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Mehring1917
01-07-2008, 01:05 PM
Hi all
I've been flying IL-2 1946 v4.8 around six months now, mostly trying to work my way through German pilot careers which begin with Bf 109 E, progressing through F2/4, and as a rookie, well, I haven't got any further yet.

I've jumped forward a few times, though, to fly various later model 109s as well as FW 190's and other planes like the Ta, er, 152(?). What I can't help but notice is that although the FW planes are much less stable in flight than the 109s, none of the planes mentioned above can I get to fly faster than than the humble 109 E, which, at between 1000-3500M I can usually get to cruise at about 400-420 kph.

The F series has much greater RPM, but does it really achieve greater speeds? The FW 190 is hard pressed even to match the 109 E in level flight, so what's all the fuss about? Or hopefully, what am I doing wrong?

Any advice welcome.

Mehring1917
01-26-2008, 11:07 AM
Hmm, surprised no response to this. Is it that you all think I'm too much of a dumbkopf to be worthy of an answer? Or are you all kings with no clothes, flying your butcher snails at half their historical speeds?

What I've found with some half scientific testing

Assuming the speedos don't lie, max level flight speeds @ 3000m -

FW 190 A4 410kph @ 35-40% prop pitch/85-90% throttle, about 2200rpm Can't catch up with an AI 1941 spitfire!

Bf 109 F2/4 440kph @ above settings, about 2100-2200rpm

Bf 109 E4 420kph on auto, 70-80% throttle

These are not the max speeds quoted in the game Aircraft Objects. Is there something wrong with my game or is the game hopelessly wrong? Somebody around here must know.

han freak solo
01-26-2008, 12:01 PM
I never saw your first post. I'm surprised some Luft experten haven't jumped in to give you advice.

1st thing. The AI will almost always out fly you in the speed, climb, and dive departments. That's partly because they have all their trim and engine controls set instantly and perfectly. You have to out maneuver the AI or let 'em go.

I haven't compared the speeds of the birds in the sim in quite some time. Someone else needs to come along and help you there. Some questions on where you are reading your speed from though.

1. From the instrument panel which is indicated air speed.

or

2. From the "no-cockpit" view which is true airspeed (if I remember correctly).

They both are usually different.

Waldo.Pepper
01-26-2008, 12:02 PM
"Now all we need to know is how fast we're going. We can easily see our Indicated Air Speed in the Speedbar and also read the airspeed indicator gage. Both will give you the same measurement. However, it is important to tell you that Indicated Air Speed (IAS) is affected by higher altitudes and you won't be getting a True Air Speed (TAS) reading. In other words, the reading on the gage is close to your true ground speed but it is not exact. In real life you'd have to make some corrections to achieve accurate navigation or level bombing operations."

From the Nugget thread that you should read completely.

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/9121094645

thefruitbat
01-26-2008, 12:33 PM
Originally posted by Mehring1917:
Hmm, surprised no response to this. Is it that you all think I'm too much of a dumbkopf to be worthy of an answer? Or are you all kings with no clothes, flying your butcher snails at half their historical speeds?

What I've found with some half scientific testing

Assuming the speedos don't lie, max level flight speeds @ 3000m -

FW 190 A4 410kph @ 35-40% prop pitch/85-90% throttle, about 2200rpm Can't catch up with an AI 1941 spitfire!

Bf 109 F2/4 440kph @ above settings, about 2100-2200rpm

Bf 109 E4 420kph on auto, 70-80% throttle

These are not the max speeds quoted in the game Aircraft Objects. Is there something wrong with my game or is the game hopelessly wrong? Somebody around here must know.

Leave the other planes on auto pitch, in blue planes all your doing is slowing yourself down. If you cant catch a spit vb in a 190a4, your flying is the reason. At 3000m your 30kmh quicker, at 560 TAS. Make sure the plane is trimmed, and close your rads to get top speed.

As you descend your advantage grows, at sealevel the a4 is 80kph faster.

fruitbat

ElAurens
01-26-2008, 12:35 PM
35 to 45% prop pitch?

You won't go very fast like that.

Mehring1917
01-30-2008, 01:33 AM
How strange, most of this thread has just disappeared!

kid_SA
01-30-2008, 02:32 AM
yup, the Great Clean.

In case it was missed: your PP is the problem. Guides have a bad habit of actually explaining what prop pitch does (and they do that very well) instead of saying that in this game, bar a very few exceptions, you are NOT controlling prop pitch (the 109 is one such exception) but are instead controlling RPM. To go faster, simply give it more RPM.

Don't touch the 109's PP settings, that will come later (much later).

The 190A series has a weird setup. In short: manual pitch gives you a CSP like control, where you tweak the RPM. Taking a 190 to manual and leaving it at 100% PP will give you more speed. Might over-rev in a dive though, so watch for that.

By the way, if you take a Spit and take it to 30% RPM (still called Prop Pitch in game) it will also undergo the same large reduction in speed.

Also, in real life, damage to the engine will happen if the RPM percentage is lower than the throttle. Diving at 60%PP and 100% throttle or cruising at high throttle and low PP is unrealistic; and while I have seen some people saying that it gives you a boost to dive with reduced PP (still really RPM) I have not seen hard, conclusive proof. In any case, even if this is true, the margin is small.

M_Gunz
01-30-2008, 03:22 AM
Mehring, did you get good info to solve the problem with?

Mehring1917
01-30-2008, 05:07 AM
I certainly did, thanks, the names fruitbat and han freak solo come to mind particularly. Also good comparisons of how things are in game and were in real life. Like kid_SA points out that low throttle and high PP is unrealistic. With 109 Fs I swear it works in IL-2.

It turned out that my biggest confusion lay in reading the nugget's guide a little too well, rather than in reading it partly or not at all. At high altitudes the IAS is nowhere near TAS, let alone "close to," it differs by nearly 1/3. So, where my IAS was 440kph, the TAS was about 640kph.

Also the 190 clearly functions differently from the 190, so I now fly with much higher throtle and PP, or, better, just fly auto.

While I'm here, though, anyone know how to asign a seperate axis to each engine on a multi-engined craft? I'm not making full use of my throttle quad atm.

JG53Frankyboy
01-30-2008, 05:42 AM
get the latest version of il2compare.
it is in most cases accurate in the shown speeds that the ingame planes can reach.


in game , if you want get the highest speed - use always full throttle and the full pitch.

leave the Daimler Benz driven planes on auto concerning their propeller setting.

Mehring1917
01-30-2008, 07:39 AM
Done some more tests and it looks like I was wrong about low prop pitch, even on 109Fs.

Margins are small in IAS at 3000m but near ground level it's all too evident. I got about 480kph IAS at 500m flying at 110% on auto. Never done that with pp at 35% http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BadA1m
01-30-2008, 07:57 AM
The learnig curve is quite long in IL2, that's why most will recommend really getting comfortable in one plane, get your technique perfected, then move on to others, adding to what you've learned as you go.

As for throttle axes, you only have one, sorry mate. It's a limitation of the now quite elderly game engine of IL2.