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Flame_Out
04-26-2004, 04:07 PM
Just wondering how important these kill points are to my fellow pilots. Personally I dont see the point.(no pun intended) Does earning points give you some chest beating rights somehow?

Last night I was shot down counless times and to tell you the truth I cant remember who did it and dont see the point in remembering who did it. At this point I judge myself by just how long I can stay alive in a DF server, not by how many kills I get.

Im interested in your opinions.

http://img56.photobucket.com/albums/v172/Flame_Out/planes2.jpg

Flame_Out
04-26-2004, 04:07 PM
Just wondering how important these kill points are to my fellow pilots. Personally I dont see the point.(no pun intended) Does earning points give you some chest beating rights somehow?

Last night I was shot down counless times and to tell you the truth I cant remember who did it and dont see the point in remembering who did it. At this point I judge myself by just how long I can stay alive in a DF server, not by how many kills I get.

Im interested in your opinions.

http://img56.photobucket.com/albums/v172/Flame_Out/planes2.jpg

BpGemini
04-26-2004, 04:11 PM
I judge myself by how many kills I get per death.

With that said, no I don't feel the need to ***** all the kills or points since part of the above statement has a lot to do with staying alive.

http://www.blitzpigs.com/images/P-39_BlitzPig_Sig_01.jpg
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carguy_
04-26-2004, 04:26 PM
Points aren`t really important in VOW/VEF.
We get only 10 points per kill - very low.

Fly 10 missions ,without a single kill, in which you landed safely and lived.Then in the next one damage the guy that he`s going down and observe the other guy take the kill with one MG burst.

http://carguy.w.interia.pl/tracki/sig23d.jpg

Eagle_361st
04-26-2004, 04:32 PM
I don't really care about points myself. I care more about objectives accomplished and returning to base. I will often break off of a human piloted enemy aircraft after severely damaging him to RTB. But I would be lying if I said I am not happy to see after a successful mission I have some poits too. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif But I don't base my whole mission around getting points, if I get some cool, if not no biggie either. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

~S!
Eagle
Commanding Officer 361st vFG
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http://home.comcast.net/~smconlon/wsb/media/245357/site1079.jpg

crazyivan1970
04-26-2004, 04:33 PM
The only thing that matters to me... is staying alive... points mean nothing, most of the times http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
Regards,

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georgeo76
04-26-2004, 04:33 PM
Everyone is going to tell you how unimportant points are, but anyone who plays online knows better.

Me, I really like points, they are important to me. it's about prestige, it's about competitiveness. It makes me feel good if I've got the highest score on the server http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

______________________
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Snow_Wolf_
04-26-2004, 05:01 PM
Points not that important to me. I find getting the job down more important then points

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"Master of Speed without getting a Ticket"

arcadeace
04-26-2004, 05:11 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by georgeo76:
Everyone is going to tell you how unimportant points are, but anyone who plays online knows better.

Me, I really like points, they are important to me. it's about prestige, it's about competitiveness. It makes me feel good if I've got the highest score on the server http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Even though I'm offline I know it would have some motivation if I was flying against others. With my judgment of human nature kudos to your honesty.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/222_1082457373_222_1082441075_airaces.jpg

WUAF_Badsight
04-26-2004, 05:17 PM
points are everything to people who think they are good

most call them ego players

they also get furious at kill stealing

& everyone had better agree that they are good or WATCH OUT !

rcorporon
04-26-2004, 05:18 PM
If I can get up, get off a few shots, and land safely I consider myself to be way ahead!

In the time that I've been online (since the original IL2), I've only pressed 'S' once or twice.

Ronnie

Chuck_Older
04-26-2004, 05:19 PM
I used to play an online racing game a lot (not GPL, I am not good enough http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif ) but in this racing game, I was really good for about a year. I placed highly on some of the weekly races, which was difficult. I had a very good rep as a help to new players, a Club leader, and as a competetive racer who could be difficult to race against even though I raced 'clean' and didn't bump folks out. I could win in anything even if my online car was out of it's class, because in multiplayer racing, staying out of trouble is as least as important as quick lap times and going fast. I also lost with class, and put to shame a few players who talked trash and challenged me, which was immensely fun (MCO vets, Reno says, "Heya")

When I could not post on the leaderboard anymore, I was initially very p!ssed.

Then I remembered I played the game to have FUN, not to be a legendary online Username, and suddenly, I had fun again.

Sure I would LIKE and TRY to be the best. If you don't want that, why do you pretend to be a fighter pilot? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif But when I'm not the best, I remember that my name is really Chris, not Chuck, and I really am NOT the best, although sometimes I fool myself into thinking I am

*****************************
The hillsides ring with, "Free the People",
Or can I hear the echoes from the days of '39?
~ Clash

diabloblanco1
04-26-2004, 05:48 PM
Strange how someone who claims to fly "full fake real", insults other players as n00bs and arcaders then claims how important points are. Some of you guys are simply pathetic. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif

The Devil made me do it!

KGr.HH-Sunburst
04-26-2004, 05:56 PM
IMO the scoring system is all wrong and those stupid points shouldnt even be there,besides the scoring system screws up sometimes
i.e when you get 4 kills and land safetly on the base without damage and NOT recieving your points. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/35.gif

i would rather see a system that just keeps track of kills/Deaths ore just team points/total kills

http://www.freewebs.com/fightingpumas/

maxim26
04-26-2004, 05:57 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
The only thing that matters to me... is staying alive... points mean nothing, most of the times http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You mean that only thing that matters is not to get points yourself but not to let other guy to get pointshttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

GK.
04-26-2004, 07:43 PM
I would rather see kills and points, not just points. I dont care about points but it is nice to know how many victories you have accumulated.

http://data.photodump.com/gk/shidensig.jpg
*Proud Chute Shooter*
"Nobody Steals my kill..and lives."
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nickdanger3
04-26-2004, 08:01 PM
I like to check on my points to keep track of how often I've gotten a kill and RTB'd successfully. Plus it's useful to find out who on the other side you need to be very careful with.

Like it or not, the scoring system, as much as we all complain about it, does give people a rough idea of who is doing the killing and who is doing the dying.

So, are points important to me? Yes. Will I employ KS method #5 to enhance my score?

See: http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=23110283&m=214100673

Not a chance.

tttiger
04-26-2004, 08:31 PM
Score ladders are the main reason I quit WarBirds/Dawn of Aces after three years. The score-whoring got very tiresome.

It's a system that rewards players who fly the most, not the best players. I was the top ace in Dawn of Aces in one tour of duty (three weeks) simply because I flew more missions and got more kills than anyone else. I guarantee you I was far from the best pilot in that sim. Far from it. I just flew more than anyone else during that tour.

The problem was that none of it was realstic. They were like huge DF arenas. Endless, mindless (and fun http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif) furballing but no sense of mission or purpose.

That said, there also were scoring systems in WB (all third party) that kept track of other stats: Kill/Death, percentage of rounds fired that hit targets, Kills/Mission, etc. I would like to see that in IL-2/FB/AEP.

I have nothing against pilots who are motivated by scores. It just got old to me after a long time and I started looking for something more challenging. I found it in realistic missions. For me, in IL-2, that means Coops. (I disagree with the post stating scores aren't important in VOW/VEF; scores are EVERYTHING in those two virtual wars, which is why I don't fly them any more, either. The lack of cooperation and the emphasis on kills takes away any feeling of realistic combat IMHO. But I'm not arguing they should be taken away from the many people who enjoy them).

I've said this several times before but it bears repeating in this thread: At the end of a weekend of flying Coops, I have no idea how many missions I've flown, how many kills I made, or how many times I was killed. All I know is I had fun flying historically correct missions.

The numbers don't matter. It's about the simulation, not the game.

ttt

"I want the one that kills the best with the least amount of risk to me"

-- Chuck Yeager describing "The Best Airplane."

IV|JG51Flatspin
04-26-2004, 09:11 PM
Inasmuch as points represent an achieved goal...yeah, I guess they're important. But you could drop a couple zeros off the end and it wouldn't bother me a bit! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

S!
Flame resistant since 1988
=Elite=Flatspin
XO
The Wings of Freedom (http://www.elitepx.com)

Bearcat99
04-26-2004, 09:17 PM
To me in DF servers not at all.. in coops.. I like to see big numbers next to my name but if I dont I dont loose sleep. I's rather see all my teammates land and line up on the tarmac at the end of the mission for that group shot.... but thats me.

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AB_Mormac
04-26-2004, 09:24 PM
I Fly for a hour get 10 points,who cares,I had a great time,that is what counts in this GAME.

TAGERT.
04-26-2004, 09:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Flame_Out:
Just wondering how important these kill points are to my fellow pilots.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
To some it is everything... To others it is nothing.

In general the one's who care are the types that enjoy DF servers where you base is so close to the enmy that you can see the dust as he takes off... Where you no sooner get off the ground and your in a 10+ TnB furball... Where you and your enemy are both flying the same plane... ie the Quake crowd...

Where as the others are more interested in simulating real war combat in real war matches ups and making use of real war tatics...

Are there exceptions to that rule? sure.. allways exceptions.. but all they real do is prove the rule.

http://www.geocities.com/grantsenn/kickme.jpg
TAGERT

BpGemini
04-27-2004, 10:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TAGERT.:
In general the one's who care are the types that enjoy DF servers where you base is so close to the enmy that you can see the dust as he takes off... Where you no sooner get off the ground and your in a 10+ TnB furball... Where you and your enemy are both flying the same plane... ie the Quake crowd...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Not true. The Quake crowd is the Cockpit off, externals, unlimited ammo "my kill, my kill" crowd. I belong to the "grip with reality" crowd.

I don't care if I'm in a co-op, large DF map or small DF map. I don't want my teammate shooting over my shoulder. It's poor tactics. You can't tell me that in real life pilots would throw lead right over the shoulder of their buddies. They would use communication to jockey position. You have to remember this is a game. It's a good simulation, but it's still a game. The real life politics and strategies work differently in the game. In the game if your buddy is engaged with a bandit you should CAP his fight make sure he doesn't need help and keep an eye out for the next wave of bandits. You shouldn't be stooging to get position on the same target he's already on while 3 unchecked bandits drop on both of you and clean up. It's bad tactics.

Steal killing on the miniscule levels add up to poor team tactics and yes there are several of us who care about good tactics.

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Franzen
04-27-2004, 10:12 AM
My father told me it's not polite to point. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif

But I'm all growed up now! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif

Fritz Franzen

Diablo310th
04-27-2004, 10:23 AM
Points don't really mean anything to me either. Our squad only recognizes kills not points and only if you RTB. I try to complete the mission ..get a kill or 2 and rtb. I really like flying scripted servers or coops with groundpounding involved. Even tho I usually fly cover I enjoy dropping a few rockets and bombs on the objective or enemy base at times too.

http://img54.photobucket.com/albums/v166/310thDiablo/Diablos20Sig.jpg

Dmitri9mm
04-27-2004, 10:27 AM
I allways try to hit exactly 666 points, and I have succeeded one or two times. Unfortunately it didn't summon the Dark Lord http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

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BaldieJr
04-27-2004, 11:11 AM
Points are dumb. Sensible flying with a P-38 will net you tons of points when vulching.

I scored 1100 points during one sortie by staying high and watching the enemy field for maximum target count. Since I wiped out the entire blue side in one run I had plenty of time to climb back to altitude before heading home while they scrambled to get airborne.

1100 points is hardly a testament to pilot skill.

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
______ _____
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+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
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|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

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Xnomad
04-27-2004, 11:34 AM
Erich Hartmann was a terrible points ***** in "Blonde Knight of Germany" it was stated that he didn't notify other people that he discovered an enemy base and kept that info to himself. I too am a points ***** but with me it's a game and I'm not that bad. I can't understand why he did that, many troops may have been killed by planes flying from this base.

http://www.xnomad.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/sig.jpg

BpGemini
04-27-2004, 12:08 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BaldieJr:
Points are dumb. Sensible flying with a P-38 will net you tons of points when vulching.

I scored 1100 points during one sortie by staying high and watching the enemy field for maximum target count. Since I wiped out the entire blue side in one run I had plenty of time to climb back to altitude before heading home while they scrambled to get airborne.

1100 points is hardly a testament to pilot skill.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Le'me tug the line a little.

You know vulching doesn't take a lick of skill so your 1100 was more like 11 points when vulched for. Now taking down 11 fighters and returning home without being killed to get 1100 would be something.

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BSS_Goat
04-27-2004, 12:16 PM
AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHEEEEEEELLLLLL WHATS YOUR FREAKIN POINT!!

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif*ahem* sorry lost it

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that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it
--George Bernard Shaw

geetarman
04-27-2004, 12:23 PM
Although I'd be lying if I said I don't like racking up a ton of points online, but, I'm more proud of overall performance in the game.

I like to feel that I out-flew and out-gunned an enemy. I fly a P-38. It feels good to go down to where the low-alt. fighters are (planes designed to fight there), take some down and then fly home.

diabloblanco1
04-27-2004, 03:36 PM
Wow, this is really interesting. The single most unrealistic part of this sim has to be online dogfights. Regardless of the planeset, difficulty settings, yes that means you "full fake real" people too.

Online dogfights are so unrealistic because of the nature of the setting. You did not have any Me-109's spending 30-45 minutes over British airfields vulching. Why? Because at best their fuel allowed them 15 mins max over the target and a fair amount hit the drink trying to make it back across the channel because of low fuel. How about all those wonderful 1v1 matchups with Fw-190's and Yaks, never happened that way.

The encounters in dogfight servers are nothing more that a FPS frag fest in the air. There is nothing realistic about that, nothing. It is fun though. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif

Oh btw, the way to solve the problem with point *****s and point braggarts is to make it so you lose ALL of your points if you are shot down or crash due to damage from another player. You would see real covering tactics and less point braggarts. This would make things loads more realistic in DF server overnight. The real chance of losing ALL of your hard earned points would cause a more cautious and realistic approach to fighting in the air. Afterall, the men that really flew "full real" risked their LIVES in EVERY air encounter. Something to ponder for ya. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

The Devil made me do it!

BpGemini
04-27-2004, 03:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by diabloblanco1:
Wow, this is really interesting. The single most unrealistic part of this sim has to be online dogfights. Regardless of the planeset, difficulty settings, yes that means you "full fake real" people too.

Online dogfights are so unrealistic because of the nature of the setting. You did not have any Me-109's spending 30-45 minutes over British airfields vulching. Why? Because at best their fuel allowed them 15 mins max over the target and a fair amount hit the drink trying to make it back across the channel because of low fuel. How about all those wonderful 1v1 matchups with Fw-190's and Yaks, never happened that way.

The encounters in dogfight servers are nothing more that a FPS frag fest in the air. There is nothing realistic about that, nothing. It is fun though. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif

Oh btw, the way to solve the problem with point *****s and point braggarts is to make it so you lose ALL of your points if you are shot down or crash due to damage from another player. You would see real covering tactics and less point braggarts. This would make things loads more realistic in DF server overnight. The real chance of losing ALL of your hard earned points would cause a more cautious and realistic approach to fighting in the air. Afterall, the men that really flew "full real" risked their LIVES in EVERY air encounter. Something to ponder for ya. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

The Devil made me do it!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Or people could just take initiative and start using team tactics that work on a simulation level.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.blitzpigs.com/images/P-39_BlitzPig_Sig_01.jpg
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Scragbat
04-27-2004, 04:29 PM
Did World War II pilots have a scoring system?
I'm not sure if they did.
I can't imagine one pilot saying to another at the end of a sortie. 'Nice 30 points there old bean! You'd have got 270 more if you hadn't lost that bird'.
It would be more like 'Splendid tally there old chap! 3 Kills but a shame you lost your aircraft'

Playing without points would be pointless (this thread is just full of puns!).
Points are important, no question.

A scoring system would certainly be better represented as a tally of kills and aircraft losses though.

Pressing 'S' would have more meaning then in my humblest opinion.

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diabloblanco1
04-27-2004, 05:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by diabloblanco1:
Wow, this is really interesting. The single most unrealistic part of this sim has to be online dogfights. Regardless of the planeset, difficulty settings, yes that means you "full fake real" people too.

Online dogfights are so unrealistic because of the nature of the setting. You did not have any Me-109's spending 30-45 minutes over British airfields vulching. Why? Because at best their fuel allowed them 15 mins max over the target and a fair amount hit the drink trying to make it back across the channel because of low fuel. How about all those wonderful 1v1 matchups with Fw-190's and Yaks, never happened that way.

The encounters in dogfight servers are nothing more that a FPS frag fest in the air. There is nothing realistic about that, nothing. It is fun though. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif

Oh btw, the way to solve the problem with point *****s and point braggarts is to make it so you lose ALL of your points if you are shot down or crash due to damage from another player. You would see real covering tactics and less point braggarts. This would make things loads more realistic in DF server overnight. The real chance of losing ALL of your hard earned points would cause a more cautious and realistic approach to fighting in the air. Afterall, the men that really flew "full real" risked their LIVES in EVERY air encounter. Something to ponder for ya. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

The Devil made me do it!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Or people could just take initiative and start using team tactics that work on a simulation level.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.blitzpigs.com/images/P-39_BlitzPig_Sig_01.jpg
_http://www.acompletewasteofspace.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=25_
IL-2 original P-39 vet soon to be P-63 vet.
_http://blitzpigs.com/_<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

We can all dream, I just prefer not to do it out loud http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

The Devil made me do it!

TAGERT.
04-27-2004, 09:29 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
Not true.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>TRUE! Read it again.. I think you missunderstood what I said.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
The Quake crowd is the Cockpit off, externals, unlimited ammo "my kill, my kill" crowd.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Agreed 100%

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
I belong to the "grip with reality" crowd.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Ill take your word for it.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
I don't care if I'm in a co-op, large DF map or small DF map. I don't want my teammate shooting over my shoulder. It's poor tactics.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Never said it was good tatics

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
You can't tell me that in real life pilots would throw lead right over the shoulder of their buddies.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Agreed 100%.. I wouldnt tell you that.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
They would use communication to jockey position.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Sometimes yes.. Sometimes no.. Kind of like zone or man on man... communication was not necessary... in that the leader and wing man had spicific rolls... in general.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
You have to remember this is a game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>As do you

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
It's a good simulation, but it's still a game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Depends on your definition of simulatin and game and where you personally draw the line

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
The real life politics and strategies work differently in the game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>As does the fear of death

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
In the game if your buddy is engaged with a bandit you should CAP his fight make sure he doesn't need help and keep an eye out for the next wave of bandits.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>For SOME situations that is true.. but NOT all.. What you described was the general rule for the likes of the 8th escorts... where there exceptions? Sure.. but does not change the fact that the rule was that.. But what you described is/was wrong for the likes of F4F pilots in the pacific.. The thatch weave required an active roll of both the lead and the wingman

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
You shouldn't be _stooging_ to get position on the same target he's already on while 3 unchecked bandits drop on both of you and clean up.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Never said you should

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
It's bad tactics.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Agreed 100%

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
Steal killing on the miniscule levels add up to poor team tactics and yes there are several of us who care about good tactics.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>As I noted... Which at this point it is clear that you didnt read what I posted.. or read one and responded to another... In that nothing you said addresses anything I said

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TAGERT

WUAF_Badsight
04-27-2004, 11:13 PM
wow Gemini has a view on the topic

me ..... i think that having any kind of point system included into the game was not a good step

offline your kills are recorded at the end of your flight & thats enough , would be cool to have that for online instead of the meaningless points display we have now

online you get players filled with pride worrying about their points ..... its pathetic the way some carry on

Tully__
04-28-2004, 12:10 AM
For me, the priorities are:

Team objectives
Survival
.
.
.
.
Points

Points are nice to have, but achieving team objectives and "living" to brag about it in the pilot's mess are much more satisfying http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

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Salut
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arcadeace
04-28-2004, 01:05 AM
This thread has become one of making points not liking points http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif

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Stalker58
04-28-2004, 03:45 AM
I'm counting only my ammo http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Altitude, speed, manoeuvre and.... CRASH!

ulriktham74
04-28-2004, 03:52 AM
Hmm. I would like to see a system of kills and statistics about the kills, for instance hits/damage/accuracy and if other players were involved.

Would that take a lot of computer processing power and lag up the game, you think? Is it doable?

Hawgdog
04-28-2004, 04:57 AM
Points indicate who is a better pilot by virtue of that alone. OR...who has been ingame the longest.
I like the scipted server type maps.
I'd like to see those scripted server maps do away completely with points, keeping talley ONLY of air kills and ground kills.
That would stop kill steal whining and whoring all together.

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DeerHunterUK
04-28-2004, 05:09 AM
The points system is very important to our Squadron and the Battle of France campaign that we're currently running. Although TBH I'd also like to see a system where you can switch between points and maybe kill tallies (as suggested previously).

No1_Moggy
-----
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Know your enemy and know yourself; in a hundred battles, you will never be defeated.

609IAP_Recon
04-28-2004, 05:17 AM
well, I've always felt that one should be reset to 0 every time they die.

How can a dead man accumulate stats? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Salute!

JG50_Recon

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609IAP_Recon
04-28-2004, 05:20 AM
I'd subtract points for losing an aircraft as well.

Getting captured is a reset to 0.

Bailing in friendly, lose half your points.

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Salute!

JG50_Recon

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Dnmy
04-28-2004, 05:21 AM
Points are important for score*****s.

And score*****s are the ones to complain loudest about so called "killstealing". If they didn't care about points they'd break off from their target as soon as they saw (friendly) tracers firing over their shoulders or someone else attacking the same target.

Don't let the guys complaining about killstealing fool you. They care about their precious points being "stolen" from them. They care because they're scorewhoring.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

--------------------------------

"killstealing only exists in the minds of score*****s"

Bull-Dog.
04-28-2004, 05:53 AM
I use point scores to indicate how good my opponants are, but with so much K/S going on Im not sure that points actually mean anything anymore.

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WOLFMondo
04-28-2004, 06:01 AM
I'd prefer it if most online games that need team work had no personal scores, just a team score. It would make a group of individuals stop caring about themselves and work together to win as a team. I think it would improve the gameplay in any game that needs people to work together.

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BpGemini
04-28-2004, 09:23 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dnmy:
Points are important for score*****s.

And score*****s are the ones to complain loudest about so called "killstealing". If they didn't care about points they'd break off from their target as soon as they saw (friendly) tracers firing over their shoulders or someone else attacking the same target.

Don't let the guys complaining about killstealing fool you. They care about their precious points being "stolen" from them. They care because they're scorewhoring.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>




Oh yes, let's move out of Dnmy's way when he shoots over our shoulders. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

Don't worry about that unchecked bandit coming in on our position that you wont pick up just because your fixated on the target I already smoked.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif


That must make me the point ***** for wondering why your not working with the team.



Dnmy = Point ***** extraordinaire and clueless to team tactics

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Dnmy
04-28-2004, 09:54 AM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Hehe i knew the Gemini score***** would reply. He must have felt adressed http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I'd never fire over anybody elses shoulder. But rest assured, everybody who's firing over my shoulders can have my target. I'll gladly break off and find myself a next one, instead of whining about killstealing.

Whining about killstealing is what score*****s like Gemini do under the pretense of teamplay.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif

--------------------------------

"killstealing only exists in the minds of score*****s"

BpGemini
04-28-2004, 09:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TAGERT.:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
Not true.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>TRUE! Read it again.. I think you missunderstood what I said.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
The Quake crowd is the Cockpit off, externals, unlimited ammo "my kill, my kill" crowd.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Agreed 100%

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
I belong to the "grip with reality" crowd.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Ill take your word for it.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
I don't care if I'm in a co-op, large DF map or small DF map. I don't want my teammate shooting over my shoulder. It's poor tactics.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Never said it was good tatics

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
You can't tell me that in real life pilots would throw lead right over the shoulder of their buddies.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Agreed 100%.. I wouldnt tell you that.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
They would use communication to jockey position.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Sometimes yes.. Sometimes no.. Kind of like zone or man on man... communication was not necessary... in that the leader and wing man had spicific rolls... in general.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
You have to remember this is a game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>As do you

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
It's a good simulation, but it's still a game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Depends on your definition of simulatin and game and where you personally draw the line

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
The real life politics and strategies work differently in the game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>As does the fear of death

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
In the game if your buddy is engaged with a bandit you should CAP his fight make sure he doesn't need help and keep an eye out for the next wave of bandits.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>For SOME situations that is true.. but NOT all.. What you described was the general rule for the likes of the 8th escorts... where there exceptions? Sure.. but does not change the fact that the rule was that.. But what you described is/was wrong for the likes of F4F pilots in the pacific.. The thatch weave required an active roll of both the lead and the wingman

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
You shouldn't be _stooging_ to get position on the same target he's already on while 3 unchecked bandits drop on both of you and clean up.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Never said you should

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
It's bad tactics.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Agreed 100%

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
Steal killing on the miniscule levels add up to poor team tactics and yes there are several of us who care about good tactics.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>As I noted... Which at this point it is clear that you didnt read what I posted.. or read one and responded to another... In that nothing you said addresses anything I said
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I think there was a misunderstanding on both sides Target. My statement directed at you was that the DF crowd isn't always a Quake crowd.

The rest of my post was my general opinion, not really directed at anyone.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

One point I was making in general you touched on, you mentioned the F4F pilots using thatch weave. That's my point about remembering it's a game. It's nice to know these RL tactics used in WWII but in the game they are not as practical.

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Deathreaper666
04-28-2004, 10:14 AM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gifWell now, why don't we all just pull our pants down, take it out and get out the trusty old ruler then. Oh this isn't that kind of a contest, excuse me I'm sorry. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif Leaving now. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif

--------------
Death is certain, look forward to it.
--------------

BpGemini
04-28-2004, 10:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dnmy:
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Hehe i knew the Gemini score***** would reply. He must have felt adressed http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I'd never fire over anybody elses shoulder. But rest assured, everybody who's firing over my shoulders can have my target. I'll gladly break off and find myself a next one, instead of whining about killstealing.

Whining about killstealing is what score*****s like Gemini do under the pretense of teamplay.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Nice try twinkles.

You're the same guy that passes the nimrod on the interstate blocking the passing lane on the right instead of running him over and then wonders why the passing lane is always clogged or doesn't care if it does get clogged.

You encourage a lack of team tactics. Why would you waste your position to let some stooge in place which will only allow you and him get pasted by the unchecked bandits? It's simply because you want people to allow you to do the same and that's Point Whoring period.

But valiant effort I must say. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif

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BpGemini
04-28-2004, 10:18 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Deathreaper666:
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gifWell now, why don't we all just pull our pants down, take it out and get out the trusty old ruler then. Oh this isn't that kind of a contest, excuse me I'm sorry. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif Leaving now. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Sounds good to me but you'll have to get the yard stick for my turn.

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Deathreaper666
04-28-2004, 10:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Deathreaper666:
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gifWell now, why don't we all just pull our pants down, take it out and get out the trusty old ruler then. Oh this isn't that kind of a contest, excuse me I'm sorry. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif Leaving now. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Sounds good to me but you'll have to get the yard stick for my turn.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

--------------
Death is certain, look forward to it.
--------------

Sweetiecakes
04-28-2004, 10:48 AM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif The testosterone levels are high today.

No limpeys please

BpGemini
04-28-2004, 11:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Deathreaper666:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Deathreaper666:
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gifWell now, why don't we all just pull our pants down, take it out and get out the trusty old ruler then. Oh this isn't that kind of a contest, excuse me I'm sorry. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif Leaving now. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Sounds good to me but you'll have to get the yard stick for my turn.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


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HayateKid
04-28-2004, 02:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Deathreaper666:
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gifWell now, why don't we all just pull our pants down, take it out and get out the trusty old ruler then. Oh this isn't that kind of a contest, excuse me I'm sorry. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif Leaving now. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Sounds good to me but you'll have to get the yard stick for my turn.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

nothing to boast about. even babies can piss farther than a yard.


btw, here's a test of how important points to you: imagine if there were no point scores in FB, how would that change the way YOU play. don't speculate how it would change others, just answer how it would change you.

the degree to which your behavior in online dogfights would change when there are no points is proportional to how important points are to you right now.

"First learn stand, then learn fly. Nature rule, Daniel San, not mine." - Mr. Miyagi

BpGemini
04-28-2004, 03:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HayateKid:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Deathreaper666:
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gifWell now, why don't we all just pull our pants down, take it out and get out the trusty old ruler then. Oh this isn't that kind of a contest, excuse me I'm sorry. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif Leaving now. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Sounds good to me but you'll have to get the yard stick for my turn.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

nothing to boast about. even babies can piss farther than a yard.


btw, here's a test of how important points to you: imagine if there were no point scores in FB, how would that change the way YOU play. don't speculate how it would change others, just answer how it would change you.

the degree to which your behavior in online dogfights would change when there are no points is proportional to how important points are to you right now.

"First learn stand, then learn fly. Nature rule, Daniel San, not mine." - Mr. Miyagi<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It wouldn't change the way I play. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Btw, I wasn't talking about a peeing contest. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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Flame_Out
04-28-2004, 06:07 PM
I like the idea of having a MOH type scoring system that gives you more information like the shots fired to shots hit ratio along with the % of diffrent types of damage dished out,being wing, rudder, pilot kill, ect. I read somewhere that there is a third party program out there that does something simmilar. If so does anyone know what the name of it is as I would be interested in it.

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TAGERT.
04-28-2004, 08:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
I think there was a misunderstanding on both sides Target.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Anything is posable

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
My statement directed at you was that the DF crowd isn't always a Quake crowd.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>always? No, not allways.. As I pointed out in my 1st post.. There are exceptions to the rule.. But in general the rule holds

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
The rest of my post was my general opinion, not really directed at anyone.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Ah, good, because it sure didnt seem to pretain to anything I said.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
One point I was making in general you touched on,<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>One of many.. which can make it hard to follow sometimes

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BpGemini:
you mentioned the F4F pilots using thatch weave. That's my point about remembering it's a game. It's nice to know these RL tactics used in WWII but in the game they are not as practical.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Espically true in the DF Quake like servers.. again, proving the rule, which is not to imply that there are not exceptions to the rules

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TAGERT

TAGERT.
04-28-2004, 08:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JG50_Recon:
well, I've always felt that one should be reset to 0 every time they die.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>That is the best idea yet! It would really promote more realistic tatics and a psydo fear of death in the Quake/Point minded folks... Which would in turn elevate the whole atmosphere of the server to a more realistic feeling

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TAGERT