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View Full Version : Mustang III vs p51DNAwhatever



CaptainGelo
03-20-2006, 09:13 AM
ehrm, why is mustang 70km/h faster? its so ugly and stuff... and bubble p51 is so pritty http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

JtD
03-20-2006, 09:19 AM
Because it has an additional 400 hp.

70 kph? What altitude?

CaptainGelo
03-20-2006, 09:25 AM
Originally posted by JtD:
Because it has an additional 400 hp.

70 kph? What altitude?

sea level

DaimonSyrius
03-20-2006, 10:13 AM
Originally posted by oleg86:
ehrm, why is mustang 70km/h faster? its so ugly and stuff... and bubble p51 is so pritty
Because Mustang III is using higher grade fuel, which allowed the engine to be run at higher manifold pressure at low altitudes, thus providing more HP.

Cheers,
S.

P.S.: From Readme_v401.rtf,

New Aircraft
.../...
Mustang MK.III, 1944 - RAF only, 25 Lbs (8l inches) engine boost, 642 km/h on Sea Level

*Edit* polished the answer a bit

JG52Karaya-X
03-20-2006, 10:15 AM
Both the P51D-5NT and D-20NA can reach ~600-605km/h TAS at sealevel - the Mustang Mk.III reaches 640km/h TAS at that altitude... makes 40km/h difference not 70 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

And yes, the MarkIII was a very special and also rare version as it was intended to hunt V1s and thus was overboosted compared to normal B/C Mustangs and furthermore these kind of planes usually had a far better finish than normal series planes with sealed gun ports and stuff which gave them that little bit of extra speed.

Capt.LoneRanger
03-20-2006, 10:19 AM
MkIII has stronger engine and less weight (e.g. 4 cal50s against the 6 of a P51)

SnapdLikeAMutha
03-20-2006, 10:58 AM
Because Mustang III is British http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

As I understand, the bubble canopy actually added drag as compared to the razorback/Malcolm hood versions.

JG53Frankyboy
03-20-2006, 11:04 AM
well, actually the P-51C has also a default skin that makes it more a RAF Mustang Mk.III than an USAAF P-51C.

this is just a "normal"/early Mustang Mk.III , the so called Mk.III a later one. With already mentioned modelled to use 150octan fuel that enabled its engine to run at a higher boost level (=25lb).

its the "same" like the Spitfire Mk.IXc and the Spitfire Mk.IX 25lb - in general same plane, but with the later one using better fuel and there fore able to reach higher powersettings.


it would be fantastic if the Maddox team would set the P-51D-20NA also to a later/higher powersetting - more difference between the two P-51Ds and i think the most Mustangpilots would enjoy that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

DaimonSyrius
03-20-2006, 11:11 AM
Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
it would be fantastic if the Maddox team would set the P-51D-20NA also to a later/higher powersetting - more difference between the two P-51Ds and i think the most Mustangpilots would enjoy that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
Frankyboy speaks truth http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif‚ ‚ ‚ http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Cheers,
S.

jds1978
03-20-2006, 03:26 PM
Originally posted by DaimonSyrius:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
it would be fantastic if the Maddox team would set the P-51D-20NA also to a later/higher powersetting - more difference between the two P-51Ds and i think the most Mustangpilots would enjoy that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
Frankyboy speaks truth http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif‚ ‚ ‚ http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Cheers,
S. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

3.JG51_BigBear
03-20-2006, 06:50 PM
Bump for an uprated P-51D. Tagert had posted a bunch of pics with D model Mustangs whose stencils showed that they were running higher octain fuel.

Slickun
03-21-2006, 07:18 AM
There were P-51B/C/D running 81" hg/25 pounds of boost operated by the Brits. Not rare at all. They had another 300 hp or so above -7 engines operating at 67" hg, and their performance was a lot peppier.

The 8th AF operated at 72" hg, about another 100 hp. Their performance gain, though substantial, was not as pronounced.

In the Pacific, the two groups operating from Iwo Jima operated their P-51D's at 80" hg, again, about another 300 hp.

All the boosted -7 engines operating above 67" hg required 150, or in the case of the Iwo birds, 145 octane fuel.

Comparisons of later war birds with P-51D's operating at 67" hg and a full load of fuel are "unfair". It is much more representative to look at a model operating at a higher boost and mostly empty fuselage tank for 1945.

JG5_UnKle
03-21-2006, 07:39 AM
+1 for uprated D

mynameisroland
03-21-2006, 07:55 AM
Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
well, actually the P-51C has also a default skin that makes it more a RAF Mustang Mk.III than an USAAF P-51C.

this is just a "normal"/early Mustang Mk.III , the so called Mk.III a later one. With already mentioned modelled to use 150octan fuel that enabled its engine to run at a higher boost level (=25lb).

its the "same" like the Spitfire Mk.IXc and the Spitfire Mk.IX 25lb - in general same plane, but with the later one using better fuel and there fore able to reach higher powersettings.


it would be fantastic if the Maddox team would set the P-51D-20NA also to a later/higher powersetting - more difference between the two P-51Ds and i think the most Mustangpilots would enjoy that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Ofcourse Mustang D pilots would enjoy travelling 40km/h faster than every other aircraft bar the Mustang III. Id enjoy flying around in a Fw 190 A4 1.42 plenty of those were around yet there not in the game.

JG53Frankyboy
03-21-2006, 08:36 AM
Originally posted by Slickun:
.............
In the Pacific, the two groups operating from Iwo Jima operated their P-51D's at 80" hg, again, about another 300 hp.

............

espacially such a plane i had in mind - for 1945 operations over the Kyushu map http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
and sure over Berlin http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

but please, IF (what i doubt), no new Mustang variant........ just upgrade the already in game P-51D-20NA

jds1978
03-21-2006, 01:33 PM
Originally posted by mynameisroland:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
well, actually the P-51C has also a default skin that makes it more a RAF Mustang Mk.III than an USAAF P-51C.

this is just a "normal"/early Mustang Mk.III , the so called Mk.III a later one. With already mentioned modelled to use 150octan fuel that enabled its engine to run at a higher boost level (=25lb).

its the "same" like the Spitfire Mk.IXc and the Spitfire Mk.IX 25lb - in general same plane, but with the later one using better fuel and there fore able to reach higher powersettings.


it would be fantastic if the Maddox team would set the P-51D-20NA also to a later/higher powersetting - more difference between the two P-51Ds and i think the most Mustangpilots would enjoy that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Ofcourse Mustang D pilots would enjoy travelling 40km/h faster than every other aircraft bar the Mustang III. Id enjoy flying around in a Fw 190 A4 1.42 plenty of those were around yet there not in the game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/crackwhip.gif

ElAurens
03-21-2006, 05:49 PM
Also remember that the USAAF razorback P51 B/C was about 20mph faster than the D model at altitude as well, owing to it's more aerodynamic shape.

VW-IceFire
03-21-2006, 09:14 PM
Originally posted by ElAurens:
Also remember that the USAAF razorback P51 B/C was about 20mph faster than the D model at altitude as well, owing to it's more aerodynamic shape.
I thought that had more to do with the engine tuning. The B and C models early on mounted an engine that was much more like the Merlin 61 than the Merlin 66 (sorry I can't remember it in the USAAF engine nomenclature). The P-51D moved the critical altitude down a little so the overall top speed was a bit lower but overall top speed was improved at medium and low altitudes.

Speed difference was more like 5mph at critical altitude...

ElAurens
03-21-2006, 09:26 PM
P51 B and or C had a top speed of around 440mph at critical altitude

D versions were around 425mph.

Mostly due to the lower drag razorback fuselage.

CaptainGelo
03-21-2006, 11:17 PM
Originally posted by JG52Karaya-X:
Both the P51D-5NT and D-20NA can reach ~600-605km/h TAS at sealevel - the Mustang Mk.III reaches 640km/h TAS at that altitude... makes 40km/h difference not 70 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

.

I'd like to see you do that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

JtD
03-21-2006, 11:20 PM
Main difference was engine, not aerodynamics. Just like IceFire said. -3 vs. -7 Packards.

Kurfurst__
03-22-2006, 12:06 AM
Originally posted by Slickun:
There were P-51B/C/D running 81" hg/25 pounds of boost operated by the Brits. Not rare at all.

Two Squadrons of P-51B/C employed during the V-1 menace, to be exact, ie. 24 operational aircraft.

JG53Frankyboy
03-22-2006, 01:43 AM
before the bashing begins (as always in such topics http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif ), here is an enjoyable read about the IWO Jima Mustang operations.

http://506thfightergroup.org/mustangsofiwo.asp

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

DmdSeeker
03-22-2006, 07:05 AM
I thought this was very interesting:

http://506thfightergroup.org/p51.asp

Slickun
03-22-2006, 10:24 AM
P51 B and or C had a top speed of around 440mph at critical altitude

D versions were around 425mph.

Mostly due to the lower drag razorback fuselage.

Slick says:

Mustangs with the -3 went 450.

Mustangs with the -7 went 440+.

That's with full fuel etc. at 67" hg. Speed increased as fuel was burned and the plane got lighter.

http://www.spitfireperformance.com/mustang/p51d-15342.html

Gives a good overview of this. The latest addition to the speed tests shows a P-51D, with wing racks, with less than a full fuel load, going 442 mph. This is the state most LW fighters would have found a P-51D over the continent.