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View Full Version : P38 a deathtrap online....I love it :) experts opinions welcome



F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 05:20 AM
Well anyone can answer, but I would like to investigate if there are tricks I dont know of and thus may improve in this baby. (I perhaps should add that I like the p38)

My background is that I'm experienced.
What I mean with deathtrap online is in combat with 109's with 30mm cannons.
An expert in a fw190 can be difficult but I seem to shoot them down as often as they shoot me. Several Japanese planes seems easier to handle and cant hang on in the manner of the 109.

Since I flew the 109's solely for a long time I feel know it well, and as I see it no p38 would be able to get away from me since I can turn better, roll better, climb and dive better aswell as accellerate and declerate faster and no p38 can outspeed me either.

Now... the only really effective escape I know of in the p38 is to hide in clouds or if the separation is great enough run away and hope he wont follow or friendlies intervenes before the 109 catches me (and he will catch me).
With a 109 on tail (experienced) I have only a few maneuvers that will work for a while only, and that is to keep my speed and distance and do soft bunts wich results in wavelike moves to avoid the 30mm spray. If I start turning or climbing he will catch me (I would in the 109).
On low ground I fly as low as possible hoping to blend in with the ground (works sometimes) and lure the chaser to crash in to trees or such.

I have found though that the p38J model meets a tiny bit slower 109's (earlier) and allows me to keep separation longer.
The later p38 is a bit slower or/and generally meets faster 109s.
It if ofcorse possible to evade a 109's pass one or even a few times but not in the long run since a p38 cant do anything better than a 109.
I dont understand what or how anyway.

Comments? Tips?

THNX

VF-29_Sandman
01-07-2005, 05:25 AM
unless oleg will listen to our comments in a different thread, compantent wingmanship is a must-have for now. and being a crack shot in the 38 will help. about all i can think of is to try to force vertical overshoots. i used it with lethal effectiveness back in the cfs2 days, and timing is extremely critical.

F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 05:47 AM
As I see it it would be hard to fool an experienced to overshoot since the 109 declerates faster and if he dont declerate and makes a highspeed pass instead Its easy to climb out of the p38's envelope, and if the p38 should follow he is in even worse situation than before, now low on E and lower than the enemy.

So it looks like wingmen is the solution.

Another strange thing I come to think of is that I actually do better in the double seat il-2 not because it has better performance but those flattrajectory guns with high rate of fire
and a reargunner and can land after a 30mm hit even with elevators out sometimes.
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif


I have heard about the p38F model as the best turner and thus had success in africa against axis, but I dont know how it compares to the later models more than that the problems with the engines was partly solved.
I also assume that the americans also came in force or atleast I have the impression so far.
I also wonder how many of the axis that were shot down was a lazy 109 e with lesser turn and power compared to the 109F variants??

Günther Rall also tried the p38 and wasnt impressed, but then he might not have been an expert on it or tested it fo enough time.
He thought highly of the p51 though.

Capt.LoneRanger
01-07-2005, 06:12 AM
I'm just trying to master the P38. I usually fly the P38J, but so far, I have a kill/death rate of 9/1. You have to get used to that sniper-plane, though. The accuracity is just great, even over long distances. You also have to learn that Jo-Jo isn't and turning into another planes needs a lot of experience, but it works better and better for me. Pitty the engines (props) aren't modelled correctly, but the plane is really good.

TgD Thunderbolt56
01-07-2005, 06:29 AM
A P-38 with a head of steam can be tough to track down. Also, the "L" can be coaxed to turn better by using the air brakes.

Here are my P-38 general tactics:

1. Don't slow down below 400kph
2. Always climb above the clouds before heading out
3. Fly with a wingman whenever possible


TB

WOLFMondo
01-07-2005, 06:39 AM
1 on 1 online vs LW planes it is very hard to do well as a figher...but with a wingman or two they can do very well. I like taking them into furballs at high speed with the wing pods, taking a few shots and zooming out the other side and then gain some height and repeat.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VF-29_Sandman:
unless oleg will listen to our comments in a different thread, compantent wingmanship is a must-have for now. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Competent wingmen was a requirement IRL also, the flew and fought in formation, there tactics were based on groups of planes, not individual aircraft, individual of cause they did well vs Japanese planes but there performance is equalled or bettered in the ETO by smaller, as fast or faster and more nimble planes later in the war. Even saying that the P38J vs other '43 planes is very much a top performer.

Every time I see a P38 online its flying low and alone and they suffer for it.

F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 06:41 AM
Yeah...if it hits it has an ok punch. I agree.

Compared to many other planes I find the shooting accurasy difficult in maneuvers because
it has a tendensy to swing up and down more than most but on steady straight runs it feels good. My shooting is ok on all ranges.
My main problem is evasion and escape with an experienced 109 on my six and I see no solution to it, (more than I have done so far).
With enough separation it may work to get away but that is because it would take a while to chase me down and luckily many online pilots are
a bit impatient.

So I really dont mean that it cant shoot enemy planes down. Unsuspecting enemies can even be shot down with a bomber.
My regular wingman F19_Olli72 shot down 3 axis fighters yesterday and made it home.
I'm more refering to the one vs one against a 109, and the only way I seem able to reverse the situation is fighting and hiding in clouds wich may give me an opportunity to fire at the enemy.

greets capt.LR

MEGILE
01-07-2005, 06:44 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif Respect to the P-38 experts, as rare as they may be.

tjaika1910
01-07-2005, 06:54 AM
The P-38 had great succes in the pacific because of tactics against induvidual japanize pilots. It would not and did not preform well against tactically disiplined germans. I belive a p-38 ace from the pacific was shoot down in his first europeean fight in p-38. Am I right in this ?

LittleJohn-1337
01-07-2005, 07:42 AM
Hear ye, Hear ye.
I will guide thee to p38 mastery.
I prefer the J model online due to slight turn performance and speed compared to the L model.
The secret to p38 success lies greatly on the control setup. Of course the obvious advice is to fly high and fly fast. Most people also forget to raise the landing gear (g key) and this can also contribute to their lack of success. The p38 is condusive to excellent marksmanship, and here-in is where I personally excell and is one of the reasons why I am recognized as a top perfoming pilot in hyperlobby. The 50 cal and hispano combination works wonders for deflection shooting. Success in the p38 depends greatly on making those 90 degree deflection shots count, because often times this is your only chance in an engagement. Contrary to popular belief, the turn perfomance of the p38J is slightly superior to that of the fw190. Also, one need only to spray the wing of a fw190 for half a second with 50 cal to negate any turning ability the fw may have had. There will be a hole in his wing the size of a grapefruit and his wing will start to dip to one side. The secret to BnZ success relies heavily on the negation of compression through the usage of TRIM (preferably on a slider). Max trim should be applied after 500kmph is achieved so that the plane wants to nose up. One only must then force the joystick forward, put the pipper underneath the target, and slightly release the joystick and fire. The negative trim will cause the p38 to "batturn" back up to altitude with little or no energy loss.

Against the most feared opponent, the bf109, it is not impossible to turn the tables but it is extremely difficult. At the bare minimum, and in the worst possible situation (when an expert 109 pilot in on your six) it is possible to delay the fight and make him work for his kill.
A high speed trim "batturn", as described above, can be used to escape a novice bf109 pilot because the 109 also suffers from compression. The batturn should allow for enough separation to escape or force a headon (which I only recommend to the most precise marksmen like myself). Take caution though, this exploit may also be used by expert 109 pilots, and if you are up against an ace, chances are his trim is also on a slider.

The second method of escape, or turning the tables, involves the use of macros. Most joysticks come with programming software. Whoever said that bf109s decelerate faster than p38s had no knowledge of macros. I, personally, bind combat flaps, prop pitch 0%, magneto (off), and throttle 0% all to one button on my stick. I call it the 1337 table turner button because it allows me to turn the tables on virtually all opponents and against any plane. At high speed with a 109 on my tail, all i need do is press this button and i obtain RAPID deceleration. Of course I don't make it obvious and engage in a break turn first. I then power back up, reverse my turn, cut inside the 109, and own him. However "owning him" depends greatly on hitting the first available shot, because it is the only shot you get. Fortunately for me, I don't miss. After his plane is crippled he can easily be out turned. Take due note that scissors should be the last resort. The somewhat poor roll rate of the p38 can be negated through the use of rudder. Rudder greatly improves the roll rate of any plane.

The very last method of forcing an overshoot involves a controlled stall. A hard breakturn to one side, then some lift to get out of the plane of turn, followed by a violent yank of the stick and rudder application will cause immediate speed loss and a spin stall. The stall can be defeated with opposite rudder and aerilon. If performed correctly the bandit will fly right by.

Thats all for now gentlemen.

249th_Harrier
01-07-2005, 07:46 AM
tjaika, you are mistaken. Check out the history of the 82nd fighter group in Italy. They went toe to toe with Luftwaffe experten who were transferred from the eastern front to counter them, and they gave as good as they got. The p-38h, g and j was more than a match for the Luftwaffe fighters they faced. The bad rep of the p-38 comes from the j being used as a long range high altitude escort in the 8th AF. The poor high altitude reliability, low (400kph) compressability onset at 30k ft, and poor cockpit heat made the j unsuited to this kind of job. It is in fact a testament to the excellent range of the p-38 that it was pressed into this role anyway, and for so long, since there was no other fighter on the planet which could do the job until the p-51. The problem is that since the scale of the 8th AF battles were so large, the largest number of p-38j vs GAF encounters were in this unsuited role, and this colors a lot of the accounts you read. You have to hunt for accounts where the p-38j encountered the Luftwaffe in its comfort zone (<25k ft). There are some accounts of 9th TAC AF p-38s fighting major battles with FW190-A8s in Aug and Sept '44. These battles were very one sided. One battle over an airfield in France (can't remember the name) at the end of Aug '44 resulted in 25 downed FWs vs 4 downed p-38s. The IL2 version of the p-38 has modeling inaccuracies which are well known: early onset of compressibility (400kph) at ALL alt, not just 30k ft (should be ~500kph at sea level), nonzero engine torque, insufficient elevator authority, absence of hydraulic ailerons on L version. An accurately modeled p-38j would be an equal match for a fw190-A8. The way it is modeled now, a fight between a flight of A8s and p-38Js would be a one-sided massacre.

F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 07:55 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TgD Thunderbolt56:
A P-38 with a head of steam can be tough to track down. Also, the "L" can be coaxed to turn better by using the air brakes.

Here are my P-38 general tactics:

1. Don't slow down below 400kph
2. Always climb above the clouds before heading out
3. Fly with a wingman whenever possible


TB <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree with the advices mate and I think also that Olli and I have developed a good teamwork over the years.
Its those one vs one engagements that go to h*ll.

I also noticed the slightly increased turn with the divebrakes and also with the J I seem able to do one or a few turns to evade the bullet stream.
I thought a while I overdid the evasion but soon noticed that it more depends on if the 109 "wants" to risk to declerate or not.
It was those declerations I felt I was so good at in the 109 and thats why I feel I cant escape.
Perhaps this is also some psychology involved = I know what I could do with it and now I see no escape??



One thing though, I had imagined that the visibility to the back was better in the p38 vs 109 but it isnt (exept for G2 and G6early).

MEGILE
01-07-2005, 08:10 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I call it the 1337 table turner <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

VF-29_Sandman
01-07-2005, 08:28 AM
this so-called 'table turner' is most likely the reason why oleg modified the trim tabs. i'd really like to see him try that stunt in a real p-38. he'd never live to tell about it. a p-38 'master'?!? surely tho doeth jest. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

btw....he wouldnt be able to get his engines restarted fast enough in our skies either http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 08:32 AM
LoL....thnx little john.
I can see in some of your comments that u know a trick or two.
I dont consider myself an expert on the p38 But I strongly belive that my tactics, thinking and deflection skills is on high level And also my knowledge of the opponents.
I also agree with many of your statements.

But...Maximum turn is one of the things I investigate first in a plane aswell as the lowspeed handling. But although I trim or do anything else I cant outturn a 109.
And with my experience with the 109 I know that a p38 cant out turn me if my motive is to turn inside his best turn. I may choose not to turn and bleed my energy with a p38 depending on the presence of enemies closeby.


With this said I'll add that the p38 as it is now still have enough turn to be able to fire upon an enemy caught at an disadvantage angle or someone making a mistake and ofcourse an inexperienced 109 pilot.
And the tables are turned with an e advantage but that would be so with a p47 aswell.

-------------------------


I also sometimes, with enough separation to a chaser, can make zooming climbs from ground up in clouds because of the p38's great climb. These are the situations where I have been able to reverse the situation against what I consider experts in the 109.

THNX for the addition.

WOLFMondo
01-07-2005, 08:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 249th_Harrier:
There are some accounts of 9th TAC AF p-38s fighting major battles with FW190-A8s in Aug and Sept '44. These battles were very one sided. One battle over an airfield in France (can't remember the name) at the end of Aug '44 resulted in 25 downed FWs vs 4 downed p-38s. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If people worked together with P38's online then they would have successes like this. The torque problems can be beaten with very little trim, elevator authority is only minutly lost at 400kph, it only starts to affect the P38 at much higher speeds (600+ kph) and the roll speed at 400kph+ is very impressive. As for in PF P38's vs 190 A8's the P38 outclimbs and out turns them.

LilHorse
01-07-2005, 10:08 AM
Once again I must be doing something wrong in the 109s. I've always found that if somebody keeps their speed in a P-38 they're pretty hard to catch. Not as hard as a P-47 or P-51 mind you. With those planes, especially the Jug, if they have alt they can run away at will. But the P-38 is still pretty fast. That said, if you do get into a situation where you have to turn with a 109 you're toast. I and a squadmate of mine encountered two P-38 flyers who were an excellent team. They messed us up pretty good. So, yeah, good teamwork is important with that bird. But also just stay fast. That's where the U.S. planes work best.

F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 10:12 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WOLFMondo:
As for in PF P38's vs 190 A8's the P38 outclimbs and out turns them. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is my experience also, but the rollrate of the fw190 and especially an experienced can make it outmaneuver a p38 because it can change directions much faster. The armament isnt bad either. I have met such pilots and dont mind losing fights when it happens.
so they are closer than the 109 and p38.

Lucius_Esox
01-07-2005, 10:15 AM
I am a novice in a P38 but is it feasable that a plane as large as a P38 should be able to mix it effectively with more nimble faster single engined opponenents. Without team tactics against an equal opponent isn't there always one outcome? Beatifull looking bird that it is isn't it like trying to outrace a bog standard sports car round a circiut in a Caddy??? Please am a novice as said but just using my eyes sats this is so!!

F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 10:37 AM
I belive U may be right Lucius Esox.

What I was interested in was if there are any moves or tricks available that I haven't tried yet.
I also read stories how p38F's outurned 109's in africa and turning on a dime and such and that this F was the better turning one...but I also suspected a big part of their success were because of teams and numbers and the axis on retreat aswell as the doctrins of the luftwaffe.
Marseille seemingly outturned all the ac he met including p40's and spits and he also attacked a greater number by himself on many occasions.
The interesting part is that most of his comrades didnt like this turning and losing energy (and they saw him a bit of a wierdo).
I wonder how much the success p38's depended on this??


BUT, Africa really doesnt matter here....because I am concerned with what I can do in PF and do it as well as I'm able.

cheers and thanks for your inputs so far.

TgD Thunderbolt56
01-07-2005, 11:05 AM
The only other ploy I can possibly think of is that hard rudder-kick-wing-flip move made so popular last year by 109 drivers.

It's practically an induced stall with enough altitude to recover. This maneuver usually only works as a last ditch effort to cause the enemy to overshoot and scrubs LOTS of "E". Recovery is usually quicker than in other birds because of the extensive wing area and potential dive-brakes. Thrud's good at it. If you see him online ask him about it. I'm sure he would tell you (although, I've seen both you AND Olli do it enough times in 109's you should kjnow what I'm talking about

TB

PBNA-Boosher
01-07-2005, 11:19 AM
The P-38 is a fearsome opponent, but only when used the right way. True, in WW2 they did dogfight against Fw-190's and Bf-109's successfully, but the way they won their combats were by extending out and up!

It's a long, boring way to fly combat, but if you want to survive in a 38 it's the way to go.

CV8_Dudeness
01-07-2005, 11:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 249th_Harrier:
tjaika, you are mistaken. Check out the history of the 82nd fighter group in Italy. They went toe to toe with Luftwaffe experten who were transferred from the eastern front to counter them, and they gave as good as they got. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
combat is not a good test of an individual planes abilitys

1 v 1 is tho

F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 12:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TgD Thunderbolt56:
The only other ploy I can possibly think of is that hard rudder-kick-wing-flip move made so popular last year by 109 drivers.

It's practically an induced stall with enough altitude to recover. This maneuver usually only works as a last ditch effort to cause the enemy to overshoot and scrubs LOTS of "E". Recovery is usually quicker than in other birds because of the extensive wing area and potential dive-brakes. Thrud's good at it. If you see him online ask him about it. I'm sure he would tell you (although, I've seen both you AND Olli do it enough times in 109's you should kjnow what I'm talking about

TB <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I Really would enjoy seeing that done...I think I maybe understand from your description.
I actually was fiddeling with braking in the p38 earlier but I did it like in the 109. So I probably overdid it.
That resulted in flatspinns or just a waggling straight fall without spinn with the L, so I gave it up....Perhaps I should give it another go.


Well for what its worth...I anyway noticed that by pulling hard and immediatly releasing the stick U can snaproll (or what its called) a p38 inverted very fast. That could be useful in an emergency. I haven't tried it online yet.

I have always watched my tracks including TgD-members very carefully and I always got some good ideas from them.....I learned a lot about how to deal with the P39 when u guys flew it on GG....I and Olli were pure axis at that time. LoL
U might not remember but U used clouds a lot in the fights in those days and its from there I started to test my tricks in cloudfighting.
Still love watching tracks http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif


THNX for your time....

249th_Harrier
01-07-2005, 12:14 PM
If you have dual throttles, can you use differential throttle for turn like pto aces did?

F19_Ob
01-07-2005, 12:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 249th_Harrier:
If you have dual throttles, can you use differential throttle for turn like pto aces did? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Seemingly No.. i think it was explained in some thread on these forums why this wouldnt work.
I dont remember exactly but it had something to do with torque and how it was modelled aswell as the effect on rapid accelleration. something like that.

JG7_Rall
01-07-2005, 12:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>and if you are up against an ace, chances are his trim is also on a slider. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

lmao! classic.

StellarRat
01-07-2005, 01:05 PM
Most of the P-38s I see online are flying way too low. They are much more dangerous around 6000 meters +. As far as mapping a macro to blow off speed and trim on sliders, etc... I consider it a cheat as it cannot be done IRL. A real plane has a wheel, switches, two levers and stick that would all have to worked at once to do this which is impossible unless you have five arms. No one can stop it, but if you fly like this you're cheating yourself and the people you fly against IMO.

BlackShrike
01-07-2005, 01:06 PM
stop giving out afj secrets. {you know who you are.}

CV8_Dudeness
01-07-2005, 01:22 PM
so LittleJohn is GoodKnight after all

bet he was Robin Hood as well . . . . but i was in a coop with Robin Hood & that guy sucked balls at DFing

BlackShrike
01-07-2005, 03:21 PM
"bet he was Robin Hood as well . . . . but i was in a coop with Robin Hood & that guy sucked balls at DFing "

that would be the only clue needed to know robin hood is not goodknight

CV8_Dudeness
01-07-2005, 03:47 PM
yea this Robin_n00b_1337 guy was with this Zero in a coop & it was just him in a Corsair against this Zero & the guy flying the Zero won

idiot

VF-29_Sandman
01-07-2005, 05:45 PM
i was just fartin around with a low pitch setting; doing very hard turns and loops at rather low alt over a non-hostile airfield.
using the L model with 25% fuel, combat flaps and brake, i was able to do very hard turns with no snapstall that usually would revert into the 'spin of death'. airspeed was also rather low. 180-210mph indicated. controls were very fluid and responsive. but would it survive online doin that...probably about as long as a snowball on a 90 degree day hehe.

tsisqua
01-07-2005, 06:04 PM
There used to be a "sticky" after the release of AEP. The title was "Suggestion To Watch Tracks Shipped With AEP". Its author was a certain game developer that was familiar with our P-38.


That's All I'm Sayin' http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif
Tsisqua

Xnomad
01-07-2005, 07:26 PM
1. Always stay up nice and high
2. Always hit and run don't stick around and turn.
3. If it's a Fw 190 then turn fight as long as the coast is clear
4. If you are high and a Bf 109 is very close on your tail dive like hell, then dial in full elevator trim, hit the combat flaps, throttle back and pull up hard, you'll probably black out but the Bf 109 will not be able to follow.
5. If a 109 is on your tail and you are low, then close your radiators dive to the floor and porpoise, you better be flying the 'J' model though.
It is possible to throw him off with a very sharp turn but you better try to shoot him at that point as it will be very dangerous after that.

The 109 won't have enough fuel to follow you forever even with 25% fuel the P-38 can fly for ages, I've had a stubborn idiot fly after me and chase me right off the map, it took some time but he ran out of fuel I turned around and blasted him before he hit the ground, pretty much a cheating kill but I wanted to teach him a lesson.

Oh and if Hayate's are on the server then don't take the P-38 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Vipez-
01-08-2005, 07:46 AM
Looking at the P38L historical charts with boosted ailerons, it had quite impressive roll rate at highspeeds... I guess in game we have the first L model without boosted ailerons.. ?

Anyway, P38 is indeed plane, that need serious teamwork against german planes .. though Jap planes are not a problem (except the KI84, first jap plane to challenge it.. )

Diving in P38 is really good way to get wridth of ur opponent. Yes, it has heavy elevators, but i suggest to use elevator trim to pull up.. setting it on a slider helps a lot in high speed pulls with P-38... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

tjaika1910
01-08-2005, 01:25 PM
Thanks 249th_Harrier. Glad for info, I going to learn more of this bird. Like the "feel" of it in FB, "noob" as I am (if you can still be a noob after all these years) I just resently made keys for multiple engine start ;-)

NuMcA_of_CS
01-14-2008, 09:31 AM
I have found a way to use my homemade quadrant for the P38!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It is not PLAYSKOOL-easy, but it can be done by anyone with 1hour to spare. It's done through a Programmable Input Emulator (which creates an IMAGE JOYSTICK as "ALchohol120%" does for CDROMs.)
Then, u can map this virtual joystick to press SELECT_ENGINE#1 when u move the throttles for engine#1" and SELECT_ENGINE#2 when u move the throttles for engine#2.

Instructions:
-------------
1) Download Carl Kenner's GLovePIE (http://carl.kenner.googlepages.com/glovepie) and install it. It helps u control almost any INPUT your PC can have (joysticks, gamepads, mice, keyboards, MIDI input devices, HMDs, Wiimotes, voicecommands, trackers (IRtrack), and of course, Virtual Reality gloves)

2) Download and install PPJoy (http://www.geocities.com/deonvdw/Docs/PPJoyMain.htm) so as to be able to create a virtual Parallel Port Joystick. You will use this "PPjoy1" to send strings of commands to IL2. TheRiddler has uploaded videoTutorials for GLOVEPIE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rii4CYX95d4&feature=related) (mainly for wiimotes but they are helpful, SO DONT FORGET TO THANK HIM).

3) Make sure u have installed PPJOY and GLOVEPIE. Then go create a virtual PPJoystick from PPJOY. Make sure u choose a joystick that has as many axis and buttons as u need, or just create a custom one.
-If u r running WINBLOWS XP then u will be asked whether or not u want to install UNSIGNED DRIVERS. These are the drivers for your virtualPPJOY, just say "CONTINUE ANYWAY" whenever u r asked.
-Next, make sure there is a new joystick installed through windows control panel/game controllers. You should be able to see a "PPJOY VIRTUAL JOYSTICK 1".

4)Run GlovePIE. It is a program that allows u to assign whatever INPUT you can imagine to a key or keycombination of your virtual PPjoystick. THE POTENTIAL OF THIS SOFTWARE IS NEAR TO INFINITE. Go to glovePIE's HELP/preliminary documentation to see a command-list. FROM here on you can free your mind and create.

THIS IS WHAT I COME UP WITH:
************************************************** ***************************
IT DOES NOT WORK 100% ** THERE R BUGS ** THE EFFORT TO PERFECT IT IS STILL
IN ITS INFANCY, LEts hELP EACH OTHER MAKE IT BETTER ** EVEN PROGRAMS ON SALE
CANNOT DEAL WITH IL2'S LUCK OF DUAL/QUADRANT-THROTTLES-SUPPORT WITHOUT BUGS ** THE CODE IS
HERE TO GIVE U IDEAS, IT CANNOT SOLVE ALL PROBLEMS **************************
************************************************** ***************************
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
ppjoy1.analog0 = joy2.x //my left throttle = 1rst axis of ppjoy1.Analog0. ppjoy1.Analog0 will be set as POWER in IL2'
if delta(joy2.x) >< 0 then //if motion is detected on the left throttle
ppjoy1.digital0 = true //press the SELECT_ENGINE1 button ( =ppjoy1.digital0)
wait(3 ms) //wait for 3 ms (*experiment on this before setting it*)
ppjoy1.digital0 = false //UNpress the SELECT_ENGINE1 button
endif

ppjoy1.analog0 = joy2.y //my right throttle = 1rst axis of ppjoy1, same as the left. the ppjoy1.analog0 will be set as POWER in IL2
if delta(joy2.y) >< 0 then //if motion is detected on the right throttle
ppjoy1.digital1 = true //press the SELECT_ENGINE2 button ( =ppjoy1.digital1)
wait(3 ms) //wait for 3 ms (*experiment on this before setting it*)
ppjoy1.digital1 = false //UNpress the SELECT_ENGINE2 button
endif

</pre>
************************************************** ***************************
THEN CLICK RUN TO TEST IT! go to glovepIE's "CP-settings/Joystick" and use your quADrant/dual throttle and see if it works.

5) If everything works, go to wherever u have installed il2 and find a folder named Users. Inside it u will find another folder named DOE which carries your settings (default: C:\program files\IL-2 Sturmovik 1946\Users\doe\settings.ini). BACK UP THE "settings.ini" FILE!! I REPEAT:*****BACK UP THE "settings.ini" FILE******.

OPEN settings.ini and find the "engineSelect1"(use Ctrl+F) so as to assign a "select engine1 button" from your PPJOYvirtualJOYSTICK
example: <pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> Joystick0 JoystickDevice2=EngineSelect1 </pre>
which means "1rst button(0) of the 3rd joystick device (2) = select engine 1"
that is because IL2 starts counting buttons/joystick from 0! because of this:
joystickdevice0 = 1rst joystick
joystickdevice1 = 2nd joystick
joystickdevice2 = 3rd joystick etc...
Joystick0 JoystickDevice2 = 1rst button of 3rd joystick
joystick3 joystickdevice0 = 4th button of 1rst joystick etc..

Do the same for "EngineSelect2" and "EngineSelectAll"

YOU CAN get my WORKING Configuration IF you just add this under [HotKey pilot] line:
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
Joystick0 JoystickDevice2=EngineSelect1
Joystick1 JoystickDevice2=EngineSelect2
</pre>
and this under [HotKey move]line in the setting.ini
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> AXE_X JoystickDevice2=-power </pre>
THIS COVERS ONLY ENGINE#1 and ENGINE#2 control.

SAve changes for settings.ini and exit.

6) NOW FOR THE TEST.
Make sure glovePIE is runing with the commands u want to use. if not, click RUN.
Cross fingers and RUN IL2...

7) If everything fails, just write your own code and send it back to me to make me understand any mistakes i have made.

I am currently trying to record same videos to help the community. i guess they wont take much longer, but i advise you not to hold your breath....

JG53Frankyboy
01-14-2008, 09:57 AM
well, beside pilot abilities, it all depends what plane you face in a P-38..........

in the PTO, the P-38J is THE killer against Zeros, Oscars and Tonies - sure, dont go in a stall fight with them http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

the P-38J vs Bf109G-6 (ok, the MK108 is a handfull if the 109 pilot is using it...) and Mc205 is a good match.
also against Fw190A-5 and -6 you are not helpless ! at least i have outturned some of them online http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

the P-38L_late, well, it lives in a later timeframe , has to fight against much better axis fighters.... it's actually not so easy anymore, keep on speed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


i like this plane since this special "Black sheep" episode i saw in TV - well, and that was some time ago http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

TgD Thunderbolt56
01-14-2008, 12:11 PM
lmao...a blast from the past fo sho. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I miss Ol' ob and Olli. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

F19_Orheim
01-14-2008, 12:18 PM
Olli's back after a time outhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Viper2005_
01-14-2008, 04:45 PM
Comments? Tips?


<span class="ev_code_red">The objective of the aerial combat is to disable, kill or force the enemy to disengage, not to fight him.</span>

I say it again and again. You're probably bored. But it's failure to appreciate this simple fact which leads to the majority of problems around here.

This kind of performance based discussion is therefore misguided since it is a very one-dimensional way of looking at what the aircraft is really about.

Having said that, it is worth recording that the P-38 is very poorly modelled in IL2 both from the point of view of its transonic handling characteristics, and also from the point of view of its pilot workload. Therefore attempts to use real wartime tactics are less likely to work than they might be in other aircraft...

As a 190 pilot, I would say that 99% of P-38s are targets. Big targets.

They have a habit of overstaying their welcome at low level attempting to kill 1 tank per pair of rockets. They often compound this sin by getting quite slow and turning.

The best advice I can give to P-38 pilots is to get in fast, hit hard and get out faster.

Do not underestimate how much the shiny L model sticks out against grass at low level.
Do not overestimate how good your SA is.
Do not operate alone.

buzzsaw1939
01-14-2008, 07:16 PM
As far as I'm concerned, the only thing missing in the 38 is 6DOF! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif

AKA_TAGERT
01-16-2008, 05:56 PM
Originally posted by Xnomad:
1. Always stay up nice and high
2. Always hit and run don't stick around and turn.
3. If it's a Fw 190 then turn fight as long as the coast is clear
4. If you are high and a Bf 109 is very close on your tail dive like hell, then dial in full elevator trim, hit the combat flaps, throttle back and pull up hard, you'll probably black out but the Bf 109 will not be able to follow.
5. If a 109 is on your tail and you are low, then close your radiators dive to the floor and porpoise, you better be flying the 'J' model though.
It is possible to throw him off with a very sharp turn but you better try to shoot him at that point as it will be very dangerous after that. All good advice for a new P38 pilot..

But not for a seasoned P38 pilot..

Like myself

TgD Thunderbolt56
01-17-2008, 08:09 AM
Originally posted by Viper2005_:

As a 190 pilot, I would say that 99% of P-38s are targets. Big targets.

I absolutely agree.


Originally posted by Viper2005_:
They have a habit of overstaying their welcome at low level attempting to kill 1 tank per pair of rockets. They often compound this sin by getting quite slow and turning.

Which supports your first point. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif



Originally posted by Viper2005_:
The best advice I can give to P-38 pilots is to get in fast, hit hard and get out faster.

Do not underestimate how much the shiny L model sticks out against grass at low level.
Do not overestimate how good your SA is.
Do not operate alone.

All good points.

The late model might as well be luminescent and have a big "come-shoot-me" sign on it.
Survival improves exponentially when flown in packs...not even with just a wingman, but packs of 3+

HayateAce
01-17-2008, 09:23 AM
Originally posted by Viper2005_:

As a 190 pilot, I would say that 99% of P-38s are targets. Big targets.



As a P38 pilot, my advice to you is don't ever find yourself 1v1 against my J in any variant of your run ninety....you ain't rtbing.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sleepzzz.gif

PS: Yes, if you are the typical run ninety player who sallies out and runs as soon as their leet dogfight skillorzs get them in over their head, a faster variant will allow you to run away from me.

Viper2005_
01-17-2008, 09:35 AM
Originally posted by HayateAce:
As a P38 pilot, my advice to you is don't ever find yourself 1v1 against my J in any variant of your run ninety....you ain't rtbing.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sleepzzz.gif

PS: Yes, if you are the typical run ninety player who sallies out and runs as soon as their leet dogfight skillorzs get them in over their head, a faster variant will allow you to run away from me.

If I get into a 1v1 fight for my life then I've already messed up and don't deserve to be going home.

If you measure your performance as a pilot by your ability to win such fights then you really have completely missed the point.

A superior pilot uses his superior judgement to avoid the exercise of his superior skill.

TgD Thunderbolt56
01-17-2008, 10:57 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif "...run ninety"

Korolov1986
01-17-2008, 11:17 AM
So, what's up with the necro threads as of late?

M_Gunz
01-17-2008, 01:56 PM
Originally posted by F19_Ob:
Günther Rall also tried the p38 and wasnt impressed, but then he might not have been an expert on it or tested it fo enough time.

Be sure you are better with P-38 than Gunther Rall!