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View Full Version : Bomber gunners aces ?



Bsnakeman
10-04-2005, 03:14 PM
S !

Wondering in real life how many bomber gunners aces the Allies had, which scores and records.

I know that IL2 has the top score bomber gunners immortal aces ! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Best,

KGr.HH-Sunburst
10-04-2005, 03:42 PM
yeah kinda funny because ive seen dead He111 gunners but ive never taken out Allied gunners on
B17/25/24/29 etc
they keep on shooting even when missing a wing and heading for mother earth

besides all gunners on multi engines planes are waaay to good, they can track you at 800kph and still make a PK (im not talking about 6 o clock attacks)

in this game its easier to survive a 1 vs 10 fighters then against a dozen of bombers lol

Zyzbot
10-04-2005, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by Bsnakeman:
S !

Wondering in real life how many bomber gunners aces the Allies had, which scores and records.

I know that IL2 has the top score bomber gunners immortal aces ! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Best,

Gunner "ace" list:

http://math.fce.vutbr.cz/safarik/ACES/aces1/usa-gunner.html

Waldo.Pepper
10-04-2005, 04:43 PM
Those figures, while official, are rubbish.

Several gunners would claim the same plane and all would get the credit equally. This type of lax scrutiny was endemic at the time and was thought to buoy morale of the crews.

Zyzbot
10-04-2005, 04:48 PM
Originally posted by Waldo.Pepper:
Those figures, while official, are rubbish.

Several gunners would claim the same plane and all would get the credit equally. This type of lax scrutiny was endemic at the time and was thought to buoy morale of the crews.

True enough. But many other "official" kill lists are probably also wrong too.

FritzGryphon
10-04-2005, 04:54 PM
besides all gunners on multi engines planes are waaay to good

The AI gunner effectiveness is far too often overstated. While they don't act realistically, they are not good.

I can easily knock down 4 Ace B-25s in a 109. I cannot shoot down 4 Human B-25s in a 109; I would be full of holes just to get one!

In TB-3, I can shoot down many early war fighters singled handedly (unless one of them rams me). AI TB-3 would not accomplish even one.

The expectation of shooting down many bombers, in close formation, by yourself, is unreasonable and unrealistic. In real life, particularly in late war, fighters would attack bomber formations in large groups, and still suffer losses equal or greater than what they shot down.

This is sharp constrast to John Wayne that dives through a B-17 box by himself, and then complains that he lost his elevator control.

Previous games that have reduced gunners to non-threatening eye candy have created a false impression among gamers, that they should be invincible to gunners, even when fighting in a very risky fashion.

Human gunners in PF better than AI, always. Sorry, just had to say that.

p1ngu666
10-04-2005, 05:20 PM
i think i may have achived 5 in one sortie a few times, irl, there where perhaps a few in bomber command, there where some who certainly got 3-4, i have a account of someone (617 i think, rear gunner) who got 3 in one night. night kill claims where often surprisingly acurate due to the 1v1 nature, and fire clearly shows up at night, with blackout and all...

F19_Ob
10-05-2005, 03:08 AM
Online the gunners are poor shooters and often shoot in the wrong direction.
I usually man the gunnerpositions myself so the enemy doeesn't get a too easy kill.
Sometimes I have lucked out and got an ai-gunnerkill but that has usually been when I have made sharp turns and fooled the chasing enemy fighter to declerate aswell, for his easy kill, then at close range and slow the gunners may do their job.
in big bombers I usually get shot down without a single hit on the attacker if I leave it up to the ai.

So online it's best to man the guns yourself http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

LeLv44_Mangrove
10-05-2005, 05:34 AM
Don't know about allied aces, but the best finnish gunner were V. M├┬Ârsky (2x I-16 in winter war) and Y. Hammaren (2x I-153 in winter war too). Their only weapon against fighters was one 7.7mm Browning!