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RamsteinUSA
12-13-2004, 02:23 PM
Hi,
While palying in pacific Fighters, I am having a problem with torpedos. I set up a bunch of Submerged subs in a COOP on a map for practice and go out with either the A20-G or the Beaufighter and a torpedo. I see the wake of the submerged sub and the periscope sticking up and the submerged sub is just a few feet fromt he surface. I launch the torpedo and it goes goes, over, under, through the submerged submarine and no explosion. A really big thing i find very odd, besides this problem, is the the submereged subs shoot at my planes and hit it.. how does a submerged sub actually fire it machine gun at me while submerged..???

Anyone have any answers for these questions.??

Thank you..

cow9th
12-13-2004, 02:30 PM
most torpedos launched by planes would skim the surface.
in reality you would have to score a direct hit on the scope of a submerged sub to actually do any damage at all wich would explain why you cannot do anythying. even the conning tower if thats what theyre called would be beneath the torpedo as it went overhead.

as for them shooting you its simply not possible. i guess thats a bug then.

the submerged sub would still be quite some distance beneath the sea, the scope extends quite some distance above the tower.

RamsteinUSA
12-13-2004, 02:35 PM
Believe me, this is no knee jerk question, I have been setting up practice maps and have tried this 100's of times.. and the subs are the only enmy of any kind in one of my practice coop maps.. so it is the submerged subs shooting me..

I would think I could hit the conning tower (sp?) becuase it is so close to the surface and have also tried to hit the periscop too, I cannot find a way of proof showing it actually was in perfect path but have had 100's of tries.. and have seen my fish right on target many times...

Please. anyone else set this up and have any better results.. whats the point of having submerged subs if they are invincible??

Jason Bourne
12-13-2004, 06:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by cow9th:
most torpedos launched by planes would skim the surface.
in reality you would have to score a direct hit on the scope of a submerged sub to actually do any damage at all wich would explain why you cannot do anythying. even the conning tower if thats what theyre called would be beneath the torpedo as it went overhead.

as for them shooting you its simply not possible. i guess thats a bug then.

the submerged sub would still be quite some distance beneath the sea, the scope extends quite some distance above the tower. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

actually, IIRC, the German Mark XXI electroboot (sp) could infact fire its 20mm turrets while mostly submerged, obviously the mike mikes had to be above the water, but i think they still could fire if the rest was under

oh, and the XXI was the german sub that actually started looking like subs of today, also its the rocket fueled one.

Mjollnir111675
12-13-2004, 06:54 PM
Replying to the post:

The Mk XIII sucked!!! Dont care!! Gimme a plane where I can drop it and HOPEFULLY it wont run 10-23 ft. deeper than intended,it might explode or keep goin and maybe JUST MAYBE I'll actually send that big beeyotch listin' into the sunset with hopefully sending alot of rising sun sailors ta Davy Jones Locker!!

RamsteinUSA
12-14-2004, 04:32 AM
Update:

I just tried the special training missions with the submerged sub and used bombs instead of torpedos and they had no effect! not a scratch ont he sub! I dumped the biggest bombs the A20-G would carry right on top of it, 'Bullseye! and Nada, Zilch! just an explosion and a huge spash! No one seems to care! What's the point of having these subs int he game if they are invincible??!!


Anyone listening??

(thanx to those that have had an input ..

is this a Bug?

what the heck is going on??!!

pacettid
12-14-2004, 04:39 AM
Buddy,

I know this problem troubles you, but believe me, there are plenty of other things that need to be patched just as badly, and the developers have promised to address them.

Have you sent in a bug report on this problem yet?

If you need any help submitting the report, I'm sure VFC CrazyIvan, or one of the other moderators would be glad to help you.

As a retired U.S. Navy man with 23 years experience chasing submarines, I feel your pain http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

Akronnick
12-14-2004, 04:48 AM
I don't beleive a torpedo or a GP Bomb would be effective against a submerged sub.
IRL ASW aircraft off WWII carried Depth Bombs that wolud not detonate until reaching a preset depth. The way this was done, especially in the
Atlantic was to deploy aircraft in Hunter/Killer teams, usually with Wildcats or Dauntlesses doing the scouting. When they spotted a sub they would radio the Killers, usually an Avenger or sometimes a PBY, or maybe even a destroyer. The point is, the actual Kill was not usuallly performed by any of the Aircraft that are Flyable, but they performed the more important task of finding the enemy sub

RamsteinUSA
12-14-2004, 05:04 AM
Problem is, is it a bug, or was it meant to be that the subs are invincible,, hey, these subs are just a few short feet below the surface, some people seem to think they moodel some deep sea subs, they do not, these are just barely under the suface.. and the conning tower is right there and the periscope has glass in it and don't tell me the bombs would not scratch that either..

If its a Bug,,, I guess a report can be made. but no one has stepped forward that's has said yeah it's a bug, submit a report..
=====

Update, just now I sent a Bug report.
Thanx to all with suggestions. If I hear anything I will report it, and if you guys hear anything let us know.. Either way..

Thank you,,

fabianfred
12-14-2004, 06:06 AM
try this thread...

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=26310365&m=8231025942

WB_Outlaw
12-14-2004, 06:08 AM
Two possibilities I see here:

The first is that it's an outright bug. It's been reported and prioritized, end of story.

Second, since there is no option to set the run depth of the torpedo, it is possible that the fish is running too shallow to hit the sub. Even a direct hit on a periscope may not be enough to detonate the warhead.

Either way, I hope we get a run depth option for the torps.

-Outlaw.

Tully__
12-14-2004, 06:15 AM
You can kill a submerged sub with 2x500lb'ers (may need a couple of passes) set with a bit of delay in 3.02bm. Bigger bombs also work. You must be VERY accurate though.

RamsteinUSA
12-14-2004, 07:44 AM
Tully,
I was told that (what you just said), and have just tried it with a Cosair and 1,000 lb and 2 500 lb bombs, and no damage occured upon every pass..

zilch, nada...

RamsteinUSA
12-14-2004, 08:27 AM
I just thought of a way to fix the sub problem, just add a damage model that spill oil and can even thow a few floating seat and bed cushions on the surface..., no need to actually change much of the code, if any at all, just add code that ads these items when it is damaged... and the messsage would come up that gives credit for the hit, kill, score.. of damaging and/or sinking a sub..

this way a finished model need Not to be re-written for the submerged subs..

Just an idea, as I do not write code, but can the benfit of just adding a damage model as a hook...

J30Vader
12-14-2004, 09:42 PM
Periscope depth was IIRC somewhere around 25'?
Depth charges and bombs were the weapons to use.

RamsteinUSA
12-16-2004, 03:03 PM
Hi, my last post on this...
I waited a couple days to think about my last repsonse, after recieving a reponse about the submerged sub from my 'Bug Report' I sent in...

the official word is that using a 2,000 lb bomb (from a Corsair) with a direct hit will kil the submerged sub.

I am not reall happy with that... but will live with that.. I was hoping we could hit it with a toorpedo, or a couple 500 lb bombs...

but again, only a dead on, direct lucky BB hit will work with a really heavy bomb..

Ok, I am simplifying the answer, but if you only have one bomb, or even 3.... and you have the choice between the submerged Sub or another target, take the other target, there is only a 2% chance you wil get the sub... and will most likely waste your bomb... so just to add submerged subs in a game with plenty of other targets, well, it's cool, to have a periscope running around... but as a target..... that's another story..


IMHO

cow9th
12-16-2004, 03:52 PM
periscope depth is still about 10-15 feet below the surface.
a torpedo doesnt travel at 15 feet beneath the surface.

thats the point i am making. aircraft cant possibly torpedo a submerged submarine.

J30Vader
12-16-2004, 11:45 PM
Actually they did. Torps were preset for a certain depth depending on the target. You may want 15' for a merchantship or a destroyer, but 18-20' for a battleship to strike below the armor belt. Then you had the torps with the magnetic exploder. They were designed to explode under the ship, breaking its back.

Torps could also have their depth setting changed in flight. At least on the TBM Avenger.
But torps were usually not wasted on a sub.

Today's torps of course travel much deeper and faster.

fabianfred
12-17-2004, 07:43 AM
has anyone tried getting a ship to ram a submerged sub...? or at least pass right over it

I watched a sub sink a destroyer with a torp then run into the sinking ship and after a dull boom ... gone

Zeus-cat
12-17-2004, 12:42 PM
I have used a submerged sub to put several torpedoes into the Tirpitz and then a second submerged sub rams the first one, sinking both subs. This way I have a damaged Tirpitz at the start of a mission.

I put two more subs on the other side of the Tirpitz so the battleship can't sink the first two subs before the torpedoes fire. The battleship uses all her guns to shoot at (and sink) submerged subs.

Zeus-cat