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XyZspineZyX
06-16-2003, 11:11 PM
1st take a look at the picture... It´s a IIb with 8x 0.303 I see the flashes when a 0.303 bullet hit the 109, so what kind of Ammo did the RAF use.. the only ammonition which create such a flashes is cannonamo with at least 20mm.
Its surly nice to see, if you hit the target, but is is realistic?!?

http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/bilder/303Hurri.jpg


Next few things are probably known bugs..
The Hurri is the only plane with an increase of turbocharger boost when you switch mixture 100% to 120% (allready known I think)

What is "Forzah" in the Hurricane IIb ?!? The only WEP with this early RR engines should be the standart 110% And I heard (this is probalbly wrong, I have to admit) that the early RR only could be overboosted for a very(!!) short time I heard things like 20 sec to half a minute before you getting in serious troubles- don´t flame me.. I read it once, not sure if it is a tale... think it should work longer- not as long as in FB /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

The Special carburator which was used by Spits and Hurris, I heard that it was a kind of double carburator one of them was inverted? and/or there was a small membrane which didn´t let the fuel floating "backwards" who knows more??

A last question- I think this construction should work at positve and negative g-forces... BUT at 0g if you performe a Parable flight?? Have no idea what should prevent the engine from cutting of...

JG53 PikAs Abbuzze
I./Gruppe

http://www.jg53-pikas.de/
http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/pikasbanner.jpg


Message Edited on 06/17/03 12:16AM by Abbuzze

Message Edited on 06/17/0312:34AM by Abbuzze

XyZspineZyX
06-16-2003, 11:11 PM
1st take a look at the picture... It´s a IIb with 8x 0.303 I see the flashes when a 0.303 bullet hit the 109, so what kind of Ammo did the RAF use.. the only ammonition which create such a flashes is cannonamo with at least 20mm.
Its surly nice to see, if you hit the target, but is is realistic?!?

http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/bilder/303Hurri.jpg


Next few things are probably known bugs..
The Hurri is the only plane with an increase of turbocharger boost when you switch mixture 100% to 120% (allready known I think)

What is "Forzah" in the Hurricane IIb ?!? The only WEP with this early RR engines should be the standart 110% And I heard (this is probalbly wrong, I have to admit) that the early RR only could be overboosted for a very(!!) short time I heard things like 20 sec to half a minute before you getting in serious troubles- don´t flame me.. I read it once, not sure if it is a tale... think it should work longer- not as long as in FB /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

The Special carburator which was used by Spits and Hurris, I heard that it was a kind of double carburator one of them was inverted? and/or there was a small membrane which didn´t let the fuel floating "backwards" who knows more??

A last question- I think this construction should work at positve and negative g-forces... BUT at 0g if you performe a Parable flight?? Have no idea what should prevent the engine from cutting of...

JG53 PikAs Abbuzze
I./Gruppe

http://www.jg53-pikas.de/
http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/pikasbanner.jpg


Message Edited on 06/17/03 12:16AM by Abbuzze

Message Edited on 06/17/0312:34AM by Abbuzze

XyZspineZyX
06-16-2003, 11:28 PM
All i know is that i try to avoid hurries online except i have really high speed advantage. they turn like maniacs, don't loose too much speed when they do, don't stall, and their guns are way too strong in my opinion. They often shoot from 500 meters away just filling the air with metal and one or 2 bullets are usually enough to destroy half of the controls in a 109. i don't know any technical data of hurries so it's just my personal opinion but compared to other planes in the sim they have a really insane FM and ammo.

http://www.just-pooh.com/images/eten.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:07 AM
I am not very documentedabut all that, and what I say may be wrong.
First of all, the IIb has 10* 0.303.
Second, "Forzath" is also called in Romanian and Russian "Fortzaj", and it means, logically an increases of the engine speed, produced by different methods.
I do not know many detailes abut Hurry engines, but all I know is that a Mk IIb can dogfight with 4 P-40 aces(I did it).
Indeed in multyplayer it's better to avoid them.
During the Battle of Britain, the Hurry's was inferior to 109's in terms of speed, but at high altitudes.
About the ammo, I read that a Hurry, "could transform any german plane in a "bunch of holes", but a flying one".
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:11 AM
Bullet splash on a target can be caused by the powder in a tracer exploding on impact. If the rounds were incendiary then you would also get a puff and splash mark.

Just enjoy it it is only a game so don't worry too much about it!




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Per Ardua Ad Astra

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:25 AM
I fly the Hurri because it is the best plane for me to get kills in (use 120 & WEP) the gunsight is great, no flash, tracers (good for shooting). I shoot under 200, so if a Hurri pilot is shooting from 500, he will be out of ammo quickly. I have never had over 2 kills in one sorti with the Hurri -- not enough ammo. I would not waste a shot over 200. I expect to change planes when the FM gets real.

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:38 AM
ive been flying the 190a9 online lately, and hurris are just cannon fodder for it

just stay above 400 and make swooping passes, blows everything to bits speicially with teh mk103 pods

----------------------------------------

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XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 04:14 AM
the IIc bullets were the type to explode on impact so they are VERY deadly ... the flashes you see can IRL be flammable things getting hit by bullets ... but i digress this is a game so it aint going to be exact , & never will

the WEP on every plane doesnt were out ... only the motors do ... every plane with FORZAH has an everlasting supply of it ... this is a game

quote "they turn like maniacs, don't loose too much speed when they do"
quote : " compared to other planes in the sim they have a really insane FM and ammo.

well IRL they were awesome at turning ... they do bleed E especially when looping but they are overmoddled a bit cause they will stall , you can do it easy if you try , but they resist stalling more than they should
the AMMO of the IIc is very deadly ammo & the Hurricane was a stable plane so it makes for a good shooting platform making it eaiser to be accurate

the Hurricane was the creme of the british fighters... was better at turning than the Spit

ive taken wings off at 500 & got hits at 700 + in the Hurri .
for me im sure the computer cant accuratly & perfectly have all bullets going correctly ... in every plane ive gotten kills with few hits & have loaded planes with hits but they flew on .... the games bugged when it comes to that & also collisions

the most unbelieveable plane in FB IMO is the I-152 ... ive seen it & the I-16 fly for real ... they were slow & had little acceleration ... their climb is unbelieveable in FB as well as their acceleration

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 07:29 AM
The FM is not the question /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I think it will be changed in the patch, BUT why are the 303 MG in the Hurricane, are the only one in the game poducing such flashes? - Remember, other planes like the P39 have the same MGs (only 4 of them) but did you ever saw such a flash?

JG53 PikAs Abbuzze
I./Gruppe

http://www.jg53-pikas.de/
http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/pikasbanner.jpg

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 07:46 AM
-BUT why are the 303 MG in the Hurricane,
- are the only one in the game poducing such flashes?
- - Remember, other planes like the P39 have the same
- MGs (only 4 of them) but did you ever saw such a
- flash?

No, the Hurricane is the only fighter in the game at present which was armed with the .303. (Plus the Blenheim among the AI bombers; almost forgot that one.)

The "view objects" information is wrong; did they repeat the error in FB? I haven't looked. Just something else that didn't get fixed.

The P-39 in fact never mounted .303s, even the export models made for the RAF. The wing guns in the earlier model P-39s were the standard US .30 caliber. Look it up if you don't believe me. I don't know why they got it wrong.

The difference is greater than might appear; the .30 US military round (the same one commercially known as the .30-06) is considerably more powerful than the British .303. I have quite a bit of experience with both rounds; I trained on the .30 M-1 (Garand) rifle in the military, and later on as a civilian I owned a .30 Springfield and a couple of .303 Lee-Enfields. The .30 has a higher muzzle velocity and therefore a flatter trajectory, which makes it a bit better for aerial use.

However, there shouldn't be any visible difference in muzzle flash size; if it's as different as you say, then that's certainly wrong. But hell, the muzzle flashes in FB are ridiculous anyway....

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 08:05 AM
Firstly, the Hurricane IIb was armed with 12x.303 brownings.

The flashes are actually typical of hits by copper jacketed bullets on other metals. You will get a spark due to friction (I know, I've shot at a steel plate with a 9mm) at certain angles you do get sparks.

Also, the British developed ammunition called De Wilde ammunition (I can't remember the cartridge designation, I'll have to get my book on the .303 round out) that was basically designed to be an incendiary round. Many pilots accounts of the BoB will speak of the flashes of the De Wilde ammunition as it struck the opposition.

NewS.

Founder member (currently the only member!) of the Unofficial Hurricane Fan Club.

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 08:11 AM
I believe that British incediary bullets ("de Wilde"?) made a flash on impact. I saw a reference to this in Len Deighton's book on the Battle of Britain where they were used in the .303s of British fighters.

(Edit - didn't notice the previous post saying the same. See this link :
http://freespace.virgin.net/john.dell/spitcom.htm
under armament.

Tony S



Message Edited on 06/17/0307:13AM by aesmith

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 08:22 AM
There was an interesting quote from a German ace about the Spitfire & Hurricane (can't remember which ace). He basically said that it was really bad news if one got into firing position because all of the guns were truly deadly and filled the sky with lead.

Speaking of Hurri's - I was online last night and it was quite a big battle (great fun, about 20 or so of us). My friend and I fly Hurricanes quite a lot and we attacked a TB-3. Both of us unloaded our entire ammo store into the plane, I caused the port-side engine to catch fire and produce thick black smoke. I saw many bullets hit this plane but still it wouldn't go down. Where they that tough?

/m

http://www.world-data-systems.com/lomac/pirhana.jpg

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 08:57 AM
They really need to fix the revi's being centered in both cockpit view choices as well

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Good dogfighters bring ammo home, Great ones don't. (c) Leadspitter


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