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View Full Version : of what material were made the parashoots?



raaaid
05-25-2007, 04:56 AM
i heard they were made of silk

but im suspicious they were made of hemp and this is hidden

because its the strongest natural fiber, it was used to make the paper of the constitution of the states, the first levis, uniforms, flags, the first ford car including oil tyres and fuel

DanoClark
05-25-2007, 04:57 AM
Silk, my Grandfather had his made into a wedding dress for my Grandmother.

raaaid
05-25-2007, 05:02 AM
beatifull story but hey maybe after all your grandma wore a hemp beatifull suit

anyway im not as paranoid as you may think i just read the parachute that saved bush lifes in wwii was made of hemp

what an ungratefull *******, natural product saves his life and then he turns into petrochemics which is the material of nowadays parachutes and everithing

they sell us which we dont need and harm us

MEGILE
05-25-2007, 05:23 AM
I heard the moon was made out of cheese.

SUPERAEREO
05-25-2007, 05:27 AM
They were made of silk, much lighter than hemp

luftluuver
05-25-2007, 05:40 AM
What is a parashoot? Sorry, couldn't resist.

Noz4r2_646
05-25-2007, 06:48 AM
Parachutes were once made from silk but now they are almost always constructed from more durable woven nylon fabric, sometimes coated with silicone to improve performance and consistency over time. Originally silk was used for parachute suspension lines, but was replaced by nylon during World War II. When square (also called ram-air) parachutes were introduced, manufacturers switched to low-stretch materials like Dacron or zero-stretch materials like Spectra, Kevlar, Vectran and high-modulus aramids. Kevlar is rarely seen except on reserve canopies.

Ratsack
05-25-2007, 06:53 AM
Definitely not hemp in the canopy. If you've ever handled hemp fabric, it's quite heavy, and very coarse until it's been washed a lot. It's really not the sort of stuff you'd want in an application where the fabric is meant be light, and it's meant to slide over itself when the chute opens.

However, there'd be nothing to stop them using hemp fibre in the harness and stuff, would there?

cheers,
Ratsack

raaaid
05-25-2007, 06:54 AM
right that was what i found out cannopy silk, cording hemp

notice the change now its all petrochemics

Whirlin_merlin
05-25-2007, 07:11 AM
As wel as being an internet forum stirrer I'm a keen climber.
I've handled old hemp ropes and I'm glad they have been replaced by nylon.
Hemp ropes were heavier and more likely to break than nylon, of course nylon has some diadvantages e.g low melting point but overall itis much better to trust your life to.
Hemp is a very versitile material but in many applications synthetics have superior performance.
EDIT: but of course not all aplications.

joeap
05-25-2007, 07:15 AM
Actually raaaid is right in that hemp was used for a lot of things, no not parachute canopies. Yes the harness and lots of other stuff. I also agree about too much plastic for stuff.



Is there something wrong with me? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

luftluuver
05-25-2007, 08:40 AM
Originally posted by Whirlin_merlin:
As wel as being an internet forum stirrer I'm a keen climber.
I've handled old hemp ropes and I'm glad they have been replaced by nylon.
Hemp ropes were heavier and more likely to break than nylon, of course nylon has some diadvantages e.g low melting point but overall itis much better to trust your life to.
Hemp is a very versitile material but in many applications synthetics have superior performance.
EDIT: but of course not all aplications.
Hemp (from Old English hænep, see cannabis (etymology)) is the common name for plants belonging to the genus Cannabis, although the term is often used to refer only to Cannabis strains cultivated for industrial (non-drug) use. Licenses for hemp cultivation are issued in the European Union and Canada. In the United Kingdom, these licenses are issued by the Home Office under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971. When grown for non-drug purposes hemp is often called industrial hemp, and a common product is fiber for use in a wide variety of products. Feral hemp or ditch weed is usually naturalized fiber or oilseed strains of Cannabis that have escaped from cultivation and are self-seeding.

XyZspineZyX
05-25-2007, 09:54 AM
Hemp was an exceeedingly common cording and rope in the USA in the '40s.

George Loving (ace and future General) recalls in his book how he was offered hemp by a local during the war. His intitial reaction was "why do I want some rope?"

Even the streotypical Kansas farmboy could tell the diference between hemp and silk when he was packing his own parachute

I'm always fascinated by the attempts to defend hemp before an argument against it was ever voiced


We all get it: hemp is more than the Hippie Lettuce. We've all known it for years. No reason to be suspicious of parachutes. The Silk lobby wasn't exactly conducting a worldwide conspiracy to discredit rope makers back then http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

BSS_Goat
05-25-2007, 10:03 AM
I fookin new it! I just new it! I told ya'll he was high all the time. I mean,d@mn you can't think of this stuff with out hitting the old peace pipe. Now he's trying to justify it.. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

raaaid
05-25-2007, 10:23 AM
my point is that hemp menaced petrochemicals supremaccy so a campaign was launch to ban it succesfully

ford intended to motorize the world with cars made out fully of hemp including tyres fuel and oil and a corpse 20 times more impact absorbant than nowadays

dupont thought it would be better to sell us something useless and harming as petrol

they succeded look i say what about substituting petrol for hemp and...

AKA_TAGERT
05-25-2007, 10:35 AM
Is that a black helo behind you?

AVG_WarHawk
05-25-2007, 10:42 AM
Originally posted by raaaid:
my point is that hemp menaced petrochemicals supremaccy so a campaign was launch to ban it succesfully

ford intended to motorize the world with cars made out fully of hemp including tyres fuel and oil and a corpse 20 times more impact absorbant than nowadays

dupont thought it would be better to sell us something useless and harming as petrol

they succeded look i say what about substituting petrol for hemp and...

ah yes, the conspiracy theory http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

XyZspineZyX
05-25-2007, 10:48 AM
I've heard that argument many times, raaaid

However, synthetics actually DO outperform hemp rope

When you are using slings to move loads in the range of dozens or hundreds of tons, you need to trust the equipment. The synthetics are not only specifically engineered to certain values, their working life is known, and tracked, from manufacturing date to destroy date

If hemps could compete on some level field with the synthetics, then maybe there's some shady business. But they really just don't. Hemp rope is possible and natural and suitable for some things

That doesn't mean it's the ideal material for all ropes. All textiles are not created equally.

Stew278
05-25-2007, 10:52 AM
Originally posted by raaaid:
my point is that hemp menaced petrochemicals supremaccy so a campaign was launch to ban it succesfully



So if they were determined to replace natural fibers with petro-based synthetics how come cotton and silk clothes have not been largely replaced by polyester and nylon too?

AVG_WarHawk
05-25-2007, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by Stew278:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by raaaid:
my point is that hemp menaced petrochemicals supremaccy so a campaign was launch to ban it succesfully



So if they were determined to replace natural fibers with petro-based synthetics how come cotton and silk clothes have not been largely replaced by polyester and nylon too? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There was an attempt in the 70's, fortunately it failed.

djetz
05-25-2007, 11:05 AM
raaaid... stay the heck away from hemp products, please. Especially if they're smouldering.

WhtBoy
05-25-2007, 11:10 AM
raaaid, please explain and compare the total cost of production of the hemp and synthetic products you are talking about. This should include things like raw materials (and a similar complete breakdown on them), all facilities involved in the process from raw materials to final production (and a similar complete breakdown on them), shipping to/from the facilities (only if they are seperate of course and this should include all intermediate facilities), labor costs, availability of labor, skill of labor required, reliability of all production facilities from raw materials to finished product (note that weather and other crop factors like disease and insect damage will factor into hemp for this one), and any other possible factor that can influence the production of the final product. I'll leave the product choice up to you.

That's all you need to do to show that hemp is cheaper, more reliable, and more functional than the synthetics that are currently used.

--Outlaw.

Stew278
05-25-2007, 11:18 AM
Originally posted by WhtBoy:
raaaid, please explain and compare the total cost of production of the hemp and synthetic products you are talking about. This should include things like raw materials (and a similar complete breakdown on them), all facilities involved in the process from raw materials to final production (and a similar complete breakdown on them), shipping to/from the facilities (only if they are seperate of course and this should include all intermediate facilities), labor costs, availability of labor, skill of labor required, reliability of all production facilities from raw materials to finished product (note that weather and other crop factors like disease and insect damage will factor into hemp for this one), and any other possible factor that can influence the production of the final product. I'll leave the product choice up to you.

That's all you need to do to show that hemp is cheaper, more reliable, and more functional than the synthetics that are currently used.

--Outlaw.

Oh ****, you mean we have to bring facts and figures into this argument? Alright, who's got the charts?

Zeus-cat
05-25-2007, 03:51 PM
raaaid, please explain and compare the total cost of production of the hemp and synthetic products you are talking about. This should include things like raw materials (and a similar complete breakdown on them), all facilities involved in the process from raw materials to final production (and a similar complete breakdown on them), shipping to/from the facilities (only if they are seperate of course and this should include all intermediate facilities), labor costs, availability of labor, skill of labor required, reliability of all production facilities from raw materials to finished product (note that weather and other crop factors like disease and insect damage will factor into hemp for this one), and any other possible factor that can influence the production of the final product. I'll leave the product choice up to you.

That's all you need to do to show that hemp is cheaper, more reliable, and more functional than the synthetics that are currently used.

No! No! No! Facts are not allowed in a raaaid post. You must be a newbie. Stick to wild conjecture and conspiracy theories thank you very much.

AFSG_Bulldog
05-25-2007, 08:13 PM
raaaaaid... you must be smoking hemp. The U.S. Constitution was written on parchment. Which is treated animal skin.

raaaid
05-26-2007, 03:32 AM
"Both the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution of the United States were drafted on hempen paper" from here:

http://kucinich.us/issues/hemp.php

lets just cut all trees to clean our boats and ruin the planet in less that a hundred years

major_setback
05-26-2007, 03:46 AM
link (http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/ncnu02/v5-284.html)


"C-class Mercedes-Benz automobiles have more than 30 parts made of natural fibers, including hemp."

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/ncnu02/images/hemp18.jpg

"Henry Ford swinging an axe at his 1941 car to demonstrate the toughness of the plastic trunk door made of soybean and hemp."

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/ncnu02/images/hemp19.jpg

"Hemp oil"

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/ncnu02/images/hemp36.jpg

Lodovik
05-26-2007, 04:36 AM
raaaid, I think you should read the comic series The Invisibles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Invisibles) by Grant Morrison.
It's a great read and you'll probably find more meaning in it than the rest of us, domesticated primates as we be http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

AFSG_Bulldog
05-27-2007, 02:11 PM
Originally posted by raaaid:
"Both the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution of the United States were drafted on hempen paper" from here:

http://kucinich.us/issues/hemp.php


Raaaaaid... You really need to start wearing your tinfoil hat again. And lay off the dope. Try going to a website that is not marijuana slanted and you might get a different opinion.

Like..U. S. Constitution Net (http://www.usconstitution.net/constfaq_a8.html)


Urban legend is that the Constitution, Declaration of Independence, and Bill of Rights were written on hemp paper, hemp being the industrial name for the fiber of the marijuana plant. For some reason, this "fact" is touted by those who seek to legalize marijuana for recreational use. First, it is not clear why the use of hemp as a fiber should mean it should be legalized for recreational use. Second, the "fact" is not a fact.

The Declaration, the Constitution, and the Bill of Rights are currently housed in the National Archives. All three are written on parchment, not hemp paper. Parchment is treated animal skin, typically sheepskin. The Declaration was inked with iron gall ink. The Jet Propulsion Laboratory was commissioned to create a system to monitor the physical status of all three. The Charters of Freedom Monitoring System took digital photos of each sheet of parchment in 1987, each document divided into one-inch squares. Over time, the photos are retaken and compared to the original to look for signs of deterioration. Before the charters were recently reencased for display, a small tear in the Declaration was repaired by adding Japanese paper to the gap. This is the only paper in any of the documents.

WhtBoy
05-27-2007, 03:23 PM
Originally posted by AFSG_Bulldog:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by raaaid:
"Both the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution of the United States were drafted on hempen paper" from here:

http://kucinich.us/issues/hemp.php


Raaaaaid... You really need to start wearing your tinfoil hat again. And lay off the dope. Try going to a website that is not marijuana slanted and you might get a different opinion.

Like..U. S. Constitution Net (http://www.usconstitution.net/constfaq_a8.html)
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Anything raaaid reads, no matter where/what it is, that supports what he believes is the absolute truth and everything else is wrong. When he is pressed to the point where he can't possibly support his position, he chickens out and stops posting to the thread. He will then wait a while and repost the same thing. Typical raaaid.

--Outlaw.

BfHeFwMe
05-27-2007, 07:25 PM
Got any good hemp brownie recipe's?

http://blogs.tampabay.com/photos/uncategorized/flash_cheechchong.jpg

raaaid
05-28-2007, 05:44 AM
this is interesting because obviously somebody is lying lets use logic then:

it makes no much sense to use leather to write in unless you live in the medievo where they want you to think the earth is flat, guttemberg made senseless writing on leather

for a thousand pages you would neep up to a hundred cows

hemp was used to make oil, sails, paper, flags uniforms, ropes at the time the constitution was made

this makes me think its your source which is lying

i may end soon wearing a tinfoil hat but probably youll end up sooner needing a soul:

http://www.wasted-opportunities.com/project.php

While millions of impoverished people die of starvation and sickness every year in Africa, the cultivation of Hemp, one of the most nutritional and useful plants known to humanity, is banned by law throughout most of the continent

yeah this web seems made by a bunch of stoners after all we know that the fact that a dark skinned person dies from starvation every 4 seconds is an urban legend

luftluuver
05-28-2007, 06:03 AM
This thread needs Josf's participation.

Pirschjaeger
05-28-2007, 08:34 AM
of what material were made the parashoots?

Starstuff. I have proofs. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

AFSG_Bulldog
05-28-2007, 09:48 AM
Originally posted by raaaid:
this is interesting because obviously somebody is lying lets use logic then:

Your rantings defy logic.


it makes no much sense to use leather to write in unless you live in the medievo where they want you to think the earth is flat, guttemberg made senseless writing on leather

for a thousand pages you would neep up to a hundred cows

First off these documents were not drafted last week. The Declaration of Independence was written in 1776 and the Constitution in 1787. They used a lot of parchment back then.

But, to use your logic, how many animals each day do you think go to slaughter just so you can have your hamburger or what ever it is you eat in your country?

Besides important documents and books were always written on parchment and vellum (another leather product) for their durability, not because there wasn't anything else around.


hemp was used to make oil, sails, paper, flags uniforms, ropes at the time the constitution was made

So was flax. And it still is. In fact flax will do everything hemp will do and it is universally accepted as a viable crop.


this makes me think its your source which is lying

This makes me think you have no argument. Calling someone else's resource a lie shows a lack of intelligence on your part. Like when one kid says to another "Oh yea..So's yours".


i may end soon wearing a tinfoil hat but probably youll end up sooner needing a soul:

When you come down from your high, you will need to explain that one to me. Because it is undefinable.


While millions of impoverished people die of starvation and sickness every year in Africa, the cultivation of Hemp, one of the most nutritional and useful plants known to humanity, is banned by law throughout most of the continent

Then they should grow flax, as it does everything hemp does except you can't smoke it, or make brownies with it.


yeah this web seems made by a bunch of stoners after all we know that the fact that a dark skinned person dies from starvation every 4 seconds is an urban legend

Perhaps you should volunteer for one of the many charitable organizations who go to the third world and teach the people how to grow crops to feed themselves. I am sure you will be able to do far more for these people in person than than you can on the web.

raaaid
05-28-2007, 09:52 AM
i didnt realize i shouldnt argue with someone who likes to be called bulldog

so now my point was clear water made i wont waste my time with somebody so nice and with such good intentions towards me

as not seeing your phony face your intend to me is crystal water

DooDaH2007
05-28-2007, 10:02 AM
The woman in my country were asked to surrender their silk stockings to make parachutes...

LStarosta
05-28-2007, 10:02 AM
If everyone else is such a phony, let's see some photos of you then. Show your mug so we can see the face of genius who can't even spell "parachute" or use proper grammar.

AFSG_Bulldog
05-28-2007, 10:06 AM
Originally posted by raaaid:
i didnt realize i shouldnt argue with someone who likes to be called bulldog

so now my point was clear water made i wont waste my time with somebody so nice and with such good intentions towards me

as not seeing your phony face your intend to me is crystal water

Then come on Hyperlobby some night, join one of our Co-ops and shoot me down.

Philipscdrw
05-28-2007, 10:58 AM
petrochemics I like this word, I think I'll keep a copy of it.
Originally posted by raaaid:
ford intended to motorize the world with cars made out fully of hemp including tyres fuel and oil and a corpse 20 times more impact absorbant than nowadays

Those were the days, when cars came with an impact-absorbing hemp corpse as standard. You just don't get that nowadays.

raaaid
05-28-2007, 01:07 PM
heres my picture:

http://www.paulscheer.com/uploaded_images/Picture%207%20Urkel-778919.jpg

Zeus-cat
05-28-2007, 01:19 PM
You look better and more intelligent than I expected. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

WhtBoy
05-28-2007, 01:25 PM
Originally posted by raaaid:
i didnt realize i shouldnt argue with someone who likes to be called bulldog

so now my point was clear water made i wont waste my time with somebody so nice and with such good intentions towards me

as not seeing your phony face your intend to me is crystal water

See what I mean. Instead of responding to BD's points about flax and the use of parchment/vellum, he just rants on about how he is the winner.

So raaaid, what do you think about the use of flax instead of hemp?

--Outlaw.

raaaid
05-28-2007, 01:38 PM
hell i dont even know what flax is

my point is clear ford intended automotion grown out of earth instead dupont view on petrochemicals imposed

should i argue on material of a single book change that hemp paper is better and more echological, if my comicbooks were made on hemp they wouldnt turn yellow with time

WhtBoy
05-28-2007, 02:21 PM
Originally posted by raaaid:
hell i dont even know what flax is

So instead of doing a little research, you simply discount it and claim that, once again, hemp is better than anything else and you are right and everyone else is wrong.


Originally posted by raaaid:
my point is clear ford intended automotion grown out of earth instead dupont view on petrochemicals imposed

The project was dropped becasue it was not cost effective. Any idiot with half a brain and an internet connection can find that out. Regardless of that fact, the aforementioned half-brained idiot would also notice that the hemp in his test car REPLACED STEEL, NOT PLASTIC.



Originally posted by raaaid:
should i argue on material of a single book change that hemp paper is better and more echological, if my comicbooks were made on hemp they wouldnt turn yellow with time

The chemicals used in the production of paper are what causes it to yellow. I bet that hemp would require a similar process to be mass produced. Acid-free wood pulp paper does not yellow with age.

--Outlaw.

Aaron_GT
05-28-2007, 02:58 PM
Acid-free wood pulp paper does not yellow with age.

There's a market for such paper for long-term storage of important documents that might need to be preserved for hundreds of years.

Back to the original question - some parachutes were made of nylon (hence nylon stockings being in short supply), but most were silk (hence a shortage of silk stockings too!). Stays were sometimes of nylon, or natural fibres.

Aaron_GT
05-28-2007, 02:59 PM
So if they were determined to replace natural fibers with petro-based synthetics how come cotton and silk clothes have not been largely replaced by polyester and nylon too?


There was an attempt in the 70's, fortunately it failed.

Nylon underwear was a particularly cruel joke foisted on us in the 1970s.

WhtBoy
05-28-2007, 06:16 PM
IIRC, Germany produced plastic bodied cars powered by small 2 cycle engines by the thousands after WW-II. The panels were made of compressed cotton and the many, many thousands of tons of resin left over from the war effort. I believe the resin was petroleum based but I can't say that for sure. I'd also bet that the resin used by good old H. Ford and his wacky tobacky panels was also petroleum based.

Once again, I can't say for sure but I'd bet that once the resin ran out, it was not economically feasible to use it anymore so they went back to steel.

--Outlaw.

Stew278
05-28-2007, 11:43 PM
Originally posted by WhtBoy:
IIRC, Germany produced plastic bodied cars powered by small 2 cycle engines by the thousands after WW-II. The panels were made of compressed cotton and the many, many thousands of tons of resin left over from the war effort. I believe the resin was petroleum based but I can't say that for sure. I'd also bet that the resin used by good old H. Ford and his wacky tobacky panels was also petroleum based.

Once again, I can't say for sure but I'd bet that once the resin ran out, it was not economically feasible to use it anymore so they went back to steel.

--Outlaw.

Might have been the same sort of resin that is used for fiberglass. In that case it is usually polyester crosslinked with polystyrene. Cotton or other plant fibers would make for a cheaper composite, but the mechanical properties probably wouldn't be as good as when using glass fibers. Either way, in such a composite there are many other plant fibers that could be used other than hemp that would work just as well.

Pirschjaeger
05-29-2007, 04:11 AM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
If everyone else is such a phony, let's see some photos of you then. Show your mug so we can see the face of genius who can't even spell "parachute" or use proper grammar.

He's an ESL (English second language) speaker.

How many languages do you speak LStar?

raaaid
05-29-2007, 04:56 AM
the rulers of this world are even more evil than i thought, they are willing to wear nylon underwear for more money

FluffyDucks2
05-29-2007, 05:03 AM
Originally posted by raaaid:
the rulers of this world are even more evil than i thought, they are willing to wear nylon underwear for more money


This statement is a CLASSIC http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Chris0382
05-29-2007, 05:07 AM
We used to make em outta bed sheets.

FluffyDucks2
05-29-2007, 05:08 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/touche.gif

Pirschjaeger
05-29-2007, 06:33 AM
Originally posted by raaaid:
the rulers of this world are even more evil than i thought, they are willing to wear nylon underwear for more money

Are you saying a more ethical Maggie Thatcher wouldn't have worn underwear? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

raaaid
05-29-2007, 06:39 AM
Are you saying a more ethical Maggie Thatcher wouldn't have worn underwear?
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif