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View Full Version : Il2 should expand into Korea



MZ6
01-06-2005, 01:30 PM
If you think about it, a basic plane set already exists in the Yak9,Il2,P51 and F4U. The YP80 can become the P80, even the ground units are already modeled.

Perhaps it's an impossiblity given the schedual to finish PF and continue work on BoB, but the very thought of flying F86 vs Mig15 combat inside the Il2 engine gives me goose bumps.

Dammerung
01-06-2005, 01:47 PM
Honestly, I couldn't agree more, but I don't think it's gonna happen.

We need: La-9, La-11, IL-10, F-80C, F-84D, F-86, MiG-15. And a Map of Korea that would probably be the size of Gulf of Finland Map.

Would I pay for it? Youbetcha!!

noshens
01-06-2005, 01:49 PM
I remeber oleg said that after completion of all WW2 theaters in B.O.B he'll do korea...

edit: on another note, I think they are already working on some russian jet planes for some il2 addon that is going to be released in russia only.

Daiichidoku
01-06-2005, 01:52 PM
IMHO the IL2 engine is outta steam and should stop at PF

Korea sim? yes WAY!...but with a new, better game engine, plz

Unless Oleg has plans to expand BoB into different theaters and times, I would prefer NOT to have BoB stricly for BoB...especially with the reworked Rowans BoB on the way

I think an Oleg Korea, WWI or Tank (WWII plz) sim with a new engine including stretchability would be ideal

Daiichidoku
01-06-2005, 01:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by noshens:
I remeber oleg said that after completion of all WW2 theaters in B.O.B he'll do korea...

edit: on another note, I think they are already working on some russian jet planes for some il2 addon that is going to be released in russia only. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Only saw this post after I posted....never mind what I jsut said, hehe


But I do see where the thread author gets his logic, would be relativly simple to do a Korea sim with only a few extras....but it's so within reach already, no reason why one couldnt do a reasonable Korea campaign with what we already have in FB/PF....with the scope limited, of course, sans the two marquee players of that war, F-86 and Mig 15

jensenpark
01-06-2005, 02:09 PM
Korea would be simply fantastic...

Just to get the SeaFury...

I'd buy it as well!

MZ6
01-06-2005, 03:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
IMHO the IL2 engine is outta steam and should stop at PF <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Perhaps this is true, that doesn't change the fact that it would be the best Korean sim ever. Much like PF is the best Pacific sim ever.

Daiichidoku
01-06-2005, 04:26 PM
Was that the only line of my post that you read???

MZ6
01-06-2005, 04:41 PM
no

Stackhouse25th
01-06-2005, 04:46 PM
Exactly. A Korean sim would be priceless.

Jets using this game engine if modeled correctly would be more accurate then past sims. However a new engine is required to facilitate for more dynamics. At the point this game cannot render navigation like radios and maps for new age style of fighting. The game engine is becoming outdated, but it is still better then MSFS2004's engine.

IF you could somehow blend MSFS2004 and IL2 and the further releases, with all the playability of both, including the NAV etc etc of MSFS, and the fighting greatness that IL2 brings you will have a 1st class winner. IF you added the complexity of Falcon 4.0 with the mods as an 'OPTION' the game would be a big seller.

The only problem is the man power, perhaps certain segments of it would be put to smaller companies using Olegs strict requirements for his sims.

-----------------
Theres still a lot of sim jocks who dont like to fly fighters, but who fly 'civlian stuff' in primary. Thats a market you could tap, that hasnt been by Oleg.
-----------------

crazyivan1970
01-06-2005, 04:51 PM
Rather see it on the new engine. Time to let this sim go and let dev team to get BOB on the roll http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

WUAF_Badsight
01-06-2005, 05:25 PM
http://server2.uploadit.org/files/clippa-IL10_Korea.jpg

WUAF_Badsight
01-06-2005, 05:26 PM
the Korean conflict had the ultimate guns only DFers ever

it would be the ultimate combat flight sim ever (not knocking BoB , but this would have been 10x cooler)

SkyChimp
01-06-2005, 06:53 PM
You actually think the planes would be modelled fairly?

I'm hoping for a remake of Rowan's MiG Alley. Except for the grpahics, still one of the Best there is.

LEXX_Luthor
01-06-2005, 07:06 PM
Korea Sim would lose money--unprofitable. For the simmers, only one nation would have any wide Choice of planes available.

The first Real jet sim, one that would cover 1950-1970, would find world-wide audience as it would include famous Swedish jets, famous French jets, as well as the more famous English jets like Hawker Hunter, Folland Gnat, and Supermarine Swift, BAC Lightning http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif , as well as the USA and Russian jets including MiG~15, F~86, and much more. Would be interesting to see if Oleg can make the Swift's FM back flip (a major problem).

Korea addon pac could be Profitable, the major Korea players held back in reserve for the addon pac.

JG7_Rall
01-06-2005, 07:29 PM
I definitely think it should be done, but on a new engine, as mentioned before http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

GT182
01-06-2005, 07:29 PM
Ahhhh, Air War Vietnam would be another good pc sim. Just think of the jets and helos you'd get to fly. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif It also would need a new game engine.

LEXX_Luthor
01-06-2005, 07:35 PM
Vietnam Sim would lose money--unprofitable. For the simmers, only one nation would have any wide Choice of planes available.

The first Real jet sim, covering 1950-1970, would find world-wide audience as it would include famous Swedish jets, famous English jets, as well as famous French jets like Mystere, Mirage III, and Mirage IV, as well the USA and Russian jets including MiG~21, F~4 Phantom, and much more.

Vietnam addon pac could be Profitable, the major Vietnam players held back in reserve for the addon pac.

heywooood
01-06-2005, 07:50 PM
Hmmmm..I'd still rather see this expansion...

old Fb engine good enough and only one empty map, a couple of period buildings and vehicles and some of these to fly and fight...

http://www.wwi-models.org/Images/Miller/render/Albatros/ascene1b.jpg

Daiichidoku
01-06-2005, 08:16 PM
As Lexx said abotu me, not long ago...YIKES! Im agreeiing with Lexxx, lol

It would be better to have a 50-70 jet sim (with some turboprop and piston holdovers, of course) which would include those types that flew in Korea, facilitating Korea scenarios, but the benefit of being able to make scenarios from any conflict 50-70

Either that (or better, both!), WWI...including the early WWI stuff, scouts with only pilot's sidearns, rifles or "airhooks"

MNy Mig Alley disc is broken http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Although dated, SDOE has patches for over 100 WWII planes....and patches to make an ensemble of WWI types!...AND patches to make ground vehicles drivable for both WWI and WWII

Despite its flaws, SFP1 is ok. and it has been reworked into WOV, Wings Over Vietnam...good reports coming from it, it, including elimination of SFP1's flaws, and good smooth online multiplay...and the radars in SFP1 is great, Id liek to know how WOV radar is

Gonna be interesting to see how things go with GMX's BoB, a reworked Rowan's BoB, coming soon, and Oleg's BoB....My guess is GMX's will pre-empt Olegs, and steal what new buyers arent aware of Olegs work

2005 will be interesting

heywooood
01-06-2005, 08:22 PM
my fear is that the Rowen team has a head start and the 1c team will rush to catch up....definately agree that the first one across the finish line will make more hay.

SkyChimp
01-06-2005, 08:41 PM
I'd like to see Oleg do a good Korea Sim. I doubt he will. And frankly, I'm not sure proper credit would be given US planes.

A '50s-'70s sime would be nice. As long as it has an F-8 Crusader http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif. I wouldn't want any of the modern super-jets in it, though. No Su-27, F-15, F-14...

LEXX_Luthor
01-06-2005, 08:46 PM
Wellcome Back SkyChimp.

The LOMAC Devs said (lo-mac.com) that the reason they won't add French Mirage2000 and other nations' planes is because the avionics modding is too complicated between nations--adding one new nation is like programing a new sim, so much depends on the modern avionics. But for 1950-1970 that is not such a big issue. I knew the LOMAC Devs made a mistake by continuing the 1990s Flanker era.

-- the planes fly by computer
-- the planes look the same

Thesis....the boring looks (~ my opinion ~), and same looks, of modern fighters does not inspire young people with aviation today. Worse, the "future" of military aircraft is no longer Faster-Higher, which are two historic aviation goals that can be visualised by the public--as opposed to avionics and electronic warfare. As well, the rapidly shrinking number of pilots that air forces hire today for the multi-billions dollar planes compared to the rather larger number of young people. In a way, this increasing gap of numbers is another canyon that divides military pilots and their aircraft from the public. I got to thinking of all this by all the posts claiming the End of Flight Simming is near, but then I am not sure about that.

There was a time, long ago, when Real missiles had fins. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

LEXX_Luthor
01-06-2005, 09:00 PM
Daiich:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>As Lexx said abotu me, not long ago...YIKES! Im agreeiing with Lexxx, lol <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Canadian CF~105 Arrow http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Daiichidoku
01-06-2005, 10:07 PM
Dont tempt me, Lexx, if I get started on the Arrow, I will end up sticking both a Bomarc missle and a CF 101 Voodoo up SOMEbody's a s s

AND

I wont let you sucker me into saying I want the Arrow in that kind of sim, I would regard it as I do the pathetic 185 109Z etc in FB/PF...only six made, and never fitted with an active FCS or weapons, and never had its intended Orenda Iroquois engines...stupid P&W J75s instead...and would necessarily have to be TOTALLY uber out out perform everything else up there suckin air

The F-107A would also sadly fall under this category....and the Delta Sea Darts...and BAE TSR 2s....and the almost-as-amazing-as-the-Arrow Vought "Super" Crusader II, a type that narrowly lost to the F-4 Phantom

I salivate at the thought of flyin and fightin in Vampires, Sea Venoms, Hunters, Sea Vixens, Canberras, BAE Lightnings, Sud-Oest Vatours, Mirages, IL-28 Beagles, Vought Cutlasses (Gutlesses hehe), Douglas F4Ds, B-58 Hustlers, and mmm mmm CF-100s,,,lot of others, but those are some o me favs

Daiichidoku
01-06-2005, 10:13 PM
hmmm may as well fight fire with fire...

Lexxx....Fokker D.VII http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

and if that dont do it, the....Neuport 28!


I dont think youre a SPAD or Albatross man

Daiichidoku
01-06-2005, 10:15 PM
Ok, if that doesnt do, if too early fo ryou, then I know what will get cha...

Fairy P H A N T O M E ! hehehe

LEXX_Luthor
01-06-2005, 10:40 PM
Daiich:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I salivate at the thought of flyin and fightin in Vampires, Sea Venoms, Hunters, Sea Vixens, Canberras, BAE Lightnings, Sud-Oest Vatours, Mirages, IL-28 Beagles, Vought Cutlasses (Gutlesses hehe), Douglas F4Ds, B-58 Hustlers, and mmm mmm CF-100s,,,lot of others, but those are some o me favs <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yikes, I agree. The planes that saw mass production 1950-1970 all *look* like pure Fantasy Science Fiction even today. Anyway, many of the good planes that were not accepted by the country of origin made sales to other countries.

MO_JOJO
01-07-2005, 12:27 AM
Aren't there enough maps, planes, and campaigns to keep you guys busy? I have barely scratched the surface of what I already own, so Korean War would be way too much for me. I'm also not sure that I want to leave WWII and prop planes. Sure we'd still have P-51's and F4U's, but jets would dominate, and that's not a can of worms I want to open yet. I think the 40's was the best decade, in history and I am happy playing there right now.

Just get all the bugs worked out of PF, add the planes the community is begging for (and the F8F), and I'm a happy man. I'd pay big bucks to get those things. I would hate to see PF get dumped to the sidelines when we just got it.

clint-ruin
01-07-2005, 01:08 AM
Which planes are we getting in the Russian planes addon again?

Skychimp wants "fair" modelling? Would that be like.. game balance, by any chance? :>

WUAF_Badsight
01-07-2005, 01:31 AM
Clint , you may or may not be a big fan of the VVS aircraft in FB , but you cant disagree that they performing optimally in FB

clint-ruin
01-07-2005, 01:34 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WUAF_Badsight:
Clint , you may or may not be a big fan of the VVS aircraft in FB , but you cant disagree that they performing optimally in FB <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Once you remove pilot training and quality control problems I'd expect them to be pretty good machines. Would like to see some of the fieldmod overboost options added for the 51/47 though.

WUAF_Badsight
01-07-2005, 01:53 AM
all planes in FB have things that are wrong & things that are spot on according to the data we have left from the fourties

the the enginge DM especially for the VVS a/c is amazing , + lots of other things that lead people to feel theres a bias in this sim

a feeling based on gameplay as much as a knowledge of history , from actual use & loss with & against russian planes in FB

believe me i used to be frustrated as hell with FB v1.x because of the VEF . . . . . VVS a/c were so much more survivable than LW stuff

PraetorHonoris
01-07-2005, 04:25 AM
I would prefer an expansion into the Spanish Civil War... almost every nation's pilots were flying there, lots of biplanes and lots of uber monoplanes like the Rata.

Who needs jets???

Rola.
01-07-2005, 04:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PraetorHonoris:
I would prefer an expansion into the Spanish Civil War... almost every nation's pilots were flying there, lots of biplanes and lots of uber monoplanes like the Rata.

Who needs jets??? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Ditto. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif
We had several jet sims, but when I thing about SCW, only a medicore "Luftwaffe Commander" comes to my mind.

1930s rock! Era of classic prop warbirds, not "flying pipes" from 1950s.

That's why I'm tring to persuade Oleg to make SCW + Poland'39 right after BOB. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Lukki
01-07-2005, 05:27 AM
The only thing cool about Korea is larger payloads for attack aircraft. Napalm and stuff, right? Ground attack role would rule...

The jet fights? Going fast isn't fun if everyone else is going fast, too. It doesn't make you special and closing in is just as slow as it is in prop vs prop. That is what makes Me262 exceptional and fun - you can outrun everyone and do swift attacks. I've gone 980 IAS in a Me262, prop planes would disintegrate and the He162 after me did disintegrate. However, dogfighting against other poorly maneuverable, fast but heavy aircraft is tiring and you don't get many opportunities to shoot. Following the target is difficult. Just flying WW2 prop planes is extreme, Korea would be even more so. I've tried LOMAC though and the systems were too complicated. The missiles were effective and boring. I couldn't get a traditional sight for the cannon at all. Annoying. Flying at full power quickly resulted in an empty tank. On top of that these "fighters" of the modern era weigh more than the bombers in WW2 (Early Heinkel 111s carry less **** than modern Sukhois). Slow down in a Su-27 and it drops like rock (The MiG-29 actually felt better). MiG-21 might be fun though. It's fast and it's built quite early so I guess it's simpler. I'd like to fly something like that. Or futuristic aircraft with pulse jet engines.. But the homing missiles are annoying. :|

Actually WW2 rocks. We just need more funny planes... ^___^

-HH- Beebop
01-07-2005, 06:32 AM
If I wanted a Korean sim I would have been playing Mig Alley. I'm playing IL-2 because I like propellers........sometimes a little too much. (yes, my psychiatrist is working with me on that.)

I want the Med! The MT map just isn't enough. I want Crete and Malta and the southern Italian boot.

Hopefully this will finally come with BoB. Until then I will plod along with the online Finnish map and a good imagination.

BlackStar2000
01-07-2005, 06:47 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
Daiich:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I salivate at the thought of flyin and fightin in Vampires, Sea Venoms, Hunters, Sea Vixens, Canberras, BAE Lightnings, Sud-Oest Vatours, Mirages, IL-28 Beagles, Vought Cutlasses (Gutlesses hehe), Douglas F4Ds, B-58 Hustlers, and mmm mmm CF-100s,,,lot of others, but those are some o me favs <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yikes, I agree. The planes that saw mass production 1950-1970 all *look* like pure Fantasy Science Fiction even today. Anyway, many of the good planes that were not accepted by the country of origin made sales to other countries. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I Believe most of those planes are forgoten in simulation, would be nice to see this era on the air.

S 8
01-07-2005, 06:52 AM
Strike Fighters.From A1 to A/F whatever, almost http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif(though you got to download a bit)

Newtria
01-07-2005, 09:07 AM
Personally, I'd love to see the entire era of 1950 -1970 modeled. I absolutely love SFP1 even if I stink at it. SFP1 is very limited when trying to fly full real...some things just can't be done w/o the hud in that sim.

Anyhow, for Maddox games to cover this era of combat flight would be the ultimate jet sim ever! Sure, Falcon 4, and to some extent, LOMAC are great jet sims, they still don't capture the thrill and dread that the early jets were known for. Besides, just think of all the fronts that could be covered...Korea, Vietnam, Sinai, etc. This could be a jet simmer's Nirvana.

Newt

NorrisMcWhirter
01-07-2005, 09:19 AM
Hi,

Korea would be alright...some time in the future. I think Oleg should 'complete the square' and sort out the Med and Spanish civil war before moving on to this. Obviously, I'm biased as I'm not a major fan of jets or uber-ised post/end of war aircraft.

Cheers,
norris

PBNA-Boosher
01-07-2005, 11:21 AM
If we got Korea it'd be the AD-1 Skyraider, MiG-15, F-84 Thunderjet, or F9F Panther for me!

CV8_Dudeness
01-07-2005, 11:46 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PraetorHonoris:
I would prefer an expansion into the Spanish Civil War... almost every nation's pilots were flying there, lots of biplanes and lots of uber monoplanes like the Rata.

Who needs jets??? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
we already have the worlds best Bi-plane fights ever in FB , they would only get more slow & less capable than what we have now

dont be Jet Hatin !

the most ultimate Propeller fighters that ever seen combat fought in Korea , it would be the Ultimate Combat Flight Sim

besides , the Classic Jets in Korea were Gunzo dude , try DFing with the Jets we have now in FB , its not that easy ! (this is why the Jets are not as favoured by FB players , they are not as "easy" to twist & turn & fight with compared to props)

Daiichidoku
01-07-2005, 11:54 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by MO_JOJO:I think the 40's was the best decade, in history and I am happy playing there right now. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

EVERY type involved in Korea was designed in the 40's or flew in WWII

CV8_Dudeness
01-07-2005, 11:58 AM
they post from a lack of knowledge just how cool the planeset of the Korean war would be

Fighters

Ground Pounders

Carriers

& fantastic scenery

LEXX_Luthor
01-07-2005, 08:27 PM
Thanks Rola, Oleg needs to do Spanish Civil WAR, but also Mongolia/China with some Japanese planes. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Spanish Civil WAR with Mongolia/China would include every aircraft building nation. A true international flight sim. Same with 1950-1970 jet sim, all nations represented.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>they post from a lack of knowledge just how cool the planeset of the Korean war would be <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
They post from lack of knowledge how much more "cool" lay outside Korea. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif If they only knew.

Now, Hawker Hunter is cool, cooler than Spitfire http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

civildog
01-07-2005, 11:38 PM
I'd buy any game with a Panther in it. And maybe a Westland Wyvern for variety.

MiG Alley was great, I loved the sound effects when pulling gee's: the creaking and groaning airframe, the heavier breathing of the pilot. The way I could flameout in the jet wash if I passed too close to a passing MiG in a head on. The smoke and flare drops by the FACs for the bomb runs. Thats the kind of immersion that allows me to forgive the graphics even to this day.

We need something like that again so we can just kick the tires and light the fires.