PDA

View Full Version : bf-109k



XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 04:43 PM
I read an account of an old luftwaffe pilot saying that if one pushed the throttle all the way forward on the k during final approach during landing, he would lose control and crash because of the engine torque, is this modeled in fb?

thanks

http://www.compsoc.man.ac.uk/~wingman/pics/g50bis_2.jpg

caccia buon

<center>http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/images/mash_henry_blake.jpg (http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/)</center>

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 04:43 PM
I read an account of an old luftwaffe pilot saying that if one pushed the throttle all the way forward on the k during final approach during landing, he would lose control and crash because of the engine torque, is this modeled in fb?

thanks

http://www.compsoc.man.ac.uk/~wingman/pics/g50bis_2.jpg

caccia buon

<center>http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/images/mash_henry_blake.jpg (http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/)</center>

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 04:48 PM
Try it and see../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/anderson3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 04:51 PM
waiting for the patch, most are saying that its good to wait

http://www.compsoc.man.ac.uk/~wingman/pics/g50bis_2.jpg

caccia buon

<center>http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/images/mash_henry_blake.jpg (http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/)</center>

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 04:54 PM
Torque is modeled before, and after patch.

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/anderson3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 04:56 PM
Yes its modeled and yes you could get spanked by the torque but its not too bad if you expect it/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<center>http://www.km011a0004.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/poser3.jpg <CENTER>
<center><b/><table style="filter:glow[color=#FF0000,strength=4)"><TD><font color="#1A0000"face="americanabt">Laughing helps<font></table></center>

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 05:06 PM
kool i wanna try that

http://www.world-data-systems.com/aerofiles/albums/userpics/hurricane_01sm~0.JPG
We have whiners about the patch, then whiners whining about the whiners about the patch.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 05:44 PM
It´s not the 109K only... every late war 2000HP engine has a lot of torque.. take a look to the Spit with the double-propeller - it should eleminate torque influence, don´t know if it worked or if it reduce the performance..

JG53 PikAs Abbuzze
I./Gruppe

http://www.jg53-pikas.de/
http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/Ani_pikasbanner_langsam.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 07:59 PM
mike_espo wrote:
- I read an account of an old luftwaffe pilot saying
- that if one pushed the throttle all the way forward
- on the k during final approach during landing, he
- would lose control and crash because of the engine
- torque, is this modeled in fb?
-
- thanks
-

Torque is very much undermodelled for all planes IMHO during takeoff, it should cause a very considerable swing during the takeoff run, especially with high powered, narrow landing gear planes, like the 109, Spit . Torque forces were very great by late war with 2000 HP engines around, even when airborne. I have read Mustang pilot`s memeoir somewhere, he flew in Italy, and he told that openening up the throttle quickly rolled his plane UPSIDE DOWN even in the air after taking off... he could barely escape a crash.

http://www.x-plane.org/users/isegrim/FB-desktopweb.jpg
'Only a dead Indianer is a good Indianer!'

Vezérünk a Bátorság, K*sérµnk a Szerencse!
(Courage leads, Luck escorts us! - Historical motto of the 101st Puma Fighter Regiment)

Flight tests and other aviation performance data: http://www.pbase.com/isegrim

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:10 PM
I agree with Isegrim - and torque seemed much stronger in IL-2 than in FB.

JG5_UnKle

"Know and use all the capabilities of your airplane. If you don't sooner or later, somebody who does, will kick your ***"


http://homepage.ntlworld.com/victoria.stevens/jg5_logo.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-25-2003, 08:00 AM
RE : Torque in FB (its a joke)
copying & pasting here from another person :

On the takeoff roll, the prop engine aircraft in FB tend to drop a wing (yet they roll pretty straight on - if you keep the wings level with aileron, you do not need any rudder input at all).

Well.. any power pilot know that this does not happen in real-life aicraft. Period. In real life aircraft experience YAW, not ROLL due to engine torque on the takeoff run (especially the tail draggers).
I have the impression that this roll tendency is meant to simulate some kind of engine torque - but if so, why does it disappear imediately once lift off?

Even worse - if you look closely, you will see the same roll tendency even in the 262 (whose engine failure behaviour is simply a bad joke, but fortunately halfways corrected in the patch. The patch beta 5 that I have introduced a different really bad bug... let's wait if this can be worked out till release).



Switch off one engine in a He-111 - apply full power on the remaining engine... and try to find ANY yaw tendency. You won't find any. Because it is simply not modelled. You want a challenge? Switch off the 2 engines on the wing of a TB3... again not the slightest yaw....!???????



Fly an aircraft really slow at full power. You do not need ANY rudder to keep it straight, and only some very minor corrections with the aileron to keep the wings level (the roll stability goes down the slower you fly - in real life this simply does not happen. Should this simulate engine torque in FB?). If you stall it from very slow speed out of a very steep climb, any aircraft in FB will lower the nose gently, having no more than 20-30 kp/h on top of the arc. Nice move - some kind of hammerhead-autopilot. Absolutely NO influence of engine torque. None. You simply cannot stall.

Of course people might argue now that prop torque is there in FB... but I ask where?
If I apply full power from idle at very low speed, I expect the engine torque to throw my aircraft into a snap roll, followed by a spin (this speed was 130 mph for the P-51D, for example). In FB the plane yaws a bit... and yaws back till the ball is centered again. It needs absolutely no rudder or aileron input to keep it level.


correct torque effects are not moddeled in FB is the edit of this part of this post which i copied from

XyZspineZyX
07-25-2003, 08:14 AM
Torque is obviously toned down in FB from Il2. Just start up a G6as in both games and see the difference.

I subscribe to the theory that the minimal torque reaction in FB is, like the very tame stall/spin behaviour, an effort to make the game more attractive to the "yank and bank" arcade brigade who buy the MS products in droves. its basically what soem posters called the "dumbing down" of Fb when it was forst released.

XyZspineZyX
07-25-2003, 08:41 AM
In my first ever flight (i went right into full real, i hate arcade) in IL2 I chose a late 109, not sure which but I remember the feel of it.. Plane starts twisting on the runway and combined with the bouncing it was a huge thrill. Maybe getting used to it has some effect also but it seems fb planes are more tame in just about everything. I liked the raw power-feel.