PDA

View Full Version : Offset sights?



FlyTyer1970
07-13-2005, 12:50 PM
Could anyone tell me why the reflector sight in bf109 and FW190 is offest to the right?

Hoarmurath
07-13-2005, 12:54 PM
shift+F1

FlyTyer1970
07-13-2005, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by Hoarmurath:
shift+F1

Sorry but how does that answer my question?

Nubarus
07-13-2005, 01:18 PM
Because with most people the right eye is the dominant eye.

FlyTyer1970
07-13-2005, 01:23 PM
So it's that simple. Was the sight offset in other planes also or was it just primary the 109 & 190 that had it offset?

Nubarus
07-13-2005, 01:30 PM
I am sure there are more plains that have an offset gunsight but the majority of the Allied planes have it in the centre.

FlyTyer1970
07-13-2005, 01:47 PM
Thanks for the reply!

Stigler_9_JG52
07-13-2005, 01:53 PM
The answer is that it WAS offset to the right for reasons of "right eye dominance" in your average pilot.

But, it did NOT have very much effect in combat, such as IL-2 suggests. Pilots using these sights were no more or less capable of using them than pilots with centered gunsights. Only in the case of extreme Gs would the head and body be moved enough to disrupt the angle necessary to see the reflected gunsight. Because of binocular vision, the sight would seem centered in either configuration. But, because our view through our monitors is NOT binocular, you get the sight appearing like it's "halfway off the glass", when this effect should only happen with Gs piled on (which does also occur on all sight pictures).

LStarosta
07-13-2005, 01:56 PM
Aryans could only aim with their right eye.

JG7_Rall
07-13-2005, 01:58 PM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
Aryans could only aim with their right eye.

What? That's blasphemous. Arians can do anything....they CHOSE to aim with their right eye http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif



Disclaimer: If you take that the wrong way and assume I'm saying Arians are superior, you're a moron.

LStarosta
07-13-2005, 01:59 PM
Sh1t, they're not?

jessi1
07-13-2005, 02:11 PM
Skinheads have more hair than brains.....oopss..hehe..wrong forum...proceed.

LStarosta
07-13-2005, 02:14 PM
What? Me? A Skinhead?


I have this much hair:
http://myspace-924.vo.llnwd.net/00145/42/95/145305924_l.jpg

JG7_Rall
07-13-2005, 02:15 PM
If you dont know who that's a picture of, consider your life worthless and in dire need of termination.

LStarosta
07-13-2005, 02:17 PM
Originally posted by JG7_Rall:
If you dont know who that's a picture of, consider your life worthless and in dire need of termination.

That sounded just a tiny notch too Aryan.


However, considering the global crisis we are experiencing at the moment, I concur.

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by JG7_Rall:
If you dont know who that's a picture of, consider your life worthless and in dire need of termination.

Unfortunately, I know who he is. Barely. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

I hate running. I love to play soccer(football). Ironic, huh?

LStarosta
07-13-2005, 03:06 PM
Originally posted by han freak solo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG7_Rall:
If you dont know who that's a picture of, consider your life worthless and in dire need of termination.

Unfortunately, I know who he is. Barely. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

I hate running. I love to play soccer(football). Ironic, huh? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I find it hilarious when soccer and football players complain of shin splints. Pu$sies.

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 03:17 PM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
I find it hilarious when soccer and football players complain of shin splints. Pu$sies.

Nice shot! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

I never had that ailment. Just torn ligaments, burst vessels in my shin that leaked into my foot for several days, dislocated fingers and thumbs, etc. All from Futbol!

Slechtvalk
07-13-2005, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by Hoarmurath:
shift+F1

Looking at your sig makes me think.
1200 feet = 365 meter (out of range).

Now I must be an ace because I can shoot planes at even 500 meter or more with not that much trouble.

Your sig must be wrong.

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 03:33 PM
Originally posted by Slechtvalk:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hoarmurath:
shift+F1

Looking at your sig makes me think.
1200 feet = 365 meter (out of range).

Now I must be an ace because I can shoot planes at even 500 meter or more with not that much trouble.

Your sig must be wrong. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ROTFL http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Chuck_Older
07-13-2005, 03:34 PM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
What? Me? A Skinhead?


I have this much hair:
http://myspace-924.vo.llnwd.net/00145/42/95/145305924_l.jpg

Looks like some Postfontaine hippie http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
Looks like some Postfontaine hippie http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Chuck_Older
07-13-2005, 03:49 PM
Actually, though, I found the film to be quite good

LStarosta
07-13-2005, 03:49 PM
Which one?

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 03:51 PM
Back to the thread at hand.

How about an offset sight for a pirate with an eyepatch on his right eye? Until this oversight is corrected the bastid pirate can't fly Luft planes.

Ninjas will rule the skies!

Chuck_Older
07-13-2005, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
Which one?

There's more than one about Prefontaine? the one I saw was made in the '80s I beleive

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 04:18 PM
Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LStarosta:
Which one?

There's more than one about Prefontaine? the one I saw was made in the '80s I beleive </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

OT! OT! OT!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif I saw the one with Jared Leto. Shhhh.

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 04:32 PM
This thread's been hijacked. Time to call in Delta Force!!

http://www.lssdigital.com/Chuckie.jpg

Slechtvalk
07-13-2005, 04:43 PM
Please be serious.

This is about an offset sight which is a serious problem with il-2.

Chuck_Older
07-13-2005, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by Slechtvalk:
Please be serious.

This is about an offset sight which is a serious problem with il-2.

No, it's not a serious problem at all. Perfectly realistic to be that way. If there is a problem, it's with the common practice of not reading the documentation. And despite that, there wasn't a single RTFM comment made.

The very first reply in this thread gave succinct and correct advice for offset sight correction, read it for yourself. The original poster was confused by this reply, and the answer was clarified. The issue was resolved to his satisfaction, and everyone lived happily ever after

LStarosta
07-13-2005, 05:33 PM
Originally posted by han freak solo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LStarosta:
Which one?

There's more than one about Prefontaine? the one I saw was made in the '80s I beleive </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

OT! OT! OT!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif I saw the one with Jared Leto. Shhhh. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The one with Jared Leto sucked. Try to find a movie called Without Limits with Billy Crudup, Donald Sutherland and Monica Potter. It's a much better representation of Pre's character and personality, and the film is technically much better written and put together.

The Leto flick lost all credibility for me when some 5 year old kid played Pre in junior high. And that was the very beginning of the movie. Furthermore, it's hard to take it seriously when Al Bundy plays the immortal Bill Dellinger.

Seriously, "Without Limits" totally beats "Prefontaine".



BTW, Chuck (or Han), seeing as you're such an old fart, relatively speaking, I was wondering if you remember anything about Pre from when you were growing up. Unfortunately, I was not alive when Pre was, so I was hoping you could tell me something you recall about him, since you pretty much knew who he was from that pic.

Bearcat99
07-13-2005, 09:28 PM
P-47D 10s & 22s also have offset sights.

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 09:43 PM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
BTW, Chuck (or Han), seeing as you're such an old fart, relatively speaking, I was wondering if you remember anything about Pre from when you were growing up.

I smell like that remark! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Honestly, I didn't know who Prefontaine was until the 1990's. When I was a lad in the '70s, I had a lot of World Cup footage stuffed down my throat with Pele in action from the '50s and 60's. It was shown to us on FILM PROJECTORS! OH MY GAWD!!

I really respect long distance runners. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif A friend of mine from my high school soccer team was also on the high school cross country team. Any long distance running takes a lot more dedication and perserverance than I was EVER willing to invest.

My goals were short term. Since I was a defender, my goal was not to allow goals! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I quit playing at age 32 after ripping the ligaments in both my ankles. Right ankle, 1st game of that season. Left ankle, 16 games later. You can actually hear them rip. It sounds like tearing cloth. Freaky!!

han freak solo
07-13-2005, 09:48 PM
Originally posted by Bearcat99:
P-47D 10s & 22s also have offset sights.

Good point! We gotta warn the pirates! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Hoarmurath
07-13-2005, 10:39 PM
Originally posted by Slechtvalk:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hoarmurath:
shift+F1

Looking at your sig makes me think.
1200 feet = 365 meter (out of range).

Now I must be an ace because I can shoot planes at even 500 meter or more with not that much trouble.

Your sig must be wrong. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

My sig come from an US gunnery manual (1943 iirc)... If you obtain consistent results at greater range with US fighters, you can assume that either you're an ace, or the sim is wrong. My sig is just what was learned to US fighter pilots during ww2.

If you have so many doubts about you being an Ace, you can as well jump to the conclusion that the sim is wrong.

Once you have determined that the sim is wrong, you are welcome to open a thread about the sim having overmodelled .50 US HMGs, then you will have the great pleasure of being called a luftsomething just because you dared consider a wartime USAAF gunnery manual as a reliable source about these weapons effectiveness.

I think it is better to keep considering my sig as a joke, and forget quickly where it come from, it is much safer for you. Your antivirus could not be as good as mine and some of the viruses sent to you by faithful defenders of the holy M2 could harm your computer.

If you manage to go through all this without beginning to consider that these faithful defenders of the holy M2 are a bunch of morons and nationalists jerks, then you are better than i am.

LStarosta
07-13-2005, 10:45 PM
Hoarmurath, stop changing the subject. We're talking about Pre here.

Hoarmurath
07-13-2005, 10:54 PM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
Hoarmurath, stop changing the subject. We're talking about Pre here.

i didn't changed the subject, Slechtvalk did. You can of course adress him a new post asking him to stay on subject, then you can adress one to all the people that posted something OT, including yourself.

But maybe it is my answer to Slechtvalk that disturb you? i can understand if you are a faithful defender of the holy M2. Then i would apologize in advance for considering you as a moron and a nationalist jerk. Sincerely, i'm sorry.

Cajun76
07-14-2005, 12:30 AM
Apparently Hoarmurath (apology accepted, btw) is also a defender of the M2, as his sig shows a simple graphic to remind pilots not to fire too far beyond convergence, and it's hardly the only reference to convergence, aiming or effective range in the entire manual, I would think.

Perhaps he would be kind enough to post the other bits from this US gunnery manual he has, or better yet, post some tantalizing snips from some 1943 French fighter plane gunnery manuals....

Slechtvalk
07-14-2005, 01:06 AM
Originally posted by Hoarmurath:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LStarosta:
Hoarmurath, stop changing the subject. We're talking about Pre here.

i didn't changed the subject, Slechtvalk did. You can of course adress him a new post asking him to stay on subject, then you can adress one to all the people that posted something OT, including yourself.

But maybe it is my answer to Slechtvalk that disturb you? i can understand if you are a faithful defender of the holy M2. Then i would apologize in advance for considering you as a moron and a nationalist jerk. Sincerely, i'm sorry. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are truly a wise men and I am wise enough that it's hopeless trying to convince anyone that shooting isn't realistic (anymore) in this simulator/game and this isn't about US guns I am a real ACE since I can do it with all (non-US) guns.

So yes I got personal issues NOT with your picture which I love but about how realistic shooting is in this game/simulator especially on long ranges.

Hoarmurath
07-14-2005, 01:46 AM
Originally posted by Cajun76:
Apparently Hoarmurath (apology accepted, btw) is also a defender of the M2, as his sig shows a simple graphic to remind pilots not to fire too far beyond convergence, and it's hardly the only reference to convergence, aiming or effective range in the entire manual, I would think.

Perhaps he would be kind enough to post the other bits from this US gunnery manual he has, or better yet, post some tantalizing snips from some 1943 French fighter plane gunnery manuals....

ask butch2k, it is its USAAF gunnery manual, he only authorised me to use this picture as a sig... btw in 1943 free french forces were using english, russian, and US planes, so they were using the same manuals (and as most were not fluent in russian or english, it was a real problem for them)

Hristo_
07-14-2005, 06:37 AM
here's why Allied planes had centered gunsights...

http://www5c.biglobe.ne.jp/~amazon66/icons/item003/cyclops_s.jpg

Monson74
07-14-2005, 07:04 AM
Who cares? - real men fire their cannons from the hip http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Grue_
07-14-2005, 11:35 AM
Real men have their cannon between their legs.

German planes only have little windscreens so the offset sight means you can see where you're going! Simple http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

Chuck_Older
07-14-2005, 12:21 PM
Originally posted by LStarosta:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by han freak solo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LStarosta:
Which one?

There's more than one about Prefontaine? the one I saw was made in the '80s I beleive </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

OT! OT! OT!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif I saw the one with Jared Leto. Shhhh. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The one with Jared Leto sucked. Try to find a movie called Without Limits with Billy Crudup, Donald Sutherland and Monica Potter. It's a much better representation of Pre's character and personality, and the film is technically much better written and put together.

The Leto flick lost all credibility for me when some 5 year old kid played Pre in junior high. And that was the very beginning of the movie. Furthermore, it's hard to take it seriously when Al Bundy plays the immortal Bill Dellinger.

Seriously, "Without Limits" totally beats "Prefontaine".



BTW, Chuck (or Han), seeing as you're such an old fart, relatively speaking, I was wondering if you remember anything about Pre from when you were growing up. Unfortunately, I was not alive when Pre was, so I was hoping you could tell me something you recall about him, since you pretty much knew who he was from that pic. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

hey, I'm not even 34 yet

I knew a guiy who was a really good X-country runner in High School. He had mentioned Steve Prefontaine sometime or another. I graduated in '89

han freak solo
07-14-2005, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
hey, I'm not even 34 yet


Don't worry, you won't smell until you hit 40.

I've been stinkin' since February '05. That's the biggest reason I will never meet any of you IL2 forum people. I'm looking out for your interests.

And I bet your interested in not smelling me! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Chuck_Older
07-14-2005, 01:20 PM
I've got a wire brush I'd let you have if you promised to saok it in gasoline when you're done http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

JG7_Rall
07-14-2005, 01:22 PM
Indeed. Get Without Limits. Steal it if you must.



and LOL @ Hristo's pic.

han freak solo
07-14-2005, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
I've got a wire brush I'd let you have if you promised to saok it in gasoline when you're done http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I suppose you'd want me to light it when I was done?

Capt.England
07-14-2005, 05:15 PM
Originally posted by JG7_Rall:
If you dont know who that's a picture of, consider your life worthless and in dire need of termination.

It's that bloke from the British 118 advert!

horseback
07-14-2005, 05:32 PM
Originally posted by Hoarmurath:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Cajun76:
Apparently Hoarmurath (apology accepted, btw) is also a defender of the M2, as his sig shows a simple graphic to remind pilots not to fire too far beyond convergence, and it's hardly the only reference to convergence, aiming or effective range in the entire manual, I would think.

Perhaps he would be kind enough to post the other bits from this US gunnery manual he has, or better yet, post some tantalizing snips from some 1943 French fighter plane gunnery manuals....

ask butch2k, it is its USAAF gunnery manual, he only authorised me to use this picture as a sig... btw in 1943 free french forces were using english, russian, and US planes, so they were using the same manuals (and as most were not fluent in russian or english, it was a real problem for them) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

They also had a helluva time with yards and feet too, I understand. There was an article in Air & Space a year or so ago by a Frenchman who did his aviation cadet training in the US during the war. The conversion of feet to meters was a major topic of conversation in the barracks...

cheers

horseback

PS-I ran high school cross-country in Arizona from 68-70. Our coach was mortified that a guy with Prefontaine's haircut was allowed to compete...