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View Full Version : Alternative to den defence?



freddie_1897
12-10-2011, 04:44 PM
I personally didn't like the den defence metagame, but I did like the concept of Templars being able to retake dens, what should they do instead of den defence but is still following the concept?

Animuses
12-10-2011, 05:05 PM
You and your Assassins simply fight against Templars. Done.

ProdiGurl
12-10-2011, 05:52 PM
I was trying brainstorm on this too bcuz I feel the same way - I love the realistic concept, just not the delivery. (or at least make it easier/less complicated - I lost all but one each time I played).

I was thinking that it could be something like an added mission instead - or some combat where you aren't given ANY medicine and the Capt. is fiercer.
It has to be something that you can lose, not like regular combat.

And it's very possible that they may not do dens in AC3 or 4 also. I hope they keep dens & Master Assassins tho.

naran6142
12-10-2011, 06:01 PM
maybe a combination of prodigurl's and animuses' ideas

a mission that u activate that lets you fight with your assassins, but maybe also be able to place assassins on rooftops and place barricades and stuff

Serrachio
12-10-2011, 06:04 PM
I feel that dens should have been larger in size, to create something bigger that the Templars would actually want to steal back through sieging, as opposed to something dinky with a small storage of bomb ingredients.

I also think that you should have fought off the waves like you did, albeit with more balanced controls implemented, and then after the siege weapon was defeated, Ezio would go back to the den and then have to fight off some waves of Templar guards running in.

More advanced Den Defenses could have more harder guards at the very end to fight, putting more consideration into timing so that you aren't just combo-killing through all of them (could have provided a reason for Templar styled guards with the difficulty of Janissaries).

After the full on brawl at the end, it ends with the Assassins settling back into a calmed down den, and cleaning up at the end (piling bodies away).

One thing that I would have also liked is that sending a Den Master away on a Mediterannean mission would leave the Den vulnerable, and maybe that attacks on Dens still happened, just that you didn't need to attend them for them to be safe, but you could if you felt like shooting Templars and placing down barricades.

ProdiGurl
12-10-2011, 06:10 PM
I feel that dens should have been bigger, to create something bigger that the Templars would actually want to steal back through sieging, as opposed to something dinky with a small storage of bomb ingredients.

Ya and I really wish the Dens were upgradeable - let us customize how the den looks. (Ok, this is probly the female in me coming out - how about pink Vinyl furniture. lol)

But seriously, link the upgrade to maybe our status in the city - how we're accepted by citizens or something. The more prominent our dens are (all manicured outside & plush), people are more accepting and they don't give us a hard time or turn us into guards? ... I dunno, something to spend our $$ on bcuz by the end of the game, I have 300-500k bankrolled.

Or, let us upgrade our assassins armor & weaponry - the lower they are, the slower they level up & get wounded. Or something.

If you lose the Den, you have regain it then restart your upgrading all over again.


One thing that I would have also liked is that sending a Den Master away on a Mediterannean mission would leave the Den vulnerable, and maybe that attacks on Dens still happened,

Another possibility.

Poodle_of_Doom
12-10-2011, 10:41 PM
What always got me was how unrealistic the idea was. These Dens are in the middle of the streets. And the templars are going to march their war machines in, and just take them back. Okay...

crash3
12-11-2011, 09:25 AM
Den Defence feels too much like an all out gang war, not some secret war behind the scenes of history like its supposed to be between templars and assassins. I think den defence is ok but it happens too often and doesnt feel very stealthy at all.

Ovrgwn Assassin
12-11-2011, 04:45 PM
Originally posted by crash3:
Den Defence feels too much like an all out gang war, not some secret war behind the scenes of history like its supposed to be between templars and assassins. I think den defence is ok but it happens too often and doesnt feel very stealthy at all.

i personally like the tower defense. when you say that this is more like a gang war instead of a secret war that is fair enough but in Constantinople the Assassins are known and so are the Templar's (not known as Templar's) but they are both known. so if they are both known why do they have to be secretive?

E-Zekiel
12-11-2011, 04:53 PM
Once I found out you can shoot people yourself I liked den defense a lot more. Although I did like it anyway.

Serrachio
12-11-2011, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by creedmaster2009:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by crash3:
Den Defence feels too much like an all out gang war, not some secret war behind the scenes of history like its supposed to be between templars and assassins. I think den defence is ok but it happens too often and doesnt feel very stealthy at all.

i personally like the tower defense. when you say that this is more like a gang war instead of a secret war that is fair enough but in Constantinople the Assassins are known and so are the Templar's (not known as Templar's) but they are both known. so if they are both known why do they have to be secretive? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thing is, they're not really.

I know it's mentioned somewhere that the Sultan is aware of their presence, but the citizens don't know that, and going into a bustling city and then discovering that there are "killers" roaming around and running across the roofs would be enough to drive away business.

Hence why the Assassins establish so many fronts for themselves, so that they're not suspicious to the common folk.

The Templars in the game are thought of as the dredgings of a fallen empire and they know that they are a small force compared to what they used to be, which is why they tug at the links hidden away from most people's consideration.

If they were to mobilise a small force, I'd honestly like the dens to be big enough to be worth their effort, and defending the den would be suitable enough to believe, but from how dinky they are inside, it's not as immersive.

The waves of guards to fight in close combat at the end would be a way to engage the player closer than pointing at parts on a street and installing things, only to watch things happen. Den Defense is strategic, that much is true, but it can be bland as well.

Spicing it up a little by emulating the VR Kill Streak challenge at the end will build players up to defeat the waves quicker so they can get their hands dirty.

dxsxhxcx
12-11-2011, 05:30 PM
they should give us 2~5 minutes to build barricades (each kind of protetion would need some time to be built and can only be built once before the attack start, this way we would need to think before place them anywhere) and place our assassins until the templars arrive and then, once they arrive, "teleport" us to the middle of the battle with some assassins at our side helping us fight the templars' waves, IMO this would be much better than just stay there shooting them and adding new assassins/barricades...

Poodle_of_Doom
12-11-2011, 08:08 PM
Originally posted by dxsxhxcx:
they should give us 2~5 minutes to build barricades (each kind of protetion would need some time to be built and can only be built once before the attack start, this way we would need to think before place them anywhere) and place our assassins until the templars arrive and then, once they arrive, "teleport" us to the middle of the battle with some assassins at our side helping us fight the templars' waves, IMO this would be much better than just stay there shooting them and adding new assassins/barricades...

Or,... they could just never do this again. But that's just me...

ProdiGurl
12-12-2011, 05:28 AM
Originally posted by E-Zekiel:
Once I found out you can shoot people yourself I liked den defense a lot more. Although I did like it anyway.

I was shooting at the Seige weapon guys and my shots always missed -
just like my cannons http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Anyone know the aiming trick to actually hit it ?