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GAU_8
12-18-2003, 04:49 PM
hey gang,

the video game industry earned DOUBLE than what hollywood did in 2002.thats a big chunk o change for "kid stuff",

"lan party" businesses have been booming everywhere i live. 6 of the best ones here in my city are allready making profit in less than 2 yrs time.after opening ..they are raking it in.

i have been in the process of trying the same, but for flight sims ONLY.sorry ...but i cannot get into too many details. im tired of getting ripped off. i CANNOT say that this will happen..but im slowly progressing.its hard to win over the minds of those that dont believe in this.

anyways, i need answers from the general public.

majority of pilots (private/commercial/military), banks, other financial investors, machinists/fabricators, and "project finders" im dealing with, can really see this as being big... but they are concerned that "you" wont be interested, and they have good reason too..

example. you got il-2, and lo-mac, FS2004 allready installed on your computer, would you really have an interest in going to my business, so you can play there, against 1-36 or more people at once, have cockpits, and league tourneys, or use the scaled down liner decks?

the up side.

everybody is on the same connection, same computer set-up, same everything. not too much of a bottleneck from any specific person/comp.you actually meet your squad. get to sim using cockpits."special guest/combat workshops" (air combat pilots telling how its done, and stories). contests for squad. (commercial/private pilots get more training in a realistic environment...as compard to home, lets be real)

the down side.

it will cost you money, gas, time. you allready got your games on the computer. is it worth it for you to go? "why go there? its 5-10 $ an hour..and i got em on here for free to play"

there are many other aspects i have dealt with, so dont adress them here.

hers the BOTTOM LINE.would any of you go? is it worth it to you? be honest. other conflicts need not be posted.

GAU_8
12-18-2003, 04:49 PM
hey gang,

the video game industry earned DOUBLE than what hollywood did in 2002.thats a big chunk o change for "kid stuff",

"lan party" businesses have been booming everywhere i live. 6 of the best ones here in my city are allready making profit in less than 2 yrs time.after opening ..they are raking it in.

i have been in the process of trying the same, but for flight sims ONLY.sorry ...but i cannot get into too many details. im tired of getting ripped off. i CANNOT say that this will happen..but im slowly progressing.its hard to win over the minds of those that dont believe in this.

anyways, i need answers from the general public.

majority of pilots (private/commercial/military), banks, other financial investors, machinists/fabricators, and "project finders" im dealing with, can really see this as being big... but they are concerned that "you" wont be interested, and they have good reason too..

example. you got il-2, and lo-mac, FS2004 allready installed on your computer, would you really have an interest in going to my business, so you can play there, against 1-36 or more people at once, have cockpits, and league tourneys, or use the scaled down liner decks?

the up side.

everybody is on the same connection, same computer set-up, same everything. not too much of a bottleneck from any specific person/comp.you actually meet your squad. get to sim using cockpits."special guest/combat workshops" (air combat pilots telling how its done, and stories). contests for squad. (commercial/private pilots get more training in a realistic environment...as compard to home, lets be real)

the down side.

it will cost you money, gas, time. you allready got your games on the computer. is it worth it for you to go? "why go there? its 5-10 $ an hour..and i got em on here for free to play"

there are many other aspects i have dealt with, so dont adress them here.

hers the BOTTOM LINE.would any of you go? is it worth it to you? be honest. other conflicts need not be posted.

georgeo76
12-18-2003, 05:07 PM
It's a good idea m8, but I doubt you'll find a big market w/ flight Sim games. You'd prop be better off if you went w/ FPS. Like doom or half-life when they come out. Flight Sim players are older, and by definition more frugal, and are less likely to fork over good money to do what they can for free on HL. However, the 12yr old FPS market are more than happy to part w/ their currency

http://webpages.charter.net/Stick_Fiend/images/alex.jpg
"Oh bliss, bliss and heaven. Oh, it was gorgeousness and gorgeosity made flesh. It was like a bird of rarest spun heaven metal, or like silvery wine flowing in a space ship, gravity all nonsense now. As I slooshied I knew such lovely pictures."
Fiend's Wings (http://webpages.charter.net/Stick_Fiend)

Future-
12-18-2003, 05:26 PM
I'd sure go there! A Forgotten Battles LAN, wow, cool idea!

If I would live somewhere near you, you could count me in!

- Future

Commanding Officer of the 530th Bomb Squad
380th Bomb Group 5th AF USAAF

http://invisionfree.com:54/40/30/upload/p1083.jpg

Visit us at http://members.tripod.com/tophatssquadron , home of the 310th FS and the 380th BG

Bearcat99
12-18-2003, 05:42 PM
Actually there is a place just like that down the street from where I live .....only the cater to the BF1942 crowd... and it is always crowded.

http://www.world-wide-net.com/tuskegeeairmen/ta-1943.jpg
<UL TYPE=SQUARE>vflyer@comcast.net[/list]<UL TYPE=SQUARE>99thPursuit Squadron IL2 Forgotten Battles (http://www.geocities.com/rt_bearcat)[/list]

GAU_8
12-18-2003, 08:12 PM
well thats the catch. it wouldnt be just a "lan house". were looking at incorporating an R/C store and field, clothing, bookstore, and small eatery area. more of a "all things related to flight" .. hopefully that will bring the older crowd in.

mllaneza
12-18-2003, 08:17 PM
There's no chance I'd go, because there no chance you're near San Francisco.

Veteran - Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force. 1993-1951.

mllaneza
12-18-2003, 08:20 PM
Another thought. Georgeo76 is probably right, there aren't enough flight-simmers to be worth it. Your location will probably need to be near both a university, military base AND an aviation museum to have any chance at all. Tucson has two of three, the Bay Area as a whole has all of it, but if you end up way TF down by Moffett I shan't be visiting too often.

Veteran - Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force. 1993-1951.

Tully__
12-18-2003, 08:21 PM
It's a niche market. It might fly (pun intended) in a major city, but don't try it in a smaller one. Tieing in the RC modelling market might make it a goer though.

=================================================

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Salut
Tully

GAU_8
12-18-2003, 11:09 PM
luckily i live in Houston. so there are a number of good reasons to pull it off here.as well as family members nearby

NASA at one edge of houston.

lone star flight museum in galveston (20 to 50 minutes away, in Galveston)

bomber field (r/c hangar, and field) in monaville, TX about 30 minutes away.

continental airlines on other edge of houston (with thousands of pilots living close by)

my brother is a private pilot, and engineer with many contacts to military/commercial/private industries. (with his own self start business of aircraft products)

as well as my sister in-laws grandfather worked /consults with nasa...so more contacts to garner interest, and publicity.

so i have the pull, and i think the right city, but there are so many things that you have to think about. like cockpits for example.. purists want "very real" and average user want "simpler" so there is a fine line on how to incorporate switches, knobs without making the hard core feel left out, but not too intensive for the beginner/novice.

georgeo76
12-18-2003, 11:14 PM
BTW, if there were an IL2 LAN party near me, I'd go. But it would be to meet ppl w/ the same hobby as me more than to play.

http://webpages.charter.net/Stick_Fiend/images/alex.jpg
"Oh bliss, bliss and heaven. Oh, it was gorgeousness and gorgeosity made flesh. It was like a bird of rarest spun heaven metal, or like silvery wine flowing in a space ship, gravity all nonsense now. As I slooshied I knew such lovely pictures."
Fiend's Wings (http://webpages.charter.net/Stick_Fiend)

tenmmike
12-18-2003, 11:54 PM
i might but not at $10 a hr no way......if you want flight sims only i think it would be hard maybe just give the flight simmers a price break and charge "normal" prices for other games.. thers one of those lan shopes down the street from me ..but its all fps...........i would say dont put all your eggs in just flight sims..(even though thats all i play)..what would you charge if your players wanted to fly a coop? 1 mission and your 1 hr is up

http://images.ar15.com/forums/smiles/anim_50cal.gif

LeadSpitter_
12-19-2003, 12:05 AM
to make a best seller you need extreme voilence blood top of the line graphics thats all it comes down too.

http://www.geocities.com/leadspittersig/LS1.txt

xTHRUDx
12-19-2003, 01:11 AM
if it was like this:

http://fantasyofflight.com/fighter.htm

i'd go

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 01:18 AM
i believe we found a happy medium for what the customer is getting. remember the BATTLETECH simulator? that was $7.00 for 15 minutes..and was OVER 10 years ago. so $6-8 dollars is a steal for an hour at todays technology. (imho)

carguy_
12-19-2003, 01:23 AM
You won`t create a big buisness with flight sims.There are just not enough of us.

But if you ask if I`d go,sure!It`d be a blast!

http://carguy.w.interia.pl/tracki/sig23d.jpg

oFZo
12-19-2003, 01:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by georgeo76:
BTW, if there were an IL2 LAN party near me, I'd go. But it would be to meet ppl w/ the same hobby as me more than to play.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ditto!

-oFZo

Founding member and Offical Keeper of The Herbs of the Eurotrolls.

Fehler
12-19-2003, 01:53 AM
Houston, huh? I go to the Galveston area about once a year or so. A place like that would definately be a stopping point for me! Once you have got your inventory set up, shoot us a URL so we (I) can see what you are selling down there. I also think it would be a great place to meet people with similar interests, learn a thing or two, and just relax with some of the chuckleheads that we might see on occassion in HL. Then again, the head to head on LAN when you can get out of your cockpit and thump the guy sitting next to you would be quite appealing as well. (I bet there wouldnt be much trash talking like on some HL servers.. LOL)

http://webpages.charter.net/cuda70/Fehlersig.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/cuda70/9JG54.html

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 01:54 AM
yes, to a point like "flight of fantasy"....but no life size aircraft. more focus on playing, but without it feeling like a game room from the 80's, nor empty like a restoration hangar. this would be a place where people can drink(at appropriate area of course).a chance to get out, meet new people with similar interests, maybe even re-acquiant...and for some, a place to remember.... most areas would be a mix of all things related to flight. except in sim areas, those would be specific, like WWII, modern jet, but everywhere else would be flight general with models, r/c, nose art, paintings,pics, suits/uniforms,

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 02:16 AM
"roughly" what i wanted.... but some of it might change... or most of it.

restaraunt...possibly set in 40s with period music., more for the family, or if not 40s era, lots of aviation decor

"ole timers" type bar, get crusty with good friends.

clothing, aviation related stuff, surplus, and designer.

book/film shop

R/C shop, field, possibly an indoor hangar, for minis/indoor R/C

3 sim areas

WWII: 32 seats

MODERN: 32 seats

PRIVATE props, up to 5 "close to real"

COMMERCIAL flight decks. "glass" type ..unsure of percentage related to actual size, and and equipment....theswe would not be allowed to "joe public"

small stage/auditoreum basic area for workshops, attack combat procedures, navigation, general flight (real or sim), special guests. taunt the other team after winning the "cup" for the year

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 02:18 AM
its 3:15 am for me..please excuse any incorrect spelling http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif lol

TX-Zen
12-19-2003, 10:01 AM
S~ GAU,

First off good luck to you on your business idea. I hope you can pull it off and make a profit doing something interesting.

Personally I would not be inclined to go to a place like that, simply because I more comfortable at home. I can play in my underwear if I like and not even my beloved Punjabi princess can stop me http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

To me the question is a little bigger than whether you already have the games installed, its more about how you can present the business so that it does appeal to those who already have them or appeals to an entirely different crowd altogether.
If you work it right, you can appeal to those who do not have good connections at home, or those who prefer a more social atmosphere or ones that enjoy playing a variety of games but don't want to spend the money on each title.

With some of the things you mentioned as enhancers for your place, I think you ought to be able to kick some behind once get you rolling with a steady client base. I absolutely think you should go for it, better to take a chance on something you believe in rather than not risk anything.


Good luck my old friend, I wish you the best sir.

S!!

TX-Zen
Black 6
TX-Squadron CO
http://www.txsquadron.com
clyndes@hotmail.com (IM Only)
http://www.txsquadron.com/library/20031218144359_Zensig2.jpg

TX-Zen
12-19-2003, 10:04 AM
PS

Seeing as how I live in Houston also (Westside over by the beltway) I'd be interested in helping you with the project, at least on an idea basis. I'd like to see you succeed and if I can help at all, let me know.

Z

Dexmeister
12-19-2003, 10:35 AM
I fly FB and FS2004 on a Matrox Parhelia video card with 3 monitors. I also sometimes use a projector.

If you could offer unique hardware configs such as these, you may attract more people and perhaps be able to charge more for it. For example, imagine a room with 3 projector screens (left, centre, right), that someone could use (with trackIR), and fight against buddies playing on the lan in another room.

If you want to sell other products, scale model airplanes may be good, as would be books and other aviation related things.

I think it's a feasible business, but you'd have to have FPS available to get simmers to bring their friends in.

http://www.asic.ca/images/simevol.jpg

SmokeJaguar
12-19-2003, 10:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GAU_8:
hers the BOTTOM LINE.would any of you go? is it worth it to you? be honest. other conflicts need not be posted.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I for one would not go. Not for monetary reasons but just because I have everything I could want in the comfort of my own home and in the privacy of my computer room (my wife calls it a study) http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Good luck with your venture, it sounds just like my kind of job http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.km011a0004.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/siggy.jpg
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Lights?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Server crashed again!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Weather_Man
12-19-2003, 11:03 AM
My first impression is, you're going to lose your arse. You've got a huge overhead in startup costs with that many things going on at once. Gonna be hard to recoup that while keeping your prices down. Try to keep it simple. Forget the restaurant--maybe a bar with snacks.

Oh, and personally, I don't go out to play games. Seems like a waste of money to me. I think you'd need a younger crowd--which means some shooter games.

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 01:29 PM
thanks for the input guys.

the honesty doesnt hurt. thats why i brought it here. you cant see if something is ood if you dont bring it up to pique interests

its been an idea comming shape for a few years now, but it still is a large, and ambitious project. most of the concepts are ready to go. but the banks are agreeing with some of you and dont want to part with thier (other peoples money) http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif
which really sux, because several of the bankers i know fly as well, and actually love the concept.

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 01:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dexmeister:
I fly FB and FS2004 on a Matrox Parhelia video card with 3 monitors. I also sometimes use a projector.

If you could offer unique hardware configs such as these, you may attract more people and perhaps be able to charge more for it. For example, imagine a room with 3 projector screens (left, centre, right), that someone could use (with trackIR), and fight against buddies playing on the lan in another room.

If you want to sell other products, scale model airplanes may be good, as would be books and other aviation related things.

I think it's a feasible business, but you'd have to have FPS available to get simmers to bring their friends in.

http://www.asic.ca/images/simevol.jpg
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



the very first idea i had was exactly that. actually the only reason its not built is due to the high cost..but plans, safety,schematics,wiring, ....3 axis movemnt has ALL been worked out..... its the COST of each unit thats stopping me. several hundred thousand bucks for each sphere..... and i wanted 32....lol...yep, have to say "out of my league"

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 01:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TX-Zen:
PS

Seeing as how I live in Houston also (Westside over by the beltway) I'd be interested in helping you with the project, at least on an idea basis. I'd like to see you succeed and if I can help at all, let me know.

Z<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

thx ZEN. i can always use help. sorry i havent been in touch with you and TX lately. glad to have your support. im in GUNS-POINT (greenspoint) at beltway 8 and 45. well right on the edge of it...safer.., go deeper..and yeah its 5th ward-ish lol

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 02:27 PM
hope i didnt just double post...

anyways. many of you have thought of the "gyroscope cockpit" its a good idea, but there are limitations that you have to work around.

remember 2 things

an AIRCRAFT, has all movement entending from center of aircraft (axis wise) pitch is always pitch, roll is always roll, and yaw is always yaw. no matter where you are looking, those axis can be applied.

a GYROSCOPE... has 3 axis movement...but each axis is supplied to the point of placement of the preceding axis... so therefore, an outer ring in such a placement, dictates to a point where the movement of other axi (?) can go.

example..grab a gyro from toys-r-us.

label each ring a seperate axis.

now with your hotas right next to you go thru pitch roll yaw procedures. have someone act out each phase of what your doing on the gyroscope.

pull strait up.....(watch the video screen)

roll 90 degrees over. watch screen and gyro

now keep pitching till inverted. the screen will show you as upside down.. but the gyroscope wont let it.. thats because its confined to another point on the axis.

hope you follow.

not that its a problem (worked it out), but just informing those that thought "use a gyroscope"

GAU_8
12-19-2003, 02:31 PM
by the way, if needed can reach me at:

SIMSPHERE@AOL.COM