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View Full Version : IL-2 1946: 8800 or 3870?



TheFamilyMan
01-22-2008, 05:12 PM
I'm looking to upgrade the graphics in my rig to something with at least 512MB. A few months ago I got a second evga 7800GT CO from ebay to run SLI. I now run IL-2 1946 at 8xAA, in-game AF at 1280x1024 on a 19" TFT and it's beautiful, but now my rig is much louder due to case fans blowing out all that extra heat (and by summer it'll be much worse). So now my quest is for quieter (and faster) performance. I've heard the 8800 has problems with IL-2 when flying over cities. Is that still a problem? Also, anyone have anything to say about the 3870? I need lots of AA to compensate for my 12x10 and I've read the ATI dx10 cards really choke when AA is applied. Any suggestions? Thanks for reading!

Edit:
My budget is about $250US. Extreme suggestions are interesting but not useful.

BTW...
athalon64 4200+ X2 @2.475G, 2x1G DDR450, asus a8n-sli premium, 2x evga 7800GT @470, etc...this will all go away once something big happens with the new 45nm processors (like 3.8G or 4G).

Chivas
01-22-2008, 05:46 PM
The 3850x2 is coming out in a week or two and is supposedly a barn burner...well maybe not that hot..http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif It may turn out to be a viable option although the price will probably be around $500.

roybaty
01-22-2008, 06:28 PM
Seems a lot smoother over cities with the Beta patch, as you see in my specs I have a median 8 series card.

Pre Beta it was rough http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Chris0382
01-22-2008, 06:46 PM
Im running full wit a 7600 GT BUT HAVE 2GB RAM and a 5600 x2 cpu and its playable at 1600 x 1200.
I also play FEAR maxed out at 1600 x 1200 playable.

I have just ordered a 8800 GT 256MB and hope though to get smooth frame rates all the time at setting the 7600GT can handle playabe (a little choppiness here and there).

I think you will do well with any 8800 at 1280x1024 but 512MB shines at above resolutions that what you are using now.

I want the coolest lowest power consuming 8800 and thats why a I went with a 256MB version as it has to be better than a 7600GT right.

Also a clean vanilla OS goes a long way to smooth game play.

Crysis seems like a diff. animal as the graphics appear to be better than if real life with its rich colors and tons of foliage and vegetation.

TheFamilyMan
01-24-2008, 03:35 PM
Found good info on the 38## cards here (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/49310655/m/9921003826). Any 8800GT/GTS user out there care to comment?

BTW, I pretty much max all setting (perfect mode, water=3) except the new 4.09 geom thing and get 40 to 60fps (vsynced) with my above settings, and its really sweet with my TrackIR. No going backwards, eye candy is life.

-HH-Quazi
01-24-2008, 03:43 PM
Imho the 7900GTX is the best nVidia graphics card to run this sim. And on the ATI slice of life the X1950XTX graphics card.

Phil_C
01-24-2008, 04:44 PM
see below for specs, but i have dual 8800 ultras and i havent had any problems with them- no studdering, no texture glitches, nothing... then again i did use the information already posted on the board, and the internet, to help get it that way...

but im completely happy with the preformance of the program on my system- and i run maxed out on a widescreen in 1920x1200x32

Hkuusela
01-25-2008, 08:18 AM
Originally posted by TheFamilyMan:
Found good info on the 38## cards here (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/49310655/m/9921003826). Any 8800GT/GTS user out there care to comment?
I've got 8800GT 512MB, C2D E4600 and I think I've got pretty much everything on max (water 4), AF x16, AA x4. I'm getting 68 average fps (limited to 70 by my monitor's refresh rate) on fmb missions with me and three enemy planes over water. The only problems I've noticed so far are flying over cities with max zoom (fps can drop even below 20) and flying REALLY low over water (fps just above 50). Didn't come cheap (270 euros), but I'd say it was a bargain!

Chris0382
01-25-2008, 08:31 AM
I just got my 8800GT 256MB yesterday and its doing very well.

I run everything maxed at 1600 x 1200 NP as I have a 20 in LCD and thats its nativeres.

FEAR is awesome now also maxed out no rough aiming now.

COD4 also maxed out gives minimum FPS of 35 which is quite nice and thats during full combat all out mayhem.

SPECS
5600 x2
2 GB Ram
Enermax 500W PSU
EVGA 256MB 8800GT
VANILLA XP and Vista (Very important IMO)

TheFamilyMan
01-25-2008, 09:40 AM
Originally posted by Hkuusela:
The only problems I've noticed so far are flying over cities with max zoom (fps can drop even below 20) and flying REALLY low over water (fps just above 50). Bummer! I was hoping the 8800GT with the latest drivers wouldn't choke like this. Are you using the 4.09b patch? roybaty above posted that it helped his 8600GT.

I notice some fps drop low over cities, but not that much. Also I use 8xAA: the visual quality on my 19" using 8xAA is night and day compared to 4xAA, and the fps is still very playable. I don't notice any problem with detecting the 'speck' of a distant aircraft using 8xAA over 4xAA. I use the in-game AF (I 'lied' my original post, which is now fixed). I've read from more than one source (including nvidia) to use in-game AA/AF setting if they are available since the developers (hopefully) optimized its application within the program so you'll get better fps performance.

Last night I took a joyride in a P-38l at very low alt. along a river valley of the 4.09 slovakia map....sweet, in some ways it's even nicer than FSX.

crazyivan1970
01-25-2008, 10:36 AM
All depends....

If you want visual quality... ATI is your card..
If you want performance.. then get nVidia.. it`s that simple http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

SeaFireLIV
01-25-2008, 10:45 AM
It`s very hard to get the RIGHt card, but it`s worth the looking and paying for a good one. Now I got an 8800GTS 320, not quite the 8800GT that I just missed out on, but i`m really happy with it anyway.

It has no problems with multiple games I`ve tried. I even overclocked it months ago and not one complaint from it.

The only slight problem I did have was flying over the dense city of Berlin and going to max zoom. There was some stutter, to my surprise. This was alleviated when I ran 4.09, I didn`t notice any stutter - the Patch? Or did I just have a good day?

As for colour, i`ve not tried the ATI, but a squad m8 made me think when he said while flying, "There`s the airfield on that yellow patch over there."

It looked light brown to me.

8800GTS 320 is a great card.

Hkuusela
01-25-2008, 11:30 AM
Originally posted by TheFamilyMan:
Bummer! I was hoping the 8800GT with the latest drivers wouldn't choke like this. Are you using the 4.09b patch? roybaty above posted that it helped his 8600GT.
I don't have the 4.09. I don't mind the loss of fps. Over water it happens if I get down to about 10 meters, but it is still quite playable (50+). I still haven't figured what makes the huge fps loss in close zoom over cities, since it doesn't happen always, but requires certain conditions. There is a way to avoid it though: Don't zoom into a city. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Zoomed out there is virtually no loss of fps.

WhiteSnake_76
01-25-2008, 11:32 AM
Got 2x 8800GT's here, game runs like a dream, but so does evry other game http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Was going for 2x 8800GTS 512mb but one of the cards would block one of my PCI slots i need for my soundcard and TV tuner so went for the 8800GT instead, just a little bit slower but still more than enough for Crysis.

8800GT and 8800GTS 512mb are both based on the new G92 chip, the 8800GTS curently is the fastest card available.

Hkuusela
01-25-2008, 11:36 AM
As for colour, i`ve not tried the ATI, but a squad m8 made me think when he said while flying, "There`s the airfield on that yellow patch over there."

It looked light brown to me.
I had the 1900GT before this one and I had no problems with it. A fine card as far as flight simming was concerned and that's about all I did with it... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Still, with the new CPU it produced a bottle neck, but then again, it isn't even supposed to be comparable to 8800.

Chris0382
01-25-2008, 03:49 PM
I think sometime the GPU is too overrated although very important.

Other areas of importance

How clean is your driver install.

How clean is your Windows install (I insist on Vanilla)

What processor do you have.

How much Ram and what type of RAM.

How fast is your HD and is it defragged optimally.

What resolution are you running.

How hot is your GPU cooler the better as FEAR came to a crawl when my GPU overheated last week due to fan failure. Then the same for the CPU and RAM.

And of course game settings.

Also what soundcard are you using and are your SC drivers installed cleanly.

Airmail109
01-25-2008, 04:20 PM
Originally posted by Hkuusela:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TheFamilyMan:
Found good info on the 38## cards here (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/49310655/m/9921003826). Any 8800GT/GTS user out there care to comment?
I've got 8800GT 512MB, C2D E4600 and I think I've got pretty much everything on max (water 4), AF x16, AA x4. I'm getting 68 average fps (limited to 70 by my monitor's refresh rate) on fmb missions with me and three enemy planes over water. The only problems I've noticed so far are flying over cities with max zoom (fps can drop even below 20) and flying REALLY low over water (fps just above 50). Didn't come cheap (270 euros), but I'd say it was a bargain! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Overclock your cpu, its not the 8800gt. Its your cpu with 2mb cache and 800fsb. OC it to 3.0ghz and performance should open out. Also whats your motherboard? Motherboards effect performance drastically. External sound card?

My friends pc is similar and averages 70fps over cities.

My AMD 3200 with 1 gig of 300mhz ram and an x800xl was getting the same performance as your pc maxxed out except for AA. Somethings not right.

thefruitbat
01-25-2008, 04:39 PM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
All depends....

If you want visual quality... ATI is your card..
If you want performance.. then get nVidia.. it`s that simple http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

can you explain? are you saying you get a better picture with ati, but better frame rates with nVidia?

cheers fruitbat

Hkuusela
01-26-2008, 09:28 AM
Originally posted by Aimail101:
Overclock your cpu, its not the 8800gt. Its your cpu with 2mb cache and 800fsb. OC it to 3.0ghz and performance should open out. Also whats your motherboard? Motherboards effect performance drastically. External sound card?

My friends pc is similar and averages 70fps over cities.

My AMD 3200 with 1 gig of 300mhz ram and an x800xl was getting the same performance as your pc maxxed out except for AA. Somethings not right.
Il-2 doesn't use multiple cores, so that explains some of it. As I told, the fps loss only happens under certain conditions and with maximum zoom. The reason my fps doesn't rise above 70 is the refresh rate of my monitor (70kHz). In my 3500+, 2 GB RAM, 1900GT 256MB, the fps was pretty much the same if I didn't apply water 4 (=2 with ATI cards, I gather). Water produces the biggest fps hit with clouds IMO. Anyhow, as Chris0382 pointed out, there are many variables affecting to what you see on your screen.

Btw, I didn't say that the fps loss was because of my video card. I just told I noticed the problem (if you can call it that).

VMF-214_HaVoK
01-29-2008, 09:21 AM
Originally posted by Chivas:
The 3850x2 is coming out in a week or two and is supposedly a barn burner...well maybe not that hot..http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif It may turn out to be a viable option although the price will probably be around $500.

This card is smokin as you can read the review here http://www.guru3d.com/article/Videocards/490/1

Retailing for around 449.00 US its a steal compared to a 8800GTX. And at the higher resolutions its does spank the more expensive 8800GTX in many game benchmarks.

Newegg.com has some in stock already. http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=E...+HD+3870+X2&x=6&y=29 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Description=Radeon+HD+3870+X2&x=6&y=29)

S!

TheGozr
01-29-2008, 11:58 PM
Well actually the best card by FAR is the 7950 GX2

I'm selling mine 7950 GX2 1 GB + gygabyte DS3 965 mobo + E6700 Duo core intel .

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Pm me

ok lets say 400 $ and i pay shipping in US

Shultze_87
01-30-2008, 02:39 AM
guys,what about a 8500?will it be good enough to play games like COD4,BOB,empires total war and other future games?thing is in my place i dont have that much of a choice,and a 8500 seems the best bargain i can get..

Chris0382
01-30-2008, 09:21 AM
Originally posted by Shultze_87:
guys,what about a 8500?will it be good enough to play games like COD4,BOB,empires total war and other future games?thing is in my place i dont have that much of a choice,and a 8500 seems the best bargain i can get..

My experience absolutly not. The 8500GT is just a DX10 video card good for multimedia etc but not for high end gaming.

It played the older games like Jedi Outcast Doom3 OK.

Slecht
01-30-2008, 10:34 AM
Perhaps consider this 3870 version.
It's single slot and overclocked with a nice cooler and lots of extra stuff.
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Sapphire/HD_3870_Atomic

TheFamilyMan
02-04-2008, 06:13 PM
Well it looks that neither card is the silver bullet (at least for the amount of money I want to spend), seeing the problems that people are posting around here with either of them. Now onto Plan B, mod my case's fan setup to do better and maybe quieter job blowing the heat off those SLI'ed cards and out of the case. Thanks y'all.

BTW, the case is an antec sonata II with that goofy air duct.

VW-IceFire
02-04-2008, 08:13 PM
Originally posted by thefruitbat:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
All depends....

If you want visual quality... ATI is your card..
If you want performance.. then get nVidia.. it`s that simple http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

can you explain? are you saying you get a better picture with ati, but better frame rates with nVidia?

cheers fruitbat </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
ATI's seem to just have less issues with blurry textures on distant objects. The 6000 and 7000 series of GeForce cards were particularly bad and well known for this kind of problem. The ATI cards have not had any issues. Generally speaking the ATI cards look a little bit better at a slight FPS penalty. The nVidia cards can also look just as good but with a much bigger penalty.

I've got a GeForce 8600GTS right now and the image quality is as good or better than my 6600GT but neither are as good as my old 9700Pro. If I understand correctly the ATI cards still hold up well to the quality standards set with the 9700. Its very slight and minor.

Also the nVidia cards seem to consistently score slightly faster in all respects in apples to apples comparisons but then the image quality isn't quite as good. So in my mind the two are neck and neck but the nVidia folks always tweak for a bit of extra frame rate performance at the expense of image quality in some minor areas and ATI has gone the other way.

For the IQ comparisons its images in motion...still images appear to be almost identical for most games.

WOLFMondo
02-05-2008, 02:05 AM
Originally posted by TheFamilyMan:
Well it looks that neither card is the silver bullet (at least for the amount of money I want to spend), seeing the problems that people are posting around here with either of them. Now onto Plan B, mod my case's fan setup to do better and maybe quieter job blowing the heat off those SLI'ed cards and out of the case. Thanks y'all.

BTW, the case is an antec sonata II with that goofy air duct.

Check out here http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/graphics-cards-gaming,review-29792.html

Something in there might fit.