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View Full Version : Any chance of early I-16 in next patch?



depalmer
07-13-2005, 08:29 AM
Type 10 lets say to get better feel for 1941. Also what happened to the I-152 or I-15? They were shot down in massive numbers. Love Russian **** planes.

Vipez-
07-13-2005, 09:38 AM
Or real I16 type 24 with 4x shkas as default armament http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

I-16 Type 29 would be most fun http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Stigler_9_JG52
07-13-2005, 09:55 AM
Amazing how Oleg has played so fast and loose with these little buggers. They turn on a dime, seem incapable of losing energy, accelerate to full speed like that... and then they get 20mm cannon as an "added bonus".

And there's your "representative" Chiaka.

Leaving us to wonder how the Luftwaffe rolled over early VVS opposition en route to the Moscow suburbs...cuz you sure can't do it that easily in an IL-2 online war or campaign.

SUPERAEREO
07-13-2005, 10:05 AM
Well, the LW in real life had a lot more combat experience than the VVS, and this does not happen online... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


S!

SaQSoN
07-13-2005, 10:48 AM
I-15? They were shot down in massive numbers.
I-15 didn't took part in the WWII. There were only about 630 of them produced in the USSR, which, by itself isn't a massive number. Around 350 of them were sold to Spain in 1937, another 200 or 250 were sent to China in 1938. All that left was removed from service within VVS at late 1938 and passed to the various airforce/civil educational institutions as unarmed aerobatic planes or as static teaching aid.

All WWII reports, reffering to the I-15 from either side, actually reffer to the I-15bis (which is sometimes erroneusly called I-152).

Regarding your initial question, the answer is "no".

LEXX_Luthor
07-13-2005, 04:29 PM
SaQs, how about this Question ??


Any chance of early I-16 in next patch?

SaQSoN
07-13-2005, 05:33 PM
SaQs, how about this Question ??
quote:
Any chance of early I-16 in next patch?

Regarding your initial question, the answer is "no".

LEXX_Luthor
07-13-2005, 08:39 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Tater-SW-
07-13-2005, 08:48 PM
I flew a "Chinese" I-16 on the ZvsW server (Rangoon map) ands that sucker is a complete UFO. I don;t throw that term around lightly, but it is a fantasy plane if ecver there was one. Has anyone tested it, it seems to climb better than, well, anything I have flown in il-2. It was at 130 mph and airborne in less time than it took for the Hawk I flew the hop before to spool the engine up to 110% and begin to roll.

tater

LEXX_Luthor
07-13-2005, 10:38 PM
Yes. That's what happens when you put a Wright Cyclone engine in the smallest possible airframe. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Tater::
Has anyone tested it, it seems to climb better than, well, anything I have flown in il-2.
Have you tested it?

No?

tater

lol dogfighter gamers http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

mothyp
07-14-2005, 01:33 AM
slighty ot but reffering to the i15/16 with small aiframes and big engines.

i was at flynig legends last sunday and they had an i15 in the display

this thing took off quicker/less roll than the jungmeister and the gladiator

thats pretty quick

crazyivan1970
07-14-2005, 04:01 AM
what SaQSoN said http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Tater-SW-
07-14-2005, 10:07 AM
I've seen a stat of 8.9 minutes to 5000m. That's about 1800fpm. I've also seen 5.8 minutes, and a few in between. That's from 1800fpm, to 2800fpm.

The latter is on par with the Hawk (not known as a super climber), the former nothing to write home about.

I will climb out to 5000m and test next time I have a chance and see how long it takes. I only asked because I know several poeople have exhaustively tested many planes and it seems foolish to repeat efforts if it is already done.

tater

LEXX_Luthor
07-15-2005, 01:43 AM
Right taters. Flight model testing and comparing with other planes can be very rewarding in itself, but its hard work producing the data and written procedure used that will convince more than just fellow dogfighter Squad/Squadette members. I know, I have soiled my diapers before in the old -84 Debates.

depalmer
07-15-2005, 03:05 AM
Was not 15 to 20% of the air assests of the USSR on 22 June 1941 I-15's or I-152's? In any case having large numbers of 20mm armed I-16's is not historical. Was not the vast majority of the I-16's in June 1941 Type 10's? It would not take much to change the type 18's to a 10.

SaQSoN
07-15-2005, 04:56 PM
I already told you about the I-15. Only about 150 were left in the USSR, most of them in non-combat units. The main I-16 type was 18 and 24 (actual 24 with 12,7mm guns, not the 28th, which is disguised in the game as 24). There were also few type 5 and type 10, but most of the type 10, that were built prior to summer 1939, were converted into the type 18 by the beginning of 1941.
There were also a number of I-15bis and I-153, but those were mostly shifted to the ground attack roles.

VW-IceFire
07-15-2005, 10:03 PM
Originally posted by depalmer:
Was not 15 to 20% of the air assests of the USSR on 22 June 1941 I-15's or I-152's? In any case having large numbers of 20mm armed I-16's is not historical. Was not the vast majority of the I-16's in June 1941 Type 10's? It would not take much to change the type 18's to a 10.
As I understand it, most I-16s were Type 18s in combat service and the rest were used in advanced training squadrons. The Type 10 was considered very poor compared to the Type 18.

We have two versions of I-16s by the way. One version does have only 4 machine guns (ShKAS) and the other has 20mm cannons. So designers and campaign generators don't have to supply cannon armred versions.

There were alot of planes destroyed on the ground in the first few days of Barbarossa...I'm not sure what they all were but they were essentially never in combat.

WTE_Warg
07-16-2005, 05:12 PM
I'd like to concur with what the earlier gentleman said about most I-15's relegated to training and liason duties. But if you ever do get your beloved "Chato" / I-15, put it in an early Crimea, Barbarossa scenario. One source states that the 3rd Fighter Regiment of the Black Sea Fleet, based at Sevastapol, were still using them in the frontline. Mind you, the usual picture you see, shows a I-153, but a caption indicating it to be an I-15. Go figure. Have also came across references to even earlier I-5's operating in the area, but always suspected it was a misprint.

LEXX_Luthor
07-16-2005, 05:20 PM
Rola who is leading (I think) the Team making the BoB Polish addon planes/objects posted that early Soviet planes may make it into BoB Polish addon pac. I~15 may make that -- 1939 -- not sure though.

SaQSoN
07-16-2005, 05:36 PM
But if you ever do get your beloved "Chato" / I-15, put it in an early Crimea, Barbarossa scenario. One source states that the 3rd Fighter Regiment of the Black Sea Fleet, based at Sevastapol, were still using them in the frontline. Mind you, the usual picture you see, shows a I-153, but a caption indicating it to be an I-15.


All WWII reports, reffering to the I-15 from either side, actually reffer to the I-15bis (which is sometimes erroneusly called I-152).

I-15 (aka Chato) as type was officially removed from VVS armory by VVS General Stuff order in 1938, which is 3(!) years before the start of GPW.
There were, however, some I-15 and even I-5 used in flight schools and in some active units as taxi trainers. This aircraft had their wings partially stripped off fabric to prevent them from unintentional take-off during training. Some of this aircraft were captured or destroyed during Barbarossa on airfields.
I even read once an account of a fighter pilot, who ocassionally was left behind his unit during retreat in the summer of 1941. He found derelict I-5 taxi trainer on the abandoned airfield and used wooden sheets (layered wood - "fanera" in Russian) and nails to cover the holes in the wings and flew this thing to the new home-base of his unit.

But this planes never were used in massive (and hardly in any at all) numbers during the WWII. There are no valid documents, photos or memories, that can proove otherwise.

And finally, there is no I-15 planned for this game.

JG53Frankyboy
07-16-2005, 06:08 PM
Originally posted by VW-IceFire:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by depalmer:
Was not 15 to 20% of the air assests of the USSR on 22 June 1941 I-15's or I-152's? In any case having large numbers of 20mm armed I-16's is not historical. Was not the vast majority of the I-16's in June 1941 Type 10's? It would not take much to change the type 18's to a 10.
As I understand it, most I-16s were Type 18s in combat service and the rest were used in advanced training squadrons. The Type 10 was considered very poor compared to the Type 18.

We have two versions of I-16s by the way. One version does have only 4 machine guns (ShKAS) and the other has 20mm cannons. So designers and campaign generators don't have to supply cannon armred versions.

There were alot of planes destroyed on the ground in the first few days of Barbarossa...I'm not sure what they all were but they were essentially never in combat. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

and the differnce is not only the armament.
the Type24 has also a more powerfull engine and so a better performance.
it would have benn nice if the canons would have been made as an armament option.
so, both I-16 would have 4 x Schkas as default.

but hey, the I-16 are so long in game....... lets keep it like it is http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

but if Ki-27s ore A6Ms will be ever flyable, a I-16 Type 10 would be nice............
and an earlier version of the I-153 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
and yes, i read saqson answer about it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

WTE_Warg
07-16-2005, 10:29 PM
The sources that have on their use in WW2 are from the Polikarpov Fighter squadron / signals publications. Again, I'm not sure of their reliability and fully agree with you on I-15 numbers and their minor use in the larger conflict. For the record, the reference to the I-5 was the last Zveno SPB mission of 22 October, 1941 near Perekop in Northern Crimea. Eleven used, with eight I-153's and the SPB's. No other details but suspect, now that this must be a misprint and are probably I-152's. Thanks for the info.

depalmer
07-20-2005, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by SaQSoN:
I already told you about the I-15. Only about 150 were left in the USSR, most of them in non-combat units. The main I-16 type was 18 and 24 (actual 24 with 12,7mm guns, not the 28th, which is disguised in the game as 24). There were also few type 5 and type 10, but most of the type 10, that were built prior to summer 1939, were converted into the type 18 by the beginning of 1941.
There were also a number of I-15bis and I-153, but those were mostly shifted to the ground attack roles.

My source was Squadron Signals publications on the I-16 and the earlier one by Squadron on the I-5, I-15, I-152 and I-153. I guess by source was not the best. I still fly the Eastern front 90% of the time and most of the time I like to fly for the VVS. Love to fly the Soviet birds so wanting a early I-16 Type 10 would be nice. Heck a real Type 24 or the version with one 12.7 and two 7.62 would be nice too. I bought Pacific Fighters just to support Oleg and Company but wished they stayed with the FB theme.

Skalgrim
07-25-2005, 01:21 AM
wrong, at spain civilwar rusian i16 pilots had much more comabat experience as germans 109 pilots,

but 109 has own the air after short time



Originally posted by SUPERAEREO:
Well, the LW in real life had a lot more combat experience than the VVS, and this does not happen online... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


S!