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dogstar4000
08-01-2005, 05:03 AM
Hi,

Does anyone on here have or know the location of a good Hurricane tutorial/guide?
Cheers.

danjama
08-01-2005, 05:29 AM
Nope sorry, but its slow, rugged, nice guns, stable platform, stay high and fast and youll be ok. Dives well too, so if you get a plane like a La that cant dive for nothin, just dive away! If he follows hell lose his wings http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif just keep altitude and dive on prey.

F19_Ob
08-01-2005, 06:52 AM
sorry dont know of any manuals....but here's my ideas for optimising its performance Online.
I describe it with german opposition wich is most common.
-----------------------------------


The Hurricane performs most maneuvers best in medium speed, and become slow in roll and generally sluggish at high speeds aswell very poor at very slow speed where it quickly loses energy and take too long to regain it.

To fly the hurricane well is a juggling act to keep the speed at a medium level in combat and retain as much of it when maneuvering against better planes , like 109's wich do everything better exept turn in medium speed. Many dont know this but a 109 actually can outturn a hurricane in fastest and slowest speeds.
In high speed a 109 can throttle back and pull hard inside the hurricane, wich cant declerate as fast or turn well in high speeds. So the 109's ability to declerate faster makes it able to overtake a hurricane this way.
In slow speeds the hurricane also become sluggish. It still turns well but only a very limited time and bleeds E quickly. The 109 in such a situation can climb steeply from very slow speed and the hurricane cant follow, or he just can accellerate away in level flight and be out of the hurricanes range in a few seconds.

Online, in hurricanes I gain as much height as possible over my own field because it climbs poorly compared to its main opposition, the fw190 and bf109. So climbing in the battlearea is out of the question.
A hurricane is always on the defensive against german fighters because it cant engage or leave a fight at will like they can.

If U have to dive away from a gaggle of 109's make sure to do a hard spiral dive, wich keeps your speed down, so u can maneuver, and at the same time make yourself harder to hit.
Diving down to the deck is a bad idea, but drawing the enemy closer to your friendly lines is better. Optimal is u can dive down into clouds. This has enabled me to escape situations where it's normally unlikely to escape.

Convergence I set to 300m in both machinegun and cannon equipped hurricanes, wich enable an ok hitpattern at 600m aswell. An average experienced 109 or fw190 pilot will only give a detected hurricane ranges at 300m or longer to shoot at. This because after a normal turn a hurricane has bleed energy and regains it slowly whereas a 109 can pull away and quickly be out of range.

This is why it's good to practise deflectionshooting at long range in the hurricane.
It's no use to fire at an experienced 109 at ranges greater than 400m with light mg's but with cannons it's good up to 600m or more because a single hit may cripple the enemy and allow the hurricane to catch up. light mg's still need lots of hits unless a lucky shot hits a vital spot.

with light mg's one rely more on luck ,such as bounces, and it's not unusual that a 109 gets away from a group of hurricanes but the opposit is very unlikely.
With cannons the hurricane is equal to the german planes in armament, but to be really effective the pilot must be a good longrange shooter because of the energy differense compared to the axis.

It,s important not to forget that the german planes always dictates the fight and the hurricane is the one on the disadvantage and should adjust the tactics accordingly.

Sometimes luck is a factor though and one can shoot down perhaps several german planes in a sortie, but then one have to recognize that it was because the enemy made a mistake and not because of the performance of the hurricane versus the germans.

Well, a few tips for online. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Low_Flyer_MkII
08-01-2005, 03:02 PM
Beg steal or borrow a copy of "Fighter Pilot" by Paul Ritchey. It's recently been re-published in paperback in the U.K. I've posted the following before but if you're interested in flying a Hurri I hope you find it useful, Ritchey certainly puts over what it was like to fly the Hurri.

Another good reference book is "Hurricane" by Edward Bishop - Airlife publishing, 1986. ISBN 0 906393 62 0. Worth scouring second-hand bookshops for.

.................................................. ...............................................
Posted 26.October.2003 14:54
Just been reading, thought some of you might find it interesting...
(That's a 'u' in P*ssy BTW - I appear to have been censored )
.................................................. ...............................................

FORMATION PRACTICE

Soon we were in our cockpits, most of us in shirtsleeves in the heat. Engine after engine burst into life and was run up by its pilot. The Bull's order came clearly over thre R/T: "Come on, we're off! We're off!" He taxied past, followed by Hilly Brown and Leslie Clisby, who formed his section of three. Then came Johhny Walker,P*ssy Palmer and Sergeant Soper, the Red Section of "A" Flight, followed by Prosser Hanks, myself and Stratton, the Yellow Section. Next came "B" Flight - Leak Crusoe, Boy Mould, Sergeant Berry (Blue Section), and Billy Drake, Sergeant Clowes and Sergeant Albonico (Green Section).

The fifteen Hurricanes move forward together with a deep roar, slowly at first, then gathering speed. Tails come up, and controls get more feel. Bump-bump-bump. Almost off. A bit frightening, this take off. We fly! No...down we come again. Bump...Blast! Must have been a down-draught...Hold it! We're off now - straight over the cliff edge 400 feet above the sea. I see Prosser shut his eyes in mock terror. It is an odd feeling. As usual, I start to talk to myself. Wheels up. Keep in. Stick between knees. Come on, bloody wheels! Dropping behind a bit. Open your throttle! More! Wide! Ah, there are the two pretty red lights: the wheels are locked up. Now get in closer, for God's sake! The Bull's giving it too much throttle, blast him! Anyway - I'm tucked in now. That's fine.

"Sections astern - Sections astern - Go!" over the R/T from the bull. Back drops my section of three, a little left and underneath. Don't waffle, P*ssy, or I'll chew up your tail! Up we climb. Phew, it's hot! But I'll bet it looks nice. Hope so anyway.

Out we go over the sea. Flying south I think. Yes, there's the far side of the Seinne. "Turning right - turning right a fraction!" from the Bull. Round and out to sea again. Keep below Prosser in the turn - that's right. Hell, the sun's bloody bright! I can't see Prosser's wing when he's above me in the turn. Don't hit him! Watch his tailplane! The Bull again: "Coming out - coming out!" We straighten. Ah, that's better - I can see now. And the Bull once more: "For Number 5 Attack - Deploy - Go! Sections-line-astern - Go! Number 5 Attack - Go!"

Open out a bit. There goes Johnny. Now P*ssy. Soper. Prosser next. Now me. Down I go. Watch "B" Z Flight and synchronize with them. Pull up now. Fire! Break away quickly. Roll right over and down to the right. Rejoin. Where's Prosser got to? Can't see a bloody thing. Ah, there he is, up there. Full throttle! Up - up - cut the corner. Here we come behind him. Throttle back or you'll pass him. And there we are again, back in line-astern.

Prosser's waggling his wings. That means form Vic. "Re-form! - Re-form!" from the Bull. "Turning right now!" Towards Havre? Yes, there it is dead ahead. "Sections-echelon-starboard - Go!" Right goes my section. Up. Left. Keep in! There, that's nice, really nice. The whole squadron is now in Vics of three aircraft and the five Vics are echeloned to starboard. now, fingers out please 1 Squadron. Hope we don't overshoot. No, here we go. "Peel off - peel off - Go!" says the bull. His section banks left in formation beyond the vertical and disappears below. Johnny's section follows. Don't watch them - keep your eyes glued to Prosser. Here goes my section now. Down, down we dive in tight Vic, turning slightly left. Keep in - tucked right in! Stratton is OK the other side of Prosser. Right a bit. The controls are bloody stiff - must be doing a good 400. Flattening out now. Don't waffle! There goes the harbour. Buildings flashing by. We're nice and low. Keep in! Hold It! Pulling up now - up - over the rise - over the airfield now. Down we go again - just to make the Frogs lie down. Up over the trees - just! Round and back again. Good fun, this. Bet they're enjoying the show down there. I am! Here we go again, skimming the grass and heading straight for the trees. Pull up - up come our noses and we just clear them. Prosser's waving his hand. Break away! There goes Stratton's belly - away we go, nicely timed in a Prince of Wales, and I'm in my own.

What now? God, I feel ill! Let's give the old girl a last shake-up. What about an upward roll? Good idea - but watch the others - the air's full of flying bodies! Let's climb. Down in that clear space. Need some space for this. 300-350-360. That's enough. Adjust the tailwheel. Now back with the stick. Gently Up - up - a touch harder now. Horizon gone - look out along the wing. Wait till she's vertical - now look up. Stick central, now over to the right of the cockpit. Round she goes. Stop. Back with the stick. Look back. There's the horizon, upside down - stick forward - now over to the left - and out we roll. Not bad. Oh my god, I'm going to be sick...

Better land. Throttle right back. Slow down to 160 mph. Wheels down. Now flaps. Turn in now. Open the hood. Hold speed at 90. Tailwheel right back. Over the boundary. Hold off a fraction. Sink, sink - right back now with the stick. Bump, rumble, rumble, rumble - fine. No brakes - plenty of room. Tiny bit heavy that one. Not quite right. Oh well. Taxi in - run the petrol out of the carburettor, switch off ignition, brakes off, undo safety and parachute harness and jump out.

I stroll across to join the other pilots. Prosser fixes me with his characteristic dead-pan look.
"You just missed a steeple when we were beating-up Havre, Paul," he says casually.
"Did I?" Equally casual. "Glad I didn't see it!"

.................................................. .................................................. .........................................

CONVERGEANCE SETTINGS

A few days later an air marshall from the Air Ministery paid us a visit. He had come, he told us, to find out out why we had shot down every aircraft we had attacked while the Fighter Command squadrons in England were, in the main, only succeeding in "driving the German aircraft off in an easterly direction", as the communiques delicately phrased it.

Since we were no longer under the jurisdiction of Fighter Command we had no hesitation in telling the air marshall the reason.

All single-seat eight-gun squadrons in Fighter Command - both Hurricanes and Spitfires - had very poor practice shooting results before the outbreak of war. We all used the "Dowding Spread" at that time - a method of gun-harmonization laid down in accordance with the conviction of our Commander-in-Cheif, Air Marshall Sir Hugh Dowding, that his fighters would never see, let alone engage, enemy fighters.

In theory the Dowding Spread, which was worked out for shooting at enemy bombers from astern, seemed a good idea. Used against a big target, theoretically it produced a wide enough bullet pattern to compensate for aiming error and left sufficient lethal density to destroy such a target. Furthermore, the range laid down - 400 yards - was outside effective enemy defensive fire.

Now we were not armament experts, but we knew about flying and air firing, and we didn't like the Dowding Spread. We reckoned that, even if the experts were right and that at 400 yards' range the bullet velocity was still high enought to prevent tumble, maintain accuracy and penetrate armour (which seemed unlikely), the spread produced by aiming, shooting and random errors combined would be more than enough to drop lethal density below the minimum required for a kill, especially against a small target like a fighter - which WE were not at ALL convinced we would never meet. As for defensive fire from an enemy bomber, we felt his one or two guns hardly stood a chance against the Hurricane's eight. Curiously, the only thing we were wrong about turned out to be this last point.

Fighter Command had dismissed our theories, so during our month's shooting practice in the spring of 1939 we secretly harmonized all our guns on a spot at 250 yards range. Our shooting results on towed air targets showed we were right - we shot them clean away time and time again. Action in France had now proved this point: we had shot down every enemy aircraft we'd attacked.

To the air marshall, and later on to the Air Staff, the case was conclusive. All sigle-seat fighter squadrons were instucted to adopt our method. It was not a moment too soon...

Not long afterwards we made another contribution that was benefit all our fighter squadrond. While still with Fughter Command, in order to facilitate recognition by our observers on the ground the undersides of our wings were painted black on one side, white on the other. We considered thid to be idiotic, since the German aircraft were duck-egg blue underneath and very difficult to spot from below, whereas we stood out like flying chequerboards. So the Bull gave orders for the undersides of our aircraft to be painted duck-egg blue, and this too was later adopted for all RAF fighters.

.................................................. .................................................. .........................................

"By the time No.1 Squadron withdrew from France on 18th June 1940, they had gained a formidible combat reputation. Miraculously, they had destroyed a total of 155 enemy aircraft with only three of their own pilots having been killed, two wounded and one captured".

Fighter Pilot: a personal record of the campaign in France 1939-1940
by Paul Richey 1941.
1990 edition published by Leo Cooper.
ISBN 1-85089-550-3
.................................................. ...............................................

JG7_Rall
08-01-2005, 03:20 PM
That book seems tight. If I had the money or the time to read it, I would...thanks lowflyer for that type-up

dogstar4000
08-01-2005, 04:08 PM
Many thanks, all very helpfull.

The book is now on my Amazon wishlist.

Cheers!

ytareh
08-01-2005, 05:23 PM
I dont wanna be seen as an Ebay sales rep or anything(especially as Im pluggin a book Im selling there elsewhere!) but have you guys ever checked out the great stuff you can get there.Like Im not just talkin about games and computer stuff but books and other "Militaria".tonight I saw a New Zealand guy who runs a mini shop selling photos and cd-rom reprints of original WW2 fighter plane manuals from engine maintenance to combat tactics etc.This guy has stuff that lads in here would die for (maybe even Oleg!-all kinds of THE most indepth tech and performance data from the period.)Just recently I did a search for "Shturmovik"(I guess lots of people dont know its often spelled like that-original russian?)and found models in every concievable material and scale,WATCHES(!),coins,dvds,books etc etc.There was definitely a cd copy of an original Hurricane manual.Have you got the ....I dont know but one of the very popular plane magazines available in all the UK magazine shops ....issue from a month or two ago which was a Hurricane dedicated issue?

TgD Thunderbolt56
08-02-2005, 07:44 AM
As a result of living in Florida for 25+ years and working at a designated hurricane shelter, I have access to stacks and stacks of hurricane guides. Drop me your addy and I'll send you one...or five. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


TB

F19_Ob
08-02-2005, 08:03 AM
Originally posted by TgD Thunderbolt56:

.........and working at a designated hurricane shelter, I have access to stacks and stacks of hurricane guides........

TB

Is there something U don't know or do m8?.. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

Any other surprizes? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

LStarosta
08-02-2005, 08:31 AM
Originally posted by F19_Ob:
sorry dont know of any manuals....but here's my ideas for optimising its performance Online.
I describe it with german opposition wich is most common.
-----------------------------------


The Hurricane performs most maneuvers best in medium speed, and become slow in roll and generally sluggish at high speeds aswell very poor at very slow speed where it quickly loses energy and take too long to regain it.

To fly the hurricane well is a juggling act to keep the speed at a medium level in combat and retain as much of it when maneuvering against better planes , like 109's wich do everything better exept turn in medium speed. Many dont know this but a 109 actually can outturn a hurricane in fastest and slowest speeds.
In high speed a 109 can throttle back and pull hard inside the hurricane, wich cant declerate as fast or turn well in high speeds. So the 109's ability to declerate faster makes it able to overtake a hurricane this way.
In slow speeds the hurricane also become sluggish. It still turns well but only a very limited time and bleeds E quickly. The 109 in such a situation can climb steeply from very slow speed and the hurricane cant follow, or he just can accellerate away in level flight and be out of the hurricanes range in a few seconds.

Online, in hurricanes I gain as much height as possible over my own field because it climbs poorly compared to its main opposition, the fw190 and bf109. So climbing in the battlearea is out of the question.
A hurricane is always on the defensive against german fighters because it cant engage or leave a fight at will like they can.

If U have to dive away from a gaggle of 109's make sure to do a hard spiral dive, wich keeps your speed down, so u can maneuver, and at the same time make yourself harder to hit.
Diving down to the deck is a bad idea, but drawing the enemy closer to your friendly lines is better. Optimal is u can dive down into clouds. This has enabled me to escape situations where it's normally unlikely to escape.

Convergence I set to 300m in both machinegun and cannon equipped hurricanes, wich enable an ok hitpattern at 600m aswell. An average experienced 109 or fw190 pilot will only give a detected hurricane ranges at 300m or longer to shoot at. This because after a normal turn a hurricane has bleed energy and regains it slowly whereas a 109 can pull away and quickly be out of range.

This is why it's good to practise deflectionshooting at long range in the hurricane.
It's no use to fire at an experienced 109 at ranges greater than 400m with light mg's but with cannons it's good up to 600m or more because a single hit may cripple the enemy and allow the hurricane to catch up. light mg's still need lots of hits unless a lucky shot hits a vital spot.

with light mg's one rely more on luck ,such as bounces, and it's not unusual that a 109 gets away from a group of hurricanes but the opposit is very unlikely.
With cannons the hurricane is equal to the german planes in armament, but to be really effective the pilot must be a good longrange shooter because of the energy differense compared to the axis.

It,s important not to forget that the german planes always dictates the fight and the hurricane is the one on the disadvantage and should adjust the tactics accordingly.

Sometimes luck is a factor though and one can shoot down perhaps several german planes in a sortie, but then one have to recognize that it was because the enemy made a mistake and not because of the performance of the hurricane versus the germans.

Well, a few tips for online. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Sexy words.