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View Full Version : OT..Can anyone explain this..Water Finders..



MB_Avro_UK
03-20-2007, 05:25 PM
Hi all,

A friend of mine recently bought a large area of land and had to check for underground streams and drains etc.

A guy from the official Water Board in England attended to check for the above.

He used a couple of 'L' shaped metal brackets in each hand and when they 'twitched' he knew that he had found water http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

He was right in his findings.

This procedure is sanctioned by the Water Board in Suffolk, England.

Is this weird?

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

MEGILE
03-20-2007, 05:30 PM
Dowsing... I'd have to see it to believe it.

VW-IceFire
03-20-2007, 05:31 PM
My great uncle has some of these...I tried them out with the rest of my family at their cottage many many years ago. He had a ground water map from the township that he showed us later and we went around with these things...sounds like what you described...and it seemed to work. I'm partially skeptical...but you'd feel a twitch walking over certain areas.

Strangest thing I'd ever tried! Still don't know what to think about it.

I didn't realize this was an accepted procedure somewhere http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

berg417448
03-20-2007, 05:31 PM
It is called dowsing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowsing

VW-IceFire
03-20-2007, 05:37 PM
Originally posted by berg417448:
It is called dowsing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowsing

Ahh fascinating...didn't know that was the name. Certainly doesn't seem possible but back when I was a kid it was a fun thing to try. Seemed to work...but seems like the statistics don't play out.

MB_Avro_UK
03-20-2007, 05:41 PM
Thanks for the replies http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

My friend was with the guy from the Water Board company when he 'found' water.

The metal brackets that the water board guy held in his hands were surrounded by a metal sleeve and were free to rotate.He could not influence the response.

My friend saw the responses and in no way he said could they be due to human interference.

As I said before,the Water Company condoned the practice although they refused to accept any legal liability.

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Phas3e
03-20-2007, 05:48 PM
My father taught me how to do it, its easy as.

We just bent a piece of fencing wire into an L shape and spin it around, to build up energy or what ever, and loosely hold it with you elbow out, the wire will twitch when you pass over water.

I used to practice in the back lawn where dad had water hoses buried as the went to different gardens and it worked every time.
He even used it to find old water pockets once under the local airfield.

x6BL_Brando
03-20-2007, 05:50 PM
I learnt dowsing at Agricultural College many decades ago, using the right-angled wire method. We used it mainly for finding land-drains and underground water-pipes. It worked successfully I recall, even when used by the more cynical in the class, and I used it quite frequently when I went into house-building until it was superseded by CAT-type scanners.

I've also seen the traditional hazel-fork in use a few times, once again with success.

B

fuzzychickens
03-20-2007, 06:01 PM
Dowsing has been proven to be a myth.

What has been shown is that most positive hits with dowsing are attributed to that fact that the water table covers a large area and dowsers "find" the water simply because you could drill a well anywhere and hit water.

When dowsers are put to proper scientific tests, the method fails. Only when dowsers already have knowledge where the water lies do their "hits" become accurate. It's not that they are cheating, it's more subconscious than anything else.

FritzGryphon
03-20-2007, 07:07 PM
It's also laughable to say you can't influence the result.

For example, a right angled wire. You simply tilt it one way, and it'll naturally flop that way.

This is hard to detect by an observer, as only a little tilt is necessary for a huge swing. Just like how one can hold a pendulum with a magic crystal on it, and make it swing with no apparent input.

It's sad enough than a gullible observer would be fooled by this, and even more shocking that the operator would unknowingly fool themselves.

WWSensei
03-20-2007, 07:28 PM
For over 20 years James Randi has had a 1 million dollar prize available to anyone who can provide proof of ESP, telekinesis or dowsing. No one has ever passed his tests to collect.

timholt
03-20-2007, 07:51 PM
I too was a skeptic; however I have not only seen it work, but was given the wires to try myself over a known and mapped underground stream - and it worked again.

Hanglands
03-20-2007, 07:55 PM
Personally I agree with the skeptics.

But its interesting to note that the technique is endorsded by the local water authority.

I can only think that this is because they view it as a 'trade skill' that cannot be disproven (yet)?

fuzzychickens
03-20-2007, 08:04 PM
Originally posted by timholt:
I too was a skeptic; however I have not only seen it work, but was given the wires to try myself over a known and mapped underground stream - and it worked again.

Read on the about tests that show why this is. It's in your subconscious. You KNOW where the water is. Scientific tests where the dowser has NO knowledge of where the water is show it doesn't work.

slappedsilly
03-20-2007, 09:05 PM
I've seen it work on a job site. The owner had called in to get the location but they failed to come out and mark it. I watched a man strip copper wire of its insulation and make two L shaped wands. He balanced them on his fingers and walked until they crossed. They dug there and found the water line. It's just spooky I tell ya.

Phas3e
03-20-2007, 09:15 PM
Originally posted by FritzGryphon:
It's also laughable to say you can't influence the result.

For example, a right angled wire. You simply tilt it one way, and it'll naturally flop that way.

This is hard to detect by an observer, as only a little tilt is necessary for a huge swing. Just like how one can hold a pendulum with a magic crystal on it, and make it swing with no apparent input.

It's sad enough than a gullible observer would be fooled by this, and even more shocking that the operator would unknowingly fool themselves.

If someone wanted to trick a bystander or something then yes, but why you would do it when trying it by yourself is just odd.
I have found that dowzing does work in all sorts of different terrain by myself with noone around to fool, and I wasnt fooling myself, it works.

Breeze147
03-21-2007, 06:53 AM
It absolutely works. I was the biggest skeptic of all time until I attended a course in Harrisburg, PA to introduce us to the latest electronic gear for finding water lines (I work for U.S. Navy Public Works). After classroom sessions we went out into the field for practical application. The electronic gear found about 75% of the water lines we were searching for. A good ol' farm boy from Southern Maryland broke out the dowsing rods and we found 100% of the lines we were looking for. I swore he was somehow influencing the outcome but he gave them to me to try for myself. They absolutely work!!! It has something to do with the Earth's natural magnetic field being interrupted. I don't really know the science of it, only that they do work!

FluffyDucks2
03-21-2007, 12:12 PM
Have to agree with those that say it works too because Ive seen it work and can do it myself despite being a complete sceptic until I had to do a story on an old dowser.
I watched in complete disbelief how his hazel rod twitched in his hands, he allowed me to try it and it worked for me too....it is SPOOKY when the rods move BY THEMSELVES with NO INPUT from me....and anyone who dismisses it is simply ignorant. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

K_Freddie
03-21-2007, 01:40 PM
Originally posted by Breeze147:
.. They absolutely work!!! It has something to do with the Earth's natural magnetic field being interrupted

On reading the first item in the thread, this is exactly what I was thinking. A piece of wire, metal rod acts as an inductor that is sensitive to magnetic fields (same principle as an electrical transformer/solenoid). This is what the nimrod's (and others) MAD (magnetic anomaly) detector is based upon - sudden changes in the earth magnetic field caused by changes of 'local' density caused by a submarine, or in this case water.

It requires one to walk at a consistent speed to produce what is called a flux gradient across the rods. This induces an electric charge in the rod and if 2 rods are in close proximity they will repel each other, similar to magnets. This is most probably the 'twitch' that is talked about.

This is my reasoning off the top of my head... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

FluffyDucks2
03-21-2007, 01:53 PM
Doesn't explain how wooden rods work though http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
The dowser I spoke to was a professional dowser who made his living finding water or whatever else (pipes,cables...etc etc..) and he told me it didn't matter what he used in his hands, as whatever was causing the phenomena worked on the human body somehow. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Many respectable multi-nationals commissioned him and others for various types of dowsing btw.

His preferred item was a forked hazel rod.
I myself have used hazel rods and metal bars etc and can report the phenomena works equally well with either, although the hazel I think gives stronger reactions... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

stathem
03-21-2007, 02:02 PM
Gravitons.

MB_Avro_UK
03-21-2007, 02:21 PM
Originally posted by Breeze147:
It absolutely works. I was the biggest skeptic of all time until I attended a course in Harrisburg, PA to introduce us to the latest electronic gear for finding water lines (I work for U.S. Navy Public Works). After classroom sessions we went out into the field for practical application. The electronic gear found about 75% of the water lines we were searching for. A good ol' farm boy from Southern Maryland broke out the dowsing rods and we found 100% of the lines we were looking for. I swore he was somehow influencing the outcome but he gave them to me to try for myself. They absolutely work!!! It has something to do with the Earth's natural magnetic field being interrupted. I don't really know the science of it, only that they do work!

Hey Breeze147,

Very interesting post http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I've been searching for a scientific link that supports your findings. Do you have anything?

This is a link to the Suffolk Water Authority in England but there is no mention of Dowsing.

http://www.scwa.com/

From what my friend says it is a recognised technique by the Water Authority but does not have any legal support.

In my opinion this is a subject that requires scientific research.

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Lead-Brick
03-21-2007, 03:32 PM
I can tell you exactly how dowsing works(or divining as its called here in New Zealand). It works because people believe that water runs in underground streams! The fact is that most underground water reservoirs are very extensive 2-3 meter thick sandstone or conglomerate sheets, often 2-3km in extent. These reservior units are usually stacked on top of each other with interveaning mudstones seperating them. Basically when a dowser tells you to "drill here" he has probably a better than 80% chance of striking water. If you don't strike water he will tell you "its just a little deeper" and so the numbers game works for him in the end.

My credentials, Geologist, BSc(Honours)

My experiance, currently working on a gas "prospect" (and I use that word very loosely) formulated by a dowser. Hopefully we can inject a little science into this thing so people don't loose their shirts to this crazy man.

F0_Dark_P
03-21-2007, 03:48 PM
I dont know anything about this, but my grandfather could find water with dowsing, i can ask my mother more about it later...

Zeus-cat
03-21-2007, 03:50 PM
I'm waiting for raaaid to show up. This topic is right up his alley.

K_Freddie
03-21-2007, 04:04 PM
Originally posted by FluffyDucks2:
Doesn't explain how wooden rods work though http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
The dowser I spoke to was a professional dowser who made his living finding water or whatever else (pipes,cables...etc etc..) and he told me it didn't matter what he used in his hands, as whatever was causing the phenomena worked on the human body somehow. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Many respectable multi-nationals commissioned him and others for various types of dowsing btw.

His preferred item was a forked hazel rod.
I myself have used hazel rods and metal bars etc and can report the phenomena works equally well with either, although the hazel I think gives stronger reactions... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Curiosity.. what is a Hazel rod made of ?
I don't know actually (will wiki it), but if one thinks of it in physical phenomena, I'm sure it will amount to the same thing..

and yes .. Lead-Brick, I worked in a geological research dept for many years and one can usually determine structures, content from stats, history, isotope analysis, etc.. yes water will be found..

I saw some amazing stuff on the discovery channel where they discussed the 'Crystal Palace' I think it was called. A new cave discovery in the USA, and other incredible natural underground water systems.
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

ploughman
03-21-2007, 04:12 PM
I've heard of folk dowsing for anything from archeological remains to deer rut lines successfully, most 'country' folk seem to think it works just as readily as I would think a publican knows how to pull a pint.

Here's a possible link to WWII:

"Britain's Weekly Telegraph of July 20th, 1994 reported the following obituary: "Colonel Kenneth Merrylees, the water-diviner who has died aged 97, worked during the Second World War as a bomb-disposal expert, when he used his dowsing skills to find bombs with delayed-action fuses which had penetrated deep into the ground."

Water ain't half of it.

K_Freddie
03-21-2007, 04:29 PM
it's definitely MAD... Magnetic Anomaly Detector (Detection)
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

MB_Avro_UK
03-21-2007, 04:50 PM
Hi all,

I spoke with a German Squad mate this evening about 'Dowsing' and he told me that it is an accepted practice in Germany http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

But there seems to be no scientific recognition anywhere in the world.

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

x6BL_Brando
03-21-2007, 04:54 PM
Curiosity.. what is a Hazel rod made of ?

Er? Hamamelis virginiana , the common Hazel, a tree.

B

FluffyDucks2
03-21-2007, 06:54 PM
Yup I have no idea how it works...but it does, that is why scientific types get their knickers in a twist(because they have no idea either http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif ) and when scientists can't explain something they ridicule it http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif.

Bottom line is this...if multi national companies(Shell,BP, Exxon) are happy to use dowsing you can bet your life that it is for a good reason http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Lead-Brick
03-21-2007, 07:45 PM
Thats funny, none of those companies mentioned running a dowsing survey over the Great South Basin when they came to see us late last year?