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Choctaw111
02-21-2005, 07:27 AM
How realistic is the BoB graphics engine going to be. I found this picture on a French website for an addon for BoB? My French is very weak but that is the idea behind the webiste I think. When I first saw this picture I was taken by it. I immediately wondered if todays computers are capable of producing graphics on this level of realism and if so how close to this can we expect in BoB. I am very eager to see some screenshots of what the terrain and scenery are going to look like and am wondering how far along this is. If anything has been done I would like to see what Oleg has come up with so far. We have seen a few screens of some of the aircraft quite a while ago but have not seen anything in quite some time.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/G1SoloSkyB2_v008_0279c.jpg

IvanoBulo
02-21-2005, 07:47 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
I'm doubt that we will see photorealistic graphics in flight sims next 5-10 years.
As for the graphic engine, Oleg told on Sukhoi.ru forum not a long time ago that there is no graphic engine for BoB yet.

Chuck_Older
02-21-2005, 09:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Choctaw111:
How realistic is the BoB graphics engine going to be. I found this picture on a French website for an addon for BoB? My French is very weak but that is the idea behind the webiste I think. When I first saw this picture I was taken by it. I immediately wondered if todays computers are capable of producing graphics on this level of realism and if so how close to this can we expect in BoB. I am very eager to see some screenshots of what the terrain and scenery are going to look like and am wondering how far along this is. If anything has been done I would like to see what Oleg has come up with so far. We have seen a few screens of some of the aircraft quite a while ago but have not seen anything in quite some time.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/G1SoloSkyB2_v008_0279c.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think what you may have seen is the pics from the Battle of France project- for FB, if I recall

Choctaw111
02-21-2005, 11:11 AM
Yes, Chuck, that is where I got it. For some reason I was just fascinated by this picture. It looks really good and I guess it just had me thinking about what flight sims are going to look like someday. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

Platypus_1.JaVA
02-21-2005, 12:52 PM
I reckon this picture is made by a DUTCH artist, not a french one. And it isn't in any way connected to any of the 1C:Maddox products (unfortunatly http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif)

Scragbat
02-21-2005, 01:03 PM
I really hope photo-real graphics comes sooner and I have high hopes for BoB.

Different style of game I know, but look how far a leap Doom III took. I still can't believe the graphics of that game http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

I hope flight sims can take a similar leap on the systems that we have now.

Dimensionaut_
02-21-2005, 01:19 PM
This is NOT a model for the BoB engine.
It is 3D art made 'just for fun' and placed on the forum, just as an example what one of the Dutch aircraft that might make it in the Battle of France add-on looks like.
If you look close, you can see that the background is an actual photograph.
The model is made of many thousands of poly's so much more then even BoB will have (I refer to Oleg's comments why the FB engine 'only' has some 3500 polys for a model in the discussion in the PF forum).
Visit the artists site to see some more of his work: http://www.luijken.com/

Please do not bother him with questions to model for PF or BoB.
He stated before that modelling for games is not what he likes. He likes to do high poly artwork.

Another note: The Battle of France project is for the BoB engine. The modelling for this project is resting until the BoB standards are known. Until then people are doing a lot of research.
http://battle-of-france-add-on.france-simulation.com/

elephant_il2
02-21-2005, 01:26 PM
Well I 've seen the pics too but it's only a very good montage to demonnstrate the fine 3d model of the Dutch plane (sorry I don't recall the name)and by no means in game screenshot from the new BoB engine.
It would have been http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif if they could go close to that.

PS Serval is right. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

BaldieJr
02-21-2005, 02:07 PM
Things you should google:

SOAR terrain rendering.
SpeedTreeRT

Coupled together, the two would produce astonishing results.

Choctaw111
02-21-2005, 08:04 PM
I checked out that speedtreeRT website and WOW!!!!!!!! I have never seen anything like that before. What kind of system do you need to run that. I would love to see scenery like that in a flight sim. That would be beyond my wildest dreams even though I knew that it would someday be possible to have graphics like that I had no idea that it was being done now. I wonder how long it will take before programmers start incorporating that in their games as I had noticed that there were no entries in the section for games that use this technology. Since the BoB engine has not yet been worked on I wonder if Oleg has seen this new stuff and I wonder if he would go for it...

LEXX_Luthor
02-22-2005, 01:14 AM
Fancy Landscape.....same old "flight sim" sky http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

mmm, the new "Wings of War" WW1 game has excellent landscape with good performance, but I think that was created as hardcore WW1 sim but the publishers changed it to arcade game. Sky looks "good" but I thinks its a fake sky, just background sky, you can never fly into.

nearmiss
02-22-2005, 04:22 AM
When I look at the picture at the top of this thread I think of a few things.

1. The aircraft in the foreground is too clean and beautiful.

2. The trees line the banks of the water similar to what they do in real world, not like in Il2 series. This has always been hard to understand...why no trees lining the river banks.

3. The aircraft in the pic look pretty good and you can't see a lot of detail either.

I think the quality of this picture is very good for combat flight sim, without the sterile and beautiful rendering of the aircraft in the foreground. I don't spend much time viewing my aircraft from behind, if you get my drift.

So, I really don't think we're so far away from good enough graphics to really enjoy combat flight simming.

A big issue in combat flight simming is lack of peripheral visual ability. The sim pilots head is stuck on a pivot, and the sim world is viewed like through a port hole in a ship. Duh! like what combat pilot in his right mind would stand back from the port hole and risk his life on the visuals seen through a port hole.

Any combat pilot would stick his head through the port hole to get better viewing, especially if his life depended upon it.

So...I'm saying there are other issues just as important visually. Issues that need to be addressed.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Platypus_1.JaVA
02-22-2005, 08:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by nearmiss:

A big issue in combat flight simming is lack of peripheral visual ability. The sim pilots head is stuck on a pivot, and the sim world is viewed like through a port hole in a ship. Duh! like what combat pilot in his right mind would stand back from the port hole and risk his life on the visuals seen through a port hole.

Any combat pilot would stick his head through the port hole to get better viewing, especially if his life depended upon it.

So...I'm saying there are other issues just as important visually. Issues that need to be addressed.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Goggles wich project the image directly into our eyes in combination with TrackIR would be quite possible with today technology. Only we should have some gloves wich let us virtually flipswitches and maybe even hold a virtual stick. That is probably allready possible but, it might be too expensive for outside an (electronic) laboratory.

TheGozr
02-22-2005, 12:36 PM
I heard it will be a doom3 cranked up engine.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

VW-IceFire
02-22-2005, 01:51 PM
I don't think we're at photorealism yet. Give it about 5 years. But we're getting there.

There are times even in FB that I think I'm looking at something real so its getting there. Slowly.

That image is a render with very high precision lighing along with some very good color work on a photograph. Its an excellent composition. Nothing a real computer can render in real time yet.

Syama
02-22-2005, 02:08 PM
Specular, bump, and normal maps would go along way in making the aircraft look more realisitc. I doubt they'd be much of a performance hit either.

Choctaw111
02-22-2005, 04:52 PM
Here are some screens from SpeedTreeRT. I was absolutely amazed at how real the graphics are. I have never seen anything like this before and I was blown away by it. I'm sure that Oleg would have to know about this. I was doing some reading on the website and they said they sell this to developers for under 6,000 US dollars per title. I think it is a GREAT DEAL!!! It doesn't seem like that much money to add this much realism to any game or sim.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/Meadow14.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/sierra06.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/Meadow08.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/autumn02.jpg

Choctaw111
02-23-2005, 02:18 PM
What do you all think of this speedtree stuff anyway? I think it would be a tremendous realism booster for BoB...and so much more fun to play... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

nearmiss
02-23-2005, 09:12 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Choctaw111:
What do you all think of this speedtree stuff anyway? I think it would be a tremendous realism booster for BoB...and so much more fun to play... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It looks very good. I just don't see Oleg putting off big bucks to pump up this sim or the BOB very much. If he can manage it through his programmers it might get done. Afterall it's probably just a lengthy programming task to provide that kind of trees and scenery. I don't know what wages in Russia are, but I'll bet they're on a pretty low scale at this point in time. Oleg, can probably pay someone to draw pictures all day and still never get to the price of the trees thing. Besides he'd have his own trees and could do with them and apply them as he sees fit if they were developed in house.

Choctaw111
02-24-2005, 06:03 PM
Who would like to see an awesome sim both at high level and at treetop level? I certainly do. I would love to be able to dive down on a target and see these awesome trees and other scenery when I look over my left wing wouldn't you? It would add so much to the realism and immersion along with a host of other things already suggested in these forums.

Airmail109
02-25-2005, 06:16 PM
A games company (activision) i think....had a meeting once to see how long it would be before they could get photo-realistic graphics. The calculated that the PCs would have to be about 20000 to 30000 times more powerful than they are now and that we would see pcs like that in about 10-15 years! Weve got a while to go! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Choctaw111
03-01-2005, 08:59 AM
bump

BigganD
03-02-2005, 09:28 AM
I hope the BoB graphic engine will be exelentos! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif I am saving money for an new computer, for BoB http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif ..everything for bob !!!

Obi_Kwiet
03-03-2005, 06:48 PM
10 or 15?! It'll be a lot longer than that. Hard ware has hit a big problem- heat. We have to conquer that before we get much faster.

LEXX_Luthor
03-04-2005, 01:02 AM
The landscape of Fighter Ops F~16 sim -- now in Beta longer than Targetware http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif -- looks almost photo real in the screenshots...at high altitude anyway but at low altitude I personally think it looks pretty good too so far. The fatal problem is the Fighter Ops sky, clouds, and weather are the same as 1990s flight sims...same small "flak puff" Flight Sim Clouds. This is an "advance" in grafix for Tank Sim, but not flight sim. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

LEXX_Luthor
03-04-2005, 01:49 AM
Chocktaw:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>What do you all think of this speedtree stuff anyway? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
For a Tank Sim, looks great. Also good for Plant Biology Sim. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

For Flight Sim, you need the combat environment of airplanes...

http://www.vought.com/heritage/photo/assets/images/db_images/db_0686_22.jpg
~ http://www.vought.com/heritage/photo/html/pmono.html

View from P~47 cockpit at 10km...
http://www.photolib.noaa.gov/historic/nws/images/wea00084.jpg
~ http://www.photolib.noaa.gov/historic/nws/


View from Bf~109 cockpit at 10km....the little white puffy dots scattered at the bottom are the size of our FB/PF clouds...traditional size of "Flight Sim" Clouds....
http://www.chitambo.com/clouds/cloudsimages/low/cb_cap_moscow_russia_jul01.jpg
~ http://www.chitambo.com/clouds/cloudshtml/calvus.html

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
This awesome tropical cloud looks like it's growing from the ocean. Well, it basically is, growing into incredible heights (about 10km). In the dark portion to the left it's raining, to the right the weather is fair. This shows how quickly weather can change in the tropics.
http://www.chitambo.com/clouds/cloudsimages/low/cb_cal_guam_oct00.jpg
~ http://www.chitambo.com/clouds/cloudshtml/calvus.html
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

VVS-Manuc
03-04-2005, 01:56 AM
I would prefer a game with not so much details but with a good fps not a slide show where I can count every leave on a tree

Choctaw111
03-04-2005, 10:00 AM
I do agree that we need some realistic clouds and some dynamic weather. I would love to see a storm developing while I'm flying but I would also love to see some detail down low when I am strafing a target. Having both great screnery in the sky and the ground would be awesome...