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Skuldpt
10-07-2011, 02:00 AM
Sorry, if this is overused. But if there is another thread like this one, please send me the link!

We all know that the Assassins Motto is "Nothing is True... Everything is Permited", so last night before I went to bed, I remembered this, if "Nothing is True", how can the Truth video be trustworthy? Or anything else in the game, maybe it was a lie since the very beggings?
And if "Everything is Permited" so creating lies and illusions is permited as well, so Juno making Desmond stabing Lucy was an illusion, The Truth video, when we she a character that looks like Minerva, but not sure it's she, with the apple, can be a fragmented memory or an illusion!
What if the Animus is the Illusion itself?

I don't know if this makes any sense to you but I it would be good to share! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

ProletariatPleb
10-07-2011, 02:11 AM
You know, this line is kinda of...weird....I've never really understood it, lol. To me, it's like a counter-question to keep you balanced...like

If nothing is true, how can this line be true?

And everything is permitted would mean nothing is permitted...because nothing is true.

Assassin_M
10-07-2011, 02:18 AM
I believe that the True Philosophical understanding of this Phrase will never be truly grasped until AC III.
I actually believe that the whole scheme of the Game revolves around this single Phrase.
The Plot, the concept, the War and then the Grand Plan will all revolve around this Prase "Nothing is true, Everything is permitted"

Skuldpt
10-07-2011, 02:43 AM
Yeah, we'll have to wait to find that out!

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 02:48 AM
hey skul do u mind making me a signiture?

Moultonborough
10-07-2011, 02:48 AM
I think Altair explanes it pretty well at the end of AC. I can't remember the whole thing but it's toward the end. You can probably a video on Youtube somewhere.

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 02:50 AM
wait btw how so u upload a picture for ur sign anyway?

itsamea-mario
10-07-2011, 03:01 AM
It's not supposed to be taken literally.

Assassin_M
10-07-2011, 03:02 AM
Originally posted by itsamea-mario:
It's not supposed to be taken literally.
Most likely.

gharlazufarc
10-07-2011, 03:05 AM
This reminds me the quote from AC1
Al Mualim: Do you remember, Alta´r, what the Assassins fight for?
Alta´r: Peace, in all things.
Al Mualim: Yes, in all things! It is not enough to end the violence one man commits upon another. It refers to peace within as well. We cannot have one without the other.
Alta´r: So it is said.
Al Mualim: So it is! But you, my son, have not found inner peace! It manifests in ugly ways! You are arrogant and over-confident.
Alta´r: Were you not the one to say "nothing is true and everything is permitted?"
Al Mualim: You do not understand the true meaning of the phrase, my child. It does not grant you the freedom to do as you wish, it is a knowledge meant to guide your senses. It expects a wisdom you clearly lack!

and then after Altair got wiser

Al Mualim: Before you go, I have a question for you.
Alta´r: Of course.
Al Mualim: What is the Truth?
Alta´r: We place faith in ourselves; we see the world the way it really is, and hope that, one day, all mankind might see the same.
Al Mualim: What is the world, then?
Alta´r: An illusion. One which we can either submit to; as most do, or transcend.
Al Mualim: What is it to transcend?
Alta´r: To recognize nothing is true, and everything is permitted. That laws arise, not from divinity, but reason. I understand now that our creed does not command us to be free; it commands us to be wise.

Skuldpt
10-07-2011, 03:21 AM
Originally posted by MeSkate:
hey skul do u mind making me a signiture?

Sure, but this isn't a thread for that, just send me a PM that I can answer your questions!



Originally posted by gharlazufarc:
This reminds me the quote from AC1
Al Mualim: Do you remember, Alta´r, what the Assassins fight for?
Alta´r: Peace, in all things.
Al Mualim: Yes, in all things! It is not enough to end the violence one man commits upon another. It refers to peace within as well. We cannot have one without the other.
Alta´r: So it is said.
Al Mualim: So it is! But you, my son, have not found inner peace! It manifests in ugly ways! You are arrogant and over-confident.
Alta´r: Were you not the one to say "nothing is true and everything is permitted?"
Al Mualim: You do not understand the true meaning of the phrase, my child. It does not grant you the freedom to do as you wish, it is a knowledge meant to guide your senses. It expects a wisdom you clearly lack!

and then after Altair got wiser

Al Mualim: Before you go, I have a question for you.
Alta´r: Of course.
Al Mualim: What is the Truth?
Alta´r: We place faith in ourselves; we see the world the way it really is, and hope that, one day, all mankind might see the same.
Al Mualim: What is the world, then?
Alta´r: An illusion. One which we can either submit to; as most do, or transcend.
Al Mualim: What is it to transcend?
Alta´r: To recognize nothing is true, and everything is permitted. That laws arise, not from divinity, but reason. I understand now that our creed does not command us to be free; it commands us to be wise.

How could I forget that?! That dialogue explains a lot to me! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

naran6142
10-07-2011, 08:32 PM
first off you have to remember its the "assassins creed", the everything is permitted part says do wat it takes to get the job done, and the nothing is true part as gharlazufarc posted dialog says it commands the assassins the analyze everything

Animuses
10-07-2011, 09:56 PM
Assassin's Creed Brotherhood: Vittoria agli Assassini.

Assassin's Creed:
Al Mualim: Do you remember, Alta´r, what the Assassins fight for?
Alta´r: Peace, in all things.
Al Mualim: Yes, in all things! It is not enough to end the violence one man commits upon another. It refers to peace within as well. We cannot have one without the other.
Alta´r: So it is said.
Al Mualim: So it is! But you, my son, have not found inner peace! It manifests in ugly ways! You are arrogant and over-confident.
Alta´r: Were you not the one to say "nothing is true and everything is permitted?"
Al Mualim: You do not understand the true meaning of the phrase, my child. It does not grant you the freedom to do as you wish, it is a knowledge meant to guide your senses. It expects a wisdom you clearly lack!

and then after Altair got wiser

Al Mualim: Before you go, I have a question for you.
Alta´r: Of course.
Al Mualim: What is the Truth?
Alta´r: We place faith in ourselves; we see the world the way it really is, and hope that, one day, all mankind might see the same.
Al Mualim: What is the world, then?
Alta´r: An illusion. One which we can either submit to; as most do, or transcend.
Al Mualim: What is it to transcend?
Alta´r: To recognize nothing is true, and everything is permitted. That laws arise, not from divinity, but reason. I understand now that our creed does not command us to be free; it commands us to be wise.

Yeah, it's obvious as to which game is better.

dave93vert
10-12-2011, 07:19 PM
you guys are close but failing to stop beating around the bush, let me get right to the point. "nothing is true, everything is permitted" goes back to the truth video sequence. we see the god creatures in control of the humans, this is the "not true" part that humans first experienced in human existence. "everything is permitted" is seen in two aspects, one is the god creatures permitting themselves to control the humans, two is the humans fighting back. simple and straightforward stuff guys. with the gods removed u can use the phrase to describe human relations between themselves. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

LightRey
10-13-2011, 01:47 AM
Originally posted by dave93vert:
you guys are close but failing to stop beating around the bush, let me get right to the point. "nothing is true, everything is permitted" goes back to the truth video sequence. we see the god creatures in control of the humans, this is the "not true" part that humans first experienced in human existence. "everything is permitted" is seen in two aspects, one is the god creatures permitting themselves to control the humans, two is the humans fighting back. simple and straightforward stuff guys. with the gods removed u can use the phrase to describe human relations between themselves. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
All theory and speculation.

lukaszep
10-13-2011, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by dave93vert:
you guys are close but failing to stop beating around the bush, let me get right to the point. "nothing is true, everything is permitted" goes back to the truth video sequence. we see the god creatures in control of the humans, this is the "not true" part that humans first experienced in human existence. "everything is permitted" is seen in two aspects, one is the god creatures permitting themselves to control the humans, two is the humans fighting back. simple and straightforward stuff guys. with the gods removed u can use the phrase to describe human relations between themselves. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I know this isn't really relevant, but calling them "God creatures" annoys me, sorry. They are TWCB (Those Who Came Before).

Altair661
10-13-2011, 01:24 PM
I always thought of it as, Nothing is True, or take nothing for granted or as the correct answer. Everything is Permitted, all options are open.

Assassin_M
10-13-2011, 02:04 PM
Originally posted by dave93vert:
you guys are close but failing to stop beating around the bush, let me get right to the point. "nothing is true, everything is permitted" goes back to the truth video sequence. we see the god creatures in control of the humans, this is the "not true" part that humans first experienced in human existence. "everything is permitted" is seen in two aspects, one is the god creatures permitting themselves to control the humans, two is the humans fighting back. simple and straightforward stuff guys. with the gods removed u can use the phrase to describe human relations between themselves. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
You speak as if thats how it is, you are so confident as if you are Alex Amancio, that is just your theory dont speak of it as a Fact.

Jexx21
10-13-2011, 02:08 PM
the saying 'Nothing is true; Everything is permitted' goes way back in history. The AC team didn't make it, it was based off the theoretical last words of the Grandmaster of the Hashashin order.

Nothing is true: don't trust what the government says, what your taught, because history is written by the victor.

Everything is permitted: Don't be bound by morals or laws, do what you need to do to get your job done. In the Assassin's case, this is stopping the Templars and any other group that is corrupt and wants world-power.

RzaRecta357
10-13-2011, 02:17 PM
I'm pretty sure it's the way that Altair says it just not in such mystical phrasing.

It means the things the government and you see aren't always the truth and there's more to everything. You can do anything.

Which I can't even word the feelings I get from it right, but something like that.

Which made me sad in AC2 because they seem to take it much more literal than the original game.

Almost like those italian assassin's just didn't get it.

Jexx21
10-13-2011, 02:19 PM
Originally posted by RzaRecta357:
I'm pretty sure it's the way that Altair says it just not in such mystical phrasing.

It means the things the government and you see aren't always the truth and there's more to everything. You can do anything.

Which I can't even word the feelings I get from it right, but something like that.

Which made me sad in AC2 because they seem to take it much more literal than the original game.

Almost like those italian assassin's just didn't get it.

I feel like they took it the same way. The Assassin order in Masyaf actually was following a lot of odd traditions instead of the actual creed. It's the reason why Altiar scrapped the traditions and declared that as long as the Assassins followed the Creed they could do what they wanted.

I don't see how you think the Italian Assassins didn't get it.

piratprince
10-13-2011, 02:28 PM
I think Ezio didnt get it:

Ezio Auditore must leave his life behind in search of answers, in search of the truth. In Assassin's Creed Revelations, master assassin Ezio Auditore walks in the footsteps of the legendary mentor Alta´r, on a journey of discovery and revelation.

So Ezio wants to find the wisdom Alta´r left at the assassins fortress. (the hidden library my friend is blowing in the wind)

Lol http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Jexx21
10-13-2011, 02:32 PM
Uh.. He understood the Creed in AC2 and ACB.

And repeating the summary of ACR doesn't do anything..

Skuldpt
10-13-2011, 02:41 PM
Interesting theories! Thanks for you answers! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

piratprince
10-13-2011, 02:42 PM
when i say ezio i also mean "everybody". These Nothing is true everything is possible "Words For Eternity"

End On End Songtext

close your eyes to the light rejoice in the fact that there is no knowledge that should not be questioned burn all books that tell you how you must think remember the times of your youth when nothing was true and everything was permitted and your mind was unburdened from hate and pain try to remember the faces and names of those who were no longer your friends once the cool crowd and fashion police reigned supreme try to remember what the world was like before science and reason boxed in your senses and changed the world into a place of angles and measures dropping blinders on your sight and dampers on your ears forget what you have been told no answers are always correct.


Its not the fault of the books either

We Have to Take Responsibility for Ourselves and for everything. because every thing we make is true and everything is possible.

RzaRecta357
10-13-2011, 03:17 PM
In AC2 when they're all standing together in the tower. I don't remember the dialogue but I remember feeling like they don't understand the phrase right.

Guess i'll have to youtube it.


Just watched it. Yeah I guess they do understand it the same.

I just don't like how they are like Where other men are held down by morals yadda yadda everything is permitted.

Makes it seem like the phrase is more about being above the law then truly understanding life.

Jexx21
10-13-2011, 03:58 PM
Originally said by Altiar:
To recognize nothing is true, and everything is permitted. That laws arise, not from divinity, but reason. I understand now that our creed does not command us to be free; it commands us to be wise.

This is pretty much the same thing. Altiar just says that it commands us to be wise, not to necessarily follow the law.

LightRey
10-13-2011, 04:08 PM
Originally posted by Jexx21:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally said by Altiar:
To recognize nothing is true, and everything is permitted. That laws arise, not from divinity, but reason. I understand now that our creed does not command us to be free; it commands us to be wise.

This is pretty much the same thing. Altiar just says that it commands us to be wise, not to necessarily follow the law. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
True, but I wonder the testicle...

Jexx21
10-13-2011, 04:13 PM
lolz.

That's gonna go on forever.

Skuldpt
10-13-2011, 04:19 PM
Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jexx21:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally said by Altiar:
To recognize nothing is true, and everything is permitted. That laws arise, not from divinity, but reason. I understand now that our creed does not command us to be free; it commands us to be wise.

This is pretty much the same thing. Altiar just says that it commands us to be wise, not to necessarily follow the law. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
True, but I wonder the testicle... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Me too.... Now that's even more mysterious than the Truth! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

LightRey
10-13-2011, 04:19 PM
Originally posted by Jexx21:
lolz.

That's gonna go on forever.
As it should. I'm turning this into a meme if it's the last thing I do.

kudos17
10-13-2011, 06:45 PM
I always took it as the statement that one should never take anything at face value, and anything goes.

But that's really the gist of it. I could think about that more, but it would be pointless - as it requires I wisdom I clearly lack.

E-Zekiel
10-13-2011, 08:17 PM
The meaning of "Nothing is true. Everything is permitted."

Means that you can never really know a universal truth, because truth is relative. Every day you learn more and more, and the knowledge you obtain is generally whatever you are permitted to obtain by those more intelligent, more powerful, more well-connected, or more fortunate than you.

dave93vert
10-13-2011, 09:59 PM
"Alamut" is a novel by Vladimir Bartol, first published in 1938 in Slovenian, dealing with the story of Hassan-i Sabbah and the Hashshashin, and named after their Alamut fortress.

Bartol first started to conceive the novel in the early 1930s, when he lived in Paris. In the French capital, he met with the Slovene literary critic Josip Vidmar, who introduced him to the story of Hassan-i-Sabbah. A further stimulation for the novel came from the assassination of King Alexander I of Yugoslavia perpetrated by Croatian and Bulgarian radical nationalists, on the alleged commission of the Italian Fascist government. When it was originally published, the novel was sarcastically dedicated to Benito Mussolini.

The maxim of the novel is "Nothing is true, everything is permitted".

The paradox of Hasan-i Sabbah can be seen in Bey's writing on the Assassins. "True, in this myth some aspirant disciples may be ordered to fling themselves off the ramparts into the black--but also true that some of them will learn to fly like sorcerers." The Assassins lived in a world beyond Divine Law where no one interposed between themselves and God--a world where, by sacrificing themselves, they became free...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alamut_(1938_novel)
http://www.alamut.com/subj/ide...lamut/litTheory.html (http://www.alamut.com/subj/ideologies/alamut/litTheory.html)