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SkyChimp
08-31-2006, 07:23 PM
My grandfather was in the US Army in the '20s stationed in the Panama Canal Zone. He flew biplanes on occassions, and was an amateur photographer, as well as a his unit's photographer. He left me his photo albums. Here are a few that were loose in the album, thought you might like to see them:

USS Saratoga
http://members.cox.net/us.fighters/USSSaratoga_1.jpg
http://members.cox.net/us.fighters/USSSaratoga_2.jpg
http://members.cox.net/us.fighters/USSSaratoga_3.jpg

HMS Renown
http://members.cox.net/us.fighters/HMSRenown_1.jpg
http://members.cox.net/us.fighters/HMSRenown_2.jpg
http://members.cox.net/us.fighters/HMSRenown_3.jpg

Luckily, he photographed about everything there was to see. He left me hundred of photos of USAAC fighters and bombers, Navy fighters and floatplanes, USS Los Angeles, many USN battleships, the British Royal Family, the Spirit of St. Louis, and Lindbergh himself. I'll try and scan more and post them.

vocatx
08-31-2006, 08:08 PM
What you have is priceless. If I were you, I'd scan all of it to disc, then rent a safe-deposit box or buy a fire-proof safe to keep all that in.

I'll be waiting to see more. Great pics.

Jungmann
08-31-2006, 08:15 PM
More, please.

leitmotiv
08-31-2006, 09:42 PM
Phenomenal. Never seen a phot of LEX class CV without any deck markings at all and the frasting deck looks like it isn't planked. Must be right after completion. Thanks a mil, SkyChimp.

slo_1_2_3
08-31-2006, 09:50 PM
That's just cool...

GreyFox5
08-31-2006, 09:57 PM
Wow - Excellent. Ya save them to a DVD and then put the orginals in a fireproof box.

Tooz_69GIAP
08-31-2006, 09:57 PM
Wow, that is some really nice stuff!! I agree with the safe deposit box idea!! Would be terrible to lose a pictorial history of that kind. It sounds like it's a very unique and valuable resource!

I'd love to see more!

ElAurens
08-31-2006, 11:06 PM
Thanks SkyChimp.

SkyChimp
08-31-2006, 11:41 PM
Here's a few more.

First of all, I have this man to thank, my Grandfather, who passed in August, 2001.

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/10.jpg

Here are some aircraft motor photos. Wright motor, Curtis d12 motor, and Liberty motor respectively.

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/motor1.jpg
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/motor2.jpg


Here's a few more.

Douglas Transport
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/douglas.jpg

An amphibian and some DeHavillands:
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/planes.jpg

Costes and Lebrix's plane, next to the Spirti of St. Louis (got a few pics of the Costes and Lebrix, too)
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/planes2.jpg

An old Thomas Morse fighter, and some Curtiss fighters (I think)
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/planes3.jpg

A Vought, and the bottom one is a plane built bya guy named Lt. Asp. I don't know much about it, but its about the size of VW Bug. I've got bunch of photos of it and the maker
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/planes4.jpg

Keystone bomber
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/keystone.jpg

A Martin bomber
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/martin.jpg

Gen Pershing top, and Spirt of St. Louis bottom


Head of the USAAC top, and a Sikorsky bottom
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/famous2.jpg

VF-51-Dart
08-31-2006, 11:52 PM
Excellent stuff, and no worries about the copyright. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

R_Target
08-31-2006, 11:54 PM
Amazing pics. Thanks. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

leitmotiv
09-01-2006, 12:38 AM
That is a splendid collection. Golden Age Army air buffs will love those shots of fighters etc.

HayateAce
09-01-2006, 01:27 AM
Actually Chimp, you haven't protected yourself enough. You should seriously see what kind of organization/catalogue scheme you can get together. If you've got enough shots, you may be able to publish a photojournal/reference style book for modelers and enthusiasts of early US army and naval aviation.

joeap
09-01-2006, 02:44 AM
COOLEST THREAD EVER!!!!!

Low_Flyer_MkVb
09-01-2006, 02:53 AM
Highly evocative pics. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif Thanks for a happy start to the day over here.

ploughman
09-01-2006, 03:10 AM
Thanks Chimp, those are windows into a different world. Amazing. I love that flying boat.

AWL_Spinner
09-01-2006, 04:01 AM
Brilliant, thanks very much for posting those!

I love that old stuff, truly the Golden age of aviation.

Anyone who enjoys reading about that era should take a look at "Fate is the Hunter", one of my favourite aviation books.

partic_3
09-01-2006, 04:26 AM
Shi-ite, after all these years, Shychimp! (sic)
Love your work.

stanford-ukded
09-01-2006, 04:38 AM
Great pics, Chimp.

About worring about the copyright, you might consider using text that is a little more obstuctive. I mean, i spent the best part of 30 seconds on your photo and got rid of the red text roughly. Give me 20 minutes and you'd never know it was there.

I'd recommend text that covers the whole image, parts of which that can't easily be replicated, in a large low opacity and possibly embossed font. It's still possible to get rid of it, but much much harder and time consuming. If you put your text over ground or sky for example, there's always more of that which can be use to "create" what is behind the text and thereby eliminate it.

http://www.cruise****et.com/images/Pete/stuff/9.jpg

I should really have embossed that copyright, it does detract from the image slightly but you can tell what was there. If people want an unedited version, let them contact you directly.

Sorry for messing with your images.

blairgowrie
09-01-2006, 04:52 AM
Just incredible stuff Sky Chimp. A national treasure. Thank you for sharing m8.

Friendly_flyer
09-01-2006, 04:58 AM
Wow, great pictures!

gdfo
09-01-2006, 05:09 AM
Good picture of Sara's 8 inch batteries.

Thanks for posting the pictures.

SkyChimp
09-01-2006, 07:42 AM
Updated.

leitmotiv
09-01-2006, 08:11 AM
Thanks for the details.

joeap
09-01-2006, 08:18 AM
Skychimp, let me reiterate this stuff is a treasure, literally. In fact it is priceless-do take whatever steps necessary to preserve it for prosterity and protect your copyright.

Never heard of the Keystone bomber, love the motor pics, the pics of the Sara in her early configuration (bow is different as well as the 8 inch turrets), Pershing and Lindberg. Ahh all the old airplane pics, just imagine flying those babies, no gps or FMC, no radios even, doubt they had gyroscopes.

Would love to see more pics, epecially taken from the air. Also, interesting to see the HMS Renown, I guess the caption (largest ship to traverse the Panama Canal) became obsolete in WWII. I'll post a pic when I get home of her as she looked after her late-30s rebuild and refit. Very different.

LEBillfish
09-01-2006, 09:03 AM
Awesome stuff!!...... So did one of your other relatives get all the pron? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Seriously though as to copyright, it will be tough.....You'll need to use an EXIF editor to insure the tons of info contained in a digital image is gone, so what you see is what you get.

What you may want to do is see about selling copies to publishers, in that way you'll retain the rights yet they'll be forced to protect them. On the otherhand though, total $ they're worth "digitally" is probably so marginal who would care?....On the same token, being they're a family heirloom, I cannot even imagine selling such treasures, only in the originals is there any money to be had, that money not worth the personal aspect of them.

Things like this are a tough call....In the end it often boiling down keeping it all to yourself, or sharing it with the world knowing you have the originals to back up your claim.....Also, don't expect to get rich from a digital product.

Either way, thanks for sharing what you have and hope to see more http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Enforcer572005
09-01-2006, 09:36 AM
WOW! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif
your grandfather was an incredible man, not only for his service, but for his photographic skills with such primitive equipment. He knew exactly what he was doing with that thing, and what was important. Such foresight.

And the Repulse....a doomed ship in better days. Sara still has the clipper bow! My great uncle was career navy NCO at that time, but very few pix.

And that's not a Thomas Morse, I cant remebmer the name, but the USAF museum has one like it I believe. I think it was also too late for WW1 like the TMS I think.

Im curious as to the plane next to Lindberghs, with "nungressor Coli" on it.

As far as copyrighting, I was going to suggest the opposite and suggest that you use less garish and smaller copyright (like a c in a circle in a corner). To totally protect it from digital manipulation, you would have to literally destroy the image. The wonder of these things is so magnificent that It needs to be seen as close to original as possible.

and besides, if your'e not going to market them or try to make some $ from them (you might be able to per the publisher suggestion above), then I wouldnt be that concerned with such. THose things are just so important historically, literally priceless. Never seen such detail on some of those planes and ships.

I hope you will consider making alot more of the planes, ships,historical figures availible so we can save that. this is the most fascinating thread Ive seen on here in a long time. Thanx for posting this, and i hope to see some more sir. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif

Ruy Horta
09-01-2006, 10:19 AM
An old Thomas Morse fighter, and some Curtiss fighters (I think)

The a/c in the forefront look like Boeing PW-9s.

Very nice material. Really love these Interbellum a/c, thanks!

Cold_Gambler
09-01-2006, 10:42 AM
That's great- THANK YOU VERY MUCH for sharing these http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

BigKahuna_GS
09-01-2006, 10:47 AM
Excellent photos Chimp !

Thanks so much for posting them. My dad went thru the Pananma Canal on the Sara during the mid to late 1930's. He was flying Boeing F4B-4's at the time which was the Navy & Marine Corps frontline fighter. While in Panama the pilots enjoyed shore leave with some fine cigars, tasty beer and latin nightlife. My dad past away last year and I am hoping to recieve a box of about 500+ photos spanning a 30year carreer in USMC aviation. I was in the process of inventoring this collection and found pics of USN/USMC Admirals (Nimits), Generals, well known fighter aces and Corps legend Chesty Puller.

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/mdegnan/_images/Boeing%20FB-4.jpg
Navy/Marine Frontline fighter Boeing F4B-4 piloted by my dad

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/mdegnan/_images/SBD%20Dive%20Bomber.jpg
Douglas SBD Dive Bomber
During WW2 my dad flew SBDs, Wildcats, Hellcats, & Corsairs in the PTO.
Most of the time these aircraft were land based but there was also carrier assignments.

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/mdegnan/_images/F9F%20Panther.jpg
F9F Panther Dad in No.#5 jet.
Later in Korea he flew strike missions in Panthers. He figuers he flew about 200 aircract
types during his 30 career which also included time as a test pilot.

_

SkyChimp
09-01-2006, 11:05 AM
Originally posted by Enforcer572005:
And that's not a Thomas Morse, I cant remebmer the name, but the USAF museum has one like it I believe. I think it was also too late for WW1 like the TMS I think.


I'm no expert. The only thing on the photo is "an obsolete fighter." But I thought it's a 4 bladed Thomas Morse MB-3A. Look here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:THOMAS-MORSE_MB-3_an...ly_Mitchell_USAF.JPG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:THOMAS-MORSE_MB-3_and_Billy_Mitchell_USAF.JPG)





Im curious as to the plane next to Lindberghs, with "nungressor Coli" on it.


That's the plane of Costes and Lebrix, French aviation pioneers. I have some more pics of that plane, and of Costes and Lebrix, also. I really didn't know that much about them until I started looking them up on the internet.

Here's a website:
http://www.wingnet.org/rtw/rtw001g.htm

Curiously, a picture on that website may have my grandfather in it...
http://www.wingnet.org/rtw/pix/r001gp5.jpg
...the man with the tripod camera (but who really knows). I have a photo of Costes and Lebrix from the angle that photo would have been taken, in that plane, in Panama. And the man taking the picture is wearing a uniform like my grandfather's.


Here are my photos of the aviators and my grandad (cool pinky rign that I just noticed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif):
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/costaslebrix.jpg

BiscuitKnight
09-01-2006, 11:11 AM
Really great stuff - the guys are right, historical gold. Even if you're not interested in selling them - especially if you're not, I'm sure there's a historian or museum that would benefit from copies.

SkyChimp
09-01-2006, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by SkyChimp:
Curiously, a picture on that website may have my grandfather in it...
http://www.wingnet.org/rtw/pix/r001gp5.jpg
...the man with the tripod camera (but who really knows). I have a photo of Costes and Lebrix from the angle that photo would have been taken, in that plane, in Panama. And the man taking the picture is wearing a uniform like my grandfather's.


I don't think so now that I've studied it. The picture of Costas and Lebrix I posted shows them wearing different clothes than they seem to be wearing in the photo on that website. though that may be my grandad in the picture.

SkyChimp
09-01-2006, 11:17 AM
Originally posted by LEBillfish:
Awesome stuff!!...... So did one of your other relatives get all the pron? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Seriously though as to copyright, it will be tough.....You'll need to use an EXIF editor to insure the tons of info contained in a digital image is gone, so what you see is what you get.

What you may want to do is see about selling copies to publishers, in that way you'll retain the rights yet they'll be forced to protect them. On the otherhand though, total $ they're worth "digitally" is probably so marginal who would care?....On the same token, being they're a family heirloom, I cannot even imagine selling such treasures, only in the originals is there any money to be had, that money not worth the personal aspect of them.

Things like this are a tough call....In the end it often boiling down keeping it all to yourself, or sharing it with the world knowing you have the originals to back up your claim.....Also, don't expect to get rich from a digital product.

Either way, thanks for sharing what you have and hope to see more http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I'd never sell them. Though I might let people use them for serious purposes. I was asked by a historian a year or so ago about using some of my Lindbergh photos, but he wanted them for free with no restrictions. I wasn't even going to charge him, but I did want credit. That was apparently too much to ask. So I passed on his request.

SkyChimp
09-01-2006, 11:19 AM
Originally posted by 609IAP_Kahuna:
Excellent photos Chimp !

Thanks so much for posting them. My dad went thru the Pananma Canal on the Sara during the mid to late 1930's. He was flying Boeing F4B-4's at the time which was the Navy & Marine Corps frontline fighter. While in Panama the pilots enjoyed shore leave with some fine cigars, tasty beer and latin nightlife. My dad past away last year and I am hoping to recieve a box of about 500+ photos spanning a 30year carreer in USMC aviation. I was in the process of inventoring this collection and found pics of USN/USMC Admirals (Nimits), Generals, well known fighter aces and Corps legend Chesty Puller.

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/mdegnan/_images/Boeing%20FB-4.jpg
Navy/Marine Frontline fighter Boeing F4B-4 piloted by my dad

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/mdegnan/_images/SBD%20Dive%20Bomber.jpg
Douglas SBD Dive Bomber
During WW2 my dad flew SBDs, Wildcats, Hellcats, & Corsairs in the PTO.
Most of the time these aircraft were land based but there was also carrier assignments.

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/mdegnan/_images/F9F%20Panther.jpg
F9F Panther Dad in No.#5 jet.
Later in Korea he flew strike missions in Panthers. He figuers he flew about 200 aircract
types during his 30 career which also included time as a test pilot.

_

Those are fantactic. Ii'd love to see more.

Ruy Horta
09-01-2006, 01:36 PM
Originally posted by SkyChimp:
I'm no expert. The only thing on the photo is "an obsolete fighter." But I thought it's a 4 bladed Thomas Morse MB-3A. Look here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:THOMAS-MORSE_MB-3_an...ly_Mitchell_USAF.JPG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:THOMAS-MORSE_MB-3_and_Billy_Mitchell_USAF.JPG)

You are absolutly right, there is no doubt about that a/c being an MB-3A, all elements are there to ID the type.

Cowling, struts, side radiators. Only the four bladed prop seems to be non-standard.

Thanks Kahuna for the F4B photo, another favorite of mine!!

hotspace
09-01-2006, 06:42 PM
Those are brilliant photo's fella's http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

You both must be so proud to have such a great family history?

Love to see more if you've got 'em http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

BillyTheKid_22
09-01-2006, 07:11 PM
LOL!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Enforcer572005
09-01-2006, 10:20 PM
I stand correcte chimp http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif. I was thinking of the TM Scout I guess. I think they do have on of these types in the usaf museum.

That very well could be your grandfather; how many marine photographers would be out there? The view camera on a tripod is interesting.

And Kahuna, I would love to see more of your dad's photos. Man, what a career! I hope you have access to his logbooks. You could probalby write a good book on that. I hope you guys can figure a way to post alot more of those so we can see them somewhere. I just go all to willies when I see stuff like that, because it's not been published elsewhere. Such treasure in private collections that needs to be seen. Thanx for posting those. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

woofiedog
09-02-2006, 06:10 AM
SkyChimp... Incredible photo's, you have given us a Very Rare Glimpse into the aviation of year's gone by and the aircraft and people of these times.

What a line up of aircraft... I wonder how many of these aircraft even have a single orginal left in a museum some where.

Thank's for sharing.

badaboom.1
09-02-2006, 05:12 PM
Priceless......absoulutely priceless.....another great post Monkey boy!!!!

leitmotiv
09-02-2006, 05:23 PM
Great USMC material, Kahuna---what a career---from 1930s Boeing F4Bs to jets. More please!

SkyChimp
09-02-2006, 08:03 PM
Originally posted by Ruy Horta:

The a/c in the forefront look like Boeing PW-9s.

Very nice material. Really love these Interbellum a/c, thanks!

Agreed. When I see a US 1920's biplane fighter, the first thing I think is 'Curtiss.' Definately a PW-9, though. Thanks.

jensenpark
09-03-2006, 11:58 AM
Bump for the 'Chimp!

More please (and how long have you been sitting on these...depriving your fellow forum members the chance to view them?) http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Thanks for sharing.