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View Full Version : I am so sad: I stink at this game!



terriblysilly
09-22-2007, 04:29 PM
I play and play on Hyperlobby and Quickmission, and I just am no good. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif I never make any kills! I turn and turn, and always my enemy gets behind me and shoots bullets into my aeroplane until it falls to pieces.

If I post a track, maybe you will tell me some things that I do wrong?

bdc_p
09-22-2007, 04:35 PM
go to quick mission builder, and train on empty bombers.
that helped me alot

VW-IceFire
09-22-2007, 04:37 PM
Yep a track with what you're doing might be helpful. I can tell already that your tactics need work...turning and turning and turning will not win you battles. It just makes you a target.

Here's a good place to start:

http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_024a.html

It will walk you through the basic concepts of air combat and specifically the use of the "boom and zoom" method.

DKoor
09-22-2007, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by terriblysilly:
If I post a track, maybe you will tell me some things that I do wrong? Give us the track http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

terriblysilly
09-22-2007, 08:41 PM
Hello! Here is my first set of recorded tracks.

The ones with many 0's are my fight against an AI Veteran!

The one with many 1's is my fight against an AI Ace!

And the remaining one is my fight against an AI Average.

I will try to see if I can make tracks of my online play! If I can do this, I will give them later. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I thank you!


http://rapidshare.com/files/57594152/records.rar.html

terriblysilly
09-22-2007, 09:00 PM
Hello again! Here I fly faster planes, against Ace enemy AI every time!

The results of these battles are more similar to what happens to me when I try to play HyperLobby....

http://rapidshare.com/files/57596340/records2.rar.html

DKoor
09-22-2007, 09:47 PM
I watched your tracks.
Me thinks that you need some further familiarization with the game.
You need to conquer the basics, because I see you have problem with it......and the fact that you've been using I-16 on your training tracks doesn't help much because I-16 is not newcomer friendly plane.
Being prone to violent stalls and all that stuff.

Take my word and use Lavochkin fighters, LA-5 thru 7.
They are great for learning the basics.
Or even Bf-109s, they are also steady although not so great in turning circles with them although maneuverability is good, they are miserable on high/very high speeds (control feels very heavy, thus low ship controlability).
A6M2 with later switch to Ki-84 is also a nice deal.

Anyway. With those you should be able to have historical fighter that is all around good and nice platform for learning stuff.

It doesn't really matters what you choose, I gave you only a suggestion, but if you stick around with same plane (series) you will probably learn faster; mastering the specific type requirements and getting that so much needed "feeling" for the ship.

Check out for instance this track;
http://www.speedyshare.com/522361213.html
........these guys know their ships inside out, look how they fly them to the edge, they are able to do it because they know precisely when to stop pushing the aircraft.
You don't have that feeling so you push your aircraft over it's limits into an inevitable stall.
That is why training on same type will help - to get that feeling faster.
It's easy for us oldtimers, we will do decent job in any crate, sure we wont excel in some crates that we don't usually fly but we can count on doing a good job.

When you master some plane, you know everything about it; deck speed, best alt speed, best turn speed, approx range and flight time with certain amount of fuel, best tactical approach in battle, gunnery (something that needs to be practiced over and over and over again, because that is no.1 important thing to be a great sharpshooter), contemporary aircraft strength and how to counter them best, when to engage and when to run, good discipline when flying in group and so many other things that makes your flight an enjoyable experience.

Waldo.Pepper
09-22-2007, 10:00 PM
Well. I don't think you suck at all.

I do think that your joystick settings suck, and this explains your propensity to stall.

Change your elevator to this...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v516/WaldoPepper/elevator/elevator.jpg

Just try it - I bet you will be surprised after a few days with it.

terriblysilly
09-22-2007, 11:18 PM
Thank you! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I am still trying to get my settings right! They are much too sensitive to small touches!

DKoor, did you see my tracks where I tried to fly P-38 instead o I-16?

I will see if there are settings to help me realize when I will stall. Maybe I can make the "Stall sound" louder.

Thank you!

Ritter_Cuda
09-23-2007, 09:30 AM
come here
http://www.joint-ops.com/joil2fb/default.asp
this is a free flight school they teach you how to basicly fly so you can then play better. hurry the Oct. class my be full and they do it every other month

DKoor
09-23-2007, 10:46 AM
Originally posted by terriblysilly:
DKoor, did you see my tracks where I tried to fly P-38 instead o I-16? Yes mate.

Ki-84 is superior in that kind of fight due to it's speed and agility.
With P-38 you need to concentrate more on attacking your oppo from above on high speed.
Any kind of relatively slow maneuvering on low/mid alt vs Japanese aircraft may end badly.

Check out my track (http://www.esnips.com/nsdoc/edce8046-80a2-4a49-8920-da3427c0b5c0) here, I fought successfully versus 6 Ace Ai Japanese enemies and defeated some of them in a P-51D. I managed to did that because I flew on high alt and on full speed whenever I could, I simply picked them up. It's almost one hour of fight on that track.

Your error on your P-38 track was to choose underwing .50cal gondollas. You shouldn't do that in fighter vs fighter combat because your Lightning becomes very sluggish in maneuver. They create more drag and thus your speed is lower which is a very bad thing.
Good decision was to climb above enemy fighter that will always put you in advantage position!

Your P-38 flying there was indeed good, but Ki-84 maneuverability and your decision to take underwing MGs have put you in a very bad position. Another words there wasn't much you can do in such equal fight.

You can also check more tracks from our community members, to see how they deal in player vs Ai combat. And learn a trick or two from some online moves.

You should accept Cuda's invitation for aviation class.

All that in combination with little offline dedication to practice will make you a really good player in no time!

terriblysilly
09-23-2007, 03:12 PM
It is strange that people say my flying is good!

I never touch trim, or mixture, or use hat-switch/mouselook. I just followed the arrow the whole time. Surely to fight is more complicated than this? I am surprised that I should be called "good"...but thank you anyway! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Ok, I will look into these options you have suggested, and when I next play online I will attempt to make a track.

Waldo.Pepper
09-23-2007, 10:56 PM
Surely to fight is more complicated than this?

Real life is far more complicated than this. And you too can make it more complicated for yourself by changing your difficulty settings to some that are more demanding than you currently fly with.

Some would scoff at your difficulty selection, but it is your game fly it the way you like.

I tempered my comments to match your settings. For your settings you are better than you give yourself credit for.

If you did select harder settings I am sure you would find yourself ever more challenged than you are now.

That is after all the point.

LEXX_Luthor
09-24-2007, 12:40 AM
He/She has alot of courage starting out in I-16. Bravo for independent thinking! My first playing the game was I-153 and that was before I had a joystick.

TS, I-16 has no trim. hehe, I didn't know you were kinda new to this stuff in the latest Trim thread.

I-16 is more a BnZ, or high speed slash attack plane, in the 1930s at least when it was designed. If you like turning, try I-153 or other biplanes. They are alot of fun.

son-in-law
09-24-2007, 03:59 AM
I really recommend Flight School at Joint Ops.

I also had the same problems that you mention, but after I had taken the Joint Ops flightschool I am a better aviator now http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

terriblysilly
09-24-2007, 04:21 AM
My problem with the Joint Ops is that their website does not seem to say what times I must be available. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif If I knew this, I would apply, but I do not want to take a slot if the times would not work for me!

Ok, I will make my difficulty settings higher! I leave on things like icons, etc., because I do not have TrackIR. But I will see what others I can change. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Yes, I like the turning planes! I thought the I-16 was one! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_redface.gif That's why I picked it! I thought it was like the I-153, but just improved, hence a higher number. See how dumb I am? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I would love to have more turning combat, but so far I do not find a server on Hyperlobby with much of this. Most of the time everyone is picking BF-109, FW190, etc. I once found a "WWI server" with special skins, but everytime I go there, nobody else will join and I fly alone. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

I am used to flying games such as Red Baron and Crimson Skies, so when I get into a fight what I think immediately is to turn, slow down to turn tighter, and then flip at an angle to try to put myself behind them. When I try to read about strategies for IL2, and see these diagrams of manoeuvres that are quite different, I feel very confused! I do not understand how to tell when they are appropriate, and I do not perform them smoothly yet.

Ok, thank you again! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Mercwolf2
09-24-2007, 08:22 AM
Hi

Joint ops you must be available for a 2 1/2 week session Monday Wednesday and Friday classes from 8:00pm est to 11:00 pm est or 8:00pm to 11:00pm England time. Here is a link if you want to inquire.

http://www.joint-ops.com/index.htm

buzzsaw1939
09-24-2007, 08:44 AM
I sense you are trying to hard to compare your self to others in this sim, I think you need to learn the basics of flight, and practice, and then practice some more, I suggest you set up a quick mission with just your self in a plane of your choice, and fly tell you feel good about it, being an old flight instructor, I think your jumping in too deep, like hyperlobby! once you get the hang of it, you will love this sim! that Joint ops flight school sounds good, hope you can get in!

Skunk_438RCAF
09-24-2007, 11:47 AM
If there is one thing I can pitch in here, its that while you're not that bad, you seem too eager to get a kill.

Your problem is that you dont take the time to line up your shots carefully. In other words, you spray and pray.

As for flying ability, anyone who can handle an I-16 you do surely shouldnt have any trouble with the more modern aircraft in this sim. Just be gentle on your controls, watch out for the hamfisting.

Lurch1962
09-24-2007, 04:55 PM
I just followed the arrow the whole time.

That's not always the best tactic. If your plane is a better turner AND keeps some speed advantage over your enemy while turning, this does generally work. But with more than one bandit to deal with, the other(s) can nail you while you're trying to bring one into your sights.

Do you use the external padlock at all? It can be a handy aid to learning how to dogfight. Yes, it does give an "unfair" situational awareness (S.A.) advantage, but if you otherwise can't see the bandit from the cockpit this'll help until your S.A. improves. But of course this will work only if you have a good feel for flight control (Waldo's earlier recommended elevator sensitivity profile is VERY worthwhile to try!)

Just keep at it... you'll get there.

--Lurch--

LEXX_Luthor
09-24-2007, 05:54 PM
Terribly::
I would love to have more turning combat, but so far I do not find a server on Hyperlobby with much of this. Most of the time everyone is picking BF-109, FW190, etc.
There are some Biplane servers, presumably with associated early monoplanes, or there were. Its said that those are the most fun, and have the best people (not the "everyone" crowd).

Or, try flying Japanese turning planes. Zero is "okay" I guess. Ki-43 and Ki-27 should be what you want most if you are currently (see below) militantly fundamentalist about turning.

Prediction: We all grow from our starting points. One day, you will be master high speed slash attack player when you yourself see and feel the power that speed gives over turning.

Yes -- I-16 in a Biplane environment is 100% high speed slash attack fighter. The Soviet Air Force doctrine of the 1930s called for "slow" biplanes and "fast" monoplanes. Thus, the I-15, I-152, I-153 biplane series, and the faster I-16 monoplane series.

mortoma
09-25-2007, 06:48 PM
Better to start out flying against the AI, then as you build skill controling your plane and getting it to do what you want, you can gradually go to online flying. AI is easier to fight against, but not always easy at first!! Until you learn the secrets.

Also practice flying your planes by yourself without enemy around, doing aerobatics like loops, rolls, Spit-Ss and the like. Practice doing tight turns until you stall so you learn how to judge the onset of stalls. Practice stalling out level and level in a climb. Practice turning and manuevering without losing too much energy or speed. Practice slow flight at the edge of a stall. Practice going as fast as you can and trimming out your plane to fly level. Practice flying very low without touching the ground. Practice climbing to high altitude and how to climb as the best speed for climbing. Practice diving and trying not to overspeed. Practice landing, taking off and flying in formation with AI, because that builds discipline. I just don't think starting out against human pilots online is the way to go until you get the basics down pat.

Once you have gotten better at all that then practice against armed and unarmed enemy AI. You will see results after a while and then you can start transitioning to online. I only fly online once and a great while, but when I do I do pretty well because of many years of practice.

The best fighter pilots had to go to flight school, everybody starts out as a newcomer, not as an ace.