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View Full Version : Not what is your favorite or what is thw best but what is most famous fighter of ww2



XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 04:02 PM
Hey guy its interesting too see what u think , remeber fame is the factor here .Its interesting too see people chioce on most famous airbattle be divided down continental lines europe=BOB america=Midway .The truth could be argues either way on both ,however the idea that Midwy is famous in Europe just doesnt hold water .that battle is not common knowledge even though it was a great
victory for the americans ,i dont know how decisive it was lets face it the USA was never going to loose that war ,where as Germany could have won the war .

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 04:02 PM
Hey guy its interesting too see what u think , remeber fame is the factor here .Its interesting too see people chioce on most famous airbattle be divided down continental lines europe=BOB america=Midway .The truth could be argues either way on both ,however the idea that Midwy is famous in Europe just doesnt hold water .that battle is not common knowledge even though it was a great
victory for the americans ,i dont know how decisive it was lets face it the USA was never going to loose that war ,where as Germany could have won the war .

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 04:18 PM
1. Zero (in movies, all Japanese planes are zeros), Mustang, 109 (in movies, all German planes are Messerschmitts), Spitfire. Take your pick.

2. "lets face it the USA was never going to loose
- that war ,where as Germany could have won the war." I suppose you don't see the fallacy in that statement...

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 04:25 PM
I'd say a toss up between;
Spitfire, P51, Zero, Bf109......somehow in this part of the world very few know anything about Russain fighters.

"Nothing difficult is ever easy"

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 04:30 PM
The Zero followed by the stuka.

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IRON SKIES
As real as you want it to be.

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 05:29 PM
Spitfire, Stuka, Zero, Mustang, Il2 I reckon as one from each team goes. I agree that Germany came a lot closer to winning the war than America did to losing it. Probably for two reasons, its hard to invade the USA and you could never bomb it into submission.

"They Gave All Their Tommorrows So That We Can Have Our Todays"

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 05:39 PM
Spitfire, P51, 109, Zero, Sturmovik.

To split hairs amongst that lot..I'd say Spitfire as the most 'Famous'. Probably the only one that could be called a 20th century icon.

"If I had all the money I've spent on drink....I'd spend it on drink!"

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 05:40 PM
F4U Corsair, of course!

The F4U Corsair won the war!!!

http://www.x-plane.org/users/aonyn/Screenshots/Leisure_Chair_Aerobat_reduced_square.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 05:42 PM
I know it was actually more likely the Spitfire, but I am still biased to the corsair. There is something about that inverted gull wing.

The F4U Corsair won the war!!!

http://www.x-plane.org/users/aonyn/Screenshots/Leisure_Chair_Aerobat_reduced_square.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 05:47 PM
To field some more german planes:

The BF110 was outstanding until the american single engined fighters appeared at the front and russia overcame its aircraft production problems.

And the Ta152! This one really kicked ***. But it came too late in the war to make a difference.

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 05:49 PM
america -P-51
britian- spitfire
japan-zero
germany-109
russia-yak
what more needs to be said


<center>I know my name is spelled wrong

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 06:06 PM
The 110 was a piece of $HIT!!! It couldn't do anything well that's why they made it a night fighter going after bombers.

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 06:11 PM
where it was very successfull j00 tr0ll. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

---------------------------------------



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under 30k?

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 06:22 PM
Ecco lulitma caccia!!!!!

http://utenti.lycos.it/AEREOFAN/images/saetta.jpg

caccia buon!

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XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 06:25 PM
i'd say the mustang was the most famous, at least in the u.s. my reason is that it's the only wwII plane i knew of as a kid, so it's not the best reasoning but gimme a break /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 06:27 PM
As a kid I never heard of the P-51.
The only planes I was told about accidentally were the Spitfire, Stuka and the Zero...the rest phhhhh /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif !

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 07:02 PM
"Wildcat"

Remenber while i was a kid, i saw the movie (black n white tv) call "bra-bra black sheep" (if not wrong)

Lt.Davis

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**Speed is the KEY**

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 07:17 PM
Bf-109
P-51
Spitfire
Zero

Stuka very recognizable to the unwashed masses, but not a fighter(as stated in original post).


http://home.comcast.net/~wolfrum_5.jg52/WOLF1.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 07:20 PM
Baa Baa Blacksheep was a tv series about Pappy Boyington and the aircraft was a Corsair.

http://utenti.lycos.it/AEREOFAN/images/saetta.jpg

caccia buon!

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XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 07:26 PM
mike_espo wrote:
- Baa Baa Blacksheep was a tv series about Pappy
- Boyington and the aircraft was a Corsair.

Agreed. Also the B-29 deserves a place, because the Enola Gay of course.

"Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty but the pig enjoys it!"

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 07:49 PM
Strange that nobody has mentioned the P40 yet. Remember this guy from that movie 1941.
http://victoryatseaonline.com/war/ww2/1941/1941-d.jpg
Since I saw that movie every time I think about WW2 aircraft, the P40 comes to mind. Right after the spit that is./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 08:11 PM
Without a doubt, I'd have to say the Spitfire, Stuka and P-51. Spitfire is very well known, the P-51 just *slightly* less so, and the Stuka is just plain famous.

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 08:17 PM
famous (adjective): 1. widely known

Some people around here seem to have some serious vocabulary problems.

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 08:18 PM
johnnyJohnson_ wrote:
europe=BOB
- america=Midway .The truth could be argues either way
- on both ,however the idea that Midwy is famous in
- Europe just doesnt hold water .that battle is not
- common knowledge even though it was a great

Be careful johnny, don't judge what's common knowledge by what is posted here. Remember, we are all to some extent history buffs. Grab a random person off the street and I'll bet you'll find that they can't name ANY battle fought during WWII.



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"Altitude, speed, maneuver, fire!"-The "formula of Terror" of Aleksandr Pokryshkin, Three times awarded the rank of Hero of the Soviet Union

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 08:19 PM
HEY! Forget the Stuka it's not a fighter...the question was only for fighters....if you want bombers then the most famous was Enola Gay .... Just one plane that dropped the first A bomb.....followed likey by Memphis Belle... these are the only two aircraft I know of that have movies made about a particular WW2 aircraft rather than a type.

"Nothing difficult is ever easy"

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 08:22 PM
Has to be the Corsair because it was the only TV show to have a WW2 plane.

Whatever that TV show with the cool guy from the Wild, Wild West where they were flying the F4U's.

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<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 09:04 PM
To us Greeks it's certainly the Stuka.
It did a lot of work in the Balkans.
My mother can still remember the sound of its sirens when they bombed her native town.
In fact the Germans had set up a command post in our house in Lamia since it was large and a small number of soldiers resided there, and placed an 88mm on the balkony for AA work.
It damaged the house from the vibration but it still held pretty well as it is made of stone.
She can still remember the German ham.
She probably would have starved to death like the rest if some German soldiers didn't give her food.
Crappy times.


<center>http://users.compulink.gr/ilusin@e-free.gr/bf109[2)1.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 09:10 PM
The Spitfire is most famous for its ugliness. Like all british fighters, Ever, it excells in cuty ugliness, the way only the british can master. Butterfly wings, oh dear.



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veiting foor p¤ts

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 09:18 PM
The Messerschmitt 109, of course.

Not only was it the main chariot of our brothers in arms, it was used by Finland as well. And in the last sad and regretful episode of the sad sequence of events known as WW2 it was the main single seat fighter of our only enemy.

It was used by Spain, which did not take part in WW2.
It was used by the newfound Israel.
It was used by nearly every nation that fell into soviet hands (and thus, into oblivion, for a long time. If anticommunism had a face, it would be Werre.).

It's a beauty to look at, it was excellent in its primary role, it was versatile.

It was fast, it was deadly. It was... outnumbered. It was... the workhorse of the Luftwaffe.

Sorry Lucasarts.


http://sivusto.servepics.com/~lahnat/werre2s.jpg

veiting foor p¤ts

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 09:41 PM
"The Spitfire is most famous for its ugliness. Like all british fighters, Ever, it excells in cuty ugliness, the way only the british can master. Butterfly wings, oh dear."

Asshat.



Lixma,

Blitzpig.

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 10:19 PM
Spitfire

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 10:28 PM
Spit is cool but it's not the most famous. Read the title of the post guys.

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 12:22 AM
If you asked 100 people randomly in every country that took part in WWII and added up the answers I'm sure Spitfire and Messerschmitt would be up at the top.

The Europeans would top the tables with the answers as they were the people who would most likely hear the names of WWII fighters, I doubt that American audiences would be as exposed to the names of aircraft as those that reside in Europe. The War is still a large topic in Europe and had a larger affect on the people here.

You are more likely to have heard of stories of a BF 109 buzzing over your town/city in Europe than about a Mustang on a mission over your home in America. I don't mean to anger anyone but I could imagine if I did a random survey in America, Britain, Russia, Germany, Japan, France, Canada etc. I would expect to get a lot of "I don't know" replies from Americans if I asked them "What is the most famous fighter of WWII" I would perhaps also expect the same from the Japanese as I feel they just want to get on with things and don't dwell much on those times. Just my opinion though /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Also a lot of action in the Pacific theatre took place in the large expanses of ocean and would therefore not have as much of an impact on local populations.

And finally I'm afraid Soviet planes would score very low as the average person in the West thinks the USA and Britain won the war, they might tell you MiG as they only know that name from post war times, and remember each country gets 100 votes.

The Spitfire would undoubtedly win as 90 British people would vote for it and there would be very few "I don't know" answers as the British have an almost unhealthy obsession with WWII and are therefore better informed. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif Don't forget Poles, French, Czechs, etc. flew from Britain in WWII and BoB and that Britain had a lot of service men coming from all over the world to fight for the Empire.







Message Edited on 08/07/0312:27AM by Xnomad

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 02:35 AM
A.K.Davis wrote:
-
- 2. "lets face it the USA was never going to loose
-- that war ,where as Germany could have won the war." I suppose you don't see the fallacy in that statement...
-
-

Honestly, why?. Germany could have won if they did things differently, like liberating Russia from Stalin instead of conquering it by force. They would then had access to enourmous resources and a serious chance of winning.

Another "what if" is England. If Germany had continued attacking airfields (instead of cities) and subsequently managed to invade England, America would have been denied the use of the UK as a springboard to invade Europe. This would have at least prolonged the war.

How about the Ploesti oil field raid? If the Americans had failed, Germany would not have suffered the lack of fuel that they did.

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 03:46 AM
the most famous in correct order of famosity anywhere in the world. 1= P-51 Mustang, 2= Spitfire, 3=ME109,4= Zero. thats it and in the correct order of famousosity

www.fighterjocks.net (http://www.fighterjocks.net) home of the 11 time Champions Team AFJ. 6 Years Flying http://www.world-data-systems.com/aerofiles/albums/userpics/p47-22.jpg 47|FC=

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 05:44 AM
It would depend on where you canvassed. Keep in mind that in many places outside of the US, most think that a Mustang is a car. There's very few planes that actually made their way into the common parlance of many nations. The Spitfire was one of them that was broadcast as a national symbol of resistance and Western pride throughout the war.

In the US, you're going to get a mixed bag. Those WWII enthousiasts will doubtlessly name the Mustang, Hellcat, Corsair, Thunderbolt and Lightning. You'll probably see the Mustang come out on top, though. From the laymen? Well, if they can name a plane at all, it's most likely going to be either a Mustang, Messerschmitt (if they can pronounce it!), Zero, or a Spitfire.

Odds are, the Spitfire would surprise many. You're asking them the most famous plane...

In Canada, you'll find a lot of the same as in the 'States, but with more of a British lean. Some might know enough to name a US plane. Others might know a German make or two. Still, the Spitfire remains very well known in this country. It's still rather easily named.

I cannot speak for the rest of the world. Britain will no doubt name the plane that was creditted with saving its nation during the Battle of Britain. Who knows what the other countries would claim? Odds are though, it's really only going to be a handful that name a US plane. Additionally, there's no one American plane that defined that country's role in the war as did the Zero for the Japanese, the BF-109 for the Germans or the Spitfire for the British. That's probably why the Yank brand of airplane would lose out in this competition.

Subtlety is reserved for planes with small guns.

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 06:02 AM
This plane /i/smilies/16x16_man-very-happy.gif



http://sunstarentertainment.maddsites.com/images/1asigh.gif


Message Edited on 08/06/0310:02PM by Hauptman99

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 06:43 AM
Problem with america is we fought two sides at once, we had alot of different planes. Europe wasnt our war really, it was personal in the Pacific due to Pearl Harbor. I must say though ME-109 is a class act fighter and I think since it fought against so many different countrys it would be the most known.

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 07:22 AM
the problem with america is she fought two sides at once ?

germany fought on many fronts as did Britian europe,pacific,africa,mediterainian,middle east

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 11:02 AM
We all know that the most Famouse fighter was the Spitfire Guys,
Not because it had any sort of advantage over other fighters the Zero could beat it in a turn fight at all altitudes and had 4 times the Spitfires range.

In 20th Century War Fare the Spitfire stands out because of the Conflict it was invloved in over Britain, in 1940.

It got publicity globaly for that reason alone,

When Winston Churchill made his statement

Never in the field of Human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few, the publicity machine was still rolling in full swing.

The reality was , Hitlers attitude in the matter not the capability of any particular aircraft.

If the Germans had originaly planned to invade England as part of their push West, they would have kept right on comming at Dunkirk, the German U Boat Wolf packs would have decimated the British Navy well before the narrow confines of the channel.

The English and the French got in the way of Hitlers plan to invade Russia after he secured Poland, by honoring their treaty with Poland so France had to be dealt with, as she was a land nieghbour on continental Europe.

Hitlers attitude towards England, to use his own words, before the Plublicity war of the Battle of Britain actualy started

England in not our natural enemy!

Yes the Spitfire is the most publicised Aircraft of WW II, you know the Heroic stand of defiance and all that sort of stuff.
While Hitler massed his armies in the East

Great propaganda for the allies, usefull deception for Hitler.

Its all history now anyway.

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 11:04 AM
In the USA, I reckon it would be a close thing between the Mustang and the Spitfire, with the Mustang possibly just a shade in front.

Throughout almost all the rest of the English Speaking World, the Spitfire would unquestionably be the most famous. This would include Canada, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa, as well as the UK.

It would also be reasonable to expect the Spitfire would be No. 1 in other nations that are, or once were, part of the British Empire/Commonwealth. These would include India, Pakistan, some African nations and Burma.

Of all the Axis fighters, only two could possibly compete fame-wise, and they would of course be the Bf 109 and the Zero.

As for Soviet types, no doubt the Yaks and Lavochkins are suitably well remembered in Russia and former 'Eastern Bloc' countries. Unfortunately, they are almost unknown to the popular Western mind.

Best regards to all,
panther3485

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 11:23 AM
Cool skin, Herr Hauptmann. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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Vezérünk a Bátorság, K*sérµnk a Szerencse!
(Courage leads, Luck escorts us! - Historical motto of the 101st Puma Fighter Regiment)

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XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 11:31 AM
As a kid it was the Corsair (yeah ba,ba,blacksheep), P40 Warhawk (because of the painted face) and the zero.

Now I would say, Mustang, Spitfire, Stuka, Zero.

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 02:32 PM
Hi guys!

The thing is, try to stay on topic!

The question was "...what is most famous fighter of WW2?"

I think I managed to resist the urge to refute some of the nonsense that has appeared on this thread! But it took nearly all the willpower I had!

I must be strong.....I must not be sucked in.....I must be strong.....I must not be sucked in.....

(Confession: I'm hoping someone else will do it!)

Best regards to all,
and it's all in the best possible spirit!

panther3485

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 02:49 PM
I'd love to see how many random people from anywhere could identify correctly the above metioned AC...

Fame vs recognition

CC

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 05:07 PM
the BF109 K-4.....with the 108 gunpods....its good!!

Canada 5 VS. USA 3

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 05:22 PM
The nationality bias is obvious here but I would say the Stuka. I'm no German but one or two "right" decisions on producing a long range bomber and WWII, at the least, would have lasted much longer.

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 05:25 PM
EyesPink - YES, those gunpods are tremendous! My personal favorite

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 05:31 PM
Most famous WW2 fighter ? Tough question really.
There were quite a few of them and not just one.

Messerschmitt Bf-109 series
North American P-51 Mustang
Supermarine Spitfire series
Yakovlev "Yak" series
A6M "Zero"


These were all equally famous, legendary, "classic" fighters.

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 06:46 PM
"Fame" is a function of information and publicity, not ability or importance. Since the Allies won the war and, at least until the past 10 years, the Russians were secretive about their planes, there can be only one fighter to consider in this category the...SUPERMARINE SPITFIRE. Spitfires won the BOB, served all over the world in almost every Allied airforce, and exemplified the British War effort more than any other plane. IMHO the Spit was also the most beautiful plane ever built. In a way there were too many US fighter types for any one to be labelled the most "famous" of the whole lot, although I'd probably consider the P-51 if I had to pick. Perhaps had the other side won the war, there would be a good case for either the Messerschmitt Bf-109 or Zero, since they lost, neither plane gets the worldwide publicity that either the Spit of Mustang have. It also helps that there are a lot of Spits and Mustangs still flying at airshows and in Hollywood flicks..for a lot of average people, they might be the only actual WW2 fighter they ever see in "real" life.

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 07:14 PM
Xnomad wrote:
- And finally I'm afraid Soviet planes would score
- very low as the average person in the West thinks
- the USA and Britain won the war, they might tell you
- MiG as they only know that name from post war times,
- and remember each country gets 100 votes.
-
-
- Message Edited on 08/07/03s12:27AM by Xnomad

Westerners who think that US and Britain won the war need to take history class again. Out of 50 million people that died in WW2 20 million were citizens of the Soviet Union, mostely Ukrainains, Russians, and Belorussians. If US and Britain won the war why in the world the red flag was flying over Berlin in May of 1945?!!! Millions of soviet soldier died liberating Poland, Hungary, Bolgaria ... almost half a million (400,000 to be exact) died in Berlin, just in one battle for Berlin.

not trying to offend anybody, but COMEON!

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 07:13 PM
Sokol CCCP

What you are saying is essentially correct - but the problem is, the Soviet contribution to the winning of WW2 has always been under-publicised in the West.

Just another area where popular perceptions and reality have never met.

Any suggestions as to what can be done, to better inform 'Joe Public'? Should we try? Does anyone (outside of the enthusiast cadre) actually care?

Food for thought, at least!

Best regards,
panther3485

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 07:18 PM
i think it depends where your from. and every country has there own to say about what the most famous fighter or was.

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 07:44 PM
Sokol_CCCP wrote:
-
- Westerners who think that US and Britain won the war
- need to take history class again.

The only thing we can be sure of is Germany lost the war. All allies contributed to the victory contrary to Eastern beliefs that they won it by themselves-

-not trying to offend anybody, but COMEON!



"We make war that we may live in peace."

Aristotle

Oh yeah , who won the Cold war?

Message Edited on 08/08/0306:46PM by rhett69

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 08:11 PM
*wiggle wiggle* What no takers!??

"We make war that we may live in peace."

Aristotle

Message Edited on 08/08/0307:12PM by rhett69

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 09:27 PM
I couldn't decide whether this was an interesting topic or just plain silly. But, instead of whining or pining about the FB patch, I thought I'd take a stab at this topic.

As several have already pointed out, the meaning of 'famous' is intangible and relative, and therefore, not easy to quantify, particulary for people of different cultures. And, as already stated, the 'winners' of WW2 definitely probably have the advantage with fame.

As a Westerner (US), I'd have to go with a plane that has strong name recognition. Therefore, I too would have to pick the British Spitfire as Numero Uno of the WW2 fighters. This is not only due to it's uniquely well-known name, but also to it's classy good looks, and it's beginning to end presence in virtually all theaters of WW2. Next, I'd pick the Japanese Zero for the huge early war impression it made in the western media as the Axis', almost mystical, fighter-to-beat. After that, I'd choose the somewhat over-popular and overly familiar U.S. Mustang because of it's prevalence in so much of the post-war media and in so many post-war air events. Finally, since the Germans didn't end up with popular proper noun names for their airplanes, I'd actually pick the Me-262. I wish I could pick the Stuka as the most famous because of it's infamous terror recognition. But, since the Stuka is technically not a fighter and the 'Bf/Me-109' doesn't quite have enough 'average Joe' name reconition, the Me-262 may be the most famous German fighter as it is continually the subject of those ever-fascinating 'what if' documentaries about the final outcome of the war.

The Russians, unfortunately, lose out on the name fame game oweing to the cold war's resultant lack of information exchange about WW2 Soviet equipment and battle events.

And that is exactly why we're playing called IL-2 'Sturmovik'. The Russians clearly have some catching up to do in the Western air war psyche and Oleg Maddox, wisely, has chosen to name this excellent flight sim after one of their very best. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

- EKat

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 09:49 PM
P40 its what I remember from a young age. Maybe not the name, but the silohette.


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"The future battle on the ground will be preceded by battle in the air. This will determine which of the contestants has to suffer operational and tactical disadvantages and be forced throughout the battle into adoption compromise solutions." --Erwin Rommel

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--NJG26_Killa--

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 09:50 PM
Any of the three in my sig Dave /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 11:10 PM
sasKuach wrote:
-
- A.K.Davis wrote:
--
-- 2. "lets face it the USA was never going to loose
--- that war ,where as Germany could have won the war." I suppose you don't see the fallacy in that statement...
--
--
-
- Honestly, why?. Germany could have won if they did
- things differently, like liberating Russia from
- Stalin instead of conquering it by force. They would
- then had access to enourmous resources and a serious
- chance of winning.
-
- Another "what if" is England. If Germany had
- continued attacking airfields (instead of cities)
- and subsequently managed to invade England, America
- would have been denied the use of the UK as a
- springboard to invade Europe. This would have at
- least prolonged the war.
-
- How about the Ploesti oil field raid? If the
- Americans had failed, Germany would not have
- suffered the lack of fuel that they did.
-
-

1. quote: "USA was never going to lose that war"

2. quote: "whereas Germany could have won the war"

How can the certainty that the U.S. would win the war coexist with the possibility of Germany winning the war? Either the U.S. wins and Germany loses, or Germany wins and the U.S. loses. And please don't give me any b.s. about "if only Hitler hadn't declared war against the U.S., etc., etc..." The "Europe first" strategy was not a result of Hitler's declaration of war.

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 11:40 PM
Dumb post, everyone knows it's the CAC Boomerang.

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XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 12:25 AM
From June through to September 1940, the whole World was aware of what was happening over the Skys in Britain.

No single Aircraft can be given that much publicity with out ending up in the number one spot guys.
Every Country was aware of the conflict even those that never ended up being involved in the War, knew what was going on in the skys over Britain.

You have to be carefull when looking at History objectivly, because the winner of Wars gets to name battles even.

When you actualy look at what was going on at the time, why would Hitler wish to invade Poland if he intended to invade France and England.

Doh! wrong direction guys, Russia was on the German agenda right from the start.
France had to be dealt with she was a Genuine Military threat to Germanys rear.
There was no contingancy plan to invade England at all!
The caucasause Oil Fields that Germany needed to wage a sustained war where in the East in Russia not in Britain.

Anyhow as a result of Germany being forced to deal with France, the Spitfire ended up getting Publicity Globaly, because of the situation it found itself fighting in.

Never mind that the largest offensive army force in Human history was begining to gather in the East.
The Russians did not see that one comming for sure, and when you think about is it any wonder, with everybody thinking England was the Agenda.

When you look at numbers of troop movements as opposed to aircraft Battles, the Battle of Britain was the largest Military Feint ever, as it turns out to go with the largest Army offensive in History in the East.

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 01:35 AM
If you ask people around the world ,
I think the most commmon answers will be,
(in this order)


SPITFIRE

MUSTANG

STUKA

this is what ordinary people have heard most of.

<ceter>http://www.daveswarbirds.com/glennill/images/p-63.jpg </center>
BECOME A KING WHINER

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 01:45 AM
Id have to say the spitfire. Some of the other planes may be famous- or more famous- in certain countries but they all know the spitty.

B-17 is very recognizable too. But its not a fighter.

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 03:05 AM
109, I knew it by name and look when I was three.

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 03:24 AM
It is more a matter of what country you're from and what type aircraft you're thinking about.

If we're discussing fighters, the P-51 in America. the Spit in England, the 109 in Germany. The one country with a for sure WW2 favorite is probably the IL2 in Russia.

Jes' for fun, but it really doesn't mean a thing at this point, now does it. All arguments should be viewed suspiciously. LOL

------------ /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:37 AM
I would have to say Spitfire, Mustang and Hurricane are the most famous as technically they won. Maybe also the B-17 as I think every one has heard of the 8th air force.

Bf 109 and 190s and those sorts were excellent a/c, but they lost and were on the "enemy" side. Of German a/c, I'd say the most famous should be the Me-262 and possibly one of the most famous of modern times just like the wright flyer.

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:46 AM
lol the thing about thatthough is this. lets say germany was still going strong and assualted the usa. not only would it be extremely hard to get troops on U.S soil from that distance,especialy with the military and industry the way it was at the time in the usa. not only that, germany would only risk attacking the U.S. if the war in europe was pretty much won, it would be suicide otherwise. secondly so late in the war that since the atom bomb was finishe dright after germany lost, we would finish the bomb with in that engagement, and it would have been used against germany as well. so pretty much, when it came to the usa losing, i have to agree, the U.S. was quite far from losing. though germany wining in europe however, was extremely close.

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 10:06 AM
109 easy

The 109 has more kills to its credit than any other plane in history ever...

Also more were produced than any other AC, very versatile and adaptable, used in every theatre of WW2, prefered by alot of pilots to newer planes in the right hands deadly and unbeatable as was proven.......

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 10:35 AM
they used the P-40 in a tv based movie..DEATH RACE...and
State OF Division it has 2 names ..

A Nazi tank chases a crippled American fighter plane across the desert during World War II

Lloyd Bridges as the german tank commander

Doug McClure as the p-40 pilot


cool show im still trying to find it

www.celebhost.net/dougmcclure/ (http://www.celebhost.net/dougmcclure/) movies3.html
but for ww2 movies ..the p51 is the most known

Chin up ..HUTCH

http://www.il2skins.com/skins/thumbs/164-bluebottomgirl.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 10:36 AM
if anyone has it let me know ......

write me at

hutch@fragnetgaming.com

Chin up ..HUTCH

http://www.il2skins.com/skins/thumbs/164-bluebottomgirl.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 12:03 PM
Heh, no offence, but I never understood why people from Western europe/USA consider Spitfire that beautiful.. and dont forget the Hurricane in BOB,, which had greater impact on the war, than Spitfire.. Sure it was the first British plane, that could effectivily confront BF-109, but still.. and dont' for that Spitfire was still inferior to the Butcherbird /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif



For American planes: P-51, P-47, Corsair, P-38

For Britain: Spitfire (Hurricane)

For Germany: BF-109, FW-190, Stuka

For Russia: Yaks, Lavochkins, Sturmovik

For the Japs: Zero /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

For the Finns: Brewster, BF-109

For Romania: IAR

And so on..




____________________________________



Official Sig:



<center>http://koti.mbnet.fi/vipez/shots/Vipez4.jpg </center>

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 03:57 PM
when i say loose that war i mean war in that theatre
( pacific)

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 04:01 PM
johnnyJohnson_ wrote:
-
lets face it the USA was never going to loose
- that war ,where as Germany could have won the war .
-
-

If Germany wins, doesn't that mean America loses?

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:19 PM
Hi guys!

Somebody posted that the Bf 109 was produced in greater numbers than any other aircraft. Almost correct!

I have found among my sources the following figures for the 'top 20' of military aircraft production up to the end of WW2:

*Ilyushin Il-2 Sturmovik - 36,163

*Messerschmitt Bf 109 - 34,700 (approx)

*Polikarpov U-2/Po-2 'Kukuruznik' - 30,000 (approx)

*Yakovlev Yak-1/3/7/9 - 29,620 (approx, excluding 9U)

*Supermarine Spitfire/Seafire - 21,990 (approx)

*Lavochkin LaGG-3/La-5/La-7 - 21,389

*Focke-Wulf Fw 190 'Wurger' - 20,000 (approx)

*Consolidated B-24 Liberator - 18,482

*AT-6 Texan/Harvard - 17,719

*Junkers Ju 88/188 - 16,080

*Republic P-47 Thunderbolt - 15,000 (approx)

*Curtiss P-36/Hawk 75/P-40 Warhawk - 14,802

*North American A-36/P-51 Mustang - 14,800 (approx)

*Hawker Hurricane - 14,449

*Waco CG-4 Hadrian - 13,910

*Douglas C-47 Skytrain/Dakota - 13,650

*Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress - 12,731

*Arado Ar 96 - 11,546

*Vultee BT-13/15/SNV Valiant - 11,525

*Grumman F6F Hellcat - 11,500 (approx)



NOTES:

Post-hostilities production not counted.

Cases of 'essentially the same airframe but different engine', where classified separately in many sources, have been combined here.


Hope this is of some interest!


Best regards to all,
panther3485

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:30 PM
States = P-38 (First plane to counter the zero problem not a great turner but Zoom and Boom cause zero's to have trouble) P-47, P-51, P-61 , F6F Hellcat, B-17, F4F-wildcat

Britain - Spifire , Mosquito , Lancaster, Stirlings, Hurricans,

Russian - all Yak's , All La's, il-2

Germany - 109 series , 190 series, He-111 , Ju-88, Me-110, Me-410

Japan- zero's (A6m2 to A6m7 and A6m8), Ki-61, Val, B5n Kate, B6n Jill, N1k2 , N1k1, Ki-45, Ki-44, Ki-100, Ki-84, Ki-43, Betty

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 06:05 PM
Ask the morons I went to school with and they'll say either the F-15, or the Red Baron's plane ('coz they don't know what it's called)


SSgt Tim Schuster
8MXS Inspection Section
Kunsan AB, Korea

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