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View Full Version : Bf109E Speed - a question not a whine!



jasonbirder
10-17-2005, 03:32 AM
I'm pretty new to the game and currently flying the Bf109E-4
Just a question about how I can get it to go faster really...
At low altitude i'm being outrun by Mig1's and Lagg3's which are the opponents i'm flying against...
Is that right (if it is i'll shut up...) If not..what can I do to get the best out of my plane...
The options I can think of don't seem to apply...there is no Yaw/Roll trim in the 109 and I'm pretty sure pitch & mixture are automatic too...nless i'm missing something obvious...
Thanks alot!

strelnik_Sipi
10-17-2005, 03:41 AM
Emil is quite deadly oponent for early russian planes. Fly it high and fast. Once you loose speed advantage its time to disengage and climb again. Just watch the MIG. High up (above 7KM) its better than you.

Jumoschwanz
10-17-2005, 09:07 AM
This 109E is slow compared to many early Russian craft. If you are low and slow in it then you better not run, it is time to fight!

Use your brain and get in a position of altitude advantage over your targets. Then dive on them, fire and get back up high. This is what Hartmann did and it worked for him.

Jumoschwanz

jasonbirder
10-17-2005, 09:14 AM
Thanks for that..so I shouldn't be too concerned if at alow altitudes these guys can pull away from me in level flight?
I was concerned there was a CEM issue i wasn't aware of that meant i wasn't getting the best out of my plane...

Kuna15
10-17-2005, 09:20 AM
LaGG is slower than E, but I find it more manouverable than MiG.
MiG is real Emil killer, it can do most things better than BF-109E, so it is not wise to enter fight on even terms.

Anyway MiG-3 is IMO best early war Soviet frontline aircraft.

Jumoschwanz
10-17-2005, 02:31 PM
Top speeds on deck in km/hr, Smolensk map, patch 4.01 at noon:

109E4 460

109E7b 464

109f2 493

109f4 503

lagg3 495
(1941 model)

lagg3 540
(type66)

I-16 440
(type24)

la-5 552
(1942 model)

Mig3 498
(1940 model)

Mig3u 545

mig3ud 507

P-40-M 473

yak1 471

yak1b 528

SpitVb 468

So the only thing you are going to outrun on an early war server is maybe the I-16, and that is only if he does not have any kind of altitude advantage on you to get a boost.
See why you better have an alt advantage or element of surprise now? At certain speeds, you might be able to OUTCLIMB some of these planes, but you can figure that one out, I don't have time to do everything.

Now, the other thing you might be able to do is out-accelerate the allied craft and get away enough to do something to save your buttt. Here are the acceleration tests on these planes. This is how many km/hr they could reach in the length of a paved runway from a standstill. very interesting....


109E4 347

109E7b 347 (better engine but more weight)

109f2 346 (same engine as E7b, but better streamlined, streamlining doesn't make a difference until at higher speeds)

109f4 350 (bigger engine)

109g2 375 (basically an F4 with even bigger engine)

109g6 362

109g6 362 (note how we are getting slower, 109 was getting heavier. This is why these are the favourite 109s for online/allied biased
late map-builders to use)

109g6 388 (finally beats the 1942 plane)
A/S

I-16
type 24 356 (a little hot rod that will run you down and blow you to bits if you let it get close to you)

P-47 356 (900 times more powerful than the I-16, but 900 times more wieght too)
D-27

Lagg3 322 (a dog at acceleration)
1941

lagg3 354 (good acceleration, I think only around ten of these were made and put to use, but if it is in the allied plane set you had better watch your step around them!)
(type 66)

la-5 363

Mig3 343 (just about as good as 109e4)
1940 model

mig3ud 343

mig3u 354 (fast accelerator, will eat the emil up)

P40-m 321

SpitVb 331
1941 model

SpitVIII 368

Yak1 322

yak1b 348

yak9 349

yak3 365


So there you go, use this information well. You see how much work and testing goes into knowing your favourite plane? HOw much brainwork you have to do to have an edge and be a real online ace? You have to know ALL the details and when to use them. This is why the aces said "always from above, sometimes from level, never from below" or something like that. And why you should start by getting altitude away from danger, then fly into the battle, and learn how to make great deflection shots while traveling 500 to 750 km/hr.

Jumoschwanz

jasonbirder
10-17-2005, 03:45 PM
Cheers for the data Jumoschwanz
Puts everything into perspective!

Vipez-
10-22-2005, 05:54 AM
In short Emil vs Lagg3/Mig3 in 1941 / 1940. Migs are pretty much superior in everything except diving speed and climb (to 5000 meters). Sustained turn is very similar with the Emil, usually the better pilot wins the turn fight between Mig and Emil. Emils only hope against seaasoned Mig pilot is keep the altitude advantage, and use the diving ability to get away from them.. Migs fall apart shortly after 600kmh Ias, While Emils should go >700kmh Ias. If the Mig has the altitude advantage, there is not much the Emil can do.. except hope the Mig pilot is fool enough to carry gunpods which slow down the plane considerably http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

About Lagg.. below 3000 meters Lagg3 series 4 is faster, heavier, should turn slightly worse, and accelerate worse (probably it does not in the game, Lagg s4 allways has been optimized by highest standards by Oleg, not according to serial production Laggs..) Emil should outclimb the Lagg, and Db601 should be superior at altitudes above 4000 m, and above here Emil also should be faster, than Lagg.. so take the fight high, if you are facing Laggs.. if you are facing Migs, you have better chances at sealevel. Emil also can outdive Laggs if you remember Laggs critical diving speed is about 620kmh Ias, after that it should fall apart. Seasoned Lagg-3 pilot does not do this mistake though..

IF you are facing Lagg3s and Mig3s mixxed in Emil, you probably are in trouble http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

JG53Frankyboy
10-22-2005, 06:26 AM
pls keep in mind that in the summer of 1941 a Bf109E wasnt anymore a topnotch fighter !

just its very experienced pilots could keep them up against the modern soviet fighters and their mostly very unexperienced pilots in that time.

oleg said here long time ago if you want have a slightly clue about aircombat in summer 1941 over the UdSSR you should set the LW fighters AI setting at veteran and the soviets in general to rookie with few normals !
but that you cant do online, sure, were all piots are aces and just to hit "refly" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

the most Lusftwaffe fighterunits were equipted with Bf109F anyway.

Levon1981
10-22-2005, 12:55 PM
109f2 493

109f4 503




I don't know why, but in the game the Bf-109F-2/F-4 are much slower than they really were, they accelerate slow, and they don't turn well. Talking about their speed on the sea level, in reality Bf-109F-2(DB-601N, 1200 hp) could reach 515 km/h and Bf-109F-4(DB-601E, 1370 hp) could reach 535 km/h. Besides, the F-4 was armoured much better than the F-2, and unlike the F-2, it was not very vulnarable to a rifle-caliber MG fire. In fact the F-4 was the most successful modification of the Bf-109. Both F-2 and F-4 were very maneuvrable, more maneuvrable than the most of their counterparts. In terms of maneuvrabbility and climb rate, the F-4 was even supperior to the later G-2 and G-6 on low alts, that is the reasons of many Luftwaffe pilots' disappointment: the G-2 and G-6 were much heavier and were much better for so caled "bum and zum" tactics, when the F-4 was very good for both "bum and zum" and "turn and burn" tactics. On top of that, the G-2 and G-6 without the use of MW-50 were even slower on the sea level (515 and 510 km/h respectively) than F-4, and only with the use of MW-50 their speed was over 540 km/h. Unfortunatelly, in the game both F-2 and F-4 are not as good as they realy were, I realy hope that one day Oleg will pay attention on this serious mistake, and will correct it.

Chuck_Older
10-22-2005, 07:20 PM
bum and zum? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif I'm guessing you wanted to type boom and zoom. But I agree

HotelBushranger
10-23-2005, 07:17 AM
Must be Kiwi http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif