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View Full Version : Me 262 now appearing on some servers



HayateAce
11-18-2005, 02:17 PM
On the Russian server Streamarena I notice they now have a map that includes the Me262. Now these folks have got it right. The base is many, many kilos from the front-line action. So, you take off with 100% fuel and head off looking for trouble.

On my first sortie I downed 2 La7s out of their furballs and RTB'ed. Nice gunz this Schwalbe.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

http://www.thirdreich.net/ME262_wow_color2.jpg

MEGILE
11-18-2005, 02:19 PM
Me262 causes lag.

Daiichidoku
11-18-2005, 02:21 PM
Originally posted by Megile:
Me262 causes lag.

BS

plz explain just how and why

HayateAce
11-18-2005, 02:49 PM
Originally posted by Megile:
Me262 causes lag.

Megile causes lagg.


http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/351.gif

danjama
11-18-2005, 02:54 PM
its just not fair game to put 262s on servers. Their too Uber compared to prop planes it just ruins the game. Period. I notice 3334th have them too, no surprise there http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Gibbage1
11-18-2005, 03:11 PM
It would be fair if they included a P-80 in the list. And dont give me that historical BS cop-out. Respawning after death is NOT historical. Any German pilot having the option to fly a Me-262 is NOT historical. Having a Me-262 dogfighting with fighters is NOT historical. DF servers are always as far as possible from historical.

xTHRUDx
11-18-2005, 03:17 PM
a pair of 47's will eat up 262's

faustnik
11-18-2005, 03:17 PM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
Having a Me-262 dogfighting with fighters is NOT historical.

Not true. (I pretty much agree with the rest for DFs though.)

Badsight.
11-18-2005, 04:02 PM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
It would be fair if they included a P-80 in the list. And dont give me that historical BS cop-out. Respawning after death is NOT historical. Any German pilot having the option to fly a Me-262 is NOT historical. Having a Me-262 dogfighting with fighters is NOT historical. DF servers are always as far as possible from historical. whaa whaa whaa

you dont need to have a P-80 included just because the other side has a 262

but yea your right , DF rooms have zero to do with history or replicating history

Badsight.
11-18-2005, 04:05 PM
Originally posted by HayateAce:
On my first sortie I downed 2 La7s out of their furballs and RTB'ed. Nice gunz this Schwalbe. just 2 kills ?

262 has given me my best equal sortie on limited ammo/fuel

Bremspropeller
11-18-2005, 04:07 PM
So you finally found out that our beloved swallow is teh roxx0rz ? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

Gibbage1
11-18-2005, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by Bremspropeller:
So you finally found out that our beloved swallow is teh roxx0rz ? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

I guess you have yet to fly the YP-80 against it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

P-80 Powens the Me-262 BIG TIME.

fordfan25
11-18-2005, 04:16 PM
Originally posted by Badsight.:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Gibbage1:
It would be fair if they included a P-80 in the list. And dont give me that historical BS cop-out. Respawning after death is NOT historical. Any German pilot having the option to fly a Me-262 is NOT historical. Having a Me-262 dogfighting with fighters is NOT historical. DF servers are always as far as possible from historical. whaa whaa whaa

you dont need to have a P-80 included just because the other side has a 262

but yea your right , DF rooms have zero to do with history or replicating history </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


tell that to the server admins who feel u need ki84Cs when there are f4uCs http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Oilburner_TAW
11-18-2005, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by danjama:
its just not fair game to put 262s on servers. Their too Uber compared to prop planes it just ruins the game. Period. I notice 3334th have them too, no surprise there http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
I have run across 2 HISTORICAL maps with 262's on either GreaterGreen or Spits vs 109's and it was not unbalanced. One map the 262 was the anti-tank version so that's what the pilots used it for. The other map had the fighter/bomber version but allies had the P-5120NA,P-51MkIII, and whatever the uber spit is. I shot down two 262's on that map. One I followed around FOREVER until I got alt on him and cut off his turn (the ace-maker gunsight made it easy). The other I caught landing (as happened historically).

I must admit I liked it, because the allies were forced to fly the mission and work together or get slaughtered. In addition, since the 262 is rare online I don't think there are a lot of real 262 pro's so (as in the case of the one I caught sightseeing) some pilots let their guard down with all that speed and fly around as if they are invincible.

Oh, and there were at least four of them in the air (probably 13-14 on server) and no lag at all.

Badsight.
11-18-2005, 04:28 PM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bremspropeller:
So you finally found out that our beloved swallow is teh roxx0rz ? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

I guess you have yet to fly the YP-80 against it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>yes i know why your wanting the P-80 if the 262 is selectable

i fly all the jets in FB regularly


Originally posted by fordfan25:
tell that to the server admins who feel u need ki84Cs when there are f4uCs i do , no reason the Ki-84 C is needed in a DF room , the B is perfectly fine

then again i dont mind flying against 262's Ki-C's or F4u-1C's & i dont whine about it when i have too

waffen-79
11-18-2005, 04:37 PM
Originally posted by Megile:
Me262 causes lag.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif oh.. er for real?

polak5
11-18-2005, 05:05 PM
Originally posted by waffen-79:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Megile:
Me262 causes lag.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif oh.. er for real? </div></BLOCKQUOTE> http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

BelaLvgosi
11-18-2005, 05:07 PM
Originally posted by waffen-79:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Megile:
Me262 causes lag.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif oh.. er for real? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So as Tie Advanced's http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

LeadSpitter_
11-18-2005, 05:12 PM
megile is right the jets cause lag as well as the rocket ac even more compaired to props.

Well if oleg lives up to what he says they will give us 2-3 runways types with 2 4 and 6 bornplaces for dogfight maps which can be used for me262s in limited numbes as well as other latewar aircraft which were not used in large numbers.

Oleg said he made the dev team aware this and it is needed badly this was 2 patchs ago and hope him or the dev team did not forget.

LEXX_Luthor
11-18-2005, 06:13 PM
Hace::
Now these folks have got it right. The [262] base is many, many kilos from the front-line action.
Great to hear this idea being used.

Another idea, theoretical, or just theatrical, is putting Jet bases right on the frontline, between Red and Blue prop bases. This should make the 262s vulnerable on takeoff. The prop players will have to fly their Ta's or Doras to cover for the 262s until they can get up some speed.

hobnail
11-18-2005, 06:20 PM
Best 262 dogfight maps I've seen are ones as Lexx has said, the field is right on the border close to an NME base.

In addition the better ones have had fixed arty that can fire into the jet-base, it took me 3 engine fires and 2 deaths to get into the air the first time. Now put that in the context of a death-kick server and it may just pay off.

zoomar
11-18-2005, 08:53 PM
Exactly how is it that having the Me262 (over 1200 built, over 100 in service)in servers not historical while many more have planes like the Mig3U, I-185, or Ta-152 which were either prototypes only or saw only minimal service, or the Bf109Z, which was never even built?

carguy_
11-19-2005, 01:04 AM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
It would be fair if they included a P-80 in the list. And dont give me that historical BS cop-out. Respawning after death is NOT historical. Any German pilot having the option to fly a Me-262 is NOT historical. Having a Me-262 dogfighting with fighters is NOT historical. DF servers are always as far as possible from historical.

I think I understand what you`re saying overall.You don`t object P51 and B17 vs Me262 and 109G6 7000m coops,do you?

I don`t get the German pilot getting Me262 not historical though http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif


Bottom line,there are Me262 coops thank to people who just want to face the odds.

Daiichidoku
11-19-2005, 01:53 AM
many ppl cant see past the top speed or an awesome cannon battery, mainly becuse they simply cannot deal with jets, when really, they can be readily dealt with, given the proper tactics, one cant fight a jet quite the same way as a prop, not if they want a chance vs a quality jet pilot, at least

that, and its own shortcomings compared to any prop, ie anemic acceleration, mediocre climb, perhpas only able to out turn a P 47, those touchy engines, can barley tolerate changes in fuel injestion, let alone a single .303

easy to get one taking off...even easier to nail one royally whilst landing

takes some thought and a good shot to engage and destroy the enemy at the higher speeds and smaller timeframe involved...of course, depending on situ, and/or what sort level of game one is playing, chance of surprise to make it easier to do varies, from maximum FR-type to ext view padlock full icons, map icons etc.

jets must also have to slow down to fight as the occasion arises, and run risk of being caught slow, or or stay fast and possibly bring on a rapid blackout, to often crash, or come to just in time to see an enemy about to mow you down



"a good ******* beats a screw any time" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Von_Rat
11-19-2005, 02:45 AM
ive flown 262 online several times, NO LAG AT ALL.

its just a myth, maybe true at one time, not now.

oh and he162 pwns the p80 lol.

jugent
11-19-2005, 04:10 AM
If the Me 262 was as fragile in WWII as it is in this game, it wouldnt have been produced.
Perhaps bomber-gunners and AAA is to good.
Warclouds always cripple the Schwalbe by putting the great gun on it.
I agree that a couple of P-47 will kill or force the 262 to spend all its time to try to climb to "survival" altitude 7k witch takes a long time.

Lucius_Esox
11-19-2005, 07:36 AM
The 262 was on Wc last night and to be honest it was more of a "nuisance" than a real threat. The guy daren't slow down enough or he gets tagged. Was good though the first time I tried to get on the six of this aircraft trailing smoke http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif and then all of a sudden,,,wtf!!! it's a 262. I'm not sure the pilot knew what he was doing though.

As far as the lag thing goes,, well.. Is it a windup or not? but I had the most wierd lag experiences I've ever had on WC. Me and one other http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif actually had clones of ourselves appearing, which was hilarious,, I actually tried to get on my own six..

Don't know how relevant that is or not though!

Viper2005_
11-19-2005, 12:45 PM
I think that the server was just laggy last night for whatever reason. I came in just after the jet map ended and had really nasty lag all night...

Hawgdog
11-19-2005, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by polak5:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by waffen-79:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Megile:
Me262 causes lag.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif oh.. er for real? </div></BLOCKQUOTE> http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


oh brotha...I tell ya what causes lag, 4 whirblewinds around a base!

By the way..an La7 will give a 262 fits, unless the 262 just attacks, keeps speed and runs away, turning around making another run, otherwise, the 262 is pulp!

La7, and those dam late war yaks are a threat!

http://users.adelphia.net/~hawgdog/assets/images/grab0005.jpg

maybe it was the wrong markings that got me shot down?

Hawgdog
11-19-2005, 02:24 PM
Originally posted by zoomar:
Exactly how is it that having the Me262 (over 1200 built, over 100 in service)in servers not historical while many more have planes like the Mig3U, I-185, or Ta-152 which were either prototypes only or saw only minimal service, or the Bf109Z, which was never even built?

shhhh, you'll ruin gibbies fantasy's http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

p1ngu666
11-19-2005, 03:21 PM
hawg, gib didnt make any of those mentioned planes http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Diablo310th
11-19-2005, 03:31 PM
Originally posted by xTHRUDx:
a pair of 47's will eat up 262's
Yayyyyy Thrud!!!! yeah

Hawgdog
11-19-2005, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by p1ngu666:
hawg, gib didnt make any of those mentioned planes http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif



Originally posted by Gibbage1:
Any German pilot having the option to fly a Me-262 is NOT historical. Having a Me-262 dogfighting with fighters is NOT historical. DF servers are always as far as possible from historical.

nakamura_kenji
11-19-2005, 04:36 PM
i guess allie v me262 feel like japanese(a6m,ki-61) v p38,p51,p47 we have put up with much fast enemy why can you no? ^_^

Monty_Thrud
11-19-2005, 04:54 PM
Only whoopsies fly the Me262...

NorrisMcWhirter
11-20-2005, 03:15 AM
Gib's flawed logic concerning the P-80 is probably why so many fantasy planes have been introduced of late http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

i.e. It doesn't matter if whatever never existed/didn't fly because the game can never be ultimately realistic so it's more than OK to include them.

I've seen some classics but that one takes the biscuit.

Me262 should be banned because there is simply an overwhelming wealth of evidence confirming that it causes lag in servers. The same research has shown that .50 cals raise the same issues - they now cause so much lag that all .50-equipped aircraft should be banned with immediate effect.

Ta,
Norris

Copperhead310th
11-20-2005, 10:06 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
whiner. It it ain't kraught it ain't right.
That what your trying to say there Norris?

Now stay right here & wait for me.....
i'm gonna go make a 'samich'. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

NorrisMcWhirter
11-20-2005, 10:38 AM
'Kraut'?

Don't worry, Copper - it'll only be a matter of time before you lose it and get banned again.

However, it doesn't surprise me that you subscribe to the same logic. Not one bit.

Ta,
Norris

HayateAce
11-20-2005, 10:53 AM
Oh, real life is a much different matter than this fun game. Yes, P80 Shooting Star would have swept the schwalbe from the skies.

10 times more beautiful too.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://www.edwards.af.mil/gallery/images/yeager-planes/p80-1_300.jpg

Copperhead310th
11-20-2005, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
'Kraut'?

Don't worry, Copper - it'll only be a matter of time before you lose it and get banned again.

However, it doesn't surprise me that you subscribe to the same logic. Not one bit.

Ta,
Norris

And the term "Ami-whiner" has never been trhown out there on these boards. nor have Americains ever been called fat lazy worthless slobs. nope that's NEVER been implied here at all. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
Now....run along and go judge a spelling b or something why don'tchas. you seem to be good at that.

And doesn't the P-80 have those wing tanks in FB? Hey Gibbage......

MEGILE
11-20-2005, 11:55 AM
Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
so many fantasy planes have been introduced of late http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif



Ta,
Norris

Names please of fantasy planes in game, exluding BF-109Z.

Daiichidoku
11-20-2005, 12:05 PM
P 80s, yes they would murder 262s (mind you, he 162s rip 80s new ones!)

however, we have YP-80s....and they had a well-known problem with the intakes actually imploding at high speed...this followed on to the early P 80s, as well, until a redesign fixed it finally...



yes, ban all the 50 cals types and thier lag, too

one of the reasons for the lag caused by 262s, or so ive been told, is the jet efflux...
the same effect displayed by any type when engine damaged...so ban those, too, as they cause lag...enjoy the G-11s!



actually, pre- 3.xx, there WAS a serious problem with the me 163 Komet since its release AEP (and never the B1), not so much causing lag per se, but that the 163 itself was untrackable, and would ufo across the atmosphere

Daiichidoku
11-20-2005, 12:20 PM
Originally posted by Megile:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
so many fantasy planes have been introduced of late http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif



Ta,
Norris

Names please of fantasy planes in game, exluding BF-109Z. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


ki84C show me hard proof of just how many were actually made...and if it EVER saw real combat...and how much actuall flight testing was done with guns fitted and fired

Go-229 i dont fly noob types, but when i do, i go all the way with the ultra-noob wing...i luv it!...however, given it only flew once, how accurate can the FM be proven? estimates....drams...FANTASIES

the 185, while it seems to have been flight tested a fair ammount (when it could actaully get off the ground), there are no examples left, and i suspect, not a wealth of accurate blueprints etc to validate its tank-like DM...not to mention its turn, not so hot compared to other types, sure, but that it shares the same wingloading with a 190, yet FAR outturns it?...IMO, a case of "boss, boss, de plane! de plane!"

WOLFMondo
11-20-2005, 12:38 PM
I've never really understood why people don't want the Ki84C on servers? Its like a vastly inferior FW190 A8 with MK108's. Whats the problem?

NorrisMcWhirter
11-20-2005, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by WOLFMondo:
I've never really understood why people don't want the Ki84C on servers? Its like a vastly inferior FW190 A8 with MK108's. Whats the problem?

It's good at shooting down US planes (or was, until it was whined into oblivion like everything else) - that's why http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

As to fantasy planes, did anyone actually provide written documentation for the P38L-Late? I've not seen any.

In fact, I've seen as much documentation to support the P38L-Late as I've seen 109Zs on servers.

Presumably you agree with Gib's logic too, Megile?

Ta,
Norris

NorrisMcWhirter
11-20-2005, 01:26 PM
Originally posted by Copperhead310th:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
'Kraut'?

Don't worry, Copper - it'll only be a matter of time before you lose it and get banned again.

However, it doesn't surprise me that you subscribe to the same logic. Not one bit.

Ta,
Norris

And the term "Ami-whiner" has never been trhown out there on these boards. nor have Americains ever been called fat lazy worthless slobs. nope that's NEVER been implied here at all. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
Now....run along and go judge a spelling b or something why don'tchas. you seem to be good at that.

And doesn't the P-80 have those wing tanks in FB? Hey Gibbage...... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I never called Americans fat lazy slobs or whatever - I've merely questioned some of America's actions...but that appears to mean that I "hate the US."

Again, surreal logic that I simply don't understand.

Still, it's amusing if nothing else.

Ta,
Norris

Daiichidoku
11-20-2005, 02:23 PM
Originally posted by WOLFMondo:
I've never really understood why people don't want the Ki84C on servers? Its like a vastly inferior FW190 A8 with MK108's. Whats the problem?

strange....perhaps the better turn, better climb, and better accel of the 84 make it vastly inferior to the A8?

or is it merely the comperable top speed and high alt ability?


the amazing thing is (perhaps not-so amazing) that when the ki84B is offered, very few will take it, even though it is just as lethal, given reasonably accurate shooting

when the C model is offered, on the other hand, ppl flock to it in droves, as even the sloppiest gunnery and luckiest, glancing, long range hits often results in the enemy blowing up...blowing up real good

same thing happens with the Yak3 and Yak 3P...
offer the Yak3 and very few select it...add the 3P instead, and half a server is polluted by them


MY problem with them is what i percieve to be the mentality that goes with it...one that tells me, if there were a SAM site offered, one button to start it, one button to fire after an auto lock-on was made, these same ppl would be using that ad naseum

I derive a great deal of fun from this, or any game, in large part by virture of the challenge it presents in killing whist staying alive, or otherwise "winning"

ill fist fight you, if you need an edge with brass knuckles, fine, but dont bring a knife into it
or a katana to a bowie knife fight
or a auto pistol to a katana fight


and plz, no **** about usa nuking 2 JP cities in some kind of "do what it takes" analogy, if that was the case,they also would have no hesitation using them in korea or elsewhere

Copperhead310th
11-20-2005, 03:41 PM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
P 80s, yes they would murder 262s (mind you, he 162s rip 80s new ones!)

however, we have YP-80s....and they had a well-known problem with the intakes actually imploding at high speed...this followed on to the early P 80s, as well, until a redesign fixed it finally...



I dunno now....the p-80 was at the top of the pile of jets in the sim a few patches ago. It was deadly to 262's.no match at all. was like hunting bf-110's in a mustang. Even the he-162 was not a match for the p-80 when flown properly. and the only real cpmpatition inthe sim was the Gotha and that took a dam good pilot to beat the p-80. JG27Aristo were talking about this one night and we did a best of five kills solo. P-80 vs 162 and the p-80 won 3 to 2. and Aristo is one of the best LW pilots i know. & like wise i'm only an average pilot. But then patches come & go and i..being cocky & overly conafdent in the p-80 dedcided to take on a pair of JV44 pilots 1 vs 2 in 262's and got OwNeD out right fair & square.
Where i could easliy out manuver any of the LW jets before....i could no longer do so. and that WAS the strongest part of the p-80's abilities was T&B vs the LW jets.
While they have the speed & fire power...i could just not be there when the attck came and reverse almost anything a 262 came to the plate with. But like i said that was a few patches ago. Maybe that has changed agin? dunno haven't flown the Shooting Star in a looong while.
Used to it was in the p-80 get alt, stay fast & turn turn turn & you'll never die.

p1ngu666
11-20-2005, 04:11 PM
weell 300 ki84c's where made
puts it above the f4u 1c (200 made)

Daiichidoku
11-20-2005, 04:40 PM
@copperhead

yea, 80s whip 262s...only the very best 262 pilot can deal with 80s, and even then can really only try to count upon exploiting the 80s lower wing-snap threshold...hmmm kinda like a 110 might be able to do to a...mustanghttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif...but yea, slim to no chance


80s and 162s are very evenly matched, ala spitI vs 109E, a pliot issue here, plain n simple

as far as top of the jets go, well...the Go!
the Go 229 (or goth as i call it) really is superlative and will eat a 80 for breakfast
the 80s only reprieve vs a goth is that it has a fairly large speed advantage at low altitudes
you DF a goth in an 80, u die..you take on a goth at alt in an 80, u die

in fact, the goth will 1 vs 1 DF any monoplane except those that outturn it, namely A6M2s and Oscars...A6M3s im not completely sure about, they are quite close, and i have never flown a Tony vs a goth, or a goth vs a Tony, so i dont know about those
but any other prop mono is meat for a goth...i LUV it when Yaks SPits and Las foolishly start turning a goth...rude awakening!..esp when those 103s hit http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif



as far as my YP 80 comment goes, of course, it plays no part in the game, as mech failures/engineering/production flaws etc arent modelled..but interesting, nonethelesshttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Daiichidoku
11-20-2005, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by p1ngu666:
weell 300 ki84c's where made
puts it above the f4u 1c (200 made)


pingu, i have waited a LONG time for someone to show me ANY solid figures of ki84C production


best ive seen so far was Fool Trottel's scan from a JP types book that only came up with "a few" were made, no actual number stated

would you, pray tell, be able to produce your source for 300 ki84Cs? not prodding ya, seriously, id like to see a published figure for 84C production...was it 1? 3? 300?

for that matter, any published accounts of a ki84C in combat would be nice, too

p1ngu666
11-20-2005, 05:15 PM
i dont have a source http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif

VW-IceFire
11-20-2005, 07:45 PM
Me 262's cause lag, so does fog, smoke, aircraft that drop bombs, maps, sky, and the sun. The sun causes lag too! Good lord! Run!

Badsight.
11-20-2005, 09:06 PM
you see Megile ?

if you repeat it enough . . . . . . & dont get bogged down in defending your statement . . . . . it becomes fact

Badsight.
11-20-2005, 09:11 PM
Originally posted by Copperhead310th:
and the p-80 won 3 to 2. . . . . . & like wise i'm only an average pilot. yes you have to be extremely Average to lose fights to a He-162 using the P-80

He-162 are the worst jet DF-er in the game

heres another clue , you go 2 v 1 & lose , its not the planes fault http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif the P-80 has never been as good in FB as it is right now v4.02

Daiichidoku
11-20-2005, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by p1ngu666:
i dont have a source http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif

np, i certainly wont hold it against you...how could i, youre a font of scanned materiel and a mossie loverhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

btw, you HAVE seen touchy's latest installment, "merlins", right?
http://www.angel.ne.jp/~tochy/


anyhow, the 300 figure is silly
seems there was "a few" 84Cs made, but as i said, i have never seen any actually number referred to, much less confirmed or published

my guess is the manufacturer, or a subcontractor, or IJA bodged a beefier mount for the 30mms and may have tested the installation...perhaps even airtested gunnery with it

they may have seen combat...but as there were probably only 3-ish of them around at all, unlikely...and its not like the JP had no clue what the 30mms could do in the first place



now, i cant feel any difference between a 84B and a C, but i bet IRL, with 2 heavier(?), by mass, cannon replacing 2 of the 20mms, and what must have been at least slightly heavier construction concerning the mounts, wether beefier, or more parts, or both, may have affected the 84Cs perf in turn, climb and roll, even if very slight

Daiichidoku
11-20-2005, 09:38 PM
Originally posted by Badsight.:
yes you have to be extremely Average to lose fights to a He-162 using the P-80

He-162 are the worst jet DF-er in the game

heres another clue , you go 2 v 1 & lose , its not the planes fault http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif the P-80 has never been as good in FB as it is right now v4.02


badsight, you would say the 162 is inferior to a 262 in a DF? seriously?

i find the 162 is a great DF'f

compared to the 80, not quite as good slow spd handling, but better accel and top speed

too bad about the ammo load, but wth, 151 seem to be what they should be now anyhow



we gotta duke it out sometime, my sally vs your star

winner gets his choice, shinden to be included into FB or 185 to come outhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

(either way, i cant really lose, i love shindens too...ummm did you ever happen to find any more pics of it online, btw?)

Badsight.
11-20-2005, 11:00 PM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
ummm did you ever happen to find any more pics of it online, btw?
i have every RL online pic of it

you doubting me on this ?

Badsight.
11-20-2005, 11:12 PM
but seriously , the He-162 has a good roll rate & thats it , its got the worst sustained turn-rate of all the Jets. it is very fast & has a good zoom (horrid at the stall over the immel tho) , low ammo load

but very fast , fastest plane to fly during WW2 & it shows in FB

with a normal 1v1 head-on DF it will lose the merge & be forced to run , my money would be on the P-80 every time

nakamura_kenji
11-21-2005, 03:05 AM
Ho-5 20mm x 94 850 rpm 750 m/s 33 kg
Ho-155 30mm x 115 (235 g) 600 rpm 700 m/s 50 kg

ho-155 30mm be 17kg hevier than ho-5 20mm i have feel over all weight be same. this cause ho-155 less ammo also read while go wing fuel tank slight smaller make room big gun so this short range bit but intend as bomber interceptor guess no real loss always drop tank if need guess. may explain why fly much same as ki-84 4xho-5.

from little read long time ago think ki-84 with ho-155 only real prototype and no produce in number more than single figure think. large gun concept no unique in japanese plane there ki-61-II prototype that were made with same ho-155 in wing as bomber killer also ki-44 were fit 2x37mm or 2x40mm(i forget sorry) little hyabusa ki-43-III got 2x Ho-5 which big plane for start 2x 7.7mm ^_^. i no mind it ingame(rather other more use plane but no chance p_q) but wish peple stop use online it much cheap think people should learn how shoot than use ki-84 ho-155

MEGILE
11-21-2005, 03:46 AM
Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:


Presumably you agree with Gib's logic too, Megile?

Ta,
Norris

You mean your copping out? like the time you claimed on HyperLobby that .50 cals could ignite planes at 700m. I asked for a demonstration but regretfully you declined.

MEGILE
11-21-2005, 03:48 AM
Originally posted by Badsight.:
you see Megile ?

if you repeat it enough . . . . . . & dont get bogged down in defending your statement . . . . . it becomes fact

hhe Badsight.. its a tad ironic. I fly more me-262 coops than Norris posts how the me-262 isn't included online.
As for the lag issue.. on weaker servers ie. slower hosts an army of me-262s can cause lag. Nothing to do with the smoke trail mind you....


I didn't mention not including it on servers however. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

MEGILE
11-21-2005, 03:53 AM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:


Go-229 i dont fly noob types, but when i do, i go all the way with the ultra-noob wing...i luv it!...however, given it only flew once, how accurate can the FM be proven? estimates....drams...FANTASIES


The FM may be suspect, but as it did actually fly, the plane isn't fantasy. Merely one which did not see service.

WOLFMondo
11-21-2005, 04:08 AM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by WOLFMondo:
I've never really understood why people don't want the Ki84C on servers? Its like a vastly inferior FW190 A8 with MK108's. Whats the problem?

strange....perhaps the better turn, better climb, and better accel of the 84 make it vastly inferior to the A8?

or is it merely the comperable top speed and high alt ability?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd say the A8 has a better high speed climb, is most definatly faster at all heights, even at 10KM, the A8 is armoured and doesn't flame at the sight of a .50, is better armed, has automated systems, better roll rate and acceleration, I don't know about that. And turn? who gives a **** about turning when you fly a FW190http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

190's look way cooler as well. But thats subjective.

In short its good at shooting down US aircraft which some people can't deal with. IMHO anyways.

robban75
11-21-2005, 04:25 AM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
P-80 Powens the Me-262 BIG TIME.

That's because it's overmodelled.

Hoarmurath
11-21-2005, 04:42 AM
Me 262 volume 4, by J.Richard Smith and Eddie J.Creek, Classic Publications, pg 855

On 17 May 1946, the last remaining flyable Me 262 at Wright Field, FE-4012, was flown to Patterson Field for comparison trials with the prototype Lockheed XP-80, prototype of America's first operationnal jet fighter, probably FE-111, by the Hugues Aircraft Corporation in Culver City. Eight trials were flown by the aircraft against the XP-80, carried out by Colonels Al Boyd and Hal Watson. The tests were to prove an eye opener for the later :
"There was no comparison as far as i'm concerned between the operationnal capability of the Me 262 and the P-80. There was nothing comparable with the Me 262 in Brittain or the US. It was another couple of years before the P-80 began to approach it."
When Boyd reported the results of these trials and the earlier ones with T2-711 (Fay's aircraft) to his superiors he was cautioned not to release his findings. The conclusions of the official report on the tests were also censored. They stated :
"Despite a difference in gross weight of nearly 2000 lbs (907 kg) the Me 262 T2-711 was superior to the average P-80A in acceleration, speed, and approximately the same in climb performance... The Me 262 apparently has a higher critical Mach number, from a drag standpoint, than any other current air force fighter."

After completion of the trials the aircraft was returned to the Hugues company for a more extensive refurbishment. It eventually emerged at the end of February 1948 with all structural gaps filled, the gun ports faired over and several coats of high gloss paint applied. Spurious German markings were applied and its earlier "FE" (Foreign Equipment) number replaced by T2-4012. The intention was to enter the aircraft in the Bendix Thompson Jet Trophy Races, in wich only Americans P-80 were due to compete but, as Watson was to record, this plan was stopped by General Arnold to prevent a potential - and predicted - source of embarrassment for the fledgling Air Force.

danjama
11-21-2005, 04:55 AM
Originally posted by WOLFMondo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by WOLFMondo:
I've never really understood why people don't want the Ki84C on servers? Its like a vastly inferior FW190 A8 with MK108's. Whats the problem?

strange....perhaps the better turn, better climb, and better accel of the 84 make it vastly inferior to the A8?

or is it merely the comperable top speed and high alt ability?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd say the A8 has a better high speed climb, is most definatly faster at all heights, even at 10KM, the A8 is armoured and doesn't flame at the sight of a .50, is better armed, has automated systems, better roll rate and acceleration, I don't know about that. And turn? who gives a **** about turning when you fly a FW190http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

190's look way cooler as well. But thats subjective.

In short its good at shooting down US aircraft which some people can't deal with. IMHO anyways. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Absolutely Spot On. I like to come into threads and see this http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Feathered_IV
11-21-2005, 05:27 AM
Go-229 i dont fly noob types, but when i do, i go all the way with the ultra-noob wing...i luv it!...however, given it only flew once........

Lol! What a strange coincidence. I only flew it once too http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Daiichidoku
11-21-2005, 09:18 AM
Originally posted by Badsight.:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
ummm did you ever happen to find any more pics of it online, btw?
i have every RL online pic of it

you doubting me on this ? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



not particularly....but you were surprised when you saw this one i posted not very long ago, remember? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0SgCFAhYXv3Hz5muONNOlC3mUfG1VWvnjASD1tpuQl8RBDGecA mUvtuWaj0CIB5ALoZq6G0HrhzELpiKQZBOpb3Nx500ZqunY55D NO01!x8F87waO1b6Vyw/sinden0.jpg?dc=4675490750162943329



i just wanted to know if you found any MORE since you saw this one, thats all


and i never dicerned between RL pics or CG

Daiichidoku
11-21-2005, 09:23 AM
Originally posted by nakamura_kenji:
Ho-5 20mm x 94 850 rpm 750 m/s 33 kg
Ho-155 30mm x 115 (235 g) 600 rpm 700 m/s 50 kg

ho-155 30mm be 17kg hevier than ho-5 20mm i have feel over all weight be same. this cause ho-155 less ammo also read while go wing fuel tank slight smaller make room big gun so this short range bit but intend as bomber interceptor guess no real loss always drop tank if need guess. may explain why fly much same as ki-84 4xho-5.

from little read long time ago think ki-84 with ho-155 only real prototype and no produce in number more than single figure think. large gun concept no unique in japanese plane there ki-61-II prototype that were made with same ho-155 in wing as bomber killer also ki-44 were fit 2x37mm or 2x40mm(i forget sorry) little hyabusa ki-43-III got 2x Ho-5 which big plane for start 2x 7.7mm ^_^. i no mind it ingame(rather other more use plane but no chance p_q) but wish peple stop use online it much cheap think people should learn how shoot than use ki-84 ho-155

never knew about the fuel tank, tx NK

Daiichidoku
11-21-2005, 09:27 AM
Originally posted by Megile:

The FM may be suspect, but as it did actually fly, the plane isn't fantasy. Merely one which did not see service.


c'mon

really, none of the types in FB are fantasy, as they all existed, if one coveniently forgets that the RL 109Z was an F, and FB has a G


ok, then allow me to correct my labelling them as fantasy to marginal, instead

Copperhead310th
11-22-2005, 04:41 PM
Originally posted by Badsight.:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Copperhead310th:
and the p-80 won 3 to 2. . . . . . & like wise i'm only an average pilot. yes you have to be extremely Average to lose fights to a He-162 using the P-80

He-162 are the worst jet DF-er in the game

heres another clue , you go 2 v 1 & lose , its not the planes fault http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif the P-80 has never been as good in FB as it is right now v4.02 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bad ol buddy go back and read a little more carefully. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
I wasn't blaming the jet in the jv44 fight.
and i had alrady stated and it is widley known i'm far from the best stick around. So that goes with out saying. all i was trying to state was that..
A. The P-80 was less effective in that match vs multiple Me-262's than it was in previous patches.
B. My piloting skill has neither improved or gotten any worse.
C. The Jv44 pilots were of some skill with thier 262's.
D. I was stupid for attempting a 2 vs 1 match to begin with.

Got it? Good. lol

Now as for the 4.02 patch...NO time in the P-80 this patch. ZERO STICK TIME.
So i don't feel comfortable speaking on it's presant performance. Ask me again after the holiday week when iv'e had a chance to finnsih recovering form thanksgiving, & my recant hard drive cash. I'll try it out over the rest of the week.

LEXX_Luthor
11-22-2005, 05:06 PM
Daiich::
really, none of the types in FB are fantasy, as they all existed, if one coveniently forgets that the RL 109Z was an F, and FB has a G
From what I know, and we thought you knew this since you post much about -Z, the intended production was to be G based, and that is what is modelled. Neither flew, and Oleg chose the intended production version. If there is a problem with -Z its the lack of contra rotating props, although I have not flown this recently so maybe they fixed it.

JG27_Stacko
11-22-2005, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by Oilburner_TAW:
In addition, since the 262 is rare online I don't think there are a lot of real 262 pro's so (as in the case of the one I caught sightseeing) some pilots let their guard down with all that speed and fly.

*cough* JV44 *cough* hope and pray u never meet them in an online DF server that has the 262. truth be told, there sqaud is the reason (prolly the only reason) its banned in all forms at War-Clouds. No matter how u try to limit them (except that BS 50 mm pos) they always seem to dominate in them.

true there are plenty of noobs in the 262 - characterised by a flaming engine through poor power application, but there are also plenty of experten.

Daiichidoku
11-22-2005, 06:01 PM
Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
Daiich:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">really, none of the types in FB are fantasy, as they all existed, if one coveniently forgets that the RL 109Z was an F, and FB has a G
From what I know, and we thought you knew this since you post much about -Z, the intended production was to be G based, and that is what is modelled. Neither flew, and Oleg chose the intended production version. If there is a problem with -Z its the lack of contra rotating props, although I have not flown this recently so maybe they fixed it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


i imagine that if the Z had same turn props, then this is accuratly modelled in FB

the problem is the Z with its same props has, or at least had, perhaps the balance has been addressed now, less torque than the 38 with contra props

we all know FB cannont account for lack of torque, so this is kinda moot, anyhow



when i state that, by virture of the fact that all the types in FB existed, technically making them NOT "fantasy" types, as a fantasy is something that does not exist, the Z is indeed a fantasy type, as the Z in FB, a G, simply did not exist, was never built, was, as you put it, the intended production model

if the FB Z was the F model, IMO it would still be marginal, a waste of space, uncalled for in light of vital missing types, and of dubious at best FM, but not a fantasy type


if we accept so easily any other type was to be modified for "intended porduction", yet was never actually built, them why not just call FB "crimson skiesII"?

how many plans, proposals and line drawing layouts still exist of types that, wether modified existing types, or wholly new types unto themselves, are there?...given the precedent set by the unbuilt, never existed FB Z, with its at best, guesstimated FM,...well...

a P 38K, anyone?...oops, that one was actually built and flown, nevermindhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

NorrisMcWhirter
12-01-2005, 05:22 PM
Originally posted by Megile:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:


Presumably you agree with Gib's logic too, Megile?

Ta,
Norris

You mean your copping out? like the time you claimed on HyperLobby that .50 cals could ignite planes at 700m. I asked for a demonstration but regretfully you declined. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Copping out? You avoided my question - I answered you by asking how many 109Zs you saw on servers but you declined not to answer that.

Yes, I recall that evening in HL...although I'm, curious whether it was the one where you and LS were ****ging off Asians. Ironic, really, for someone who once called me a xenophobe.

And if you really want to know about the .50s, ask FlyingFinn as he was the one I bagged - I believe that you know each other. And it wasn't 700m, it was 650m. At least get it right, eh?

Ta,
Norris

LeadSpitter_
12-01-2005, 06:53 PM
Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Megile:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:


Presumably you agree with Gib's logic too, Megile?

Ta,
Norris

You mean your copping out? like the time you claimed on HyperLobby that .50 cals could ignite planes at 700m. I asked for a demonstration but regretfully you declined. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Copping out? You avoided my question - I answered you by asking how many 109Zs you saw on servers but you declined not to answer that.

Yes, I recall that evening in HL...although I'm, curious whether it was the one where you and LS were ****ging off Asians. Ironic, really, for someone who once called me a xenophobe.

And if you really want to know about the .50s, ask FlyingFinn as he was the one I bagged - I believe that you know each other. And it wasn't 700m, it was 650m. At least get it right, eh?

Ta,
Norris </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

-----------------------------------------------

****gin off asians? I never would do that... EVER and you can ask any of the pacific islanders and asians in the community who know me..

Get a backbone and stop making up **** norris you ****ing chode!

I knew this would come in handy again.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v43/leadspitter/yo.gif

To the moderators I appologize for the language but when stupid ****** like norris make up such false rumors i dont appreciate it... and that ****head norris needs the ban for making up pure bs.

LS out.... ban norris for ****ing lying and making up pure BS.

wheres the log norris or chatlog.txt becuase your ****ing making it up you dumb **** ban norris for this permantly.

Daiichidoku
12-01-2005, 09:45 PM
jets go fast

NorrisMcWhirter
12-02-2005, 10:52 AM
I'm sure you thought your comments were quite harmless at the time...almost a joke, even, LS. A bit like the ad-homnium in the placing of one of your no-doubt 'hilarious to you' animated gifs.

I'd quite welcome the mods banning me but I don't tend to make things up. I'd also be quite happy to continue this in PM if you so wish, providing that you haven't been banned for posting inappropriate images again http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Also, I may well have the chat log available but I do tend to clear it out quite often....I will take a look, however, when I'm on my normal machine.

Ta,
Norris