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bunkerratt
09-21-2010, 11:01 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

http://www.archive.org/details/ExerciseDesertRock1951

WilhelmSchulz.
09-23-2010, 01:41 AM
just hearing some of the **** they did gives me the willys. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Celeon999
09-23-2010, 02:52 AM
He talks about his instructions giving him safety at around 16:30.

He had no idea that his instructions violated the basic safety rules for nuclear weapons testing outlined by the United States Atomic Energy Commission.

People that knew much more about nuclear weapons and radioactivity than any u.s general.

Bunkerrat will notice right away which beginner mistake almost all of the soldiers in my video make at 3:30 when they climb out of their foxhole. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I guess they had their minds on something else in that moment with that ringing in their ears. The one in the front even does it twice as wrong. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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Kaleun1961
09-23-2010, 11:07 AM
You'll have to clue us in, Celeon. Was it how they climbed out of the trenches?

Celeon999
09-23-2010, 11:39 AM
Originally posted by Kaleun1961:
You'll have to clue us in, Celeon. Was it how they climbed out of the trenches?

Indirectly, yes. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Look what they do with their weapons. All three of them. (the first three) http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

EDIT : Wait ! Actually even four do the same mistake http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Then watch it a second time and look what the other two soldiers in the next foxhole do differently. They do it right. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

WilhelmSchulz.
09-23-2010, 11:45 AM
putting there weapon on the ground then climing out?

Celeon999
09-23-2010, 11:53 AM
Originally posted by WilhelmSchulz.:
putting there weapon on the ground then climing out?

Yes, but mainly sticking the muzzle in the dirt. The first one even accidently pushes his rifle's muzzle into the sand.

Never ever let the muzzle of your weapon touch the ground. N E V E R. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Thats one of the first things you learn in basic training.

Dirt, sand or a single tiny little stone in the barrel and you have a malfunction at hand or in the worst case, parts of your weapon may fly around your ears when you fire it the next time.

Celeon999
09-23-2010, 12:21 PM
Found a pic http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

There is a neat little trick to keep the muzzle up when you want to lay your weapon down and have nothing to lean it against, which you also learn in basic training http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

You can do the same with the M1Garand http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


http://img814.imageshack.us/img814/4805/02600px.jpg

bunkerratt
09-23-2010, 01:40 PM
yep....keep the dam muzzle out of the dirt ...also yes the m-1 garand has a "stacking swivel "on it

Celeon999
09-23-2010, 02:25 PM
They certainly didn't do similiar experiements with that one.

It was an experimental dry-fuel hydrogen bomb with 750 times the yield of the ones in the other two vids , vaporized a large portion of the test atoll and left a 15 miles wide crater

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Because of a calculation mistake and misunderstanding about the nuclear fusion process, it detonated with 2.5 times of the expected yield and almost killed the observing scientists and military personell.

Sixteen members of the observing aircraft carrier USS Bairoko recieved second degree burns and had to be treated in hospital. Most of the atoll was contaminanted and the fallout travelled as far as north america and Canada, Japan ,Australia , Russia and partially even Europe.

The international outcry brought the process for the atmospheric test ban treaty into motion.

The test itself was completely useless as all scientific data was lost when the unpexpectedly powerful blast destroyed the atmospheric probes and sensoric equipment surrounding the test site.

bunkerratt
09-23-2010, 05:24 PM
what i also found to be alarming was the sweeping off the troops with a broom creating a small dust cloud ...

Foehammer-1
09-23-2010, 08:40 PM
And I thought only Jukov (Zhukov in English, ????? in Russian) has performed these kinds of experiments on soldiers...

Speaking of Castle Bravo, it's sad how it left its mark for the next several thousand years. Look at that crater!

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a176/Foehammer88/Capture-21.png

Kaleun1961
09-23-2010, 09:59 PM
Ah, yes, I didn't notice they had put their muzzles into the dirt. How dare a gyrene do that! Must burn Bunkerrat's eyes to see that.

When I was a reservist we used to stack our FN's the same way. It sure kept them off of the ground and looked rather cool at the same time. Having just done my firearms safety course a few days ago it is very fresh in my mind. I had to simulate climbing a fence while carrying a loaded [dummy ammo] 12 gauge shotgun. The correct procedure according to the Canadian firearms safety course is to unload the weapon, prove it safe, lay it on the ground with the breech or ejector port facing up, then climb the obstacle several feet down muzzle of the gun. Walking in front of the muzzle is an instant fail. I'm pleased to report that I scored 100% on all tests. It's not that difficult provided you pay attention in class. Minimum passing grade is 80%. My next course is hunter training and application for my PAL [possession and acquisition license.] Canadians do not have the constitutional right to bear arms like our American cousins, something I envy them for. But our gun laws are another subject for a different day and a different thread.

Kaleun1961
09-23-2010, 10:03 PM
Originally posted by Foehammer-1:
And I thought only Jukov (Zhukov in English, ????? in Russian) has performed these kinds of experiments on soldiers...

Speaking of Castle Bravo, it's sad how it left its mark for the next several thousand years. Look at that crater!


Zhukov was a very effective general by Soviet standards but was rather profligate with his mens' lives. According to one account I recall having read, an American general shortly after WW2 asked him how he dealt with German minefields. Zhukov's reply: "We attack as if it wasn't there. Our losses would be about the same or less than if the Germans actually defended it with guns instead of mines." The Soviets had the "luxury" of being able to squander lives that way. Their attitude is reflected in the abhorrent casualty figures, even when accounting for the number of men involved in Russian front fighting. Any Allied general with an attitude like that would have been canned.

Messervy
09-24-2010, 01:44 AM
Yes, the Russian front was a true meat grinder.
The WWll had been decided there.
No less that 607 Axis divisions were lost there(destroyed or disabled).

Celeon999
09-24-2010, 02:21 AM
Originally posted by bunkerratt:
what i also found to be alarming was the sweeping off the troops with a broom creating a small dust cloud ...

Exactly. And all that without respirators or even facemasks.

But if you think this was the peak of carelessness and blank stupidity watch this one here and check out what they do in the end of the vid.

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bunkerratt
09-24-2010, 01:45 PM
if you look closely at film's of the atomic tests you;ll notice white smoke trails on either side of the blast ..that's to analyze the rate of expansion each rocket is set a known distance from ground zero http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

Foehammer-1
09-24-2010, 04:32 PM
Feeding people with pots salvaged from destroyed houses? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Good luck doing that today!

Kaleun1961
09-24-2010, 04:43 PM
Originally posted by bunkerratt:
if you look closely at film's of the atomic tests you;ll notice white smoke trails on either side of the blast ..that's to analyze the rate of expansion each rocket is set a known distance from ground zero http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

That's something I only recently found out. When I was a kid I asked an adult what those smoky lines were. He replied they were were "shock waves." I swallowed it; hey I was a kid! Since then I never saw the subject discussed until quite recently. It all makes sense now. Shock waves my butt! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif I hate it when somebody makes up an answer rather than saying, "I don't know."

Celeon999
09-25-2010, 01:23 AM
Originally posted by Foehammer-1:
Feeding people with pots salvaged from destroyed houses? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Good luck doing that today!

No no the food is not that from the test , its more that they brought it near the test area and eat it there in the open to proof how safe it is there.

Just because they knew the wind directions and propably did some superficial geiger readings of the area.

That they eat there did not mean that the area was free of fallout, it just means that the contamination had levels they considered to be "safe levels" in 1955.

What were safe levels in 1955, are levels which require protective clothing and respiratory protection today.

And of course safety requirments forbid to eat in a contaminated area.

Its one of the typical "nuclear attack is bad, but not THAT bad" feel good productions meant for calming the public.

The bomb falls, you come back out of your safe room , put some new paint on your house, drive some screws tight again and in the next minute the friendly civil protection man will knock at your door to tell you that the radiation has now been washed away, the USA was victorious because it had more a-bombs than the commis and the american way of life goes on just as before. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

The paperboy and the milkman are already just around the corner and the city will be fully rebuilt by the end of the week. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

That this test was done with a comparatively tiny a-bomb and that there is also something called h-bomb is just mentioned in passing. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Foehammer-1
09-25-2010, 06:39 AM
That this test was done with a comparatively tiny a-bomb and that there is also something called h-bomb is just mentioned in passing. Big Grin

Of course there are worse things out there.

Kaboom (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1q0hzSnKQoE)

Celeon999
09-25-2010, 11:48 AM
The music is from 2001 A space odyssey http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


And thats not the first a comparatively powerful explosion has happened.

Tunguska Event of 1908 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunguska_event)

The eyewitness accounts in the article are peticular interesting.

You need quite an explosion to knock over 80 million trees. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif


The Tsar bomb is interesting in many ways, but the least known fact about is that its detonation inspired its creater Andrei Dmitrijewitsch Sacharow to become an anti-nuclear weapons activist who was among the first to call for the abolishment of all nuclear weapons.

And that as head physicist of the soviet nuclear weapons program and one of the fathers of the h-bomb, imagine that !

He did not made himself many friends in the politbureau with that so much is sure. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

He once said that on the day he witnessed the Tsar bomb exploding , he immidiately understood that we know have all we need to destroy the entire human civilisation in a matter of hours.

That was the moment he decided to end his work and call for a total nuclear disarmament of the Soviet Union and all other countries.

But Sacharow wasnt the typical nuke-designer anyway. Beside being a physicist, he was also a human-rights activist who campaigned for the rights of ethnic minorities in Russia and a democratic overhaul of the soviet system.

It is a great irony that one of the fathers of the h-bomb recieved the nobel peace prize in 1975.

The EU named a human rights prize after him , the Sacharow Prize.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/34/BonnerAndSakharovAndKallistratova1986.jpg/800px-BonnerAndSakharovAndKallistratova1986.jpg

Foehammer-1
09-25-2010, 12:27 PM
yeah, I remember reading about that. Didn't make himself popular, indeed.

And the Tunguska was not a man-made event. But if we count those, there are worse things out there.

Like the Chicxulub that probably wiped out the dinosaurs.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/24/Yucatan_chix_crater.jpg

Or Manicouagan crater here in Canada, the crater itself is gone, but shocked rock beneath tells where it used to be... It's happened way before the dinosaurs.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5c/STS009_Manicouagan.jpg

So humans are really amateurs compared to the Universe in trying to find ways to wipe ourselves out http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

WilhelmSchulz.
09-25-2010, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by Foehammer-1:
So humans are really amateurs compared to the Universe in trying to find ways to wipe ourselves out http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif
Yeah but it dosent realy much to kill a man though. And I have heard somehwere that the Csar Bomba was only detonated with only 1/3 of its designed plutonium(or was it Urainium?).

Foehammer-1
09-25-2010, 06:41 PM
The Tsar Bomba was supposed to be 100 megatons, but someone finally persuaded Hruschev that it would be dangerous to this planet.

So he said, during his Kuzka's Mother speech, that here was 50 megatons, we didn't want to explode 100 megatons because we could have shattered our own windows.

And it's a fusion bomb, so it worked on tritium (stuff used on glowing compass needles and weapon sights), with the plutonium primary fission explosion providing the necessary temperature and X- and gamma-rays needed for tritium fusion.
I am not sure if they have simply loaded less tritium, or exploded a different bomb altogether... I have read somewhere that it could have been turned into a 100-megaton bomb, so I suppose it might indeed be the tritium load.

[edit] Make that deuterium-tritium

Kaleun1961
09-25-2010, 06:43 PM
The Czar bomb was an impractical design, meant to cow the West. It would have been useless as a weapon because it was too big to deliver. Our strategy was smaller bombs but deliverable with greater accuracy. As the saying goes, "Better to hit with a .38 than to miss with a .50 cal."

Celeon999
09-26-2010, 02:09 AM
Mars even has got some much bigger impact craters than earth does. One of it is the largest in our solar system , the Borealis basin making up about 40% of Mars' surface.

It must have happened very early during our solar system's formation.

Luckily we have Jupiter around to pull most space debris towards itself with its massive gravity.

There is also this theory that our moon is made up of debris that was smashed out of earth by the impact of a giant stellar object in the early phase of the earth's formation about 4.5 billion years go.


With Fallout New Vegas coming, im pretty sure Foe and myself agree that we're kinda thankful for the bombs existence http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

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Celeon999
10-08-2010, 10:49 AM
Wow, we were just talking about Sacharow a few days back and suddenly ... (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11499098)

PhantomKira
10-18-2010, 08:43 PM
Originally posted by Kaleun1961:
Our strategy was smaller bombs but deliverable with greater accuracy.

Of course, we had the systems to provide that accuracy. The Soviets, I gather, did not. Therefore, they needed a larger explosion to ensure the required level of target damage due to degraded weapon accuracy.

Foehammer-1
10-20-2010, 08:49 AM
Originally posted by PhantomKira:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kaleun1961:
Our strategy was smaller bombs but deliverable with greater accuracy.

Of course, we had the systems to provide that accuracy. The Soviets, I gather, did not. Therefore, they needed a larger explosion to ensure the required level of target damage due to degraded weapon accuracy. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh, come ON!

Back then, there was no GPS-guiding. And remember, this is an AIRCRAFT-dropped munition. Show me an American bomb which can be dropped from more than 10km up and still be as accurate as a ballistic missile.

If you think it's that easy, also consider this. Because 50 megatons will knock any plane out of the sky within a considerable radius, you need a parachute ******ation system which will let your bombers get away.

Now I want you to show me an American bomb which can hit a dead center of a city descending with a parachute, acted upon by the four winds.

And don't tell me about the ICBM's, we are talking about the plane-dropped bombs here. Can't compare bananas and durians http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

So I'd rather get a big bomb that wipes out Washington no matter where it hits, than one that gives the Pentagonians a nice view of a mushroom cloud in the distance...

And don't tell me about anti-bomber defenses, I agree that it would be hard to reach Washington with the NIKE-Hercules's and interceptors. We are talking about the end result.

And besides, I would think twice about attacking a country that has such a weapon. Because the ORIGINAL point of it was to be deployed by a submarine about 100km off the American shore, and create a very inefficient (compared to underwater landslides) tsunami wave, which is still capable of wiping out anything on the nearby coast.

I wouldn't risk the lives of thousands of my citizens if I decided to attack the USSR.

Remember, they were very suspicious and paranoid about the NATO aggression back then. I'd think the threat of an unexpected tsunami all along the coast would be a very good deterrant IF the Americans were stupid enough to invade the USSR.

Kaleun1961
10-20-2010, 03:48 PM
From what I recall reading about that particular bomb, it was too heavy to be transported by aircraft to America, even if there were no defenses to worry about. It really was more of a propaganda effort than it was practical. What was more worrisome to the West were the various smaller and mobile rocket systems that could be moved around, and thus almost immune to pre-emption. The Americans planned such a style of deterrence with their MX system, which was never deployed.

In conventional ICBM's, the Americans did have greater accuracy, but Soviet rockets had greater throw weight, which afforded them the luxury of making heavier warheads to compensate for their lesser accuracy. In the end, the same aim would have been achieved. Thank God, their has never yet been a war where these things have been thrown around.

Could the Czar Bomba have even been deployed by submarine? Was there any work done to this end?

Foehammer-1
10-20-2010, 05:20 PM
In the end, the same aim would have been achieved. Thank God, their has never yet been a war where these things have been thrown around.

Could the Czar Bomba have even been deployed by submarine? Was there any work done to this end?

Indeed.

As for the submarine deployment, there have been extensive studies in underwater explosion effects on wave generation, at the same time as the bomb was developed. That much we know, and it may point to interesting conclusions.

The actual results, as well as the probable submarine deployment plans are probably never going to see light.

Then, around the same time, someone has briefed Hruschev about deployment of 100-megaton bombs (yes, 100-megaton!) by the US coast.

People have pieced this together some time ago, and I have found out also a long while ago. Can't remember a lot of details.

But it's a good thing we never saw missiles fly back and forth and sudden tsunamis all over the North American coast...

Kaleun1961
10-20-2010, 08:19 PM
I believe the main reason why we haven't seen such an exchange is the uncertainty about being able to completely disarm the foe. Even if you got 99% of his nukes, the 1% left could still ruin your country to the point that it wasn't worth it. MAD [mutually assured destruction] seems to have worked. Still, I'm sure there were zealots on both sides who thought it would still be "worth it." Of course, those are the guys who would have themselves and their families in one of those safe bunkers. In terms of civil defence, the Soviet Union was and probably still is ahead of the U.S. I've read that they had/have shelters for millions of their citizens. As to whether they have enough supplies in those shelters...?

Celeon999
10-21-2010, 02:42 AM
Ja zee good old days when Celeon was still contained behind zee iron curtain http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif


Little did the world knew what was unleashed when the wall came down http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

A "little" tour through an East German Army bunker complex inside a mountain in Thuringia, still waiting for the class enemy to try the great contra-revolution. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

The west german side had similar sized installations as most of them were already under construction during ww2 and just had to be finished and modernized.

The second part of the video shows the east german governmental bunker which was the most modern in the entire eastern block. Hidden underneath a forest.

The very important rooms were not mounted on shock absorbers underneath them, which is the usual method. Instead they were hanging free floating in the air on giant springs. An interesting approach by the engineers. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Equipped with enough telecommunication stuff to command the entire armed forces. Direct phoneline to Moscow included , of course. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Check out all the old 70's technology down there. Most of it is still working http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

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Kielhauler2010
10-21-2010, 02:52 AM
Originally posted by Foehammer-1:

And don't tell me about the ICBM's, we are talking about the plane-dropped bombs here. Can't compare bananas and durians http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif And what has Foe got against durians, the "king of fruits"?

Foehammer-1
10-21-2010, 05:07 AM
In terms of civil defence, the Soviet Union was and probably still is ahead of the U.S. I've read that they had/have shelters for millions of their citizens. As to whether they have enough supplies in those shelters...?

Under every "government" structure, be it a hospital, factory, city hall, library, school, etc, there was a bunker designed to hold the building's current occupants, as well as people living in the surrounding area.
These were very well stocked with food preserves, water, water filtration, some gas masks, some medicine. Almost like Fallout's vaults, but not as elaborate.

After the world has come to sort of peace (After Hruschev and after Penkovskiy, I hope you all know who he was), construction of shelters has stopped. At the same time, enormous apartment building complexes were built, thus making it more difficult to house all those people in bunkers if need be.

As for shelters themselves, they are still around, sealed "just in case". I have been in one under a hospital and under my school. There is about 2 meters of solid concrete of roof, plus the building on top, and several exits, all sufficiently far away to not get blocked by debris.

However, all of the supplies have been removed long ago.

[edit] And durians smell rather weird. They taste very good, but only when I have a clothes pin on my nose. Once I take a whiff of the garlic/onion/fruit mix, all of a sudden I feel like running to a lavatory with upset stomach http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Celeon999
10-21-2010, 06:07 AM
The Sakharov price has been awarded to Cuban dissident Guillermo Farinas (http://www.dw-world.com/dw/article/0,,6134427,00.html)

Celeon999
10-22-2010, 02:36 AM
Some images from a military that did not survive the cold war. The second most powerful in the Warsaw Pact, behind the Red Army.

Celeon's father and older brother served in it. Both in air defence.

Celeon in a different one..... to be precise : the ENEMY ! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

And i didn't had to immigrate to another country for that. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Always a interesting story to tell at parties and stuff. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


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Foehammer-1
10-22-2010, 06:04 AM
Wow, they used T-34/44 in the late 60's there?? Or was that just a random clip from WW2?

I know those T-34's were used in other poorer countries, but didn't know about Germany?

Messervy
10-22-2010, 11:41 AM
Originally posted by Celeon999:
Celeon's father and older brother served in it. Both in air defence.

Celeon in a different one..... to be precise : the ENEMY ! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

And i didn't had to immigrate to another country for that. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Always a interesting story to tell at parties and stuff. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Pha....Amateurs. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

I served the same army in the same country I later fought in same country but in a different army. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Celeon999
10-23-2010, 01:27 AM
Originally posted by Messervy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Celeon999:
Celeon's father and older brother served in it. Both in air defence.

Celeon in a different one..... to be precise : the ENEMY ! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

And i didn't had to immigrate to another country for that. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Always a interesting story to tell at parties and stuff. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Pha....Amateurs. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

I served the same army in the same country I later fought in same country but in a different army. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


You won. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Cant possibly beat that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


@ Foehammer

I tried to find out more about that but my father only knows that he once drove, among many ZILs, ZIS', Urals, Kaz, a BAT which is a truck body mounted on the tracks of T-34.

He cant remember having seen a T-34 as he was in a , at that time , still brand new and top secret SA-2 Flarak battalion whichs homebase was not shown on any roadmaps and only had a postal adress.

It was so new that almost nobody recognized their strange uniform markings and colors and they had to constantly show their papers and explain who they are when being at a different base. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

He never got to see any tanks there.

I only found out that the T-34 was kept and used as target for firing exercises to the very end (1990). No idea when it was taken out of active service.

The other tanks were T-55 and T-72M.

More old stuff. East German Fallschirmjäger battalion "Willy Sänger". Propably named after some old guard communist. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Notice the socialist version of Chuck Norris smashing roof tiles with his bare hands while wearing sunglasses for coolness. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

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Foehammer-1
10-23-2010, 05:17 AM
Notice the socialist version of Chuck Norris smashing roof tiles with his bare hands while wearing sunglasses for coolness.

Hehehe, yup! Nice one.

As for the jumping and rolling stuff, Foe can do that http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

Never tried it with a rifle, though, I doubt the neighbors would appreciate that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Celeon999
10-26-2010, 03:45 AM
Another relict of the cold war : This time the once top secret bunker of the West-German government hidden under a vineyard.

Its codename was "Rosengarten" I dont think i need to translate that do i ? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

1:00 Shows decontamination showers

1:40 A section of the air filtering system where the possibly extremely hot air from the outside would be cooled down prior to filtering.

2:13 One of five mess halls , each for 600 persons

2:50 Emergency power diesel generators

3:50 Plenarhall of the senate

4:40 Bathroom and personal rooms of the chancellor (Better than anything the others would have had, OF COURSE ! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif )

5:20 Communication hatches. Underneath is a extendable 25 meter high antenna array.

6:50 One of five command centers from which the bunker could be sealed. The vineyard had hidden blastwave sensors which could seal the airintakes on their own within milliseconds.

Basically big concrete lids hanging over the unfiltered airintakes. The sensores would have triggered small explosives after which the lids would fall down on the intakes. (Not shown in this video)

7:40 Test of the automatic emergency sealing of the bunker


There was also a railway line leading into the bunker which is sadly also not shown in the video.

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Celeon999
11-13-2010, 03:19 PM
Originally posted by Celeon999:
He talks about his instructions giving him safety at around 16:30.

He had no idea that his instructions violated the basic safety rules for nuclear weapons testing outlined by the United States Atomic Energy Commission.

People that knew much more about nuclear weapons and radioactivity than any u.s general.

Bunkerrat will notice right away which beginner mistake almost all of the soldiers in my video make at 3:30 when they climb out of their foxhole. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I guess they had their minds on something else in that moment with that ringing in their ears. The one in the front even does it twice as wrong. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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I finally found some informations regarding this video.


The name of this test was "Dog" and it was the first detonation of the "Snapper" part of Operation "Tumbler-Snapper" and the fourth of an overall of eight tests in the entire operation.

The bomb had a yield of 19 kilotons and was dropped by a B-45 bomber on Target Area 7 of the Nevada Test Site on May 1, 1952 at 4:30 PM, airbursting in height of 1040 feet (316 meters)

The soldiers in the video are u.s army and u.s marine corps and participated in field exercise "Desert Rock IV" that was conducted on the Nevada Test Site during Operation Tumbler-Snapper.

Beside "Dog", varying numbers of soldiers of an overall 8000 men participating in the exercise were also ordered to march into Ground Zero of two other shots while moving close to a third one :

"Charlie" dropped from a B-50 bomber, airbursting at 3447 feet (1050 meters) with a yield of 31 kilotons on 22. April 1952 on Area 7 at 5:30 PM. This was the most powerful of all shots in this operation

"George" exploded on top of a tower at a height of 300 feet (90 meters) with a yield of 15 kilotons at Area 3 on 1. June 1952 , 11:55 AM

George was initially supposed to be detonated on Area 2 of the test site but the radioactivity from the shots Easy and Fox was too high there.

"Fox" detonated on top of a 300 feet tower with a yield of 11 kilotons on 25, May 1925 12:00 AM

1450 soldiers closed in on Ground Zero without actually marching to it.


Operation Tumbler-Snapper released around 15.500 kilocuries of radioiodine (I-131) into the atmosphere. Unfavourable weather patterns caused significant civilian radíation exposure.

At least what is considered significant by standards of 2010, not necessarily of those of 1952.

Kaleun1961
11-13-2010, 07:09 PM
It would be interesting to read any cancer statistics for the soldiers who participated in those tests as compared to other soldiers and civilians of the same age, later in life. Did they have higher rates of cancer, did they experience a lower life expectancy, etc.?

Celeon999
11-14-2010, 02:49 AM
Originally posted by Kaleun1961:
It would be interesting to read any cancer statistics for the soldiers who participated in those tests as compared to other soldiers and civilians of the same age, later in life. Did they have higher rates of cancer, did they experience a lower life expectancy, etc.?


Informations could be aquired from them : National Association of Atomic Veterans (http://www.naav.com/)


It is certain that their exposure must have had serious health related consequences for many of them. Except they were all super heroes with body cells covered in lead.

According to documents about Tumbler-Snapper, the limit for radiation exposure was set to a maximum of 3.0 REM per person.

The reported exposure of 58 individuals exceeded this value.

48 recieved 3 to 5 REM , 9 recieved 5 to 10 REM and one recieved 10 REM.

Considering that 7350 individuals participated in exercises in conjunction with shots Charlie, Dog , George and Fox the claim that a whopping 7292 of them remained within the 3 REM limit is extremely unlikely.

It is also highly unlikely that 10 REM was the highest exposure recieved during Tumbler Snapper, especially among the soldiers walking towards Ground Zero.

The soldiers in the Dog shot did not even reach Ground Zero as excessive radiation levels there forced them to stop.

Its more likely that the exposure of a huge number of soldiers was never even measured at all or not properly measured.


I also found some infos about the "Dog" bomb.

It was a modified Mark 7 tactical boosted fission bomb testing the usefulness of deuterium gas (Heavy Water) fusion boosting.

The Mark 7 was the USA's first tactical nuke

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/21/Mark_7_nuclear_bomb_at_USAF_Museum.jpg

Celeon999
11-24-2010, 07:37 AM
Here is something you definitely couldn't do today anmore.


On July 19, 1957 at the Nevada test site, five men (servicemen and cameramen) volunteered to stand on Ground Zero while a tactical nuclear air to air missile (AIR-2 Genie) of 1,6 kilotons was airbursted directly above them at a height of 15.000 feet (4500 meters).

This was done to visualize the "safety" of nuclear tests.

Only one of them, cameraman George Yo****ake is still alive today, the other four died early of cancer.

Not because of that peticular test but because they witnessed dozens of tests over the years while wearing nearly no protective clothing.

The footage is at 6:00 into this video. Sadly i couldn't find it in better quality but the real film material owned by George Yo****ake has much higher quality.

EDIT : The name is Yoshi-take ... stupid censorship system http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

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Kaleun1961
11-26-2010, 12:04 PM
EDIT : The name is Yoshi-take ... stupid censorship system

Let's see if "shiitake mushrooms" gets through.

Kielhauler2010
11-29-2010, 11:26 AM
Try typing in 'Scunthorpe' a few years ago and US internet filters would shut you down and send the police 'round!

The city council complained and the filter restriction was eventually lifted.