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Farran1966
03-14-2008, 09:45 AM
Hello people,

I love the Fw-190 and would love to be able to master it or at least get a lot better than I currently am with this aircraft. Presently, I am rubbish!

Last night over a few ales with a fellow Il2 buddy I said to him I was going to post a request for help and so here I am.

My request is this, would any of you who have mastered this aircraft be prepared to spend maybe an hour or two online and impart some of your knowledge to me and help me to get better?

I realise that this is a big ask but I am not lazy and just trying to cut out the hard work, I have read many of the posts and tips on the Butcher Bird and have tried to apply them with some degrees of success but always find whenever I have a bandit on my 6, it's game over, every time.

Maybe, it's all of my flying that's not that good and the 190 exposes those flaws much easier, I don't know.

Anyway cheers.

JV44_Wubke
03-14-2008, 10:35 AM
Let me know when you are usually online. I am usualy on after 9pm ET, mostly in War Clouds but come and get me. Also get team speak if you dont have it, it will help.

Viper2005_
03-14-2008, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by Farran1966:
...but always find whenever I have a bandit on my 6, it's game over, every time.


It is, unless you're outside gun range and can extend. Usually the game is over long before rounds start flying.

The most important things to work on when flying the 190 are:
<span class="ev_code_red">
- Speed
- SA
- Anticipation
- Gunnery
- Teamwork
</span>
<span class="ev_code_red">Speed</span> is life (insurance). If you're going faster than the enemy, he's going to have a very hard time sneaking up through your low 6 blindspot. Of course, even if you're flying fast you should still periodically check said blindspot...

<span class="ev_code_red">SA</span> is vital because without it you cannot make informed tactical decisions. Of course, you've still got to make the right decisions, but you're far more likely to do so on the basis of good information. The 190 has an excellent cockpit view, so make good use of it!

<span class="ev_code_red">Anticipation</span> is the key to staying fast. If you can work out where your target will be in a few seconds' time then you can manoeuvre gently to point your guns into that bit of sky, thereby paying the minimum energy cost for your firing angle. As with so many things in life, if you're desperate to sell energy for angles in a hurry, the chances are that you won't get a good price...

<span class="ev_code_red">Gunnery</span> is the objective of the exercise. Kill the other guy now and his superior aeroplane and/or his superior stick & rudder skills can't be a factor 2 minutes down the line. If you can take difficult deflection shots then you won't have to spend so much energy buying "better" angles.

<span class="ev_code_red">Teamwork</span> is especially important when flying any energy fighter because when things go wrong and you end up defensive it's extremely difficult either win the ensuing knife fight or to build up sufficient energy to safely extend. However, if the bandit is fixated upon you, the chances are that he won't see your team mate diving in behind him...

Stay fast, and never forget that <span class="ev_code_yellow">the objective of aerial combat is to kill the enemy, not to fight him.</span>

Dustysquareback
03-14-2008, 12:46 PM
"..but always find whenever I have a bandit on my 6, it's game over, every time."

I'm no master in the Shrike, but I can tell you right now, if you've let them get on your 6, and your going under 700 kph, then yeah, it's probably game over.

That bird is the ultimate hit-and-run machine. 1st order of business is to stay on the end of the plane WITHOUT guns poking out of it.

Xiola
03-14-2008, 12:52 PM
Think about fighting in the vertical, not the horizontal which is more natural to a new pilot.

Use you enrgy and speed in the dive to attack and zoom back up out of harms way, this way a lower pilot cannot do anything but defend (imagine a hawk diving on a mouse and flying back up with it)

For practice, use the QMB, the Fw190A4 vs the Spitfire Vb, with you starting 1500m above them, once you can kill two of them without dying you should have cracked it, as you cannot possibly win using horizontal turnfighting, they will be on you in a second.

BUT you outclass them in every other field of WW2 combat.

Cajun76
03-14-2008, 01:15 PM
You need to remember that most engagements are over once someone is on your close six with roughly equal speed. This is the kill position, as I'm sure your been in this position before against your opponent.

What is critical, especially in a fighter like the Focke Wulf, is the seconds leading up to the enemy on your six. If your merging with the enemy and simply hard turning to get on his six, this is not proper tactics.

What's critical as you spot your adversary and merge is to evaluate your speed and energy vs your enemies speed and energy. Most of your eventual success or failure is decided right here. If your opponent is higher and faster, then you need to maneuver so that he loses his altitude and speed advantage. If you are faster and higher, you need to maneuver to maintain or increase your advantage until you get into a favorable position to fire.

I'm purposefully not going into specifics, because depending on what your flying vs your opponent can make a huge difference, and what may work in a Fw-190A may not work in a Fw-190D. Throwing different opponents into the mix like various marks of Spitfire, Mustang, Thunderbolt, Yak or Lavochkin only increases the complexity of the engagement.

I'm confident Wubke or others can help you out, it's just important to note that situation awareness and knowing your and your opponents strength and weaknesses are critical to being successful.

Schwarz.13
03-14-2008, 09:15 PM
Hi Farran.

I have it on good authority that K_Freddie is working on a follow-up turorial to this (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/1561011816/p/1) tutorial. I'm sure when it is ready it will help you immensely http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I also fly the FW190 and have only been playing this superb game for just under a year but i am getting quite good in the 190 now (offline at least).

I think Viper's advice is spot-on but i would like to add one thing: if you are caught with a bandit on your 6 then the Scissors is a wonderful manoeuvre (depending on situation) to master.

Due to the FW190's phenomenal roll rate the Scissors can be very effective once you have mastered it. However, the idea is not to get into such a situation in the first place!

Good luck...

Farran1966
03-15-2008, 03:26 AM
OK guys,

Many thanks for all your advice, I'd better get practicing http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Trinity_Jay
03-15-2008, 07:28 AM
I have been flying this sim since day one (would that be seven years or so?) and concentrated on the Spitfire, Hurricane, 109G-2 and Fw190: planes that are different and possess unique capabilities. With the 190, I would recommend flying online and go for half a tank of fuel. Fly away from the combat zone and gain altitude - go way high, say, 15,000ft. Open rads to cool the engine and then hunt, looking below you for opportunities as well as to see if you're being hunted. Once you see a target, open her up and zoom down going for a quick kill. If you miss, it doesn't matter; just climb and evaluate the situation. If you can, do another dive or fight another day.

You have fantastic roll and use it, but DO NOT dogfight unless necessary. Work as a team and use altitude to get you home. Once you have worked this out, the Butcher Bird is a dream to fly.

Another fuel option is to take 25/50% fuel and drop tanks in case of urgent action is necessary.

It always make me chuckle when I see fresh 190 pilots take off at 2000ft or so and go straight into the combat zone. They're usually doomed.

Bulldog

Ratsack
03-16-2008, 06:38 AM
You can dog fight in the Fw 190 A in this game, even against Spitfire IXs.

The tricks are:

1. Situational awareness. You must be able to keep track of multiple contacts flashing in and out of your blind spots as you roll like a maniac.

2. Speed / energy. Stay fast, keep your energy.

3. Closure. Get close. If you're going to get yourself into a knife fight in the 190 A, you must not let the bandit get far enough away from you to be able to get a gun solution by turning. Remember, it's a good working assumption that your opponent can always out turn you. Keep him so close he CAN'T turn inside you.

4. Roll. There is a season, roll, roll, roll...Use smallish elevator inputs to pull out of the bandit's plane of motion, roll sideways to it, and pull back in, always aiming toward his high six.

5. Anticipate. You are trying to get your guns to where the bandit is going to be. You are therefore rolling to get your plane of motion in line with where his plane of motion is going to be. You must move early, but not so early he can react to you.

6. Snap shooting. You will get scoring shots as the bandit crosses from 2 to 12, or 10 to 12. You must use the triangular quarter windows to aim, but don't succumb to the temptation to try to track him. That way lies death.

7. Blind shooting. You will get scoring shots where the bandit is below the nose. Learn to take these. The four 20 mm cannon of the 190 A make it worth your while.

8. Convergence. Don't set it too short for the 190 A. It's nice to have it at 500 m so the gun fire is nearly parallel. The sheer fire power of the 4 x 20 mm makes short convergence redundant, but the long reach is nice if somebody is stupid enough to go head on with you. It also works best on bombers.

9. Engine management. Learn to keep your engine cool. If you're not fighting or climbing for your life, you should be cooling the motor. The radials run hot in this game.

10. Be the one taking the first shot.

cheers,
Ratsack

Ratsack
03-16-2008, 06:59 AM
However, having said all of the above, it should be added that all of this is a losing strategy. If you end up outnumbered, you're dead. If some bandit screams in with a load of E and no warning, you're dead. If you end up swirling a twirling in the middle of a gigantic fur ball, surrounded on all sides by friend and foe alike, you're about 10 seconds from being dead anyway.

Dogfighting is not a first option, it's the last. The fact you're dogfighting means you didn't get the best of the approach. If you had, he'd be falling in flames and you'd be looking for another target. In small words, if you're dogfighting, you've already made a mistake.

However, I posted the list above to point out that it's not hopeless in the 190 A. If you make a mistake (get bounced, poor SA, get drawn into a fur ball), you can use the Fw 190 A to get you out. The same is true of all fighter types.

cheers,
Ratsack

M_Gunz
03-16-2008, 11:33 AM
It does seem like what is wanted is the secret to always winning at least from those who see
others they can never seem to touch. Might as well search for the Fountain of Youth.

Once you you quit being a mudhen, the mudhens will regard you mightily yet you have only moved
into the realm of hawks and eagles. Good part is there's fewer of those, bad part is they will
occasionally eat your heart and liver.

M_Gunz
03-16-2008, 06:22 PM
Oh yeah and get the prop pitch and rpm down once in a while to build some heat reserve.

WOLFMondo
03-17-2008, 02:52 AM
All good advice.

One other thing helps when in the 190, know your opposition. Finding a Spitfire on your long 6 is a completely different situation to a P51 or P47.