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cgdemon894
10-08-2011, 08:40 PM
Being in these forums for quite a while now, I see people arguing about how Ezio's face in Revelations is quite ugly compared to his Brotherhood face. I disagree. I decided to make a comparison shot of Ezio/Desmond's face from Brotherhood to the new face model from Revelations which was edited to suit Ezio's various age growths (via the magic of Photoshop) which I then put onto the Brotherhood outfit model. Enjoy :P

http://i.picasion.com/pic44/e61abcaeb93c7c250f8264f9a7e96acc.gif

http://i.picasion.com/pic44/a7b17208656ae77d223f8a80a629d34e.gif

kriegerdesgottes
10-08-2011, 08:43 PM
Very nicely done first of all. I always thought Desmond looked a lot like Ezio but I didn't realize how close they really are.

cgdemon894
10-08-2011, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
Very nicely done first of all. I always thought Desmond looked a lot like Ezio but I didn't realize how close they really are.

Thanks! Yea, I was kinda surprised by finding out that they were basically the same model, the only difference being the textures for the older Ezio.

Calvarok
10-08-2011, 08:56 PM
I'm glad thay took out the annoying frown lines on ezio's face. He can't have that many frown lines all the time, it just makes him look unnaturally angry or tired!

Now they got the new emotion system that can have dynamic frown lines!!!

Anyways, those lips look totally non-monkeyish to me, so hah.

He looks close enough, but just way more detailed, expecaially the lining of his face.

kriegerdesgottes
10-08-2011, 09:37 PM
I have to say though this really brings home for me how different he really does look than he did in previous games. I still don't think it's a big deal because he is still recognizable but he looks so different compared to the previous ACII/ACB model.

Calvarok
10-08-2011, 09:55 PM
Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
I have to say though this really brings home for me how different he really does look than he did in previous . I still don't think it's a big deal because he is still recognizable but he looks so different compared to the previous ACII/ACB model.
In that recent interview we had with Darby and Poiker, they explained that in AC1, with abstergo's animus, the animus used exactly the face of the user, including hairstyle and facial hair.

Then in AC2 and ACB, the Assassin animus showed a cross between Desmond and Ezio, with Desmond as the base model, but things like facial hair, expressions, and wrinkles and hair being Ezio's.

Now in Revelations, either because of the black room or Rebecca's latest update (the code in a trailer shows us this is a new animus software version) it is showing full on what Ezio looked like.

That combined with the graphical enhancements makes Ezio look a lot different from what he used to.

And regarding how DESMOND has changed, actually, Desmond was based off the model whose face they scanned for Desmond in Revelations, so now Desmond looks more like they wanted him to look like in the first place.

The unnatural lighting of the Black Room and his more expressive face is throwing people off a bit. It's still unmistakably Desmond.

Jexx21
10-08-2011, 10:00 PM
I agree with CAlvarok here.

kriegerdesgottes
10-08-2011, 10:13 PM
Yes I realize that is the reason. I just hate that stupid excuse. lol. And actually according to the Podcast with Escoblades, I believe it was falko poiker or Darby who said that because of the new textures and better graphics the faces just look different which is why desmond looks so different in Revelations which I don't get either really. Why would improving your graphics change the physical appearance of the characters? I suppose there is some technical reason for it that I wouldn't understand.

Calvarok
10-08-2011, 10:20 PM
Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
Yes I realize that is the reason. I just hate that stupid excuse. lol. And actually according to the Podcast with Escoblades, I believe it was falko poiker or Darby who said that because of the new textures and better graphics the faces just look different which is why desmond looks so different in Revelations which I don't get either really. Why would improving your graphics change the physical appearance of the characters? I suppose there is some technical reason for it that I wouldn't understand.
Well really, it's not just like pressing a button and the face automatically upgradig. When a face is made, it is usually constructed from nothing, in Desmond's AC1, 2, B case, it was constructed using Fransisco randez as a reference.

For Revelations, they were able to match his face a lot more closely with an actual scan of his face, which the artist then used to allow for a much closer match, with far more realism than can be crafted quickly enough by hand, and which can be molded more easily by animators.

So all of the changes are him just looking more like what he's supposed to look like.

kriegerdesgottes
10-08-2011, 10:24 PM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
Yes I realize that is the reason. I just hate that stupid excuse. lol. And actually according to the Podcast with Escoblades, I believe it was falko poiker or Darby who said that because of the new textures and better graphics the faces just look different which is why desmond looks so different in Revelations which I don't get either really. Why would improving your graphics change the physical appearance of the characters? I suppose there is some technical reason for it that I wouldn't understand.
Well really, it's not just like pressing a button and the face automatically upgradig. When a face is made, it is usually constructed from nothing, in Desmond's AC1, 2, B case, it was constructed using Fransisco randez as a reference.

For Revelations, they were able to match his face a lot more closely with an actual scan of his face, which the artist then used to allow for a much closer match, with far more realism than can be crafted quickly enough by hand, and which can be molded more easily by animators.

So all of the changes are him just looking more like what he's supposed to look like. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah could be and I believe they did say on the podcast that they had him come back in and make more models but I feel like old Desmond's face resembles Francisco's much more than the new one does. Revelations could always end up proving me wrong though when it comes out.

Jexx21
10-08-2011, 10:45 PM
I heard someone say that Desmond's new face looks like a fusion of Francesco's and Nolan North's.

Which honestly would make sense, seeing as the voice normally goes along with the face.

CRUDFACE
10-08-2011, 10:54 PM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
I have to say though this really brings home for me how different he really does look than he did in previous . I still don't think it's a big deal because he is still recognizable but he looks so different compared to the previous ACII/ACB model.
In that recent interview we had with Darby and Poiker, they explained that in AC1, with abstergo's animus, the animus used exactly the face of the user, including hairstyle and facial hair.

Then in AC2 and ACB, the Assassin animus showed a cross between Desmond and Ezio, with Desmond as the base model, but things like facial hair, expressions, and wrinkles and hair being Ezio's.

Now in Revelations, either because of the black room or Rebecca's latest update (the code in a trailer shows us this is a new animus software version) it is showing full on what Ezio looked like.

That combined with the graphical enhancements makes Ezio look a lot different from what he used to.

And regarding how DESMOND has changed, actually, Desmond was based off the model whose face they scanned for Desmond in Revelations, so now Desmond looks more like they wanted him to look like in the first place.

The unnatural lighting of the Black Room and his more expressive face is throwing people off a bit. It's still unmistakably Desmond. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Very nice, I didn't know that. I think it's personally just their technology getting better, but tying it to the game is a very nice touch and draws you in more

I lol'd when they had all these reasons for Desmond's face to change and they just basically said, "Our graphics got better."

But I've seen the real model's face. It's very angular and more sleek, Desmond's has become more saggy and tired looking.

Calvarok
10-08-2011, 11:01 PM
Originally posted by t260z:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
I have to say though this really brings home for me how different he really does look than he did in previous . I still don't think it's a big deal because he is still recognizable but he looks so different compared to the previous ACII/ACB model.
In that recent interview we had with Darby and Poiker, they explained that in AC1, with abstergo's animus, the animus used exactly the face of the user, including hairstyle and facial hair.

Then in AC2 and ACB, the Assassin animus showed a cross between Desmond and Ezio, with Desmond as the base model, but things like facial hair, expressions, and wrinkles and hair being Ezio's.

Now in Revelations, either because of the black room or Rebecca's latest update (the code in a trailer shows us this is a new animus software version) it is showing full on what Ezio looked like.

That combined with the graphical enhancements makes Ezio look a lot different from what he used to.

And regarding how DESMOND has changed, actually, Desmond was based off the model whose face they scanned for Desmond in Revelations, so now Desmond looks more like they wanted him to look like in the first place.

The unnatural lighting of the Black Room and his more expressive face is throwing people off a bit. It's still unmistakably Desmond. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Very nice, I didn't know that. I think it's personally just their technology getting better, but tying it to the game is a very nice touch and draws you in more

I lol'd when they had all these reasons for Desmond's face to change and they just basically said, "Our graphics got better."

But I've seen the real model's face. It's very angular and more sleek, Desmond's has become more saggy and tired looking. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think that that was part of their way to not make him look like a supermodel. He has the same facial structure, but Desmond's been through a lot even before AC1, and he's not really super young.

CRUDFACE
10-08-2011, 11:15 PM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by t260z:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
I have to say though this really brings home for me how different he really does look than he did in previous . I still don't think it's a big deal because he is still recognizable but he looks so different compared to the previous ACII/ACB model.
In that recent interview we had with Darby and Poiker, they explained that in AC1, with abstergo's animus, the animus used exactly the face of the user, including hairstyle and facial hair.

Then in AC2 and ACB, the Assassin animus showed a cross between Desmond and Ezio, with Desmond as the base model, but things like facial hair, expressions, and wrinkles and hair being Ezio's.

Now in Revelations, either because of the black room or Rebecca's latest update (the code in a trailer shows us this is a new animus software version) it is showing full on what Ezio looked like.

That combined with the graphical enhancements makes Ezio look a lot different from what he used to.

And regarding how DESMOND has changed, actually, Desmond was based off the model whose face they scanned for Desmond in Revelations, so now Desmond looks more like they wanted him to look like in the first place.

The unnatural lighting of the Black Room and his more expressive face is throwing people off a bit. It's still unmistakably Desmond. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Very nice, I didn't know that. I think it's personally just their technology getting better, but tying it to the game is a very nice touch and draws you in more

I lol'd when they had all these reasons for Desmond's face to change and they just basically said, "Our graphics got better."

But I've seen the real model's face. It's very angular and more sleek, Desmond's has become more saggy and tired looking. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think that that was part of their way to not make him look like a supermodel. He has the same facial structure, but Desmond's been through a lot even before AC1, and he's not really super young. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Lol, I was talking more along the lines of Desmond basically looking less like him the more they upgrade his face to the model's.

hasn't AC only been going on for like two months in their time? that or a month and a half.

Desmond's only 25, still pretty young. Or Maybe I just want to believe that since it won't be long till I turn that XD

rileypoole1234
10-09-2011, 09:00 PM
Wow this is really good. You've done a great job! They've definitely increased the faces and facial animations and even the overall graphics just looks better. I'm so excited for this game, my excitement has far surpassed my excitement level for Brotherhood at this point. I'm also strangely elated that we finally get to see fully what Ezio really looked like.

Sarari
10-09-2011, 09:31 PM
I heard a reason as to why Desmond looks so different. Since he is in the black room, Desmond has a mixture of Altair and Ezio's face, because the animus cannot separate Desmond from Altair and Ezio, which combines their DNA's together to create a whole new face.

This is just a guess reason I heard from somewhere and it actually sounds like a good reason.

worsecuve
10-09-2011, 10:25 PM
Originally posted by Sarari:
I heard a reason as to why Desmond looks so different. Since he is in the black room, Desmond has a mixture of Altair and Ezio's face, because the animus cannot separate Desmond from Altair and Ezio, which combines their DNA's together to create a whole new face.

This is just a guess reason I heard from somewhere and it actually sounds like a good reason. Nah its wrong. The devs already said its just his new face.

E-Zekiel
10-10-2011, 12:36 AM
Honestly I prefer the original way they did it, and the original face.

I pretty much dismiss their explanation of facial differences as non-canonical unless it's actually gonna be mentioned in the game, because I think it's somewhat of a cop-out for just trying to update the graphics with ever-improving technology and such.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not saying they shouldn't improve, I just feel that they need not try to come up with an explanation, nor do they need to make unnecessary changes.

LightRey
10-10-2011, 12:49 AM
Originally posted by t260z:
Lol, I was talking more along the lines of Desmond basically looking less like him the more they upgrade his face to the model's.

hasn't AC only been going on for like two months in their time? that or a month and a half.

Desmond's only 25, still pretty young. Or Maybe I just want to believe that since it won't be long till I turn that XD
Eh, yeah. Calvarok, I don't know exactly what you consider to be "super young", but 25 isn't exactly old.

Calvarok
10-10-2011, 01:18 AM
Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by t260z:
Lol, I was talking more along the lines of Desmond basically looking less like him the more they upgrade his face to the model's.

hasn't AC only been going on for like two months in their time? that or a month and a half.

Desmond's only 25, still pretty young. Or Maybe I just want to believe that since it won't be long till I turn that XD
Eh, yeah. Calvarok, I don't know exactly what you consider to be "super young", but 25 isn't exactly old. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I don't say 25 wasn't young, but that it's not super young.

I know 13 year olds that can pass at 18+, I know 20 year olds who look like kids.

People can look too old or too young for their age.

LightRey
10-10-2011, 01:39 AM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by t260z:
Lol, I was talking more along the lines of Desmond basically looking less like him the more they upgrade his face to the model's.

hasn't AC only been going on for like two months in their time? that or a month and a half.

Desmond's only 25, still pretty young. Or Maybe I just want to believe that since it won't be long till I turn that XD
Eh, yeah. Calvarok, I don't know exactly what you consider to be "super young", but 25 isn't exactly old. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I don't say 25 wasn't young, but that it's not super young.

I know 13 year olds that can pass at 18+, I know 20 year olds who look like kids.

People can look too old or too young for their age. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yeah, but really, his previous model looked quite much like that of a 25 year old man. I see no reason to make him look older than he already did.

RzaRecta357
10-10-2011, 01:59 AM
When it comes to Desmond it's been like 6 years since buddy had his face scanned. Talk about totally judge and bring down the guy calling him old LMAO.

ANewOutlet
10-10-2011, 06:41 AM
The new guy is ugly. I don't care if they originally wanted him to look like that. Using a lame plot device like 0mGzZ w3 uPd@+3d +3h @n!mu$ is a pretty poor way to explain making an iconic character, who was reasonably good looking and instantly identifiable, ugly.

Grandmaster_Z
10-10-2011, 07:10 AM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
I have to say though this really brings home for me how different he really does look than he did in previous . I still don't think it's a big deal because he is still recognizable but he looks so different compared to the previous ACII/ACB model.
In that recent interview we had with Darby and Poiker, they explained that in AC1, with abstergo's animus, the animus used exactly the face of the user, including hairstyle and facial hair.

Then in AC2 and ACB, the Assassin animus showed a cross between Desmond and Ezio, with Desmond as the base model, but things like facial hair, expressions, and wrinkles and hair being Ezio's.

Now in Revelations, either because of the black room or Rebecca's latest update (the code in a trailer shows us this is a new animus software version) it is showing full on what Ezio looked like.

That combined with the graphical enhancements makes Ezio look a lot different from what he used to.

And regarding how DESMOND has changed, actually, Desmond was based off the model whose face they scanned for Desmond in Revelations, so now Desmond looks more like they wanted him to look like in the first place.

The unnatural lighting of the Black Room and his more expressive face is throwing people off a bit. It's still unmistakably Desmond. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

so how do they explain everyone else having original faces? how come al mualim doesnt look like desmond? etc.

kudos17
10-10-2011, 07:13 AM
Originally posted by ANewOutlet:
The new guy is ugly. I don't care if they originally wanted him to look like that. Using a lame plot device like 0mGzZ w3 uPd@+3d +3h @n!mu$ is a pretty poor way to explain making an iconic character, who was reasonably good looking and instantly identifiable, ugly.

Agreed. It's not so much that the face is ugly for me (although compared to the earlier versions, it is), but a matter of consistency. I can understand why Altair and Ezio go through such dramatic changes - the Animus. THAT I can understand, and to me it doesn't feel like a cop-out because that's how I always explained it in my head.

But changing Desmond? It makes no sense. And while he's still recognizable, it feels a little too different, especially after three previous games of close similarities.

Silvrslide
10-10-2011, 04:14 PM
Oh, so there is a fanbase worse than the sonic fanbase.

There is nothing wrong with the mans ****ing face he looks fine, we even get a closer look at him in a gameplay video and he looks fine. Stop getting your panties damp with menstrual blood.

Calvarok
10-10-2011, 04:28 PM
Originally posted by Grandmaster_Z:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
I have to say though this really brings home for me how different he really does look than he did in previous . I still don't think it's a big deal because he is still recognizable but he looks so different compared to the previous ACII/ACB model.
In that recent interview we had with Darby and Poiker, they explained that in AC1, with abstergo's animus, the animus used exactly the face of the user, including hairstyle and facial hair.

Then in AC2 and ACB, the Assassin animus showed a cross between Desmond and Ezio, with Desmond as the base model, but things like facial hair, expressions, and wrinkles and hair being Ezio's.

Now in Revelations, either because of the black room or Rebecca's latest update (the code in a trailer shows us this is a new animus software version) it is showing full on what Ezio looked like.

That combined with the graphical enhancements makes Ezio look a lot different from what he used to.

And regarding how DESMOND has changed, actually, Desmond was based off the model whose face they scanned for Desmond in Revelations, so now Desmond looks more like they wanted him to look like in the first place.

The unnatural lighting of the Black Room and his more expressive face is throwing people off a bit. It's still unmistakably Desmond. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

so how do they explain everyone else having original faces? how come al mualim doesnt look like desmond? etc. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Because Desmond is only reliving Altair, not Al Mualim.

Altair remembers Al Mualim as being a different person than himself, so obviously he won't have the same face as everyone.

Calvarok
10-10-2011, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by kudos17:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ANewOutlet:
The new guy is ugly. I don't care if they originally wanted him to look like that. Using a lame plot device like 0mGzZ w3 uPd@+3d +3h @n!mu$ is a pretty poor way to explain making an iconic character, who was reasonably good looking and instantly identifiable, ugly.

Agreed. It's not so much that the face is ugly for me (although compared to the earlier versions, it is), but a matter of consistency. I can understand why Altair and Ezio go through such dramatic changes - the Animus. THAT I can understand, and to me it doesn't feel like a cop-out because that's how I always explained it in my head.

But changing Desmond? It makes no sense. And while he's still recognizable, it feels a little too different, especially after three previous of close similarities. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Three previous games of pretty much the exact same character model is NOT a point in a game series' favor.

Games are supposed to eveolve. Retcons such as the exact shape and detail of a face are to be expected. Most critics are going to bash the game for not having changed enough. I don't think you understand how important that is.

kudos17
10-10-2011, 05:18 PM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kudos17:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ANewOutlet:
The new guy is ugly. I don't care if they originally wanted him to look like that. Using a lame plot device like 0mGzZ w3 uPd@+3d +3h @n!mu$ is a pretty poor way to explain making an iconic character, who was reasonably good looking and instantly identifiable, ugly.

Agreed. It's not so much that the face is ugly for me (although compared to the earlier versions, it is), but a matter of consistency. I can understand why Altair and Ezio go through such dramatic changes - the Animus. THAT I can understand, and to me it doesn't feel like a cop-out because that's how I always explained it in my head.

But changing Desmond? It makes no sense. And while he's still recognizable, it feels a little too different, especially after three previous of close similarities. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Three previous games of pretty much the exact same character model is NOT a point in a game series' favor.

Games are supposed to eveolve. Retcons such as the exact shape and detail of a face are to be expected. Most critics are going to bash the game for not having changed enough. I don't think you understand how important that is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

When I hear "evolve", I think gameplay and general graphics, as well as how those changes are executed. AC:R's graphics are beautiful, and the gameplay is interesting. The character model of Desmond, I find less so.

When a character evolves, it should be mostly emotional. We should see Desmond grow as a person, and flesh out as a true character. If his looks are to be updated at all - then they should be just that. Updates, not full on overhauls.

Granted, Desmond looks fine the way he is now, but it's more the fact that he's too different. If this is how he had basically looked in the past games, then I'd have no trouble. But it most certainly is not.

In fact, I think that's my biggest issue with Desmond. Ubisoft can just NOT DECIDE how they want him to look. First game? Plain white hoodie, normal looking dude. Second? Same character, but definitely more stylized. Third? Hoodie now suddenly has a giant freakin' eagle symbol on the back, with a red interior and other such details. Not to mention that, once again, his overall face has been tweaked. Now we arrive at Revelations where the details of the face are more obviously changed.

I have no problem with them adding more details to the face. I encourage it. But to even the untrained eye, the face is far from what we remember of the past three games, not to mention that it's not even really close to Fransico Randez's anymore, in anything but the basic soul of the art. A little more consistency in the main character is all I ask.

kalo.yanis
10-10-2011, 05:43 PM
I mean, I understand upgrading the engine will add some detail and texture to the face and blah blah, but can we please keep the facial structure consistent? Or at least, if it's gonna change, make it better. Ahem...

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f195/NightBlade151/funkyDesmond.png

http://static2.dmcdn.net/static/video/958/999/32999859:jpeg_preview_large.jpg?20110701175009

Sarari
10-10-2011, 06:22 PM
Desmond's facial expression looks like Niko Bellic's when S16 is explaining all that stuff. He like gives a "wtf?" smiling stare and bobs his head a bit lol. I pay attention to those kind of things.

kudos17
10-10-2011, 06:33 PM
Originally posted by NBST:
I mean, I understand upgrading the engine will add some detail and texture to the face and blah blah, but can we please keep the facial structure consistent? Or at least, if it's gonna change, make it better. Ahem...

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f195/NightBlade151/funkyDesmond.png

http://static2.dmcdn.net/static/video/958/999/32999859:jpeg_preview_large.jpg?20110701175009

Those images right there are a great reference. The Brotherhood one pictured, in my opinion, is the best face yet and fits Desmond perfectly. Looks his age, and strongly built. The Revelations one pictured looks sad and droopy. I'll still have to play the game to get a true feel for the new face, but as it stands now I believe the Brotherhood version is far better.

AkeiraXgamer
10-10-2011, 06:38 PM
^ http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Gave me a scare since I never saw ACR!Desmond

Looks alot like ACR!Ezio, I think someone said that the theory was that with the animus glitching, it's getting the two profiles mixed up or something.

Good thing it'll only be until AC3 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Sarari
10-10-2011, 06:41 PM
You know what I noticed, the faces are actually a lot better. If you see Desmond's video when he wakes up, he looks exactly the same as ACB, but with a beard and more detail. If you look at Altair's face when he speaks to Al Mualim in the demo, his face looks fine. It actually looks great. But the problem Ubisoft made with the faces is how they look from an angle. The picture of Desmond above is an example. His nose and cheeks look misshaped. But in the vid he wakes up he looks fine. When Altair sees Al Mualim being held by the Templars and speaks to the traitor, his face looks horrible. It's because they didn't get his face right from the bottom angle. His eyes were weird, his jaw, everything. I'll post pictures up later if you guys want.

Jexx21
10-10-2011, 07:13 PM
I got the first picture from a video, the rest are all from the wiki.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/JoshTheDude/Stuff/desmondface.png

In order-
ACR
AC1
AC2
ACB
ACB Concept Art

The truth is, Desmond's face in ACB is practically completely off the mark. I'm sorry I couldn't get a frontal shot of his face though, I'll edit it once I get ACB downloaded and can get my own shots or when I find a good shot of his ACB face in a video.

Calvarok
10-10-2011, 07:25 PM
Originally posted by kudos17:
When I hear "evolve", I think gameplay and general graphics, as well as how those changes are executed. AC:R's graphics are beautiful, and the gameplay is interesting. The character model of Desmond, I find less so.

When a character evolves, it should be mostly emotional. We should see Desmond grow as a person, and flesh out as a true character. If his looks are to be updated at all - then they should be just that. Updates, not full on overhauls.

Granted, Desmond looks fine the way he is now, but it's more the fact that he's too different. If this is how he had basically looked in the past games, then I'd have no trouble. But it most certainly is not.

In fact, I think that's my biggest issue with Desmond. Ubisoft can just NOT DECIDE how they want him to look. First game? Plain white hoodie, normal looking . Second? Same character, but definitely more stylized. Third? Hoodie now suddenly has a giant freakin' eagle symbol on the back, with a red interior and other such details. Not to mention that, once again, his overall face has been tweaked. Now we arrive at Revelations where the details of the face are more obviously changed.

I have no problem with them adding more details to the face. I encourage it. But to even the untrained eye, the face is far from what we remember of the past three games, not to mention that it's not even really close to Fransico Randez's anymore, in anything but the basic soul of the art. A little more consistency in the main character is all I ask.
God forbid he change his clothes.

He's only done it once, you know. And he's been in this mess for about two months. That's not exactly unusual.

As for it looking worse, I really don't think it does. Desmond's AC2 and aCB face look like a caricature to me.

I don't see droopiness in the above pictures, I see sadness. from a low angle

I look like that with a sad expression from a low angle, and I'm only 17.

He doesn't have any wrinkles or anything. I think when you guys get into the game and actually look at his character model and face, instead of choosing scenes where the camera is looking up his nose and freezing them, he'll look a lot better.

And regardless, the AC2 ACB desmond face was heavily stylized. This is more photorealistic. It's more of a retcon in the style with which characters are portrayed in the game than changing what they look like but keeping the same style.

Just look at the eyes in his pictures. they convey more sadness than Desmond's old face did when he was killing his best friend, and they're conveying a subtler emotion than anger.

Go to the mirror. Make your saddest face. Make your happiest face. Make one in between. Observe how different your fully human and non-3D animated face can look just because of a change in expression.

AC2-Brotherhood faces were rather flacid in that regard. You couldn't see any muscles working in them, the foreheads didn't wrinkle and crease and pull across the skin, the brow stayed uniform.

I will say it again: people are being thrown off by the expressiveness.

And really, if you just went through any scene in Brotherhood, you could freeze and take a screen of a character looking bad almost immediately. that's why these faces are meant to be seen in motion.

Sarari
10-10-2011, 07:33 PM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kudos17:
When I hear "evolve", I think gameplay and general graphics, as well as how those changes are executed. AC:R's graphics are beautiful, and the gameplay is interesting. The character model of Desmond, I find less so.

When a character evolves, it should be mostly emotional. We should see Desmond grow as a person, and flesh out as a true character. If his looks are to be updated at all - then they should be just that. Updates, not full on overhauls.

Granted, Desmond looks fine the way he is now, but it's more the fact that he's too different. If this is how he had basically looked in the past games, then I'd have no trouble. But it most certainly is not.

In fact, I think that's my biggest issue with Desmond. Ubisoft can just NOT DECIDE how they want him to look. First game? Plain white hoodie, normal looking . Second? Same character, but definitely more stylized. Third? Hoodie now suddenly has a giant freakin' eagle symbol on the back, with a red interior and other such details. Not to mention that, once again, his overall face has been tweaked. Now we arrive at Revelations where the details of the face are more obviously changed.

I have no problem with them adding more details to the face. I encourage it. But to even the untrained eye, the face is far from what we remember of the past three games, not to mention that it's not even really close to Fransico Randez's anymore, in anything but the basic soul of the art. A little more consistency in the main character is all I ask.
God forbid he change his clothes.

He's only done it once, you know. And he's been in this mess for about two months. That's not exactly unusual.

As for it looking worse, I really don't think it does. Desmond's AC2 and aCB face look like a caricature to me.

I don't see droopiness in the above pictures, I see sadness. from a low angle

I look like that with a sad expression from a low angle, and I'm only 17.

He doesn't have any wrinkles or anything. I think when you guys get into the game and actually look at his character model and face, instead of choosing scenes where the camera is looking up his nose and freezing them, he'll look a lot better.

And regardless, the AC2 ACB desmond face was heavily stylized. This is more photorealistic. It's more of a retcon in the style with which characters are portrayed in the game than changing what they look like but keeping the same style.

Just look at the eyes in his pictures. they convey more sadness than Desmond's old face did when he was killing his best friend, and they're conveying a subtler emotion than anger.

Go to the mirror. Make your saddest face. Make your happiest face. Make one in between. Observe how different your fully human and non-3D animated face can look just because of a change in expression.

AC2-Brotherhood faces were rather flacid in that regard. You couldn't see any muscles working in them, the foreheads didn't wrinkle and crease and pull across the skin, the brow stayed uniform.

I will say it again: people are being thrown off by the expressiveness.

And really, if you just went through any scene in Brotherhood, you could freeze and take a screen of a character looking bad almost immediately. that's why these faces are meant to be seen in motion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I agree with you, but sometimes showing emotions in the game looks weird. I know they're trying to be more realistic but sometimes realisticness doesn't work with all games (when it comes to facial expression). But I can't wait to see what It actually turns out to look like in the end http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Jexx21
10-10-2011, 07:36 PM
Err.. the realisticness is looking real good at the moment in the videos we've seen.

Sarari
10-10-2011, 07:43 PM
Originally posted by Jexx21:
Err.. the realisticness is looking real good at the moment in the videos we've seen.
Except from the angles. They needa fix that with Altair and Desmond.

Calvarok
10-10-2011, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by Sarari:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jexx21:
Err.. the realisticness is looking real good at the moment in the videos we've seen.
Except from the angles. They needa fix that with Altair and Desmond. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
People don't look good from all angles.

Neither did the Brotherhood faces.

Jexx21
10-10-2011, 07:46 PM
Originally posted by Sarari:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jexx21:
Err.. the realisticness is looking real good at the moment in the videos we've seen.
Except from the angles. They needa fix that with Altair and Desmond. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Really? I thought they both looked good..

Sarari
10-10-2011, 08:04 PM
Remember when Altair looked up and saw Al Mualim held captive? Yea, he looks totally different there than when he looks at Al Mualim eye to eye.

And they didn't show people from bottom angles much. I can't name a time.

kudos17
10-10-2011, 08:11 PM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kudos17:
When I hear "evolve", I think gameplay and general graphics, as well as how those changes are executed. AC:R's graphics are beautiful, and the gameplay is interesting. The character model of Desmond, I find less so.

When a character evolves, it should be mostly emotional. We should see Desmond grow as a person, and flesh out as a true character. If his looks are to be updated at all - then they should be just that. Updates, not full on overhauls.

Granted, Desmond looks fine the way he is now, but it's more the fact that he's too different. If this is how he had basically looked in the past games, then I'd have no trouble. But it most certainly is not.

In fact, I think that's my biggest issue with Desmond. Ubisoft can just NOT DECIDE how they want him to look. First game? Plain white hoodie, normal looking . Second? Same character, but definitely more stylized. Third? Hoodie now suddenly has a giant freakin' eagle symbol on the back, with a red interior and other such details. Not to mention that, once again, his overall face has been tweaked. Now we arrive at Revelations where the details of the face are more obviously changed.

I have no problem with them adding more details to the face. I encourage it. But to even the untrained eye, the face is far from what we remember of the past three games, not to mention that it's not even really close to Fransico Randez's anymore, in anything but the basic soul of the art. A little more consistency in the main character is all I ask.
God forbid he change his clothes.

He's only done it once, you know. And he's been in this mess for about two months. That's not exactly unusual.

As for it looking worse, I really don't think it does. Desmond's AC2 and aCB face look like a caricature to me.

I don't see droopiness in the above pictures, I see sadness. from a low angle

I look like that with a sad expression from a low angle, and I'm only 17.

He doesn't have any wrinkles or anything. I think when you guys get into the game and actually look at his character model and face, instead of choosing scenes where the camera is looking up his nose and freezing them, he'll look a lot better.

And regardless, the AC2 ACB desmond face was heavily stylized. This is more photorealistic. It's more of a retcon in the style with which characters are portrayed in the game than changing what they look like but keeping the same style.

Just look at the eyes in his pictures. they convey more sadness than Desmond's old face did when he was killing his best friend, and they're conveying a subtler emotion than anger.

Go to the mirror. Make your saddest face. Make your happiest face. Make one in between. Observe how different your fully human and non-3D animated face can look just because of a change in expression.

AC2-Brotherhood faces were rather flacid in that regard. You couldn't see any muscles working in them, the foreheads didn't wrinkle and crease and pull across the skin, the brow stayed uniform.

I will say it again: people are being thrown off by the expressiveness.

And really, if you just went through any scene in Brotherhood, you could freeze and take a screen of a character looking bad almost immediately. that's why these faces are meant to be seen in motion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't think he would've went from a plain white jacket in AC2 to a similar jacket with an eagle symbol on the back during the truck ride that took place before AC:B, but since we didn't actually see that take place I'll give you that one.

Anyways, perhaps you have a point. Most of what I've seen of AC:R Desmond are in bad lighting and from odd angles. Also, there are some pictures where the similarities in basic facial structure are still very noticeable compared to the other games. Admittedly, the new way the faces convey emotion in AC:R will obviously have something to do with the differences in detail as well.

I suppose I'll just have to wait until I play the game to really get a feel for how the look pans out. There's really no other way to get a good capture of it. And again, I've never hated the "new" look, but it really threw me off compared to the stiffer, stylized versions.

cgdemon894
10-10-2011, 08:24 PM
Originally posted by Jexx21:
I got the first picture from a video, the rest are all from the wiki.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/JoshTheDude/Stuff/desmondface.png

In order-
ACR
AC1
AC2
ACB
ACB Concept Art



The truth is, Desmond's face in ACB is practically completely off the mark. I'm sorry I couldn't get a frontal shot of his face though, I'll edit it once I get ACB downloaded and can get my own shots or when I find a good shot of his ACB face in a video.


Front sht of the Desmond ACB model
http://oi55.tinypic.com/2ujowhk.jpg

Calvarok
10-10-2011, 08:38 PM
Originally posted by Sarari:
Remember when Altair looked up and saw Al Mualim held captive? Yea, he looks totally different there than when he looks at Al Mualim eye to eye.

And they didn't show people from bottom angles much. I can't name a time.

That was because he was squinting to see Al Mualim in the distance before, and he was standing on lower ground so he had to angle his head up. Another reason they're looking different is because prior AC game shave never showed characters in such dynamic and unconventional poses before. Ususally Ezio is standing straight up as he talks, on flat ground.

I noticed in Brotherhood that after the first sequence all the animation looked a lot more static, and it got worse as the game went on, until the last sequence, where it was almost as good.

But judging from what we saw that's halfway through the game (The E3 gameplay) the level of quality is much more consistent.

Sarari
10-10-2011, 08:46 PM
Yea but remember when Altair was standing on flat ground talking to the traitor when he killed him? His face still looked awkward.

Calvarok
10-10-2011, 09:01 PM
Originally posted by Sarari:
Yea but remember when Altair was standing on flat ground talking to the traitor when he killed him? His face still looked awkward.
No, his face was being shown from below, while he stood over the traitor. we're used to him being shown from slightly above as he leans over, during the memory corridor moments.

And really, I though his face looked fine then. His face was more impassive afterwards with Al Mualim.

Arabjah
05-26-2012, 05:34 PM
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