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View Full Version : Oleg: Not a German flyer, but 109 Glass...??



XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 07:08 AM
Salute Oleg

I am not a 109 flyer, if I do fly them, I fly the 109F2 or F4 which are a lovely little planes.

I have been testing the later model 109's on the new Normandy and Ardennes maps, and really began to notice the extremely poor rear glass, with all the dirt, etc.

These planes have without a doubt, the worst quality of glass of any of the aircraft in the Sim.

Now, while it seems likely that German manufacturing quality deteriorated as the war began to go against them, this seems to be overdone.

We know that the quality of the glass in the LaGG's, MiG's and Yak's were not very good in the early days of the war, but they do not seem to be penalized.

Since the early Soviet aircraft are not suffering from poor quality, it does not seem fair to make the late 109's have such a penalty.

I think the German pilots probably deserve to have a better vision through this glass than they have now.

Anyway, just an opinion.


Thankyou for your patience

RAF74 Buzzsaw

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 07:08 AM
Salute Oleg

I am not a 109 flyer, if I do fly them, I fly the 109F2 or F4 which are a lovely little planes.

I have been testing the later model 109's on the new Normandy and Ardennes maps, and really began to notice the extremely poor rear glass, with all the dirt, etc.

These planes have without a doubt, the worst quality of glass of any of the aircraft in the Sim.

Now, while it seems likely that German manufacturing quality deteriorated as the war began to go against them, this seems to be overdone.

We know that the quality of the glass in the LaGG's, MiG's and Yak's were not very good in the early days of the war, but they do not seem to be penalized.

Since the early Soviet aircraft are not suffering from poor quality, it does not seem fair to make the late 109's have such a penalty.

I think the German pilots probably deserve to have a better vision through this glass than they have now.

Anyway, just an opinion.


Thankyou for your patience

RAF74 Buzzsaw

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 08:07 AM
We notice you avoided La~7 /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Must be a grafix thing, I see very little dirt on any late 109, not enough to affect gameplay. But then I have SiS integrated motherboard video----lets you and me make a realistic FMB frontline warfare environment mission and then we will talk how to get good framerate.

Funny the late WAR La~7 glass has some dirt too--front *and* back. Again not enough to bother with on my SiS video chipset. You may wish to look at grafix settings. Still, Oleg may be taking a risk with this glass "realism" if this stuff can be overdone with grafix card/drivers.

I still don't think the home PC can yet render the true brightness range of real environmental objects to make dark or dirty glass both realistic and usable.

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 08:16 AM
Thinking of dirty glass what is the deal with the P-51's glass. It is really clear all around except on the edges of the frame where it looks like someone spilled some grey paint on it.

<center>----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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At the start of WW2 the German army lacked experienced anti-aircraft gunners. The average gunner was so bad that the USSR decided to help them out. They did it by forcing some of their pilots to fly I-153 flak magnets. These planes were slow but very sturdy. This allowed German anti-aircraft gunners to get a large amount of target practice on a relatively small number of planes. Thanks to the Soviets help, by the end of the war the German anti-aircraft gunners were amoung the best in the world.</center>

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 12:06 PM
Maj_Death wrote:
- Thinking of dirty glass what is the deal with the
- P-51's glass. It is really clear all around except
- on the edges of the frame where it looks like
- someone spilled some grey paint on it.


They were rushing to get in finished /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif




"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - Gunther Rall

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 12:46 PM
RAF74BuzzsawXO wrote:
- Salute Oleg
-
- I am not a 109 flyer, if I do fly them, I fly the
- 109F2 or F4 which are a lovely little planes.
-
- I have been testing the later model 109's on the new
- Normandy and Ardennes maps, and really began to
- notice the extremely poor rear glass, with all the
- dirt, etc.
-
- These planes have without a doubt, the worst quality
- of glass of any of the aircraft in the Sim.
-
- Now, while it seems likely that German manufacturing
- quality deteriorated as the war began to go against
- them, this seems to be overdone.
-
- We know that the quality of the glass in the LaGG's,
- MiG's and Yak's were not very good in the early days
- of the war, but they do not seem to be penalized.
-
- Since the early Soviet aircraft are not suffering
- from poor quality, it does not seem fair to make the
- late 109's have such a penalty.
-
- I think the German pilots probably deserve to have a
- better vision through this glass than they have now.
-
- Anyway, just an opinion.
-
-
- Thankyou for your patience
-
-
- RAF74 Buzzsaw
-
-
-

I think this has been said over and over and over and over again. By the way, I totally agree with you.

If you remember a post in the locked "P-51 bubble canoyp vs late model 109 canopy" someone posted a photo taken from inside the 109 (With late model canopy) to try and prove his point (I think it was Issy)

The thing I immediately noticed was how nice and clear the glass was compared to the game. Now, it might be because it was restored with modern plexiglass or something like that, but it is hard to believe that an industry that can manufacture engine tolerances within .008 of an inch cant make glass that's at least relatively clear. It's simply overdone.

It's a great idea, but I think it is very overdone. It looks like the cockpit got egged by someone on the ground crew just before flight.. LOL If it was really that bad in real life, perhaps the Germans should have just put up 1/4 inch plate steel for pilot protection because the glass sure wasnt too functional...



http://webpages.charter.net/cuda70/Fehler.jpg

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 04:08 PM
I agree 100 percent. Unfortunately, this is another one of those issues that gets ignored(like the views etc.). Its a shame, when you really look at the overall cockpits of the German aircraft verses the Allied. Sorry but thats not a whine, its reality.

I think these issues still need to be pressed though so that hopefully when the BOB and the later sims(which will probably have the late model 109s and the 190s) come out the LW cockpits will be modeled more accurately. I am sure that the Oleg Team is planning on sims that cover every aspect of WW2 after the BOB is released.

Don't get me wrong, this is a great sim that I truly enjoy.


Message Edited on 11/11/0306:46PM by IVJG51_Swine