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TheGozr
04-02-2007, 01:15 PM
Braking my silence here for a remarque.

Since 1946 is out for quite a long time and all those new jets..Now look into the servers and i see no jets. Meaning It was a waste they should of spend the same time to fix and redo many old cockpits that we use every day. That would of be a blast but to me rrstudios 's work was some how wasted.
Imagine what we missed, nice new style cockpits designs that make you feel great to fly on and a complete different new modern look that we all use in all servers..
Luckly we have knights of the sky coming soon.

4.09 release should be oriented to redesign and fix and NO new planes and objects. But too late..

Viper2005_
04-02-2007, 01:27 PM
Presumably you haven't been to the 4.08 Jets server on HL then. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

It's a shame that it isn't full switch, but you can't have everything.

The Luft46 content is great fun; the anti-jet lobby OTOH is rather boring...

ImpStarDuece
04-02-2007, 03:42 PM
Originally posted by TheGozr:
Braking my silence here for a remarque.

Since 1946 is out for quite a long time and all those new jets..Now look into the servers and i see no jets. Meaning It was a waste they should of spend the same time to fix and redo many old cockpits that we use every day. That would of be a blast but to me rrstudios 's work was some how wasted.
Imagine what we missed, nice new style cockpits designs that make you feel great to fly on and a complete different new modern look that we all use in all servers..
Luckly we have knights of the sky coming soon.

4.09 release should be oriented to redesign and fix and NO new planes and objects. But too late..

Yawn.


Offliner here.


Having great fun with the jets and the Japanese stuff.


Couldn't care less whether they are prevalent on the lobby or not.


All I want is slightly better AI...

XyZspineZyX
04-02-2007, 03:43 PM
Well Gozr, surely you know that there wasn't a list of planes that were needed to be done or remade, and they just picked a poor set of crates to do, mate

This is what they wanted to do. Heck, who wanted an Il-2? Well, "They" did http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I don;t fly the 1946 planes at all. I've never tried one. Maybe I will. But I got lots of things out of the 1946 add-on that I'm happy with, let alone Pe-2 (which I haven't flown) and SoM

All depends on what you wanted to see. I couldn't care less about a 1946 scenario, but the other pros outweighed that con for me

Monguse
04-02-2007, 04:14 PM
I'm with Gozr on this 100%.

Firstly let me say that a more plausible alternate scenario for 1946 would have been... US foresees what Stalin has in mind for "after the war" and Patton is allowed to take all of Berlin. Stalin, in a mad frenzy announces the US must be stopped. There is no COLD WAR as both countries scavenge German technology. The Allies include, Italy, France, Belgium, England (insert others) while Russia aligns itself with Japan; a bloodier second chapter of WWII continues.

The 1946 Roswell add on was a study in what if aircraft. The only positive thing to come from the UFO add on was the much needed addition of the A20C and new maps in 4.08.

What would have been better in my opinon would have been to include a flyable FW200 Condor, B17, B24 even if the only solution was an add-hoc cockpit because the 3D interiors were not available.

Why? Simple, more Atlantic/Mediterranean convoy scenarios using the Condor and some high altitude bombing and escort for the Allies while giving the Axis something to do with their big bada-booms.

TheGozr
04-02-2007, 04:29 PM
yes agree http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Btw for me the 1946 ( 408 ) doesn't mean the 406 version. witch is good.
SO much things could of be done to enhance the already Scenarios and eyes pleasures..

Jaws2002
04-02-2007, 05:16 PM
Jets are cool. The only problem is that there are no jet servers. The only one is 4.08=Jets= (open pit) http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif, but I get a kick out of flying Jets in there. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
I would love to see a server with jets and harder setings.
You are missing a good part of the game just like you would miss if you wouldn't fly byplanes at all.

JG53Frankyboy
04-02-2007, 05:29 PM
1. i also had no need of the planes of the 4.07 AdOn (means the jets and their stuff)

2. i like them - actually only the jets , not the mixed planes (not to talk about the Lerche)

3. i also had not flown them online, and i play this game 99% online only, much if at all so far.

4. for a "balanced" jetmap, the RED side is unfortunatly missing a jet (mean pure jets) that could fly groundattack with bombs/rockets http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif ....... the Blue side has several


anyway, these 46 planes dont harm the game in total http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif - fortunatly

FritzGryphon
04-02-2007, 06:06 PM
I think that it's dangerous reasoning to say that any plane that isn't used a lot online is not worthwhile to make.

To me, many of the least popular planes are the most worthwhile and entertaining ones. No one uses P.11, or J8A, or CR.42, but they are some of the coolest planes.

I think it's mainly due to an obsession with generic late war engagements with the aircraft most 'legendary' in the popular history.

Any aircraft that do not fit into this mould, either early war planes (for being too underperforming), or late war jets (for being too overperforming) are automatically precluded as unsuitable. In fact, the huge majority of servers don't even allow these planes. I would love to fly P.11 in a late war server, but I'm not even allowed to take it due to the narrow mindedness of whoever made the mission.

It's just a lack of imagination of the part of those who want to play the same old late war prop battles over and over again, that we don't see more jet servers. It only takes 1 person to limit a plane set.

I hope that BoB stays strictly 1940 for a loooong time (or even go to earlier theatres), because as soon as you throw in the P-51s and Doras, no one will fly anything else.

JG53Frankyboy
04-02-2007, 06:41 PM
Originally posted by FritzGryphon:
..............I hope that BoB stays strictly 1940 for a loooong time (or even go to earlier theatres), because as soon as you throw in the P-51s and Doras, no one will fly anything else.

i hope the whole SoW series is going to be "battle scenario" orientated http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif - whatever Airbattles that will be. more "almost all of one" instead of "some of almost all"

and personaly i also like in general early scenarios, if ETO,MTO, EasternFront or PTO/CBI more than later one http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

unfortunatly the "great" time of historical based COOP onlinewars seems over (sure , still some are existend) and online play is focused on dogfight maps nowadays............
but fortunatly there are a lot of different servers around http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif - with a lot of different aimings (settings, missiongoals, planesets).


anyway, this whole topic is asking for personal tastes, true. but costumers tastes, as different they can be, are always interesting to know i think.

Monguse
04-02-2007, 07:40 PM
I just want to make it clear. We do have maps that include the 234 Arado and the ME 262 when historically correct.

VW-IceFire
04-02-2007, 08:19 PM
Remember that we also got the Ki-27, Ki-43-II, N1K-2J, A-20C, and Ar-234 all which are quite historical in different time periods and are quite fun to fly. I think you probably already know that and you're just talking about the jets (I agree, a little frivolous as something like the Typhoon, Hs-123, Hs-129, and so forth would have been nice for tactical ops) but we did get some good things out of this too.

Some great new maps too.

LEXX_Luthor
04-02-2007, 09:37 PM
GOZER::
Since 1946 is out for quite a long time and all those new jets..Now look into the servers and i see no jets. Meaning It was a waste
You'd have to look at the Russian servers maybe. You were here when we all knew 1946 was made for Russia market and surrounding states, but we managed to get it too, in that west market.

...butt, you "forgot." http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

PBNA-Boosher
04-02-2007, 09:52 PM
if you give a mouse a cookie...

GerritJ9
04-03-2007, 02:17 AM
Of the new jets, I've only flown the Ar-234 and the Yak-15. Does that make 46 a waste? No, not to me. I get lots of fun out of the Ki.27, Ki.21, Ki.43-II and the other stuff that was included. To some, the addition of, say, the Tempest was the ultimate. Everybody has his/her preferences; I prefer early Pacific/SE Asia planes and maps, for others all that stuff is a waste. To each his/her own, and the complete sim (46) offers much to cater for every preference.

Galaboo
04-03-2007, 02:45 AM
1946 planes a waste?

If we talk Online here lets see how many planes were a waste...

Every single German plane.

Thats right, the Germans developed high altitude fighters and medium bombers so that they would always be above their enemies and have the advantage. Though online you'll see everyone fights below 2000 ft, I don't think I've ever seen anyone go above 6000ft and fought, where all Germans planes slaughter at.

The only German planes I can see that are usually below that level are the Jets, which are rarely allowed in the majority of servers. The propellored German planes aren't suited for such low altitude fighting, especially not against allied planes that are made for low altitudes.

The only planes I ever see is:

La7
La7
La7
Spitfire
Tempest
yak
P38
P39

and Japanese Planes

So really, you shouldn't have made any German planes cause the allied planes are really good at low altitude and are the only ones flown in multiplayer.

XyZspineZyX
04-03-2007, 03:10 AM
You should try flying on the closed cockpit servers with full real or limited icons. dogfights can occur as high as 7000m. Try Warclouds, Spits vs 109s, Historia, Winds of War, Zekes vs Wildcats for PTO action.

These are only a few of the servers which are in my opinion excellent & have balanced plane sets or "historically accurate" dogfight senarios.

Try them out, you will get a pleasant suprise

M_Gunz
04-03-2007, 04:49 AM
Seeing as how the 1946 release has a huge positive change to ALL the planes, only a bent-up
troll would call it a waste. Gozr, the line already formed months ago, go to the back of
that one instead of trying to start a new one with you up front! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

269GA-Veltro
04-03-2007, 05:15 AM
Before have a LaGG jet, would have been nice have a credible DM for the prop's one...for example.

1946 a waste of time? Absolutely yes for me....an incredible waste of time.

The next time before waste time and resources with these ridiculous UFO, give us a 109 addon (for ex) with updated cockpits, lods and DM......

My two cents.

joeap
04-03-2007, 05:18 AM
Have we forgotten the stuff Icefire and others posted about? A few real planes that were used, fantastic maps and ground objects so I could not care less about the Lerche.

JG53Frankyboy
04-03-2007, 05:33 AM
as far i understood the topic starter, he was speaking there only of the planes of the 1946 part of the '46 DVD, that he feels it was a waste of time to modell them.

sure, the topic headline is confusing there http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

vonStahlhelm
04-03-2007, 05:43 AM
i still miss the "haunebu" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

VMF-214_HaVoK
04-03-2007, 09:01 AM
Please try to remember that only a small portion of those that own IL-2 series fly online. Im sure many of those offliners out there fly the 46 part of the series.

Many of the dedicated servers on HL are at least semi historical based. So of course you will see no 46 stuff. There are a few arcade servers that offer a 46 matchup.

So perhaps it is a waste for us who only fly online but I bet there are thousands out there who enjoy it.

Monguse
04-03-2007, 11:13 AM
Lets see now...

I still agree with Gozr and Veltro and the best part about it is, you dont have to agree with me or them.

Better time would have been spent on developing and fixing what we have, and I might add, I'd pay for it.

Chivas
04-03-2007, 11:54 AM
New cockpits have and are being made as we speak but they will be introduced in BOB. Its time to move on and personally I could have done without Pacific Fighters, PE-2, and 1946. I would much rather of had those aircraft and cockpits introduced using the SOW engine. We would have been flying BOB quite sometime ago and probably have just bought the Med-addon and looking forward to release of SOW "Pacific Theater". http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

M_Gunz
04-03-2007, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
as far i understood the topic starter, he was speaking there only of the planes of the 1946 part of the '46 DVD, that he feels it was a waste of time to modell them.

sure, the topic headline is confusing there http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

It takes a LONG TIME in hours of work and communication to make the 3D model. Many are made by
volunteers of time and there is something between them and company, a commitment they intend to
keep if possible. That is reputable business. And it is not the only content, it is ready
content; what is ready and stable and pretty well 'known' by the writers at release. Funny
thing but at release the same people are well into another cycle of improvement going who knows
and all that time people are complaining about what may be already fixed. And we USED TO GET
TOLD!

NSAdonis85
04-03-2007, 04:27 PM
Erm...UFO's...I don't see any flashy flying discs ingame, so don't call the 46 planeset UFO's, on either side...now this excludes the Lerche of course, that plane should have been swapped with some another. And I also miss the Western ones too.

I find the people who call the 46 jets (mostly the LW ones from what I read around) "wonder planes", UFO's and simmilar are narrow-minded, and don't even know what the word wonder plane means.

Just my 0.2...

Galaboo
04-03-2007, 05:44 PM
The expansion should have been called...

"IL2 Sturmovik 1946 Expansion for offliners"

Skoshi Tiger
04-03-2007, 07:45 PM
Originally posted by Monguse:
Firstly let me say that a more plausible alternate scenario for 1946 would have been... US foresees what Stalin has in mind for "after the war" and Patton is allowed to take all of Berlin. Stalin, in a mad frenzy announces the US must be stopped. There is no COLD WAR as both countries scavenge German technology. The Allies include, Italy, France, Belgium, England (insert others) while Russia aligns itself with Japan; a bloodier second chapter of WWII continues.


I think that this is a whole less likely than the one presented.

Historically there was a lot of bad blood between the Japanese and the Russian. I don't think they would form an aliance. Maybe a Russian member of the forum could comment?

A more likely senario would be the US not being able to stopping the war with the A-Bomb, the Russian's invading Japan from the North and the us invading from the South, then a second stand off between the US and the USSR in Japan as well as Germany. This may have tipped the scales to WWIII.

I think a discussion of the vaious alternate histories would need a topic of it's own and run to many-many pages. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif



There is no COLD WAR as both countries scavenge German technology.


The US/ UK had thier own Jet fighters in production and wouldn't have needed to scavenge too much. Also the geman industry had been devistated and it would have taken years to for the US to re-tool thier factories to produce the German designs, by which time they would have been obsolite.



I find the people who call the 46 jets (mostly the LW ones from what I read around) "wonder planes", UFO's and simmilar are narrow-minded, and don't even know what the word wonder plane means.


I though the Jets were "wonder planes" in their time. In a matter of years they made all piston engined Fighters outclassed and uncompetitive.

TgD Thunderbolt56
04-04-2007, 06:39 AM
I certainly don't speak for Gozr, but I think the gist of his post isn't truly whether the '46 addon was good or not (he actually states that there is content in it that he greatly enjoys). Rather, the lack of much of the later content online has left many wanting a bit more time in some of those aircraft.

Personally, I like the FM's and much of the new content myself. The Ki-27 is one of my favorite aircraft and I only have something like 5 sorties in the thing online. Offline, I've flown the Lerche and some of the new jets just to see their performance strengths and weaknesses. I have yet to see the opportunity to fly them online (though I haven't looked very hard mind you) with the exception of some testing servers shortly after their initial release.

Nonetheless, I saw Oleg post this a.m. in the Community Support Forums and I'm glad to see they're still around.


TB

csThor
04-04-2007, 08:27 AM
It is simply a question of "1946 content" or no content at all. As RRG will not discuss the background for their decision for 1946 (which will probably include business and gameplay reasons) all we can do is speculate as to why this scenario was chosen. But IMO there wouldn't have been a valid chance of having other "historically relevant" types in a pay addon at all. The list is too diverse and theaters of operation do not match - you can't plug a Do 217 and a B5N2 into the same AddOn if you want to tell a story http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif