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OmegaSpruz
01-24-2010, 03:59 AM
Savanarola the monk from second dlc has a piece of Eden? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif
And how can he be a templar if Borgia ordered him arrersted??

kyleagius
01-24-2010, 05:00 AM
Lets just say that Ezio is...
Very clumsy!
And Savanarola is involved...
But still not a templar!

Abeonis
01-24-2010, 05:27 AM
Originally posted by kyleagius:
Lets just say that Ezio is...
Very clumsy!
And Savanarola is involved...
But still not a templar!

Actually, Savanarola is a Templar, as confirmed here (http://translate.google.fr/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=fr&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fforums-fr.ubi.com%2Feve%2Fforums%2Fa%2Ftpc%2Ff%2F27310687 84%2Fm%2F6191096618&sl=fr&tl=en).

TwinIltani
01-24-2010, 07:53 PM
Originally posted by OmegaSpruz:
Savanarola the monk from second dlc has a piece of Eden? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

This is, I think, explained in the AC2 book. Sadly, I don't have a copy yet.


And how can he be a templar if Borgia ordered him arrersted??

Why couldn't he be a Templar? It would be silly to assume that all Templars worked together for the same cause and by the same means without any differentiation.

In real life, Borgia (Pope Alexander VI at the time) wasn't pleased with Savonarola because the monk preached against Vatican and the brand of corrupt religion that it was spreading. Savonarola's idea was that the only thing that would prevent the world from coming to and end (likely, in his opinion, in year 1500) was pious life. He didn't see Renaissance as progression, but rather as a devilish path to destruction. Creativity, inventiveness and social acceptance of differences between humans galled him.

Savonarola's motivation might not have been composed of sheer desire to obtain power, but it seems to have been rooted in a deeply held belief that he was the only one with the right idea. All the actions he took fit fair and square into Templar philosophy as presented to us in-game.

Power inevitably centers on the aspect of control over masses of others. Savonarola wanted that control, even if on a misguided and frustrated premise. He knew what was good for the society of Florence at large, and he was going to make damn sure that he got his way.

How much more Templar can you get?

Savonarola's life is an interesting story. I can't wait to see how Ubi will wrap all the events into AC2's story line. It's bound to be interesting.

Runaque
01-26-2010, 09:22 AM
Originally posted by TwinIltani:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by OmegaSpruz:
Savanarola the monk from second dlc has a piece of Eden? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

This is, I think, explained in the AC2 book. Sadly, I don't have a copy yet.


And how can he be a templar if Borgia ordered him arrersted??

Why couldn't he be a Templar? It would be silly to assume that all Templars worked together for the same cause and by the same means without any differentiation.

In real life, Borgia (Pope Alexander VI at the time) wasn't pleased with Savonarola because the monk preached against Vatican and the brand of corrupt religion that it was spreading. Savonarola's idea was that the only thing that would prevent the world from coming to and end (likely, in his opinion, in year 1500) was pious life. He didn't see Renaissance as progression, but rather as a devilish path to destruction. Creativity, inventiveness and social acceptance of differences between humans galled him.

Savonarola's motivation might not have been composed of sheer desire to obtain power, but it seems to have been rooted in a deeply held belief that he was the only one with the right idea. All the actions he took fit fair and square into Templar philosophy as presented to us in-game.

Power inevitably centers on the aspect of control over masses of others. Savonarola wanted that control, even if on a misguided and frustrated premise. He knew what was good for the society of Florence at large, and he was going to make damn sure that he got his way.

How much more Templar can you get?

Savonarola's life is an interesting story. I can't wait to see how Ubi will wrap all the events into AC2's story line. It's bound to be interesting. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ironically I have to say that Savonarola has been asked by Lorenzo I "il magnifico" de Medici to come to Florence. After the death of Lorenzo de Medici, Savonarola turned himself against this family and when France got the power over Florence, they made Savonarola head of the city.

Savonarola was not a Templar, he was just not an ordinary priest, but he was very loyal to the roman catholic religion and he was against pope Alexander VI (Rodrigo Borgia) and he didn't made a secret of it. Also he had an enormous influence on Florence, everything he told the citizens of Florence was truth for them and in that way it fits in the story of this episode that is coming out soon.

Captain Tomatoz
01-26-2010, 10:07 AM
Spoilers
<span class="ev_code_WHITE">in the novel savanrola steals the piece of eden off ezio in the alpine mountains. When ezio goes to get it back borgia is also trying to get the peice of eden.</span>

and savanrola is not a templar. if you read the novel you can find out.

Runaque
01-26-2010, 03:04 PM
Originally posted by Tony6593:

and savanrola is not a templar. if you read the novel you can find out.

Or knowing history facts also helps a bit. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I noticed when I wanted to update my knowledge about rennaisance, that there is a lot to find about the persons that you see in the game.
De Medici, Borgia, the Pazzi family, ect ect ect.
This is one of the things I love this game that much, it's very loyal to history facts.

TwinIltani
01-26-2010, 05:52 PM
If you look at real life history, Savonarola's entire ideology was centered on truncation of personal freedoms and progress via control of the population of Florence. Bonfire of the Vanities, other than a display of power, is also a strike against knowledge - destruction of, for example, books that contain statements and historical accounts that are inconvenient (for whatever reason) to the one currently in power.

Savonarola "knew" precisely what was good for Florence. He "knew" exactly that the world was coming to an end, and had no problem with imposing his "knowledge" upon the masses in order to "save" them.

Even if he is not a member of the Templar order in-game, what difference does it make? He takes precisely the same approach to individuals as the Templars do - the masses don't know what they're doing and they need to be restricted and then herded like a bunch of sheep.

An ideology perpetrated by the same means but under a different name is still the same ideology.

Obviously, I am looking at it from historical point of view, without the benefit of knowing how Ubisoft has decided to implement it. I think it's safe to venture a guess that the monk is not a friend to the Assassin cause.

Tony - Spoil the book for me if you can spare a minute of your time (customs is sitting on my copy for a reason likely known only to the Abstergo corporation.
) - what is Savonarola's reason for wanting the Apple?

Runaque - Lorenzo de Medici was in fact a patron of Savonarola for a while, although I would venture a guess that it was more due to the monk's preachings against Rome's corruption than anything else. Medici's interest in spreading knowledge about ancient cultures and his contribution to humanism was likely the straw that broke this particular camel's back - Savonarola, to me, does not appear like much of a fan of Greek philosophers at large.

itsamea-mario
01-27-2010, 09:57 AM
Originally posted by TwinIltani:


Tony - Spoil the book for me if you can spare a minute of your time (customs is sitting on my copy for a reason likely known only to the Abstergo corporation.
) - what is Savonarola's reason for wanting the Apple?



well he didnt go searching for it, i assume he stumbled on it by accident, held it and then saaw things, once he felt its power he wanted it.

he is NOT a templar, but his ideoligies are very templar, however more like the templars from ac1, he is not driven by power or greed. hes especially like jubaier (i dont know how its spelt but hes the one who burned the books in the first game)

Runaque
01-28-2010, 09:53 AM
Originally posted by itsamea-mario:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TwinIltani:


Tony - Spoil the book for me if you can spare a minute of your time (customs is sitting on my copy for a reason likely known only to the Abstergo corporation.
) - what is Savonarola's reason for wanting the Apple?



well he didnt go searching for it, i assume he stumbled on it by accident, held it and then saaw things, once he felt its power he wanted it.

he is NOT a templar, but his ideoligies are very templar, however more like the templars from ac1, he is not driven by power or greed. hes especially like jubaier (i dont know how its spelt but hes the one who burned the books in the first game) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Templars first started as a good cause for protecting catholics against robing and/or being slaughtered by Moslims when they where on their way to Jerusalem. They took distance about their goods and went through life without posessions, after a while they where recognized by the church and it gained more popularity with other people, also rich people and in no time the Templars became that rich that they start orienting on other things and they became more in banking then protecting catholics. They became on a moment that powerful and the king of France had depths to the templars, so he started a campaign against them and forced the church to arrest them all, a lot got slaughtered and the Templars start more doing business in secret and on the day when the leader of the templars got killed, he cursed the king of France and the pope to death and not even a year later they where death and the next pope restored the image of the Templars so they couldn't be prosecuted anymore.
So, the templars started first with a good ideology and ended up with greed and the need for more power and influence everywhere they could.

I just ordered the book AC Renaissance to learn more about it, i heard it is a very good book, so i'll hope it's not waist spending my time in it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif