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View Full Version : Will you uninstall PF if no patch were forthcoming?



lkemling
05-12-2005, 05:48 PM

jarink
05-12-2005, 06:01 PM
No. Even without the 'missing content', it just adds too much to the game to consider removing it.

3.JG51_BigBear
05-12-2005, 06:03 PM
I don't think there's any reason to go back to AEP/FB. In my opinion, despite what I consider the half-hearted nature of PF in terms of planes and maps, the game is still better with it in just about every other way.

VW-IceFire
05-12-2005, 06:14 PM
PF still lets me fly on the West and Eastern fronts as well...I'm still having a blast with what we've got.

Building campaigns and the like. DGEN is kind of bland...but its a good way for me to get ideas for new campaigns. A human touch is so much better for SP experience...and MP continues to draw my attention too.

Grunherzjager
05-12-2005, 06:23 PM
No way, I love this game! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Mainly off-line player here.

But be sure that I will not install the upcoming patch if the performance with the new clouds, will be so bad as the people are saying. If so, I will just try to integrate the Kurland/Murmansk maps and campaigns in 3.04.

DRB_Hookech0
05-12-2005, 06:25 PM
I'll fly it as long as my squadies fly it but the debacle that is PF will most likely keep me from buying 1c's BoB unless I see a marked improvement in how the game is marketed and it's completeness at release.

EnGaurde
05-12-2005, 06:32 PM
Now be honest and no flames please

no flames?

uninstall it due to nothing more than the growing hysterical attitude towards the patch suddenly renders the game unplayable???

you idiot.

what a stupid topic. I feel dirty even replying to such a petty, tit for tat idea.

yeah! i'll uninstall it! That'll teach 1C a lesson they'll never forget!

christ almighty where is the factory churning these fools out. Somebody shut it down !!!

I suspect that you need much, much more in your life if this is that important to you.

no patch != the end of the world

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

heywooood
05-12-2005, 06:49 PM
jeez Enguardo.. lighten up...no more caffiend for you my friend....


I think Hookech0 is on track with his sentiments....I think alot of people will regard BoB a little differently than they would have if PF stays as is - and if the rumoured FB russia only patch is not shared...

Not to say I wont buy it- but some will skip it that otherwise would have hunted it down.

Having said that - I really hate it when people that are trusted by 1c as Beta testers - or out and out theives post unauthorized screen shots etc...
on these boards.
That is a HUGE F.U. to 1c and it Blows. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

codeseven7
05-12-2005, 06:58 PM
Originally posted by EnGaurde:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Now be honest and no flames please

no flames?

uninstall it due to nothing more than the growing hysterical attitude towards the patch suddenly renders the game unplayable???

you idiot.

what a stupid topic. I feel dirty even replying to such a petty, tit for tat idea.

yeah! i'll uninstall it! That'll teach 1C a lesson they'll never forget!

christ almighty where is the factory churning these fools out. Somebody shut it down !!!

I suspect that you need much, much more in your life if this is that important to you.

no patch != the end of the world

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Holy ****! This lack of a patch stuff has got some people on edge. Lighten up!

Shakthamac
05-12-2005, 07:02 PM
Originally posted by EnGaurde:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Now be honest and no flames please

no flames?

uninstall it due to nothing more than the growing hysterical attitude towards the patch suddenly renders the game unplayable???

you idiot.

what a stupid topic. I feel dirty even replying to such a petty, tit for tat idea.

yeah! i'll uninstall it! That'll teach 1C a lesson they'll never forget!

christ almighty where is the factory churning these fools out. Somebody shut it down !!!

I suspect that you need much, much more in your life if this is that important to you.

no patch != the end of the world

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ease up on the caffiene there slick. all he did was ask a simple question. you had the option not to respond if you thought it was idiotic. now go play with your legos and let reasonable people discuss this idea.

No I won't uninstall it. it still adds a great dimension to this game.

Atomic_Marten
05-12-2005, 07:09 PM
Originally posted by lkemling:
Now be honest and no flames please, Seeing as Pacific Fighters is at the very best totally incomplete as a pacific theater sim and If no patch is forthcoming would you concider uninstalling Pacific Fighters and reverting to just FB /AEP.

Can I flame you just a little bit: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v442/Atomic_Marten/Smileys/Flamethrow.gif

Voted no, of course. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif.

lkemling
05-12-2005, 07:15 PM
Originally posted by EnGaurde:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Now be honest and no flames please

no flames?

uninstall it due to nothing more than the growing hysterical attitude towards the patch suddenly renders the game unplayable???

you idiot.

what a stupid topic. I feel dirty even replying to such a petty, tit for tat idea.

yeah! i'll uninstall it! That'll teach 1C a lesson they'll never forget!

christ almighty where is the factory churning these fools out. Somebody shut it down !!!

I suspect that you need much, much more in your life if this is that important to you.

no patch != the end of the world

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I won't dignify this with a reply.

SeaFireLIV
05-12-2005, 07:17 PM
I doubt there are many here who would be so petty as to uninstall PF because of no patch 4.0 ... although nothing would surprise me.

The start of this thread does sound like an excuse for a Patch whine by the back door to me.

arcadeace
05-12-2005, 07:21 PM
I enjoyed the original version of FB so what do I know. PF is worth my money, I can easily spend the same going to our local Red Lobster for 1 evening. I wasn't disillusioned I basically knew what I was getting, except for the Betty http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif As far as I'm concerned my principles with this aren't so high as to be a fool in depriving my life of cheap, pleasant enjoyment http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

LEXX_Luthor
05-12-2005, 07:24 PM
The thought has crossed my mind, and actually in a moment of Panic thought I Deleted my last copy of Patch 3.01, but I found it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif If there is no 4.0, then its back to 3.01 just to see nearby Dots against the ground.

I now fly at 1280x960 Perfect and with new monitor hope to fly at 1600x1200 soon. Maybe eventually 2048x1536 -- exactly 4 times the number of on-screen pixels as 1024x768 "Online Dogfight" resolution. I know a few here sim FB/PF at 2048x1536 so I know its possible.

WOLFMondo
05-12-2005, 07:24 PM
Uninstall it because there is no flyable betty? thats the missing promised content, I don't remember anything else being mentioned. Nothing else, the only other thing that is missing that is stated on any packaging is an AI Tempest from AEP. Unless its flyable I don't really want a Tempest, I want to fly ithttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I really hope to see all the patch whiners online in betty's for the coming months when released.

One thing I don't think some of the guys who own PF realise is the British ships that are in PF also served throughout Europe and the Med, the Beaufighter was a real workhorse for the RAF in every theatre till the end of the war and the FAA used the Corsair, Hellcat and Wildcat in Europe as well. The A20 and B25 were used in Europe by the commonwealth forces and VVS. The PF content compliments very much the existing FB+AEP content.

So hell no, I will not uninstal it, I'll continue with the great package that I have.

BTW IBTL:P

GoToAway
05-12-2005, 07:27 PM
I would most definitely get rid of all of that extra content that I paid for as well as a number of aircraft that can also be used in the ETO and eastern fronts just because I'm angsty about a patch.
Yup.
Definitely.
No question about it, because doing something like that makes absolutely perfect sense and is not nonsensical or petty at all.

EnGaurde
05-12-2005, 07:33 PM
I won't dignify this with a reply.

But you just did. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

Perhaps i did get carried away. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Been on edge lately... *eyelid twitch*

Without the agro, what i said, still stands.

Much Ado About Nothing.

If everyone just took a deep breath, forgot about the patch for a while, and enjoyed the immense variety that is a merged install, then silly pointless I Have No Patch But I Must Do Something posts would go away.

*eyelid twitch*

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

Equilizer
05-12-2005, 07:46 PM
Uninstall? No.

But then, I haven't really been playing it since the patch that reduced the stall speeds globally so carrier planes can take off from stationary carriers or from moving carriers with abnormally large loudouts.

So, no 4.0 - I'll probably totally give it up.

4.0 takes more than next week and we get no official information on whats going on, I won't buy BoB.

shinden1974
05-12-2005, 08:05 PM
no.

If anyone bought this game, felt they got taken for a ride and didn't return the game...maybe it's time to think about other important things, like paying your bills, filling out your tax return, getting to work on time and let's hope you don't have any children.

If anyone bought this game from someone without a return policy, your problems may be even worse.

If anyone is really, really mad and feels that uninstalling PF will help your mental health, please do so before you drive the rest of your family insane.

If anyone lives alone and realizes that uninstalling PF will make absolutely no difference to anything in the entire universe, it may be time to jump, who knows maybe your sacrifice will form some crazy sympathy in the hearts of the 1c guys and they'll release the patch incomplete and all. If that happens I'll be sure to copy it onto a CD and bury it with the poor guy.

Bearcat99
05-12-2005, 08:19 PM
Not on your life.... LMAO.. are you INSANE!!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

(sorry man I couldnt help it... just the idea... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif is so http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gifprosterous http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif... to uninstall a sim I fly in everyday, paid good money for (just the sim alone... not to mention all the hardware upgrades over the past 3 years...) all because of a few missing planes and ships and maps.... and it isn't like the planes, maps,objects,FMs,DMs etc that we have are bad or in small quantity....... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Scrapper_511
05-12-2005, 08:20 PM
I will not uninstall it, but I will be hugely disappointed.

Papa_K
05-12-2005, 11:21 PM
Why is it that the world revolves aroung a patch?

The game isn't good enough for you?
It'll be twice the game it is now with some additions and changes?

LuckyBoy1
05-12-2005, 11:47 PM
Originally posted by lkemling:
Now be honest and no flames please, Seeing as Pacific Fighters is at the very best totally incomplete as a pacific theater sim and If no patch is forthcoming would you concider uninstalling Pacific Fighters and reverting to just FB /AEP.

I want some of what this Dude is smoking! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Cworth
05-13-2005, 12:01 AM
Uninstall the game..No way!!

I enjoy this game to much to do that.

Though after buying this game in the state it is in with such a lack of important aircraft,ships etc.
It will impact my decision on whether I buy any more of the games in the series though.They would have to really put out something special to get mne to buy again if they dont release anything more for this game.

masaker2005
05-13-2005, 12:02 AM
My answer is no! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

Finkeren
05-13-2005, 01:52 AM
All this nonsense about the patch not comming. I was one of those who got to see the screens of the leaked patch yesterday, and I must say that a whole lot of work would have gone to waste if the patch was not released.
Don't wory it's comming. That said, I fear that PF might never be what we all want it to be. There are a lot of planes that'll never make it (TBF/M - flyable, TDB-AI, P-61, N1K2, and maybe even the italian planes) and that will disappoint me a lot. Until the message comes, that there will be no more additions to this series, I keep my fingers crossed (wich BTW made it sorta difficult to write this message http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif)

GerritJ9
05-13-2005, 02:11 AM
Uninstall the only theatre that includes the Netherlands??????????? NO WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LuckyBoy1
05-13-2005, 02:13 AM
I just saw a post by CrazyIvan that says PF only sold less than 60,000 copies... so that means most of the guys I play with at HyperLobby are pirating the game!

I'm sitting here looking at the legal copies of Forgotten Battles, ACE and PF and also my next edition of the Users Guide that I've been working on... then to see this sort of patch whining thread just kinda adds to the death of the game. Considering not buying the next add-on?... how 'bout we all buy this one first and stop killing the development of this game? At the rate things are going, between the patch whiners, the pirating and the greedy U.S. corporations holding history hostage by copywrite laws, it surprises me that Oleg bothers to punch us up even a right now patch, much less the right patch or even dreams of whether or not we can choose to buy the next possible add-on.

Frenchminem
05-13-2005, 03:02 AM
i'm used to play some games without buying it, because, usually, most of them are real ****... i'm sorry to say this, because I know some people worked hard on It, and might believed in it...
and, I bought PF+FB+AEP... i've been on my fnac, and Ig got for... wow, more than 100", I'm quite sure, it was huge, but, with my brand new computer, I though It could be nice to got a great game...
and i must say that there's real good things in that game... but i'm really disappointed of the way things are doing now...
patch and addons for Russian, and nothing for others, stupid american lockheed, asking for copyrights... so no US dive bombers...
and the way 1C is heading his efforts...
I don't really think FB graphic engine is out of date... cuz my brand new pc is not so fast on perfect mode, at 1024... (not more than 20-30 fps... with much lower on great action...
i'd prefer the developpers to release a game with better ground effects... then adding 1000 more polygon on planes...
this software was said to answer what players would, and there's even a forum, to say what we'd like... but It looks more and more for me like it's getting unused, regarding all the planes done or boats for PF, made by the community... and always the same answer... "we'll see If we'll put it in the patch..."
did such games opened and modified such EAW (I begin on IT (Hi to all the old users and people who modified It!!))or even Flight simulator are selling so bad, cuz people can do what they want themself for the game they use...
(look Half life, they're carrying on supporting mods developpment, and it remains the best succesfull games!!)
I hope we'll have soon a game like that for WWII simulation soon...
many new things can be done by developpers, letting community make planes, or add datas for ground cities, or such stuff..
BoB II had for example invented the "clickable cockpit"... it looks so normal, why ain't nobody did this before...???
I don't want mlore graphics... i want more of all the small things who made a cold simulation , a game you like to use... even if you 're using full realistic realism...

Art-J
05-13-2005, 03:41 AM
Flaming or not, lightening or not, the fact itself, that this thread ever started shows the "patch-hysteria" reached it's peak http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif. Maybe EnGaurde's replay to initial post was a bit harsh indeed, but I kind of agree with him - some guys are just too crazy about all this "patchy-issue".

No, I will not uninstall it. I am fan of Far East theatre of ops, always was, always will be. European air war is just not my playground. So I'm still happy to see PF as it is. It has serious drawbacks (seen from dedicated Pac-guys point of view), but it's better than nothing! I remember how pleased I was, when we got this Zeke, Frank and "Pacific" MP map for original FB. Small bonus, wasn't it? But so much fun. Compared to that PF still gives much more enjoyment.

And for the future 1C products - I'm not planing to buy BoB, since it will cover the time and area of history I'm totally uninterested in, but I believe It will be a good product, because It's developed only by Maddox team itself. I'll try to explain what I mean.
The PF at the moment is kind of "unwanted child". The work on it was started by 3rd party guys with great enthusiasm, but without proffesional attitude and proper resources (uncoordinated moddelers work ---> wicked planeset, wicked shipset, unmet time deadlines, insufficient maps). Then (Murphy's laws!) something turned wrong and it was "finished" by guys with proffesional attitude and resources (1C team), but without any enthusiasm for it (Oleg initially never intended to include Pacific in the current game). The result - half-finished product, too much to call it an "add-on", not enough to call it "stand-alone-product". They seem to have more trouble with It now than they intended and I guess Oleg wished It all never would happen. I think this is the lesson for 1C - never rely on third party guys If the fate of huge commercial product relies on their work. If Oleg and team holds their intended BoB developement line and don't "step aside" to work on ANY "community-whined" addon, there will be no risk of making another "unwanted child" based on BoB engine. Just prepare this God-d@mned patch and move over to planned BoB developement.

Regards - Art.

aminx
05-13-2005, 03:54 AM
patch or no patch the sim will remain 50% empty and missing all the crucial elements for constructing and reliving the hystorical battles in the pacific.
aminx

Jex_TG
05-13-2005, 05:58 AM
Why would anyone want to remove it? If you've paid for something, and it works, why remove it so you no longer have it - It doesn't get in the way of IL2/fb et al does it? If not then unless you're desperate for disk space I see no reason to get rid of it.

How strange http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Oh and as for Engaurde - I think he was pretty spot on. What a stupid post

LuckyBoy1
05-13-2005, 06:13 AM
Oh, the humanity! Please, we beg you don't uninsta... uh, wait a minute... here, let me compose my thoughts into how much I care what you do with this game....

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

SeaNorris
05-13-2005, 06:25 AM
Originally posted by EnGaurde:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Now be honest and no flames please

you idiot.

yeah! i'll uninstall it! That'll teach 1C a lesson they'll never forget!
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

1. Voted no, I have lots of stuff to do on this game.

2. One person isn't going to teach 1C a lesson http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

SpartanHoplite
05-13-2005, 07:17 AM
No, I wouldn't uninstall it. Just yesterday, I shocked myself by doing an approximation of how many hours I have played this game over the last few years... Yow! I could have written the great American novel, or something!

But that being said, I do find my interest (very) slowly waning. I'm sure I'll never abandon it, but I think I'm mentally prepared to move onto a new "primary" game, if one were to come along that fit the bill.

SH

Slammin_
05-13-2005, 07:38 AM
Originally posted by EnGaurde:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Now be honest and no flames please

no flames?

uninstall it due to nothing more than the growing hysterical attitude towards the patch suddenly renders the game unplayable???

you idiot.

what a stupid topic. I feel dirty even replying to such a petty, tit for tat idea.

yeah! i'll uninstall it! That'll teach 1C a lesson they'll never forget!

christ almighty where is the factory churning these fools out. Somebody shut it down !!!

I suspect that you need much, much more in your life if this is that important to you.

no patch != the end of the world

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



Well said!

Capt._Tenneal
05-13-2005, 08:00 AM
No I won't uninstall PF. Even if there will be no patch coming, too many fan made missions and campaigns for the offliners and servers for the onliners are now running on a merged install of FB+AEP+PF that even if I didn't use it that much, PF will still be essential to play the game.

But, don't get me wrong, I do use PF as much as FB+AEP. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Raptor_20thFG
05-13-2005, 08:11 AM
Originally posted by EnGaurde:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Now be honest and no flames please

no flames?

uninstall it due to nothing more than the growing hysterical attitude towards the patch suddenly renders the game unplayable???

you idiot.

what a stupid topic. I feel dirty even replying to such a petty, tit for tat idea.

yeah! i'll uninstall it! That'll teach 1C a lesson they'll never forget!

christ almighty where is the factory churning these fools out. Somebody shut it down !!!

I suspect that you need much, much more in your life if this is that important to you.

no patch != the end of the world

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Jesus man cut the coffee

DRB_Hookech0
05-13-2005, 08:28 AM
the Betty I could care less about, as I dont fly the Japanese side. I've resigned myself about the ships and the fact we wont get or see anymore of them. It's the lack of useable maps for the south pacific campiagn that is what is really bugging me. 80% of the planeset is tailor made for the Sept 42 thru Aug 44 time frame.

Now if 1c and Oleg are tired of hearing us bi@*h about it, then maybe a SDK for map creation might be in order. Otherwise we have to learn the super secret handshake/counter phrase to "on the team". I'm not saying a full open file structure like the CFS series, that would be a disaster, but give us the ability to fix what 1c is unwilling, or otherwise un-able to do. Othewise our only recourse is to sit here and "whine" and gripe about content that is missing.

I know a lot of people over the past 6 months have been hammering the "Dont worry, Oleg really supports his products with patches all the time" but for us PF players, we are not seeing it. We feel like the red headed bastard step child of the community and see nothing to make us feel any other way.

And yes, how we consumers are treated at this time has reprecussions on our future outlook of things produced by 1C. Sorry but thats the way things go.

Yes I expect to get BBQ'd over this by the fan boys.....oh well.

Flakenstien
05-13-2005, 08:34 AM
No, I won't uninstall it, I don't know where some live but returning open software can't be found in my part of the US [http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif]
I am however exrememly disappointed in what I waited for as far as the PTO is concerned, I bought it to fly the PTO and then ended up having to go out and by FB/AEP in order to play online.
But with that money already spent I see no reason to uninstall what I have been enjoying with my friends. Patch or no patch It is a mute point, they already got thier money so not playing it won't affect them. I am happy with what I have now and if a "super patch" is released than I hope it makes me happier but I'm not going to be dependant on it.

But on the other hand BoB is not a purchase I'm going to make unless 1C/Maddox do something far different in the way it is marketed and sold, I understand that Oleg and Co are at the mercy of UBI and the suits that just think money and how fast they can get it with no concern for the customer, so it really isn't 1C/Maddox Im blaming, it is just the fact that from here on out UBI no longer will proffit from any money that I have, FB/AEP/PF is the last bit of software that I will purchase with the letters UBI anywhere associated with it.

Bottom line, if you really want to see action taken don't waste time posting it here, you hit them where it hurts and that is the bank account, boycott UBI, you already have the best WWII Combat sim on the market, so just enjoy it and never think of buying UBI again, that is how people make a differeance [http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif]

DarthBane_
05-13-2005, 08:41 AM
I will not uninstall PF, neither will 1c see my money ever again. This wait was too much for me, and i wont forget this.

GT182
05-13-2005, 09:01 AM
Uninstall... NO way.

If you can't be patient enough to wait while they do the patch... and do it right... then you can uninstall what you have if you want. But by looking at the numbers of those that voted, I don't think many will uninstall it. They'll wait like the rest for 4.0.

I've also heard that the wait is almost over. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Just hang in there, patience is a virture.

Tater-SW-
05-13-2005, 09:45 AM
I'm sad to say I'm kinda with darthbane. The "3d disk" takes a year to get to us? It has as much to do with not being kept well up to date on what is going on... t's crappy to be asked to be patient for features that were printed on the box, then have all kinds of secrecy. On top of that, hasn't the Betty been finished for ages? At least patching to add the G4M would bring PF up to what the box promised, right? I would've made that a priority just to be on the up and up.

tater

codeseven7
05-13-2005, 10:02 AM
I'm gonna go out on a limb here. Despite, a patch or no patch, 'this sucks, that sucks', 'well, they better do this, they better do that or else!', ect., ect., I'll bet, once Bob arrives, what with all the previous buildup and fanfare, screenshots and hype about it's release, that 99.9% of you (ok,me included) are gonna buy Bob as soon as we can get our sweaty hands on it, guaranteed!

codeseven

crazyivan1970
05-13-2005, 10:54 AM
No, i am not going to uninstall the sim...but i will deffinitely uninstall Internet Explorer in order to not to look at this forum anymore http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

You asked to be honest - i am honest http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

WWSensei
05-13-2005, 11:01 AM
Uninstalling the game because the last patch wasn't delivered would be like cutting out your own tongue after a 10 course gourmet meal because you didn't like the way they folded your napkin.

Qbeesh800
05-13-2005, 11:11 AM
Why would i?Il2 is best *** kickin sim i've ever played

tascaso
05-13-2005, 12:16 PM
CrazyIvan,

I love your comments. The boredom is hitting big in the community HL numbers dwindle and the forum is full of "posters". There is still a lot of flying to do in the current reiteration of the "Finest Sim of All Time" (my op). Patch delay smatch delay I still fly a couple sorties every night offline and online, I am training with a new Squad! Life is good in the FB/AEP/PF universe.

I am over the PTO issues I had ... some meds and therapy helped with that. Let move on 4.0 will be out soon enough and then there is BOB and time to build a new super computer.

Cheers

123_Tony_123VEF

TROOPER117
05-13-2005, 03:44 PM
No!
Not a flippin chance!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

lkemling
05-13-2005, 04:20 PM
Look's like the no's have it 69 to 15....And I never said this series of flight sims by Oleg wasn't the best ever marketed It without a doubt is the finest to date that's why the disappointment, And listening to some here speaking their minds as to purchasing BoB I take it I'm not totally alone as to looking at it with a jaundiced eye.

Cheer's http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gifs

fordfan25
05-13-2005, 04:31 PM
Originally posted by 3.JG51_BigBear:
I don't think there's any reason to go back to AEP/FB. In my opinion, despite what I consider the half-hearted nature of PF in terms of planes and maps, the game is still better with it in just about every other way.

my feelings to

fordfan25
05-13-2005, 04:33 PM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
No, i am not going to uninstall the sim...but i will deffinitely uninstall Internet Explorer in order to not to look at this forum anymore http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

You asked to be honest - i am honest http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

i know right. can you just picture the **** staorm if thay canned the 4.0 patch. o man

-HH-Quazi
05-13-2005, 05:18 PM
Originally posted by WWSensei:
Uninstalling the game because the last patch wasn't delivered would be like cutting out your own tongue after a 10 course gourmet meal because you didn't like the way they folded your napkin.

Well put! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/351.gif

Hunter82
05-13-2005, 05:32 PM
Uninstall No

Give out the secret handshake No

Continue to listen to the typical whining associated with forums...god knows why http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif Yes

LEXX_Luthor
05-13-2005, 05:56 PM
LuckyBoy::
I just saw a post by CrazyIvan that says PF only sold less than 60,000 copies... so that means most of the guys I play with at HyperLobby are pirating the game!
mmm. What do you mean? Explain. This is fascinating stuff for the future of flight sims and especially Oleg's BoB and Beyond sims.

LuckyBoy1
05-13-2005, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by Hunter82:
Uninstall No

Give out the secret handshake No

Continue to listen to the typical whining associated with forums...god knows why http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif Yes

I know why!!! It's all that big money your making by cashing CrazyIvan's paycheck from UBI along with the one they give you! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Lexx, I don't have exact numbers, but 1C is apparently broke and the pirating is going to kill this game. Maybe Hunter82 would be willing to dig up that link to what he thinks should be done... besides beating up ping666 that is!

LuckyBoy1
05-13-2005, 06:36 PM
Here you go Lexx and anyone else who cares...

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/63110913/m/9071091813

Treetop64
05-13-2005, 07:05 PM
Um, No... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

bird_brain
05-13-2005, 08:54 PM
Not! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Hunter82
05-13-2005, 09:32 PM
I'm a link...Click me (http://www.putfile.com/media.php?n=catdrum)

EnGaurde
05-13-2005, 09:57 PM
HAA

classic.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Slammin_
05-13-2005, 11:58 PM
Hahaha, I can watch/listen to that for hours!

Slammin_
05-14-2005, 12:12 AM
Originally posted by lkemling:
Now be honest and no flames please, Seeing as Pacific Fighters is at the very best totally incomplete as a pacific theater sim and If no patch is forthcoming would you concider uninstalling Pacific Fighters and reverting to just FB /AEP.

Really, you present this with such manners, and I really do think you are a nice guy. So, since you've asked with such politeness, yes, I will take uninstalling PF under consideration if the patch is not fothcoming, now that you've mentioned it.

Now, since we are being all open and cudly and stuff, let's just say, and no, I'm not trying to burst your bubble, but let's just say there is no such thing as Santa Claus. Wait! Just saying...

Now, what if I can prove it. Will you consider killing your parents?

Should I make a new poll?

F4U_Flyer
05-14-2005, 12:31 AM
Huh! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

EAF51_Ookami
05-14-2005, 12:36 AM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
No, i am not going to uninstall the sim...but i will deffinitely uninstall Internet Explorer in order to not to look at this forum anymore http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

You asked to be honest - i am honest http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

You can't! Mods IE is a special version! Can't be uninstalled... it's a way to pay the sins of your previous lifes! Mwhahuahuahuahua!


uhm... Jumping back to topic... No... I won't uninstall it... the few times I fly online with my Squadron mates are good enough the keep PF alive on my pc.
I'm quite sure that the ones who are more w(ait)(hin)ing about the patch are the ones that mostly fly offline or are not part of Squadron...
Join a Squadron, fly with mates and all the bad feelings about the patch will fly away!

S!

danger13
05-14-2005, 03:21 AM
would NOT uninstall, BUT , did someone mention a PATCH????? lol

ivanmoe
05-14-2005, 08:51 AM
I formatted my HD back in February and never bothered to re-install PF or FB.

I still fly IL2, though, and sincerely believe that its a great game/slim, in spite of its lack of wind effects. The developer made a great decision in choosing limited areas of the Eastern Front as a setting for IL2. By minimizing the scope of the game, he was able to include a lot of detail that is absent most flight sims, to tweak the game out graphically.

I won't be reinstalling the later games in the series, patch or no patch. The game engine can't effectively handle the fighting attendant to the Western Front and Pacific theatres of war, with their vastly greater geographical demands and high-altitude regimes. For those, I'm afraid that I'm stuck with the CFS series. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Ivanmoe

Tater-SW-
05-14-2005, 09:30 AM
I doubt many would uninstall it, besides, HD space is cheap. OTOH, does the incomplete/poorly-managed PF, or the slow speed of the patch promised "soon" after release change your likelyhood to buy BoB. That's really a better question. It's important to remember the thread topic, it requires if no patch were forthcoming. If this patch never appeared, I would not buy BoB under any circumstances. I don't think this is at all likely, but any answer must make the assumption it never appears.

I suppose they should be glad there is no real competition, and we should be sad for the same reason.

tater

goshikisen
05-14-2005, 09:35 AM
Originally posted by Tater-SW-:
OTOH, does the incomplete/poorly-managed PF, or the slow speed of the patch promised "soon" after release change your likelyhood to buy BoB. That's really a better question.


tater

The silence I find baffling... in a purely business sense. You'd think you'd want to do whatever you can to not only acquire new customers but also to maintain your current customer base. The simple fact that a post like this exists would worry me if I were running a business selling this type of sim.

Maybe Oleg's stellar past communication was just too good to be true.

Regards, Goshikisen.

danger13
05-14-2005, 11:42 AM
Originally posted by goshikisen:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tater-SW-:
OTOH, does the incomplete/poorly-managed PF, or the slow speed of the patch promised "soon" after release change your likelyhood to buy BoB. That's really a better question.


tater
****d straight, i will NOT be buying BoB... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

The silence I find baffling... in a purely business sense. You'd think you'd want to do whatever you can to not only acquire new customers but also to maintain your current customer base. The simple fact that a post like this exists would worry me if I were running a business selling this type of sim.

Maybe Oleg's stellar past communication was just too good to be true.

Regards, Goshikisen. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

looks like the support for Pacific Fighters is rapidly dwindeling away, shame really, it has a hell of a lot of SERIOUS potential,and the U.S. market would love it. why cant oleg and team see it??? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Hunter82
05-14-2005, 12:07 PM
Well honestly if a few things were kept in mind besides Olegs current health situation.

1) Newborn baby at home (1st)

2) Office move

3) Some new employees joined, some old left

4) Patches released already (it's not like the game came out and there has been no work to date)

5) constant complaining and argumentative posts when he posts...not sure why anyone would bother posting in that environment

6) BoB being developed while this is all going on

7) 3rd party delays,modifications,maps, or models that needed to be tweaked and some completly reworked.

I could keep going on and on in this list but I think it would fall on deaf ears.

Hunter82
05-14-2005, 12:10 PM
I believe they can see it but UBI owns the rights to publish. If it will not cover expenses due to low sales or piracy issues funds cannot be allocated to increase work or possible add ons.

This also continues to delay BoB as PF is continually added to.


Originally posted by danger13:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by goshikisen:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tater-SW-:
OTOH, does the incomplete/poorly-managed PF, or the slow speed of the patch promised "soon" after release change your likelyhood to buy BoB. That's really a better question.


tater
****d straight, i will NOT be buying BoB... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

The silence I find baffling... in a purely business sense. You'd think you'd want to do whatever you can to not only acquire new customers but also to maintain your current customer base. The simple fact that a post like this exists would worry me if I were running a business selling this type of sim.

Maybe Oleg's stellar past communication was just too good to be true.

Regards, Goshikisen. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

looks like the support for Pacific Fighters is rapidly dwindeling away, shame really, it has a hell of a lot of SERIOUS potential,and the U.S. market would love it. why cant oleg and team see it??? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

DuxCorvan
05-14-2005, 12:33 PM
There's something I don't get: even if PF is not as complete as I'd like, is there any advantage in uninstalling it -apart from having those awful pre-PF muzzle-flashes again?

I mean, am I losing something for having it installed? I don't think so. I still have MORE than before it, even if I don't have all I want.

But I want so much... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

goshikisen
05-14-2005, 12:51 PM
For the record... in case some think danger13's misquote was actually something I said, I WILL be buying BOB when it comes out.

Oleg has a great track record with flight combat sims (I'd say stellar but PF isn't up to Oleg's standards) and I know BOB will provide great entertainment for the money. If BOB hits the shelves I'll buy it.

On the silence issue... I understand that Oleg has a great deal going on in his life and there are more important things to attend to BUT Oleg doesn't build these sims on his own. I'm sure he could have somebody on his staff take 15 minutes and write a brief update every once in a while. It's just good business sense, isn't it? A few screenshots take minutes... a brief write up may take a bit longer. Even if there isn't anything to update a brief and official "not much going on right now" would end the speculation that runs rampant here.

The dev. updates solidify the core audience and let new folks know that this product is a going concern... if there's a bit of unwarranted criticism just ignore it. You'll always have detractors... I've openly criticised Oleg for the lack of ships in what is, ostensibly, a Naval Aviation sim. This doesn't mean I think Oleg is a bad person or that his product is no good... I just want to help him make a great product even better. That's what most of the criticism is about. It irritates me that people want to warp this into some sort of negativity thing. I'm not a "Yes" man... I'll criticise if it's warranted but I'll also be quick to praise.

I've said this before... Oleg set his own precedent with the excellent support and it has been a major selling point in reviews of the product and by word of mouth. I'm sure Oleg wants to have a long stay in this industry... wouldn't it make sense to maintain his edge?

I'd say 95% of the folks here are big fans of Oleg's work and only want to see it get better. You get constructive criticism in all walks of life... you've just got to take it for what it is and not make it personal.

Regards, Goshikisen.

p.s. my colleague just had his first daughter about 7 months ago... you want to see a change in someone's regular routine, add a new born baby into their daily life. Add 2 car accidents to that mix... talk about life in flux.

Hunter82
05-14-2005, 01:14 PM
Oleg does the updates himself. Hopefully in a few more days things will start to get more back to normal

Treetop64
05-14-2005, 01:23 PM
That cat video was beautiful! Hilarious!
How apt it is for this thread...

Old_Canuck
05-14-2005, 03:40 PM
Originally posted by jarink:
No. Even without the 'missing content', it just adds too much to the game to consider removing it.

What he said.

OMK_Hand
05-14-2005, 04:25 PM
No.

Maddox Games have defined the genre.

There was nothing on the scale of the IL2 series available before, and there's nothing to compare with it now.
Likewise with customer support - Unprecedented.

I hope they never lose focus, or the will to continue because of all the vitriol that€s clearly generated when people (including staff at UBI) don't understand what they're being told.
If Maddox appear somewhat withdrawn at the moment, I for one do not blame them.
It€s at least a break from the unique exposure they€ve inflicted upon themselves.

A remarkable team. A remarkable product.
If they were standing for UK Government, I'd vote for them.

SeminoleX
05-15-2005, 08:14 AM
Have not uninstalled but it is over two months now since I bothered to play.

Each day the desire fades a bit more.

Tallyho1961
05-15-2005, 11:22 AM
I'm loving things as they are. Until I achieve ace-level flying/fighting ability on every single a/c in the current set, there'll always be something to work on. And since I can't claim that for even one measly a/c yet, I've got my hands full.

Now go take on the day http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

moonsign
05-15-2005, 12:26 PM
The whole thing has soured me to the point, I'm back on FS2004, flying my 298 aircraft. If they screw us on the patch, I'm going to delete both of them, and be totally through with ubi, and all their products. I smelled a "rat" a long time ago, and posted same.I check site every few days, but no info comning from "the powers to be". Thats my story, and I'm sticking to it.
"Moon" Mullins

Bluedog72
05-15-2005, 06:41 PM
Why wait and see if the patch comes or not? I uninstalled the **** thing yesterday.

Then I reinstalled everything, patched up to current , defragged my D drive and have been having an absolute stutter free blast with it ever since.

I eagerly await the patch, checking pretty much daily for news, but untill it arrives the current one will do just fine thanyou very much.

Doug_Thompson
05-15-2005, 08:25 PM
No, I won't uninstall the game, but will quit this forum if the patch doesn't come soon.

Bearcat99
05-16-2005, 07:24 AM
Some of these guys kill me.

Like the ones who say "OoooOoOOO I had to buy FB and Aces to play online http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif." No you didnt... You can fly PF as a stand alone online if you want to.. if you can FIND anybody that does it as a stand alone. The fact that most fliers prefer to use the merged install is not 1Cs fault. Could you imagine the clamor if PF was released as a stand alone onlY?!! LMAO... some people would be loosing thier minds..... The dual install is brilliant IMO.

Then there are the guys who think they will really make some kind of statement (either to themselves, the community or somebody else who... frankly also could GAS) by uninstalling a sim that runs absofrickinlutely great as it is, with the berst graphics,DMs etc on the market... all because of a delayed update. An update BTW delayed for so many reasons beyond the developers control that a good sized essay could be written on the whole affair.

Then you also have the guys that actually believe that the are supposed to be able to recreate every battle of the PTO in it's full historical accuracy..... all this... in a $40 sim. Get real. Then some of those same people will say... "OoOoOOOOOooOOOOoo the missions are tooo loooooong..... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif." LMAO....... what a bunch of characters we have here.

It is an amazing thing..... all due to this sim I can get my WW2 pilot fantasies seriously stroked, meet a whole bunch of interesting cats from all walks of life that I would have never even known about otherwise, learn all kinds of neat info about the planes I came to love as a kid and some new ones I hadnt even heard of till this sim..... all that and be entertained by some of the best clowns in the business. All for a few bucks and without leaving the house.... WaahhhOOoOOOOo!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif


B.T.W. Hunter..... whens the last time you went to the Mod forum...? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

goshikisen
05-16-2005, 09:05 AM
Originally posted by Bearcat99:
Then you also have the guys that actually believe that the are supposed to be able to recreate every battle of the PTO in it's full historical accuracy.....


Originally posted by Enthor1:
It is not: "The Entire Pacific War On The Sea And In The Air And On The Land With Most, If Not All, Of The Ships, Planes And Vehicles Of All The Combatant Nations Sailing, Flying Or Toolin' Through The Palm Trees Just As They Did Fifty To Sixty Years Ago"


Originally posted by Hunter82:
hang on I just checked my box PF came....yep I do not believe it said every freakin inch of the Pacific modelled


I find this way of refuting a point of view to be amusing... exaggerate and oversimplify so the opposing perspective looks so unreasonable no sane person would ever agree with it.

The vast majority of people who would like to see new objects incorporated are looking for baseline historical accuracy... not comprehensive. Is it wrong to expect a USS Yorktown to go with your included Midway map? A Malaya map to go with your included HMS Prince of Wales? (I pick these because these issues can and may be addressed by a future patch) How would you like a Kursk map without a T-34? It almost seems like there was no focus in the creation of content... maps with no corresponding content, content with no corresponding maps. I, in no way, expected to get every theatre, every object, and every aircraft... I did, however, expect that the content we did get would have some sort of continuity and historical relevance. What's ungrateful or unappreciative about that?

Requesting additional content does not mean one is dismissive of the effort that goes into making a sim like this or ungrateful. That seems to be the implication in many of these "enjoy what you've got" messages. I think Oleg's sims are great... always have and always will.

Regards, Goshikisen.

Tater-SW-
05-16-2005, 09:20 AM
Well said, Goshikisen.

It isn't about having everything, it's about having something relatively complete, someplace.

Pearl map, no US BBs. Waste of effort.

RN BBs, no map, or proper planes to sink them. Kind of a waste on the BBs (how many more generic ships (IJN CA?) could have been added for the work on the BB?)

The fact that virtually all the planes, and many typical ships (minus any decent sized IJN surface combatants (BB/CA)) exist for a great Slot capaign---but no map!

NG map picked for the shortest, least useful (from a campaign standpoint) part of the island.

About the only things that the game seems to model well in terms of these factors is CV based missions (since you have a mobile airfield to RTB to). On the down side is that lack of wind makes CV ops harder than they should be (a major flaw when CV ops are the only part of the overall scenario base that are realistic in terms of maps).

I would rather have seen far fewer maps, but better choices/placement of those maps. One complete Slot map from Guadalcanal to New Britain/New Ireland would have made more sense than all the other maps combined. Actually, if you made a slot map that included all of New Britain, you'd also have virtually the entire NG map we have now in there. True, a huge map, but mostly water, and it could be done with zero roads, and the only objects placed could be at the target airfields and towns (Rabaul, etc).

The colored squares are the sizes of maps already in PF to give some idea what was certainly possible:
http://members.spinn.net/~merrick/Stuff/Maps/the_slot.jpg

tater

Worf101
05-16-2005, 09:41 AM
No... I won't uninstall... I'm having a blast flying the P-40 Warhawk. I getting a lot more action then my navy and marine brethren and the P-40's a hoot to fly.

Da Worfster

Doug_Thompson
05-16-2005, 09:52 AM
Originally posted by Worf101:
No... I won't uninstall... I'm having a blast flying the P-40 Warhawk. I getting a lot more action then my navy and marine brethren and the P-40's a hoot to fly.

Da Worfster

Are you using the Austrailian Air Force campagin? It's P-40 heaven.

DRB_Hookech0
05-16-2005, 09:53 AM
Bear....I'll grant the points about much you said above, but here and elsewhere you fall into the "Merge it" mantra.

Do you not remember that PF was to be a STANDALONE outside of the IL2 series until this forum threw a fit over it? It was then decided to placate the masses by allowing the "Merged" install.

Besides....once and for all explain to me how exactly will adding ETO and eastern front plane sets add anything to the PTO? I mean if your just a dog fighter and dont care if your going 109's on Hellcats or whatever...thats one thing. But how will that help me, as a person that is deeply interested in the PTO, make my experence better? Last time I checked, there were no 190's or 109's over the South Pacific. Other than the gulf of Finland map, how will total land mass maps help me, as my squads mission builder, recreate any of the combat areas of the PTO?

For 6 months, all I have heard is how great all the support is. Well, from a PF perspective...it's not there. Lets look at the patches shall we?...were not the last 2 basiclly to fix things that got hosed in the 1st patch? Ive never been a advocate of "we have to drag 3000 lbs of ordence off a non moving carrier" crowd....I think that is completely rediculous, but in 3.03 they basically made carrier ops un-useable. 3.04 fixed that, some would say to the detremit of the entire series. I would not know as I fly the F4u series only, with the occisaional hop in a Zeke just to remember waht it can and cant do. I have seem people here say that they dont give a "pleep" about the PTO...and I can say the same in the other diretion, as I could care less how the Corsair turns in relation to a 190. I'll never see that matchup in the skys over the south pacific.

The Singapor map will be welcome, I guess, but from the looks of it, it is nothing but a large land mass map with a very wide river in it. Again it is of no help for the vast portion of the air war in the pacific. Someone in another thread told me to get off my *** and lend a hand. I will the day 1C comes out with a SDK for map building, and the ability for users to add maps to the game without going thru 1C. I'd bet that day will never come. As long as this is a closed system (which for the AC and all that I agree with BTW) and 1C is unwilling or unable to correct the gaping holes in the content for this game...then they have set themselves up to having to listen to consumers for thier lack of substance/items/content.

You said there has been no other game ever for the genre that was MORE complete. I'd say that CFS2, while old now, and having a horrific online setup, and mid 90's graphics, was 200% more complete than PF, cost about the same at release, and allowed the user to fix and or add (which had to be done because a lot of the things like FM, and DM were Fubar'd ) things into the game. Ever wonder why that game is still going, what 6-7 years after it came out?

I came back to the IL2 series because of PF after spending a lot of time in the CFS3 crowd. I didnt like much of CFS3. The grapics were below par, the game was balky, the FM and DM was ify, but it was complete. I could fly from and to just about any point in the ETO. I could add any plane, object, airbase I wanted to if it existed out in the mod community. Having said all of that...I am still here flying PF 7 months later. Am I frustrated that PF is going to remain an after thought...you betcha. Am I angry that seamingly the vast part of this latest patch is for the AEP merged install....yep.

Will I uninstall it because of all of that....nope.

I'll fly it as long as my squad wants to fly it. But I will say that the whole PF experence has really hurt 1C's rep in my eyes and those of my squad. I will have to take a long, hard look at BoB to see if it is as half baked as PF has been. If it is, then I'll find something else to spend my paycheck on.

Ok...let me get into my flame-******ant clothing.....

DRAGON_2_GO
05-16-2005, 12:15 PM
@ all those whiners:

I agree, the game is totally incomplete:
I can't get out of my plane, grab my gun and hunt them on foot, I can't go to the flyer's bar, and worst of all, I can't even explore the Carriers from within. But worst is this: every time I leave my computer, I get to realise it's 2005 and not 1941.... *lol* It's a game, remember? I guess some of you have also got CFS 3, are you also whinig for the missing big bombers? No you just get an add on. So why don't you try to pay for the patches? I guess if Oleg could afford it, he'd have the patch out sooner, biut you know, he's also got other problems then the patch. I'm not sure if I would spend any time working on a patch that won't be good enough to meet your demands *lol*.

Maybe he should really just cancel it. I doubt the response would be much worse, but he could spend the time doing something, that he enjoyes...


And to mention, I think PF is great even if you got it as a stand alone, but I'll still get the patch as it becomes aviable.


Dragon

DRAGON_2_GO
05-16-2005, 12:18 PM
One mre thought: What will I gain by de-installing Pf? You're telling people there's not enough in it so that if you take this away there will be more, or what? Can't you see that's senseless? It might be sensible if you really hated the game and got your money back.

regards

goshikisen
05-16-2005, 12:21 PM
Originally posted by DRAGON_2_GO:
I agree, the game is totally incomplete:
I can't get out of my plane, grab my gun and hunt them on foot, I can't go to the flyer's bar, and worst of all, I can't even explore the Carriers from within. But worst is this: every time I leave my computer, I get to realise it's 2005 and not 1941.... *lol*


Yup... that's what we want. Great appraisal. (tongue firmly planted in cheek). Try rationalizing what people are saying instead of blowing the whole thing out of proportion.

Why is it that the people who criticise the folks interested in additional content almost always either get it wrong or resort to exaggerating? Think about it... this series has gone through numerous improvements (and potentially some detrimental changes) because of community input. Is that wrong? Should those who made suggestions that were implemented have just clammed up and let sleeping dogs lie? COME ON... be reasonable!

Regards, Goshikisen.

Doug_Thompson
05-16-2005, 01:00 PM
Question: Did the original IL-2 Sturmovik do a better or worse job at representing the whole Eastern Front than Pacific Fighters did for the PTO?

DRB_Hookech0
05-16-2005, 02:25 PM
Id say better if memory serves me. It's been a long time since I had the original IL2 on my PC.

IIRC, the plane sets were evenly matched for the timeline and you had maps to represent the 3 main advances of the Germans into the stepps. The objects included matched the plane set and the map set. So I'd say it was a more complete game out of the box as far as usable content than PF was.

If PF was called "Carrier Operations" then that would fit more of the lines of what the content included. I would still say that the map selection was not the smartest. Pearl Harbor while beautifully made and rendered... (and I say this after taking a ride in a Cessna along the route flown by the Japanese across the main part of the island....and it made the hair stand up on the back of my neck when you come thru that valley and over a ridge and there is Pearl...man what was going thru the mind of that pilot in the lead plane....it's one of those sights that is burned into your brain forever)....that it is more of a attack than air combat as only a handfull of US planes made it into the air and at most your looking at 5 mins over the target.....which in PF is guarded by British battlewagons.

Wake, while a desparate struggle, was a short lived fight between the Japanese Fleet Air Arm and a handful of Wildcats, Buffaloes, Vindicators and Devestators (both of wich we dotn have...thankfully).

Midway is the 1st very good map, although the map size is a little small I think....you can very closely recreate the entire Midway campaign.

The Coral Sea map allows you to do 3 battles...well 2 and 3/4. You can do either the Coral Sea or Bismark Sea carrier engagments and the the Battle of Santa Cruze if you ignor the land based bombers and support A/C.

Guadalcanal is placed on the early map bas-ackwards. The US fleet sailed in between Savo and Guadalcanal before spilting into the Tulagi force and the main Guadalcanal force....why then is there so much water south of Guadacanal? nothing took place there other than bombers flying from Espreto Stantiago (spelling is way off) to henderson to refuel before heading up to bomb the anchorages at Buna and Rabual. To make a mission on the Guadalcanal map you have to have the blue team fly along the northern map edge and then down into the combat area just to get the timings right (and without spawning 30 A/C in the middle of the game and stalling everyones PC) and give them a temp airstrip to land on because there is no where for them to go.

The Marines landed on Guadalcanal what Aug 9ish 1942? The last carrier v carrier battle until August 1944 too place in Sept 1942 off cape Espearance, Guadalcanal. Other than NG, there are no maps for what is considered the Main effort in the PTO and that is the drive up the Solomons to Bouganville, and bombing the heck out of Rabual. 23 months of combat.

Where did you think the Hellcat and the Corsair make their combat debuts? Over New Georgia. the first F4u-1 squadrons landed on Guadalcanal on Feb 20 1943. Basically there are no maps for 1943 to late 1944. Take a look at the planeset for the US side....tailormade for this timeframe but no maps. No maps to re-create the exploits of the Blacksheep or VF-17....nothing.

Doug_Thompson
05-16-2005, 03:34 PM
Originally posted by DRB_Hookech0:
Id say better if memory serves me. It's been a long time since I had the original IL2 on my PC.

IIRC, the plane sets were evenly matched for the timeline and you had maps to represent the 3 main advances of the Germans into the stepps. The objects included matched the plane set and the map set. So I'd say it was a more complete game out of the box as far as usable content than PF was.

I'm not going to argue, but try to make some points.

The endless steppe is much, much easier to satisfy as a map requirement than the PTO. China, the Himalayas, Pacific Atolls, the torrid jungles of New Guinea. All of these are far more demanding from a game production point of view than Russia. Arguably, Russia was one continuous front that stretched from a heavily forested area with rivers to a sparesly forested area with rivers.

In addition, Russian topography is not well known in the West. We miss less because we know less.


If PF was called "Carrier Operations" then that would fit more of the lines of what the content included.

Which was both more marketable and the greatest single departure from the earlier series. While Malaya, Burma and particularly Guadacanal/New Guinea locales would have been more interesting to us who enjoy history, it would not have offered a significant variation from what's already been done with IL-2 and its successors.

Focusing on carrier operations and sinkable ships added a new facet to the game. New maps would have only been variations to the same line.

I'm not that far from your view of things, DRB_Hookech0. I also consider Pacific Fighters little more than a glorified expansion kit. This is why I waited until the price fell to $20 before buying it. However, I see Pacific Fighters as a transition toward something better, and a difficult transition at that. I'm not as disappointed. If you retort that this is only because my expectations were lower, I'd argue that it was because the problems of integrating ship and aircraft movement was probably a severe technical challenge. Look at the dearth of good-quality naval wargames. There has to be some difficulty involved.


I would still say that the map selection was not the smartest. Pearl Harbor while beautifully made and rendered... (and I say this after taking a ride in a Cessna along the route flown by the Japanese across the main part of the island....and it made the hair stand up on the back of my neck when you come thru that valley and over a ridge and there is Pearl...man what was going thru the mind of that pilot in the lead plane....it's one of those sights that is burned into your brain forever)

I'm jealous. Intensely


....that it is more of a attack than air combat as only a handfull of US planes made it into the air and at most your looking at 5 mins over the target.....which in PF is guarded by British battlewagons.

I will admit that seeing Pearl filled with KGV's was jarring. However, I wonder whether Maddox games used the detailed drawings from Ubisoft's "Silent Hunter III" to cut down cost.


Wake, while a desparate struggle, was a short lived fight between the Japanese Fleet Air Arm and a handful of Wildcats, Buffaloes, Vindicators and Devestators (both of wich we dotn have...thankfully).

Correction here. There were only Wildcats on Wake, and only a couple of those. The rest were bombed out the first day. There were strikes by Japanese carrier aircraft and land-based Nells.


Midway is the 1st very good map, although the map size is a little small I think....you can very closely recreate the entire Midway campaign.

Glad to hear it.


The Coral Sea map allows you to do 3 battles...well 2 and 3/4. You can do either the Coral Sea or Bismark Sea carrier engagments and the the Battle of Santa Cruze if you ignor the land based bombers and support A/C.

Again, the question is: Air Sim or Sea Sim? For instance, the USS Hornet was scuttled in the battle of the Santa Cruz because Japanese surface warships were approaching. Also, a shore bombardment to supress Henderson field was a crucial part of the Japanese battle plan.

The point I'm trying to make is that it would talk almost a full-scale naval sim AND a flight sim to give the level of detail needed for something that could really model the Guadalcanal situation.


Guadalcanal is placed on the early map bas-ackwards.(etc.)

No arguement there.


The Marines landed on Guadalcanal what Aug 9ish 1942? Aug. 7, if memory serves.


The last carrier v carrier battle until August 1944 took place in Sept 1942 off cape Espearance, Guadalcanal.

I quibble here, but the last one actually took place off the Santa Cruz Islands on Oct. 26, 1942. Anyway, there were only five carrier battles in the Pacific: Coral Sea, Midway, the Easten Solomons, Santa Cruz and the Phillipine Sea. Unless I've misunderstood you, at least four of those can be recreated with this game.

I understand -- in fact, I agree -- that the emphasis in this game is on carrier operations. That's a design decision you and I may disagree with, but it is not a screw-up.


Other than NG, there are no maps for what is considered the Main effort in the PTO and that is the drive up the Solomons to Bouganville, and bombing the heck out of Rabual. 23 months of combat.

Again, no disagreement.


Where did you think the Hellcat and the Corsair make their combat debuts? (etc.)

Please don't assume users of this forum know less history unless a poster gives grounds for that belief.

Hunter82
05-16-2005, 03:53 PM
original IL2 was is development for a very long time (years) prior to release. PF in general terms was about 1/8 of the time IMO compared to IL2.

Now with that said do I feel PF is complete as a stand alone...honestly no I do not. As a add on yes.

Do I think PF will be complete with the patch.... I think it will bring alot of the group togther again IMO.

DRB_Hookech0
05-16-2005, 04:10 PM
I called it the Battle of the Bismark Sea as I have seen it both call that and the Battle of the Eastern Solomons.

And yes we agree on the main points. My "Where do you think" comment was more along the lines of what time frame and area of operations were they 1st deployed to...not poking fun at anyone.

I guess I have always maintained that there has to be a way of maping out this vital area of operations.

I understand that you cant go from Rabual to Guadalcanal. Thats way too big and way too long for most people. But how about the Russel Islands to New Georgia, even if you have to shorten the distance to fit them on a map. Heck even 1 or 2 airstrips on the Russles would work.

Munda point to the southern end of Bouganville, again even if you have to shorten the distance between the 2 to get some of Empress Augusta Bay in it. Bouganville to Rabual is a bit of a strech because of Island orientation and air base locations. But Rabual could be done and even if there was a sliver of land somewhere to place a temp strip on...that would work and it would bring a lot of options for USSAF guys flying out of NG (even if they air start) etc...

I'd say they can do it, but they wont or are unwilling to do it anytime soon. If there was a way for us peons to do it and add it ourselves then all the better. There are a LOT of talented folks out there and I bet we could give the "offical" maps a run for their money.

Anyway, thanks for an intelligent reply.

Chuck_Older
05-16-2005, 04:24 PM
Yes, I will uninstall if no patch is forthcoming. Oleg will feel a great disturbance in the force and we'll really have shown him

Also, if Oleg doesn't give me a pony I am calling a lawyer

goshikisen
05-16-2005, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by DRB_Hookech0:
If there was a way for us peons to do it and add it ourselves then all the better. There are a LOT of talented folks out there and I bet we could give the "offical" maps a run for their money.


Map building... I'd gladly forfeit any additional aircraft if the community was given the ability to build maps. I think, in terms of product longevity, you couldn't do better.

Doug_Thompson
05-16-2005, 04:51 PM
I understand that you cant go from Rabual to Guadalcanal. Thats way too big and way too long for most people. (etc)

The battles in the Upper Solomons and New Guinea that you describe are the fertile ground for simming. No doubt about it.

New aircraft types are appearing on both sides. Older types still predominate, with the worst ones dropped. Skip bombing was being developed, etc. Even the carrier junkies get a raid on Rabaul in 1943.

I'd suggest that the players who were so disappointed in PF maps agree that the areas around Raubal are needed most, and lobby for that area. I know many want Malaya and other want China, Flying Tigers etc., but the reduction of Raubaul is where the most intense, interesting action would be.

Another possibility, believe it or not, is the Phillipines. In one of the least explicable intelligence failures of the war, Leyte Island was a horrible place to make airfields. The Japanese were briefly able to seize air superiorty there after the U.S. invasion of 1944. The big carriers couldn't hang around forever, and even late model Wildcats from escort carriers were in the fight. The Japanese on the ground, though, were severely outgunned and crushed. Kamikazes were out in force, too.

Hunter82
05-16-2005, 06:06 PM
Problem is then each map would need to be sent to Oleg to be compiled in the SFS and throughout the game. This would require a signifigant amount of time on 1C's part to keep all intact as far as the closed arch of the sim. Equally to open just the maps portion would be considerable in time and effort.


Originally posted by goshikisen:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DRB_Hookech0:
If there was a way for us peons to do it and add it ourselves then all the better. There are a LOT of talented folks out there and I bet we could give the "offical" maps a run for their money.


Map building... I'd gladly forfeit any additional aircraft if the community was given the ability to build maps. I think, in terms of product longevity, you couldn't do better. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

DRB_Hookech0
05-16-2005, 06:28 PM
well Hunter, as long as there are problems of this magnitude in this game and we have no recourse except to wait while Oleg gets sick, has babys...ok his wife had the baby....and have unfortunate vehicular incidents.....unless he opens some of it up....then all we can do is sit here at bi@c* about it.

just think of it as a farm team....never know who will rise up and make it to the big leagues....

Hunter82
05-16-2005, 06:54 PM
arch is not going to change in the sim (thank god) so we'll all have to wait.

If Oleg gives the ok we'll post some screens of some of the newer items but not sure about details as each will need to be cleared by him.

Can't really say more until ok'd..

I think personally though you guys need to lay off the comments like this though "except to wait while Oleg gets sick, has babys...ok his wife had the baby....and have unfortunate vehicular incidents" it's really in poor taste IMO.

KarayaEine
05-16-2005, 07:40 PM
Why would I uninstall it?

It's great as it is.

Johann

zoomar
05-16-2005, 08:04 PM
What a stupid question, made stupider by the crybaby majority who voted "yes". PF is far more "complete" than CFS2 or any other pacific war sim still available. It has more maps, planes, ships, any anything else than any available or past pacific war sim. The fact that you can't fly a Kate or Avenger (the only really serious omission)is a small problem. I am frankly more likely to uninstall my FB+AEP+PF merged install than my PF stand alone.

DRB_Hookech0
05-16-2005, 08:50 PM
Originally posted by zoomar:
PF is far more "complete" than CFS2 or any other pacific war sim still available. It has more maps, planes, ships, any anything else than any available or past pacific war sim.

Gosh...last I looked, the entire planet earth was maped in CFS2...what map are you playing on? the moon?

In it's day CFS2 allowed you to do or create any mission flown in the PTO....does it compare "eye candy" to PF...no. But dont tell me that PF was or is more complete than my 6cd's of content for CFS2.

Hunter...my point is that if Oleg aint around...then seemingly....nothing gets done or it gets pushed back a month. The lack of communication or even a heads up is what fuels all these threads. Singapor is going to make the Brit flyers happy but it is going to make a lot of us even more bitter about all this. A lot of which cold be solved if we could make and insert some of this missing content.

goshikisen
05-16-2005, 09:08 PM
Originally posted by Hunter82:
Problem is then each map would need to be sent to Oleg to be compiled in the SFS and throughout the game. This would require a signifigant amount of time on 1C's part to keep all intact as far as the closed arch of the sim. Equally to open just the maps portion would be considerable in time and effort.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by goshikisen:
Map building... I'd gladly forfeit any additional aircraft if the community was given the ability to build maps. I think, in terms of product longevity, you couldn't do better. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I guess I'm thinking more along the lines of an application that would preclude the involvement of Oleg in the implementation of the map. Something like that would maintain interest for a long time... and take a great deal of the weight off Oleg's shoulder in terms of keeping his baby (the sim, not his actual baby http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif) healthy. Of course I may be talking out my a$$ as I have no idea how much work would go into building an IL2 map creation application.

I would be wholly against any opening of code on aircraft models, flight models and objects... but the the ability to create maps would really give this sim legs. You'd get people who would master map making in much the same way that skinners have more than outdone many of the default skins. It'd be a much bigger endeavour, of course, but you'd find people willing to take on the task.

Just a thought.

Regards, Goshikisen.

p.s. Rabaul and the Solomons with New Guinea (Lae and Port Moresby)... that alone would have been a great focus for an early war WW2 aviation sim. The whole Pacific Theatre... talk about biting off more than you can chew.

Hunter82
05-16-2005, 09:22 PM
I would love to have people make maps for PF and IL2 don't get me wrong...there is a ton of talent out there that could do a incredible job. 3rd party is great for things just like that...it's when the other things get opened up that a killer happens....

Personally I loved real weather in CFS and would like to see something like that evenually for IL but with the program using so many resources I don't think it would have anything to spare lol.

Hunter82
05-16-2005, 09:27 PM
Work continues on everything if Oleg is not there. Just final say is up to him on release or info passed out..as I said earlier in the thread I'll ask what I can post and I believe Crazy Ivan is asking also for a possible update. Can't until ok'd, NDA covers that one http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


Originally posted by DRB_Hookech0:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zoomar:
PF is far more "complete" than CFS2 or any other pacific war sim still available. It has more maps, planes, ships, any anything else than any available or past pacific war sim.

Gosh...last I looked, the entire planet earth was maped in CFS2...what map are you playing on? the moon?

In it's day CFS2 allowed you to do or create any mission flown in the PTO....does it compare "eye candy" to PF...no. But dont tell me that PF was or is more complete than my 6cd's of content for CFS2.

Hunter...my point is that if Oleg aint around...then seemingly....nothing gets done or it gets pushed back a month. The lack of communication or even a heads up is what fuels all these threads. Singapor is going to make the Brit flyers happy but it is going to make a lot of us even more bitter about all this. A lot of which cold be solved if we could make and insert some of this missing content. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hunter82
05-17-2005, 05:08 AM
some information

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/63110913/m/9761008123

Bearcat99
05-17-2005, 06:01 AM
Speaking of maps.. I wonder if it would be possible to have a generic scenery map that would load seamlessly (or maybe with the same kind of blip that occurs when AI planes load) between maps... say like a generic tundra between two winter maps or generic ocean between two PTO maps.. that would go a long way towards making many aspects of this already great sim even better.

9th_Bloodfist
05-17-2005, 07:26 AM
Ok I guess I can put in my 2 cents worth. I won't unistall the game if the patch isn't released, I do enjoy it, but this whole PF situation has left a real bad taste in my mouth. Some said Oleg was brilliant for mergeing FB+AEP+PF, well they're right. If they wouldn't have done that then PF would have been a complete bomb. I'm also tired of all the fan boys around here telling us how great the support is for this game. As far as that goes, every other game I have and play has had equal or even better support. The only difference is that Oleg decides to jump in and say hey every now and then. That's fine and dandy, however I would prefer at least a dev member to make some updates on how the patch is coming or anything else their working on instead. Support for this game has really seemed to drop drastically after PF came out. Plain and simply put, there has just been to many excuses for me to even care anymore about the patch. If we get it great, If we don't, well that just wouldn't suprise me at all. I'll keep playing with my squad until another game comes out that we like better. As far as buying BoB goes, I'll probably have to read some reviews before I make the choice of buying it. Hopefully they'll at least get a new game engine for this one, and be able to put all the info on 1 or 2 CD's. If I hear that excuse again lol, I would definatley not buy it. My squad mates all feel about the same way as I do, and obviously alot of others do as well. I just hope Maddox games is paying attention to all of what the comunity has to say, not just the fanboys who post everychance they get.

Tater-SW-
05-17-2005, 08:26 AM
Doug, excellent points, and I largely agree. That said, it isn't enough to have a Rabaul map, and/or a Western PNG map, the critical issue is size.

Heck, a generic map with a fairly small land area in each corner of a large map like Hawaii (1000x1000km) would do nicely. Better might be a map with a larger island in 2 corners, and atolls in the other 2 corners. That would allow for SWPA island to island combat as well as some of the missions flown out of PNG to smaller atolls. It would also allow CV vs island combat as well.

As you point out (think I did a few pages up as well), the sim seems best aimed at blue-water combat, but in that case more effort should have been paid to wind, to improve CV ops, IMHO. Even the simple solution of using the fixed storm wind in the game already, but on a clear or good visibility map, that seems off the shelf, and you'd know that for TO and landing ops to run your CVs into the fixed wind direction. The atoll maps are certainly easier for them to do.

My biggest beef is simply the choice of where they put the effort in the maps. If you simply equate land area to effort, we could have had much more satisfying maps using the exact same land area (though fewer maps). It seems like the meeting to pick maps should have been the CV war first (minus Pearl, IMO, since it's only good for 1 day, and only then if they model the US BBs), then take a total amount of land-area they have time to do, and try to make the best of it.

tater

Doug_Thompson
05-17-2005, 08:40 AM
Tater-SW; Thanks for the feedback and for the agreement. I put a lot of thought on the issue last night and went back to €œA World at Arms€ by Gerhard L. Weinberg. He described what I believe to be the perfect PF campaign locale.

All we need is the map. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif I don€t expect it to get it any time soon, but it€s a prospect worth remembering. The map would have Leyte island on the south and Manila on the north, a distance of about 600 kilometers.

Sorry for the long post. It€s overkill, but should address most issues:

=======

A combination of an American blunder with geography, topography, kamikazes and the naval battle of Leyte Gulf left the Japanese in a rare and brief position of overall air superiority over Leyte in late 1944. The best plane types of both sides would be available in large numbers.

As Weinberg says on page 856, the Imperial Army able to reinforce Leyte island heavily after the invasion:

€œThe growing strength of the Japanese intersected with increasing problems for the Americans. Not only was Japanese resistance on the island growing rather than waning, the air situation deteriorated badly. The escort carriers had to be refitted after the battering they had taken. As for the buildup of land bases for airplanes, it soon turned out there had been a terrible intelligence failure. The central Leyte area which 6th army had begun to clear as it drove inland proved quite unsuitable for airfield construction. The steel mats sank in the swampy ground, and the resulting inadequate air support meant the steadily reinforced Japanese air attacks by the 2,500 planes of the Japanese 4th Air Army often dominated the sky over Leyte. Continued Japanese Air raids hampered the progress of airfield construction and operations in general. Naval air support from fleet carriers proved necessary for the Americans, but even so a slogging match ensued in which the Americans gained slowly and at high cost.€

The Japanese base is, of course, occupied Clark Field and other facilities around Manila. The key American airbase on Leyte is called Tacloban. According to Weinberg, Tacloban was very small and narrow field located on a sand spit. The vital field was €œthe target of a spectacular Japanese suicide operation in which planes crash landed on the airstrips around Tacloban and paratroopers landed nearby. This was a major effort to seize the airstrips as Japanese ground forces counter-attacked toward them.€ The Americans drove off the attacks.

The distance from Manila to Tacloban is 570 kilometers, or 354 miles €" dive bomber range.

Even after resistance on Leyte was contained, the ground was so bad for airstrips that the Americans had to seize another island, lightly held, before the invasion of Luzon could proceed.

====================

The whole scenario is rife with sim possibilities. The Japanese would have Franks, Tonys, and Zeros in quantity. The Americans would have Hellcats and Corsairs, but would also use late-model Wildcats from the escort carriers and Army planes at Tacloban.

There would also be Kamikaze€s with plenty of targets: The shipping to support the invasion and the escort carriers to provide air cover. These piloted drones could make for a frantic shooting gallery for American planes.

Also, the map would contain Mindoro, the lightly held island seized by the U.S. for air bases for the invasion of Luzon. Then almost the whole Phillippines campaign from Leyte until the destruction of any meaningful Japanese air power in the Philippines would be available.

If the map could stretch as far north as Lingayen Gulf, both the Japanese invasion of the Philippines early in the war and the campaign to take Manila back in 1944 could be used.

zoomar
05-17-2005, 05:10 PM
DRB:

You are comparing apples and oranges. Out of the Box (which is the only fair way to describe any game), CFS2 was and remains a far more limited game than PF. What did we get, maybe 6 flyable planes and another 6 AI or something like that? I don't really remember a great variety of ships either. True, there have been oodles of third-party additions to CFS2, but it would be unfair to credit that to Microsoft. I bought CFS2 and it's six flyable fighters for 50 bucks when it came out, and they were still charging 50 for it years later - still with the same six planes. PF had a much greater variety of flyable and AI planes, including dive, level, and torpedo bombers (if not the Kates and Avengers we all want), and was cheaper. Not that CFS2 was bad, but I feel I've already gotten more value from PF.

Bearcat99
05-17-2005, 11:18 PM
Originally posted by zoomar:
DRB:

You are comparing apples and oranges. Out of the Box (which is the only fair way to describe any game), CFS2 was and remains a far more limited game than PF. What did we get, maybe 6 flyable planes and another 6 AI or something like that? I don't really remember a great variety of ships either. True, there have been oodles of third-party additions to CFS2, but it would be unfair to credit that to Microsoft. I bought CFS2 and it's six flyable fighters for 50 bucks when it came out, and they were still charging 50 for it years later - still with the same six planes. PF had a much greater variety of flyable and AI planes, including dive, level, and torpedo bombers (if not the Kates and Avengers we all want), and was cheaper. Not that CFS2 was bad, but I feel I've already gotten more value from PF.

One of the best points of this thread.

Sturm_Williger
05-18-2005, 02:59 AM
Uninstall ?! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

And go back to the muzzleflash whines ??? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

( forgotten about those have you ? )


I think NOT !

Mark5001953
05-18-2005, 09:04 AM
Love the game as is. A patch is gravy.

henriksultan
05-18-2005, 01:56 PM
I will never uninstall it, just as I still have star craft install. The game is to fun to remove, even if BoB turns out to be ten times better (witch we all hope) I will propably still keep it... its love, thats what it is http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Saunders1953
05-18-2005, 02:14 PM
then all we can do is sit here at bi@c* about it.

Or not.