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View Full Version : Over Sensitive Carbs.



darkhorizon11
06-20-2005, 10:44 AM
Is it just me or does anyone else notice that the carburated aircraft in the game are ultra sensitive to any negative G maneuvers. Like not just pushing the nose over intentionally but any bump or force feedback inputs and you lose power.

I've never flown a vintage world war two aircraft but I have over 200 hours now in reciprocating engine aircraft, both multi and single engine and I've never seen anything slight to this.

Technology has improved naturally however the modern carbs we use are updraft type and theres no redundancy in our carbs for negative G flight so they shouldn't be any better in this aspect. IIRC there are certain carbs can be used for negative G flight but the carbs in the Warriors, Seminoles and Grobs I've flown definitely weren't this type. In fact I've done some aerobatic stuff in Caps before and later I'll check that POH for the type of carb since that aircraft is approved for inverted manuevers.

Anyways, although carbs are sensitive to zero and negative G situation it seems that the reduction in power is far too sensitive.

More on this later.

darkhorizon11
06-20-2005, 10:44 AM
Is it just me or does anyone else notice that the carburated aircraft in the game are ultra sensitive to any negative G maneuvers. Like not just pushing the nose over intentionally but any bump or force feedback inputs and you lose power.

I've never flown a vintage world war two aircraft but I have over 200 hours now in reciprocating engine aircraft, both multi and single engine and I've never seen anything slight to this.

Technology has improved naturally however the modern carbs we use are updraft type and theres no redundancy in our carbs for negative G flight so they shouldn't be any better in this aspect. IIRC there are certain carbs can be used for negative G flight but the carbs in the Warriors, Seminoles and Grobs I've flown definitely weren't this type. In fact I've done some aerobatic stuff in Caps before and later I'll check that POH for the type of carb since that aircraft is approved for inverted manuevers.

Anyways, although carbs are sensitive to zero and negative G situation it seems that the reduction in power is far too sensitive.

More on this later.

TX-EcoDragon
06-20-2005, 12:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Is it just me or does anyone else notice that the carburated aircraft in the game are ultra sensitive to any negative G maneuvers. Like not just pushing the nose over intentionally but any bump or force feedback inputs and you lose power.

I've never flown a vintage world war two aircraft but I have over 200 hours now in reciprocating engine aircraft, both multi and single engine and I've never seen anything slight to this. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


I have, and I agree. It does depend on the design of course, but I have never flown anything that was so sensitive, and so quick to starve. Additionally there should be no need for the pilot to do anything to restart the engine other than restore +G conditions unless the prop has stopped (usually it will windmill).

PBNA-Boosher
06-20-2005, 04:22 PM
Having flown in real life and seeing Merlin demonstrations, the carbs are DEFINITELY NOT this sensitive. My little Piper can handle a lot more neg. G's than what's going on in game. If you think it's worth it, e-mail 1C and Oleg and ask.

irR4tiOn4L
06-20-2005, 05:55 PM
stuff that! Have you ever noticed that if you try and fly level inverted for more than a couple of seconds you begin seeing a red out? WTF?
I think these are related problems.

badaboom.1
06-20-2005, 06:14 PM
Ummm,No.....no I'll pass,I'm on the ATKINS diet[LOW CARBS]pass the steak please!!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

darkhorizon11
06-21-2005, 10:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by irR4tiOn4L:
stuff that! Have you ever noticed that if you try and fly level inverted for more than a couple of seconds you begin seeing a red out? WTF?
I think these are related problems. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Totally unrelated. Red out is when you hang upside and all the blood rushes to your head. It isn't that profound but its extremely uncomfortable sustained inverted flight sucks for humans basically.

I'm talking about carbuerators and their inability to transfer fuel to the engine in a negative G situation. Although it does happen I've come to the conclusion that the carbs definitely are NOT this sensitive. There is a such thing as a negative G carb, I'm not too familiar with their operation or how much they were used in WWII. Later model aircraft incorporated fuel injectors with a fuel metering system which eliminate the problem completely.

If I get the chance I'll post this in ORR and send an email.

TX-EcoDragon
06-21-2005, 03:55 PM
There have actually been quite a few ORR threads about this in one form or another, and I have submitted reports to the bug/beta email addys as well, but another certainly wont hurt. They have improved on the need to toggle mags and press the "I" key though, so I think over time the behavior is improving.


Regarding the red out (I agree not really related, but still similarly sensitive):
The red out effects are arbitrary in how they are applied in any sim since there is no real world effect to base this visual representation of the FEEL of negative Gs on. In reality there is not really any such thing as redout. There are some suggestions that some people at very high negative G may have visual artifacts of the negative G from the bottom eyelid rising to partially cover the eye, but I have no first hand experience of this, and I don't know anyone who does. What is more common is the bursting of blood vessels in the eye and head (if there is some specific weakness in the pilot or localized pressure like from a headset or helmet) but this is still pretty rare too. . . and we push more G's than anyone would or could ever do in one of these fighters or in a combat setting. I feel the in game effect is a bit overdone, but it does remind the virtual pilot that you're subjecting the pilot to something a bit uncomfortable.

Jumoschwanz
06-21-2005, 07:21 PM
In the opening scene to the movie Battle of Britian, and early Hurri does a fly by and a roll and the engine coughs and some black smoke comes out of the exhaust, cool......S!

Jumoschwanz