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iQv_nuclear
10-01-2006, 07:00 PM
How in the heck do you shoot these buzzards down? I've been flying full real servers, especially Historia, lately and having a great time with it. Unfortunately, I have a great deal of trouble bringing down P 47's. It seems almost as much hassle as Il 2's or He 111's http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Btw, I fly the 109, all models.

VW-IceFire
10-01-2006, 07:04 PM
Aim for one wing and keep firing. Do not fire at the fuselage and do not spread your fire between both wings and the fuselage as that will just compound the loss of ammunition.

P-47s are by far the toughest fighters of WWII. They are rediculously overbuilt (part of that incredible weight which makes the earlier models climb very slowly and makes throwing them around in a dogfight impossible) and they dwarf other fighters. The rear fuselage is also filled with the turbosupercharger gear which is also the most bullet resistant (it acts like another set of pilot armor).

But if you keep hammering away at one wing either at the root or about midway the wing will either break off or the wing will loose so much life as to put the plane in an uncontrollable state.

Daiichidoku
10-01-2006, 07:13 PM
shoot three or rour 7.7mm or .303 rounds at the mighty, paper-mache, insta-stop(TM) R-2800 engine

problem sloved

VW-IceFire
10-01-2006, 08:38 PM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
shoot three or rour 7.7mm or .303 rounds at the mighty, paper-mache, insta-stop(TM) R-2800 engine

problem sloved
Yes that also works. Sadly.

Treetop64
10-01-2006, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by VW-IceFire:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
shoot three or rour 7.7mm or .303 rounds at the mighty, paper-mache, insta-stop(TM) R-2800 engine

problem sloved
Yes that also works. Sadly. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No sh*t. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Xiolablu3
10-01-2006, 08:48 PM
Very tought to bring down from behind using a BF109 with anything except Mk108.

If there is no Mk108 option, Use a FW190 instead if there are P47's around.

FW190A and P47 are very simlar birds in 'fighting style'. Its almost like fighting a mirror image, except the FW190 has a better roll rate at low speed and the P47 has a better (incredible) zoom climb. I can dive down on an enemey from 3000m and zoom back up to the same height in a 45 degree climb, its amazing, nothing can catch you as long as you dont stray into powered climb territory, level off when you get to around 300kph.

In the game both have really powerful guns, both are incredibley fast, and both dive really fast.

I most fear P47s if I am flying Axis these days, they are killers if flown correctly.

LStarosta
10-01-2006, 09:25 PM
Usually looking at it really hard works wonders.

fordfan25
10-01-2006, 10:22 PM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
shoot three or rour 7.7mm or .303 rounds at the mighty, paper-mache, insta-stop(TM) R-2800 engine

problem sloved agreed. i find the DM on both the jug as well as the cosair and hellcats not up to historys take. the only advantge in this game a 47 has is above 20/25k ft top speed. of course it takes so long to get anywear near that top speed you get cought by 109's before you can get there.

fordfan25
10-01-2006, 10:23 PM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
Usually looking at it really hard works wonders. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

WOLFMondo
10-02-2006, 12:17 AM
Drag them down to low altitude and sucker into a slow speed turning battle. Or aim for the pilot.

zbw_109
10-02-2006, 12:25 AM
Use a HE-162/ME-262/GO-229 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Xiolablu3
10-02-2006, 12:58 AM
The P47 is still incredibly fast on the deck, its one of the few planes I fear when I am in a FW190A9.

I agree the engine needs toughening up a bit, but the general model is very strong. Easily the strongest single engined fighter in the game.

WOLFMondo
10-02-2006, 01:20 AM
The 'D' Is still slower than an A8 or A9 on the deck by about 20kph and the normal P47's are all slower than the A5 and A6.

Xiolablu3
10-02-2006, 02:37 AM
Really?


Thanks for that info, I'll use that to good effect.

Its not a plane I know a lot about , but I started flying it recently when I discovered how dangerous it was to my FW190.


It always seemed to catch my 190A9 with no problems in my usual 'escape dive' (shallowish dive from 2000-3000m. Perhaps thats why, because it was diving.

I will now know to keep him on the level rather than dive so hard.

Thanks!

F19_Ob
10-02-2006, 03:15 AM
Shoot at the tail only.
The elevators comes of easily and then the plane is out of action.
Actually the tail quite often comes off when shooting with the 109's 20mm cannon. I tested if they had fixed this in the latest patch. They didn't.
Try it in quick combat without stress.
Online there is more stress and one scatter the ammo more. With experience of deflection the scattering becomes less, but it takes time to get there.

A single 30 mm hit may disable a p47 although it still looks like flying.
Many times I've taken a single hit wich resulted in elevator and/or aileron failiure, and this despite there was no visible damage on my plane.

When meeting a 109 a p47's only chance is to try to bounce and then flee after its pass on the 109, wich is faster and does everything else better, and have better armament.
In a p47 I must rely on my teammates to shoot away the bandit on my tail.

The thing with p47 is that in a dive it can gather speed so the 109 closen only slowly. Many 109's give up their chase before a minute or so in my experience.

Remember to record tracks so u can examine the fight later.

Snyde-Dastardly
10-02-2006, 05:38 AM
shoot at it all day,,,just watch out for his wing man!!! 8 50s will do you in every time! Good luck and
CARPE VITA!!

JtD
10-02-2006, 05:56 AM
The other day I had already seen a lot of action in my 109G-6 and had expended all 20mm ammo except for three rounds. I found a P-47 and figured it would be a tough fight with only the MG131 left. I decided to empty the cannon first, before switching to the MG. So I got to it's six (or so), fired my three rounds, hit the cockpit and the P-47 went down.

PBNA-Boosher
10-02-2006, 07:05 AM
Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
It always seemed to catch my 190A9 with no problems in my usual 'escape dive' (shallowish dive from 2000-3000m. Perhaps thats why, because it was diving.

I will now know to keep him on the level rather than dive so hard.

Thanks!

The P-47 will murder you in a dive. Anyone who knowingly dives in an attempt to get out of the way of the 47 is asking to be killed. It's one of the heaviest fighters of the war, it's got a VERY powerful engine, and gravity sucks that thing down like a bucket of bolts on a Sunday! Also adding to your problem, at that high dive speed it still has extreme control over its ailerons, elevators, and rudder.

NEVER dive against or away from a P-47.

TgD Thunderbolt56
10-02-2006, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by PBNA-Boosher:
The P-47 will murder you in a dive. Anyone who knowingly dives in an attempt to get out of the way of the 47 is asking to be killed. It's one of the heaviest fighters of the war, it's got a VERY powerful engine, and gravity sucks that thing down like a bucket of bolts on a Sunday! Also adding to your problem, at that high dive speed it still has extreme control over its ailerons, elevators, and rudder.

NEVER dive against or away from a P-47.

Sage advice Boosher, though in a high speed dive a FW has better sustained roll than a jug...if he doesn't use it, though, he's toast.


TB

BillyTheKid_22
10-02-2006, 11:21 AM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
Usually looking at it really hard works wonders. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Haigotron
10-02-2006, 12:08 PM
Call it names or taunt :

"you call those Jugs? those are A-cups"....that can really turn the tide of the battle...


About diving versus a P47...wouldnt its heavier weight make it outdive you? In the sense that, if he's heavier, and im in a lighter plane (let's say a zero) and we both dive, wont he dive down faster than me, pass me and when he tries to come back up, I have already pulled out of my dive and gained a heigh advantage?

Or im looking at this wrong...i havent played much with the 47, i assume if it can dive well, it has good elevator response? and can easily follow my zero back up?

Monguse
10-02-2006, 03:37 PM
nuclear,


Here is a screen of one of my encounters in a 52nd FG P51D against a MC-205 series III at 32,000 feet
flown by a TUSA/TX-Gunslinger.
http://www.warwingsart.com/historia/Historia-15thAF-00.jpg

Xiolablu3
10-02-2006, 04:17 PM
Originally posted by PBNA-Boosher:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
It always seemed to catch my 190A9 with no problems in my usual 'escape dive' (shallowish dive from 2000-3000m. Perhaps thats why, because it was diving.

I will now know to keep him on the level rather than dive so hard.

Thanks!

The P-47 will murder you in a dive. Anyone who knowingly dives in an attempt to get out of the way of the 47 is asking to be killed. It's one of the heaviest fighters of the war, it's got a VERY powerful engine, and gravity sucks that thing down like a bucket of bolts on a Sunday! Also adding to your problem, at that high dive speed it still has extreme control over its ailerons, elevators, and rudder.

NEVER dive against or away from a P-47. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


You know guys, I have also been impressed with the P47D 'Late's climb rate, its not nearly as bad as I had expected. Put the boost on at take off and you are at 3000m in no time at all.

I am discovering its an excellent energy fighter, on a par with the FW190.

Its zoom climb in the game is fantastic. It was a real shock the first time I B&Zed someone from 3000m, hit around 600m and pulled back up. You can zoom almost right back up to 3000m.

I also find its guns incredible if you hit properly. (Make sure you are near convergeance, even being too close will make most of your bullets miss). I also love the Hellcats/Wildcats guns. I am now a firm believer in the power of hte 50 cals in game. Its just on the 'wobbly' P51 which make the 50's seem underpowered, becasue so many of your bullets miss and you cant get a good concentrreaion of fire in one spot in the Mustang. Hope the instability gets tamed a bit next patch

Mysticpuma2003
10-02-2006, 05:08 PM
To shoot a Jug down do this:

Aim at the tail, the elevators fall off along with the rudder. Keep firing and the plane splits in two.

Don't bother shooting at the wings, the tail end, just behind the cockpit, will just fall off after a couple of hits, much quicker than the wing.

If the tail doesn't fall off, don't worry you'll kill the pilot instead.

Don't worry about being hit by the eight-Fifties. Even though pilots who flew it in WW2 say that a one-second burst would take any plane down, you will rarely see that effect in the game. You'll see lots of 'speckly' debris, and if your really lucky you may get a plane smoking, but it takes about fourteen P-47's to shoot a wing off (exaggeration!).

The fifties are undermodelled (no don't start another fifty whine!), the tail falls off, the pilot dies easily and the elevators and rudders come off easily.

The Jug usedto be formidable, no engine or pilot kills, loads of hits (as it should be) and devestating gunnery.

Obviously it was seen as too realistic, so now we have the 'gameified' version....shame...real shame!

Lament the passing of the best WW2fighter for sheer durability and 'grunt'.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/compsmash.gif

Brain32
10-02-2006, 05:50 PM
Well, well, I never though I will actually read something like this but, hey you learn as long as you live I guess http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
First of all the DM of the P47 is obviously made with that story in minf, of one that returned home with insane number of holes in it.
And whoever can't destroy anything it can meet in the air with 8 .50's obviously doesen't hit at all.
P47 besides being one of my favourite overall and definitively my favourite American plane is one of the best planes currently in game, if you fail to see it, don't blame me, don't blame Oleg, blame yourself because you obviously don't know what to f*ck are you doing.
I'm very happy that Oleg didn't turn "FatLady" into some kind of ridiculous UFO due to whining...

R988z
10-03-2006, 09:19 AM
None of those planes are particularly tough, Il-2s are so easy to shoot down with the 20mm, you dont need that silly mk108. That's like bringing a sledge hammer to a knife fight, you have one crude, difficult to aim swing before you get stabbed to death. To kill Il-2s just aim at the left wing root, hit that with just a short burst and the wing falls right off, easy peasy. You will need to aim though, but since you are using the 20mm that's easy, the Mk108 is so overrated, someone here once described it as like throwing hammers, which is completely wrong as it's nowhere near that accurate. It's good against heavy bombers but fairly useless against most fighters aside from a sneak boom and zoom on an unsuspecting victim.

.50cals are very effective if you get close, REAL close, even the six fifites on the P-40 will easily chop the wing off most fighters with a short burst at (very) close range with a 150m convergence set. The main problem is most people shoot from miles away so the bullets lose a lot of momentum so the odd one that actually does hit doesn't have as much energy and wont do as much damage.

A few times I have been doing ground attack in something tough like a P-47 or Fw-190 and watched as some clown comes up and starts blasting away from 1000m away until all his ammo is gone. Usually I wont even bother with changing course, you can usually just plod along like a sitting duck loaded with bombs and take it. Then captain clown will complain about damage models and undermodelled guns, when the real problem is their premature trigger finger. I never usually fire from further than 300m unless it's to try and scare off an enemy attacking a team mate or a chance burst on someone pulling away. I know from experience how annoying it is to start firing from a distance only to run out of ammo, just as you get a decent firing solution http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif eventually you should learn to hold your fire and conserve ammo. One thing that is slightly unnerving online is when someone gets on your six and doesn't fire immediately, then you know you are dealing with someone who knows what he is doing, psychological advantage to him. If he starts wildly blasting from miles away then all it says is that he is a noob hoping for a lucky shot, psychological advantage to you. The only thing undermodelled there is the pilot brain. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif