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View Full Version : One 1946 disappointment of mine...



Wepps
10-11-2007, 07:30 PM
I finally got around to buying 1946, and the biggest disappointment I experience is when i went to start with my old hobby, building historical missions and campaigns.

After all this time I expected to see a ton more maps than I found!

Granted, Pacific and Khalkin Ghol, but what ever happened to western Russia? I miss it dearly.

The only border province shown is in southern Poland/Ussr.

I had hoped to finally build a realistic campaign but there are simply too many gaps in the geography to do so accurately.

Hopefully there will be time in the future to add the rest of Russia to the inventory of maps.

Wepps
10-11-2007, 07:36 PM
Bah sorry about responding to my own post, but I hit the button too early and can't find how to edit.

At any rate, I promised once that if you would box all the expansions and patches into a single product, I'd rather buy that than have to patch everything again it was so annoying.

Well, I did as I promised. I bought it.

Now I'm telling you if you release a map expansion including a serious upgrade to the missing parts of western Russia, I'd spend good money to buy that too.

To me it would be worth it. Just like 1946 was.

Thanks again Oleg for a great game.

VW-IceFire
10-11-2007, 08:58 PM
I know what you mean Wepps but the real problem is that during late 1944 and 1945 on the eastern front allot of ground is covered in a very short time and allot of maps would need to cover the areas required to really do something proper...even really large maps like the Gulf of Finland wouldn't really do.

We do have a few more maps slated for release with 4.09 from third party sources. One of those is Slovakia which if memory serves should be very useful for a 1944/1945 setup as the Soviets and Germans both passed through the area battling each other.

Copperhead311th
10-11-2007, 10:22 PM
Well the thing about those (Slovakia Map & others) is that they are the pet project of some people who have kissed enough *** in the right places around the sim to get thier hands on the mapping tools. There are a lot of maps that we should have but don't. Slovakia being one of them and one of the more important maps for the Eastern front. Yet.....in the mean time we only have 1/2 of New Guinia nothing of the Phillipeans, and an imaninary island runway for southern England. I mean for go sakes mae an english channel map....it's be the size of the findland map or larger but geeze. I hardly belive an Itialn Map was tyhe way to go. and once gaain the PTO & PF get swept under the rug. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

VW-IceFire
10-11-2007, 10:28 PM
Thats the thing really...everyone has their own ideas on which map should be available and why.

Jutocsa
10-12-2007, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by Copperhead311th:
Well the thing about those (Slovakia Map & others) is that they are the pet project of some people who have kissed enough *** in the right places around the sim to get thier hands on the mapping tools. There are a lot of maps that we should have but don't. Slovakia being one of them and one of the more important maps for the Eastern front. Yet.....in the mean time we only have 1/2 of New Guinia nothing of the Phillipeans, and an imaninary island runway for southern England. I mean for go sakes mae an english channel map....it's be the size of the findland map or larger but geeze. I hardly belive an Itialn Map was tyhe way to go. and once gaain the PTO & PF get swept under the rug. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

And when exactly making free 3rd party addons became ***-kissing ? I bet if Martin and his team would be doing some "important" Pacific maps youd be doing theirs...
Funny that not only everyone thinks that his map needs are the most and only important, they start mocking those who were willing to spend years to learn and actually do something for the sim. Have you done that ?

MatoKKK
10-12-2007, 01:45 AM
I am kind of tired and simply don't have time for people like Copperhead. If he thinks we had to kiss someone's *** to get the map tools, let him fool himself. No, we simply asked for them, but before that we established our credibility with Maddox Games by being their betatesters and making Slovak dynamic campaign and voicepack for AEP. And of course it's a pet project. What would you expect? I wouldn't spend 1000-1500 hours of my free time on something I don't care about. We wished to have our home map in the game, so we put together resources and did it while you just kept whining, praying, wishing, whatever. We deliver results and work, you just demand and blame others. If you REALLY wanted to have more PTO maps, you could have created them. We started from scratch over 2 years ago.

Philipscdrw
10-12-2007, 07:47 AM
Originally posted by Copperhead311th:
Well the thing about those (Slovakia Map & others) is that they are the pet project of some people who have kissed enough *** in the right places around the sim to get thier hands on the mapping tools. There are a lot of maps that we should have but don't. Slovakia being one of them and one of the more important maps for the Eastern front. Yet.....in the mean time we only have 1/2 of New Guinia nothing of the Phillipeans, and an imaninary island runway for southern England. I mean for go sakes mae an english channel map....it's be the size of the findland map or larger but geeze. I hardly belive an Itialn Map was tyhe way to go. and once gaain the PTO & PF get swept under the rug. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

There's a deliberate reason why England is a tiny island with one runway. (Not because that's what England is from an American point-of-view http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ) - it's because making a full Channel map would harm SoW:BoB. The Normandy maps are there for the aircraft added in the Aces Expansion Pack.

Like Jutocsa and MatoKKK have said, no-one 'kissed ***' - the Slovakia map team (and the other map teams) got the map tools by demonstrating to 1C that they're a dedicated team who do have the persistence to complete the thing to a high standard.

All the best bits in Il-2 are someone's pet project, Copperhead - look at the cockpit of the J-8A, or the Tempest, or the new Africa maps, to pick a few examples.

Wepps
10-12-2007, 05:17 PM
I wonder how difficult it would be to turn European Russia into a single....huge...map.

Then add a tool that allows the mission builder to choose an area of small to large size for the mission.

Or perhaps do that for Battle of Britain, then apply the same method to old Russia.

Just a thought.

DKoor
10-12-2007, 06:32 PM
Huge map=Slide show

Woodstock_69
10-12-2007, 07:16 PM
Huge map=Slide show

Or the time to load such a map will last for ages... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

VW-IceFire
10-12-2007, 07:46 PM
Originally posted by Wepps:
I wonder how difficult it would be to turn European Russia into a single....huge...map.

Then add a tool that allows the mission builder to choose an area of small to large size for the mission.

Or perhaps do that for Battle of Britain, then apply the same method to old Russia.

Just a thought.
Difficult...using the current method since the entire map is loaded into memory and every object is kept track of in some way.

It also means that with a huge area such as that its harder for the creators to either keep the map properly detailed or without bugs. As it is there are problems on maps like Normandy where it was just not possible for the team that gave us that (also a third party effort) map to check absolutely every square inch of the map.

Tricky proposition.

MaxMhz
10-12-2007, 08:31 PM
Instead for being gratefull some talented people are giving up their free time to bring a great map to the community these people now need to be insulted? what the heck is going on...

Don't you have any shame?

Kongo Otto
10-13-2007, 07:48 PM
Originally posted by MatoKKK:
I am kind of tired and simply don't have time for people like Copperhead. If he thinks we had to kiss someone's *** to get the map tools, let him fool himself. No, we simply asked for them, but before that we established our credibility with Maddox Games by being their betatesters and making Slovak dynamic campaign and voicepack for AEP. And of course it's a pet project. What would you expect? I wouldn't spend 1000-1500 hours of my free time on something I don't care about. We wished to have our home map in the game, so we put together resources and did it while you just kept whining, praying, wishing, whatever. We deliver results and work, you just demand and blame others. If you REALLY wanted to have more PTO maps, you could have created them. We started from scratch over 2 years ago.

Who in the world gives a cent on a statement from Copperhead?
Nobody.
Everytime i read one of his staements the word "Windtalker" becomes a new meaning.

GerritJ9
10-14-2007, 06:17 AM
I think I read somewhere that the FB engine limits maps to a certain size, so one huge map would probably not be possible.

BenQ-the-Hawk
10-14-2007, 08:26 AM
mr .50 kills tiger:
who cares about PTO http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Bearcat99
10-14-2007, 08:03 PM
Originally posted by Copperhead311th:
Well the thing about those (Slovakia Map & others) is that they are the pet project of some people who have kissed enough *** in the right places around the sim to get thier hands on the mapping tools. There are a lot of maps that we should have but don't. Slovakia being one of them and one of the more important maps for the Eastern front. Yet.....in the mean time we only have 1/2 of New Guinia nothing of the Phillipeans, and an imaninary island runway for southern England. I mean for go sakes mae an english channel map....it's be the size of the findland map or larger but geeze. I hardly belive an Itialn Map was tyhe way to go. and once gaain the PTO & PF get swept under the rug. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Copperhead.. sometimes the dumb $hit that comes out of your mouth just friggin astounds me.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif as much as I like you. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

For what it is worth ... can you say STORM OF WAR:BATTLE OF BRITAIN ... and sure the PTO could use more maps.. the sim could use more of a lot of stuff. We dont have it. We probably will never get it..... when will some of the folks in here get it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif

Wepps this sim isn't like the MS offerings... since it is closed architecture anyone with a globe can't just make a map and offer it... thats the way it is. There are some new maps coming... I for one, would really LOVE to see HUGE maps.. more on the line of the MS offerings... but this sim is not structured that way. I can imagine what it would be like if people had really huge maps and took the time to populate them accordingly.. say with objects etc... on some of the larger maps now the sim will chug along on below average rigs... imagine the game play with huge maps.. not to mention the load times.. it is what it is. I recommend that you just deal with it and you will find that you will still be able to do some interesting and engrossing stuff with the resouces that you have...

and Copper.... shoelaces do not look good betwen your teeth.

By the way... if you think that making the maps for this sim is an easy thing to do read this thread @ SHQ (http://www.simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2346800#Post2346800).... incidentally it is about the new soon to be released Bessarabia map.


Like Jutocsa and MatoKKK have said, no-one 'kissed ***' - the Slovakia map team (and the other map teams) got the map tools by demonstrating to 1C that they're a dedicated team who do have the persistence to complete the thing to a high standard.

All the best bits in Il-2 are someone's pet project, Copperhead - look at the cockpit of the J-8A, or the Tempest, or the new Africa maps, to pick a few examples.

Exactly..........

Wepps
10-14-2007, 09:57 PM
Actually I've been around for some time, I'm aware of what's possible and what's not.

I can't believe how this place has degenerated into such a flame fest. Tossing of assumptions and griefs to everyone seems to be the norm.

What's with you people?

And by the way, my disappointments are my own, and for Oleg in particular in this case. I will have them, and I will pass them on when *I* see necessary to do so for what I see is the betterment of the game. Whether or not you like it.

I just thought I'd point that out.

If you don't like it, I suggest buggering off somewhere else and cooling off for a while. But people's personal problems don't concern me so don't lay them on me like I care.

jurinko
10-15-2007, 01:24 AM
Merging of existing maps - not possible.
New maps only by 3rd party - Slovakia, Bessarabia, hypothetical ME map.

Bearcat99
10-15-2007, 06:49 AM
Originally posted by Wepps:
Actually I've been around for some time, I'm aware of what's possible and what's not.
I can't believe how this place has degenerated into such a flame fest. Tossing of assumptions and griefs to everyone seems to be the norm.
What's with you people?
And by the way, my disappointments are my own, and for Oleg in particular in this case. I will have them, and I will pass them on when *I* see necessary to do so for what I see is the betterment of the game. Whether or not you like it.
I just thought I'd point that out.
If you don't like it, I suggest buggering off somewhere else and cooling off for a while. But people's personal problems don't concern me so don't lay them on me like I care.

Are you talking to me? I hope not... since I don't think anything I posted to you was inflammatory in anyway... I just couldn't let that other comment slide because it was just too asinine. I don't think anyone else in here directed anything at you for you to take offense at either... it looks to me like every comment made in this thread directed at you was pretty reasonable and certainly not flaming you in anyway, so I don't know where that is coming from at all. As for your not being new and people making assumptions.... maybe this...

I finally got around to buying 1946, and the biggest disappointment I experience is when i went to start with my old hobby, building historical missions and campaigns.

led folks to think you were a newcomer right or wrong.. and not really a big deal eh...... and the overall comment.

Any negativity in this thread was not directed at you it was directed at the totally uncalled for and disparaging remarks made towards the people who took the time to make the new maps we do have, imperfect as they may be, by a single poster in this thread. So ..... lighten up. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif


Originally posted by jurinko:
Merging of existing maps - not possible.
New maps only by 3rd party - Slovakia, Bessarabia, hypothetical ME map.

Yeah I often dreamt about that too.... like a small transition map... one in water... one in desert.. one in snow and one on grass.... sort of like a map that would actually spawn off the map.. way off the map, where there are no objects... at all... I guess the time to load the new maps and objects would totally screw things up... sort of like when it loads in a muission.. be it coop or DF... then I guess if you had 16 guys going back and forth on the borders of the maps..... LOL....

Wepps
10-15-2007, 10:31 AM
Bah that was to everybody in general.

In my experience, this type of forum environment is caused by two failures:

1 - The total lack of a definitive response, or policy, on the part of the game company in question.

Without this, players take it upon themselves to make assumptions.

For example, there are a lot of people who look at the recent hacking as a bad thing. Obviously, Oleg doesn't want this. On the other hand, there are a lot of people who view the recent hacking as a good thing, the community is doing something abourt apparent lack of content in the game after 6+ years of development.

Which side is wrong is apparently up to the individual, and that polarizes the forums into THIS and THAT, and they are each emotional about the issue.

2 - Forum moderation is not up to par.

Control of the forum is very important. Personal attacks are responded to it seems by mods, but not removed. Not removing them allows for followup emotional responses on the part of the polarized crowd, as we see clearly in this thread.

In order to be successful here though, you have to have SOME kind of policy on the part of the forum managers/owners and/or 1c Maddox.

/shrug

This place reminds me of the VN boards now.

"Why you Oleg kiss *** fanboi!"

"You no good Oleg hater!"

Pfft.

We need some positive feedback on the GAME concerning what works, and criticisms on what doesn't, or what it truly needs, and we need it organized with an appropriate response from tired Russians, or the forum will just be a place to come to lay accusations and rhetoric.

edit (yes figured it out) ----

As to the map, the problem you suggest in your last paragraph can 'easily' be overcome...by allowing the mission builders the tools to choose the size of the area map that will exist in the mission. Allowing a LARGE or TOTAL MAP to use while simply building the mission doesn't translate into a huge TOTAL map at the time of the mission.

What I'm suggesting is a base, huge map covering everything or at least a lot, and the tools necessary to reduce it in size for the mission or server in question. Do we see where I'm going here?

A mission builder choosing a 'large map' from the main one would still have a significantly reduced map size for the mission itself.

Essentially what I am saying is that one could conceivably, then, take a *portion* of the Gulf of Finland maps and build a mission from that. You don't always have to have the complete map - to this end, the tools necessary to do that would be required, and additional maps of huge size would be very nice to work with.

I'd pay good money for a CD with just tons of maps on it of western Russia, not to mention the other theatres around the world.


Weppster

Bearcat99
10-15-2007, 01:11 PM
Bah that was to everybody in general.

http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/bronners_1971_62705191


Ok........ http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif


Essentially what I am saying is that one could conceivably, then, take a *portion* of the Gulf of Finland maps and build a mission from that. You don't always have to have the complete map - to this end, the tools necessary to do that would be required, and additional maps of huge size would be very nice to work with.

So what happens when someone joins a coop and they don't have said "portioned" map? Or are you saying if they have the big map then it will (hypothetically)just follow the directions of the server and load accordingly.... It would be nice.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sleepzzz.gif


I'd pay good money for a CD with just tons of maps on it of western Russia, not to mention the other theatres around the world.


Weppster

So would I....

Wepps
10-15-2007, 03:25 PM
Essentially what I am saying is that one could conceivably, then, take a *portion* of the Gulf of Finland maps and build a mission from that. You don't always have to have the complete map - to this end, the

Well, if everyone has the same maps, then the person running the mission need only upload what they have.

Not the entire map mind you, but *this map* *these coordinates*. *Now add all the bull******

So initially instead of loading a map, the map's already there. You're only telling the joining player's computer which part of which one, and their computer does the rest.

The mission map editor should only be a matter of point and click-drag until the box is the size you want it. The coordinates are saved. Or, "click the center of the map you want to use, now choose small medium or large." This last would give more control to Oleg and co in choosing what would be appropriate sizes given the game engine etc...

Bearcat99
10-15-2007, 03:45 PM
It would be nice.... Id love to be able to fly from England to Germany...... in real time.... (Id probably just do it one... but still..LOL).. it would be nice....

triad773
10-15-2007, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by Bearcat99:
It would be nice.... Id love to be able to fly from England to Germany...... in real time.... (Id probably just do it one... but still..LOL).. it would be nice....

I did that once- B-17II- Fighting 8th. All the way from England to Hamburg. Could do it in a B-17, P-47 or Mustang as I remember. Graphics not the best even then, but a real education as to the long stretches of boredom punctuated by moments of terror. I purposely did it ONCE without hitting the time skip key. It was a real challenge. Can imagine it being much much worse IRL http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif

Enforcer572005
10-15-2007, 08:54 PM
Once in MS CFS2 (which was never finished by microdork or its million defects patched at all) I flew a Zeke from Rabaul to GUadalcanal and back, in real time. I had to put it on auto pilot quite a bit, but it took many hrs. The map was extremely detailed and had most of the solomons in it. But this sim isnt built like that, though I do wish Guadalcanal had a few more islands.

You can improvise maps, sa there are alot of them. The Kuban makes an great China map, and Ive seen Hawaii and Saipan used as Malta (though Saipan is better for that). Whatever scenario you want to do can probably be improvised very well.

ryankm
10-18-2007, 04:36 PM
What Wepps was trying to say was that the ubi forums have become a flame war in general. Your response to that just proved his point. He was not directing that comment at you but at the forums in general. I for one am also sick of has been happening with theses forums this past year. All other people do his give and then people here just complain about how their special thing was not included....

If you know what I'm talking about.

ryankm
10-18-2007, 04:41 PM
oh sorry haven't read page two yet that response above was for page 1 only. I just didn't notice page 2.