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XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 02:15 PM
What are people's views on this? It looks great and I am thinking of buying it. What are people's thoughts on it? I am particularly interested in hearing people opinions on the flight models. Also I have heard that the virtual cockpits are fairly low res. How do they look as flying with a 2d panel doesn't interest me in the slightest.

Cheers in advance.

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 02:15 PM
What are people's views on this? It looks great and I am thinking of buying it. What are people's thoughts on it? I am particularly interested in hearing people opinions on the flight models. Also I have heard that the virtual cockpits are fairly low res. How do they look as flying with a 2d panel doesn't interest me in the slightest.

Cheers in advance.

Zayets
08-20-2003, 02:17 PM
there's a huge thread on this forum regarding this. Some like it , some don't . As for the FM , there's no FM in M$ games.

Zayets out

http://www.arr.go.ro/iar81c.JPG

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 02:28 PM
Don't ask here because most of the people here cut
Microsoft down without even giving it a try. I'm
completely in **awe** over it and flying nightly
VOR/IFR/ILS flights on my leg-by-leg journey,
and LOVING it!

It's Microsoft's best yet, and IMO SOOOO worth the
money. I haven't played FB since I got it, which is
partially because FS is so well done, and partially
because the FB patch is so NOT well done.

I've been adding planes, adding terrain mesh, and have now
flown from Toronto Canada all the way through to the bottom
of South America, back through the West coast of the US,
to Vancouver, and now back across so far to Regina.

For reference, look at the difference between Novvorossysk
in FS and IL2/FB. Get the feeling Oleg forgot some objects?

http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/Quiz1.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/quiz1b.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/Quiz3.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/Quiz4.jpg



And then some others random pics:
Add-on (payware) Visual scenery:
http://www.computerpilotforums.com/megaforum/uploads/post-4-1061282463.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/seafury4.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/seafury5.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/KGCN1.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/KGCN5.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/ToVegas3.jpg


http://mysite.freeserve.com/bpstuff/fs2004/sheep3.JPG


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/a131.jpg


http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/a134.jpg





<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:06 PM
What is that extremely ugly texture on picture #1?

Black and green?


Isn't this pretty much the same textures you get in CFS3 or this is totally different?




S!
609IAP_Recon

Forgotten Wars Virtual War
Forum: http://fogwar.luftwaffe.net/forums/index.php
Website: http://forgottenwars.dyndns.org
Visit 609IAP at http://takeoff.to/609IAP

http://www.leeboats.com/609/sig/609_recon3.jpg

Agnus Dei, Qui Tollis peccata mundi, Miserere nobis. Dona nobis pacem

Zayets
08-20-2003, 03:07 PM
Neat pics!
I have almost the same landscape in my FS2002. Didn't tried the area of Novosibirsk but I will check it when i will have some time. Of course , in FS2002 and in Fly!2k (although here is pretty poor) , but in X-Plane as well.
As far for the objects missing I think they had to do a sort of compromise. Afterall , this is a combat sim which is already loaded with lotta calculations. I guess there were simply no more room for landcape rendering. no offence for your FS2004 , if you like it , play it and promote it.

PS: you must be really lucky. I didn't played a game since weeks now. My house is turned upside down! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Zayets out

http://www.arr.go.ro/iar81c.JPG

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:11 PM
As far as Oleg forgetting some objects in Novvorossysk, keep in mind Oleg's representation is 1940's vintage while MS is 2003. I'm sure the town has grown up a bit in 60 some odd years. With that said I would fully expect MS 2004 to have better terrain/visuals than FB. Afterall, its newer and it doesn't have the added drain of combat operations to tax your CPU. That's just my humble opinion of course.

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:13 PM
Yeah it looks really good. What about the flight models. Does it feel like you think flying should? I know that people will state it but unless they own both and state so their comments will be disregarded. Thanks for the pics. I really like the idea of flying such old planes. Another think I would be interested in is WW2 period planes. I know there are plenty for FS2002 but do they have 3d virtual cockpits?

michapma
08-20-2003, 03:19 PM
That 5-page thread on FS 2004:

http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zbowj

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

Ô =69.GIAP=ChapÔ

69.GIAP (http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/giap/)</p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

Zayets
08-20-2003, 03:20 PM
Nice things about FS2004 is the 3d cockpit. FS2k2 had 3d cockpits only in few planes or if the plane maker decided to supply one , and is not functional. FM is really difficult to evaluate in FS2k... First of all all data about the aircraft lays in some plain text files which can be modified according to "your needs". This is good , and also is not good. One thing is for sure , in M$ sims , no-one , well , almost no-one have same FM as anyone else. If you stick to the out of the box planes , well , then yes , they do. You could not compare FM from FS with x-plane or even FU3 , say , for a cesna. The last two one feel like real aircraft. In FS you c an enter on final with any speed and land on any speed. DM is not so advanced but , hell , there are lotta add-ons for FS. Aactually , this is the only thing I find good about M$ flight games , and also the immersion , unmatched , so far ...

Zayets out

http://www.arr.go.ro/iar81c.JPG

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:22 PM
Nice pictures ...

but where are the guns ...

and the shootin' ...

and the flames?

I drove planes for a livin'.

It was fun, but now I needs guns ...

lotsa guns ...

and bombs too!

Bombs are good.


Falcon

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_euro_us_02.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:23 PM
Dex:

OK, I understand what you mean about MS flight sims. CFS3 is not all that bad, really, but they did drop the ball, for me. It is still an interesting sim, but FB beats it so badly that I hardly play CFS3 at all. What I love about CFS3 though, is the sheer number of things going on around you. What I hate is how it hogs the system and how MS basically lied, right on the box, about the system requirements.


But my problem is this:

I can't see where you're coming from regarding FB. I am sorry to say this, but I just don't buy your explanation of why you don't play FB any more. Here is my reason-

You say it is "partially because FB is so good, and partially because the patch is so bad". You state that you haven't played it in a long time. I can't understand this, because the patch has NOT been out for a long time. The patch cannot be the reason you stopped playing FB- you stopped playing it well in advance of the patch! A bad patch (in your opinion) cannot be the reason you stopped playing way back when because it didn't exist yet.

Please escuse me for pointing this out, but I find your reasoning terribly confusing and I wonder if you could elaborate?

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:26 PM
Dom01 wrote:
- Yeah it looks really good. What about the flight
- models.

I'm not an actual pilot, but let's assume the stock FMs
are very poor, at least in comparison to FB. That said, I've
downloaded some ProjectOpenSky and FlightCraft add-ons that
are very challenging to fly. Where I can do an ILS approach
with a default Boeing first try (or second /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif ), I have a
FlightCraft Airbus that took me 20+ tries to get right.

FMs are just a small part of what FS has to offer.
The modability of it is phenominal. I've already revised
landclasses in my home city, reloaded more detailed terrain,
and added piles of planes.

Anyways, the thread mentioned above has a lot more details,
but let's just say FS is my new "baby"... Very pleased with
it.



<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

michapma
08-20-2003, 03:26 PM
Dex has just been in an MSFS mood lately. He doesn't really think FB sucks.

/i/smilies/16x16_robot-happy.gif

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

Ô =69.GIAP=ChapÔ

69.GIAP (http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/giap/)</p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:29 PM
The only problem I have is the ground textures. Other than that, Im ok with it.

-----------------------------------
Uh no sig

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:31 PM
Dexmeister wrote:
- Don't ask here because most of the people here cut
- Microsoft down without even giving it a try.

I love the series and the latest beta should be great/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

<center>http://www.km011a0004.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/sig.jpg <CENTER><Center><div style="width:200;color:FF3300;font-size:12pt;filter:shadow Blur[color=red,strength=8)">A society flexible enough to stand for everything really stands for nothing </div></center>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:34 PM
Hi dex, nice pics. Could you please go to airpor called "Moorabbin" in Melbourne Australia and post a screenshot of surrounding areas, as I live almost next to it~! thanks

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
http://members.cox.net/lallend/KUNG_FU.GIF

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:35 PM
I slowed down my playing of FB prior to the patch. Then I waited and waited for the patch, as you all did. It arrived and I was faced with the reality that the one visual feature (a Matrox-related video modification) that was said to be in the patch wasn't. Then I flew the patch and found many glaring sound issues. Then I found out that all the maps I've created for a scripted server will not function since BadBernie's Daemon needs some post-patch revision. Then I found out that joining by IP is problematic, and this is how I connect to my own server when hosting on one PC and playing on another.

Combine these factors with the fact that FS has impressed me the way original online IL2 did, and you start to see a picture of why I'm not too impressed with FB right now. UBI has managed the product in a pathetic way, continues to do so (no offense to Oleg's great work), and after applying a patch UBI had been "testing" for a sh!tload of time and realizing the number of problems that slid past them, I frankly decided that I can't be bothered with it until they can be bothered to fix it.

Not bashing FB, and sure, it's dominated a lot of my time in the past months, but I'm just saying that finally something else has captured my attention, thus allowing me to stop waiting for and hoping for fixes in FB.



<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:35 PM
I haven't been near MS FlightSim since FS2000, which I hated. Those pics sure do show just how much things have improved though. I may have to splash out some dosh and have a fly around.
The thing that I did like about FlightSim is that the whole world appears to be modelled. I love trying to recreate the flights I've done - just had a trip in a DH Beaver floatplane around Victoria BC that I wouldn't mind recreating.
Cheers.

<CENTER>


<IMG SRC="http://www.apqa16.dsl.pipex.com/sig5.jpg"


Then a powerful demon, a prowler through the dark,
nursed a hard grievance.

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:52 PM
Dunkelgrun, recreating flights is awesome! I've now flown into many major cities I've visited in my travels, and it's really cool. Having an ILS approach rigged up is really cool, and working your flight with the ATC is a real immersion thingie too /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif I am getting a lot of enjoyment out of flying from one place to the next, planning my next flight, flying that, etc... I'm about 20 pages into my paper-based log book, and have recorded VOR frequencies, distances, ILS runways, ILS frequencies, etc etc...

Apples and oranges from FB, but I've gotta say, there's something cool about waking up in the morning a doing a little "morning flight" somewhere, like BC for example.

<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:58 PM
Dex,

Do airports actually have runway signs, boards and other markers on yet (without having to resort to payware)? If not, I'm not interested. At least not enough to upgrade from 2002 Pro.

Cheers,

SSS

michapma
08-20-2003, 04:00 PM
Dex, I know what you mean. Even before I had FS2k2 or even really knew about IL-2, I enjoyed getting up on a Saturday morning and going island-hopping in CFS2. /i/smilies/16x16_robot-happy.gif

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

Ô =69.GIAP=ChapÔ

69.GIAP (http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/giap/)</p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 04:05 PM
SpinSpinSugar wrote:
-
- Dex,
-
- Do airports actually have runway signs, boards and
- other markers on yet (without having to resort to
- payware)? If not, I'm not interested. At least not
- enough to upgrade from 2002 Pro.

Hell yeah! The taxi signs are awesome now, no add-ons required! Now all I need to do is learn how to taxi to Golf 4 via A4 D3 XXX Z4 across 27R to the gas station /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Some pics you can see them in:
http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/MDHE3.jpg

http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/fs2004/MDHE1.jpg




<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 04:07 PM
S!
Can u shoot dogfight agains any plane, and hit him with a Mk108 in F$$$$$?
no?

so this is why Forgotten Battles RuleZ

-------------------------------------
Luftwaffe Brasil
For├ža e Honra!

]http://www.erichhartmann.hpg.com.br/newbo.gif (http://www.erichhartmann.hpg.com.br/newbo.gif[/img)

LBR=Hartmann in HL

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 04:07 PM
Thanks Dex, nice pics!

Is that on all airports (i.e. small regional and so on?). That makes a BIG difference (sure as hell beats following a glowing purple line to the apron!).

Cheers,

SSS

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 04:09 PM
SpinSpinSugar wrote:
- Is that on all airports


I'm 99% sure that's the case, except perhaps where there's only one runway and one taxiway.



<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

eskimo-FHmod
08-20-2003, 04:25 PM
Avi8or wrote:
- Hi dex, nice pics. Could you please go to airpor
- called "Moorabbin" in Melbourne Australia and post a
- screenshot of surrounding areas, as I live almost
- next to it~! thanks
-


not worth it. i live in sydney and work next to the bankstown airport. the surrounding areas are nowhere close to the real thing. not even the streets. a bit of a shame but what gives. i absolutely enjoy FS. might have to look into those scenery addon thingys.

at the moment i am flying the same stint over and over again. from kiel to luebeck (germany) past ploen the town i grew up in http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif just love the great lake http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

fantastic that they included helicopters. i have yet to successfully land one.

Message Edited on 08/20/0303:28PM by eskimo-FHmod

michapma
08-20-2003, 04:28 PM
Of course you're not going to be able to compare MS to God. Sydney is too beautiful to be captured on film, much less a flight sim.

On the other hand, I did enjoy trying to simulate landing on the east-side beach of Fraser Island when I got back from vacation last year. /i/smilies/16x16_robot-happy.gif

Mike

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

Ô =69.GIAP=ChapÔ

69.GIAP (http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/giap/)</p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 04:28 PM
Adding higher detail terrain mesh may help out the situation with desolate areas, and you can also easily modify landclasses with EZLandClass (at avsim.com). My city Toronto is not exceptionally well done, but after I threw in some of the greenery that surrounds rivers and adding more suburban areas it's now more enjoyable to me.

<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

eskimo-FHmod
08-20-2003, 04:33 PM
dont get me wrong. as long as i can find the landmarks like rivers, bays or specific buildings i am happy. though it would have been cool if out of the box i would have been able to follow the M5 straight to newtown http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
gee, for all i know the M5 might even be there and i just havent found it what with all the intense air traffic control to keep track of http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

i have really taken a liking to my flight instructor rob, hahaha

<centerhttp://homepages.ihug.com.au/~peabody/ihugSig.jpg (http://www.fhmod.com)

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 05:11 PM
traitor.

Boosher-PBNA
----------------
<center>Heaven is a place where the French are the cooks, the British are the butlers, the Germans are the mechanics, and the Swiss are the politicians. Hell is a place where the British are the cooks, the French are the butlers, the Swiss are the mechanics and the Germans are the politicians.<center>
<center>Boosher-ProudBirds-VFW<center>
http://proudbirdswing.tripod.com/proudbirds.htm

http://www.escadrila54.com/logo_sm.jpg

<center><marquee><FONT COLOR="RED"><FONT SIZE="+1">"The ProudBirds..Fly High and Proud..~S~"<FONT SIZE> </marquee>

michapma
08-20-2003, 05:13 PM
/i/smilies/16x16_robot-happy.gif

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

Ô =69.GIAP=ChapÔ

69.GIAP (http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/giap/)</p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 06:49 PM
Seems to me that every one who has played it with the exception of one loves it. People who haven't make wide sweeping statments in the negative. But hey I know some one who doesnt like apple pie. Looks like I have to purchase.

Thanks for the info every one.