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blakduk
11-14-2005, 10:27 PM
Hi guys
I posted some time ago that i cannot get a BF109 to do its thing, and it doesnt seem to matter much which version it was.
No matter how much i persevere with these planes i cannot maintain a good kill ratio- and i cant get the hang of shooting with it. My aim is crooked with it- i dont seem to have the same problem with a 190 so i dont think its the fact that the gunsight is offset (and yes i do use the shift-F1 combination).
I try BnZ tactics- i just dont seem to score enough hits to make it worthwhile.
I try TnB and just flounder with it.
And the fuel range- its a disaster.
I do better with a P40!!!!
What am i missing with these 109's?
I am currently using a borrowed computer (which can run a decent framerate on 'perfect' settings, its AWESOME http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif) and i've managed to lose my patch files. Thus, i running AEP without the patches (2.0). Was the 109 porked without the patches?
The other weird thing is they were supposedly a dog of a plane to takeoff and land in, i find them to be very sedate and far easier than a lot of the others.

polak5
11-14-2005, 11:01 PM
practice, practice, practice and more...well u know.
The way i started out with the 109 was in quickmission builder versus hurricanes. Circle climb (cuz they cant catch u, then do a hammerhead on them.) Do as neccesary.
It is also good to know ur strengths and weaknesses of ur plane, aswell as those of ur enemy. Here is a good guide that will help immensely. http://www.airwarfare.com/Sims/FB/fb_essential_files.htm#001
good luck http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Tully__
11-14-2005, 11:59 PM
Make sure you have the ball centered as much as possible, the 109 doesn't hit exactly where it's aimed if you've not got the rudder co-ordinated.

Alternatively if you're a rudder klutz like me http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif learn to allow for the shooting off required when your rudder isn't coordinated.

dieg777
11-15-2005, 01:26 AM
With the low amount of ammo it carries then you have to make your shots count. Get in close - I generally dont score well above 250m but inside this Im better.
As the guys above have said practice a lot and record your tracks and play them back. Use the external views to see where you miss, high or low etc

Good luck

see snapshot in my sig for some general tips.

LeadSpitter_
11-15-2005, 05:24 AM
jv44 kurfurst has that problem too he seems to think oleg porked all german planes but they are really the best in the game everyone else does extremely well in them, just practice, read some of the cem guides on http://www.airwarfare.com. Nothing VVS can compete with german ac highspeed or alt, and nothing british or american can compete with german ac low speed turning or 190s highspeed.

Hardware will make anyone a ace in this game. Especially since oleg made it not even for all now because of the fast pc complainers thinking those with mid speed systems should not have the same visability distance as someone who paid more money. Unfortunately he listed to those whiners. We use to have the same draw distances and visability distances for all resolutions but not anymore now higher resolutions have futher visability draw distances.

trackir rudder pedals and fast cpu and graphics card will make anyone an ace and its all $$$ related now those who pay more have a huge advantage in this game now and it never use to be like that.

georgeo76
11-15-2005, 05:43 AM
Remember that the throttle is a control surface in every AC, but none so much as the 109. Cut throttle when you want to change direction, and re-engage it as your heading or turn is established. The 109 also has more than normal rudder authority, essp at low speed, learn to use it effectively.

Chadburn
11-15-2005, 07:58 AM
Flying a 109 will make you an instant ace.

Any 109 will easily outturn any Brit or US plane in sustained turn with no E bleed at any altitude. Its stall speed is lower than all allied planes, and it can accelerate or stop on a dime, making aerial manouevers very easy.

The later 109s outclimb and outdive all US and Brit planes of same year, including P38, P51, P47 and Spit. So you can completely dictate the terms of the fight.

There are no CEM issues with 109. Just firewall it for all flight regimes, and don't worry. It never overheats or has its engine seize. As a matter of fact, in winter maps or at high alt, fly with the rad closed or you'll have trouble keeping it warm.

View is superior to all bubble top craft, especially to rear.

The German 20mm are superior to the wimpy hispanos, and the laser-like 108 is accurate to distances of 1000m plus. Usually you're safe to start firing from about 500m to make sure of a hit though. But remember, don't lead too much since the ROF and velocity of the rounds are extremely high.

The LODs are also a bonus. It disapears at about 800m, just about the time your enemy will be trying to line you up, and it has the tiniest dot at long distances, so it's very hard to spot.

If someone should happen to gain your six, just fly straight. The tail is exceptionally strong and can absorb ridiculous amounts of fire without losing any control cables. That's what people are referring to when they talk about it's concrete controls.

Jaws2002
11-15-2005, 08:07 AM
Originally posted by Chadburn:


LMAO.
He is flying AEP without patches. Nothing you say is true (except the climb). I think the p-51 is flying like that. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

cawimmer430
11-15-2005, 08:21 AM
I fly the 109 better than the FW-190. The BF-109's feel heavy and need practice and skill to be flown properly. I'm still learning how to fly it but I've made good progress. I can dogfight with Spitfires and Hurricanes, P-40's but have problems agains the P-47 and P-51 and some latter Russian planes. I prefer the 109 over the 190. Later 109's have an "ammo metering" unit in the top left portion of the cockpit. This should help you see how much ammo you have left etc.

In real life, the BF-109 had poor range. And when you're dogfighting, the thing seems to burn up more fuel than usual! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

LilHorse
11-15-2005, 11:32 AM
Chadburn is a funny guy..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

As mentioned practice. But also patience. The 109 is not a plane that you can casually wade into any situation. It requires that you think about your quarry. Against any VVS always BnZ. Do not turn with them or if you must DF then make use of more vertical manuvering not horizontal. If you're up against a La-5FN you are S.O.L. in both horizontal and vertical. So, BnZ and then get away from them.

Never turn with Spits and never get slow and turn with Hurris.

With U.S. opponants it's sort of the opposite of the VVS...sort of. You will never win a race with a P-47, P-38, or P-51. Either trying to catch them or get away if they have a good head of steam. With that head of steam they will all zoom very well esp. the Lightning. But I still don't recomend a turn battle against the Stang. Always best to bounce U.S. planes or if you must DF do it in with team mates.

I go for stretches where I stink in the 109 and then sometimes I do pretty good. But I've never been really good in it (or any other plane for that matter http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif). But it's still my favorite plane. I always find I don't have to be nearly so careful in Spits or Stangs, but then that's one of the reasons I don't fly them much. Not quite as challenging.

alert_1
11-15-2005, 01:31 PM
Me109 is example of plane taht is "good in everything and excels in nothing but climb". Always try to convert fighting into vertical maneuvres but watch your opponents energy state closely! La5FN, La7 and Spitfires (Hurris vs. Me109E) are dangerous if you underestimates their energy.
Use trim often, when accelerate in dive to boom something trim nose heavy but be ready to retrim fast, elevator authority is not the best around.Fly high, fly fast with rads open (set them to auto prior fight), cool engine down ASAP you get oeverheating message, briefly pull throtle back.
Dont follow your target into weeds, let it go, if smoking then job done.
Me109 is very fragile, only Zeke is worse, few pings and although there is no visible damage you are often out of fight.
Use combat flaps briefly in Me109g2 you sometimes CAN outturn evne La5FN and Spits, try hold corner speed about 260 km/h, dont play "their" game (Las/Spits turn better at higher speed). But turning in Me109 is always the LAST option, go vertical whenever possible....

blakduk
11-15-2005, 03:47 PM
Thanks for the clues guys.
I hadnt read before that the 109 cannon had a higher velocity- it may be that i am leading too much????
It also makes sense about the vertical fighting. I've spent most of my time fighting in the horizontal- i'm not terribly expert at maneuvers such as the hammerhead and i feel VERY vulnerable when slow. I much prefer to stay fast at all times.
I'll keep practising but i still cant help feeling that there is something i just dont get with the 109. Certainly it had a great reputation with those who flew it IRL.
Maybe its the fact that it was good at everything but not outstanding in any one particular field.
I am still waiting for the day when i can play online and check how the experts do it.
It just seems weird to me that i can kill scores of 109's when i'm flying an I16, while when i fly the 109 against I16's i am the lame duck. History indicates it should be the other way around http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

blakduk
11-15-2005, 03:50 PM
BTW- when i am dogfighting in a 109 it seems to take no time at all for the fuel to disappear. If this is accurate, how the h*ll did the LW get across the channel and back in these things?

fighter_966
12-09-2005, 07:17 AM
Originally posted by blakduk:
Hi guys
I posted some time ago that i cannot get a BF109 to do its thing, and it doesnt seem to matter much which version it was.
No matter how much i persevere with these planes i cannot maintain a good kill ratio- and i cant get the hang of shooting with it. My aim is crooked with it- i dont seem to have the same problem with a 190 so i dont think its the fact that the gunsight is offset (and yes i do use the shift-F1 combination).
I try BnZ tactics- i just dont seem to score enough hits to make it worthwhile.
I try TnB and just flounder with it.
And the fuel range- its a disaster.
I do better with a P40!!!!
What am i missing with these 109's?
I am currently using a borrowed computer (which can run a decent framerate on 'perfect' settings, its AWESOME http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif) and i've managed to lose my patch files. Thus, i running AEP without the patches (2.0). Was the 109 porked without the patches?
The other weird thing is they were supposedly a dog of a plane to takeoff and land in, i find them to be very sedate and far easier than a lot of the others.
One tactic you can use as they did in Rl is Hit
and run its not quite bnz . In hit and run you
dont have to zoom

fighter_966
12-09-2005, 07:18 AM
Originally posted by fighter_966:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blakduk:
Hi guys
I posted some time ago that i cannot get a BF109 to do its thing, and it doesnt seem to matter much which version it was.
No matter how much i persevere with these planes i cannot maintain a good kill ratio- and i cant get the hang of shooting with it. My aim is crooked with it- i dont seem to have the same problem with a 190 so i dont think its the fact that the gunsight is offset (and yes i do use the shift-F1 combination).
I try BnZ tactics- i just dont seem to score enough hits to make it worthwhile.
I try TnB and just flounder with it.
And the fuel range- its a disaster.
I do better with a P40!!!!
What am i missing with these 109's?
I am currently using a borrowed computer (which can run a decent framerate on 'perfect' settings, its AWESOME http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif) and i've managed to lose my patch files. Thus, i running AEP without the patches (2.0). Was the 109 porked without the patches?
The other weird thing is they were supposedly a dog of a plane to takeoff and land in, i find them to be very sedate and far easier than a lot of the others.
One tactic you can use as they did in Rl is Hit
and run its not quite bnz . In hit and run you
dont have to zoom </div></BLOCKQUOTE>and also go close as
you can like 150meters ...

HART_dreyer
12-09-2005, 07:51 AM
I have had great success with the BF-109. Perhaps some of my online tracks can give you some pointers?

Please view:

http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2

AndyHigh
12-09-2005, 09:22 AM
Its flying time with cruise speed is much longer so don't keep your throttle over 100% all the time. Try 90% instead and fuel lasts much longer. When you meet enemies you can fly longer at 110% before overheating because your engine was cooler in the beginning of a battle.


Originally posted by blakduk:
BTW- when i am dogfighting in a 109 it seems to take no time at all for the fuel to disappear. If this is accurate, how the h*ll did the LW get across the channel and back in these things?

fighter_966
12-09-2005, 09:25 AM
Originally posted by AndyHigh:
Its flying time with cruise speed is much longer so don't keep your throttle over 100% all the time. Try 90% instead and fuel lasts much longer. When you meet enemies you can fly longer at 110% before overheating because your engine was cooler in the beginning of a battle.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blakduk:
BTW- when i am dogfighting in a 109 it seems to take no time at all for the fuel to disappear. If this is accurate, how the h*ll did the LW get across the channel and back in these things? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
They meditated... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Pirschjaeger
12-09-2005, 09:29 AM
I fly the 109 and 190. I can fly the 109 much better but I can aim better with the 190.

Which 109 are you flying Blakduk?

I like the F's, the G2, and the G14.

BTW, I avoid the I-16's. Those little laser cannons are deadly against a 109. I'm not into bnz either.

Fritz

HQ1
12-09-2005, 10:33 AM
Originally posted by HART_dreyer:
I have had great success with the BF-109. Perhaps some of my online tracks can give you some pointers?

Please view:

http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2
those are prevoius 109's tracks. I do not think v4.02 109 is still good. climb no! She can not spiral climb anymore. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

money_money
12-09-2005, 11:15 AM
Originally posted by LeadSpitter_:
Hardware will make anyone a ace in this game. Especially since oleg made it not even for all now because of the fast pc complainers thinking those with mid speed systems should not have the same visability distance as someone who paid more money. Unfortunately he listed to those whiners. We use to have the same draw distances and visability distances for all resolutions but not anymore now higher resolutions have futher visability draw distances.


Is this true?. Ive only ever read on these boards "1024 X 768 res. is best" .

money_money
12-09-2005, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
I fly the 109 and 190. I can fly the 109 much better but I can aim better with the 190.

Which 109 are you flying Blakduk?

I like the F's, the G2, and the G14.

Fritz

What do you like about the G14?

<3 $

Brain32
12-09-2005, 11:38 AM
Is this true?. Ive only ever read on these boards "1024 X 768 res. is best" .
I'm also very interested on this subject since my rig is quite capable of running it 1280x1024.
As for the ME109 flying tips, hm I have many stick-time in it(since orig IL2) but 4.02 brought unforseen difficulties of flying it for me. All I can recommend now is trim your elevator often and center the ball all the time, no tight turns if you want to live turning is for Spitfire's...
My primary weapon is 190 now http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif, and P47 when flying Allied http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

Von_Rat
12-09-2005, 12:04 PM
Originally posted by money_money:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LeadSpitter_:
Hardware will make anyone a ace in this game. Especially since oleg made it not even for all now because of the fast pc complainers thinking those with mid speed systems should not have the same visability distance as someone who paid more money. Unfortunately he listed to those whiners. We use to have the same draw distances and visability distances for all resolutions but not anymore now higher resolutions have futher visability draw distances.


Is this true?. Ive only ever read on these boards "1024 X 768 res. is best" . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



unless somthing changed in 4.02 i can't see dots at hi res. i have to play 1024x768 to see them.

i guess i'll try higher res again to see if this is true.

Pirschjaeger
12-09-2005, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by money_money:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:

I like the F's, the G2, and the G14.

Fritz

What do you like about the G14?

<3 $ </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not sure really. But it seems to handle nicely, like the G2 and the F's.

Fritz

money_money
12-09-2005, 01:21 PM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by money_money:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:

I like the F's, the G2, and the G14.

Fritz

What do you like about the G14?

<3 $ </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not sure really. But it seems to handle nicely, like the G2 and the F's.

Fritz </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Interesting. I like all the 109's except the g14, o and the f2. Im sure I would be shot down every time in a g14 v's beginner AI p11 dogfight.

<3 $

danjama
12-09-2005, 01:35 PM
I find all late 109's dogs to fly, so **** heavy! I would take a G2 over a G10 or K version any day, even if im against mk9's or P51D's. Fritz, i heard somewhre that G10 is like G14 but lighter (?) so faster, maybe someone can give more info.

Although i prefer 190's i spend alot of time in 109's too, but theres not really much i can help with http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Its a pretty standard plane, one of the simplest to use in fact. No vices, many virtues.

As for your fuel problem its a strange one.

If you find yourself flying the G10 and upwards, make sure not to engage WEP if your throttle is above 100%, this will send ur engine crazy. Take throttle under 100% first, put the WEP on then go to 110% to engage it fully.

Um, although their good for turnin up to G6 late, i wouldnt spend my time learnin to turn with it, unless i really had to use it, it isnt worth it. Turning leaves you slow and big (nice target).

Try and stay fast and high as in many planes, and make big turns or vertical maneuvres.

As has been said dont spiral climb, u will get ur **** shot off.

Hope this helped.

Pirschjaeger
12-09-2005, 02:07 PM
Ha ha ha, Danjama, I would give the opposite advice. I love turning with the 109. Normally I fly the G2. I love to turn with the F's and G2. The G14 is jst for a change. I fly it rarely.

I also use the spiral climb a lot, especially if I got an enemy on my 6. The trick is to not be consistent. My favorite move is a large barrel roll using oposite rudder and a little elevator. I do this at higher speeds and produce enough G's that it's almost a total black out. I found this was a good way to clear my 6. It works best starting at about 800m and starting in a dive. If the enemy tries to follow they usually hit the ground.

I just wish I could fly the 190 as good as I can the 109.

Frutz

danjama
12-09-2005, 02:35 PM
"The trick is to not be consistent. My favorite move is a large barrel roll using oposite rudder and a little elevator."

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/351.gif

Also, G2 is beautiful to turn in and has great acceleration. If i was going to use a 109 to turn in, it would be the G2. But it really depends on your circumstance (enemy planes and their positions, your speed etc)

G2 would be my choice for aerobatic displays.

waffen-79
12-09-2005, 03:35 PM
Originally posted by Chadburn:
Flying a 109 will make you an instant ace...

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif ROTFLMFAO

ok this is BS, er, sorry but BS still, are u flying 4.02?

The La-7 3xB is a very good plane all-in-all below 3500, most DF servers don't even pass 4500m.

And don't get me started with the Yak-3T'45.

Seriously I get 4-5 kills per sortie in those planes than in my prefered 109K-4, perhaps I should change ride. LOL

ONLY rant, is FOV of the 109/190 cockpit I will post examples when I get home.

I always miss anticipating where the plane will be visible making deflection shots BnZ'ing.

****Totally not intending to create an axis/allies "my plane is better war", JUST facts from my experiences flying this sim***

MOH_MADMAN
12-09-2005, 07:21 PM
good ol days had a 109 w rudder trim, not so anymore. The engine torque draws you right to left. Use this to saddle your opponent. Come in from right side and let your travel drift your guns across target AT CLOSE range. If you go from left to right, you will be fighting the rudder too much. I have never used pedals and dont know how that would help, though its on my xmas list.
Lots other good info in this thread...and if i cared to read it all i may even vouch for some of it. Tully, in early i did read, good stuff.


MAD

Jetbuff
12-10-2005, 03:12 AM
Without the patches, (4.01 or higher to be precise) you do not have MinenGeschoss rounds in your hub-mounted cannon and naturally even when you do hit, you'll do little more than peel the paint of your intended victim. Patch up asap.

Xiolablu3
12-10-2005, 02:49 PM
Originally posted by Chadburn:
Flying a 109 will make you an instant ace.

Any 109 will easily outturn any Brit or US plane in sustained turn with no E bleed at any altitude. Its stall speed is lower than all allied planes, and it can accelerate or stop on a dime, making aerial manouevers very easy.

The later 109s outclimb and outdive all US and Brit planes of same year, including P38, P51, P47 and Spit. So you can completely dictate the terms of the fight.

There are no CEM issues with 109. Just firewall it for all flight regimes, and don't worry. It never overheats or has its engine seize. As a matter of fact, in winter maps or at high alt, fly with the rad closed or you'll have trouble keeping it warm.

View is superior to all bubble top craft, especially to rear.

The German 20mm are superior to the wimpy hispanos, and the laser-like 108 is accurate to distances of 1000m plus. Usually you're safe to start firing from about 500m to make sure of a hit though. But remember, don't lead too much since the ROF and velocity of the rounds are extremely high.

The LODs are also a bonus. It disapears at about 800m, just about the time your enemy will be trying to line you up, and it has the tiniest dot at long distances, so it's very hard to spot.

If someone should happen to gain your six, just fly straight. The tail is exceptionally strong and can absorb ridiculous amounts of fire without losing any control cables. That's what people are referring to when they talk about it's concrete controls.

I disagree with this statement, if you are talking same time frame 109s with Spitfires.

I find the Mk5 Spit to turn better than the 109F and also the Spit9 to turn better than the G6late or G10.

The Spit 8 has the best turn circle in the game for Luftwaffe vs Western Allies same time frame. (obviously the older planes turn better)

I feel a bit more manouverable in a Spit than a 109 , although its close.

EDIT: Omg I just realised you were joking, LOL.

fighter_966
12-10-2005, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by fighter_966:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fighter_966:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blakduk:
Hi guys
I posted some time ago that i cannot get a BF109 to do its thing, and it doesnt seem to matter much which version it was.
No matter how much i persevere with these planes i cannot maintain a good kill ratio- and i cant get the hang of shooting with it. My aim is crooked with it- i dont seem to have the same problem with a 190 so i dont think its the fact that the gunsight is offset (and yes i do use the shift-F1 combination).
I try BnZ tactics- i just dont seem to score enough hits to make it worthwhile.
I try TnB and just flounder with it.
And the fuel range- its a disaster.
I do better with a P40!!!!
What am i missing with these 109's?
I am currently using a borrowed computer (which can run a decent framerate on 'perfect' settings, its AWESOME http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif) and i've managed to lose my patch files. Thus, i running AEP without the patches (2.0). Was the 109 porked without the patches?
The other weird thing is they were supposedly a dog of a plane to takeoff and land in, i find them to be very sedate and far easier than a lot of the others.
One tactic you can use as they did in Rl is Hit
and run its not quite bnz . In hit and run you
dont have to zoom </div></BLOCKQUOTE>and also go close as
you can like 150meters ... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
In general Bf109 is plane in which you gotta
know how to shoot And that comes with aful lot of Practice http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

HQ1
12-10-2005, 08:34 PM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
I also use the spiral climb a lot, especially if I got an enemy on my 6. The trick is to not be consistent.
Frutz
Sorry My english is not good. What is the meaning of "consistent" here? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

danjama
12-10-2005, 09:07 PM
He means vary the angle and velocity of your climb using the control surfaces, making you a difficult target rather than a easy one http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Kuna15
12-10-2005, 09:40 PM
In turn Bf-109 will gain on anything for short period of time.
That is enough for many online 'experten'.

That is perhaps the most complete conventional aircraft in game.

Pirschjaeger
12-10-2005, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by HQ1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
I also use the spiral climb a lot, especially if I got an enemy on my 6. The trick is to not be consistent.
Frutz
Sorry My english is not good. What is the meaning of "consistent" here? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you fly at the same angle, it's being consistent. This makes it easy for your enemy to aim at you. Most often as I'm spiral climbing, I and continuously pulling tighter and tighter to a point where I start dropping the nose of the plane, combat or if slow enough, takeoff flaps. I drop the power and pull back on the stick, changing direction quickly, full power, raise flaps, and normally I'll end up in a better position and with E.

Fritz

HQ1
12-10-2005, 11:06 PM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HQ1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
I also use the spiral climb a lot, especially if I got an enemy on my 6. The trick is to not be consistent.
Frutz
Sorry My english is not good. What is the meaning of "consistent" here? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you fly at the same angle, it's being consistent. This makes it easy for your enemy to aim at you. Most often as I'm spiral climbing, I and continuously pulling tighter and tighter to a point where I start dropping the nose of the plane, combat or if slow enough, takeoff flaps. I drop the power and pull back on the stick, changing direction quickly, full power, raise flaps, and normally I'll end up in a better position and with E.

Fritz </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
In 3.04/4.01 do the spiral climb( your enemy has simmilar energy as you) just as you said pulling tighter and tighter is very effective. but now 109 will stall firstlier than enemy. this make the spiral climb very difficult in this version. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

blakduk
12-12-2005, 04:26 PM
Originally posted by Jetbuff:
Without the patches, (4.01 or higher to be precise) you do not have MinenGeschoss rounds in your hub-mounted cannon and naturally even when you do hit, you'll do little more than peel the paint of your intended victim. Patch up asap.

Thanks for the feedback guys. I tend to agree with Jetbuff- i've found the cannon to be far less effective than i thought it would be, considering how deadly they are in a 190.
Fritz- i've been trying to complete a campaign starting off in a Bf109F. I havent managed to get very far http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif
Lately i've also been flying a campaign using an F4F wildcat, emergency landings on carriers is a rush http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif
What i've discovered is my prejudice has a lot to do with my success in air combat- I KNOW the wildcat is way outclassed by the A6M Zero so i fly to survive and hit targets of opportunity. This attitude has increased my success rate enormously in the missions.
When i've applied the same principal to my 109F missions it has had the same effect- i concentrate on saving my AI comrades rather than taking the fight directly to the enemy. My ratios are steadily increasing.
In a 190 i dont have to worry about that so much- its incredible weaponry and dive ability gets me out of trouble very quickly.
Some stated the 109 is a 'jack of all trades but a master of none'- it doesnt have obvious superiority in any one area that i can rely on to save me. I have to fly cautiously and really pick my moments to hit and run.
I love the way this game really puts the detail into the different character of each plane.

Pirschjaeger
12-12-2005, 05:45 PM
Originally posted by blakduk:
Some stated the 109 is a 'jack of all trades but a master of none'- it doesnt have obvious superiority in any one area that i can rely on to save me. I have to fly cautiously and really pick my moments to hit and run.
.

The 109 is a tactical pilot's plane. Some will cal it a noob plane and say you can just jump in and go, but this is not the case. I flew in an online d-fight mission the other night for the first time in 14 months.

I rushed into a furball and killed 3 planes in well under 5 minutes. That had nothing to do with my G2 or my skills. It was more to do with the other's skills, or lack of. The funny thing was, they were all G2's, red side and blue side.

They tried to out turn me, they tried running, they tried catching me but they had no chance. These were the same guys who think you can just jump into a 109 and fly it like the La7.

Blakduk, I wouldn't recommend training by flying campaigns. I'd recommend you start simple with 4 average AI Mig3's in OMB, 3000m, Moscow1 map. Set your guns between 200 and 300, what ever you are more comfortable with. Don't shoot unless you are guaranteed a hit. The 109 carries a small ammo load.

When you can kill all four and still have ammo left, increase the AI's skill until you've achieved total victory and still have ammoo remaining. The start over with another AI plane, let's say 4 Laggs.

In campaigns you get little combat training and more "holiday travel" training.

Once you feel confident, start training online. I say "training" again since areal pilot is much more difficult than the predictable AI.

Time and patience. Also, record your training with tracks. Watch your plane from it's 6, watch it using F3 key, and watch from the enemy AI. You'll be amazed at where you are making mistakes. If you have a buddy you trust, fly online 1vs1 d-fight, be sure he is much better than you, and ask him to record tracks of your fights. The he can send you the tracks and you can see from his plane where you went wrong and what he did to get you. Believe me, this opens up a whole new world. I did this with JG/54 Serpentblade and learnt so much. When you can't see your mistakes, you can't solve them.

Anyway, I wish I was able to fly online with you but I'm moving back to Germany next week. I got a lot to do.

I think you'll realize the 109 is not the noob plane that others claim it is. If someone tells you it's a noob plane, you'll then know they have no real experience with the 109.

Good luck dude! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Fritz

AVG_WarHawk
12-13-2005, 12:30 AM
Your sig just keeps getting better and better Fritz http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

jugent
12-13-2005, 04:06 AM
To fly LW-a/c you need backup and group-tactics. because theese planes are not so good in this game, compare Me109 to a spit

Try the spit for TnB and P-47 for BnZ, they are much better.

Pirschjaeger
12-13-2005, 04:16 AM
Thx Warhawk. I'm still not happy with it though. It needs more work. BTW, your sig is cool. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Jugent, obviously you don't fly the 109. I've never used group tactics or a backup. I tend to fly lone-wolf. Spits are one of my favorite tartgets. I'm not a bnzer and never have been. I like to turn fight with anything but a I-16.

A Spit can out turn a 109 but it can't out maneuver it. The P-47 cannot out turn a 109 unless the 109 pilot has rigamortis, then the P-47 has a chance. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Although lately I fly the 190, I'm still much better in a 109.

Fritz

fighter_966
12-13-2005, 01:19 PM
Keep on paddling Pirsch http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif