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EagleDeer
02-28-2005, 04:06 AM
In case you have not heard, there is a free Flaming Cliffs (LOMAC 1.1) demo available. Arguably the best FM ever seen on a PC (alas exclusievly for the SU-25). BTW the new Su-25 (not in the demo)reportedly has a poly count of 52,000.

TIR VE zoom only is implemented, but nevertheless greatly adds to immersion.

http://www.lockon.ru/index.php?end_pos=135&scr=products&lang=en

HotelBushranger
02-28-2005, 07:19 AM
Just registered. Cheers for the link. Do you have LO-MAC? If so, could you describe to me the difficulty of combat, i.e. radars, locking targets etc. I had the Lomac demo; I had to read the step-by-step instructions in the manual, and invulernability and infi-ammo to get a kill. Please don't tell me its as confusing as it appears to be http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Cheers for the link anyway, I'll download it on the weekend.

VW-IceFire
02-28-2005, 12:01 PM
This new demo seems much more approachable. I tried the old one and couldn't get into it. Consequently, I never bought the game although I'm starting to regret that now.

I'd try it out and start by clicking on the Training/Tutorial button and watching the two tutorials included. They are a bit long but let them run their course. Write some notes and then get into the quick fly missions and have a go.

I can't figure out howto use the Su-25 yet but the A-10 seems pretty decent. I've managed to now annihilate an entire T-80 tank collumn from a few KM range using TV guided mavricks. Its certainly different than diving on the rear of a Panzer IV with a Yak-9T http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Maj_Death
02-28-2005, 01:22 PM
The Su-25 is not the simplest to use. To use a laser guided missle, press "o" to turn on the laser designator, then use the target selector slew keys to point the designator at your desired target, lock target, fine tune the aim and then press fire. BTW, the regular Su-25 only has 3 guided weapons at its disposal, all others are unguided. For those you use them as follows: turn on laser range finder by pressing "o" and then use pipper to aim weapon.

Lipfert_5JG52
02-28-2005, 01:24 PM
Be advised that the original Demo had Star-Force included by mistake, it will install drivers that could cause Nero not to function.

Star-Force loads drivers that gives the Developers Control of who runs the application.

If you click Start, Run and type devmgmt.msc goto view and check Hidden Devices, then browse under Non-Plug and play drivers.

Look for Star-Force Protection.

I deleted mine, but it appears to be back again.

Blast !!!

CKY_86
02-28-2005, 01:45 PM
cant download at moment i get the

website not responding

message http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

NoBunny
02-28-2005, 01:46 PM
LOMAC sat on my shelf for the last year - started playing with it about two weeks ago - now im hooked.

So hooked in fact that I made the jump to a HOTAS Cougar - Should be here in a couple of days.

This will keep me busy until BoB is released.

BSS_Vidar
02-28-2005, 09:59 PM
LOMAC is the best flight sim ever made for PC's, and v1.1 will only make it better. You have to learn the weapon systems, know the limitations of the weapons themselves, as well as the aircraft. The only thing I don't like about LOMAC is the ground taxi handeling. Good thing we don't spend the whole time playing it on the ground. So I over look that part. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

People that say, "Oh, so you like the easy missile kill", or "I guess you don't have the skill to fly a WWII sim," have no idea how stupid/ignorant they sound. Their's A LOT more to it than that. In reality, they probabaly saw the list of commands needed to effectively fly a sophisticated weapons system, then mearly gave up and put it back on the shelf; therefore, contrived their little "missgivings" about skill.

A buddy of mine who is on the development team for LOMAC told me to get this sim. He's an ex-U.S. Navy Hornet driver, and is now a Captain for a major U.S. airline. He promised the closest thing to being their in a PC sim, and he was right.

Treetop64
02-28-2005, 10:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>A buddy of mine who is on the development team for LOMAC told me to get this sim. He's an ex-U.S. Navy Hornet driver, and is now a Captain for a major U.S. airline. He promised the closest thing to being their in a PC sim, and he was right. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The part that says "A buddy of mine..." is code for "Someone who does not exist..."! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Just making a friendly stab. Laugh with me! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

DD_NL
03-01-2005, 01:47 AM
Yeah, or the "...I know a friend of a friend of mine who..." http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Flakenstien
03-01-2005, 08:21 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DD_NL:
Yeah, or the "...I know a friend of a friend of mine who..." http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Cool! you know the same people I do!

Platypus_1.JaVA
03-01-2005, 08:25 AM
Falcon 4.0 with all the wonderfull 3rd party additions is still the most realistic Modern Jet sim hands down.

CKY_86
03-01-2005, 08:36 AM
finally got the demo http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif & i must say that this is the best modern day flight sim ive played, so im gonna have to get the original lock-on.

does anyone know if it has a mission builder

VW-IceFire
03-01-2005, 09:08 AM
It does have a mission builder...no idea if its as good as FB's FMB. I'm trying to find a copy myself.

In my experience, it seems there is no "easy missile kill". For all the guidance and automation that goes into the missile...there's a thousand things that can go wrong. At least in World War II you're bullets aren't getting distracted by countermeasures. They hit or don't http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

CKY_86
03-01-2005, 10:05 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VW-IceFire:
It does have a mission builder...no idea if its as good as FB's FMB. I'm trying to find a copy myself.

In my experience, it seems there is no "easy missile kill". For all the guidance and automation that goes into the missile...there's a thousand things that can go wrong. At least in World War II you're bullets aren't getting distracted by countermeasures. They hit or don't http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

thanks icefire i havent even tried the missiles yet http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif im having too much fun with the a10's kicka** cannon lol

about the avalibility i can pick up a copy for about 10 failly easy in the u.k but i suppose it depends on where your from

BSS_Vidar
03-01-2005, 09:41 PM
Nah,
I'm not pullin' your legs gents. He does really exsist. I've known him for over 15 years because we're avid plastic modelers - and dare I say, we both compete well at the Nationals level http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif. If you have Jane's F/A-18, start it up. The game has a pic of him sitting in an A-7 Corsair. (You can tell by the ESCAPAC ejection seat). He was on the development team for that one as well. He made the transition from Corsairs to Hornets shortly before he got out to fly with the airlines. I can give you his log-in name, but that's it. "Hornit" with an i.

I was a flyer in the Navy as well, but we never served in the same CAG. Too bad, we would have had some great liberty. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif As far as recreating the environment of flying as far as flight model, and manipulating a sophisticated weapons system goes... LOMAC is the best.

Blackdog5555
03-01-2005, 10:35 PM
Vidar, Falcon 4.0 SP 4.2 with BMS 2.0 with Aeyes pits and Hitiles is the only real true patched "off the shelf" flight sim out there. I have LOMAC and the above and there is no comparison. Lomac is pretty and has good online support. but dam..Janes F/A18 has a more sophisticated avionics then LOMAC! Landing the SU33 on a carrier in LOmac is a true blast though.

Charlie901
03-01-2005, 10:46 PM
The only thing that bothers me about LOMAC, and I've had it since day 1, is the scripted "Landing on Rails" flight model.

No matter how you touch down, both your rear wheels snap down together and stick to the tarmac like glue!

Quite a letdown after you've been spoiled by IL2's landing physics.

Although the new SU-25T in FLAMING CLIFFS will have advanced landing physics, as shown in one of the recent vids (shows the SU-25 landing on one tire and being able to bounce and swerve down the tarmac).

VW-IceFire
03-01-2005, 11:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CKY_86:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VW-IceFire:
It does have a mission builder...no idea if its as good as FB's FMB. I'm trying to find a copy myself.

In my experience, it seems there is no "easy missile kill". For all the guidance and automation that goes into the missile...there's a thousand things that can go wrong. At least in World War II you're bullets aren't getting distracted by countermeasures. They hit or don't http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

thanks icefire i havent even tried the missiles yet http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif im having too much fun with the a10's kicka** cannon lol

about the avalibility i can pick up a copy for about 10 failly easy in the u.k but i suppose it depends on where your from <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Canada....no stores carry it...Amazon.ca has it for $79.99 and everywhere else is just as expensive online. Its darned impossible right now.

AWL_Spinner
03-02-2005, 02:23 AM
VW-IceFire, I'm over in Canada in a couple of weeks and could bring a copy I could send to you via Canada-Post when "in country" if you like.

Jester_159th
03-02-2005, 07:57 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CKY_86:
finally got the demo http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif & i must say that this is the best modern day flight sim ive played, so im gonna have to get the original lock-on.

does anyone know if it has a mission builder <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It does have both QMB and FMB in the original.

Having used both, I think that the FMB in LOMAC is somewhat more user friendly and easier to learn than the one in IL2, although IL2 has more placeable static objects.

Having said that, the LOMAC FMB has a few little quirks of it's own, I would recommend reading any tutorials you can find on it.

hernanyork
03-02-2005, 08:37 AM
Falcon 4.0 and IL2 are the more realistic sims i spend 2 years in to learn both of them and im actually happy.
kisses

BSS_Vidar
03-02-2005, 12:02 PM
I agree, anything to do with wheels on deck, LOMAC is terrible. Once you're airborn, nothing beats it in flight model performance - which is hopefully where you spend most of your time playing it. I do have Falcon 4.0. and it is a good game, but I just don't see it surpassing LOMAC.

Now Jane's F/A-18... There's some realistic emmersion there, even though the performance characteristics are quite arcadish. The radio comms alone gave me flashbacks from my flying days around the boat. You can tell they did their homework in that arena.

I love the Falcon 4.0 start up audio sequence. It's the actual comms between two F-14's from VF-32 "The Swardsmen" who shot down two Lybian MiG-23s out of Bengazi. I know, because I was there, and they kept those MiGs from shooting down my S-3A Viking just north of the Lybian FIR, callsign Vidar 704, VS-22 Checkmates, Feb 1989.

LOMAC brings it all together folks, save the ground handeling. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif But then again, nothing Ubi has done, as far as Flight sims goes, ever gets ground handeling correct. i.e. over-effective flight control inputs while taxiing, no differential "independent" toe braking just to name the worst cases. Microsoft, funny enough, has done very well with that. Good thing we spend more time flying, insted of taxiing. In that case I would be inclinded to agree with you.

sgilewicz
03-02-2005, 04:08 PM
I just read the review of Flaming Cliffs in PCGamer and it was spectacular. However, I also saw that it is only available from the Russian developer on-line. Call me paranoid but I am nervous about putting my financial info in the wrong hands. I do plenty of internet transactions but with sincere apologies to our Russian friends here, I am nervous about site security over there at this time. If I am off base I would be glad to here it.

Willey
03-02-2005, 05:14 PM
Beware, Lomac is a Dia show, and FC will be even more with it's 53k poly Sue http://www.ubisoft.de/smileys/3.gif

Remember, FB planes don't even have a 15th of that poly count. That really does hurt fps.

CKY_86
03-02-2005, 05:23 PM
whats a good recomended system to run lomac on

TAGERT.
03-02-2005, 05:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BSS_Vidar:
I agree, anything to do with wheels on deck, LOMAC is terrible. Once you're airborn, nothing beats it in flight model performance - which is hopefully where you spend most of your time playing it. I do have Falcon 4.0. and it is a good game, but I just don't see it surpassing LOMAC.

Now Jane's F/A-18... There's some realistic emmersion there, even though the performance characteristics are quite arcadish. The radio comms alone gave me flashbacks from my flying days around the boat. You can tell they did their homework in that arena.

I love the Falcon 4.0 start up audio sequence. It's the actual comms between two F-14's from VF-32 "The Swardsmen" who shot down two Lybian MiG-23s out of Bengazi. I know, because I was there, and they kept those MiGs from shooting down my S-3A Viking just north of the Lybian FIR, callsign Vidar 704, VS-22 Checkmates, Feb 1989.

LOMAC brings it all together folks, save the ground handeling. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif But then again, nothing Ubi has done, as far as Flight sims goes, ever gets ground handeling correct. i.e. over-effective flight control inputs while taxiing, no differential "independent" toe braking just to name the worst cases. Microsoft, funny enough, has done very well with that. Good thing we spend more time flying, insted of taxiing. In that case I would be inclinded to agree with you. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I actully like LockOns grnd model.. I like the way it leans a little in a turn.. As if the weight is shifting and compressin the gear on that side. As for MicroSoft's doing a better ground model.. Yeah, I like it too! I also like the GUI better too.. What with that Person Outside Standing (POS) waitig for you to select a plane to fly.. But now stop and ask yourself.. If you only had 100 hours and $100 dollars to develope a flight sim.. Would you spent 1hr and $10 on the ground modle.. A place where you spend about 1/1000 of your time.. Or spend 10min and a buck on the ground model and spend the rest of your moneny on the FM.. where you spend most of your time! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Charlie901
03-02-2005, 07:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TAGERT.:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BSS_Vidar:
I agree, anything to do with wheels on deck, LOMAC is terrible. Once you're airborn, nothing beats it in flight model performance - which is hopefully where you spend most of your time playing it. I do have Falcon 4.0. and it is a good game, but I just don't see it surpassing LOMAC.

Now Jane's F/A-18... There's some realistic emmersion there, even though the performance characteristics are quite arcadish. The radio comms alone gave me flashbacks from my flying days around the boat. You can tell they did their homework in that arena.

I love the Falcon 4.0 start up audio sequence. It's the actual comms between two F-14's from VF-32 "The Swardsmen" who shot down two Lybian MiG-23s out of Bengazi. I know, because I was there, and they kept those MiGs from shooting down my S-3A Viking just north of the Lybian FIR, callsign Vidar 704, VS-22 Checkmates, Feb 1989.

LOMAC brings it all together folks, save the ground handeling. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif But then again, nothing Ubi has done, as far as Flight sims goes, ever gets ground handeling correct. i.e. over-effective flight control inputs while taxiing, no differential "independent" toe braking just to name the worst cases. Microsoft, funny enough, has done very well with that. Good thing we spend more time flying, insted of taxiing. In that case I would be inclinded to agree with you. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I actully like LockOns grnd model.. I like the way it leans a little in a turn.. As if the weight is shifting and compressin the gear on that side. As for MicroSoft's doing a better ground model.. Yeah, I like it too! I also like the GUI better too.. What with that Person Outside Standing (POS) waitig for you to select a plane to fly.. But now stop and ask yourself.. If you only had 100 hours and $100 dollars to develope a flight sim.. Would you spent 1hr and $10 on the ground modle.. A place where you spend about 1/1000 of your time.. Or spend 10min and a buck on the ground model and spend the rest of your moneny on the FM.. where you spend most of your time! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



Guys it's not the taxiing and suspension that ruins it for me (I could care less) it's all about the "Scripted Landings".

Try to land on either the left or right tire first and see what I mean. No matter what attitude or angle you touchdown at, both tires will hit as if you made a perfect 3-point landing (physics engine snaps you level just before touchdown) and you never bounce back up off the deck. Again the FC expansion will introduce the SU-25T that has an advanced flight model which eliminates this scripted landing sequence (as can be seen in one of the video trailers).

Sometimes, even more than blowing stuff up, I enjoy doing "touch and go's", with the different jets, but can't get past the crummy totally "Scripted" landing sequence and for me semi-relistics landings is important in a CFS.

han freak solo
03-02-2005, 11:26 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>At least in World War II you're bullets aren't getting distracted by countermeasures. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

A tailgunner spraying my windscreen is a h*ll of a countermeasure. I can't see a friggin thing! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Korolov
03-03-2005, 03:21 AM
Any mirrors to this? The link on the site is pretty slow. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

TAGERT.
03-03-2005, 10:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Charlie901:
Guys it's not the taxiing and suspension that ruins it for me (I could care less) it's all about the "Scripted Landings".

Try to land on either the left or right tire first and see what I mean. No matter what attitude or angle you touchdown at, both tires will hit as if you made a perfect 3-point landing (physics engine snaps you level just before touchdown) and you never bounce back up off the deck. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Oh, that, yes I agree that is a bit cheezie.. But at least it will penalize you if you touch down too hard. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Charlie901:
Again the FC expansion will introduce the SU-25T that has an advanced flight model which eliminates this scripted landing sequence (as can be seen in one of the video trailers). <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>That is good news!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Charlie901:
Sometimes, even more than blowing stuff up, I enjoy doing "touch and go's", with the different jets, but can't get past the crummy totally "Scripted" landing sequence and for me semi-relistics landings is important in a CFS. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Well.. looks like we will all get a little more this time around.. This sim is really shaping up into one of the best jet sims ever made.. Hmmm actually.. it is about there now? Im really looking forward to FC!

Griffon_25th
03-03-2005, 08:16 PM
Lomac doesnt really have a ground radar at all either and IMO its mission builder is not that good (neither is il2s)...both mission builders are straightforward and one dimentional (want to see the best mission builder, take a look at JF-18 but still not what a MB could be).

Hairball_1
03-04-2005, 03:11 PM
Am I a ******? Where the heck do I download this new demo?

Hairball_1
03-04-2005, 03:13 PM
Nevermind, found it at CheckSix. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Hairball_1
03-04-2005, 04:11 PM
Ugh. What a waste. The devs need to learn a thing or two about making their software user-friendly. I don't have the luxury of Track IR, and that makes LOMAC about as pleasant as a root canal. Is it too much to ask for a snap view that will *SNAP* back to center? Screw it.

NoBunny
03-04-2005, 04:29 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hairball_1:
Ugh. What a waste. The devs need to learn a thing or two about making their software user-friendly. I don't have the luxury of Track IR, and that makes LOMAC about as pleasant as a root canal. Is it too much to ask for a snap view that will *SNAP* back to center? Screw it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

alt+z down to get snap view.

PapaSmurf630
03-04-2005, 07:11 PM
Guys, you have to remember, THIS ISN'T IL2!!

You can't just turn it on and play. When I first purchased FB, it didn't take me long to be able to start shooting down enemies. It's almost basically point and shoot. There aren't many things to master in the button pressing and keyboard layout area. Apart from maybe mixture and pitch control etc but you eventually get the hang of them.

Lo-Mac however takes a lot more time. You can't just expect to be able to jump in to a quick mission and shoot at the enemy. If you want a certain veiw command, you have to look it up from all the other commands and buttons. Take your time and these soon become second nature. It's annoying when I see all these people putting down a game when they actually haven't looked hard enough. You guys remember all the Pacific Fighter noobs that were complaining they couldn't get their aircraft of the deck of a carrier because they hadn't found the 'remove chucks' key? It's the same kind of feeling.

TAGERT.
03-04-2005, 07:12 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hairball_1:
Ugh. What a waste. The devs need to learn a thing or two about making their software user-friendly. I don't have the luxury of Track IR, and that makes LOMAC about as pleasant as a root canal. Is it too much to ask for a snap view that will *SNAP* back to center? Screw it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Probally best you just give up now.. In that LockOn requires one to at least thumb through the readme and manula ONCE.. Not only best for you, in that you wont get fustrated, but best for the sim maker too.. In that they dont need the bad press that stems from people who can not be bother we reading the readme or manuls ONCE.

Trink_Afri-Cola
03-05-2005, 04:31 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Platypus_1.JaVA:
Falcon 4.0 with all the wonderfull 3rd party additions is still the most realistic Modern Jet sim hands down. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Maybe so, but its hard to find a copy like rb3d. The demo looks bad of falcon 4.

avimimus
03-07-2005, 06:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VW-IceFire:
It does have a mission builder...no idea if its as good as FB's FMB. I'm trying to find a copy myself.

In my experience, it seems there is no "easy missile kill". For all the guidance and automation that goes into the missile...there's a thousand things that can go wrong. At least in World War II you're bullets aren't getting distracted by countermeasures. They hit or don't http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

V1.1 is laying the ground work for a dynamic campaign. It will include some scripting and the ability to put random variables into missions.

The Missiles can be evaded. The "easy-kill" is more commonly criticised by the "easy-death" that goes with it.

There are a lot of Jane's USAF junkies who want to be in an A-10 and shoot down 4xMig-29s and get irrate if an R-77 is more effective than a Aim-9M. Don't listen to their complaints!

SS_Bubblehead
03-07-2005, 09:08 PM
Lock-on is fantastic. It is a complex flightsim to say the least and comes with a steep learning curve.

On-line is tough. You must understand your adversary. I dont just mean enemy plane turning capability. The deeper level is understanding your enemies BVR capability and the transition to medium range and then god forbid a turning IR missile fight. What a Su-27 can do with R-27ER is totally different than an F-15 with an aim 120.

Its a facinating world and add to that multiple and accurately modelled SAM systems adding an even greater level of complexity. Brings true meaning to the term situational awareness to computer flight simming.

Its just a blast to fly the Hog with a load of IR Maverick Ks, staying low to avoid detection from enemy Dogear EW radar (which your RWR chirps loudly on such events). Flying in low light conditions, you select A2G mode, select mavs on your armament control panel, verify on your HUD the position of the target based on laser emmissions picked up by your Pave Penny laser pod. Get within 5 nm, pop up, ground stabilize, slew to target and fire. Hopefully hitting your target, all the while shooting chaff and flares to avoid enemy SAMs, perform an avoidance manuever anyway, get back low and head for home. Your RWR just chirped! Oh **** Mig 29!

Its just a fun game, I love IL2, LOMACs just a different experience.

BSR_Dude
03-07-2005, 09:59 PM
Overall I've found IL2 is much easier to "fly". In LOMAC you have to work to spoof enemy missiles, and there are completely different tactics to use for each missile you fire. When you add a wingman to the mix tactics change once again. You not only have to worry about guns, but missiles too. I've had people shoot IR missiles at me w/the sun to my six, the missiles never even tracked on my plane. Popup from behind a hill and you can get a quick snapshot w/missiles or guns.

It's definitely more difficult and a good pilot and wingman can take on twice the amount of enemy if their tactics are there. It's a cross between dogfighting, airshow maneuvering and chess.

I've messed w/all the "popular" jet sims and by far LOMAC has the sensation of speed. F4 (patched or not) can't say that. And if you end up down low LOMAC is as beautiful as it gets.

HotelBushranger
03-08-2005, 02:07 AM
Nah, I like PF more. Its just more....relaxing, with Lomac, I did the quick fly in the Su-25, really confusing...no way, jets aren't for me. I prefer the good old days, when you could actually SEE your opponent.

Flakenstien
03-08-2005, 02:56 AM
I would have to say Warbirs are by far my favorite, but when wanting to work my brain LOMAC is the way to go.
I love the fact that on my computer I can partake in the evolution of Air Combat http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

EagleDeer
03-08-2005, 04:46 AM
Its good to have all on the hard drive so that I don't burn out on any one. Su-25 is as close to the IL-2 birds as a modern jet probably gets. I'm reading a book titled Corsairs, so I fired up FB+AEP+PF after a long break and it was astounding to me how much the feeling of narrative was recreated by this sim. Having a blast with DCG and the USMC at Guadacanal (F6F so far though).

PapaSmurf630
03-08-2005, 10:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HotelBushranger:
Nah, I like PF more. Its just more....relaxing, with Lomac, I did the quick fly in the Su-25, really confusing...no way, jets aren't for me. I prefer the good old days, when you could actually SEE your opponent. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Another common stereotype. The majority of the time you do see your opponent, he may not be 50 meters ahead of you in your gun sights (Hopefully) but you can see him. I rarely score a kill at a greater range of 15km

fordfan25
03-08-2005, 11:32 AM
LOL by the time i figure how to get the rudder control set to my flight stick LOMAC 2 wil be out and ill have to start all over again. cockpits are not up to FB standers eather. thay look like thay were drawn on screen. not that im complaining mind you http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

EnGaurde
03-08-2005, 04:28 PM
yeah, bought lomac when it first arrived.

i do like it, its interesting though how in the '42 era, it was get close to your target.

in lomac, its almost the opposite?

what can become very stale for me is loitering around, stooging about at the limit of radar etc, ducking in to light someone up on radar, launch, then watch for the fireball. Or repeat if there is none. Its just a different kind of fighting.

i prefer this: last night on zVw, i came in on the edge of a furball, looking for strays to tackle. One p40 popped out of the melee and i lined up behind, throttle full. He saw me, started to dive, i fired mgs to get him to panic, he rolled up to my right. By the time i reacted and rolled / climbed after him we were mirror imaging each other, rolling around like we were stuck the the inside of a barrell on opposite sides? This was fantastic, real maneouvering close enough to see the stars on his wings. I started to overshoot still being at full noise, so i chopped the throttle ( yes it does have its uses) and kept the rolling engagement happening via inertia. Eventually he stalled out at the top, i clicked in flaps, full throttle, rasied the nose and had a perfect 90 degree deflection shot on a stalled and near stationary P40. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

i have a track of it, ill dig it up when i get home.

lomac, IMO, just cant reproduce that kind of in your face guns only maneouver.

BSR_Dude
03-08-2005, 05:31 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EnGaurde:
what can become very stale for me is loitering around, stooging about at the limit of radar etc, ducking in to light someone up on radar, launch, then watch for the fireball. Or repeat if there is none. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You have no idea how to approach a jet sim. You'd last exactly 30 seconds in a server w/any of the guys I fly with. While the fights are different than in IL2, they are every bit as intense. I'd say you were probably playing in a n00b server w/peeps that have no clue. It's a completely different mindset that you have to have to fly a sim w/missiles. I like prop sims alot, I cut my teeth on 'em but there comes a point when "Air-Quake" gets old.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by fordfan25:
cockpits are not up to FB standers eather. thay look like thay were drawn on screen. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

They're as good or better than the best of the IL2 cockpits. Look again.

noshens
03-08-2005, 05:34 PM
this thread is worthless without screenshots

EnGaurde
03-08-2005, 06:11 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> You have no idea how to approach a jet sim <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

now this kind of response is the reason i dont frequent forums, or stay long. Its just too **** frustrating. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

ill approach any jet sim any **** well way i choose, sport. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif And anyhow, just what do you know from my post what servers i fly on and what i dont? Pfft.

who the hell are you to indicate how any sim should be approached, anyway?

dont turn this into a pissing contest about how you and your very likely schoolboy buddies are so "hardcore" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

im not one to be even slightly impressed by that serious geek sh!te. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

im not dumping on your precious jets, im stating my preference and an example of why. In fact its your write off of the sim as Air Quake that deserves your own kind of response.

i dont need your condescending "advice", nor did i ask for it.

AArgh

*twitching left eyelid...*

Griffon_25th
03-08-2005, 06:19 PM
il2 suxxors you noobs!!!

Yeah it can be boring by yourself after awhile. But flying with a team online against another team online using tactics is extremely fun (guns and IR missiles only). PF still rocks and is a totally different deal anyways!

BSR_Dude
03-08-2005, 06:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EnGaurde:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> You have no idea how to approach a jet sim <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

now this kind of response is the reason i dont frequent forums, or stay long. Its just too **** frustrating. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

ill approach any jet sim any **** well way i choose, sport. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif And anyhow, just what do you know from my post what servers i fly on and what i dont? Pfft.

who the hell are _you_ to indicate how _any_ sim should be approached, anyway?

dont turn this into a pissing contest about how you and your very likely schoolboy buddies are so "hardcore" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

im not one to be even slightly impressed by that serious geek sh!te. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

im _not_ dumping on your precious jets, im stating my preference and an example of why. In fact its _your_ write off of the sim as Air Quake that deserves your own kind of response.

i dont need your condescending "advice", nor did i ask for it.

AArgh

*twitching left eyelid...* <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Sorry you got your panties in a bunch. It was friendly advice, I'm sorry you took it wrong. Your description is totally incorrect of how these types of sims work that you appeared to those of us in the know that you were a n00b. If I'm wrong I apologize. Understand that you spouted off like you knew what you were talking about. You didn't. I was trying to impress upon the people here that Jet sims in general are a completely different animal.

As for your schoolboy comment, I won't respond but to say that I haven't seen those hallowed halls for over 20 years. Yep, you didn't ask for my opinion but you got it. That's how forums work. If you don't like it then I suggest you opt out. I meant no ill will towards you in my post, but you obviously went the few extra steps to insult me. Kudos. Someone who I'll never meet nor do I give a rat's behind about insulted me. How will I ever live w/myself? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/351.gif

The terrain in LOMAC was made w/Satellite imagery, no repeating tiles.
And for noshens:

http://members.cox.net/teambsr/lo01.jpg
http://members.cox.net/teambsr/lo02.jpg
http://members.cox.net/teambsr/lo03.jpg
http://members.cox.net/teambsr/lo04.jpg
http://members.cox.net/teambsr/lo05.jpg

Griffon_25th
03-08-2005, 07:38 PM
Yeah thats a major draw back for me with il2, the terrain...its like flying in a weird cartoon.

Now lomac on the other hand.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif

noshens
03-08-2005, 07:39 PM
Thanks BSR_Dude.
Downloading demo...

fordfan25
03-08-2005, 07:40 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BSR_Dude:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EnGaurde:
what can become very stale for me is loitering around, stooging about at the limit of radar etc, ducking in to light someone up on radar, launch, then watch for the fireball. Or repeat if there is none. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You have no idea how to approach a jet sim. You'd last exactly 30 seconds in a server w/any of the guys I fly with. While the fights are different than in IL2, they are every bit as intense. I'd say you were probably playing in a n00b server w/peeps that have no clue. It's a completely different mindset that you have to have to fly a sim w/missiles. I like prop sims alot, I cut my teeth on 'em but there comes a point when "Air-Quake" gets old.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by fordfan25:
cockpits are not up to FB standers eather. thay look like thay were drawn on screen. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

They're as good or better than the best of the IL2 cockpits. Look again. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

ok. i looked again and you know what? thay still look like cr@p to me.

marcocomparato
03-08-2005, 10:53 PM
i can email X52 profile for LOMAC. makes the game alot easier with HOTAS.

ive owned the game for a year and i still cant quit seem to figure out how to fire missles air2air.

marcocomparato
03-08-2005, 10:57 PM
got any good links that break-down the weapons system a bit more?

thx

BSR_Dude
03-09-2005, 07:20 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by fordfan25:
ok. i looked again and you know what? thay still look like cr@p to me. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wildcat, Thunderbolt, Lightning. Those do too.

Marco, there are tons of A/G weapons. There are Maverick IR and TV A/G missiles, Russian Laser guided A/G missiles, cluster-h/e-fuel air bombs, antishipping missiles.

Platypus_1.JaVA
03-09-2005, 10:32 AM
Well, I like LOMAC also for what it is. I'm having a blast in the Ruskie jet's that are soooooo diffrent then the F-16 I was used to in Falcon 4.0

But, the feeling creeps upon me that F-16 is a much deeper simulation. Furthermore, LOMAC is a buggy (locks-up at least every two hours) product with a somewhat clumsy interface. Falcon 4.0 and Il-2 are much more user friendly.

But, when I am airborne, having dealt with the bugs and everything works fine, it is a really good sim. Shooting enemies with weird and unfamiliar rockets and actually hitting them is very entertaining.

It is a buggy product at best. Like they changed the 'pickle weapon' button on western A/C in the 1.02 patch but, I didn't yet find it in the key assignments so, I can't change it to any other button... They even have a seperate forum for bugs... go figure http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Now I think of it, we have that also, it is just called diffrent, the ORR http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

PapaSmurf630
03-09-2005, 10:58 AM
Every bit of software has its bugs. This game was rushed out by Ubi. The patches sort out the bugs. I get none. 1.1 will be coming which will sort a whole lot more (Hopefully not introduce more)

As for the whole dogfight, in your face action, I get a lot of dogfighting online. Aslong as you get past the BVR phase, which is very intense, you get a very intense dogfight.

To be honest, IL2 is a quake sort of game for me. I do like the single missions though, very nice and atmospheric. I just find myself playing more Lomac.

Oh btw, they aren't very good screenshots, but still look better than IL2!! :P http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Obi_Kwiet
03-09-2005, 11:54 AM
Yeah, three years old engine vs. a year old engine. I wonder which will look better. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

BSR_Dude
03-09-2005, 04:12 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Platypus_1.JaVA:
It is a buggy product at best. Like they changed the 'pickle weapon' button on western A/C in the 1.02 patch but, I didn't yet find it in the key assignments so, I can't change it to any other button... They even have a seperate forum for bugs... go figure http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The reason the pickle button is mapped that way is because............wait for it...............that's how it is IRL.

And there was a bug forum, until UBI and Eagle Dynamics went their separate ways. In fact, there is still a forum there where you can get help from the community to configure your install. Just like what happens here on the IL2 forums. And we all know how helpful UBI is/has been w/bugs and such........http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Asgeir_Strips
03-10-2005, 06:55 AM
I have LOMAC and its a good sim.. But i find it extremely annoying with all the keys!
In Reality its far more easier to lock on to a target by radar than it is in this game, because of all the key commands... but other than that. its a darn fine sim..

Maybe i should invest in some sort of HOTAS gear, because then i could prolly assign some of the radar operating keys on the stick and trottle?

BSR_Dude
03-10-2005, 07:19 AM
A HOTAS is always a good idea. It makes things go smoother. Even though there are less commands in PF it's much easier than having to look down at the k/b to choose what you want to do. I can watch the screen and perform any action I like.

Platypus_1.JaVA
03-10-2005, 01:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BSR_Dude:

The reason the pickle button is mapped that way is because............wait for it...............that's how it is IRL.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know they use seperate buttons to fire cannon or release weapons but, why can't I find it in the key assignments? You must agree with me that Lock-on could've been alot better if the developpers removed some bugs at first and thought about the interface system a bit more. Or, if only UBI had given them the time to do it.

But, as I said, once you are 'airborne', Lock-on has got a great gameplay and it looks fantastic too.

BSR_Dude
03-10-2005, 10:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Platypus_1.JaVA:
I know they use seperate buttons to fire cannon or release weapons but, why can't I find it in the key assignments? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's right there in the readme file for the 1.02 patch. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif