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stugumby
07-31-2006, 11:24 AM
Best Buy > Accessories > Computer Accessories > Game Controllers > PC Joysticks > Product Info




Our Price: $41.99
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Logitech 3D Pro Joystick

Model: 963290-0403




12 well-placed fully programmable buttons
8-way rubberized hat switch for optimum control
Rapid-fire trigger
More Options

Compare with products in this price range.








Product Features








Twist handle and weighted base provide precise direction control




Smooth and accurate throttle settings for the ultimate gaming edge









Product Details









Warranty Terms - Labor 1 year








Connection Port(s) USB








Number of Buttons 12








Pedals Included No








Number of Programmable Buttons 12








"Tilt" Technology No








"Rumble" Technology No








Force Feedback No








Right/Left Handed Universal








Number of Hat Switches 0








"Twist" Technology Yes








Throttle Control Yes








Included Software Logitech gaming software for PC








System Requirements PC with Intelā® Pentiumā® processor or equivalent; Windows 98, 2000, ME or XP; USB port; 64MB RAM: 20MB hard drive space; CD-ROM drive; Macintosh with USB port; Mac OS 9 or Mac OS 10.x or later

ytareh
07-31-2006, 11:38 AM
Glad I got to reply first!Most people HATE these sticks as they had a very big ,very bad batch where the potentiometers (inner electrical thingys involved in movement sensing)went on them and they would not react all the way in a particular direction.
I LOVE these sticks.Now I reckon that many of the returned sticks were fine (including at least one I returned myself)as people do not fully understand TRIM(Youve got to learn this fairly soon ,particularly in some planes that wont fly in a straight line unless you trim them).Many /most of the planes in the game if flown in a quick mission will "pull" in a certain direction (the Ki43 and J8A will shoot straight upwards for example unless you pull down on the stick(which slows your maximum speed) or trim them-and the Hurricane leans to the right pretty quickly)
The best thing about them is their stiff spring (stiffest this side of US$150 CH products)and beautifully anatomic /comfortable hand fitting grip-Saiteks have limp springs and are just a plain 'bar' to hold cos they want to cater for the left handers while making the other 85% of right handers suffer!!!)
So in summary buy the Logitech BUT KEEP THE RECEIPT and be ready to take it back in a few months if it starts to not go all the way in a certain direction AS TESTED IN THE JOYSTICK SETTINGS SCREEN -not in the cockpit during a flight...

ytareh
07-31-2006, 11:41 AM
Oh yes and dont bother with their software cd -just set it up in the game Controls screen-rclick on the right hand side of the control and click the button you want to work it -Throttle and weapon 1 and 2 are usually preset up already...

R_Target
07-31-2006, 11:52 AM
I went through four of them. I think they're garbage. Nice layout and spring tension though.

JFC_Rautaristi
07-31-2006, 11:59 AM
I use the same stick and i've been happy with it. Couple of months more and i've used this one for two years. Although it's started degrading recently, it's still good and it's been easily worth it's price.

I'm fairly certain i will eventually replace it with the same stick http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

TgD Thunderbolt56
07-31-2006, 12:38 PM
For the casual simmer (relative statement) the Logitech are fairly inexpensive and functional. Put quite simply they just don't last and get very sloppy before they take a dirt nap. If the cost is the drawback to better controllers, then I'd say get one piece at a time (if you go CH) or simply wait a bit longer and get a Saitek. If you were to get a CH combatstick 568 for $76.00 then you would really only be required to use the keyboard for rudder until you could get some pedals and the combatstick is easily 3 times the controller of ANY Logitech stick. If you went whole-hog and got the Fighterstick for about $100 you'd find it's even better due to the added functionality and extra modes.

If you hop into the game once or twice a week for an hour or so, then the Logitech may work out for you, but I can't seriously recommend them for anyone who flies multiple sims or for more than an hour or so a week as they simply won't last.

Over the years, I've owned three Logitech sticks, a Saitek X36, Microsoft FFB2, Cougar, and myriad CH sticks. My very first CH flightstick 2-button controller still works like it did the day I took it out of the box almost 12 years ago. All the Logitechs felt good in my hand and I really wanted to like them. Fact is when you start losing control of your aircraft for no apparent reason and your stick needs constant calibration or just loses some of its precision it becomes a bit tiresome.

In some cases, propaganda can be called good marketing...


TB

Wilburnator
07-31-2006, 06:30 PM
I had a 3D wireless Logitech that I liked at first, but developed bad spiking issues shortly after purchase. I returned it 3 times and decided I was all done with Logitech sticks, free replacement or not. Each one I got as replacement for the last developed the same problem, and it had nothing to do with trim, lol.

I think an older Logitech that works properly is the exception rather than the rule.

sparx1951
07-31-2006, 06:53 PM
Been reading here on the Forum for a while since I just started to get back into flight sim.
(Hope you don't mind the post here with questions, I don't mean to hijack the thread)

I got IL2 and a CH Fighterstick USb. Problem is 1- I have smaller hands than most and 2- I am over 50 and worked construction so my hand gets sore a little sooner than most. I agree that the CH is well made, and have read countless comments here to support this.

I truly hate the little trigger button on the front/bottom of the stick; it produces pain for my little finger.

My thoughts were to sell this stick and get a CH Flightstick Pro since, if I am correct, the button on the front and low on the stick does not exist.

I also wish the stick filled the palm of my hand as some other brands I have had did. I suppose I could add some padding on the right side and cover the low button, but then that switch would be 'closed' at all times.

Also how long before I get adjusted to IL2, I played MS Combat FS and enjoyed European Air War very much but this one is quite difficult to say the least!

Again, sorry for butting in.
sparx

timholt
08-01-2006, 04:24 AM
I went through 2 Logitechs in less than 2 years.
The first one was replaced under warranty after about 9 months, the scond one started playing up after about 10 months.
Gave it away and purchased a CH Combatstick and (even with small hands) haven't looked back since.

TgD Thunderbolt56
08-01-2006, 06:00 AM
@ Sparx1951:

I can highly recommend the CH Flightstick Pro for IL2. It fits smaller hands better, has no bottom button, has a shorter throw, and is IMO the most comfortable stick they make. Obviously it has a bit less functionality due to less buttons and only 1 mode, but combine it with a CH Pro Throttle (which compensates for the less buttons AND has three modes) and you've got a good setup.

I'm left-handed and opted for a flightstick pro after attempting to fly right-handed with a Fighterstick. It just didn't work for me and I've been using my flightstick now for over 2 years.

In referrence to adjusting to IL2/PF, I'd strongly suggest finding a group or at least an individual to fly with occassionally. You don't need to join a squad as there are multiple servers out there that have excellent teamwork and public com channels available for those flying on the servers. That will flatten the learning curve considerably. Since you're familiar with flight-sims, you're already ahead of the curve but getting on coms with someone who may be familiar with specific server settings, maps and the process will help immeasurably. I can list some of the servers, their IP addresses and some of the TeamSpeak information if you need it or aren't sure where to look.


TB

WTE_Tigger
08-01-2006, 06:16 AM
Dodgitech... dont go near it. I had three of them in 12 months. Bad batch or not i will never use one again. I only payed for the first fortunatly...

You want cheap, without the nasty, try the Thrustmaster Pro stick/throttle-combo for about $95 AU (about $70 US?) ive had two over 5 years of flying for a low end price i was very happy with them (non-forcefeedback, throttle/stick combo model, not the standalone joystick) I use the X52 now...

Bearcat99
08-01-2006, 06:44 AM
I wouldn't. My first 3 sticks were Logitechs. They make nice speakers and mice and such.. but thier joysticks are not very good. I recommend Saitek or CH. Go to this website (https://order.store.yahoo.com/cgi-bin/wg-order?unique=f4c0a&catalog=saitekusa&et=44cf5312&basket=b%3D5C3a42bfd1017e1d44cf4c0a964903a42bfd1f0 8c324480902b8c9fa0373146ac%26l%3D%26s%3DkBZf9TTKoS kcu2Fc9w4Fufe7At0-) where you canget a reconditioned Saitek X-52 with full warranty for $69. I dont know if they ship overseas but if you are in the U.S. you cant beat it with a stick. It is a very good stick and has enough functions in it for you to grow into and for $69 you cant beat it. Or you can go CH here (http://www.provantage.com/ch%7E110CHPU.htm).

hkg36sd
08-04-2006, 03:02 PM
Might also depend on how rough you are on the stick. IL2:FB/PF though, discourages abrupt handling (stall results)

A while ago, Had a Thrustmaster (with wcs setup) but it went out of allignment almost too soon. To Thrustmasters credit, I called them, told them of my issues, and they sent me a potentiometer(s)/button/springs replacement kit. ..This was a while ago though.

Have a Logitech Extreme 3d pro and am pretty happy with it so far. np.

triad773
08-04-2006, 03:19 PM
Things may have changed, but my experience with thier joysticks was dissappointing. I had ended up replacing it with a Saitek.

Akronnick
08-04-2006, 04:39 PM
Logitech + Usb Joystick = ****

just my $.02

sparx1951
08-04-2006, 05:23 PM
TgD Thunderbolt56

I wanted to thank you for posting the Provantage site. I purchased CH-- pedals, throttle and a Flight Stick Pro joystick, all USB. Been wanting pedals for years, well here goes. How do I stop my chair from rolling, Pergo floor in office! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I hope this combination will lead to enjoyment with IL-2.

I have been reading here and have been overwhelmed in a way regarding all the data (number setting?) peeps are programming their controls with.

I am going to try to get all these connected and give it a shot.

I will no doubt have question, hope you guys can assist.

That vender BTW (Provantage) is very low on prices and high on customer service. I received my controls in 3 days. Also they beat Neweggs prices!

I checked for Provantage on Resellers to leave a positive rating but could not locate them. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Thanks again, sorry for rambling.
sparx

SkyChimp
08-04-2006, 09:39 PM
I went through 3 in 18 months. For me, at the 6 month point, they stopped holding center. They are heavy, feel well built, but they wear out way too fast.

Malahl1
08-04-2006, 10:55 PM
what is your budget?

under 50? Go with Saitek or Thrustmaster

around 100? Get an X52

over 100? CH BABY!

TgD Thunderbolt56
08-05-2006, 04:32 PM
Glad to have helped Sparx1951.

As far as the input figures for your controllers are concerned, I'd strongly suggest using them stock out of the box first. Then, if that doesn't suit your style you should THEN tweak the ranges a bit. There are plenty of people around here to help with it, but if you ended up getting all CH then I'd recommend registering at the CH-Hangar. Their forums are down right now for an update, but sometime tomorrow night they should be back up.

Here's the IP addy: http://www.CH-hangar.com


TB

sparx1951
08-05-2006, 06:12 PM
Having trouble with flying after connecting pedals.

See here: I am shark bait!!! (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&f=49310655&m=9701035964&r=4701087964#4701087964)

It has to be something simple, if it were compliated it would have been illegal for me to purchase it! LOL! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
jim

Bearcat99
08-06-2006, 12:49 PM
Originally posted by sparx1951:
TgD Thunderbolt56

I wanted to thank you for posting the Provantage site. I purchased CH-- pedals, throttle and a Flight Stick Pro joystick, all USB. Been wanting pedals for years, well here goes. How do I stop my chair from rolling, Pergo floor in office! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Provantage is great..... I ordered my pedals on a Saturday.. and they were at my door by Tuesday..

I hope this combination will lead to enjoyment with IL-2.

I have been reading here and have been overwhelmed in a way regarding all the data (number setting?) peeps are programming their controls with.

I am going to try to get all these connected and give it a shot.

I will no doubt have question, hope you guys can assist.

That vender BTW (Provantage) is very low on prices and high on customer service. I received my controls in 3 days. Also they beat Neweggs prices!

I checked for Provantage on Resellers to leave a positive rating but could not locate them. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Thanks again, sorry for rambling.
sparx

sparx1951
08-06-2006, 01:51 PM
<span class="ev_code_RED">Redtail</span>

I hope my post you quoted is not out of line?

Otherwise I am makeing progress, got the pedals working and with help on my other thread have the HAT working as well.

Very helpful Forum, thanks for being here.

I do have a queston about gun sites if you have a moment. I have the, (pardon my lack of knowledge), heads up sight on the windscreen and am using it. What is the black sight off to the left side for? Is this a "manal" sight? Flying a P47 ATM. Can I switch?

jim

TheGozr
08-06-2006, 01:58 PM
Go to the store and test them. how they feel to you.

Bearcat99
08-06-2006, 10:46 PM
Originally posted by sparx1951:
<span class="ev_code_RED">Redtail</span>

I hope my post you quoted is not out of line?
Otherwise I am makeing progress, got the pedals working and with help on my other thread have the HAT working as well.
Very helpful Forum, thanks for being here.

I do have a queston about gun sites if you have a moment. I have the, (pardon my lack of knowledge), heads up sight on the windscreen and am using it. What is the black sight off to the left side for? Is this a "manal" sight? Flying a P47 ATM. Can I switch?

jim

LMAO!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

I forgot to put my post in....DOLP!!!!

Now I forgot what I was going to say.. but it was good..LOL....

Oh yeah.. something about ordering my pedals from Provantage on a Saturday and getting them by Tuesday I think... and that pedals take a little getting used to.. but once you do you will never go back to a twist or rocker again... Good move....

sparx1951
08-07-2006, 07:34 AM
Originally posted by Bearcat99:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sparx1951:
<span class="ev_code_RED">Redtail</span>

I hope my post you quoted is not out of line?
Otherwise I am makeing progress, got the pedals working and with help on my other thread have the HAT working as well.
Very helpful Forum, thanks for being here.

I do have a queston about gun sites if you have a moment. I have the, (pardon my lack of knowledge), heads up sight on the windscreen and am using it. What is the black sight off to the left side for? Is this a "manal" sight? Flying a P47 ATM. Can I switch?

jim

LMAO!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

I forgot to put my post in....DOLP!!!!

Now I forgot what I was going to say.. but it was good..LOL....

Oh yeah.. something about ordering my pedals from Provantage on a Saturday and getting them by Tuesday I think... and that pedals take a little getting used to.. but once you do you will never go back to a twist or rocker again... Good move.... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I thought it was somethiing like that, but you're the Mod so I wanted to go easy on you! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I am beginng to get adjusted to the pedals, just not always certain on how much and when to use the rudder in turns, but in time. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
jim

TgD Thunderbolt56
08-07-2006, 07:36 AM
Originally posted by sparx1951:
<span class="ev_code_RED">Redtail</span>

I do have a queston about gun sites if you have a moment. I have the, (pardon my lack of knowledge), heads up sight on the windscreen and am using it. What is the black sight off to the left side for? Is this a "manal" sight? Flying a P47 ATM. Can I switch?

jim


The metal sight on the left of the HUD is a manual sighting aid. It's not of much use without the ability to lean over and center in front of it. It's really onlt there for cockpit modelling accuracy.


TB

sparx1951
08-07-2006, 08:53 AM
Originally posted by TgD Thunderbolt56:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sparx1951:
<span class="ev_code_RED">Redtail</span>

I do have a queston about gun sites if you have a moment. I have the, (pardon my lack of knowledge), heads up sight on the windscreen and am using it. What is the black sight off to the left side for? Is this a "manal" sight? Flying a P47 ATM. Can I switch?

jim


The metal sight on the left of the HUD is a manual sighting aid. It's not of much use without the ability to lean over and center in front of it. It's really onlt there for cockpit modelling accuracy.


TB </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks, now I don't feel so bad attempting to find a command to move to windscreen center.

Jim

TgD Thunderbolt56
08-08-2006, 10:36 AM
Hey Sparx1951, how you coming along getting online? TeamSpeak? etc,..

TB

sparx1951
08-08-2006, 12:02 PM
Originally posted by TgD Thunderbolt56:
Hey Sparx1951, how you coming along getting online? TeamSpeak? etc,..

TB

Not online or set up with Teamspeak.
I connected my CH throttle yesterday and it did not work and it fouled all my settings for the joystick and pedals. (I had a back up file so I can still play without the throttle connected)http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I have to plow through the CH Manager tutorials and attempt to set up inside CH manager, as per peeps recommendations. First I have to upgrade from 3.6 to 4.0 CH MGR.

I am not eager to lose my ability to play if I lose settings in an attempt to employ the CH MGR to make the three controls work. There is more to study and learn than anticipated.

Later today I hope to get something working through the CH MGR using DX I think a poster called it.

Thanks for your concern Thunderbolt. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Can I get a headset at Best Buy?
sparx1951

TgD Thunderbolt56
08-08-2006, 12:13 PM
I have the same setup as you (FS+PT+PP) and I've always just used the in-game settings to program all my flight functions. I think the problem you're having is the result of plugging in another controller AFTER you've already setup the other controls. Any time you add a controller, It potentially (read 'always' for me) changes the controller ID of the ones I had plugged in and working requiring me to go back and reassign the keys.

I'd recommend plugging them all in, let windows find them, then calibrate them in Control Manager. Once you have them all installed and calibrated you can go into the game and assign all your buttons and keys. They should never require resetting again unless you unplug one or the other. If you choose NOT to use your pedals, I'd still plug them in and have them identified/calibrated so that when you DO decide to implement them you're good to go.

Again, If you continue to have difficulty you can get on TeamSpeak. I'd be glad to help you out 'on coms'.


TB

sparx1951
08-08-2006, 02:22 PM
TGD
I sent you a PM.
Sparx

sparx1951
08-09-2006, 04:23 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I have the (3) devices working together now!

First I unplugged the joystick and pedals, rebooted. Then I removed 3.6 CH Control software with the remove programs in Control Panel.

I shut down, plugged in all (3) the JS Pedals and Throttle. I rebooted Windows did its thing.

Then I installed 4.0 CH Manager. Then the CH Manger installed drivers EXCESSIVELY. I don't think I ever saw more repetitive driver installations since I have been building computers! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

I calibrated the devices in CH manager.

Then I ran up IL-2 and assigned the joystick stick axis, the throttle axis and the rudder in the GAME at the bottom under "HOTAS".

Started the game and some (of course) were reversed but I got that squared up and was able to fly! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif But I was blind with the joystick and/or throttle HAT. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

So I fiddled by replacing values from my back up file into the active ini file but it did not work very well. Then I again assigned the joystick HAT from within the game and noticed that it was named POV8 and not POV4. So after changing all the 4's to 8's I got eyes again! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

What does "POV" stand for?

I now need to get adjusted to the throttle; I have found the pedals to be very useful.

I have been flying the P-51 with settings on hard and doing fairly well, it does get into a spin if you panic when diving and pull hard on the stick or force the plane in turns.

Thanks for all the assistance so far.
I would like to enter my values for the controllers within CH Control, but ATM I am pleased to have all three working. I will need to read up more on the CH Control method before I will attempt that. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

One more>>> Can the movie be shut off by editing the ini file? (you know the carrier movie when the game starts)
sparx

Sooocool
08-10-2006, 12:58 PM
POV stands for Point Of View.
If, for example, your stick has a hat switch, you might want to use it to "look around", or assign other functions to it.

sparx1951
08-10-2006, 01:46 PM
thanks Cool
jim

Divine-Wind
08-11-2006, 07:50 PM
About disabling the opening movie:
Open IL2Setup, and at the bottom cornor (forgot which one) there should be a box that says 'Intro'. Unchecking it will turn off the intro movie. I think there's one somewhere in the ingame settings, but I forgot where it is, if it's in there.

sparx1951
08-11-2006, 08:58 PM
Devine
Got it! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

leitmotiv
08-15-2006, 07:15 AM
The Logitech Wingman Force 3D is the finest force feedback stick made today, and I speak with authority because I own all the FF sticks made now. All of the horror stories about loss of control with Logitech sticks are from people who do not know about the Logitech Clear Calibration Utility which fixes the sticks instantly---I was not aware of it a year and a half ago and I tossed a perfectly good Logitech FF stick. Having written the above, I just acquired a brand new Microsoft SideWinder Force Feedback 2 stick, and it truly is, as many maintain, the king of FF joysticks---if you can find one. I bought mine on eBay from a guy in Seattle who gets them new from Microsoft employees. This stick is immersion incarnate. You feel like you have a real airplane stick in hand.

Necron2003
08-15-2006, 08:32 AM
I have logitech 3D Pro. Same problems encountered. Can't have it replaced and can't throw 'em. I opened the case and used lighter fluid on the potentiometers and moved the stick around for a bit. I guess it was dust build-up or hardening of the lubricants. It worked fine then.

leitmotiv
08-15-2006, 04:25 PM
The Microsoft SideWinder Force Feedback 2 isn't just the king of FF sticks, it is the king of sticks---I don't even have to use the Brown settings on it to get realistic resistance on the stick---it does it automatically even with Maddox default stick settings. I am massively impressed. Considering the enormous acclaim these sticks received when they were in production, and the booming market in even second-hand ones, I can't understand why Microsoft doesn't put them back in production.