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XyZspineZyX
09-13-2003, 07:51 AM
Concerning all the new il2 videos comming out, id like to offer a tip on making them smooth. I have seen the wm9 codec stop 1 too many movies from being as good as they could have been. Those 2 incredible Chinese movies were the last straw!! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Since we dont have an offical ubi il2 movie forum, and the other movie forum is down, i gues i have to post this here.

There are 2 parts to smooth video. Input video and output video.

the first has allready been addressed, and involved getting fraps to record video at 15fps, and setting the game speed to half for recording. Then in virtualdub(or whatever movie editor you are using) setting the fps to 30, this will double the half speed video, and play it as 30fps normal speed.
The benifits of this are incredibly smooth(lifelike) video, and it is super easy on hardware, even crappy comps have no trouble captureing 640x480 at only 15fps. This is smooth input video

The second component which people seem to be neglecting is output video, and for the post part this involves the codec. The wmv format(9 in particular) is horrible http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif you will notice almost every single video encoded with wm9 is choppy, some more so then others, but still allways choppy.
The wm9 codec has a smoothness-crispness slider, which when set near cripness causes frame dropping. This is the choppiness we all see. I cant find the link to the article on divx-digest.com(if i do ill add it) that explains it better. But if the codec cant meet the desired setting it screwes the video to make up for it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Even if you put perfectly smooth video in(which i am almost sure all the movie makers are), the codec single handedly ruins it, and you get choppy video out.

How do you solve this? simple DO NOT encode with the wm9 codec. Thats it, thats all it takes. Use either divx or xvid. If you insist on using the wmv format(wm9 codec), make sure you set the smoothness-crispness slider far enough down that it does not output a choppy video. wmv does not offer a better quality/size ratio then xvid or divx, it only appears to because it screws your video to acomplish it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif And even still xvid beats it.

in conclusion, for smooth video(il2 movies)
you need smooth video input, and smooth video output(a codec that wont produce choppy video). Do not encode with wm9, you'll be amayzed with the results. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-13-2003, 07:51 AM
Concerning all the new il2 videos comming out, id like to offer a tip on making them smooth. I have seen the wm9 codec stop 1 too many movies from being as good as they could have been. Those 2 incredible Chinese movies were the last straw!! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Since we dont have an offical ubi il2 movie forum, and the other movie forum is down, i gues i have to post this here.

There are 2 parts to smooth video. Input video and output video.

the first has allready been addressed, and involved getting fraps to record video at 15fps, and setting the game speed to half for recording. Then in virtualdub(or whatever movie editor you are using) setting the fps to 30, this will double the half speed video, and play it as 30fps normal speed.
The benifits of this are incredibly smooth(lifelike) video, and it is super easy on hardware, even crappy comps have no trouble captureing 640x480 at only 15fps. This is smooth input video

The second component which people seem to be neglecting is output video, and for the post part this involves the codec. The wmv format(9 in particular) is horrible http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif you will notice almost every single video encoded with wm9 is choppy, some more so then others, but still allways choppy.
The wm9 codec has a smoothness-crispness slider, which when set near cripness causes frame dropping. This is the choppiness we all see. I cant find the link to the article on divx-digest.com(if i do ill add it) that explains it better. But if the codec cant meet the desired setting it screwes the video to make up for it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Even if you put perfectly smooth video in(which i am almost sure all the movie makers are), the codec single handedly ruins it, and you get choppy video out.

How do you solve this? simple DO NOT encode with the wm9 codec. Thats it, thats all it takes. Use either divx or xvid. If you insist on using the wmv format(wm9 codec), make sure you set the smoothness-crispness slider far enough down that it does not output a choppy video. wmv does not offer a better quality/size ratio then xvid or divx, it only appears to because it screws your video to acomplish it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif And even still xvid beats it.

in conclusion, for smooth video(il2 movies)
you need smooth video input, and smooth video output(a codec that wont produce choppy video). Do not encode with wm9, you'll be amayzed with the results. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-13-2003, 10:17 AM
Davinci, thanks a lot for this posting. I'll immediately try out what you're saying, because I too have problems with choppiness.

You are the KING of smooth videos (I loved your anotherday.avi) and I automatically thought you were using video output and grabbing it with a digicam. It is very heartening to know that you are using fraps like us other mortals! (I'm using the freeware version, is that ok?)

I have an athlon xp2000+, 512 mb ram with a geforce4 ti4200 128 mb ram. How does that shape up compared to your system? Should I be able to get your results?

I record with fraps and FB set to 640x480 screensize, 2 x AA, no sound, all graphic details to excellent. Maybe you could advice me regarding which graphic details which should be set lower and would have a big effect on how FB runs, but only a negligible impact on graphic beauty?

Regarding the codecs, that's all very interesting. I am beginning to think that divX is an ok output format, because the people that are interested in computer movies will have gotten it by now (to much stuff they couldn't play back otherwise!). However, I deleted the add-ware that came with DivX5 and have been told in Ulead video Editor 6 that I can't use that codec for encoding unles the add-ware is still on my comp. I guess I should just install it and live with it? Is Xvid the same and where do I get that codec?

OK, those were a lot of questions, but it just shows there was a need for your posting and I'm very grateful to hear from "the expert"! (It is because I saw "davinci" that I said to myself "gotta heed the advice in this thread!" :-)

To those of you who haven't seen davincis latest video, you MUST download it here:

http://www.nr.no/~pab/IL2%20movies/Anotherday.avi



Freycinet
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Message Edited on 09/13/0311:19AM by Freycinet

XyZspineZyX
09-13-2003, 04:46 PM
- It is very heartening to know that you are using
- fraps like us other mortals! (I'm using the freeware
- version, is that ok?)

yep, fraps 1.9d(freeware)

- I have an athlon xp2000+, 512 mb ram with a geforce4
- ti4200 128 mb ram. How does that shape up compared
- to your system? Should I be able to get your
- results?

Athlone tbird 1.2ghz, 256mb ram, radeon 9000(non pro), 5400rmp HD.

- I record with fraps and FB set to 640x480
- screensize, 2 x AA, no sound, all graphic details to
- excellent. Maybe you could advice me regarding which
- graphic details which should be set lower and would
- have a big effect on how FB runs, but only a
- negligible impact on graphic beauty?

my movies are recorded with fraps at 640x480, game at 640x480, video settings are everything to excellent, 4xAA(performance), first video was 2x though, and 8xansio filtering. Because i am only running the game at 640x480, my video card has cycles to spare, and you can ramp everything else up. Remember you are only recording 15fps!!, you can turn on lots of eye candy and still stay above 15fps even on weak systems.

- I deleted the add-ware that came with DivX5 and have
- been told in Ulead video Editor 6 that I can't use
- that codec for encoding unles the add-ware is still
- on my comp. I guess I should just install it and
- live with it? Is Xvid the same and where do I get
- that codec?

you should donwload just the codec/player combo, adwere isnt a problem. http://download.divx.com/divx/DivX51Bundle.exe
and xvid
http://www.divx-digest.tv/software/codec/XviD_Install.exe

XyZspineZyX
09-13-2003, 04:50 PM
did you notice in the greatly made chinese videos they dont show the full ammos amount the 190 tail can take and they always pan away when .50s are hitting the 190s except for when the 190 dives down and the p40 got a clean gas tank hit http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

flying online 190 pilots will never do that they just spin like a top and stick yank.

The 200+ meg vid was the best one I ever seen, but they should have shown 20mm hits on the yak http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


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XyZspineZyX
09-13-2003, 08:35 PM
Thanks for the good tips. Here's another question for you: How do i get rid of the time counter in track files?

Thanks

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XyZspineZyX
09-14-2003, 01:25 AM
You can get rid of all th chats when you play your tracks by turning off the in game messages at the track load screen.

Davinci-

I understand the way you achieve the look in your smooth as warm butter movies. There was a dilemma that we faced in our last couple of movies. We still did them at 15fps etc. but did not bump up the frames in V-Dub, just at the time of the final movie compression. I see that you use 1.9 Fraps without any in game sounds. The real issue comes when using in game sounds and bumping up the frames in V-Dub. Of course this cuts the 30 second clip to a 15 seconds clip and messes up the audio synch with the video. You then have to use a sound editor to take the audio track and compress it to 15 seconds so it still fits the video clip. The only problem is because the audio plays a little faster the in game sounds are not 'perfect' like they would be normally(like a slightly faster chat produces the helium voice effect etc..) Which in a way defeats the purpose of having in game sound so to speak. Folks have responded in a positive way to in game sound.

All that to say if you do want movies with in game sounds there is a slight sacrifice made in terms of speed/quality of sound to make it as smooth as warm butter on the video side. Since we realized we could not do both we 'settled' for as smooth as we could get it with in game sounds (LOL).

The CHN videos and yours are interesting to us for several reasons. I think the technical hurdle we all face and can solve together is the hurdle of producing movies with your smooth as warm butter look 'AND' perfect in game sounds. Clearly they have a HOG rig to render those larger bomber formations, ground objects, sound, perfect settings etc. all at the same time without a 'large' amount of chopiness.

We just got some new movie making software from Sony and will be getting a super fast rig in about two weeks. Once that happens I will report the results here. I really think the trk recording and system etc. has ALOT to do with this issue as well as the codec compression issue that you have correctly identified.

Let's talk more about ways to solve this issue in the future. S!





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XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 05:31 PM
bump

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