw.. just to let everyone know...

in the first assassins creed there was this writing saying "YONA GUNI" on the floor.. this is a place where it is believed that a very advanced civilization used to live before. obviously, it relates very well to minerva and all these beings.. they are from yona guni probably or something like that.. maybe a temple is there?? and maybe we have to visit that temple in AC3?

edit: oh and many people are saying that the gods want desmond to have a son with eve (or a descendant).. this is actually impossible because as we all know, lucy mentioned that 72 days were remaining until the satellite launch and presumably the end of the world or something (october 10 + 72 days = 21 dec 2012) .. and it takes 9 months for a baby to be born.. so we can safely discard the theory about desmond needing to have a baby with someone.

tpont201
12-24-2010, 01:45 AM
There are some serious problems with the "Lucy is a Templar" theories. First, Desmond has Eagle Vision, and in the final sequence you can see that Lucy glows blue. If she was a Templar spy, then she would have glowed red under Eagle Vision. But, it is interesting that she disappears for a little while in the story. It could be that the Templars secretly captured and bugged her without her knowing, or that they have a tracking system installed on all employees. And since both Altair and Ezio have survived stabbing, there's no reason that Lucy couldn't have.

On to the mysterious voices at the end of the game...
I have suspicions that these voices are the head assassins who would have come to check on the team after receiving no word. And the fact that they say "back in the Animus" does not neccesarily mean that the whole game so far was a flashback. The head assassins would know how much time Desmond has spent in the Animus, and since they knew he was in there before its not a stretch for them to say put him back in it.

Another interesting thing is that the contact in the email's signs his name William M. Could it be that his name is William Miles, and he is Desmond's father that was mentioned in the first game?

Millhouse3rd
12-24-2010, 08:02 AM
The red footprints are the path Ezio took back into the Villa after he was shot by Cesare's soldiers during the invasion and siege of Monterigionni.

HonoraryPanic
12-24-2010, 02:23 PM
desmonds son is the start of the catalysm? 16 says that she can not be trusted by think mjcould be minerva since she wants ressurection and desmond is the key to it then the sun the start has a double meaning.i think desmond is slowly finding out minerva is a selfish ***** that wants her people to come back and to do so needs desmond to have a son who will be an alien full blood and desmonds son will cause the destruction of humanity????

HonoraryPanic
12-24-2010, 02:27 PM
or project 16 is desmonds son? helping him out. though theres no mention of that. plus remember the triangle full of signs on AC 1? im pretty sure those two symbols are in there too. and probably seprately on the collum and floor too i think. i cant wait for the next one. if they cliffhang me again i will start an assasin organization myself and take out ubisoft lol

Nutella0Mutt
12-24-2010, 03:33 PM
Originally posted by HonoraryPanic:
or project 16 is desmonds son? helping him out. though theres no mention of that. plus remember the triangle full of signs on AC 1? im pretty sure those two symbols are in there too. and probably seprately on the collum and floor too i think. i cant wait for the next one. if they cliffhang me again i will start an assasin organization myself and take out ubisoft lol


Please don't, I want them to keep making epic games!

fatmanjosh13rr
12-24-2010, 03:55 PM
i think the story about desmong being a reincarnation of adam and lucy of eve makes complete sence. i mean in the truth video at the end of AC2 the voices of adam and eve are similar to that of lucy and desmond. yeah lucy gats stabbed and probabl died, but subject 16 mentioned in the video at the end of ACB that you must fibd eve in the garden of eden and the key is her DNA. well what if when lucy died she went to the garden of eden ( i mean i aint religous or nothing) but what if desmond has to find her and have sex with her to save humanity. and the thing about subject 16 being his son, that makes complete sence aswell.

fatmanjosh13rr
12-24-2010, 03:56 PM
i think the story about desmond being a reincarnation of adam and lucy of eve makes complete sence. i mean in the truth video at the end of AC2 the voices of adam and eve are similar to that of lucy and desmond. yeah lucy gets stabbed and probably died, but subject 16 mentioned in the video at the end of ACB that you must find eve in the garden of eden and the key is her DNA. well what if when lucy died she went to the garden of eden ( i mean i aint religous or nothing) but what if desmond has to find her and have sex with her to save humanity. and the thing about subject 16 being his son, that makes complete sence as well.

fatmanjosh13rr
12-24-2010, 04:00 PM
ucy mentioned that 72 days were remaining until the satellite launch and presumably the end of the world or something (october 10 + 72 days = 21 dec 2012) .. and it takes 9 months for a baby to be born.. so we can safely discard the theory about desmond needing to have a baby with someone.

They could of had sex before???????

fatmanjosh13rr
12-25-2010, 02:39 AM
Bugattiboy91
P.S. Where the hell did 72 come from? I thought 42 was key to the universe and all that weird a-ss sh1t.


october 10 + 72 days = 21 dec 2012
this is when templars launch satellite and supposed doomsday

hermanhenning
12-26-2010, 08:59 PM
Well i'd like to post something aswell after reading all off your posts.
Someone mentioned the shroud, that can bring people back to life and so on. Someone also wrote that the shroud could possibly be hidden in the "well/fountain" in Monteriggioni.
The red "footsteps" that you can see outside the villa with your eaglevision leads to a big fountain with an assassins symbol on it.

Could it be that they want to tell us about the well/fountain?

Also notice that one of the songs in the end credits is from a movie called "The Fountain"
And what is the fountain about? Adam and Eve and EDEN.

Could this be a coincidence?

Also what struck me was how similar this story is tho the annunaki conspiracy theory. Maybe we can find answers that way?

J0sephM
12-27-2010, 04:20 AM
After a bit of thinking and listening to to the "she's not who she says she is" in "The Truth"

The obvious answer he is talking about Lucy. Well I'm starting to think that it could be referring to the god. I may of heard something like "we should of just left you alone", could she be the corrupt person ?


Replying to the quote from the game "there is someone who will enter with you and she is not in your view"~ ( I had to paraphrase if someone has the direct quote ). I believe this means that someone ( a she ) will be introduced into AC3 and she will 'enter' with Desmond.

As to Lucy living in AC3 it could be possible. The main reason she would remain ( if my theory is correct ) is because she has been in the last three installments.

Maybe she lives for the first few sequences and then her vitals start to drop and Desmond is flung out of the Animus standing beside her as she dies with her final words being " "Desmond..." leaving yet another statement to further progress the story.

I am fairly certain that the gods' intention is not for the 'wise cracking brit' and the 'techy' girl as the god says that he must go alone while he is struggling not to kill Lucy.

To further back up my 'LUCY IS DEAD THEORY' when you complete the game ( on PS3 ) you get a trophy that says something along the lines of "A Dagger Through The Heart" and I have not heard of someone living after that...

Millhouse3rd
12-27-2010, 02:39 PM
Originally posted by J0sephM:

To further back up my 'LUCY IS DEAD THEORY' when you complete the game ( on PS3 ) you get a trophy that says something along the lines of "A Dagger Through The Heart" and I have not heard of someone living after that...

Yeah, but it's not a dagger that hits her (it's the hidden blade), neither is her heart stabbed by the hidden blade. She gets poked in the intestines and that "A Dagger Through The Heart" is a metaphor for the desolation that Desmond feels when he stabs her with the blade.

Agentbarto
12-30-2010, 03:31 PM
The Footprints

In further support of my "increased synchronization" hypothesis I wish to point out that there was a poll released by Ubisoft that basically asked what aspects we, the consumers, would like to see improved. One of the aspects indicated was "Enhanced Eagle Vision" that would allow the player to see paths of enemy patrol routes among other uses. Maybe the steps were a "step" in that direction (forgive the pun). It seems possible that Desmond is simply improving his own vision's ability to perceive the truth.

Survey link (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/12/05/survey-gauges-interest-in-potential-future-assassins-creed-feat/)

gothpunkboy89
12-30-2010, 05:49 PM
i think i'm understanding why lucy was stabbed and why Desmond was forced to do it. Juno or who ever it was mentioned that he had to do what he has to do with Eve. The assassin blood line is a decedent from Adam and Eve. their decedents get the Eagle vision. since they are possibly the first and only human/TCB cross. and while Lucy is an assassin by choice she lacks Eagle vision so she isn't an assassin by birth. because of that she can't be the Eve to Desmond Adam.

And you can tell that those to are developing a relationship together. slowly i'll grant you but a relationship. Which can not be because at Desmond's side has to be a decedent of Eve which sadly isn't lucy. and what is the best and most permanent way to cut all connections to someone. have them killed.

chris.l.byram
12-30-2010, 09:26 PM
I believe when you see subject 16 talk about not trust worthyness he never mentions who so this is a thought, he is talking about the godess/alien she sounds very angry and mad when your jumping on the blue platforms and mad you could get the 6th sense knowledge.

Also i would love the new game to be set like in te Americn revolution and decloratin of independence because there is a lot of conspiracy and lies witch could be in there, It would also be like the Movie The National Treasure starring nicholas cage

Also the subject 16 talks about a "SUN" then says "SON" again but the son of offspring so it might be Desmond son in the Animus playing as Desmond and Ezio witch is shed loads of pressure and tention on one person so when you hear the end voices it could easily be to new assassins frieds or partners of Desmonds Son.

Also The Godess thought Lucy could cause a threat and help Desmond save the world and the Godess didnt want that so she controlled him to kill Lucy. And if you seen the video when adam and eve are escaping it looks like there agile and could be the first "Assassin" Figrues and Ezio and Desmond are direst desendants from them so The goddess uses desmond to find the apple threw Ezo and himself


Reply I want to hear you theories abuout it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Posted Thu December 30 2010 20:27 Hide Post

wickedlycool2
12-30-2010, 09:34 PM
Ok,
We know about some things...
The line at the end of the credits or whatever.
Could this mean they're using desmond's son on a animus and make him into a weapon?
As in the emails Lucy said they needed him to be in the animus although he was screaming in his sleep.
Did desmond see the future in his sleep?

Also New to AC website so, yeh I'm confused seeming i haven't finished the game yet. But nearly.

chris.l.byram
12-30-2010, 10:05 PM
Yer as i said It so could be talking about his son

Bambleozie
12-31-2010, 02:18 AM
I believe Lucy was or probably still is a Templar and that's why juno killed her. I also noticed she was missing for two entire memory sequences. However I noticed the red foot prints before that and just assumed that as I was seeing visions of Ezio that they were left over from the attack on the villa and belonged to Borgia troops. Now i think about it I think the footsteps belong to the one eye traitor. Also did anyone else noticed on lucy's desk there was a security pen like the ones they used back at abstergo? If that's true it would point to the fact that Lucy still is working with abstergo and a Templar. However when we used eagle vision back at abstergo [ac1] she was blue mea Ning she was good right. Any way as for the dialogue in the credits I also believe that they are talking about Desmond's son as the second voice does sound a lot like Desmond himself. Did anyone else think that? No clue who the other guy could be, maybe another assassin?
Any one else thinking the same?

TheSpectator
12-31-2010, 05:06 AM
Originally posted by chris.l.byram:
Yer as i said It so could be talking about his son
No.

lizardsrule7
12-31-2010, 05:57 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bambleozie:
i believe ezio was i terrorist coz he bombed the dead kittens http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif, Also hey Daniel xD

fatmanjosh13rr
01-02-2011, 12:32 PM
here's an idea, what if the gods (minerva, juno etc.) were templars and they made made desmond to stab lucy because she was the key. in subject 16 video he sais that eve, her dna is the key, find her in the garden of eden. maybe this eve is lucy and she's not dead.s16 also said she's not who you think she is. now the obvious person is lucy, but what if he was talking about the god. and about the voices during the credits, will someone please post something on that.

Lenown
01-02-2011, 01:21 PM
Originally posted by fatmanjosh13rr:
here's an idea, what if the gods (minerva, juno etc.) were templars and they made made desmond to stab lucy because she was the key. in subject 16 video he sais that eve, her dna is the key, find her in the garden of eden. maybe this eve is lucy and she's not dead.s16 also said she's not who you think she is. now the obvious person is lucy, but what if he was talking about the god. and about the voices during the credits, will someone please post something on that.

In the ending to the second one they explained that the "gods" was not templars.

In the truth video it show's adam and eve breaking out of the forge they was in because the "gods" had the apple of edan and was controling them. Adam and Eve stole the apple witch then broke the control over the people and they rebaled.

After a long war I say someone used the apple in a special way and it exploded nearly destorying the world (because if you beat brotherhood the apple explodes into yellow wave which could be called fire) so then the god's and humans started working together to rebuild the world.

But after time passes people get to independent and want their way so the templare's was borning. And since most of the god's are dead they can't help the assassin's in stopping the templar's so it's up to Desmond to save them because he is adam's decendent and he is a hybird templar and assassin.

And Desmond was probley falling in love with Lucy and to the god's that can't happen because they dont want the adam and eve blood line being broke up. So they have desmond stab lucy to get her out of the way.

Lenown
01-02-2011, 08:45 PM
My theroy is that you are playing a memory inside of a memory and it is after 2012 and your playing as desmond's son.

And the sun dont explode and kill earth. The apple when you use it explodes into a yellow bubble that if the apple has hidden power's it could explode and seem like a big yellow explosion that takes out the world.

But I think the templar's got the apple, sent it into space and took control of the world and desmond's son and a few other people that was immune to the control of it banded together and put him in a old animas to find out what the templar's did with the apple after they killed desmond.

And since the templar's ruled they thought they killed all the assassin's so they changed the way they lived to the older times before gun's, and that is the only way I can see the story working out without gun's or other realstic aspects of the present day being involved.

NIGHTRAIDER68
01-03-2011, 06:11 AM
I believe their will still be use of the animus but not in the traditional way... if you remember in AC2 when Desmond sees the ghosts and goes back to Altair, Shaun said he could return to his ancestors with out an animus however no one has been able to control it. So i believe you will master that skill, and that will be how they still make use of the animus but give it more of a free flow feeling because you could do it at any point.

gamer1012011
01-03-2011, 09:26 AM
wat if you have to find desmond has to find jupiter and a third apple of eden because in ac 2 minevare talks aout her juno and jupiter then desmond must find all three peices and assemble and them it will show him where to find eve

ChaosxNetwork
01-03-2011, 09:53 AM
Originally posted by Agentbarto:
The Footprints

In further support of my "increased synchronization" hypothesis I wish to point out that there was a poll released by Ubisoft that basically asked what aspects we, the consumers, would like to see improved. One of the aspects indicated was "Enhanced Eagle Vision" that would allow the player to see paths of enemy patrol routes among other uses. Maybe the steps were a "step" in that direction (forgive the pun). It seems possible that Desmond is simply improving his own vision's ability to perceive the truth.

Survey link (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/12/05/survey-gauges-interest-in-potential-future-assassins-creed-feat/)
I now that they are unsure weather the poll was put out by Ubisoft themselves but boy do I hope so, The Enhanced Eagle Vision sounds brilliant!, making unique bombs from special ingredient sweet!
But if I voted I still would have chosen the New Ancestor and Time Period, but that's just me.

ForteanJo
01-03-2011, 02:12 PM
Whilst we can all agree Desmond is a direct descendant of Adam, it's highly unlikely that Lucy is a descendant of Eve. Just too neat, tidy and convenient. Juno probably had Desmond stab Lucy to alienate Lucy, Shaun and Rebecca and ensure he sought Eve on his own (as Juno commanded).

Whether that means Lucy is dead doesn't really matter. Desmond will be largely on his own despite being re-inserted into the animus. It just means his new handlers will be more detached than Lucy and co.

FireTempest00
01-03-2011, 05:19 PM
Having Finished the game along with the Subject 16's truth video and what not and reading all the responses, I'll throw in my two cents.


The ending itself, there are 2 possibilities as to what happened next before being pushed back into the animus (and knowing the AC Team, everything they do is done with a purpose to the story, even the multiplayer segments). These are going to be long so TL;DR them if you want.

1) Desmond stabbing Lucy did happen, and the Apple knocks everyone out. The Templars/Assassin who find Desmond put him back into the Animus and replay the memory to see what exactly happened and when they reach the point were Desmond stabs Lucy he is kicked out of the animus in shock just like how when Desmond tried entering Altiar's Memory in AC or Ezio's memory far later then he should have.
Something thing that supports that is when Rebbecca explains to Desmond how Sequence 9 that was attempted to enter at the start of the game was repairing itself (because it seemed Ezio was recovering from some sort of trauma which is still visible when Ezio drops Cesare of the wall and when he drops the Apple under the Colosseum). This would explain how the voices about pushing Desmond back into the Animus and put him back into Ezio in an attempt to ease the shock. The fate of the Apple is unknown depending on who gets to them first.

TL;DR - Stabbing Happened, Templar/Assassins use Animus to see memory and trauma kicks Desmond out of memory and into shock.

2) Desmond is in the animus for some unknown reason, maybe captured after securing the Apple, and is desynchronized from the memory after stabbing Lucy, because it didn't happen. One thing that struck me was because Subject 16 tells him that it is later than he thinks and everything he holds dear is gone. This could mean that the entire events of AC:B (in terms with the present) was in a sense, a knocked-out/comatose/sedated Desmond reliving what he already did in the animus. For what purpose is unknown. But for a possible scenario, Desmond and the team could have been captured after having the Apple, but had already in anticipation handed off to another Assassin team or hid the Apple for later recovery by them or another team, and Abstergo could be viewing Desmond's memory to find out where it is but fail from the desynch.

Another branch off for the "Lucy not really stabbed" theory is the Apple itself. It has been known that the Apple creates hallucinations just as Altiar had with Al Mualim making it look like he stabbed him. So while Desmond thinks he killed Lucy and abandons everyone else he will later wind back up to a scenario similar to #1, but those checking out his memory will assume Lucy is dead. If a Abstergo captures him, Abstergo will believe Lucy Rebecca and Shaun will no longer be a concern for them, and Desmond will most likely lose the Apple to Abstergo for the Satelite.


TL;DR a) Desmond and co is captured and while in the animus he desynchs because stabbing Lucy was not part of the memory. Desynch is a subconcious/Subject 16/TWCB/POE defence mechanism to stop the viewer of the memory from finding the location of the Apple.

TL;DR b) Lucy stabbing was Apple illusion and everyone thinks Lucy is dead. Outcome depends on who captures Desmond afterwards. Abstergo capture will lead to loss of the Apple.

grr8whitehype
01-04-2011, 08:53 PM
I've read most pages and don't believe anyone mentioned Christina the girl Ezio loves from AC2 and has a couple off the main story flashback missions with in Brotherhood. I believe she is his Eve. Not sure what it all means but why have those missions? Just thought I would mention her.

Lenown
01-05-2011, 02:34 AM
Originally posted by grr8whitehype:
I've read most pages and don't believe anyone mentioned Christina the girl Ezio loves from AC2 and has a couple off the main story flashback missions with in Brotherhood. I believe she is his Eve. Not sure what it all means but why have those missions? Just thought I would mention her.

If you done her missions you would find out what happens to make that not even possable http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

And I guess they put that in there to give closure to her in the story line since the only time you saw the love of his life was the begining of AC2. Then after that never again till this game.

RedSpider
01-05-2011, 07:34 PM
It's 2:30am, I've just finished the game and I am MIFFED! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

grr8whitehype
01-05-2011, 08:56 PM
Originally posted by lenown:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by grr8whitehype:
I've read most pages and don't believe anyone mentioned Christina the girl Ezio loves from AC2 and has a couple off the main story flashback missions with in Brotherhood. I believe she is his Eve. Not sure what it all means but why have those missions? Just thought I would mention her.

If you done her missions you would find out what happens to make that not even possable http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

And I guess they put that in there to give closure to her in the story line since the only time you saw the love of his life was the begining of AC2. Then after that never again till this game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've done the missions. I don't remember seeing her die. He just does that stuff with his family and she helps.

Lenown
01-06-2011, 02:52 AM
Originally posted by grr8whitehype:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by lenown:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by grr8whitehype:
I've read most pages and don't believe anyone mentioned Christina the girl Ezio loves from AC2 and has a couple off the main story flashback missions with in Brotherhood. I believe she is his Eve. Not sure what it all means but why have those missions? Just thought I would mention her.

If you done her missions you would find out what happens to make that not even possable http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

And I guess they put that in there to give closure to her in the story line since the only time you saw the love of his life was the begining of AC2. Then after that never again till this game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've done the missions. I don't remember seeing her die. He just does that stuff with his family and she helps. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You might only get access to it after you beat the game, or complete so many other missions. But she ends up dieing in Ezio's arms.

I think there is 5-6 missions with her so beat the game and complete side missions and you might get it. I didn't get it untill I beat the game and completed almost all the side missions.

Synapse-Err0r
01-06-2011, 02:41 PM
hey there, this is my first post on here, but i felt like I had to add something, I'm not sure if it's been said yet, BUT, when desmond stabs lucy at the end, he appears to stab her in the stomach, which would kill her slowly and she could still recieve medical help, kinda counter productive, what if instead, he was actually stabbing her in some important reproductive organ so that desmond would have no choice but to fornicate with "eve" when he finds her. I know it's kinda far fetched, but that's what I thought pretty much instantly.

Eaglesong
01-08-2011, 06:43 AM
I think (as I'm sure a lot of you do) Desmond is a programme being played by his son (and therefore Desmond is an ancestor) which would mean the whole thing is an animus inside an animus. The whole God and apple thing is a programme designed by Templar agents holding said son to seek out something from the past. Just my hunchs - I'm probably a leap of faith afar from the truth. Also feeling Christina memories have got something to do with the Eve we have to find in the next game. Could it be her ancestor? Gargh! I can't wait to find out what happens, but on the plus side I can now emerge back into reality after being glued to the computer 24/7 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

RebeccaLH
01-08-2011, 12:16 PM
Talking about the ones who came before is it possible that there is good/evil like with the humans with assassins/templars.
As with the war with the humans mabye the ones who came before had a war. Perhaps over the apple, it wasnt said how they became extinct, mabye this?

IIwangcarsII
01-08-2011, 12:47 PM
Originally posted by RebeccaLH:
Talking about the ones who came before is it possible that there is good/evil like with the humans with assassins/templars.
As with the war with the humans mabye the ones who came before had a war. Perhaps over the apple, it wasnt said how they became extinct, mabye this?

I like your theory, this is what i have come to think aswell. There's definitely something up with Juno, i think she altered the PoE somehow, and we are yet to meet jupiter.

RebeccaLH
01-08-2011, 05:36 PM
Thankyou. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
Yeah the peice of eden must have been altered since desmond was made to kill lucy.
Jupiter , i know nothing about the god in mythology so i wouldnt be able to have a guess at the personality.

lodylody
01-09-2011, 06:46 AM
I have loads of theories but I'm just going to tell you a possible thing about AC3.

I think we'll meet Jupiter (via ancestor or Desmond)! We met Minerva, and she mentioned Juno and Jupiter - I think in that order. We met Juno at the end of this one, so I think in AC3 we'll see Jupiter.

WarpSpeed10
01-09-2011, 03:35 PM
Originally posted by MrT858:
Also more clues pointing to this are the red footseps going back and forward outside the villa; (when u play as desmond and go outside for the ten mins in eagle vision). Now based on the emails i read on the computer everyone has a surveillance duty to do including Lucy. They are also red meaning at least as far as it goes in the animus; enemy.

No, the blood you see in the present outside the Vila is Ezio's. If you remember, he was bleeding out from the gunshot wound all the way to the Vila.

Which brings up another point. If Desmond can see his ancestor's blood, maybe he can see 16's blood at the end of AC1 because they are related, which would explain why he and Desmond shared some of the same memories of Ezio.

mastesergeant
01-09-2011, 10:08 PM
Hear! Hear! So many questions. Will Lucy live? Who will we play as next? Will Desmond ever get a complex romantic subplot!?

knatte1
01-10-2011, 12:29 PM
i snap this up of some source http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

Assassin's Creed 1

Obviously thruout the game we learn the basics about the bleed effect whereby Desmond gains the skills of his ancestors. The longer he spends in the animus the more this is apparent until, as with other subjects, he becomes unable to mentally distinguish between the past and present. At the end of the game there's a section where you see a bunch of stuff written on the walls. It covers all major religions and much of it involves the afterlife / next life. There's also a bunch of stuff about the 21st of December 2012, the theoretical "date for the end of the world"

This writing, combined with the emails you pilfer from Abstergo's computers indicate that they are working hard to locate all the "pieces of Eden". I thinkthey intend to launch them all in satellites for some event that will occur on the 21st of Dec 2012. Some of the emails also talk about historic, unexplained events like the Tunguska Incident and the Philladelphia Experiment. They take both these and claim them to be the result of Templar/Assassin activities. The bottom line is that it looks like the templars have probably mastered a form of time travel (Philladelphia Exp email where they send the ship forward in time) and this is part of their plans.

The pieces of eden are forbidden artifacts of great power from the time humanity was created. Not sure what their power is supposed but it's safe to assume controlling mankind is a major power and the reason it's so heavily sought after by the templars.

Assassin's Creed 2

Way back before us humans were around there was a different race. They were far superior to us both technically and mentally and they created us using Eden. I'm not sure but I think theyalso controlled humans using Eden (this would also explain why the Templars want it). Subject 16's video shows two humans (assumed to be those who were later ideolised as Adam and Eve) stealing a piece of Eden. Assumedly the humans used this power to regain controland, since then, there were constant wars between the old race and humans. They were stronger but there were more humans so it was an even fight. They were so busy fighting that they didn't notice the sun getting brighter/hotter until it was too late andsortcatastrophe occured wiping out almost everyone. The old race tried to ensure the catastrophe wouldn't repeat itself by building teaching the humans but they weremisunderstood and what they taught turned into myth/legend/religion. There were some who wanted peace instead of war and they built temples/vaults. The "god" you meat at the end of AC2 tells you to find these temples quickly as they hold the key to saving the world and the Templars work against you in this goal

Assassin's Creed : Brotherhood

It's confirmed in the first sentence spoken when you touch the apple ofEden that you are in fact a mixed breed of the two races indicatedat the end of AC2.This explains why you have Eagle Vision and also explains why someone with your DNA is able to activate the apple(Eagle Vision is the "sixth sense" alluded to as you navigate your way through the temple). The voice then proceeds to tell you that you must make a journey with one other who is likeyou against "the cross" (however they cannot see where this other person is because the "cross" darkens their vision). In order to ensure your mind is open and you proceed forward in the right way they make you kill Lucy. I assumed this was because of a growing relationship between Desmond and her and toensure he didn't get too heavily involved in an Assassin vs Templar war and make the samemistake the original two races did. The important part is that you have to travel alone to awaken the sixth. I believe the goal is for you and this other person,use the pieces of Eden andeither stop the event from occuring in 2012 and/or to be the creators of the new human race.

Side note : Ceaser and the "entities" controlling Desmond at the end of the game seem to confirm that a major power of the Apple of Eden is to control humankind. Tis would explain why the Templars want it so bad and why it's important that they don't get it.

During the end credits you hear the voices of the people I assume find Desmond saying to put him back in the Animus. I believe these are the other assassin's who have found him lying beside the others and assumed he's "gone crazy" They put him back into the Animus to stop him from going nuts I guess. At the end of the exchange you hear Desmond say "No!" so he obviously regains consciousness slightly and I'll bet that's where AC3 begins

Zoooeeeyyy
01-10-2011, 06:51 PM
Originally posted by tortle:
I personally think that first off subject 16 and what he says is the most important piece to figuring this mess out thats why its called "the truth"

This made me have a random thought that I need to share. I have many other things I could speculate on but the one thing I want to say is this.

The words you see from Subject 16's "The Truth"is 'The miracle is in the execution'

That made me think that Lucy's 'execution' holds the way to the miracle, possibly being Eden...

I have so much more I want to say but I needed to get that out of my system and see if people had any replies to it!

beJlbl4
01-11-2011, 04:59 AM
Watch this please: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvPUsgmYjCM =)

ekulnnud
01-11-2011, 07:17 PM
i saw this on gamefaqs and thought i should post it here to see what you guys think



Oracle: Okay. Now I'm supposed to say, `Umm, that's interesting, but...' then you say...
Neo: But what?
Oracle: But you already know what I'm going to tell you.
Neo: I'm not the one.
Oracle: Sorry kiddo. You got the gift, but it looks like you're waiting for something.
Neo: What?
Oracle: Your next life maybe, who knows? That's the way these things go.

Neo is subsequently killed and becomes The One in his 'next life.' The same thing could happen with Lucy, she has to die first before she can become Eve.

Zoooeeeyyy
01-11-2011, 08:00 PM
Originally posted by ekulnnud:
i saw this on gamefaqs and thought i should post it here to see what you guys think



Oracle: Okay. Now I'm supposed to say, `Umm, that's interesting, but...' then you say...
Neo: But what?
Oracle: But you already know what I'm going to tell you.
Neo: I'm not the one.
Oracle: Sorry kiddo. You got the gift, but it looks like you're waiting for something.
Neo: What?
Oracle: Your next life maybe, who knows? That's the way these things go.

Neo is subsequently killed and becomes The One in his 'next life.' The same thing could happen with Lucy, she has to die first before she can become Eve.

This would make sense when considering the whole 'The miracle is in the execution' Lucy cannot become Eve until she dies and is brought back (By the shroud maybe?)

And the shroud bringing her back could be (as some people have already mentioned) the reason for the footprints outside of the Sanctuary, which are in the shape of a double helix like someone mentioned in another thread, the shroud may be hidden underneath the grate..

Bha I need the next game

jovianfan0011
01-11-2011, 10:46 PM
so many questions unanswered. What does go find the 6th alone even mean. It was still a very good game but ubisoft has got to work on endings. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif!!!!?????

SevketErhat
01-12-2011, 12:39 AM
Originally posted by jovianfan0011:
so many questions unanswered. What does go find the 6th alone even mean. It was still a very good game but ubisoft has got to work on endings. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif!!!!?????

They do that in purpose

tk-42117
01-12-2011, 06:14 PM
The voices during the credits are guys at assassin hq (listen carfuly and the "no..." is Desmond and the expert is probably the guy from lucy's e-mails). Rebeca is a hacker/enginier and Shaun is a historian and tactical support. They didn't no what to do but stop the bleeding so they took Desmond and Lucy to hq.

At least thats what I think and just about everybody I know has agreed with.

Evongelo
01-12-2011, 10:19 PM
Back when I finished *** Creed 1 I told myself I wouldnt play any more until all the *** Creeds came out. That way I wouldn't have to put myself thru this mind(ya) every damn time. But I never listen to me. and here i am again. honestly if i had any of my own theories prior to getting onto this thread i certainly dont got em anymore. all i have is your guys's stuff floatin around in there. its good stuff tho so thanx.

therealboreal
01-12-2011, 10:26 PM
But then if Desmond's desendant is looking back into the Animus at this memory within a memory, what need would there be? They would have already saved the world from the templars, so there would be no need to explore the past through the animus anymore...
Originally posted by Piflik:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Another possibly I have though of, is that this dialogue is going on in the real, real world. what I mean by that, is that all of the time that Desmond thought he was escaping, and going to Monteriggioni etc. was actually spent in an animus (so Ezio's was actually a memory within a memory). Then, you hear that dialogue because Desmond (or some descendent of Desmond) is going into shock from too much exposure to the animus, and comes out of it for a second after he sees the memory of Desmond killing Lucy.


I thought so, too, after hearing Subject 16's message in the Truth Sequence. I guess the 'real' protagonist of the AC series is Desmond's son... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ADDN1NJA
01-13-2011, 02:16 PM
Originally posted by Shiboleth17:
Yeah, I feel like the ending gave more questions than answers. Have you seen the truth yet? 16 mentions something about Lucy being untrustworthy, so that is probably why she needs to die.

They can (and hopefully will) release another AC, because there is still the whole problem with the world needing saved from some cataclysm that could wipe out all life on earth. So in AC3 (possibly) Desmond will likely use the The Apple to determine where the locations of the temples are and activate them to save earth. Also, they could always release new games about other assassins unrelated to Desmond... This way, they could create any world they want. I feel like they might go this route when they finish Desmond's story.

No idea why Ezio would come back to Monteriggioni except to leave some hints about where he hid the Apple.

I don't think Ezio originally placed the Apple back into the spot from AC2, since it later shows Ezio leaving the Colosseum in Rome. That was the first and only place Ezio hid the Apple.

One thing I found interesting about the end was the line that was spoken after a few seconds into the credits. I believe it said something like "****, he's gone into shock. Put him back in the machine. It's the only way to fix this." Then another character says something like "but the animus did this to him." "Am I the expert or not, Do it!" "No."

This gives me a few ideas. I believe this dialogue could be one of several things. First, it could simply be Shaun and Rebecca (or more than likely other assassins, since the voices are male and not British) trying to get Desmond back into the animus, which is why you end up back in Rome as Ezio when the credits end.
Second, it might be a flashback of a memory. Which means it could be Desmond's personal memory, or the memory of an ancestor. The only memory I could think of that might make sene is that the dialogue could be the moment when Vidic pushed subject 16 too far with the animus and drove hime insane. Then abstergo created a clone of 16 in order to get the info they want, hence, subject 17 (better known as Desmond).
Another possibly I have though of, is that this dialogue is going on in the real, real world. what I mean by that, is that all of the time that Desmond thought he was escaping, and going to Monteriggioni etc. was actually spent in an animus (so Ezio's was actually a memory within a memory). Then, you hear that dialogue because Desmond (or some descendent of Desmond) is going into shock from too much exposure to the animus, and comes out of it for a second after he sees the memory of Desmond killing Lucy.

The stuff that bothers me most about the ending is what 16 says in the Truth. Some of the craziness that comes out of his mouth leads me to believe one or another of my above theories...

Anyway, let me know what you think of that.


to quote from the official game guide book "The First Civilization cannot allow Desmond to be sidetracked from his union with Eve, the carrier of the other half of the First Civilization DNA stock. Lucy is a distraction they cannot afford." as to the voices at the end those are other fellow assassins.

joaomuas
01-15-2011, 01:03 PM
Lots of people here have been talking about France, and lots of other people have answered "WHAT?! FRANCE?! ARE YOU CRAZY?" or "There isn't any clue about France" or even "France sucks!". I mean, what is wrong with you guys?! Haven't you noticed all the clues that lead to France!? COME ON! It's obvious! Take a look:

1. Desmond is in Italy so, really near France (I know the Templars are watching the border, and that makes this theory even better - wouldn't it be awesome to open a game trying to cross the border unnoticed, ending up in a brutal action sequence with Desmond escaping to France?)

2. SPOILER ALERT - "That's a Phrygian Cap. It stands for freedom... and that, that's a Masonic Eye. Now those two come together in only one place--" - Shaun Hastings (ACB Ending). The answer is... France. Yes, it's true, this symbols come together in France. I have a theory about the symbols: I think they represent the battle. The Masonic Eye - symbolic reference to the Masons (great theory about them some posts above) and the Illuminati and others like these - represent the Templars, as the Templars are some kind of guys continuing Illuminati's New World Order plans. The Phrygian Cap, as it stands for freedom, represents the Assassins. - END OF SPOILERS

3. Ubisoft released a multiplayer expansion pack that contains the map Mont St. Michel, in France. Isn't that a clue?

4. The guys from Ubisoft Montreal are mostly Canadian, so they also speak French. Wouldn't they like to make a game in France?

5. Lots of Templar Crusaders were from France and there were some religion conflicts (among other conflicts) involving them. France has lots of History with the Knights Templar and some of the Templar survivors in Italy after some religious problems fled to France and continued the brotherhood underground. Aren't these clues enough?

6. The Priory of Sion. They had some kind of alliance with the Knights Templar about the Holy Grail (I believe it is also a Piece of Eden). They kept its secret, and the Grail was in France for a long time. What about involving The Priory in the next game? And Desmond wanted the locations of the temples, and The Apple pointed to France. Can you imagine Desmond finding The Holy Grail? The Templars were giving up on it, and if they could follow Desmond and discover about it... It would make an awesome story!

7. France was one of the most important countries in both World Wars, which according to Subject 16, were created by The Apple, in the hands of the Templars.

Note: Desmond probably won't go to France in the Animus so, instead of the Animus Database, Desmond could go to The Louvre, or The Louvre's Website or open a Louvre Book, I don't know, and get the information he needs. Isn't it a good idea?

8. France has a beautiful History and is a great cultural center, adapting well to how the producers want the settings.

9. French cities are well built and appropriate to how Ubisoft Montreal wants the cities, instead of cities like New York (although it would be really really really awesome to have an open-world New York, but I think the producers prefer the way European cities are rather than American, and I don't disagree, I just also don't agree, cause European cities are awesome, and American ones like New York are awesome; I just think European ones adapt better to the franchise, both in story, gameplay, and the way they are built).

10. Ancient brotherhoods. They could make part of side-quest stories, and France has lots of History with a lot of them, including the Mayans, Illuminati and Knights Templar. These 3 I mentioned are really important in the franchise plot, and side-quests about them would be awesome!

11. Lots of catacumbs!

12. Paris!

13. France is awesome! Can you imagine a Leap of Faith from The Eiffel Tower?

Don't get me wrong: Desmond could very well buy a plane ticket to America; there are also some clues about America (and awesome clues, mainly on the storyside, with references to betrayals, presidents, wars, armys, alliances, revolutions, conspiracies among lots of other things, and these clues are mainly shown on 16's puzzles in both AC2 and Brotherhood; the multiplayer pack could mean nothing; Montreal could prefer a game in Canada; the religious conflicts may have nothing to do with the franchise; The Holy Grail, according to some historians, was moved to England, and then never leaved it; World Wars may not fit in the franchise plot; Ubisoft may want to forget History and focus on the future, leaving behind culture and ancient history (ok guys, we all know this is not going to happen); the producers may want to change to flat glass skyscrapers, casinos, and driving cars in the middle of high traffic until we're ****ed off, get out of the car and start killing everyone (no, not anymore: there is no possible explanation for the message "Desmond did not kill civilians"), what would be awesome; there are also ancient brotherhoods from America; we could explore sewage instead of catacumbs (it would also be awesome); New York and Leap of Faith from Empire State Building.

These are both great settings, and I can't decide about which I prefer. It would be awesome in France, it would be awesome in America, it would be even more awesome in both of them (it would be the best game ever), and maybe awesome in another place! Personally, I think it will go to France (this doesn't mean I prefer it). Maybe France in AC3 and New York in AC4, but I just think that, with the information we have right now, it will go to France. I can't decide between the 2 I just spoke of about which I prefer, but I think it's slightly more possible for it to go to France. BUT, MAYBE IT WON'T BE IN FRANCE, NEITHER IN AMERICA! We don't know... yet!


P.S. - Sorry if my english isn't that good (I'm portuguese).
If you want this facts explained, understand a lot more things about the franchise, or know some of my sources, read Angels and Demons and The Da Vinci Code, both by Dan Brown.

beanoboy400
01-15-2011, 03:37 PM
Hey. Dunno of anyone has mentioned this but if you look at the dates from the emails it is,November time. Now from everyone rating stuff about end of world according to Maya calendar world will end 21 st December 2012. Ac brotherhood ends in November 2012. The abstergo satilittle launch is 72 days from the end of game which could lead to 21 st December 2012 in the game and proposed end if world.

Just a thought http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

And also where do shun and the other woman go after demon stabs Lucy. They kinda just disappear leaving Lucy and desmond.

LAsT_AsSaSSiN_
01-17-2011, 06:12 PM
Okay, Iíve never posted before so please forgive me if I make a mistake but I just had to post http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Iíve read through every single post on this thread and it sounds like there are a lot of supporters for the ďDesmondís son is the protagonist and heís in the Animus reliving his fatherís memoriesĒ. Originally I thought the idea to be interesting if not a bit silly. I mean, they have currently based everything on Desmond, why would they suddenly do a 180 but, then again, this is Ubisoft and they like to keep us on our toes Ė evidently!

Then I thought, ďhang on.....Ē and thus the theory below was born!!!!!!

So anyway, my point http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

I noticed that once you finish the game, just as you can before the end, you can go back to any of the sequences and redo Ezio's memories - but you canít redo any of the ďpresent day memoriesĒ such as arriving at Monteriggioni or relive getting into the temple and you canít re-watch the ending. My very long winded idea for why this is not Desmondís son reliving his fatherís memories through an Animus is because if it was his son, surely you would be able to watch any memory back? Iím sure there are a million and one holes to this theory and I may be wrong and you can experience them again but, to my current knowledge Ė you canít.

I came up with this about 5 minutes ago so I have not got it fool proof yet but I think itís a decent theory, heck, thereís more than enough of them going around, might as well through my penny in too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Iíd be interested to know what people think of this idea http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Auditorexxx
01-17-2011, 09:12 PM
Well it was somewhat confusing but i somewhat get the ending. Now why desmond killed Lucy is somewhat a puzzle to me. Like someone said in a older post, she could of been a templar. Also, the voices at the end gave us the point that Desmond was found but we still do not know who capture him. Judging by the fact that you ended up playing as ezio at the end states that he was placed back in the machine (forgeting the name this moment >&lthttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

It leaves alot of options and the ending might of sum up of what the next assassin's creed might take place. Someplace where freedom is either being fighting.

Redmonkeyking
01-18-2011, 03:20 AM
That's a very good point, Last Assassin. Who knows, though. They might be using a different kind of Animus in the future.

narojr
01-18-2011, 03:48 AM
yo i think that they should like add like a dark assassins creed so it will be like desmond will need to fight the templars and the dark brotherhood.

KonEl3016
01-20-2011, 02:18 AM
Does anyone know what the red symbol on the floor of the vault means. IF you use eagle vision just before you start going round the room with the apple it appears on the floor with the switch.

joaomuas
01-20-2011, 02:05 PM
Originally posted by KonEl3016:
Does anyone know what the red symbol on the floor of the vault means. IF you use eagle vision just before you start going round the room with the apple it appears on the floor with the switch.

Can you post a screenshot or describe the symbol? I know a bit of symbology.

RobbieRageX
01-21-2011, 09:51 PM
OKay my theory.....

Minerva is the woman 16 is talking about. In the truth video of ACII she is obviously the one in that factory ordering the humans. Freeze frame the video and its her dress and helmet. She and the other gods used the PoE to control mankind for their own gain. Adam and Eve were the first humans to fight back and thats why they stole the PoE. Minerva and Juno are tricking the assassins to work for them. Lucy was killed because she would have helped stop them somehow.The world isnt ending in 12/21/12(72 days)but if the Assassins keep listening to Minerva and the other gods they will BRING BACK those gods on that day to steal mankind's free will again with the PoEs. So either a new Animus subject will be explored or Desmond will flee or be kidnapped from the Assassins headquarters to work with the Templars.

The Templars are going to save mankind.
The Assassins are leading humans to their demise.
Nothing is true. Everything is permitted.

KonEl3016
01-21-2011, 10:52 PM
Originally posted by joaomuas11:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KonEl3016:
Does anyone know what the red symbol on the floor of the vault means. IF you use eagle vision just before you start going round the room with the apple it appears on the floor with the switch.

Can you post a screenshot or describe the symbol? I know a bit of symbology. </div></BLOCKQUOTE> I can't find a screenshot of it anywhere. None of the gaming sites, or anyone else for that matter, seems to know about it. When you use eagle vision on the floor with the second or third pedestal (not sure how many there were) an outline in red of a weird shape separates from the rest of the blue line and in the middle of it are two crescent moons facing each other.

joaomuas
01-22-2011, 03:07 AM
I can't find a screenshot of it anywhere. None of the gaming sites, or anyone else for that matter, seems to know about it. When you use eagle vision on the floor with the second or third pedestal (not sure how many there were) an outline in red of a weird shape separates from the rest of the blue line and in the middle of it are two crescent moons facing each other.

Never heard of that symbol.

KonEl3016
01-23-2011, 08:48 PM
I drew quick sketches with and without eagle vision. It's the switch not the pedestal the apple is on http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/konel3016/img007.jpg http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/konel3016/img006.jpg

SquarePolo27
01-24-2011, 01:46 PM
Not many people have thought that this is related to some of the bits in the animus. Cesere says "No man can murder me" and "Chains will not hold me". I don't think he would say that because of the heck of it.

joaomuas
01-25-2011, 09:05 AM
Originally posted by KonEl3016:
I drew quick sketches with and without eagle vision. It's the switch not the pedestal the apple is on http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/konel3016/img007.jpg http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/konel3016/img006.jpg

The crescent moon means the Mind or the Evolving Human Spirit. This fits well with Juno's words about the 6th sense - Knowledge. As there are two of them, it must mean that two people - Desmond and Eve's descendent - must awaken their 6th sense, and by the way they're together, they probably need to have a son.

That's all I can think of right now. I hope it helps!

Mann-IMD
01-26-2011, 12:36 PM
Hey!

Those pictures, you draw, are which ledge you have to grap when Desmond get the power to the apple, ! You have to pull the left ledge, and then the right, and the left agian to get the power http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif If you pull wrong you have to start over http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

joaomuas11 nice guess http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

rangernater
01-26-2011, 10:29 PM
Originally posted by Shiboleth17:
Yeah, I feel like the ending gave more questions than answers. Have you seen the truth yet? 16 mentions something about Lucy being untrustworthy, so that is probably why she needs to die.

They can (and hopefully will) release another AC, because there is still the whole problem with the world needing saved from some cataclysm that could wipe out all life on earth. So in AC3 (possibly) Desmond will likely use the The Apple to determine where the locations of the temples are and activate them to save earth. Also, they could always release new games about other assassins unrelated to Desmond... This way, they could create any world they want. I feel like they might go this route when they finish Desmond's story.

No idea why Ezio would come back to Monteriggioni except to leave some hints about where he hid the Apple.

I don't think Ezio originally placed the Apple back into the spot from AC2, since it later shows Ezio leaving the Colosseum in Rome. That was the first and only place Ezio hid the Apple.

One thing I found interesting about the end was the line that was spoken after a few seconds into the credits. I believe it said something like "****, he's gone into shock. Put him back in the machine. It's the only way to fix this." Then another character says something like "but the animus did this to him." "Am I the expert or not, Do it!" "No."

This gives me a few ideas. I believe this dialogue could be one of several things. First, it could simply be Shaun and Rebecca (or more than likely other assassins, since the voices are male and not British) trying to get Desmond back into the animus, which is why you end up back in Rome as Ezio when the credits end.
Second, it might be a flashback of a memory. Which means it could be Desmond's personal memory, or the memory of an ancestor. The only memory I could think of that might make sene is that the dialogue could be the moment when Vidic pushed subject 16 too far with the animus and drove hime insane. Then abstergo created a clone of 16 in order to get the info they want, hence, subject 17 (better known as Desmond).
Another possibly I have though of, is that this dialogue is going on in the real, real world. what I mean by that, is that all of the time that Desmond thought he was escaping, and going to Monteriggioni etc. was actually spent in an animus (so Ezio's was actually a memory within a memory). Then, you hear that dialogue because Desmond (or some descendent of Desmond) is going into shock from too much exposure to the animus, and comes out of it for a second after he sees the memory of Desmond killing Lucy.

The stuff that bothers me most about the ending is what 16 says in the Truth. Some of the craziness that comes out of his mouth leads me to believe one or another of my above theories...

Anyway, let me know what you think of that. OHHHH she couldn't be trusted because she got them guys to follow the 4 to tht weird place and she was always in dept for wat tht old dude did i forget his name vince, vector i can't remember but its all speculation im just guessing good idea though

KonEl3016
01-27-2011, 10:41 PM
Originally posted by Mann-IMD:
Hey!

Those pictures, you draw, are which ledge you have to grap when Desmond get the power to the apple, ! You have to pull the left ledge, and then the right, and the left agian to get the power http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif If you pull wrong you have to start over http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

joaomuas11 nice guess http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Thanks that helped a lot. It was driving me nuts trying to find out what it was.

joaomuas
01-28-2011, 04:35 PM
I just completed the game again (I really need to buy a new game, cause since all my games are at 100%, I just keep completing ACB over and over again) and came up with some strange things:

1. At some part of the ending, Juno says "You will know only when it is too late". Maybe that has to do with Lucy: Desmond discovers she is a Templar, but it's too late to save her or turn her into an assassin, so he needs to kill her.

2. When Desmond asks the Apple for the location of the temples, those two symbols appear, but with a lot of other symbols in the background. One of them, is Abstergo's.

3. After Lucy is stabbed, they both fall and the Apple rolls over and touches Lucy's hand. It's only touching it, she's not holding it! Then, the credits roll and after that, before you go back to the Animus, there is a quick look at that scene again, BUT, in that quick look, Lucy is actually HOLDING the Apple in her hand. Wierd, no?

XKidRetro96
01-29-2011, 12:35 AM
Lucy can,t be trusted because she either has ties to Abstergo or at the very least used to. as we in AC 1 and 2 maybe she was killed because of this.

SquarePolo27
02-05-2011, 01:28 PM
I'm sorry folks but I'm gonna echo what I have said. Cesare is saying crazy stuff like "You don't know anything!"

AboeSafiyyah
02-08-2011, 11:59 AM
Hey guys,

Well that's some interesting answers, keep it up i love 'to read al those possibilitys.

My one, will be short lived cause realy, the game is awesome! Thumbs up for the makers!

What there will be coming is AC 3 will be a mystery.

Anyway keep Posting!

Spudsimpson12
02-12-2011, 09:03 AM
Ok this is awesome you guys have been blowing my mind!! I haven't read all the stOries bit I don't think anybody had mention. Between the 6 and 7 mission you can exit the Animus and talk to Lucy. You ask when are they goin to attack redefine to Templars. She says well today is October 8 and the year is 2012. So we have only 74 days left. The day the Templars attack is 12 21 2012 mind=blown.

tk-42117
03-01-2011, 11:22 AM
What I've seen countless times on the internet is people saying subject 16 is Desmond's son or dad. listen to Lucy in the begining of AC2, Ezio is the closest link between them. Their like 12th cousins or somthing.

Poodle_of_Doom
03-01-2011, 05:37 PM
Originally posted by tk-42117:
What I've seen countless times on the internet is people saying subject 16 is Desmond's son or dad. listen to Lucy in the begining of AC2, Ezio is the closest link between them. Their like 12th cousins or somthing.

Really? I kind of had the impression that Ezio was the decendant of subject 16, and they had stolen the Animus core to access those memories to train Desmond.

WHATTHEdead
03-16-2011, 07:29 PM
K so.. these are my thoughts, as people have said in the Truth video S16 says, "The Sun.. Your Son" is really suppose to mean something. I really.. really (reeeeally) hope Ubisoft doesnt pull an Infinity Ward and kill off my favorite characters.. there is a chance that Lucy is still alive.. look where Desmond stabbed her.. in her general stomach area.. if they really wanted her to be dead and us to be sure about it after all the assassination things we have watched you would think these superior alien beings (or w/e) would atleast stab her in the throat. I think that maybe she was pregnant (*shrugs*) and that is why S16 said something about "Your -->SON<--" or as someone else suggested (which makes sense to me) that Lucy would distract Desmond from finding the desendent of Eve.. reguardless.. Ubisoft.. if you are reading this i want you to know.. i love you.. so please dont kill off our characters.. (P.S. no offense.. the second newest Prince of Persia was terrible.. so terrible if fact that i have not tried the very newest one because i am afraid it will be as bad as he second newest and complete ruin my image of the original Prince that i grew up playing)

YeOldeSierra
03-20-2011, 02:21 PM
I don't really have a theory on things at the moment because I don't feel I have a sufficient grasp of the franchise to really share one, but I have to say, I really enjoy reading the ideas given out by other members on the forums. Clearly, people are really into the Assassin's Creed franchise. One thing I do like is how the story is open to interpretation, and how much detail Ubisoft have put into crafting the game and its environments.

The only idea I've had as to why Desmond was forced to stab Lucy was that she potentially was an obstacle to the Assassins and their end goal. Desmond likely had to be fully devoted to the cause that the Assassins uphold. I don't imagine he killed Lucy though; I saw it more as a form of showing his loyalty. Still, I'll keep reading the theories of others - they're really fascinating to see!

El_Sjietah
03-23-2011, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by Sticker704:
I'm sorry folks but I'm gonna echo what I have said. Cesare is saying crazy stuff like "You don't know anything!"

This bothers me as well. Right from the moment he was captured, the game took a turn to the absurd, but pretended like it all made perfect sense. All that rambling about "no chains can hold me" and what not. Did he see it by using the apple? Did something else play a part? Why did it even matter to Ezio? There were warlords all over Europe causing pain and suffering. What Cesare was doing somewhere far off after he escaped was nothing special, yet Ezio insists he has to go hunt him down.

Then, when he eventually does chase him down, one of the oddest dialogues in gaming history kicks in. It was so out of context it left me wondering for several minutes before I continued with what I was supposed to do.

All that ranting about "I can't die by the hand of man!" was insane enough without Ezio actually taking it completely serious and follow up with "Then I shall leave you in the hands of fate." I mean, what? Why not just slice his throat? He's just a man... right? Or is Ezio so hung up on prophecies and futuretelling, he's fulfilling them by acting accordingly?

After that it became even more bizarre with all the random Animus flashes of apples, Borgia and Ezio when Cesare supposedly plumetted to his death. Supposedly, because we never see him actually hit the ground.

Then it cuts off and we're expected to simply carry on with the story, like nothing happened. It was all very... confusing.. to say the least. I'm not even sure whether Cesare is dead or not. Hell, I'm not even sure whether Cesare is human or not.

TwentyGlyphs
03-24-2011, 10:32 PM
Originally posted by El_Sjietah:

This bothers me as well. Right from the moment he was captured, the game took a turn to the absurd, but pretended like it all made perfect sense. All that rambling about "no chains can hold me" and what not. Did he see it by using the apple? Did something else play a part? Why did it even matter to Ezio? There were warlords all over Europe causing pain and suffering. What Cesare was doing somewhere far off after he escaped was nothing special, yet Ezio insists he has to go hunt him down.

Then, when he eventually does chase him down, one of the oddest dialogues in gaming history kicks in. It was so out of context it left me wondering for several minutes before I continued with what I was supposed to do.

All that ranting about "I can't die by the hand of man!" was insane enough without Ezio actually taking it completely serious and follow up with "Then I shall leave you in the hands of fate." I mean, what? Why not just slice his throat? He's just a man... right? Or is Ezio so hung up on prophecies and futuretelling, he's fulfilling them by acting accordingly?

After that it became even more bizarre with all the random Animus flashes of apples, Borgia and Ezio when Cesare supposedly plumetted to his death. Supposedly, because we never see him actually hit the ground.

Then it cuts off and we're expected to simply carry on with the story, like nothing happened. It was all very... confusing.. to say the least. I'm not even sure whether Cesare is dead or not. Hell, I'm not even sure whether Cesare is human or not.

This is exactly how I've felt about the entire ending in the Animus. What was Ezio remembering in 1507 that was interfering with trying to access the sequence at the beginning of the game anyway? And then when you finally get there, the memory is still all jumbled up and glitchy. When you drop Cesare off the wall, the Animus glitches out, then shows the dramatic speech of Cesare in weird silhouette mode, then suddenly shows Ezio hiding the Apple.

To top that off, in the Da Vinci Disappearance, Ezio says in 1506 that the Apple has been "put to rest." This would have been before Ezio ever went after Cesare in Sequence 9. Was he remembering that after killing Cesare? Even more bizarre, in the DLC William acts like there's some big issue with accessing Ezio's memories. It's like they can't access any of his memories from 1504 to early 1507, and the 1506 memories of the DLC becoming available is a breakthrough.

It's weird that this wasn't addressed more. Hopefully they know what they're doing and have some sort of payoff to this mystery. I wouldn't be surprised if this year's game happens sometime during the missing years between 1504 and Ezio's return to Rome in 1506, and offers some explanation. I wonder if these memories have somehow been scrambled as a security mechanism so they can't be accessed by Abstergo, or until the timing is right leading up to 12/21/2012. Perhaps the Apple was altered by Minerva so it would do this when in Ezio's possession after the scene in the Vault? Weird mystery.

ellumin0us
03-25-2011, 08:58 AM
In the Da Vinci Disappearance at the end when Ezio and Leo get in the tomb, they see numbers with 'N' and 'W' but they think the numbers are meaningless. but when the memory ends you hear the same guys (like in the end) saying we got the coordinates. so this memory wasnt meant for Ezio it was meant for whoever had to do something with the Animus (like Desmond, or his son or the Templars). So what was the reason Those Who Came Before put the coordinates there?