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Avl521
01-10-2011, 04:43 AM
More to point it out since no one seems to have written about it yet.

We all wondered what's with that whole last moments with Cesare at Viana.
The whole "No man can murder me!" issue kept everyone kinda asking what he meant.

Now playing through Project Legacy, we have a prominent part of the game that involves The Shroud.

Now, there's a memory on the Holiday pack of Project Legacy in which Assassins claim that it seems the Shroud shows the shape/image of the last man it healed. And that the image has changed through history to match the last man that somehow used it?

There's also a Mnemonic set called The Shroud Of Turin. It's pieces are: Jesus Of Nazareth, Jacques De Molay, Geoffroi De Charnay and... Cesare Borgia?

It has been stated by some historians that it is possible that the images of Jesus of the time were inspired by Cesare's looks, and he certainly looks similar to the common description of Jesus, so, knowing that the modern Shroud Of Turin supposedly has the image of Jesus Of Nazareth in it...

Is it possible the actual person in this image that's present on the shroud is Cesare Borgia?

Please do not bypass the Language Filter.

Oh but I didn't bypass it http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif I just put little "*".
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

obliviondoll
01-10-2011, 04:52 AM
Yes, Cesare is God.

I thought that was obvious?

(sorry. More seriously, though...)

Yes, that rumour has been mentioned before - is a good theory. I won't argue either side though, because I don't trust Facebook apps.

Avl521
01-10-2011, 05:04 AM
Originally posted by obliviondoll:
Yes, Cesare is God.

I thought that was obvious?

(sorry. More seriously, though...)

Yes, that rumour has been mentioned before - is a good theory. I won't argue either side though, because I don't trust Facebook apps.

I'm not stating he's God, I'm stating that he might have been revived by the Shroud after his death at Viana. And that the Shroud now has his image printed on it.

And well, it's a Facebook app, but it's made by Ubi, it links to AC:B, it has Uplay... I think it's fair to trust it specially since it comes from Ubisoft.

misterB2001
01-10-2011, 06:11 AM
What a twist this would be!

TheSpectator
01-10-2011, 06:16 AM
This series has a tight grip on balls and it just won't let go. SOOOOOOO COMPLEX!!!! AGHHHHHHHHHH
SOOOOO MANY POSSIBILITIES!!!!!!

Avl521
01-10-2011, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by TheSpectator:
This series has a tight grip on balls and it just won't let go. SOOOOOOO COMPLEX!!!! AGHHHHHHHHHH
SOOOOO MANY POSSIBILITIES!!!!!!

Lol, a tight grip indeed.

sakaspuds
01-10-2011, 07:35 AM
when the shroud was carbon dated it was found to be old enough to be around in cesares lifetime, but not old enough to be around in jesus time, so make of that what you will (the artifact was created in the Middle Ages, as indicated by carbon dating which placed the artifact between 1260 and 1390)

madjedo1
01-10-2011, 07:47 AM
when the shroud was carbon dated it was found to be old enough to be around in cesares lifetime, but not old enough to be around in jesus time, so make of that what you will (the artifact was created in the Middle Ages, as indicated by carbon dating which placed the artifact between 1260 and 1390)

Thats not exactly the whole story... Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shroud_of_Turin

It remains one of the most controversial artefacts ever

Alpha Ender
01-10-2011, 08:10 AM
Originally posted by madjedo1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">when the shroud was carbon dated it was found to be old enough to be around in cesares lifetime, but not old enough to be around in jesus time, so make of that what you will (the artifact was created in the Middle Ages, as indicated by carbon dating which placed the artifact between 1260 and 1390)

Thats not exactly the whole story... Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shroud_of_Turin

It remains one of the most controversial artefacts ever </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not to mention that if you accept that it was created in the Middle Ages, you disregard that it is a Piece of Eden. In this series, you can't always accept things for what they appear to be. Perhaps the Shroud they have in the Cathedral at Turin is just a replica left behind by the PoE Shroud. Think of something like...like a receipt or a carbon copy. I know it sounds ridiculous, but there's some things you have to accept for certain elements in the game to work.

Just saying.

Johno_efc
01-10-2011, 08:17 AM
Originally posted by sakaspuds:
when the shroud was carbon dated it was found to be old enough to be around in cesares lifetime, but not old enough to be around in jesus time, so make of that what you will (the artifact was created in the Middle Ages, as indicated by carbon dating which placed the artifact between 1260 and 1390)

Some claim Carbon dating is quite inaccurate.

Cesare was revived as a baby using the shroud wasn't he? That's why his image could be on it, not because he'd been revived after the end of AC:B.

***Edit***

I was thinking of Perotto

AntiChrist7
01-10-2011, 08:29 AM
Yeah the theory has been mentioned sometimes, but i don't think Cesare is going to survive. Cause it would destroy one of the strong pillars of the series: make subtle changes to history, but stay in the bounders. Cesare died in 1507 (in real life), so i don't think that at Ubisoft they are going to say "Templars rewrote history, and Cesare actually lived untill 1520". Cause Ubisoft was amways strong in keeping historical accuracy, especially regarding dates. Conrad of montferrat (son of) was in real life murdered by assassins, but not in 1191, so that's why they took his father, who did die in 1191

Avl521
01-10-2011, 08:30 AM
It does remain one of the most controversial artifacts in history.

The carbon dating was supposedly taken from the edge that had been repaired due to a fire, and no further samples were taken, so indeed it could be older than the Middle Ages, or it could not.

However in AC lore, we just know The Shroud is a POE, and that it heals and revives people... or kills them...
And if it actually holds the shape of the last person who used it, and in modern times it supposedly has the shape/image of Jesus. And some people/historians do say that the portraits of Jesus' appearance by that time were based on Cesare Borgia.

I just find all that to be an... interest collection of creepy facts.


Originally posted by Johno_efc:
Some claim Carbon dating is quite inaccurate.

Cesare was revived as a baby using the shroud wasn't he? That's why his image could be on it, not because he'd been revived after the end of AC:B.

***Edit***

I was thinking of Perotto

Actually it was Perotto's son, Giovanni Borgia, who was healed by the Shroud, but by that time, he was just a baby, so I don't think he'd look like Cesare/Jesus at a few months of age.
After Giovanni was healed, and Perotto died, Cesare assumed the role of Giovanni's father.


Originally posted by AntiChrist7:
Yeah the theory has been mentioned sometimes, but i don't think Cesare is going to survive. Cause it would destroy one of the strong pillars of the series: make subtle changes to history, but stay in the bounders. Cesare died in 1507 (in real life), so i don't think that at Ubisoft they are going to say "Templars rewrote history, and Cesare actually lived untill 1520". Cause Ubisoft was amways strong in keeping historical accuracy, especially regarding dates. Conrad of montferrat (son of) was in real life murdered by assassins, but not in 1191, so that's why they took his father, who did die in 1191

Robert De Sable died in 1193, 2 years after the end of AC1. And he was relatively old when he died in 1193, so AC1 TOTALLY changed Robert.
This shows Ubi are not necessarily "accurate" in everything.

So technically, it's not that they're saying: "Templars rewrote history, and Cesare lived until 1520" it's more like: "Templars left out information" which according to the game, they DID left out. Otherwise people would know about Ezio and everything he did by 2012, but since they don't, it's obvious Templars DID rewrite history to their benefit.
Plus if Cesare is revived by The Shroud, it's not something they'll place in history. How would you place in a history book that Cesare died in Viana in 1507, then revived with the help of a mysterious shroud? There are reasons why it wouldn't appear in historical books, it would be dismissed as BS.

AntiChrist7
01-10-2011, 09:09 AM
yes you are right about robert, but still for cesare, i think it would be very unlikely, cause he was a prominent figure (involved in a lot of things), so that would mean that the rest of his life (after 1507) he would have done nothing big at all, like command armies or so, cause that would get a mention for sure. Hardly worth the effort te rewake him then, unless you want him to become a dull accountant at a desk or so

There is also a big difference in letting someone live shorter than actual (which was the case for robert), and to let someone live longer than actual (like for cesare)


Also, he was ill for several months after the poison he got into his system, why not use the shroud to make himself beter? Cause everything fell apart from then on, while he was in his sick bed.

misterB2001
01-10-2011, 09:19 AM
Ezio managed a rather prominent & important life whilst keeping to the shadows. I'm sure Cesare could do something similar

AntiChrist7
01-10-2011, 09:28 AM
Yeah but Ezio was on the assassin side, not the side that rewrote history. And still, what of influence would it have that in modern times we think that cesare died earlier than really was the case? I think for templars it's more important that the way he died (murdered by an assassin) is hidden from us. A bit like how hitler and kennedy died: tricking us into believing that it wasn't a set-up, but just an isolated case.

Alo if he did live longer than originally thought, how come he lost the shroud relativly quickly to Nicolo di pittigliano (who had it in 1509). Seems a bit reckless to lose the thing that saved your life

Avl521
01-10-2011, 09:36 AM
Originally posted by AntiChrist7:
Yeah but Ezio was on the assassin side, not the side that rewrote history. And still, what of influence would it have that in modern times we think that cesare died earlier than really was the case? I think for templars it's more important that the way he died (murdered by an assassin) is hidden from us. A bit like how hitler and kennedy died: tricking us into believing that it wasn't a set-up, but just an isolated case.

Alo if he did live longer than originally thought, how come he lost the shroud relativly quickly to Nicolo di pittigliano (who had it in 1509). Seems a bit reckless to lose the thing that saved your life

If Cesare was revived, they wouldn't mention he lived longer than his death at Viana, that would be unvelievable.
Also, if you remember, Templars became secret too. They were in plain sight during the crusades, but by AC2 they were hidden puppet masters, so they wouldn't reveal a lot about them either just as they wouldn't reveal anything about assassins.
Well the guys weren't exactly careful, what with Giovanni taking the Apple outside as a kid without Cesare noticing until he came back? or the way they allowed him to play with the apple on repeated occasions. And we don't know if he would have lost it. He could have just hid in the shadows continuing his work as Grand Master of the Templar Order, and just like the future templars after him, he could have lent POEs to certain people if he believed it could lead him to more power.
It's really not that hard to make.

misterB2001
01-10-2011, 09:36 AM
I think this thread is testament to how well Ubisoft have done in creating a cliffhanger, absolutely anything is possible!

AntiChrist7
01-10-2011, 09:48 AM
Why couldn't he have lived longer? How many people really saw him falling of the castle? and you could always claim he was injured during the battle, but recovered. And if some people found him dead, it's not too hard to silence them. Cesare isn't the type that sit stills, or operates very secretly. it just seems a waste to let someone who has great commanding skills, let him hide underground

Being the pope (like rodrigo borgia was) is not something i call being secretive. i agree, it was not known he was a templar, but most people in history who were templars, were quite famous (like ford, or edison etc..), it was just not known they were templars. Just like it was not known (during the renaissance) that the borgias were templars.

It are the assassin's who aoperate more in the dark than the templars

Avl521
01-10-2011, 10:18 AM
The templars chose who got recognized for what, so the ones that were famous were famous because the templars wanted them to be.

If Cesare took the role left by Rodrigo as master of the templar order, he'd have to take more care of himself, and plot the way to get to the POEs.

Even if he didn't, who would support Cesare other than the templars? the new pope was against the Borgia. Rome was already under assassin/people's rule. Cesare was exiled and ran after he got his support cut from him, he went to John de navarre and that's the siege of viana.

Considering there was a supposed inscription in his grave in rome that said: "Here lies in ittle earth one who was feared by all, who held peace and war in his hands." so everyone apparently KNEW Cesare was dead. For him to show up in public and cause a panic (and the first report in history of zombies) would be...

And by the way, it is stated templars went underground and undercover before Assassins did, they handled the threads from the darkness, no longer in public.
Then the assassins followed.

I-am-the-peel
01-10-2011, 10:48 AM
Bringing back cesare would be a great idea for the next ac game. Would be a good way for Ezio to die: fighting Cesare and pushing him off a building again but Cesare brings him too the ground with him
To me, this is a good way to end Ezio and introduce someone else. Maybe a french assassin?

AntiChrist7
01-10-2011, 10:51 AM
Srry, but no i can't follow anymore. Do you believe Cesare died and remained dead, or not? Cause i believe the first thing.

and he was (and still is)buried in spain, not in rome. How can you expect that 500 year people knew what went on in another country, with no phone, internet or whatever. I mean that's the whole point of AC, people know little about what really goes on behind the scenes.


He was originally buried in a marble tomb beneath the altar of the Church of Santa Maria in the town with an inscription "Here lies in little earth one who was feared by all, who held peace and war in his hand." In 1537, the Bishop of Calahorra ordered the tomb destroyed and the remains transferred to an unconsecrated site outside the church. In 2007, Fernando Sebastian Aguilar, the Archbishop of Pamplona, allowed the remains to be moved back inside the church on the day before the 500th commemoration of Borgia's death.

My point is just that in renaissance, templars were prominent figures, like for example the pope, or the commander of the papal forces. If they lived longer than generally known, they would come out in the open (without revealing they are templars)

Inorganic9_2
01-10-2011, 01:15 PM
I'm pretty sure that, by the time they got to Italy and back with it, Cesare's body would be too decomposed to revive...

...plus, it's an awful idea. I kind of hate this damn shroud. When something's dead, it's dead (unless you can get to it very shortly after death, which I've heard is possible in some things)

germanosz
01-10-2011, 01:33 PM
Originally posted by I-am-the-peel:
Bringing back cesare would be a great idea for the next ac game. Would be a good way for Ezio to die: fighting Cesare and pushing him off a building again but Cesare brings him too the ground with him
To me, this is a good way to end Ezio and introduce someone else. Maybe a french assassin?
I'm really sorry to kill your hopes, but we see Cesare falling alone. We don't see him crashing, but we see him falling far away from Ezio. Unless he has elastic hands, I don't see how he can grab Ezio..

itsamea-mario
01-10-2011, 01:49 PM
It's not possible to see Ezio die (unless of course he dies during... "contraception")
Also cesare didn't really seem interested in prolonging the templar regime, more about getting as much power for himself as possible.

This does seem like a nice idea, and does make sense, what with his supposed image actually being on the shroud. but Cesare doesn't seem like the recurring badguy type, not the right kind of character for that, someone like al mualim maybe.

Anyone else feel Ubisoft where extremely lucky that all these interesting things with these people happened in history.
For example The reign of rodrigo borgia, coincided with the life of Leonardo divinci.

Avl521
01-10-2011, 02:44 PM
Well, the shroud is there, whether people like it or not.
And yeah Cesare looked like he wanted as much power for himself as possible, but he also seemed to be greedy enough to try and take the power the Templars have.
And we don't know what plans he might have had for the Apple.

But yeah, lots of facts and hints in the games add up, so theories can come from anywhere you look.
I just think the way all this stuff fits is very interesting.
Same with other things in the AC universe... it seems you can add a bunch of historical events + a bunch of hints from the fiction in the game = possibilities that could almost be real.
Not saying that they are, just that they fit extremely well together.

YHHTQ
01-10-2011, 09:00 PM
I believe that Cesare at one point possibly owned The Shroud, having in mind one of the memories available in Project Legacy, but I honestly doubt he was brought back to life using it. My reasons for saying this are...

- ( Supposedly ) some of the people behind Julius Caesar's death tried to bring Brutus back to life using The Shroud and it even though it revived him partly, they failed... In the end, he was still dead.
- In Project Legacy, there's this templar who tries to use The Shroud in order to survive, only to be teared apart from the inside out ( literally...!!! ) by it...

The only individual which we know for sure that actually survived the use of The Shroud was Giovanni Borgia shortley after he was born, IMO, because he was a pure soul, unlike Brutus or even Niccoló... Having in mind the kind of individual Cesare was, I doubt he would be elligible. He simply got owned by Ezio at the Siege of Viana and that's pretty much it, even though I wouldn't be surprised if the PoE he owned all those years actually "lied" to him.

Thus, his own dellusion towards the end...

Ass4ssin8me
01-10-2011, 10:46 PM
Originally posted by Avl521:
More to point it out since no one seems to have written about it yet.

We all wondered what's with that whole last moments with Cesare at Viana.
The whole "No man can murder me!" issue kept everyone kinda asking what he meant.

Now playing through Project Legacy, we have a prominent part of the game that involves The Shroud.

Now, there's a memory on the Holiday pack of Project Legacy in which Assassins claim that it seems the Shroud shows the shape/image of the last man it healed. And that the image has changed through history to match the last man that somehow used it?

There's also a Mnemonic set called The Shroud Of Turin. It's pieces are: Jesus Of Nazareth, Jacques De Molay, Geoffroi De Charnay and... Cesare Borgia?

It has been stated by some historians that it is possible that the images of Jesus of the time were inspired by Cesare's looks, and he certainly looks similar to the common description of Jesus, so, knowing that the modern Shroud Of Turin supposedly has the image of Jesus Of Nazareth in it...

Is it possible the actual person in this image that's present on the shroud is Cesare Borgia?

Please do not bypass the Language Filter.

I have seen it mentioned in the forums, several times but have never asked... What is this Shroud?

TheSpectator
01-10-2011, 11:03 PM
It's a p.o.e that can heal people. Or split them in two.
50/50

Ass4ssin8me
01-10-2011, 11:12 PM
Ah, I see... I don't like the idea of something bringing people back to life then.... Healing is okay, but back to life? I don't like it.

AntiChrist7
01-11-2011, 12:57 AM
Originally posted by YHHTQ:
I believe that Cesare at one point possibly owned The Shroud, having in mind one of the memories available in Project Legacy, but I honestly doubt he was brought back to life using it. My reasons for saying this are...

- ( Supposedly ) some of the people behind Julius Caesar's death tried to bring Brutus back to life using The Shroud and it even though it revived him partly, they failed... In the end, he was still dead.
- In Project Legacy, there's this templar who tries to use The Shroud in order to survive, only to be teared apart from the inside out ( literally...!!! ) by it...

The only individual which we know for sure that actually survived the use of The Shroud was Giovanni Borgia shortley after he was born, IMO, because he was a pure soul, unlike Brutus or even Niccoló... Having in mind the kind of individual Cesare was, I doubt he would be elligible. He simply got owned by Ezio at the Siege of Viana and that's pretty much it, even though I wouldn't be surprised if the PoE he owned all those years actually "lied" to him.

Thus, his own dellusion towards the end...

You just said everything i thought of last night :P Kudos to you

Nobody has ever been succesfully resurrected from death with the shroud, only jezus, and that was just for 3 days. When Nicollo di Pitigliano used it, he was tortured and cushed by it. The only one who survived was indeed Juan Borgia. maybe because he was an infant, and not yet dead

And also we don't know if he had the shroud when Cesare was in Viana. Maybe it was taken from him when he was arrested. Or maybe he had it hidden somwhere in rome, but then got arrested and had no chance of picking it up before he was send to spain

TheSpectator
01-11-2011, 01:01 AM
Originally posted by Ass4ssin8me:
Ah, I see... I don't like the idea of something bringing people back to life then.... Healing is okay, but back to life? I don't like it.
For example it could heal someone with a life threatening hidden blade wound to the stomach http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif but not a man who's been dead for 2 hours.

Avl521
01-11-2011, 10:51 AM
Originally posted by TheSpectator:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ass4ssin8me:
Ah, I see... I don't like the idea of something bringing people back to life then.... Healing is okay, but back to life? I don't like it.
For example it could heal someone with a life threatening hidden blade wound to the stomach http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif but not a man who's been dead for 2 hours. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It supposedly resurrected Jesus after 3 days.


Originally posted by AntiChrist7:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by YHHTQ:
I believe that Cesare at one point possibly owned The Shroud, having in mind one of the memories available in Project Legacy, but I honestly doubt he was brought back to life using it. My reasons for saying this are...

- ( Supposedly ) some of the people behind Julius Caesar's death tried to bring Brutus back to life using The Shroud and it even though it revived him partly, they failed... In the end, he was still dead.
- In Project Legacy, there's this templar who tries to use The Shroud in order to survive, only to be teared apart from the inside out ( literally...!!! ) by it...

The only individual which we know for sure that actually survived the use of The Shroud was Giovanni Borgia shortley after he was born, IMO, because he was a pure soul, unlike Brutus or even Niccoló... Having in mind the kind of individual Cesare was, I doubt he would be elligible. He simply got owned by Ezio at the Siege of Viana and that's pretty much it, even though I wouldn't be surprised if the PoE he owned all those years actually "lied" to him.

Thus, his own dellusion towards the end...

You just said everything i thought of last night :P Kudos to you

Nobody has ever been succesfully resurrected from death with the shroud, only jezus, and that was just for 3 days. When Nicollo di Pitigliano used it, he was tortured and cushed by it. The only one who survived was indeed Giovanni Borgia. maybe because he was an infant, and not yet dead

And also we don't know if he had the shroud when Cesare was in Viana. Maybe it was taken from him when he was arrested. Or maybe he had it hidden somwhere in rome, but then got arrested and had no chance of picking it up before he was send to spain </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

We don't know why Giovanni survived.
The Shroud told Perotto Giovanni was: "BROKEN GOODS" and that he could not be healed, but Perotto kinda ordered The Shroud to heal Perotto. It could be possible that it is because Giovanni is a pure soul, or it could be that you can't heal yourself, but you can heal others. We just don't know how it works, and we know Giovanni was healed, but he then suffered from "Consus" and severe Bleeding Effect in his dreams.

Again, Jesus was resurrected AFTER 3 days, not for 3 days.
And I fixed the name of the Borgia kid for you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Krayus Korianis
01-11-2011, 11:19 AM
Originally posted by germanosz:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by I-am-the-peel:
Bringing back cesare would be a great idea for the next ac game. Would be a good way for Ezio to die: fighting Cesare and pushing him off a building again but Cesare brings him too the ground with him
To me, this is a good way to end Ezio and introduce someone else. Maybe a french assassin?
I'm really sorry to kill your hopes, but we see Cesare falling alone. We don't see him crashing, but we see him falling far away from Ezio. Unless he has elastic hands, I don't see how he can grab Ezio.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You need to read better. He hopes that Cesare comes back and hopes that Ezio falls with him to end Ezio, to make way for a new Assassin Ancestor.

Avl521
01-11-2011, 11:25 AM
Originally posted by Krayus_Korianis:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by germanosz:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by I-am-the-peel:
Bringing back cesare would be a great idea for the next ac game. Would be a good way for Ezio to die: fighting Cesare and pushing him off a building again but Cesare brings him too the ground with him
To me, this is a good way to end Ezio and introduce someone else. Maybe a french assassin?
I'm really sorry to kill your hopes, but we see Cesare falling alone. We don't see him crashing, but we see him falling far away from Ezio. Unless he has elastic hands, I don't see how he can grab Ezio.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You need to read better. He hopes that Cesare comes back and hopes that Ezio falls with him to end Ezio, to make way for a new Assassin Ancestor. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

But even then, as stated before, it's not possible to see ezio die unless he dies while "planting a seed" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

AntiChrist7
01-11-2011, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by Avl521:



We don't know why Giovanni survived.
The Shroud told Perotto Giovanni was: "BROKEN GOODS" and that he could not be healed, but Perotto kinda ordered The Shroud to heal Perotto. It could be possible that it is because Giovanni is a pure soul, or it could be that you can't heal yourself, but you can heal others. We just don't know how it works, and we know Giovanni was healed, but he then suffered from "Consus" and severe Bleeding Effect in his dreams.

Again, Jesus was resurrected AFTER 3 days, not for 3 days.
And I fixed the name of the Borgia kid for you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Ah thanks http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

i don't agree with you completly. according to a chapter in Project legacy, Brutus' followers tried to resurrect him, but it didn't work. So even that "only heal others" is not completly true.

germanosz
01-11-2011, 12:20 PM
Originally posted by Krayus_Korianis:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by germanosz:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by I-am-the-peel:
Bringing back cesare would be a great idea for the next ac game. Would be a good way for Ezio to die: fighting Cesare and pushing him off a building again but Cesare brings him too the ground with him
To me, this is a good way to end Ezio and introduce someone else. Maybe a french assassin?
I'm really sorry to kill your hopes, but we see Cesare falling alone. We don't see him crashing, but we see him falling far away from Ezio. Unless he has elastic hands, I don't see how he can grab Ezio.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You need to read better. He hopes that Cesare comes back and hopes that Ezio falls with him to end Ezio, to make way for a new Assassin Ancestor. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I do... Thanks for correcting me, then http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

FYI (all of you), if the next AC is numbered (ACIII), then forget about Ezio (he might appear in the beginning, but that's all; in that case, what I-am-the-peel said would be possible)

Sorry again; missing one word can be fatal.

Avl521
01-11-2011, 12:36 PM
Yep, pretty much given that ACIII will have a different ancestor.

Ezio might appear at the beginning, or in a Bleeding Effect induced cutscene, but not much more about Ezio.

It's time to let him Requiescat In Pace http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

AntiChrist7
01-11-2011, 12:56 PM
Well yeah, Ezio's stry has run it course, at the end of brotherhood he is like almost 50. Maybe we will kow his last deeds if he writes a codex/diary, like altair did

marbatico
01-11-2011, 01:15 PM
you guys know that we cant see ezio die right? he still has to get the child that becomes one of desmonds ancestors and after that point, we cant follow ezio anymore.

chizzy12
01-11-2011, 01:48 PM
I'm too lazy to read anything...soo yeah

anyway, Cesere Borgia died in 1507 during the assault in Viana. I don't think ubisoft would go against that.

misterB2001
01-11-2011, 02:44 PM
Of course we can see Ezio die........if his kid was around to witness it!

Krayus Korianis
01-11-2011, 05:11 PM
Originally posted by Avl521:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Krayus_Korianis:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by germanosz:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by I-am-the-peel:
Bringing back cesare would be a great idea for the next ac game. Would be a good way for Ezio to die: fighting Cesare and pushing him off a building again but Cesare brings him too the ground with him
To me, this is a good way to end Ezio and introduce someone else. Maybe a french assassin?
I'm really sorry to kill your hopes, but we see Cesare falling alone. We don't see him crashing, but we see him falling far away from Ezio. Unless he has elastic hands, I don't see how he can grab Ezio.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You need to read better. He hopes that Cesare comes back and hopes that Ezio falls with him to end Ezio, to make way for a new Assassin Ancestor. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

But even then, as stated before, it's not possible to see ezio die unless he dies while "planting a seed" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm not disputing that. I'm just correcting the thoughts of another poster so it's easier to comprehend their hopes and dreams.

I honestly don't care if Cesare comes back or Ezio dies. I want a new Ancestor. Or something for AC.

TheSpectator
01-11-2011, 05:45 PM
Originally posted by marbatico:
you guys know that we cant see ezio die right? he still has to get the child that becomes one of desmonds ancestors and after that point, we cant follow ezio anymore.
Unless the child witnesses his death. DUH DUH DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

Masta_Pain
01-11-2011, 05:57 PM
Originally posted by AlphaEnder:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by madjedo1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">when the shroud was carbon dated it was found to be old enough to be around in cesares lifetime, but not old enough to be around in jesus time, so make of that what you will (the artifact was created in the Middle Ages, as indicated by carbon dating which placed the artifact between 1260 and 1390)

Thats not exactly the whole story... Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shroud_of_Turin

It remains one of the most controversial artefacts ever </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not to mention that if you accept that it was created in the Middle Ages, you disregard that it is a Piece of Eden. In this series, you can't always accept things for what they appear to be. Perhaps the Shroud they have in the Cathedral at Turin is just a replica left behind by the PoE Shroud. Think of something like...like a receipt or a carbon copy. I know it sounds ridiculous, but there's some things you have to accept for certain elements in the game to work.

Just saying. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
The Assassin's Creed series doesn't follow the course of history to every detail, it slightly alters it for a better story. In this case the shroud is definitely a PoE.