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Ratsack
11-29-2006, 05:13 AM
Is there any possibility that we can disable the ability to hear nearby aircraft? This feature of the game regularly enables online pilots to avoid the bounce by hearing their enemy approach.

This just should not happen.

It is particularly bad for those who use the historical approach of getting as close as possible before opening fire. It completely nullifies this approach because the victim will hear you at 200 m and start evasive action.

The pilots of these planes wore a helmet with ear-covering headphones. They were locked inside enclosed cockpits (for the most part). They were in VERY close proximity to an extremely loud engine, with its exhausts pointed back in the general direction of the cockpit. They could not hear a thing outside their own plane.

It is highly unrealistic for a pilot to be able to hear a plane approach under these conditions.

Please, can this be fixed?

cheers,
Ratsack<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

JG14_Josf: 'Gravity, among may other things, is not known...' http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Philipscdrw
11-29-2006, 05:59 AM
A difficulty option which removes the sound from other aircraft, perhaps? I'd like that.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

------------------------------------------------------------
PhilipsCDRw

PF_Tini's Simple Guide to Switching 4.04m, 4.05m, and 4.07m. (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/7351046415)
Flying on Hyperlobby as EAF_T_Dozer

Capt.LoneRanger
11-29-2006, 07:05 AM
Conf.ini

under

[SOUND]

Attenuation=7

set it to 1



Search function makes things so easy. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

greets
Capt.LoneRanger

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v411/Arcadiac/Lone1copy.png

Ratsack
11-29-2006, 07:35 AM
Thanks for that, Lone Ranger. Reading carefully makes things easy, too.

I'm talking about preventing ALL players from hearing ALL OTHER players, not just me being unable to hear them.

That strikes me as a server setting or fix. Are you aware of either?

cheers,
Ratsack<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

JG14_Josf: 'Gravity, among may other things, is not known...' http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Tater-SW-
11-29-2006, 08:40 AM
Yeah, whatever the host has set for Attenuation should be forced on everyone.

Me not cheating doesn't prevent others from doing it to me.

tater

F19_Ob
11-29-2006, 08:54 AM
this is an old question, but no fix to it yet.
Perhaps it has something to do with different soundcards aswell?Perhaps its too difficult to find a perfect midle way to work well with all varieties of cards?

I have an audigy 2 card and I can hear a plane next to me in formation, but not a plane approaching from behind.
I know some of my m8's hear approaching planes online.

Fighters online usually have few view-problems online compared to bombers, being able to twist roll and yaw to see better.
Bombers however are seriously handicapped in immovable planes and thus having problems to see a fighter shooting at u when dissappearing being one of the bars in the gunnerseats.
Early warning consisting of enginesound may to some degree make up for that lack of vision and the fact that a bomber pilot doesn't get any other warning from the gunners unless they fire wich often is too late.
the pilot must himself move around to get atleast some allround visual info and thus making the workload vastly higher than in fighters.

So infact disabling bombers from hearing fighters approach one actually give the fighters, wich have a comparatively easy time, more advantages, but at the same time give the bombers who already have a hard time even more disadvantages.
Not acceptable ofcourse.

This issue has many angles to consider and the above are just a few of many.


Very much doubt anything will be done about it now, since it was up many years ago.

regards<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/f19_ob/ob_ver2.jpg

WB_Outlaw
11-29-2006, 09:27 AM
Originally posted by F19_Ob:
So infact disabling bombers from hearing fighters approach one actually give the fighters, wich have a comparatively easy time, more advantages, but at the same time give the bombers who already have a hard time even more disadvantages.
Not acceptable ofcourse.


Allowing one error to "make up" for another is even more unacceptable. Even if the aircraft in question doesn't support the level stabilizer, it's possible to fly the aircraft from a gunner position so the acceptable solution for that situation is for the player to keep his own eye out, not rely on such a glaring flaw as hearing another aircraft's engine.


--Outlaw

F19_Ob
11-29-2006, 09:36 AM
Originally posted by WB_Outlaw:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by F19_Ob:
So infact disabling bombers from hearing fighters approach one actually give the fighters, wich have a comparatively easy time, more advantages, but at the same time give the bombers who already have a hard time even more disadvantages.
Not acceptable ofcourse.


Allowing one error to "make up" for another is even more unacceptable.
--Outlaw </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

making new errors to "make up" for old ones is very much unacceptable aswell.

I ment that there are many issues to consider before changing anything.

Just disabling the sound for all does not only make it much easier for the fighters to attack bombers, it also makes it much harder for bombers to detect fighters.

So lets not make a new 'likely' error before we have looked at the issue from a few more angles.

All soulutions in the game are not perfect but sometimes compromises are the only choice available.

thanks.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/f19_ob/ob_ver2.jpg

WB_Outlaw
11-29-2006, 10:08 AM
Originally posted by F19_Ob:
making new errors to "make up" for old ones is very much unacceptable aswell.

I ment that there are many issues to consider before changing anything.

So lets not make a new 'likely' error before we have looked at the issue from a few more angles.


There is zero likelihood of creating any error of any kind by removing the audio radar bug. I have been in the tailgunner position of a B-17 (Texas Raider) in flight while a P-51 (the Gunfighters one) was parked less than 50 feet off the starboard rear quarter for a photo op. You can't hear ANYTHING except your own aircraft from inside a warbird. In that same flight I tried to talk to one of the crew while we were in the radio compartment with no luck. The only way you can even make yourself heard is to scream directly into their ear. Sure they can hear something but it's unintelligible.

This is a TERRIBLE bug with an easy fix of attenuation=1 as a server side setting. If you like the ridiculousness of it, fly on one of the many gimp servers that will undoubtedly allow it.

--Outlaw.

Tater-SW-
11-29-2006, 10:16 AM
I've spent a while inside a B-24 (collings, prop gov was out, and we tried 3 times to take a hop, for a total of a couple hours on the ground engines running) and a B-17 (aluminum overcast ride).

The former was at out AFB/airport, loads of planes nearby, heard NOTHING but our 4 radials. The B-17 ride was at a smaller field, and there was an AT-6 warming up right next to us. Again, nothing but our own noise, can't hear yourself think (but god i love that noise!).

This idiocy needs to go away.

tater

slipBall
11-29-2006, 11:53 AM
I agree that all one should here in the pit, is the sound of his own engine....It would be nice to have a stickie poll on this matter....maybe Oleg would see it, and implement, while there is still time during SOW sound developement<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f394/SlipBall/orders.jpg

Chivas
11-29-2006, 12:31 PM
This is something that should be fixed. Most of my kills used to be a slow bounce from low and behind. Using 108's from close range, the guy usually didn't know what hit him. Because the DM of this game allows damaged aircraft to still fight effectively its imperative you do devistating damage on the first shot. Especially if your bouncing two aircraft in formation. The sonar sound has made it impossible to do an effective co E bounce.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://www.war-clouds.com/sigs/jg27chivas.jpg

F19_Ob
11-29-2006, 01:45 PM
Originally posted by WB_Outlaw:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by F19_Ob:
making new errors to "make up" for old ones is very much unacceptable aswell.

I ment that there are many issues to consider before changing anything.

So lets not make a new 'likely' error before we have looked at the issue from a few more angles.


There is zero likelihood of creating any error of any kind by removing the audio radar bug. I have been in the tailgunner position of a B-17 (Texas Raider) in flight while a P-51 (the Gunfighters one) was parked less than 50 feet off the starboard rear quarter for a photo op. You can't hear ANYTHING except your own aircraft from inside a warbird. In that same flight I tried to talk to one of the crew while we were in the radio compartment with no luck. The only way you can even make yourself heard is to scream directly into their ear. Sure they can hear something but it's unintelligible.

This is a TERRIBLE bug with an easy fix of attenuation=1 as a server side setting. If you like the ridiculousness of it, fly on one of the many gimp servers that will undoubtedly allow it.

--Outlaw. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Please re-read my answer.
Originally posted by WB_Outlaw:
"This is a TERRIBLE bug with an easy fix"
--They would ofcourse have fixed it years ago when the question was up then if it is as easy as u say to fix.


Originally posted by WB_Outlaw:
"If you like the ridiculousness of it, fly on one of the many gimp servers that will undoubtedly allow it."
--I personally would suggest correct aids for the bombers first, before simpliying it so much for just the fighters online, and then fix the sound ofcourse.
In the mean time couldn't you be the bigger man and just set the attenuation=1 until then? As I.

Seemingly I'm not as familiar with 'gimp'servers as you, but you'll usually find me on zekes if u feel like slaughtering bombers http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

No need for ridiculing m8, and I don't like 'it'.

P.S......I fly with all aids off online, and I can only hear a plane next to me in close formation...not attacking planes. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/f19_ob/ob_ver2.jpg

WB_Outlaw
11-29-2006, 02:37 PM
Originally posted by F19_Ob:
Please re-read my answer.
Originally posted by WB_Outlaw:
"This is a TERRIBLE bug with an easy fix"
--They would ofcourse have fixed it years ago when the question was up then if it is as easy as u say to fix.


Originally posted by WB_Outlaw:
"If you like the ridiculousness of it, fly on one of the many gimp servers that will undoubtedly allow it."
--I personally would suggest correct aids for the bombers first, before simpliying it so much for just the fighters online, and then fix the sound ofcourse.
In the mean time couldn't you be the bigger man and just set the attenuation=1 until then? As I.

Seemingly I'm not as familiar with 'gimp'servers as you, but you'll usually find me on zekes if u feel like slaughtering bombers http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

No need for ridiculing m8, and I don't like 'it'.

P.S......I fly with all aids off online, and I can only hear a plane next to me in close formation...not attacking planes. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Setting attenuation=1 locally does nothing to solve the bug of enemies hearing a bounce. All it does is provide a handicap that others will not have.

If all easy fixes were done, "...years ago...", then things like the giant muzzle flash would not have lasted past the first patch. It's the same type of fix as setting client cloud settings to match the server's.

Feel free to lobby for "correct bombing aids" to your heart's content but don't hang onto one really bad BUG to make up for the lack of a gunner alert.

--Outlaw.

Vike
11-29-2006, 08:58 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif *Bump* http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Like SlipBall;

While doing a BnZ yesterday on a OnLine server against a fat & ludicrous P-47D,i was fastly approaching his low dead 6...

We were only two at that moment on the server. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
I bring my K4-B4 closer and closer to him,he was slightly rolling on his left/right to see around him,but i was in his low dead 6,and he manifestly didn't see me.

And suddenly,guess what? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Ready to shoot with my crushing-gun,he immediatly dove,all of a sudden for NO reason. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_redface.gif

Then,we made a simple dogfight,in which he naturally went down. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/halo.gif

Two tactics are unfeasible with this sound bug:

-Dead 6 approach,in the German/E.Hartmann way.
-The Taran.

Concerning me,i use hardware acceleration enabled on my good old SoundBlaster Live,for the astonishing growling sound of the Daimler-Benz engines.I prefer having my ears being invaded by this engine roaring sound rather than desactivate hardware acceleration and cheat (there is no other word) that permitt to hear planes behind... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

IRL,as it has been already said,pilots were surrounded by their engine sound,but this was so loud that,most of the time,they even didn't hear the bullets impacts upon their plane fuselage!!!

It was simply their stick abnormal vibrations that indicated them that something wrong was happening to their plane...

We're somewhat far from this in the current state of our sim. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Here is an IRL story concerning Kyosti Karhila,a famous Me109-G finnish ace.This story includes exactly what i (and many other i suppose) would like to feel when i fly my favourite aircraft:

"It was the 20 August 1943. Lieutenant Kyosti "Kossi" Karhila was another pilot of the 3rd flight of FAF HLeLv 43 based in Kymi air base North of Kotka on the southern coast of Gulf of Finland. The task of the flight was to defend the towns of Kotka and Hamina, their harbour and the adjacent sea area with its military objects against Soviet Air Force.

Four Bf 109 G-2 fighters were airworthy that day at 14:41 hours as there was an alert: Four enemy Il-2M's escorted by eight fighters approaching Someri island, situated 50 km South from the base. Finnish pilots hurried to their fighters: Flight Commander Captain Puhakka , his wingman Sgt. Nuorala, Flight Master Tuominen and Lt. Karhila .

Lt. Karhila climbed in the cramped cockpit of the "MT-229" while two mechanics worked hard hand-cranking the flywheel of the inertia starter.<span class="ev_code_yellow"> The pilot closed the hood and went through the pre-start check list before starting the engine. When testing the magnetos, the no.2 magneto made the engine drop 150 rpm. That was a bad sign but Karhila did not care: he gave a sign to remove the chocks </span>. He prepared for takeoff after Flt.Mstr Tuominen, because the narrow airstrip could take only one fighter at a time. He had to wait for one minute so that the previous fighter's slipstream would disappear, worrying about the possibility of his own engine overheating.

Now Karhila applied power so that the Messer began to roll. He steered the fighter with brakes and aligned it with the runway. Then he gently applied more power, and to be able to control the huge torque of the three bladed prop he pulled the stick to keep the tailwheel on the ground. The Me's weak spot was its undercarriage: the weak stilt-like legs and narrow wheelbase made it accident-prone. The pilot kept increasing power, all the time feeling with his feet when the rudder would "bite".

As Karhila felt that the rudder was responding, he eased the stick and allowed the tailplane rise. Now he gently applied full power, because he was able to counter the torque with pedals.<span class="ev_code_yellow"> The Daimler-Benz engine growled at its' characteristic low note, accompanied by the falsetto whine of the supercharger.</span> The fighter was now accelerating on its main wheels, the propeller blade tips sweeping seven (!) centimeters from the runway gravel. The pilot waited until the Bf had accumulated enough speed. Then the powerful engine pulled the fighter off the ground at a light pull of the stick.

This was a normal Bf 109 take off. Any Messerschmitt pilot had to be able to do all this juggling without thinking about it. (Not everyone made it: one FAF pilot, whose name better be withheld, smashed five Bf's at start before he was rejected from training...) When airborne, Karhila pulled in the undercarriage, landing flaps and radiator gills. Next he adjusted power and set the prop pitch control to automatic. Then he eased the seat belt across his chest to be better able to look in the rear sector. His guns were loaded and the Revi gunsight illumination was on. Lieutenant Karhila and "MT-229" were ready and willing to fight the enemy. The pilot could not tell whether he was a part of his aircraft or whether the fighter was a part of him...

Karhila followed Cpt. Puhakka in 3000 m. They were not really flying in a finger-of-four formation as they should have and they were trained to do. Karhila and Tuominen were experienced and self-confident pilots who were hungry for more victories and unwilling to fly as anybody's wing men.

The enemy turned back before attacking having seen the four Me's, but the Finnish fighters pursued them and caught up with the enemy formation over the Gulf of Finland west of Seiskari Island (note: the Finnish names of those islands). Karhila saw the Flight Commander attack two enemy fighters. He looked around and there, below him he saw four "Sturmoviks" and six La-5 and Yak-7 fighters flying South.

<span class="ev_code_yellow"> Karhila was just about to attack them as his instinct told him to look back. There, 20 meters from his tail he saw the nose of a La-5 with big white prop spinner shining in sunlight.</span> Without thinking the Finnish pilot slammed the stick to the right and kicked the right pedal. He heard a crack in the left wing of the Me, but the rest of the enemy salvo missed his fighter with the sound of a passing express train, tracers flying. Karhila allowed his Messer do two rapid turns in flat roll, contrails extending from the wingtips.<span class="ev_code_yellow"> Where did the La appear ?</span> He continued in a 30 to 45 degree dive to NW with full power and "squirmed". He had checked the rear sector some seconds before. When tightening his curve the Finnish pilot saw the Lavotchkin 50 m behind his tail, looking menacing. The enemy must have dived from the sun.

Karhila kept diving with full power, but he was unable to shake off the enemy. For a second he was at a loss what to do, but then he decided that attack would be the best defence. He had to turn the nose of his fighter at the enemy at any means. Karhila pulled the stick as hard as he could, steering his fighter in a climbing left curve.

He curved tighter and tighter, increasing his rate of climb at the same time. He saw that the enemy was losing on him, but at the same moment he felt how his Me was about to stall. He eased the stick and barely recovered the fighter from complete stall. As the Bf 109 returned to full control, he was flying horizontally. The La-5 was on the same altitude, on the opposite side of their common turning circle.

Now Karhila curved tight again and soon he had the enemy in his gunsight. He fired for the first time at 150 m. The La-5 half-rolled and dived, the Finnish pilot followed. The enemy pulled out of the dive, Karhila aimed and fired again at a range of 200 m. The La-5 made another half-roll and dive, striving for the AA cover of a Soviet base on Peninsaari Island. The enemy was now 800 m ahead of him but Karhila was catching up fast.

When Karhila was within range and fired at 300 m, the enemy apparently decided to use the same manouver that had saved Karhila: the La-5 pulled into a tight left climbing curve. The Finnish pilot allowed the enemy turn for a second before following. The Me was more manouverable than the LA-5, he approached the enemy fast.

At the range of 75 m Karhila aimed with rough deflection and opened fire, shooting brief salvoes. The enemy fighter took hits in its fuselage.<span class="ev_code_yellow"> When the range was 50 m, the La-5 broke in two just behind the cockpit. Karhila's Messer was for a moment surrounded by flying debris.</span>

The tailless La-5 rocked violently, then nosedived. More debris fell off, then the enemy pilot bailed out. Soon his parachute opened and the pilote splashed in the sea. Karhila watched with fascination how the tail end of the enemy fighter slowly fell, the rudder flipping and showing the red star on both sides of the tailplane. Then he realised what really happened and he shouted in the radio: "Anybody saw - I shot a La-5!". It was his victory no. 18.

A Bf 109 fighter passed overhead - it was Oippa Tuominen who responded and congratulated. Karhila saw a white streak on the sea: a Soviet speedboat arrived to rescue the La-5 pilot from his cold bath.

Now the "MT-229" engine began to act up, making the fighter vibrate violently every now and then. Also there was a big hole in the left wing. It certainly had been a close shave, and Karhila took course to the base with low power, anxious to avoid any more fighting this time.

He made a victory pass over the base before landing. Landing a Bf 109 was nearly as tricky as taking off. The pilot had to control the attitude of the fighter so that the nose would not be too down - the prop would literally "bite dust" - nor should the plane be allowed to stall at low altitude and smash the flimsy undercarriage legs.

But Karhila landed expertly. He parked the "MT-229" and climbed out of the cockpit. The ground crew already had heard the good news, they also could see that soot from the muzzle flashes of the guns had soiled the nose of the fighter and the pilot was drenched in sweat and his knees appeared to be a bit weak. There also was a gaping hole in the left wing...

Everybody congratulated Karhila for his victory. To "bag" a La-5, a very dangerous opponent, after being surprised by it proved excellent flying skill. What Kossi Karhila had experienced was the nightmare of any fighter pilot - but he had been able to "turn the tables" and survived . You could not find a happier man in Kymi air base that day.

<span class="ev_code_yellow">He had been lucky, too, because the mechanics told that the enemy hit had virtually split the main spar of the wing and it had been a miracle that the damaged wing had withstood the stress of the battle and the victory pass. The wing had to be replaced before "MT-229" was airworthy again.</span>"

-Here (http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/karhi/karhi.htm)-

Mr Kyosti Karhila was lucky that day,that's why he could be back to tell us what it happened.

Curiously,what was a real EXCEPTION IRL seems to be a common "feature" in OnLine servers...http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Crossing fingers for the 4.08m patch for a fix. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

@+

ps:

Note: The La5 shot down by Kyosti Karhila made evasive maneuvers AFTER the finnish Ace opened fire on him,not BEFORE.
That's yet exactly what happens when i approach a "red" plane on OnLine servers most of the time.The "red" plane pilot manifestly hears me and begins to evade BEFORE i shoot a single bullet..! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/354.gif

Ratsack
11-29-2006, 09:59 PM
Exactly. THE most effective historical attack method - the bounce with surprise - is emasculated by this bug.

If it hurts the situational awareness of bombers I shan't cry. The AI already acts as an infallible warning system anyway. This before we even talk about the sniping tail gunners. I'm sorry if that seems harsh, but bombers in this game are already far too dangerous. As somebody said in a GD thread recently, you're more likely to survive a sortie in a B-25 than in a P-38, and you'll probably have kills as well.

No, in my view, this ability to hear other aircraft is a bug that has a dramatic effect upon gameplay. It's as bad and as serious as the Spidey Senses of the AI and their ability to 'see' you through cloud. If the surprise attack is neutered in the online environment, then there's effectively no element of surprise in the game.

I think it should be fixed if possible.

cheers,
Ratsack<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

JG14_Josf: 'Gravity, among may other things, is not known...' http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

F19_Ob
11-30-2006, 02:21 AM
Originally posted by WB_Outlaw:


Originally posted by WB_Outlaw:

Setting attenuation=1 locally does nothing to solve the bug of enemies hearing a bounce. All it does is provide a handicap that others will not have.

If all easy fixes were done, "...years ago...", then things like the giant muzzle flash would not have lasted past the first patch. It's the same type of fix as setting client cloud settings to match the server's.

Feel free to lobby for "correct bombing aids" to your heart's content but don't hang onto one really bad BUG to make up for the lack of a gunner alert.

--Outlaw.



Still not quite reading me m8, but thats ok.

Setting attenuation=1 ofcourse works for the bigger person while we wait for fixes to 'all' problems.
And I said nothing of that "all easy fixes" were done.

And yes thank you, I am feeling free to lobby for the bomberguys problems. (I am somewhat obligated to do it, but will gladly give it up when someone else takes over.)
Ofcourse I don't want the soundbug more than u, but I cant leave this discussion because the removal of 'the bug' concerns bombers aswell.
Although I personally hear nothing, I don't want to rob my m8's of this small help 'BEFORE' bombers are fixed. Not perfect solution but sofar no replacement for it.
(In my argumentation may be detected minor distrust that anything will be done, especially for the bombers.)
Compared to fighterboys lobby bomberguys have had very few LOUD advocates pointing at the vast differences in difficulty between these two.
Since the problem has more sides it must be pointed out in this thread aswell, and fairly early.

Please note that I'm NOT "hanging onto one really bad BUG to make up for the lack of a gunner alert" as u say, just pointing on a more broader, in stead of, narrow viewpoint.

Forgive my humor of trading blunt argumenting for a little subtle cunning.
Can't help it.

You do understand that I am bumping this thread, don't you. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
---------------------------------------------


In your crusades for "realistic flying" being so agitated for sound online, don't
U get more angry over 'gunstats' and 'stats' aswell of possibility to watch how many players there are and what types they fly on the other side.

Text with info of when disabling the opponents controls is available, aswell as other info.

In the name of realism these and many more 'bugs' are a bit more serious than the soundbug. Don't u think.

Not tryiong to irritate, just illuminate.

Well, regards............and BUMP http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/f19_ob/ob_ver2.jpg

WB_Outlaw
11-30-2006, 04:51 AM
Originally posted by F19_Ob:
Setting attenuation=1 ofcourse works for the bigger person while we wait for fixes to 'all' problems.
And I said nothing of that "all easy fixes" were done.

I guess we have different definitions of "works". To me it should mean that the problem is, at the very least, reduced in scale if not fixed entirely. As I said before, setting attenuation=1 locally does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to prevent the person someone is attacking from hearing the bounce. I can be an even bigger person and fly with a bindfold on but that still won't prevent him from hearing me when I'm close.

You said that, if it were easy to fix, then it would have already been fixed. Now you say that all easy fixes are not done. With there still being easy fixes not implemented, placing the sound bug in the non-easy category simply because it hasn't been fixed is a big assumption. Of course, I am also making an assumption with my fix, however, since my fix only involves pushing a server side setting to the client (like every difficulty setting and cloud detail is already done), I think my assumption is less of a stretch.


Originally posted by F19_Ob:
Ofcourse I don't want the soundbug more than u, but I cant leave this discussion because the removal of 'the bug' concerns bombers aswell.
Although I personally hear nothing, I don't want to rob my m8's of this small help 'BEFORE' bombers are fixed. Not perfect solution but sofar no replacement for it.

Please note that I'm NOT "hanging onto one really bad BUG to make up for the lack of a gunner alert" as u say, just pointing on a more broader, in stead of, narrow viewpoint.

You say you don't want the soundbug but then go on to say that it should not be retained as a compromise until there is a fix for the lack of a gunner alert in bombers.

How's this for a compromise - look around. Not a perfect replacement for a gunner call out but it will give you way more than 150m of warning which is probably more than the audio radar on most systems.

Having a viewpoint of anything other than fixing bugs is just ridiculous.



Originally posted by F19_Ob:
In your crusades for "realistic flying" being so agitated for sound online, don't
U get more angry over 'gunstats' and 'stats' aswell of possibility to watch how many players there are and what types they fly on the other side.

Text with info of when disabling the opponents controls is available, aswell as other info.

In the name of realism these and many more 'bugs' are a bit more serious than the soundbug. Don't u think.

Oh geez. If you can't see a difference between the impact of those pathetic little gripes and the sound bug, forget everything I said previously as this is the proverbial battle of wits.

--Outlaw.

CSL_Kocour
11-30-2006, 08:25 AM
There were many attempts already by pilots to try and negotiate the removal of the so called "sonar" from IL2 series.

I for one completely agree that this bug is most serious and spoils the game for bouncers, but as yet no joy in its removing.

There are two main reasons:

1. The game is made also for "arcade" lovers and this crowd likes the "movie" type of sounds, which unfortunately have nothing to do with reality. It is not easy to provide two sets of sounds in current sound engine, one for arcade and one for hardcore simmers. So there is some kind of compromise now and there will be no change in this in IL2 series. Be sure. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

2. The second reason is, that developers are still not COMPLETELY convinced, that stories like the one from Karhila above, are true. So the only chance for us to have that fixed at least in SOW:BOB is to PROVIDE A DEFINITE PROOF that engines and props are really not heard from cockpit and that bounces, as thay happened on daily basis since WWI (yes WWI Red Baron times, even then it was possible to bounce), were for real and not a fiction...

We planned to make a test with two same or similar REAL planes flying in formation, listening to the sound of the other plane as they would by moving round each other in different positions and different ranges and recording our opinions on video right there in cockpits. But we did not get around to it yet. Maybe next summer. If anyone of you guys has a better chance to make this test, just do it and provide the video to the community and developer. That, I imagine, would be the first serious step towards removing the sonar from any sim.

The next question is the developer┬┤s willingness and ability to make the sound optional for arcade/hardcore simmers. But if there is a proof and if there is a serious demand from community, there could be a chance http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

WB_Outlaw
11-30-2006, 08:53 AM
Kocour,
We're not asking for two sets of sounds. Simply pushing the server side setting of attenuation=1 to the client will fix the problem with no change in sounds. It would be an OPTION for those server operators that want it, nothing more.

I would be most surprised if any of the developers believe that you could hear an enemy aircraft bounce. Those that make the decisions have most likely been in these types of aircraft before. If not, they would most certainly defer to those of us who have.

Since attenuation is an option, it's obvious that they anticipated this situation. Unfortunately they didn't implement the server side push of the setting.

I'm not certain that it really is an easy fix but I hope that it is and will make it into a patch sometime before BOB. Either way though, I still got way more bang for the buck out of this product than anything else I've ever purchased (except maybe my scuba diving certification but it's a close call).

--Outlaw.

JG4_Helofly
11-30-2006, 03:28 PM
I agree 100% that this bug should be removed. The problem is that if you move the pilots head 90 degrees to the left your own engine sound will decrease on the left ear and that makes very good sonar sound conditions because all other sounds are still as loud as before.

But there is not only this problem. The whole sound in il2 is a problem. For exemple, when you hear machine guns which are very far away or things like that. And the story that a better sound card and a good sound system will remove all problems is ****.

B0lloX
12-02-2006, 12:45 AM
I think this is an excellent idea.

B0llox<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

MALIM PRAEDARI

Eldude95
12-02-2006, 12:18 PM
You no if sound is a problem why not upload some music of engines and guns and so on and so on.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

I am the Super Sabre if you hate it your an idiot

S!

After the war if I could have tought my F6F to cook I'd have married it.

B0lloX
12-02-2006, 09:54 PM
Originally posted by Eldude95:
You no if sound is a problem why not upload some music of engines and guns and so on and so on.

Aaahhhmmm...wha?

B0lloX<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

MALIM PRAEDARI

Vike
12-05-2006, 12:31 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif *Bump* http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif


Originally posted by Vike:
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif *Bump* http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Like SlipBall;

While doing a BnZ yesterday on a OnLine server against a fat & ludicrous P-47D,i was fastly approaching his low dead 6...

We were only two at that moment on the server. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
I bring my K4-B4 closer and closer to him,he was slightly rolling on his left/right to see around him,but i was in his low dead 6,and he manifestly didn't see me.

And suddenly,guess what? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Ready to shoot with my crushing-gun,he immediatly dove,all of a sudden for NO reason. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_redface.gif

Then,we made a simple dogfight,in which he naturally went down. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/halo.gif

Two tactics are unfeasible with this sound bug:

-Dead 6 approach,in the German/E.Hartmann way.
-The Taran.

Concerning me,i use hardware acceleration enabled on my good old SoundBlaster Live,for the astonishing growling sound of the Daimler-Benz engines.I prefer having my ears being invaded by this engine roaring sound rather than desactivate hardware acceleration and cheat (there is no other word) that permitt to hear planes behind... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

IRL,as it has been already said,pilots were surrounded by their engine sound,but this was so loud that,most of the time,they even didn't hear the bullets impacts upon their plane fuselage!!!

It was simply their stick abnormal vibrations that indicated them that something wrong was happening to their plane...

We're somewhat far from this in the current state of our sim. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Here is an IRL story concerning Kyosti Karhila,a famous Me109-G finnish ace.This story includes exactly what i (and many other i suppose) would like to feel when i fly my favourite aircraft:

"It was the 20 August 1943. Lieutenant Kyosti "Kossi" Karhila was another pilot of the 3rd flight of FAF HLeLv 43 based in Kymi air base North of Kotka on the southern coast of Gulf of Finland. The task of the flight was to defend the towns of Kotka and Hamina, their harbour and the adjacent sea area with its military objects against Soviet Air Force.

Four Bf 109 G-2 fighters were airworthy that day at 14:41 hours as there was an alert: Four enemy Il-2M's escorted by eight fighters approaching Someri island, situated 50 km South from the base. Finnish pilots hurried to their fighters: Flight Commander Captain Puhakka , his wingman Sgt. Nuorala, Flight Master Tuominen and Lt. Karhila .

Lt. Karhila climbed in the cramped cockpit of the "MT-229" while two mechanics worked hard hand-cranking the flywheel of the inertia starter.<span class="ev_code_yellow"> The pilot closed the hood and went through the pre-start check list before starting the engine. When testing the magnetos, the no.2 magneto made the engine drop 150 rpm. That was a bad sign but Karhila did not care: he gave a sign to remove the chocks </span>. He prepared for takeoff after Flt.Mstr Tuominen, because the narrow airstrip could take only one fighter at a time. He had to wait for one minute so that the previous fighter's slipstream would disappear, worrying about the possibility of his own engine overheating.

Now Karhila applied power so that the Messer began to roll. He steered the fighter with brakes and aligned it with the runway. Then he gently applied more power, and to be able to control the huge torque of the three bladed prop he pulled the stick to keep the tailwheel on the ground. The Me's weak spot was its undercarriage: the weak stilt-like legs and narrow wheelbase made it accident-prone. The pilot kept increasing power, all the time feeling with his feet when the rudder would "bite".

As Karhila felt that the rudder was responding, he eased the stick and allowed the tailplane rise. Now he gently applied full power, because he was able to counter the torque with pedals.<span class="ev_code_yellow"> The Daimler-Benz engine growled at its' characteristic low note, accompanied by the falsetto whine of the supercharger.</span> The fighter was now accelerating on its main wheels, the propeller blade tips sweeping seven (!) centimeters from the runway gravel. The pilot waited until the Bf had accumulated enough speed. Then the powerful engine pulled the fighter off the ground at a light pull of the stick.

This was a normal Bf 109 take off. Any Messerschmitt pilot had to be able to do all this juggling without thinking about it. (Not everyone made it: one FAF pilot, whose name better be withheld, smashed five Bf's at start before he was rejected from training...) When airborne, Karhila pulled in the undercarriage, landing flaps and radiator gills. Next he adjusted power and set the prop pitch control to automatic. Then he eased the seat belt across his chest to be better able to look in the rear sector. His guns were loaded and the Revi gunsight illumination was on. Lieutenant Karhila and "MT-229" were ready and willing to fight the enemy. The pilot could not tell whether he was a part of his aircraft or whether the fighter was a part of him...

Karhila followed Cpt. Puhakka in 3000 m. They were not really flying in a finger-of-four formation as they should have and they were trained to do. Karhila and Tuominen were experienced and self-confident pilots who were hungry for more victories and unwilling to fly as anybody's wing men.

The enemy turned back before attacking having seen the four Me's, but the Finnish fighters pursued them and caught up with the enemy formation over the Gulf of Finland west of Seiskari Island (note: the Finnish names of those islands). Karhila saw the Flight Commander attack two enemy fighters. He looked around and there, below him he saw four "Sturmoviks" and six La-5 and Yak-7 fighters flying South.

<span class="ev_code_yellow"> Karhila was just about to attack them as his instinct told him to look back. There, 20 meters from his tail he saw the nose of a La-5 with big white prop spinner shining in sunlight.</span> Without thinking the Finnish pilot slammed the stick to the right and kicked the right pedal. He heard a crack in the left wing of the Me, but the rest of the enemy salvo missed his fighter with the sound of a passing express train, tracers flying. Karhila allowed his Messer do two rapid turns in flat roll, contrails extending from the wingtips.<span class="ev_code_yellow"> Where did the La appear ?</span> He continued in a 30 to 45 degree dive to NW with full power and "squirmed". He had checked the rear sector some seconds before. When tightening his curve the Finnish pilot saw the Lavotchkin 50 m behind his tail, looking menacing. The enemy must have dived from the sun.

Karhila kept diving with full power, but he was unable to shake off the enemy. For a second he was at a loss what to do, but then he decided that attack would be the best defence. He had to turn the nose of his fighter at the enemy at any means. Karhila pulled the stick as hard as he could, steering his fighter in a climbing left curve.

He curved tighter and tighter, increasing his rate of climb at the same time. He saw that the enemy was losing on him, but at the same moment he felt how his Me was about to stall. He eased the stick and barely recovered the fighter from complete stall. As the Bf 109 returned to full control, he was flying horizontally. The La-5 was on the same altitude, on the opposite side of their common turning circle.

Now Karhila curved tight again and soon he had the enemy in his gunsight. He fired for the first time at 150 m. The La-5 half-rolled and dived, the Finnish pilot followed. The enemy pulled out of the dive, Karhila aimed and fired again at a range of 200 m. The La-5 made another half-roll and dive, striving for the AA cover of a Soviet base on Peninsaari Island. The enemy was now 800 m ahead of him but Karhila was catching up fast.

When Karhila was within range and fired at 300 m, the enemy apparently decided to use the same manouver that had saved Karhila: the La-5 pulled into a tight left climbing curve. The Finnish pilot allowed the enemy turn for a second before following. The Me was more manouverable than the LA-5, he approached the enemy fast.

At the range of 75 m Karhila aimed with rough deflection and opened fire, shooting brief salvoes. The enemy fighter took hits in its fuselage.<span class="ev_code_yellow"> When the range was 50 m, the La-5 broke in two just behind the cockpit. Karhila's Messer was for a moment surrounded by flying debris.</span>

The tailless La-5 rocked violently, then nosedived. More debris fell off, then the enemy pilot bailed out. Soon his parachute opened and the pilote splashed in the sea. Karhila watched with fascination how the tail end of the enemy fighter slowly fell, the rudder flipping and showing the red star on both sides of the tailplane. Then he realised what really happened and he shouted in the radio: "Anybody saw - I shot a La-5!". It was his victory no. 18.

A Bf 109 fighter passed overhead - it was Oippa Tuominen who responded and congratulated. Karhila saw a white streak on the sea: a Soviet speedboat arrived to rescue the La-5 pilot from his cold bath.

Now the "MT-229" engine began to act up, making the fighter vibrate violently every now and then. Also there was a big hole in the left wing. It certainly had been a close shave, and Karhila took course to the base with low power, anxious to avoid any more fighting this time.

He made a victory pass over the base before landing. Landing a Bf 109 was nearly as tricky as taking off. The pilot had to control the attitude of the fighter so that the nose would not be too down - the prop would literally "bite dust" - nor should the plane be allowed to stall at low altitude and smash the flimsy undercarriage legs.

But Karhila landed expertly. He parked the "MT-229" and climbed out of the cockpit. The ground crew already had heard the good news, they also could see that soot from the muzzle flashes of the guns had soiled the nose of the fighter and the pilot was drenched in sweat and his knees appeared to be a bit weak. There also was a gaping hole in the left wing...

Everybody congratulated Karhila for his victory. To "bag" a La-5, a very dangerous opponent, after being surprised by it proved excellent flying skill. What Kossi Karhila had experienced was the nightmare of any fighter pilot - but he had been able to "turn the tables" and survived . You could not find a happier man in Kymi air base that day.

<span class="ev_code_yellow">He had been lucky, too, because the mechanics told that the enemy hit had virtually split the main spar of the wing and it had been a miracle that the damaged wing had withstood the stress of the battle and the victory pass. The wing had to be replaced before "MT-229" was airworthy again.</span>"

-Here (http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/karhi/karhi.htm)-

Mr Kyosti Karhila was lucky that day,that's why he could be back to tell us what it happened.

Curiously,what was a real EXCEPTION IRL seems to be a common "feature" in OnLine servers...http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Crossing fingers for the 4.08m patch for a fix. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

@+

ps:

Note: The La5 shot down by Kyosti Karhila made evasive maneuvers AFTER the finnish Ace opened fire on him,not BEFORE.
That's yet exactly what happens when i approach a "red" plane on OnLine servers most of the time.The "red" plane pilot manifestly hears me and begins to evade BEFORE i shoot a single bullet..! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/354.gif <div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://vike01.free.fr/images/avatars/signIL2.jpg
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slipBall
12-05-2006, 12:55 PM
Note: The La5 shot down by Kyosti Karhila made evasive maneuvers AFTER the finnish Ace opened fire on him,not BEFORE.
That's yet exactly what happens when i approach a "red" plane on OnLine servers most of the time.The "red" plane pilot manifestly hears me and begins to evade BEFORE i shoot a single bullet..!



Small chance of seeing this in fb...maybe a better chance in bob...hopeing anyway<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f394/SlipBall/orders.jpg

Philipscdrw
12-06-2006, 08:30 AM
When I have more money, I'll take an aerotow with a glider. I'll be sat in an engineless aircraft 60ft/30m behind a Piper PA-25 Pawnee, flying at about 60kts, and I'll see if I can hear it.

Granted, its 250hp engine is reedy compared to anything used in WW2 combat, but then again I don't have an engine on my own aircraft!

Actually, I can just ask someone else when they take an aerotow. (Saves me money!)<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

------------------------------------------------------------
PhilipsCDRw

PF_Tini's Simple Guide to Switching 4.04m, 4.05m, and 4.07m. (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/7351046415)
Flying on Hyperlobby as EAF_T_Dozer

Ratsack
12-08-2006, 04:53 AM
Bump!

SeaFireLIV
12-08-2006, 05:07 PM
Is this to do with the new add-on? I`ve still got 4.05 and I don`t hear aircraft coming.

AA_Absolute
12-11-2006, 12:04 AM
Hi

The "sonic radar" are the great bug of il2 now and always (is easy to solve,make switch turn off external sounds in full real settings), i write here more times and times and silence... (i dont understand).

I write for bump but dont have any hope in il2 or in SoW, as all people know sonic radar have benefits for "T&B" figthers, no need say more...

SeaFireLIV
12-11-2006, 03:34 AM
Well, obviously everyone wishes to continue whining about this, but wasn`t this solved in an old patch ages ago? I remember writing about the difference.

I still fly online and I still don`t find myself being alerted to encroaching enemies on my 6 without a wingie to help or looking behind. Just last Monday we were bounced online by enemy 109s. So what`s going on?

Perhaps it`s the sound settings? perhaps it`s the soundcard? I have an XFI though, and I still don`t hear aircarft in tme to be warned by them.

Oh well, continue. I haven`t noticed the problem.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v31/SeaFireLIV/LIVeyes.jpg
"If it burns, it is confirmed."

Ivan Lukich Zvyagin

CSL_Kocour
12-11-2006, 04:40 AM
Most likely the attenuation settings or just more "sensitive" sound card drivers. Some hear even sirens from 5km up...incredible.

As for the aero tow video...I found a couple on YouTube http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZH67CvnSPDM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYY89Ut__Nw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luCUPfFEfIY


And guess what...the 100m distant tow plane engine sound is lost in the air clutter in glider cockpit http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Vike
12-11-2006, 05:15 AM
Excellent find Kocur,thanks! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://vike01.free.fr/images/avatars/signIL2.jpg
- AthlonXP 2400Mhz + 1024MB DDR CL 2.0
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slipBall
12-11-2006, 05:26 AM
Most likely the attenuation settings or just more "sensitive" sound card drivers. Some hear even sirens from 5km up...incredible



This may be very true<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f394/SlipBall/orders.jpg

CSL_Kocour
12-11-2006, 05:42 AM
Now some formation flying vids http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVVDGXH9DUI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKVGmkC6zgo&mode

There is more on YouTube, still trying to find the best one

As for the attenuation set by server...I just got message from Oleg...it is NOT possible in IL2 series and it WILL be possible in BoB series!

So lets hope http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

slipBall
12-11-2006, 12:08 PM
As for the attenuation set by server...I just got message from Oleg...it is NOT possible in IL2 series and it WILL be possible in BoB series!


Now that is good news<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f394/SlipBall/orders.jpg

Vike
12-12-2006, 07:09 AM
Originally posted by slipBall:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">As for the attenuation set by server...I just got message from Oleg...it is NOT possible in IL2 series and it WILL be possible in BoB series!


Now that is good news </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I dunno...http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://vike01.free.fr/images/avatars/signIL2.jpg
- AthlonXP 2400Mhz + 1024MB DDR CL 2.0
- Radeon 9800XT 460/790Mhz
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- Aka JV69_Vike http://vike01.free.fr/images/avatars/jv69.jpg

Matz0r
12-12-2006, 08:22 AM
A good trick is to set throttle to 0% when you're about 500m out. This way they cannot hear you, sure you'll lose some speed but you will also get more time to shoot http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

--
F16VS http://flygflottilj16.se/
Visit ~VALHALLA~ our full real server on Hyperlobby, hosting early war historical planesets and missions.
http://home.swipnet.se/hotascougar/pics/fokker_now.jpg

Tater-SW-
12-12-2006, 08:53 AM
Originally posted by CSL_Kocour:
As for the attenuation set by server...I just got message from Oleg...it is NOT possible in IL2 series and it WILL be possible in BoB series!

So lets hope http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Then the solution is simple, remove external sounds altogether or change the attenuation to minimum.

It shouldn't even be a server setting, it's absurd.

tater

triggerhappyfin
12-15-2006, 10:37 AM
Originally posted by F16_Matz_:
A good trick is to set throttle to 0% when you're about 500m out. This way they cannot hear you, sure you'll lose some speed but you will also get more time to shoot http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

A creative solution on something others see as a problem http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v257/Triggerhappyfin/ace1copy.jpg


<span class="ev_code_YELLOW">"Enemy fighters at 2 o┬┤clock!"

"Roger! What should i do until then?"!</span>

blindpugh
12-15-2006, 11:12 AM
Originally posted by Tater-SW-:
I've spent a while inside a B-24 (collings, prop gov was out, and we tried 3 times to take a hop, for a total of a couple hours on the ground engines running) and a B-17 (aluminum overcast ride).

The former was at out AFB/airport, loads of planes nearby, heard NOTHING but our 4 radials. The B-17 ride was at a smaller field, and there was an AT-6 warming up right next to us. Again, nothing but our own noise, can't hear yourself think (but god i love that noise!).

This idiocy needs to go away.yes it certainly does need to go-away-thats why in bombers they had internal radio channels -cos you couldnt hear sod -all

tater

Ratsack
12-16-2006, 10:49 PM
I'm sorry to hear that Oleg's said it isn't possible in IL-2.

I hope (hope springs eternal, eh) that this means, 'No, there is no time to spend mucking around with server side coding to do this: we have BoB to release.' This would mean there is a slim shadow of hope for a fix one day.

On the other hand, if Oleg actually meant there's some restriction in the IL-2 core that doesn't allow the fix, then that's a shame.

cheers,
Ratsack<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

JG14_Josf: 'Gravity, among may other things, is not known...' http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Ratsack
01-04-2007, 02:22 AM
I hate audio radar!!

I also hate being able to hear explosions as planes hit the ground. I particularly hate it that the sound of the bang is simultaneous with the crash: sound at the speed of light. Kewl.

I also hate being able to hear opponents guns. I hate them being able to hear mine even more.

I also double plus hate Goldstein.

But I love Big Brother and INGSOC.

Ratsack<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

JG14_Josf: 'Gravity, among may other things, is not known...' http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif