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ScytheOfGrim
06-07-2011, 09:52 AM
At exactly 4:00 in the E3 demo (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2011-assassins-creed/714944) of AC: Revelations, the song used contains the words "Allahu akbar, Allahu akbar", in the same form commonly said during the Islamic call to prayer.

Unless Ubisoft is looking for a backlash from the Islamic community, I strongly urge them to do some magic censor-work.

Better somebody point this out early to you Ubi-peeps so that it doesn't result in a delay in the future, like this same issue did with other games.

IIwangcarsII
06-07-2011, 09:58 AM
Allahu akbar

It only means Allah is the greatest. How is that offensive unless you are a die hard to your own religion.

phil.llllll
06-07-2011, 10:01 AM
I noticed that as well - or at least it sounded like it; I couldn't be sure.

And yeah, I'm sure someone will take offense to it so you're probably right.

EDIT: ^Probably the context it's used in - i.e. a game about killing people (muslims, christians, whatever).

sfin1994
06-07-2011, 10:12 AM
well remeber were Ezio is, there could be people praying around there, remember, back in those days religion was like gaming to us...

Assassin_M
06-07-2011, 10:15 AM
yup Muslim Summoned, me, and no its not offensive we have that phrase in many songs and music, no one will be offended really, atleast Im not

kriegerdesgottes
06-07-2011, 10:31 AM
Who is going to be offended by that? I'm Christian and I'm not offended by that.

SupremeCaptain
06-07-2011, 10:49 AM
Remember The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time with their chanting. Muslims got offended not by the chanting, but the context of where the chanting took place.

Like Phil.llllll said.

iN3krO
06-07-2011, 10:58 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
At exactly 4:00 in the E3 demo (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2011-assassins-creed/714944) of AC: Revelations, the song used contains the words "Allahu akbar, Allahu akbar", in the same form commonly said during the Islamic call to prayer.

Unless Ubisoft is looking for a backlash from the Islamic community, I strongly urge them to do some magic censor-work.

Better somebody point this out early to you Ubi-peeps so that it doesn't result in a delay in the future, like this same issue did with other games.

Are you fuc**** kidding us?...

Man, the game is multicultural and religion based why would ppl be offended cuz the game got religion words inside?

Well, i've been really offended when i knew i was fighting the Papa o.o (joking -.-'')

ScytheOfGrim
06-07-2011, 12:28 PM
LBP (http://blog.us.playstation.com/2008/10/17/littlebigplanet-release-update/) was delayed a week because a verse from the Qur'an was found in one of the songs.

Little Big Planet.

If you're going to compare and claim that the argument lies in the context or whatnot, trust me when I say you're arguing a moot point.

Fact is, people will be offended. I guarantee you that.

Assassin_M
06-07-2011, 12:31 PM
Understand that you are comparing very different points, The words "Allahu Akbar" are not only used in the call for prayer, its normally used in normal Speech and even in some songs.
The Quran verse in LBP is different however.
trust me Im a Muslim and I know more than you do

Crouching.Tiger
06-07-2011, 12:36 PM
I think Assassin's Creed is so insulting to all religions and beliefs, including atheism and evolutionism that it evens out.

ScytheOfGrim
06-07-2011, 12:38 PM
You know more than I do, do you?

Funny that.


It's the same thing. People will be offended.

Although "Allahu akbar" is used more often in songs, that doesn't mean it should be there. People will still pick up on it, notice that it's used in a manner simply to promote the music and not in a religious sense, and bite back because of it.
If you can't see the issue at hand, then you are unable to remain proactive. The last thing you want is for Ubisoft to pull the game off shelves and delay it for a week.

Assassin_M
06-07-2011, 12:43 PM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
You know more than I do, do you?

Funny that.


It's the same thing. People will be offended.

Although "Allahu akbar" is used more often in songs, that doesn't mean it should be there. People will still pick up on it, notice that it's used in a manner simply to promote the music and not in a religious sense, and bite back because of it.
If you can't see the issue at hand, then you are unable to remain proactive. The last thing you want is for Ubisoft to pull the game off shelves and delay it for a week.
Believe me you wouldnt want to hear what "allahu akbar" is sometimes used for in some of our songs

ScytheOfGrim
06-07-2011, 12:48 PM
Your songs, hm?
Interesting, interesting.

Assassin_M
06-07-2011, 12:53 PM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Your songs, hm?
Interesting, interesting.
Yes, Arab songs

ScytheOfGrim
06-07-2011, 12:55 PM
Ew, you're an Arab?

Assassin_M
06-07-2011, 12:57 PM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Ew, you're an Arab?
you got a Problem ?

ScytheOfGrim
06-07-2011, 01:00 PM
Not at all.



You see, I happen to be an Arab, too.

Assassin_M
06-07-2011, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Not at all.



You see, I happen to be an Arab, too.
WHAT SORCERY IS THIS ?

notafanboy
06-07-2011, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by Assassin_M:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Not at all.



You see, I happen to be an Arab, too.
WHAT SORCERY IS THIS ? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
not sorcery boy, skill !! ... wait, what are we talking about ?

BTOG46
06-07-2011, 01:28 PM
@ Assassin_M

You've just been Scythed, he does love his little mind games.

And yes, he is an Arab, and lives in an Arab country.

We really should give him a title, kind of like a Government Health warning..."Replying to his posts may cause loss of sanity"....... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

Moultonborough
06-07-2011, 01:37 PM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
LBP (http://blog.us.playstation.com/2008/10/17/littlebigplanet-release-update/) was delayed a week because a verse from the Qur'an was found in one of the songs.

Little Big Planet.

If you're going to compare and claim that the argument lies in the context or whatnot, trust me when I say you're arguing a moot point.

Fact is, people will be offended. I guarantee you that.

I think more people would get offended when you try to kill the Pope a few timeshttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Not so much by words, besides why do you think they have the declaimer at the start?

Assassin_M
06-07-2011, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by BTOG46:
@ Assassin_M

You've just been Scythed, he does love his little mind games.

And yes, he is an Arab, and lives in an Arab country.

We really should give him a title, kind of like a Government Health warning..."Replying to his posts may cause loss of sanity"....... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif I WILL FIND YOU, SCYTHEOFGRIM !!!!!! you better not be Egyptian

ScytheOfGrim
06-07-2011, 01:46 PM
It's a simple fact that the Muslim community has a harsher reaction than most other religious communities.
Throw on top of that the fact that there is absolutely no way for Ubisoft to justify the inclusion of the words in the song itself, and they have an even greater argument.
Ubisoft can say, "Oh, we're trying to stay true to history," when confronted with the Pope issue, but they can't say anything against the music.


I'd like a title that says, "Resident Waffle".
That would be nice.


EDIT:

No, no, not Egyptian.

O6EvolutionIXMR
06-07-2011, 02:56 PM
I see absolutely no reason why anyone would be offended by the praise for one's god. There is a misconseption that it's only said by radical muslims before they attact/threaten someone.

ScytheOfGrim
06-07-2011, 02:57 PM
The problem is that in this context, it's not considered praise, anymore.

L0rdeKing
06-07-2011, 03:31 PM
I noticed that too but I did't bother to comment on that cause I thought at first they have augmented the prayers calls in the game with it's day and night cycle yet I doubt that ubi devs would give it that much thought and I found it strange from jesper kyd to use a turkish theme song for jerusalem in the original AC then use the islamic theme on this one, am I missing something here? On the other hand recently the witcher 2 made a patch that takes out all the islamic themes that were in the game such as the praying mat and the books that resembles the Qur'an.
Lastly Long time no see scyth

crash3
06-07-2011, 05:51 PM
i think religion has of relevance to the AC series, think back to those deep conversations between altair and al mualim, religion was involved a fair bit in those conversations

AC has that philosophical context to it and has created a fictional but interesting look on life.

also the series is about exploring different cities, cultures and time periods constantiople was ruled by the ottomans in 1511 who were muslims, of course you are gonna hear chanting in the city, it wouldnt feel ottoman occupied without the chanting

chizzy12
06-07-2011, 06:24 PM
oh no! People will be offended? Boo hoo.

Grow up

thornebrook
06-07-2011, 07:07 PM
My best friend's half-Egyptian and Muslim (and a big fan of AC), and when I showed her the youtube video of the gameplay demo, she was thrilled when she heard the athaan. I had no idea what that was, so she had to educate me a little.

Anyway, count me among those who doubt that a significant number of people will be gravely offended.

Mic_92
06-07-2011, 07:19 PM
It means "God is the greatest".

If you are offended by this, well you are a moron and f you.

maddogre
06-07-2011, 07:35 PM
If people get offended by content in a GAME. Dont buy it. Wait for the demo, try it out and if you are still offended then DONT BUY IT!!.... I knew this would happen...stupid religous freaks. Scratch that, stupid religous PEOPLE stay away from games. They are fictional....just like your god HA. ****ers \M/

Assassin_M
06-08-2011, 12:35 AM
Originally posted by maddogre:
If people get offended by content in a GAME. Dont buy it. Wait for the demo, try it out and if you are still offended then DONT BUY IT!!.... I knew this would happen...stupid religous freaks. Scratch that, stupid religous PEOPLE stay away from games. They are fictional....just like your god HA. ****ers \M/
Lets not turn this into a childish conversation now, Only 2 out of 10 will be offended, its not a significant number, and i even doubt those who would be offended are even playing Assassins creed

SilverHer0
06-08-2011, 01:18 AM
HAHA! Are you serious people?!?

Me and my friends were actually THRILLED to hear the athaan "allah akbar". Show it to any Muslim or Arab and they would be fascinated. All my Arabic friends on facebook mentioned it and praised Ubi for adding it.

Ubisoft, no, Jesper Kyd did an awesome job of adding it to the musical background. It shows the culture and represent Constantinople, making the environment feel extremely real and accessible to every player out there.

GO UBi, your doing things right.

xepa105
06-08-2011, 02:49 AM
I'm Roman Catholic and I wasn't offended by the portrayal of the church in AC:2 and AC:B. I understand what you are saying, that some people may take offense to it, but those people should stop and think, do they really want to make a fuss over a video game? It's just something put into the game, it's not like the guy you are supposed to kill is shouting it as you kill him.

Plus, remember, in AC:2 you had to infiltrate the Vatican and try to kill the Pope AS HE IS LEADING MASS!? That surely is more offensive than what you are referring to, and yet I can't think of any Christians going ape over it.

It's a game, just that. Plus, it's not meant as an insult.

ScytheOfGrim
06-08-2011, 02:58 AM
There's a very strong misconception that's rooted in your minds. The idea isn't whether it's offensive or not, or how people may react to it. The argument that the game is multicultural is a moot point, since it doesn't address the issue.

The problem isn't people protesting against the game, or being offended by it.

The problem is governments banning the game.

The Middle East isn't a small region, and it does play a role in software sales. As the game stands, I guarantee all of you that it will be banned across most countries in the Middle East.
The instant the game is banned, that's a significant guaranteed financial loss for Ubisoft.

What does this mean for you as a consumer? It means that the series you have grown to love won't sell as well as it should. Why does that matter to you? Because company big-wigs decide on budgets depending on the success of the game.

The better Revelations sells, the more money that will be put into the next game.
The more money put into the next game, the higher chances of the next game being better.

There is no argument here. No concept of whether or not it's offensive, and absolutely pointless to say it's just a game, since any and all of those arguments do not address the issue.
Governments will ban it, simple as that.

Crouching.Tiger
06-08-2011, 07:20 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
It's a simple fact that the Muslim community has a harsher reaction than most other religious communities.
Throw on top of that the fact that there is absolutely no way for Ubisoft to justify the inclusion of the words in the song itself, and they have an even greater argument.
Ubisoft can say, "Oh, we're trying to stay true to history," when confronted with the Pope issue, but they can't say anything against the music.


I'd like a title that says, "Resident Waffle".
That would be nice.


EDIT:

No, no, not Egyptian.

Oh, please. Remember how the main antagonist, as well as most enemies, in all the games so far apparently represented the Catholic church? And how pretty much every religion in the world has been explained as products of charlatans using alien technology?
I also think that it isn't that out of place to hear an arabic prayer shouted/sung in a muslim metropolis. You know, minarets.

EDIT: In regards to your latest post, I actually prefer the artists to maintain their vision of their works, whether or not some oppressive stop-having-fun guys would prohibit said works. Freedom of speech should be especially embraced when it comes to art, which I count a good video game as.

ScytheOfGrim
06-08-2011, 09:02 AM
Again, another argument that is placed in the general sense. This is not about whether or not the developer's portray a certain religion or faith in a certain manner. That is beside the point.
The point is that the inclusion of a few words that are supposed to be said in a religious manner are being used in a way that disrespects the meaning of the words. Oh, I already see the arguments against how that can be disrespectful. Put those arguments aside, as arguing such would only show your ignorance towards the faith in question.
Yes, others have said that they are/know Arabs/Muslims who were happy when they heard it. In those instances, I provide you with one of two explanations: they thought the call to prayer was a game effect that occurs at certain times in the game so as to add to the sense of realism, and not part of the background music, or, like you, do not understand the faith.

It isn't out of place to hear the call to prayer in the game. I would be the first to suggest its inclusion as a sound that is played during specific times of the day, so as to add to that sense of immersion and believability. I do not support, however, mixing the call with musical symphonies just to make the background music sound Arabic/Ottoman. They could have thrown in any Arabic words into it, and are not forced to pick up words of religious value. There's no point to it, and it only helps attract unwanted attention.

Artists are free to provoke whatever emotions they want from their works. That said, this is not the work of one artist. This is the work of over a hundred artists. All of these artists are relying on their game to sell, and to sell well. They all want to keep their jobs, and be able to return to a food-laden dinner table at the end of the day. I highly doubt they are ready to ignore such a large gaming population just to speak their minds, especially over a matter that says very little in the way of subjective matter and ideals.

It is not to their benefit, nor is it to yours.

PhiIs1618033
06-08-2011, 12:21 PM
Scythe, there are songs in Arabic which contain the phrase Allahu Akbar, right? Then why shouldn't western works be able to do the same? If western works aren't allowed to contain that phrase, then that's just plain discrimination against race.
I would be very offended if anyone considered it offensive.

ScytheOfGrim
06-08-2011, 12:40 PM
Sadly, there are songs that do contain it, but they get away with it for a number of reasons, the main one being the way it's said. It's not said in the same manner as that of the call to prayer, rather, it's said more as an average phrase.

Although it's hypocritical in nature, it's just the way it is. It doesn't help that the game is coming from a foreign developer, either, since emic views are always more acceptable than etic ones.

Assassin_M
06-08-2011, 01:51 PM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Sadly, there are songs that do contain it, but they get away with it for a number of reasons, the main one being the way it's said. It's not said in the same manner as that of the call to prayer, rather, it's said more as an average phrase.

Although it's hypocritical in nature, it's just the way it is. It doesn't help that the game is coming from a foreign developer, either, since emic views are always more acceptable than etic ones.
Makes sense ....

misssnark
06-08-2011, 03:52 PM
To me it doesn't really sound like part of the background music, it sounds like the athaan happened at that moment and there was already music playing in the background.

If you look at it from the character's point of view, he only hears the athaan, not the music. Also, I could be wrong about this, but I'd guess that Ezio was blowing things up around sunset, so the athaan would make sense.