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doogerie
09-23-2009, 01:41 AM
I just forind ths quote on a website

'On the 1C forum Oleg said, "We will go with (paid add-ons) with SoW. It would be more complex in development and time consuming to go with so many free updates with aircraft and other objects. However we will keep some part as free updates' this dosnt bode well for me

csThor
09-23-2009, 01:54 AM
Given the enormous complexity of SoW objects (just look at all those interior details of the airframe) it's not a surprise that the "Free 4 all" is going to end. According to Oleg an experienced modeller in his team needs about 6 months to fully model a cockpit for SoW - that's for a single-seat aircraft.

Romanator21
09-23-2009, 02:24 AM
I think it's fair.

M_Gunz
09-23-2009, 02:35 AM
You will be paying for cockpits to make planes flyable in your copy of the game, and only for the ones you want.
However you will also be getting free planes every time new ones are added, that way everyone can run on the same server.

Some day maybe you get a job and tell the boss to only pay you the first day of the week, the rest and all overtime are free?

DKoor
09-23-2009, 02:50 AM
Originally posted by Romanator21:
I think it's fair. +1

In fact anything else is a rip-off.

I don't want to work for someone for free, therefore I don't expect of others to work for me for free.

They will provide decent planeset in the initial game version, and fully working game... it is fair to pay for further content from that point on.

BillSwagger
09-23-2009, 03:19 AM
The alternative is to charge a higher price up front, 'cause add ons are a lot of work and people should be paid for their work.
Paid add ons usually include many more details than what might be included in a free-on. I never underestimate the value of money http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif and maybe by paying a few dollars you will get much more out of the add ons than if they were free.

As for purchasing additional planes that also seems reasonable, and somewhat favorable. If you are like me, there are probably only a handful of planes you enjoy flying, so the idea of just paying for what i'm going to use in game is fine.
Consider ROF. It has several new planes for purchase for about 10-15 bucks. I'd rather pay the ten bucks and get the one or two planes i want, than have to buy the whole lot for 70. There are planes in Il2 that i haven't flown more than once or twice, or probably will never fly. Unless you can get all the planes added for a reasonable price, then just paying for the ones you want, makes sense.



Bill

FishCookie
09-23-2009, 03:46 AM
I'm fine with that business model, mans gotta get paid. If that scares you I seem to remember that paid subscription was also considered and may yet be implemented in future. It's a niche market and for publishers to keep supporting flight sim projects we all have to be willing to pay a little more.

Skoshi Tiger
09-23-2009, 04:06 AM
Taking the rise of flight model, I've bought the planes I want and left the ones I don't. It's all good!
The only complication is for mission builders. Do they stick with purely historic plane sets or do they make sure at least one of the default planes are included so that every one can use their mission.

WTE_Galway
09-23-2009, 04:30 AM
Well the free upgrades which often included new aircraft and maps did seem to encourage a breed of forum brat that felt entitled to demand all sorts of outrageous stuff on the basis that they had paid there $20 and therefore Oleg owed them.

I think its a positive change.

Tully__
09-23-2009, 04:33 AM
We've being paying for updates in IL2 since 2001, I bought the Forgotten Battles, Ace Expansion and Pacific Fighters updates.

Fortunately for those new to the franchise, it is now possible to buy the lot (including some additional updates that were not originally freely available outside Russia / Eastern Europe) in a single compilation called IL2 Sturmovik : 1946

I personally am fine with a similar business model for SoW.

Crash_Moses
09-23-2009, 05:30 AM
Ditto. No worries here.

Choctaw111
09-23-2009, 05:32 AM
This is not a problem at all.
In fact, I was amazed at the amount of free content Oleg had for Il2. I would have paid for ALL of it.
How many people did NOT get the PE2 addon because it cost money?
My point being that if Oleg comes out with an addon and charges some money for it, people will pay it.

skarden
09-23-2009, 07:13 AM
As a big fan of FSX and some of the amazing stuff I'v bought from 3rd party companies,I also think this is a very good thing,and not to be confused with him suddenly making everyone pay extra for the planes that have already been done so far for BOB.

I'm sure we'll get some amazing stuff coming out for the SOW series from oleg as well as by 3rd party companies,and as Oleg has stated a few times,who says they have to even be restricted to WWII?apparently the engine can easly handle planes from any era with all sorts of complex systems running(which is my suspision why the engine is taking a long time to develop)My hope is that it'll become similar to FSX only I'll be able blow stuff up! I imagine there'll be a wide range of products and era's to choose from and you just get the ones you want and leave the rest.

Besides as others have stated,I've gotten a hell of lot enjoyment out of IL-2,especially considering how relatively little I'v paid for the amount of product I've gotten,so I've no problem paying for a good product from a developer that I know can deliver the goods.

JG53Frankyboy
09-23-2009, 07:25 AM
that is ok totaly !

to pay for every bigger update like a new scenario and between some smaller patches for bugfixes and smaller upgrades.

it cant be anymore with a lot of patches with sometimes 4-6 new planes/cockpits in it and these for free like in the past.

doogerie
09-23-2009, 07:29 AM
hmm I see your point i was just thinking about patches and stuff and it panocked me to think that i would have to pay for a patch for agame but if it's like whjen he added forgotten battels and stuff thats fime i may have overeacted a bit

Rjel
09-23-2009, 07:58 AM
Originally posted by Tully__:
We've being paying for updates in IL2 since 2001, I bought the Forgotten Battles, Ace Expansion and Pacific Fighters updates.

That was my first thought too. Oleg has been generous but he's also been a very savvy business man.


Fortunately for those new to the franchise, it is now possible to buy the lot (including some additional updates that were not originally freely available outside Russia / Eastern Europe) in a single compilation called IL2 Sturmovik : 1946

I personally am fine with a similar business model for SoW.

I posted way back when 1946 was released as the "final" version that it might end up not being the case. I think we will see another "final" version down the road after this next patch or the one after that if it happens. I would probably buy it too just to round out my collection.

Lt_Letum
09-23-2009, 09:13 AM
As long as it's the business model of addons that IL2 used and NOT the way Rise Of Flight are doing things; it's all good with me.

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-23-2009, 01:48 PM
Originally posted by doogerie:
I just forind ths quote on a website

'On the 1C forum Oleg said, "We will go with (paid add-ons) with SoW. It would be more complex in development and time consuming to go with so many free updates with aircraft and other objects. However we will keep some part as free updates' this dosnt bode well for me

Whats not good about it? It is nothing different then what every other game developer does. I will gladly pay for addons. Not a single issue or complaint here. It sickens me that some people think they should receive stuff for free all the time (Not saying you are one of them). Creating this software is their job and in return they need to be paid for it. I really do not see what the problem is.

Patches are free and addons cost money. Its simple if you ask me. Nobody will be forcing anyone to buy them if they choose not too.

Waldo.Pepper
09-23-2009, 02:05 PM
Good thing cost good money.

Freiwillige
09-23-2009, 05:03 PM
If he does it like he did with IL2 and releases 10 aircraft in an add on pack then I am all for buying the add on. And the many that follow.

If he does it like R.O.F. per aircraft, Forget it!

The way he did it with IL2 made him plenty of money as he has stated, So I doubt he would change an already successful business model.

waffen-79
09-23-2009, 05:08 PM
Originally posted by Romanator21:
I think it's fair.

+1

I think it is fair, also

Let the first PAY pack contain:

Bf-110, Me-210, Me-410, Fw-190, Ta-152

all full variants

for 30usd how about that?

Stiletto-
09-23-2009, 05:18 PM
in iRacing, if you want to get a new car it will cost you $15. A new track is anywhere from 15-30 dollars. If you don't have the car, you can't race in that series.. If you don't have the track, you have to skip out that week and loose championship points that week too. Alot of the cars come out with a very "beta" feel to them with off physics.

I plan to get RoF soon enough, and the current price of 8 dollars per plane and that you can fly against them if you don't buy sounds like a steal to me.

Things are so complex with modelling these days, there is no way any of the cockpits in IL-2 are close to current standards, takes much longer to complete.

Look at how much it would cost to have all the planes used on warclouds... Same late war planes all the time... Not much. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

WTE_Galway
09-23-2009, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by waffen-79:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Romanator21:
I think it's fair.

+1

I think it is fair, also

Let the first PAY pack contain:

Bf-110, Me-210, Me-410, Fw-190, Ta-152

all full variants

for 30usd how about that? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ummh ... given the other planes proposed for SOW are all summer 1940 ... exactly what is that ta-152 going to go up against ???

staticline1
09-23-2009, 07:46 PM
Ditto with the FW-190, ME-410 and 210 given its a 1940 planeset. The paid addon is a good idea especially if money is tight at this point (which it probably is). A paid addon of the 1941 planeset and scenario would be a good starting point then make it over to the Mediterranean. The only thing I would like for a paid addon is a hard copy but that's just me.

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-24-2009, 08:32 AM
Originally posted by waffen-79:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Romanator21:
I think it's fair.

+1

I think it is fair, also

Let the first PAY pack contain:

Bf-110, Me-210, Me-410, Fw-190, Ta-152

all full variants

for 30usd how about that? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

A Ta-152 in the first pack? I think not. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Crash_Moses
09-24-2009, 10:09 AM
No! I demand the SBD-2 and TBD Devastator!

And I will pay.....a million dollars!

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y125/Crash_Moses/dr-evil.jpg

Uhoh...I'm starting to see a problem with this business model...

M_Gunz
09-24-2009, 11:33 AM
I hope that people realize that SOW planes do not equate to IL2 planes or even close.

RoF is only charging $8 per and people biiiiiitch?
I realize that's almost $60 in dog money but dogs don't play flight sims.

Haigotron
09-24-2009, 11:45 AM
If done properly, DLCs are definitely worth it. Some companies make ripoffs (Street Figther 4 costumes...) but a whole new plane? I think it will be worth it!

Just look at how the FSX addons sold!

Sillius_Sodus
09-24-2009, 01:01 PM
Unless you need to have the aircraft right away, I would wait a little, aircraft will likely get bundled up every now and then and I'm sure we'll get "mega packs" from time to time too.

doraemil
09-25-2009, 12:53 PM
I would pay for something of quality.

It's only fair.

Oleg mention of the price plan is fair. Provided the SOW series has everything IL-2 series has and improvements (AI, I luv the shoot thru pals at you, air circus AI / jet like FM, sniper one hit major damage gunnery, and the best, crashing into each other during formation changes or trying to get your your six).


I like IL-2's format of a new theater release has that theate's planes added to the overall game planeset.

ROF's model of few planes per $$ is kind of gouging, since good WW I sims (not counting mods) are few and far in between (last was Red Baron 3D?) are few and the saying goes, beggars can't be choosers . . . but some people really love ROF, so maybe it might be worth it. I dunno, can't run it nor play it (PC build in the works).

They should have released at least 4 for each side, and add more planes and have gamers pay when they buy the expansions to other theaters / fronts.



I think waffen-79's comment was NOT for just BOB timeline, but for future SOW theaters / different timelines since SOW series is going to cover most if not all WW 2 theaters / timelines.

I think it was just an example of a pricing model, LOL and not a request for BOB to have a TA-152.

of course someone is waiting for the .50 cal that can explode tigers. Or the mustang with liberal flight model + .50's that punch like 30's (mm) in all theaters, including Battle of Stalingrad.

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-25-2009, 04:13 PM
of course someone is waiting for the .50 cal that can explode tigers. Or the mustang with liberal flight model + .50's that punch like 30's (mm) in all theaters, including Battle of Stalingrad.

No serious simmer wishes such ridiculous things.

M_Gunz
09-25-2009, 04:18 PM
Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">of course someone is waiting for the .50 cal that can explode tigers. Or the mustang with liberal flight model + .50's that punch like 30's (mm) in all theaters, including Battle of Stalingrad.

No serious simmer wishes such ridiculous things. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's what MSCFS is for.

Bearcat99
09-25-2009, 08:59 PM
I think it is great that he said in spite of that he will still offer free stuff as well... If it is 1C and it is WWII sim related I am on it like white on rice.

M_Gunz
09-26-2009, 01:48 AM
Bear, there has to be free stuff or those who buy extra won't be able to play on the same server as those who don't.