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View Full Version : Best Joystick/controller for Pacific Fighters?



drmathprog
05-03-2005, 01:29 PM
Title.

ElAurens
05-03-2005, 01:37 PM
You are going to get a lot of differing opinions on this one. But, first we need to know what kind of money you are willing to spend. there are many choices than span the range from $30 US to $350+ US.

Two brand names that I have used and like are Saitek and CH Products.

horseback
05-03-2005, 01:49 PM
The best controller you can muster for Pacific Fighters is an all CH Products HOTAS-I've used a Combatstick/Pro Pedals/Pro Throttle combination for the last three years without a hitch. Using CHControlManager softwear, you can put together a six axis, 30 button + POV hat controller, which should meet most of your needs.

Look here

http://www.chproducts.com/retail/index.html

for ideas, but use their list of suppliers to shop around for the best price. If you have a Frys' Electronics in your area, a setup similar to mine can be had for $300 USD plus sales tax.

Some controllers may claim to have more/better features, but none dare claim better quality.

cheers

horseback

major_setback
05-03-2005, 01:54 PM
Welcome to the club!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

You might like to read this recent post.... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/5941049613

BenvZijl
05-03-2005, 02:05 PM
i just ordered a hotas set from CH products and pedals also from ch. they will arrive next week but what i hear and read about them is very good

drmathprog
05-03-2005, 02:48 PM
I didn't realize that the better ones were so expensive. Is there a consensus "best value" choice in the lower price range?

uberchuckie
05-03-2005, 02:48 PM
Some people like to use the throttle from the X45 with their Fighterstick/Pro pedals. You get to keep the knobs for rudder/elevator trim.

drmathprog
05-03-2005, 03:08 PM
These are probably stupid questions, but I can't tell from the Saitek web site: does the X-45 handle the rudder also, or not?

x6BL_Brando
05-03-2005, 04:20 PM
The Saitek rudder is a fudge .. a rocker switch in the throttle handle; awkwardly-placed, it doesn't centre very well and is a nightmare if you have small hands. So a pair of pedals is well worth the outlay. I use CH gear, incredibly rugged and with very good, WHQL-approved drivers that make the programming of the beast a real snap.

Also, horseback forgot to mention that there are three modes that can be used (a simple button-push) and so there are actually more than 90 available commands on the stick itself. You can do similar with the throttle too, plus the pedals include brakes and steering plus a spare slider control.

The kit IS expensive, but the support is tremendous, the kit 1st class, and you will have enormous difficulty breaking it. I guess it all depends on whether you have the bug or not! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Atomic_Marten
05-03-2005, 04:27 PM
Originally posted by drmathprog:
These are probably stupid questions, but I can't tell from the Saitek web site: does the X-45 handle the rudder also, or not?

Uhh.. you should check few of my recent posts about X45 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif. I have X45 and also I have bought today Cyborg EVO. IMO EVO has rudder control much, much better solved than X45. X45 has rudder control on the throttle lever.

Which is not really so difficult considering the fact that X45 has unusable rudder control (well, if you don't believe me try it for yourself). You can use it on taxiing, for some manoeuvres etc., but most importantly you can not expect satisfactory usage when *in combat* (that goes for aiming -- rudder corrections when aiming are out of question with X45). It is extremely unprecise.
IMO, if I had this knowledge before, I would never purchase X45.

EVO is decent joystick and has everything OK. Another words, it is good buy. Cannot tell more about it because I have that stick in use for about two hours now (about durability etc..).

fuser59
05-03-2005, 06:23 PM
As good as the "CH" Equipment is, dont they have any Joysticks that are Force Feedback? I cant understand why in the world some Company out there cant get it togeather and come up with a great Combat Stick (Such as the previously famous MS Force Feedback Joystick). To me, flying just isn't the same without one.

x6BL_Brando
05-04-2005, 06:22 AM
As good as the "CH" Equipment is, dont they have any Joysticks that are Force Feedback?

You're not alone in that request Fuser. Many CH owners would love to have that capability. CH are aware of the interest but I think it would demand a radical turnaround in design and production - a lot of investment for a small market.

I've owned both marks of MS FF stick - the Pro was the best until WinXP came along - and the FF2 was good also - but the sales policy was one based on disposability. They would last X amount of time and then we bought another - replacement springs or switches were never offered, and no repair service or even tech support existed. And then they stopped making them altogether.....

I feel your pain http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif I've just learnt to live without force-feedback, and the Fighterstick and pedals go a long way to making up for it

TgD Thunderbolt56
05-04-2005, 06:41 AM
CH was the first to market back in the day with a force-feedback stick. They made the decision to focus more on functionality, durability and precision which the early FFB versions lacked. There have been many discussions polls and threads in their forums.

Force-feedback may be in the future for CH, but I wouldn't let that stop me from getting a CH setup.


TB

Reaves_42
05-04-2005, 10:56 PM
I use a Logitech Wingman Force + the pedals from my Thrustmaster Force Racing wheel for the rudder. I have no problems with it and the force feedback makes the game even better.

Both controllers are pretty cheap and I certainly wouldn't expect them to have the quality of more expensive brands but the pedals for rudders cannot be beaten. It has perfect precision and is much better for immersion.

XyZspineZyX
05-05-2005, 07:07 AM
Hello,

I did recently buy a Saitek X52. It is maybe a little much for IL2 but it is great, precise and smooth. There is a rudder axis on the joystick it self and it can be disabled if you want to, like in my case because I hace the CH rudder pedals.

Sensei

Beirut
05-05-2005, 03:17 PM
I'm using an MSFFB2 and it's great. It lacks bells and whistles, but it's pretty solid, has a good feel and the FFB effects are great. I use it and the command pad from my Saitek PC Gamers keyboard to fly. Not quite a HOTAS, but still good fun and no full size keyboard in the way.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/horsesass/kids2022.jpg

I'm going to get the new Saitek X52 HOTAS this summer. Not to replace MSFFB2 but just so I can have both to play with. That X52 just looks like too much fun not to have. If I could use my MSFFB2 stick with the Saitek throttle, it would be Fat City!

ElAurens
05-05-2005, 04:04 PM
Nice looking sig I see on your monitor....

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

MAILMAN------
05-05-2005, 05:49 PM
Originally posted by TgD Thunderbolt56:
CH was the first to market back in the day with a force-feedback stick. They made the decision to focus more on functionality, durability and precision which the early FFB versions lacked. There have been many discussions polls and threads in their forums.

Force-feedback may be in the future for CH, but I wouldn't let that stop me from getting a CH setup.


TB

I am using, since 1997, a CH Force FX Joystick with a CH Pro Throttle and CH Pro Pedals which plug into a game port. I dual boot my computer with WME and WXP so I can use my force feedback setup and speedkey program. An individual has come up with a utility to use speedkeys with WXP, but can't do anything about the Force Feedback. Immersion who made the I-Force (forces) for the CH Force FX opted not to continue with it and CH opted to get out of the Force Feedback business. What I got from CH is that they do not ever plan to produce FF sticks.

If I am not mistaken the CH Pro Pedals (gameport version) can be connected to the X45 and used instead of the rocker switch on the throttle. I also believe that with some simple rewiring the toe brakes can be made to function with this stick. Check the CH Forums for the Force FX. Hope this helps.

Winter-Storm
05-05-2005, 06:41 PM
as if the best isn't the Thrustmaster H.O.T.A.S Cougar (http://europe.thrustmaster.com/products/dsp_fam.php?fam=39) with IJ's Uber II NXT (http://cougar.frugalsworld.com/mods.php#nxt) mod and Cubpilots Hall Sensors.

Pictures: http://cougar.frugalsworld.com/cougarpics.php

tenmmike
05-06-2005, 12:36 AM
Originally posted by Beirut:
I'm using an MSFFB2 and it's great. It lacks bells and whistles, but it's pretty solid, has a good feel and the FFB effects are great. I use it and the command pad from my Saitek PC Gamers keyboard to fly. Not quite a HOTAS, but still good fun and no full size keyboard in the way.

[IMGhttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/horsesass/kids2022.jpg[/IMG]

I'm going to get the new Saitek X52 HOTAS this summer. Not to replace MSFFB2 but just so I can have both to play with. That X52 just looks like too much fun not to have. If I could use my MSFFB2 stick with the Saitek throttle, it would be Fat City! there is no reason you cant ..i until recently used my msffb2 along with my x-45 set up im now a all ch flyer now ...(yes i miss ffb in the stick)...i used the ffb as the main stick and the hotas(x-45 throttle) as the throtle and the x-45 stick as a button bay ..there are a lot of ppl doing this so i see no reason the x-52 and msffb-2 wont work together as well

Papa_K
05-06-2005, 12:40 AM
I've got a Saitek Evo now...it took some getting used to, but it's good now. It was a lot more sensitive than I was used to, right around the "deadzone" -- super twitchy when I started with it. A combo of settings, the Saitek deadzone utility, and plain-old Time got me used to it - it works just fine. (The Evo followed an MS Precision Pro that finally quit after a long service life.)

I've been tempted by the X52 (over the X45)... At least it's got a twist rudder instead of the rocker-on-throttle rudder, but that's a matter of preference.

You can probably get good with any joystick if (1) it doesn't break, and (2) you use it long enough.

Papa_K

Freelancer-1
05-06-2005, 11:28 AM
I'm going to say:

X-45, CH pedals, Track IR combo is the best for me

Not having to map your views, you can use all four hat switchs for good stuff like:

Hat1 Chocks, seat position, canopy, arresting hook
Hat2 Landing light, nav lights, tail wheel lock, mirror
Hat3 Flaps up, flaps down, gear up, gear down
Hat4 elevator trim up, elevator trim down, rudder trim left, rudder trim right.

Then you have the two rotaries for aileron trim and prop pitch

And a number of other buttons for whatever.

The profiler is a bit of a PITA, but once every thing is mapped you rarely ever need to touch the key board. It's just a click in the system tray and off you go.

Hope this helps, Freelancer

RAF__Swede51
05-06-2005, 12:59 PM
Hello
Well gotta chime in here to vent a little... I've used a MicrosoftP2 stick for years and never really realized how good a stick it was until it finally broke and I had to use something else. About a year and a half ago a buddy of mine talked me into a Saitek45.. Well my combat skills have deteriorated beyond belief.. The fine contol I had with the MS stick just isnt there with the Saitek. I have experimented with settings until I'm blue in the face. I've got it where it's 'acceptable' but I'm not happy at all. And that rocker rudder thing is 'sloppy' at best. And to actually use this stick you must keep lubricating the bearing surface at the base. If you don't you can't make fine adjustments in flight without it jerking and creaking. There is no description for the fustration after stalking an enemy plane on-line for several minutes only to miss at the crucial moment because of sloppy control. And of coarse on-line when you miss, the other guy won't...

However on a positive note, the features and buttons the X45 has for the left hand throttle and the right hand stick handle are pretty neat.. I hardly ever have to access the keyboard in combat. I wish more stick makers would incorporate that sort of thing.

So there might be some that are looking for second hand sticks and will see the X45. I just wanted to share my experience with it. I know there are some that use the X45 and think it's great so it just goes to show that everyone is different and like different things.

I haven't seen a X52 yet in the stores here or know anyone who uses one so maybe they are better.. don't know.
I have not heard any seriously negative things about the CH products at all so my next trip to the 'big city' I'll take a good look at those. It sure sounds like that's the ticket now..

mikes911s
05-06-2005, 08:10 PM
Guess you all cant afford the real deal
Thrustmaster Cougars all the way

Beirut
05-07-2005, 09:39 AM
Well thank you for making us all feel poor. We do appreciate it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Regardless, though the Cougar is obviously a hell of a hunk of hardware, I've read in several places that it is fantastic(!) for sims like Falcon 4 and LOMAC, but not really great for prop sims.

SKY_BOSS
05-07-2005, 10:09 AM
just got back from a 7 month brake from the sim. reinstalled it on xp and cant get the sim to see my x45 when the ch pedals are hooked up. they are both usb. is there a problem the x45 has on xp with multi game controlers?